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Word A Word B Word C Word D Occurrence Frequency Band MI MI Band Prominent
religion_n church_n papist_n protestant_n 3,430 5 8.0447 4 false
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A38090 Antapologia, or, A full answer to the Apologeticall narration of Mr. Goodwin, Mr. Nye, Mr. Sympson, Mr. Burroughs, Mr. Bridge, members of the Assembly of Divines wherein is handled many of the controversies of these times, viz. ... : humbly also submitted to the honourable Houses of Parliament / by Thomas Edwards ... Edwards, Thomas, 1599-1647. 1644 (1644) Wing E223; ESTC R1672 272,405 322

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matter_n of_o great_a moment_n and_o controversy_n apolog._n we_o still_o choose_v to_o practice_v safe_o and_o so_o as_o we_o have_v reason_n to_o judge_v that_o all_o sort_n or_o the_o most_o of_o all_o the_o church_n do_v acknowledge_v warrantable_a although_o they_o make_v additament_n thereunto_o to_o this_o three_o great_a principle_n of_o you_o i_o answer_v 1._o to_o it_o general_o as_o you_o lay_v it_o down_o here_o general_o and_o afterward_o more_o particular_o to_o the_o instance_n and_o particular_n bring_v by_o you_o to_o make_v it_o good_a in_o this_o principle_n you_o labour_v to_o cast_v a_o odium_fw-la upon_o all_o the_o reform_a church_n who_o differ_v from_o you_o deal_v by_o they_o in_o such_o a_o medium_n and_o way_n as_o the_o protestant_n do_v by_o the_o papist_n whereas_o we_o allege_v against_o the_o papist_n that_o the_o protestant_a religion_n be_v via_fw-la tuta_fw-la and_o what_o we_o practise_v they_o themselves_o can_v but_o allow_v only_o they_o hold_v 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state-end_n and_o political_a interest_n namely_o ●…at_a when_o some_o great_a person_n lord_n and_o other_o shall_v be_v force_v through_o the_o badness_n of_o the_o time_n as_o be_v expect_v and_o fear_v to_o seek_v for_o shelter_n in_o providence_n and_o hispani●…la_n you_o may_v be_v there_o ready_a to_o remove_v with_o they_o and_o be_v take_v along_o into_o those_o country_n where_o you_o hope_v to_o set_v up_o new_a church_n and_o subdue_v those_o country_n and_o people_n which_o shall_v come_v over_o into_o your_o mould_n or_o if_o otherwise_o thing_n in_o england_n shall_v come_v to_o have_v a_o great_a turn_n as_o they_o have_v by_o this_o parliament_n then_o also_o by_o be_v in_o holland_n rather_o than_o new-england_n you_o be_v nigh_o hand_n and_o your_o estate_n more_o at_o command_n quick_o to_o return_v to_o england_n have_v this_o kingdom_n in_o your_o eye_n hope_v you_o may_v either_o subdue_v england_n into_o the_o way_n of_o your_o church-gover●…ent_a or_o else_o 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can_v not_o but_o suppose_v that_o they_o may_v not_o see_v into_o all_o thing_n about_o worship_n and_o government_n their_o intention_n be_v most_o spend_v as_o also_o of_o our_o first_o reformer_n in_o england_n upon_o the_o reformation_n in_o doctrine_n in_o which_o they_o have_v a_o most_o happy_a hand_n and_o 〈◊〉_d have_v with_o many_o other_o observe_v that_o although_o the_o exercise_n of_o that_o government_n have_v be_v accompany_v with_o more_o peace_n yet_o the_o practical_a part_n the_o power_n of_o godliness_n and_o the_o profession_n thereof_o with_o difference_n from_o carnal_a and_o formal_a christian_n have_v not_o bee●…_n advance_v and_o hold_v forth_o among_o they_o as_o in_o this_o our_o island_n as_o themselves_o have_v general_o acknowledge_v we_o have_v the_o advantage_n of_o all_o that_o light_n which_o the_o conflict_n of_o our_o own_o divine_n the_o good_a old_a nonconformist_n have_v strike_v forth_o in_o their_o time_n and_o the_o draught_n of_o 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worship_v god_n acceptable_o and_o so_o most_o according_a to_o his_o word_n unless_o to_o insin●…ate_v and_o to_o cast_v a_o aspersion_n upon_o all_o other_o they_o have_v so_o and_o so_o and_o they_o be_v engage_v by_o education_n and_o otherwise_o a_o fine_a r●…hetoricall_a way_n of_o cast_v blemish_n upon_o all_o other_o and_o free_v yourselves_o as_o much_o as_o in_o plain_a english_a to_o say_v that_o state-end_n political_a interest_n preferment_n and_o worldly_a respect_n engagement_n by_o education_n and_o such_o like_a with_o the_o stream_n of_o public_a interest_n may_v bear_v all_o other_o down_n that_o they_o shall_v not_o find_v out_o the_o truth_n but_o you_o alas_o good_a man_n so_o f●…e_v from_o have_v any_o thing_n to_o do_v in_o this_o world_n or_o regard_v worldly_a preferment_n or_o hang_v upon_o great_a person_n that_o you_o must_v needs_o find_v out_o the_o truth_n but_o as_o you_o will_v bring_v education_n in_o and_o converse_v with_o the_o reform_a church_n 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say_v be_v so_o well_o settle_v at_o first_o and_o since_o so_o many_o question_n and_o controversy_n have_v rise_v about_o worship_n and_o government_n in_o their_o church_n and_o we_o as_o about_o morelius_n and_o about_o the_o anabaptist_n and_o brownist_n and_o of_o late_a the_o independent_o and_o these_o difference_n have_v be_v debate_v in_o synod_n and_o assembly_n have_v hear_v and_o see_v all_o they_o can_v say_v against_o presbyterial_a government_n and_o what_o can_v be_v say_v for_o themselves_o if_o either_o they_o or_o you_o have_v the_o truth_n on_o your_o side_n what_o reason_n can_v you_o give_v why_o they_o shall_v not_o see_v into_o it_o upon_o so_o much_o enquity_n study_n and_o dispute_v the_o reform_a church_n be_v more_o free_a to_o entertain_v truth_n and_o change_v somewhat_o in_o their_o discipline_n than_o you_o be_v in_o your_o first_o entertain_v this_o new-way_n for_o example_n the_o church_n of_o france_n live_v under_o persecution_n for_o their_o religion_n and_o the_o truth_n of_o god_n if_o your_o way_n have_v any_o truth_n in_o it_o it_o be_v all_o one_o for_o matter_n of_o persecution_n to_o receive_v you_o as_o their_o own_o as_o to_o that_o passage_n in_o this_o section_n concern_v the_o good_a old_a non-conformists'_a that_o you_o say_v we_o have_v the_o advantage_n of_o all_o that_o light_n which_o their_o conflict_n strike_v forth_o in_o their_o time_n &c_n &c_n i_o answer_v a_o great_a part_n of_o their_o light_n as_o in_o mr_n cartwright_n mr_n hildersham_n etc._n etc._n be_v against_o the_o separatist_n and_o their_o practice_n as_o their_o write_n testify_v as_o well_o as_o against_o the_o diocesan_n bishop_n and_o ceremony_n and_o it_o have_v be_v happy_a for_o you_o and_o this_o kingdom_n that_o you_o have_v make_v better_o use_v of_o their_o light_n and_o of_o their_o draught_n of_o discipline_n the_o reformation_n have_v be_v more_o easy_a and_o the_o godly_a party_n more_o unite_v and_o the_o common_a enemy_n 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their_o book_n of_o discipline_n who_o if_o they_o proceed_v otherwise_o be_v liable_a to_o censure_v themselves_o and_o their_o be_v appeal_v to_o synod_n and_o assembly_n and_o all_o be_v carry_v in_o reference_n and_o dependence_n to_o assembly_n the_o case_n be_v very_o different_a now_o if_o the_o church_n of_o your_o way_n and_o communion_n in_o old_a england_n and_o in_o new_a will_v yield_v to_o have_v a_o government_n fix_v and_o settle_v by_o synod_n and_o assembly_n establish_v also_o by_o the_o magistrate_n upon_o which_o rule_n and_o order_n they_o shall_v proceed_v in_o the_o way_n of_o make_v minister_n and_o that_o such_o error_n in_o doctrine_n and_o such_o evil_a manner_n aught_o to_o be_v the_o subject_n of_o excommunication_n and_o then_o agree_v upon_o appeal_n to_o synod_n and_o assembly_n than_o there_o will_v be_v less_o dang●…r_n in_o such_o a_o entire_a and_o complete_a power_n in_o particular_a congregation_n to_o the_o second_o particular_a under_o this_o first_o head_n namely_o what_o some_o of_o the_o old_a non-conformists'_a grant_n place_v the_o power_n of_o excommunication_n in_o the_o eldership_n of_o each_o particular_a church_n until_o they_o do_v miscarry_v and_o then_o indeed_o subj●…cting_v they_o to_o presbyt●…riall_n and_o provincial_n assembly_n and_o that_o it_o can_v not_o be_v infallible_o prove_v that_o any_o of_o the_o church_n record_v in_o the_o new_a testament_n be_v so_o numerous_a as_o necessary_o to_o exceed_v the_o limit_n of_o one_o particular_a congregatïon_n and_o that_o both_o the_o minister_n of_o the_o reform_a church_n and_o our_o non-conformists'_a all_o grant_v that_o there_o shall_v be_v several_a elder_n in_o every_o congregation_n who_o have_v power_n over_o they_o in_o the_o lord_n i_o answer_v as_o follow_v for_o mr_n cartwright_n you_o not_o quote_v which_o of_o his_o book_n you_o have_v reference_n to_o and_o so_o not_o know_v which_o to_o turn_v to_o to_o find_v out_o what_o you_o assert_v of_o he_o i_o shall_v not_o deny_v it_o but_o as_o for_o mr_n baynes_n diocesan_n trial_n which_o be_v the_o only_a book_n i_o ever_o hear_v of_o wherein_o he_o handle_v these_o point_n he_o do_v in_o the_o three_o question_n give_v the_o ecclesiastical_a power_n and_o the_o exercise_n of_o it_o to_o a_o unite_a multitude_n of_o presbyter_n in_o which_o book_n howsoever_o as_o intend_v his_o book_n against_o diocesan_n bishop_n and_o diocesan_n church_n to_o who_o all_o presbyter_n and_o church_n stand_v in_o subjection_n and_o subordination_n he_o plead_v against_o they_o for_o the_o power_n of_o the_o particular_a elder_n in_o the_o several_a congregation_n yet_o as_o against_o the_o reform_a church_n practice_v namely_o of_o a_o presbyterial_a church_n consist_v of_o many_o particular_a congregation_n and_o rule_v by_o the_o elder_n of_o several_a congregation_n combine_v he_o plead_v not_o but_o express_o in_o answer_n make_v to_o those_o two_o objection_n from_o the_o church_n and_o elder_n where_o there_o be_v a_o co-ordination_a and_o a_o communi●…y_n in_o government_n as_o in_o the_o low_a country_n and_o at_o géneva_n he_o grant_v the_o thing_n contend_v for_o against_o your_o congregationall_a way_n even_o before_o miscarry_v and_o show_v th●…_n great_a difference_n between_o the_o diocesan_n government_n and_o the_o presbyterial_a in_o several_a particular_n and_o answer_v your_o objection_n which_o you_o common_o make_v of_o a_o foreign_a extrinsicall_a power_n and_o for_o your_o better_a satisfaction_n read_v and_o compare_v together_o the_o passage_n in_o these_o page_n of_o mr_n baynes_n diocesan_n trial_n page_n 21_o page_n 11._o what_o be_v mean_v by_o a_o diocesan_n church_n and_o in_o the_o 12_o page_n two_o first_o conclusion_n agree_v in_o and_o in_o the_o 16_o page_n and_o for_o the_o non-conformists'_a in_o their_o write_n against_o the_o episcopal_a government_n and_o diocesan_n church_n though_o they_o put_v the_o bishop_n their_o adversary_n all_o they_o can_v to_o it_o to_o make_v they_o prove_v
of_o dort_n and_o unto_o ostensum_fw-la vedelius_fw-la de_fw-la episcopatu_fw-la constantini_n magni_fw-la who_o as_o all_o man_n know_v give_v in_o that_o book_n power_n enough_o to_o magistrate_n in_o ecclesiastical_n yet_o he_o lay_v down_o at_o large_a that_o as_o the_o anabaptist_n and_o socinian_o follow_v the_o donatist_n give_v too_o little_a to_o the_o magistrate_n so_o the_o arminian_n do_v offend_v in_o the_o excess_n for_o before_o the_o synod_n of_o dort_n they_o contend_v that_o under_o the_o orthodox_n magistrate_n the_o church_n have_v of_o itself_o no_o spiritual_a power_n the_o minister_n of_o the_o church_n do_v perform_v their_o office_n in_o the_o name_n of_o the_o magistrate_n so_o that_o the_o magistrate_n because_o he_o for_o other_o business_n can_v not_o preach_v etc._n etc._n he_o do_v preach_v by_o the_o minister_n they_o give_v the_o government_n of_o the_o church_n to_o the_o magistrate_n alone_o they_o give_v the_o call_n of_o minister_n and_o their_o depose_n to_o the_o magistrate_n alone_o with_o many_o other_o such_o but_o af●…er_v the_o synod_n they_o deny_v it_o be_v their_o right_n and_o office_n to_o oblige_v man_n by_o their_o authority_n to_o the_o decree_n of_o synod_n however_o agreeable_a to_o the_o word_n or_o to_o use_v any_o coactive_a power_n in_o that_o case_n etc._n etc._n in_o which_o they_o take_v away_o as_o much_o from_o the_o magistrate_n as_o in_o other_o thing_n they_o seem_v to_o give_v and_o it_o may_v be_v fear_v however_o these_o apologist_n now_o to_o ingratiate_v themselves_o and_o be_v leave_v alone_o in_o their_o churchway_n say_v they_o give_v more_o to_o the_o magistrate_n than_o the_o presbyterial_a and_o that_o they_o profess_v to_o submit_v and_o to_o be_v most_o willing_a to_o have_v recourse_n to_o the_o magistrate_n judgement_n and_o cognizance_n and_o examination_n of_o ecclesiastical_a cause_n yet_o when_o they_o shall_v come_v once_o to_o be_v cross_v and_o the_o parliament_n by_o the_o advice_n of_o the_o assembly_n to_o settle_v the_o government_n of_o the_o church_n and_o by_o their_o authority_n to_o bind_v they_o to_o the_o thing_n agreeable_a to_o the_o word_n we_o shall_v see_v then_o what_o they_o will_v say_v of_o the_o magistrate_n power_n there_o be_v too_o many_o speech_n already_o since_o the_o meeting_n of_o the_o assembly_n out_o of_o their_o fear_n how_o thing_n may_v go_v which_o have_v fall_v from_o many_o independent_o that_o prognosticate_n they_o will_v do_v by_o the_o parliament_n as_o the_o remonstrant_n do_v after_o the_o synod_n of_o dort_n by_o the_o state_n 2._o but_o whatever_o you_o say_v here_o that_o you_o think_v you_o give_v more_o to_o the_o magistrate_n than_o the_o principle_n suffragamur_fw-la of_o the_o presbyterian_a government_n will_v suffer_v they_o to_o yield_v i_o do_v much_o doubt_v it_o and_o do_v judge_v that_o in_o many_o thing_n you_o give_v no_o more_o in_o ecclesiastical_n then_o the_o presbyterian_o and_o in_o other_o you_o give_v less_o and_o they_o give_v more_o m._n robinson_n in_o his_o apology_n say_v of_o himself_o and_o his_o church_n that_o in_o the_o point_n of_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n and_o his_o office_n they_o hold_v altogether_o the_o same_o thing_n which_o the_o belgic_a church_n do_v and_o that_o to_o their_o confession_n in_o this_o point_n they_o do_v ex_fw-la animo_fw-la agree_v now_o the_o belgic_a church_n be_v presbyterian_o and_o your_o churchway_n &_o m._n robinson_n differ_v not_o much_o ●…o_o that_o till_o you_o know_v what_o you_o give_v more_o to_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n then_o m._n robinson_n and_o his_o church_n do_v i_o can_v believe_v you_o especial_o consider_v that_o m._n burroughes_n one_o of_o you_o in_o his_o lecture_n upon_o hosea_n speak_v of_o the_o power_n of_o magistrate_n in_o church_n affair_n ve●…_n give_v no_o more_o to_o they_o then_o the_o rigide_a presbyterian_o namely_o that_o the_o king_n be_v supreme_a governor_n to_o govern_v in_o a_o civil_a way_n by_o civil_a law_n so_o as_o to_o s●…_n christ_n not_o dishonour_v so_o as_o to_o keep_v out_o idolatry_n to_o protect_v the_o church_n to_o punish_v enormitio_n that_o be_v there_o to_o define_v it_o from_o enemy_n in_o that_o sense_n he_o be_v say_v to_o be_v the_o head_n but_o that_o title_n of_o supreme_a governor_n be_v understand_v in_o a_o civil_a way_n be_v more_o proper_a now_o it_o be_v easy_a out_o of_o beza_n calvin_n zanchius_n and_o many_o presbyterian_o to_o show_v more_o power_n give_v to_o king_n by_o they_o in_o matter_n of_o religion_n then_o by_o m._n burroughes_n there_o so_o that_o i_o have_v more_o reason_n to_o judge_v of_o your_o principle_n by_o what_o m._n burroughes_n write_v particular_o and_o by_o way_n of_o answer_v doubt_n of_o conscience_n then_o from_o a_o narrration_n in_o general_a and_o from_o we_o think_v more_o than_o the_o principle_n of_o presbyterial_a government_n will_v suffer_v they_o to_o yield_v in_o other_o thing_n you_o give_v not_o so_o much_o to_o the_o magistrate_n as_o the_o presbyterian_o first_o whereas_o the_o a_o presbyterian_o do_v acknowledge_v the_o protestant_a prince_n and_o magistrate_n a_o eminent_a member_n of_o the_o church_n and_o in_o their_o great_a assembly_n and_o counsel_n give_v he_o a_o eminent_a place_n and_o power_n you_o according_a to_o your_o principle_n do_v not_o own_v he_o for_o a_o member_n of_o the_o church_n neither_o shall_v his_o child_n be_v admit_v to_o baptism_n nor_o he_o to_o the_o ordinance_n though_o a_o protestant_n and_o orthodox_n unless_o you_o account_v he_o a_o visible_a saint_n etc._n etc._n neither_o do_v you_o give_v he_o so_o much_o power_n or_o vote_n no_o not_o in_o a_o particular_a church_n in_o any_o church_n matter_n of_o censure_n admission_n election_n of_o officer_n etc._n etc._n as_o you_o do_v give_v to_o one_o of_o your_o serve_a man_n and_o the_o supreme_a magistrate_n and_o his_o child_n though_o bring_v up_o and_o profess_v the_o true_a religion_n may_v be_v and_o will_v be_v keep_v from_o the_o sacrament_n all_o their_o day_n 2._o the_o presbyterian_o give_v to_o the_o magistrate_n a_o coercive_a and_o coactive_a power_n to_o suppress_v heresy_n schism_n to_o correct_v troubler_n and_o unruly_a person_n in_o the_o church_n to_o tie_v and_o bind_v man_n by_o their_o authority_n to_o the_o decree_n of_o synod_n make_v according_a to_o the_o word_n of_o god_n which_o power_n as_o b_o voetius_fw-la show_n only_o the_o remonstrant_n with_o the_o libertine_n do_v not_o admit_v but_o all_o the_o presbyterian_o do_v reject_v such_o opinion_n that_o the_o magistrate_n can_v not_o by_o his_o stringere_fw-la authority_n bind_v and_o compel_v man_n to_o observe_v the_o decree_n of_o synod_n conformable_a to_o the_o word_n of_o god_n ordinem_fw-la now_o do_v you_o allow_v the_o magistrate_n such_o a_o power_n by_o your_o plead_n for_o toleration_n of_o religion_n and_o for_o liberty_n of_o conscience_n and_o that_o conscience_n be_v not_o to_o be_v tie_v and_o by_o your_o speak_n against_o imposition_n of_o thing_n lawful_a and_o agreeable_a to_o the_o word_n as_o set_v form_n of_o prayer_n decree_v by_o synod_n and_o such_o like_a it_o be_v very_o suspicious_a you_o allow_v not_o such_o a_o power_n to_o magistrate_n and_o your_o good_a friend_n ●…0_n m._n s._n in_o his_o answer_n to_o the_o observation_n and_o consideration_n upon_o your_o apologetical_a narration_n plead_v your_o cause_n deny_v and_o plead_v against_o this_o coercive_a power_n of_o the_o magistrate_n 3._o the_o presbyterian_o give_v a_o great_a deal_n of_o power_n to_o the_o supreme_a christian_a magistrate_n in_o the_o reformation_n of_o religion_n and_o in_o repair_v and_o build_v the_o house_n of_o god_n as_o may_v be_v show_v out_o of_o calvin_n zanchius_n peter_n martyr_n etc._n etc._n but_o whether_o the_o independent_o give_v as_o much_o when_o they_o allow_v private_a man_n to_o gather_v and_o make_v church_n and_o minister_n to_o do_v such_o public_a work_n and_o that_o without_o leave_n nay_o against_o the_o mind_n and_o law_n of_o the_o supreme_a magistrate_n i_o question_v there_o be_v a_o tractate_n in_o my_o hand_n about_o a_o church_n that_o go_v under_o the_o name_n of_o one_o of_o you_o wherein_o civil_a magistrate_n be_v cut_v off_o and_o minister_n too_o from_o have_v any_o power_n to_o make_v church_n and_o the_o immediate_a independent_a power_n from_o christ_n be_v give_v to_o the_o saint_n only_o to_o gather_v and_o combine_v themselves_o in_o such_o a_o assembly_n without_o expect_v warrant_n from_o any_o governor_n what_o soever_o upon_o earth_n saint_n as_o saint_n have_v a_o right_n and_o full_a power_n to_o cast_v themselves_o into_o the_o fellowship_n without_o ask_v the_o consent_n of_o governor_n and_o civil_a magistrate_n who_o have_v no_o power_n in_o the_o marriage_n of_o their_o people_n nor_o shall_v have_v it_o be_v a_o act_n of_o natural_a civil_a
only_o and_o the_o high_a power_n can_v they_o always_o hear_v or_o attend_v unto_o through_o the_o many_o great_a business_n of_o state_n affair_n all_o the_o difference_n scandal_n schism_n that_o both_o in_o particular_a church_n and_o between_o church_n will_v fall_v out_o in_o a_o kingdom_n or_o nation_n in_o this_o way_n of_o non-communion_n and_o protestation_n against_o one_o another_o especial_o in_o independent_a church_n where_o people_n make_v church_n and_o minister_n in_o that_o way_n they_o do_v and_o have_v no_o fix_a rule_n nor_o certain_a way_n i_o warrant_v the_o supreme_a magistrate_n and_o high_a power_n king_n and_o parliament_n shall_v have_v something_o to_o do_v to_o back_o the_o sentence_n of_o non-communion_n and_o to_o hear_v all_o cause_n and_o difference_n but_o if_o you_o understand_v the_o inferior_n also_o major_n bailiff_n etc._n etc._n i_o represent_v it_o to_o you_o what_o fit_a judge_n most_o of_o they_o be_v to_o judge_v and_o determine_v of_o such_o difficult_a ecclesiastical_a cause_n in_o heresy_n schism_n scandal_n etc._n etc._n which_o fall_v out_o among_o the_o minister_n of_o church_n and_o between_o church_n themselves_o again_o if_o you_o understand_v the_o magistrate_n indefinite_o and_o absolute_o any_o magistrate_n though_o heathen_a popish_a arrian_n as_o mr_n robinson_n do_v in_o his_o apology_n and_o i_o find_v it_o in_o your_o manuscript_n and_o principle_n that_o you_o take_v it_o so_o judge_v then_o in_o yourselves_o if_o the_o church_n have_v not_o remedy_n among_o themselves_o how_o fit_a be_v they_o who_o understand_v not_o christian_a religion_n nor_o the_o doctrine_n according_a to_o godliness_n to_o judge_v of_o the_o great_a difference_n between_o church_n and_o to_o assist_v the_o sentence_n of_o non-communion_n against_o church_n if_o the_o apostle_n paul_n reprove_v the_o corinthian_n so_o in_o 1_o cor._n 6_o 1_o 2_o 3_o 4_o 5_o 6_o 7._o for_o cariy_a matter_n from_o the_o church_n even_o the_o small_a matter_n the_o thing_n that_o pertain_v to_o this_o life_n unto_o unbeliever_n how_o will_v he_o blame_v the_o carry_n of_o thing_n spiritual_a and_o ecclesiastical_a unto_o heathen_a from_o the_o minister_n of_o the_o church_n or_o do_v you_o understand_v that_o there_o shall_v be_v court_n of_o civil_a judicature_n to_o appeal_v unto_o etc._n etc._n then_o there_o must_v be_v certain_a law_n and_o rule_n agree_v upon_o as_o for_o particular_a church_n so_o between_o the_o church_n according_a to_o which_o they_o must_v proceed_v to_o back_o the_o sentence_n of_o non-communion_n and_o protestation_n etc._n etc._n which_o yet_o you_o practise_v not_o now_o the_o many_o inconvenience_n that_o will_v come_v of_o such_o court_v you_o may_v easy_o foresee_v so_o that_o this_o be_v not_o like_a to_o be_v a_o effectual_a remedy_n 6._o what_o shall_v be_v do_v in_o case_n there_o be_v no_o magistrate_n at_o all_o to_o take_v any_o notice_n in_o matter_n of_o religion_n and_o church_n government_n but_o leave_v church_n to_o themselves_o in_o that_o as_o it_o be_v with_o you_o in_o holland_n there_o be_v no_o magistrate_n meddle_v with_o the_o government_n and_o order_n of_o your_o church_n nor_o none_o to_o have_v recourse_n unto_o or_o to_o back_o the_o sentence_n of_o non-communion_n you_o be_v in_o a_o place_n and_o state_n where_o no_o outward_a violence_n or_o any_o other_o external_a authority_n either_o civil_a or_o ecclesiastical_a will_v have_v enforce_v you_o what_o shall_v in_o this_o case_n supply_v the_o defect_n of_o excommunication_n and_o of_o a_o ecclesiastical_a authoritative_a power_n have_v not_o the_o wisdom_n of_o christ_n provide_v remedy_n in_o the_o church_n for_o all_o the_o internal_a necessity_n of_o the_o church_n and_o constitute_v it_o a_o perfect_a body_n within_o itself_o 7._o whether_o can_v it_o be_v rational_o and_o probable_o think_v that_o in_o a_o ordinary_a way_n the_o have_v recourse_n unto_o the_o magistrate_n though_o orthodox_n and_o the_o submit_v to_o his_o particular_a cognizance_n and_o examination_n of_o such_o cause_n with_o his_o back_n the_o sentence_n of_o non-communion_n in_o ecclesiastical_a cause_n in_o case_n of_o sin_n error_n difference_n that_o arise_v in_o church_n shall_v be_v as_o effectual_a and_o sufficient_a a_o remedy_n as_o the_o way_n of_o class_n and_o synod_n and_o that_o the_o magistrate_n interpose_v their_o authority_n and_o power_n of_o another_o nature_n will_v be_v as_o good_a as_o the_o authoritative_a presbyterial_a government_n in_o all_o the_o subordination_n and_o proceed_n of_o it_o now_o that_o it_o be_v not_o probable_a it_o shall_v be_v or_o that_o it_o shall_v serve_v in_o stead_n of_o synod_n and_o class_n take_v these_o probable_a and_o rational_a ground_n 1._o all_o wanton_a wit_n and_o erroneous_a spirit_n all_o your_o sectary_n and_o novelist_n be_v rather_o for_o this_o way_n then_o for_o synod_n and_o class_n though_o most_o of_o they_o will_v have_v neither_o to_o meddle_v at_o all_o in_o matter_n of_o religion_n as_o the_o socinian_o anabaptist_n etc._n etc._n thus_o the_o arminian_n be_v against_o class_n and_o synod_n and_o all_o for_o the_o power_n of_o magistrate_n and_o it_o be_v their_o chief_a engine_n by_o which_o in_o those_o sad_a day_n of_o the_o netherlands_o they_o increase_v their_o party_n and_o come_v to_o such_o a_o height_n sectary_n hope_v that_o if_o they_o can_v decline_v the_o ecclesiastical_a assembly_n they_o shall_v wat_fw-mi by_o flattery_n and_o what_o by_o delay_n through_o other_o great_a business_n of_o state_n and_o what_o by_o sophism_n and_o fallacy_n and_o what_o from_o principle_n of_o policy_n in_o many_o statesman_n and_o what_o by_o friend_n etc._n etc._n effect_n that_o which_o they_o have_v no_o hope_n at_o all_o by_o ecclesiastical_a assembly_n they_o know_v the_o presbytery_n and_o synod_n be_v able_a to_o discover_v their_o fallacy_n answer_v their_o argument_n will_v mind_v those_o business_n whole_o be_v not_o to_o be_v wrought_v upon_o by_o state_n principle_n etc._n etc._n now_o if_o in_o experience_n and_o reason_n this_o way_n be_v as_o powerful_a to_o reduce_v a_o church_n or_o church_n from_o schism_n and_o heresy_n they_o will_v never_o be_v so_o much_o for_o this_o way_n rather_o than_o presbytery_n 2._o natural_a reason_n dictate_v that_o they_o be_v best_a able_a and_o fit_a to_o judge_v and_o resolve_v of_o thing_n who_o do_v above_o other_o give_v themselves_o to_o the_o study_n and_o profession_n of_o those_o thing_n as_o physician_n can_v best_o judge_v of_o wholesome_a meat_n and_o disease_n and_o lawyer_n of_o the_o law_n and_o difference_n arise_v in_o they_o a_o counsel_n of_o war_n of_o difficult_a case_n and_o point_n in_o war_n and_o therefore_o in_o thing_n that_o belong_v to_o the_o spiritual_a good_a of_o the_o soul_n and_o the_o church_n the_o minister_n of_o the_o church_n be_v most_o likely_a to_o resolve_v and_o to_o remedy_v thing_n can_v it_o ordinary_o be_v expect_v that_o the_o magistrate_n shall_v in_o matter_n of_o doctrine_n and_o opinion_n in_o matter_n of_o schism_n and_o in_o matter_n of_o worthiness_n and_o ability_n of_o minister_n and_o in_o many_o case_n that_o arise_v be_v able_a to_o judge_v and_o determine_v matter_n as_o the_o minister_n and_o pastor_n of_o the_o church_n 3._o those_o who_o have_v most_o time_n and_o leisure_n to_o attend_v a_o work_n and_o business_n to_o sift_v into_o it_o to_o hear_v all_o that_o can_v be_v say_v and_o can_v mind_v it_o they_o be_v able_a and_o understand_a be_v likely_a to_o determine_v best_a and_o bring_v thing_n to_o a_o good_a end_n we_o see_v in_o experience_n that_o able_a and_o honest_a man_n through_o multitude_n of_o business_n delay_v long_o slubber_v over_o business_n and_o can_v do_v thing_n so_o effectual_o as_o they_o ought_v and_o seldom_o prove_v good_a arbitratour_n in_o difficult_a intricate_a case_n now_o magistrate_n through_o many_o great_a and_o necessary_a business_n of_o state_n have_v large_a dominion_n can_v so_o well_o attend_v as_o the_o class_n and_o synod_n to_o hear_v and_o examine_v all_o the_o difference_n scandal_n schism_n etc._n etc._n that_o do_v and_o may_v arise_v both_o in_o church_n and_o between_o church_n especial_o as_o will_v fall_v out_o in_o the_o independent_a way_n and_o particular_o in_o this_o way_n of_o submission_n non-communion_n and_o mutual_a protestation_n but_o matter_n will_v be_v delay_v and_o neglect_v or_o escape_v whole_o or_o be_v huddle_v up_o 4._o to_o these_o i_o may_v add_v as_o follow_v that_o the_o magistrate_n through_o his_o just_a greatness_n will_v not_o know_v the_o spirit_n and_o disposition_n of_o minister_n &_o people_n nor_o of_o other_o matter_n so_o well_o as_o the_o minister_n who_o live_v among_o they_o and_o converse_v with_o one_o another_o frequent_o neither_o will_v there_o be_v that_o easiness_n of_o access_n to_o the_o magistrate_n and_o great_a person_n as_o
to_o their_o minister_n and_o pastor_n with_o other_o such_o like_a 8._o but_o in_o ecclesiastical_a matter_n and_o difference_n upon_o the_o magistrate_n interpose_v his_o power_n what_o be_v it_o you_o will_v submit_v unto_o and_o what_o will_v you_o allow_v he_o to_o do_v and_o what_o be_v that_o power_n you_o will_v give_v he_o in_o back_v the_o sentence_n of_o non-communion_n upon_o his_o judgement_n of_o the_o cause_n and_o how_o far_o and_o in_o what_o will_v you_o obey_v he_o that_o so_o we_o may_v understand_v how_o this_o civil_a power_n be_v intend_v by_o you_o for_o a_o remedy_n and_o help_v in_o church_n and_o between_o church_n for_o instance_n will_v you_o submit_v not_o to_o gather_v church_n nor_o set_v up_o assembly_n witho●…●…is_o leave_v and_o upon_o complaint_n of_o the_o many_o mischief_n and_o difference_n occasion_v thereupon_o will_v you_o upon_o his_o hear_v both_o side_n and_o judge_v that_o those_o who_o be_v gather_v shall_v be_v dissolve_v dissolve_v they_o and_o not_o meet_v in_o those_o way_n any_o more_o will_v you_o upon_o some_o member_n complain_v to_o the_o magistrate_n of_o some_o minister_n or_o minister_n in_o their_o church_n for_o preach_v erroneous_a and_o unprofitable_a doctrine_n mere_a novelty_n subtlety_n and_o the_o magistrate_n upon_o particular_a cognizance_n and_o examination_n of_o such_o cause_n judge_v that_o he_o shall_v preach_v no_o more_o will_v the_o minister_n forbear_v upon_o it_o or_o the_o church_n to_o hear_v he_o in_o case_n the_o minister_n will_v not_o yield_v will_v the_o church_n now_o go_v choose_v a_o new_a and_o orthodox_n minister_n upon_o it_o or_o in_o case_n a_o member_n or_o more_o be_v unjust_o excommunicate_v and_o they_o complain_v to_o the_o magistrate_n who_o call_v the_o church_n to_o account_v and_o hear_v both_o side_n shall_v judge_v on_o the_o complaiants_n side_n and_o now_o order_v the_o church_n to_o absolve_v he_o and_o order_v they_o to_o confess_v their_o sin_n public_o and_o appoint_v they_o to_o keep_v a_o day_n of_o humiliation_n for_o it_o and_o order_v they_o to_o give_v he_o such_o a_o sum_n of_o money_n for_o the_o wrong_n trouble_n and_o loss_n of_o his_o time_n in_o follow_v the_o business_n against_o they_o will_v the_o church_n now_o submit_v to_o do_v all_o this_o yea_o or_o no_o what_o say_v you_o to_o these_o and_o the_o like_a case_n now_o i_o ask_v you_o this_o in_o the_o close_a because_o you_o pretend_v a_o great_a deal_n of_o submission_n to_o the_o magistrate_n and_o to_o give_v he_o much_o power_n which_o though_o you_o do_v grant_v yet_o for_o the_o many_o reason_n and_o ground_n already_o specify_v this_o will_v not_o countervail_v the_o way_n of_o the_o presbyterian_o in_o their_o spiritual_a censure_n by_o presbyter_n and_o synod_n whether_o you_o clear_o and_o plain_o allow_v this_o to_o the_o magistrate_n because_o i_o find_v in_o manuscript_n and_o hear_v that_o in_o sermon_n by_o man_n of_o your_o churchway_n the_o contrary_a be_v public_o preach_v and_o hold_v as_o for_o example_n in_o that_o treatise_n about_o a_o church_n which_o go_v under_o one_o of_o your_o name_n there_o be_v this_o passage_n with_o more_o to_o that_o purpose_n the_o saint_n need_v not_o expect_v their_o power_n or_o leave_v for_o to_o gather_v together_o so_o as_o without_o it_o such_o a_o combination_n be_v unlawful_a nor_o shall_v they_o forbear_v it_o out_o of_o conscience_n of_o the_o magistrate_n prohibition_n indeed_o if_o the_o magistrate_n shall_v force_v or_o compel_v they_o to_o forbear_v or_o persecute_v they_o they_o may_v forbear_v actual_a assemble_v act._n 8._o 1._o not_o because_o the_o magistrate_n forbid_v it_o but_o in_o mercy_n to_o themselves_o and_o indeed_o about_o a_o church_n christian_n magistrate_n have_v no_o more_o power_n then_o heathen_a magistrate_n have_v so_o that_o this_o be_v speak_v by_o you_o where_o magistrate_n be_v christian_n and_o where_o church_n be_v already_o settle_v and_o add_v to_o this_o that_o m._n s._n in_o his_o reply_n in_o defence_n of_o your_o apology_n be_v against_o coercive_a and_o coactive_a power_n in_o matter_n of_o religion_n and_o that_o you_o all_o hold_v a_o toleration_n and_o that_o the_o magistrate_n ought_v not_o to_o hinder_v man_n or_o punish_v they_o for_o the_o matter_n of_o their_o conscience_n how_o then_o notwithstanding_o all_o your_o discourse_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o magistrate_n which_o add_v to_o non-communion_n will_v be_v a_o effectual_a mean_n to_o relieve_v person_n injure_v to_o reduce_v church_n and_o person_n go_v in_o schism_n and_o error_n shall_v person_n injure_v be_v remedy_v or_o church_n and_o person_n reduce_v for_o suppose_v the_o person_n or_o church_n that_o now_o fall_v into_o such_o error_n and_o schism_n will_v pretend_v nay_o it_o be_v so_o real_o that_o they_o in_o their_o conscience_n hold_v error_n for_o truth_n and_o thereupon_o withdraw_v from_o such_o church_n to_o other_o nay_o suppose_v those_o who_o now_o receive_v these_o new_a truth_n shall_v cast_v out_o of_o their_o fellowship_n and_o excommunicate_v some_o for_o hold_v otherwise_o as_o for_o instance_n a_o church_n fall_v into_o antinomianisme_n shall_v censure_v some_o of_o their_o member_n that_o remain_v orthodox_n for_o legal_a christian_n and_o for_o be_v enemy_n to_o freegrace_n and_o shall_v judge_v themselves_o bind_v to_o do_v so_o in_o these_o and_o such_o like_a case_n what_o remedy_n be_v there_o for_o miscarry_v church_n by_o all_o the_o power_n of_o the_o magistrate_n you_o pretend_v to_o give_v to_o he_o but_o this_o be_v bring_v in_o here_o by_o you_o and_o give_v to_o he_o to_o put_v of_o that_o strong_a argument_n against_o your_o way_n and_o that_o you_o may_v have_v something_o for_o present_a to_o blind_v the_o eye_n and_o stop_v the_o mouth_n of_o many_o that_o look_v no_o further_o that_o it_o may_v serve_v your_o turn_n at_o such_o a_o straight_o whereas_o upon_o other_o principle_n you_o deny_v the_o magistrate_n this_o when_o it_o shall_v come_v to_o be_v a_o matter_n of_o conscience_n and_o now_o by_o all_o the_o several_a particular_n under_o this_o five_o head_n the_o understand_a reader_n may_v observe_v that_o not_o only_o in_o many_o respect_v your_o non-communion_n and_o magistrate_n power_n be_v not_o a_o remedy_n comparable_a to_o the_o presbyterian_a way_n not_o proper_a nor_o to_o the_o nature_n of_o the_o offence_n and_o thing_n in_o question_n a_o way_n in_o stead_n of_o bring_v thing_n to_o a_o end_n redress_v and_o mend_v matter_n amiss_o that_o will_v be_v but_o the_o begin_n of_o more_o strife_n and_o make_v more_o difference_n and_o evil_n then_o either_o it_o sinde_n or_o can_v heal_v the_o mother_n and_o nurse_n of_o confusion_n disorder_n and_o endless_a contention_n but_o also_o that_o all_o the_o power_n here_o pretend_v to_o be_v give_v to_o the_o magistrate_n upon_o examination_n be_v no_o such_o matter_n nor_o will_v not_o amount_v to_o make_v good_a the_o end_n propound_v whereas_o the_o presbyterial_a government_n here_o scandalize_v as_o either_o whole_o inconsistent_a with_o this_o form_n of_o civil_a government_n or_o else_o not_o give_v it_o its_o due_a will_v be_v find_v by_o its_o principle_n not_o only_o to_o have_v powerful_a spiritual_a remedy_n for_o all_o spiritual_a evil_n of_o the_o church_n but_o will_v be_v find_v in_o many_o respect_n to_o make_v use_n of_o and_o to_o give_v honour_n and_o power_n to_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n as_o a_o nurse_n father_n from_o first_o to_o last_o even_o in_o the_o ordinary_a way_n of_o the_o order_n and_o government_n of_o the_o church_n beyond_o you_o beside_o what_o they_o give_v more_o in_o extraordinary_a case_n in_o a_o church_n miserable_o corrupt_v disorder_a etc._n etc._n of_o which_o the_o reader_n may_v read_v at_o large_a in_o apollonius_n who_o be_v a_o great_a presbyterian_a cap._n 2._o and_o so_o learned_a 83._o zanchius_n in_o his_o tractate_n de_fw-fr magistratis_n show_v it_o be_v in_o the_o power_n of_o the_o magistrate_n not_o to_o suffer_v heretic_n nor_o erroneous_a person_n to_o preach_v and_o he_o give_v he_o coactive_a punitive_a power_n to_o cut_v they_o off_o beza_n a_o great_a presbyterian_a in_o his_o epistle_n and_o other_o write_n in_o matter_n of_o religion_n do_v not_o exclude_v the_o magistrate_n but_o give_v he_o that_o power_n in_o some_o thing_n which_o you_o deny_v but_o beside_o that_o power_n they_o give_v the_o magistrate_n they_o stand_v for_o as_o needful_a in_o the_o church_n class_n and_o synod_n for_o the_o government_n of_o it_o zanchy_a show_v that_o discipline_n can_v 713._o take_v place_n where_o the_o minister_n never_o meet_v together_o the_o me●…ting_n of_o minister_n and_o ecclesiastical_a synod_n we_o judge_v most_o necessary_a as_o no_o polity_n commonwealth_n or_o kingdom_n can_v consist_v without_o their_o meeting_n senate_n and_o counsel_n
and_o vigour_n be_v sensible_o increase_v the_o lord_n be_v praise_v and_o beside_o these_o letter_n the_o thing_n itself_o speak_v for_o whereas_o in_o england_n he_o be_v not_o able_a to_o preach_v nor_o have_v not_o hardly_o three_o time_n in_o three_o year_n after_o he_o come_v into_o holland_n he_o be_v pastor_n of_o the_o church_n at_o arnheim_n and_o preach_v constant_o and_o have_v that_o strength_n to_o beget_v a_o son_n whereas_o he_o be_v marry_v many_o year_n in_o england_n never_o have_v any_o child_n and_o not_o only_o from_o he_o but_o from_o other_o also_o there_o have_v be_v many_o letter_n send_v to_o commend_v the_o place_n where_o you_o lose_v your_o fellow_n labourer_n to_o be_v so_o healthful_a and_o pleasant_a as_o to_o resemble_v they_o to_o bury_v in_o suffolk_n and_o hart_n ford_n as_o for_o that_o high_a praise_n of_o those_o two_o worthy_a minister_n as_o precious_a man_n as_o this_o earth_n bear_v any_o i_o think_v it_o become_v you_o not_o they_o be_v you_o and_o of_o your_o way_n and_o can_v be_v interpret_v by_o the_o understand_a reader_n but_o that_o you_o take_v occasion_n here_o as_o in_o all_o other_o place_n of_o your_o apologetical_a narration_n to_o magnify_v and_o cry_v up_o your_o own_o party_n the_o more_o to_o make_v people_n to_o be_v in_o love_n with_o your_o way_n which_o have_v as_o precious_a man_n as_o this_o earth_n bear_v any_o but_o i_o judge_v it_o be_v too_o high_a and_o hyperbolical_a for_o though_o i_o dear_o love_v the_o man_n and_o do_v acknowledge_v they_o be_v precious_a and_o believe_v they_o be_v go_v as_o that_o great_a divine_a say_v in_o his_o sickness_n he_o be_v go_v where_o luther_n and_o zuinglius_fw-la do_v well_o agree_v yet_o i_o must_v needs_o correct_v that_o phrase_n as_o this_o earth_n bear_v any_o for_o i_o be_o of_o opinion_n that_o both_o in_o learning_n and_o piety_n they_o be_v inferior_a to_o some_o not_o only_o in_o the_o earth_n which_o be_v wide_a and_o spacious_a contain_v church_n and_o minister_n more_o precious_a than_o you_o know_v of_o but_o in_o this_o earth_n of_o england_n and_o scotland_n and_o your_o encomium_n of_o they_o if_o you_o remember_v what_o you_o write_v before_o of_o some_o precious_a man_n alive_a now_o in_o new-england_n as_o ever_o this_o kingdom_n breed_v and_o grant_v that_o new-england_n be_v the_o earth_n do_v amount_v to_o this_o that_o these_o two_o minister_n mr_n archer_n and_o mr_n harris_n be_v as_o precious_a man_n as_o ever_o be_v in_o england_n which_o you_o must_v pardon_v i_o if_o i_o doubt_v it_o for_o i_o believe_v whitaker_n reynolds_n baynes_n greeneham_n dod_n brightman_n with_o many_o more_o be_v more_o precious_a as_o for_o that_o other_o instance_n yourselves_o come_v hardly_o off_o that_o service_n with_o your_o health_n yea_o life_n i_o have_v not_o hear_v of_o any_o great_a sickness_n any_o of_o you_o five_o have_v there_o except_v mr_n bridge_n who_o come_v hardly_o off_o with_o his_o health_n some_o of_o you_o indeed_o have_v ague_n there_o which_o you_o may_v have_v have_v in_o england_n in_o suffolk_n or_o in_o oxfordshire_n and_o for_o mr_n bridges_n sickness_n i_o judge_v it_o be_v as_o well_o occasion_v and_o strengthen_v upon_o the_o unhappy_a difference_n and_o bitter_a division_n between_o he_o and_o mr_n simpson_n and_o mr_n ward_n and_o their_o church_n and_o the_o wicked_a report_n raise_v upon_o he_o which_o discontent_v and_o trouble_v his_o spirit_n as_o by_o the_o distemper_n of_o the_o place_n or_o change_v of_o the_o air_n and_o for_o other_o of_o you_o how_o fat_a and_o well_o like_v you_o come_v back_o into_o england_n and_o how_o all_o of_o you_o return_v well_o clad_v and_o shine_v beyond_o most_o of_o we_o who_o live_v always_o in_o england_n many_o can_v witness_v and_o have_v speak_v of_o it_o all_o which_o be_v no_o great_a sign_n either_o of_o the_o many_o other_o misery_n the_o companion_n of_o your_o banishment_n nor_o of_o the_o come_n off_o so_o hardly_o with_o your_o health_n and_o life_n when_o it_o please_v god_n to_o bring_v we_o his_o poor_a exile_n back_o again_o apolog_fw-la in_o these_o revolution_n of_o the_o time_n as_o also_o of_o the_o condition_n of_o this_o kingdom_n into_o our_o own_o land_n the_o pour_v forth_o of_o manifold_a prayer_n and_o tear_n for_o the_o prosperity_n whereof_o have_v be_v no_o small_a part_n of_o that_o public_a worship_n we_o offer_v up_o to_o god_n in_o a_o strange_a land_n we_o find_v the_o judgement_n of_o many_o of_o our_o godly_a learned_a brother_n in_o the_o ministry_n that_o desire_v a_o general_a reformation_n to_o differ_v from_o we_o in_o some_o thing_n wherein_o we_o do_v profess_o judge_v the_o calvinian_a reform_a church_n of_o the_o first_o reformation_n from_o out_o of_o popery_n to_o stand_v in_o need_n of_o a_o further_a reformation_n themselves_o and_o it_o may_v without_o prejudice_n to_o they_o or_o the_o imputation_n of_o schism_n in_o we_o from_o they_o be_v 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in_o as_o much_o as_o lay_v in_o you_o do_v not_o you_o so_o act_v for_o your_o own_o opinion_n and_o church_n way_n that_o you_o will_v have_v hazard_v the_o kingdom_n religion_n and_o all_o rather_o than_o the_o loss_n of_o your_o independency_n which_o you_o know_v the_o scot_n be_v so_o averse_a unto_o 7._o whether_o have_v not_o some_o of_o you_o in_o conference_n with_o many_o good_a people_n and_o by_o discourse_n in_o private_a ac●…ed_v for_o yourselves_o and_o way_n by_o stumble_v they_o in_o the_o point_n of_o a_o particular_a church_n and_o in_o the_o point_n of_o come_v to_o the_o sacrament_n of_o the_o lord_n supper_n and_o by_o plead_v for_o a_o toleration_n of_o all_o opinion_n that_o may_v stand_v with_o save_v grace_n and_o do_v none_o of_o you_o remember_v what_o be_v answer_v you_o that_o polig●…mie_n may_v stand_v with_o save_v grace_n and_o must_v that_o be_v tolerate_v 8._o whether_o have_v not_o some_o of_o you_o tamper_v with_o some_o parliament_n man_n about_o 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a_o few_o in_o comparison_n and_o go_v in_o a_o new_a different_a way_n from_o all_o the_o reform_a church_n and_o the_o destructivenesse_n of_o your_o principle_n to_o reformation_n with_o the_o danger_n of_o they_o in_o draw_v away_o and_o steal_v our_o sheep_n from_o we_o and_o the_o contempt_n of_o our_o ministry_n occasion_v by_o your_o principle_n among_o all_o the_o people_n general_o of_o your_o way_n as_o also_o your_o leave_v the_o land_n in_o the_o great_a need_n notwithstanding_o all_o these_o and_o many_o more_o that_o all_o the_o godly_a minister_n of_o city_n and_o country_n shall_v carry_v themselves_o towards_o you_o with_o that_o love_n respect_n fairness_n brotherly_a kindness_n as_o they_o do_v may_v have_v provoke_v you_o indeed_o but_o in_o another_o way_n than_o you_o express_v it_o and_o for_o the_o truth_n of_o this_o i_o appeal_v to_o your_o own_o breast_n and_o to_o the_o knowledge_n of_o my_o brethren_n and_o to_o these_o follow_a demonstration_n 1._o there_o be_v a_o great_a deal_n of_o love_a respect_n and_o fair_a carriage_n towards_o you_o both_o in_o admit_v you_o into_o their_o pulpit_n and_o in_o forbear_v all_o thing_n offensive_a to_o you_o and_o your_o party_n before_o the_o sermon_n to_o gratify_v you_o 2._o there_o be_v a_o great_a deal_n of_o fair_a respect_n to_o you_o in_o admit_v you_o into_o their_o society_n and_o public_a meeting_n about_o the_o matter_n of_o reformation_n 3._o there_o be_v a_o general_a silence_n by_o the_o godly_a minister_n i_o fear_v unto_o sinful_a in_o forbear_v preach_v against_o your_o point_n and_o that_o when_o some_o of_o you_o preach_v for_o your_o way_n and_o many_o pamphlet_n be_v print_v for_o it_o 4._o the_o minister_n suffer_v some_o of_o you_o and_o no_o
be_v sufficient_o know_v and_o however_o all_o these_o thing_n of_o no_o other_o interest_n but_o a_o subsistence_n in_o our_o own_o land_n and_o of_o enjoy_v the_o ordinance_n of_o christ_n and_o not_o know_v where_o else_o with_o safety_n health_n and_o livelihood_n to_o set_v our_o foot_n on_o earth_n be_v hold_v forth_o as_o specious_a pretence_n to_o the_o parliament_n and_o reader_n to_o persuade_v and_o to_o allure_v they_o yet_o the_o bottom_n of_o all_o this_o desire_n of_o a_o toleration_n in_o england_n though_o conceal_v be_v that_o there_o be_v no_o other_o place_n on_o earth_n where_o you_o be_v like_a to_o propagate_v your_o way_n to_o gain_v so_o great_a a_o party_n to_o enjoy_v such_o full_a and_o rich_a congregation_n and_o to_o have_v that_o respect_n and_o applause_n in_o your_o way_n as_o in_o england_n and_o in_o england_n as_o london_n and_o the_o adjacent_a part_n or_o where_o you_o can_v have_v those_o fair_a hope_n and_o probability_n of_o draw_v so_o great_a a_o part_n of_o a_o kingdom_n to_o your_o churchway_n as_o here_o and_o where_o if_o you_o go_v on_o to_o act_v as_o diligent_o and_o politic_o as_o you_o have_v do_v in_o these_o three_o year_n last_o pass_v and_o the_o minister_n be_v as_o general_o silent_a and_o the_o common_a people_n of_o the_o kingdom_n come_v a_o little_a more_o to_o understand_v your_o principle_n and_o have_v time_n to_o digest_v and_o consider_v of_o the_o great_a liberty_n and_o power_n they_o have_v thereby_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o kingdom_n may_v in_o time_n come_v to_o be_v behold_v to_o you_o for_o a_o toleration_n of_o presbytery_n if_o it_o be_v establish_v which_o you_o will_v as_o soon_o grant_v if_o you_o come_v to_o have_v power_n in_o your_o hand_n as_o you_o will_v episcopacy_n and_o popery_n many_o of_o your_o churchway_n ordinary_o affirm_v they_o have_v rather_o have_v episcopacy_n then_o presbytery_n and_o it_o have_v be_v affirm_v to_o i_o by_o a_o minister_n of_o note_n that_o a_o 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all_o under_o his_o power_n and_o charge_n to_o worship_n god_n upon_o which_o learned_a divine_n as_o zanchius_n excellent_o show_v the_o duty_n of_o magistrate_n in_o reference_n to_o command_v and_o provide_v that_o their_o people_n shall_v worship_v god_n according_a to_o his_o will_n rom._n 13._o 4._o ephes._n 5._o 11._o 1_o tim._n 5._o 22._o 2_o john_n 11._o v_o revel_n 〈◊〉_d 20._o with_o many_o other_o place_n in_o scripture_n of_o remove_v away_o of_o evil_a and_o of_o not_o consent_v to_o evil_n &c_n &c_n the_o parliament_n be_v bind_v to_o establish_v and_o to_o command_v obedience_n to_o that_o reformation_n which_o be_v judge_v most_o agreeable_a to_o the_o word_n and_o to_o suppress_v and_o hinder_v all_o other_o it_o be_v excellent_o do_v by_o the_o parliament_n to_o call_v together_o so_o many_o able_a godly_a and_o orthodox_n divine_v to_o debate_v and_o find_v out_o the_o mind_n and_o will_n of_o god_n for_o doctrine_n worship_n and_o discipline_n and_o to_o give_v 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will_v not_o be_v well_o please_v with_o it_o neither_o can_v you_o answer_v it_o unto_o god_n you_o may_v lawful_o nay_o you_o ought_v in_o that_o which_o be_v good_a to_o compel_v man_n though_o they_o pretend_v conscience_n shall_v the_o error_n of_o other_o man_n conscience_n hindr_v you_o from_o yield_v that_o service_n which_o god_n requite_v of_o you_o may_v a_o parliament_n displease_v god_n to_o please_v man_n or_o may_v they_o be_v please●…s_n of_o other_o man_n sin_n and_o wink_v at_o evil_a to_o content_v some_o person_n no_o parliament_n in_o make_v law_n for_o religion_n must_v depend_v on_o the_o will_n of_o god_n ●…led_v in_o his_o word_n in_o the_o best_a and_o 〈◊〉_d way_n communicate_v to_o they_o and_o not_o upon_o the_o conscience_n of_o some_o people_n 〈◊〉_d the_o toleration_n desire_v be_v against_o the_o solemn_a league_n and_o covenant_n for_o reformation_n take_v by_o the_o parliament_n and_o the_o kingdom_n ●…on_n of_o england_n and_o scotland_n and_o 〈◊〉_d be_v co●…ed_v to_o without_o 〈◊〉_d of_o that_o oath_n and_o covenant_n so_o that_o the_o apology_n and_o motion_n for_o a_o toleration_n come_v ●…o_o late_o the_o door_n be_v shut_v against_o it_o the_o kingdom_n hand_n be_v bind_v so_o that_o if_o such_o a_o toleration_n be_v not_o in_o it●…_n self_n unlawful_a and_o against_o the_o duty_n of_o the_o magistrate_n yet_o now_o because_o of_o the_o oath_n and_o covenant_n it_o be_v unlawful_a so_o that_o whatever_o may_v have_v be_v grant_v before_o can_v now_o lest_o the_o kingdom_n shall_v be_v guilty_a before_o god_n of_o covenant-breaking_a now_o a●…_n toleration_n and_o this_o move_n for_o a_o toleration_n by_o the_o apologist_n be_v express_o against_o these_o branch_n of_o the_o covenant_n 1._o against_o that_o clause_n in_o the_o first_o branch_n of_o endeavour_v the_o reformation_n of_o religion_n in_o the_o kingdom_n of_o england_n and_o ixeland_n in_o doctrine_n worship_n government_n and_o discipline_n according_a to_o the_o 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god_n in_o the_o three_o kingdom_n to_o the_o near_a conjunction_n and_o uniformity_n in_o religion_n confession_n of_o faith_n form_n of_o church_n government_n directory_n so●…_n worship_n and_o catechi●…ing_n now_o if_o the_o parliament_n have_v covenant_v so_o how_o can_v it_o grant_v a_o toleration_n of_o so_o different_a a_o form_n of_o church_n government_n and_o worship_n as_o the_o independent_a way_n be_v from_o the_o presbyterial_a and_o how_o can_v you_o be_v excuse_v from_o explicit_a formal_a breach_n of_o covenant_n in_o this_o part_n of_o your_o apology_n have_v swear_v and_o sub●…bed_v to_o endeavour_v by_o all_o mean_n to_o bring_v the_o church_n of_o god_n in_o these_o three_o kingdom_n to_o the_o near_a conjunction_n and_o uniformity_n in_o religion_n who_o in_o stead_n of_o so_o labour_v and_o endeavour_v or_o ever_o so_o much_o as_o try_v whether_o you_o with_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o church_n may_v not_o be_v bring_v into_o a_o near_a conjunction_n and_o 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of_o schism_n and_o whatever_o shall_v be_v find_v contrary_a to_o find_v doctrine_n and_o the_o power_n of_o godliness_n lest_o we_o partake_v in_o other_o man_n sin_n now_o that_o which_o you_o move_v for_o be_v schism_n and_o contrary_a to_o sound_v doctrine_n the_o churchway_n be_v a_o schism_n beside_o many_o of_o your_o church_n principle_n be_v against_o sound_a doctrine_n and_o the_o power_n of_o godliness_n as_o that_o in_o your_o apology_n about_o the_o subject_n of_o excommunication_n as_o that_o of_o a_o few_o people_n have_v power_n to_o join_v together_o and_o set_v up_o a_o church_n and_o choose_v what_o minister_n they_o will_v as_o that_o of_o the_o independency_n of_o particular_a congregation_n from_o any_o authenitative_a power_n etc._n etc._n so_o that_o the_o parliament_n in_o the_o midst_n of_o their_o reformation_n and_o bless_a conjunction_n according_a to_o the_o word_n of_o god_n with_o the_o reform_a church_n shall_v in_o allow_v you_o a_o toleration_n suffer_v a_o formal_a schism_n both_o in_o worship_n and_o government_n in_o the_o midst_n of_o these_o kingdom_n 4_o this_o toleration_n sue_v for_o be_v against_o a_o part_n of_o the_o four_o branch_n endeavour_v the_o discovery_n of_o such_o as_o have_v be_v evil_a instrument_n by_o hinder_v reformation_n of_o religion_n or_o make_v any_o faction_n or_o party_n among_o the_o people_n contrary_a to_o this_o league_n and_o covenant_n now_o the_o parliament_n be_v bind_v by_o this_o against_o all_o person_n and_o thing_n which_o hinder_v the_o reformation_n and_o make_v any_o faction_n or_o party_n among_o the_o people_n now_o whether_o a_o toleration_n grant_v yea_o but_o move_v for_o will_v not_o hinder_v the_o reformation_n of_o religion_n and_o make_v faction_n and_o party_n among_o the_o people_n let_v it_o be_v consider_v i_o confess_v i_o wonder_v how_o the_o apologist_n ever_o take_v this_o covenant_n or_o have_v take_v
unless_o they_o be_v church_n member_n with_o many_o more_o all_o slat_n against_o the_o primitive_a pattern_n have_v ever_o be_v from_o first_o to_o last_o a_o fountain_n of_o evil_a and_o a_o root_n of_o bitterness_n of_o many_o bitter_a division_n and_o separation_n among_o themselves_o of_o manifold_a error_n and_o other_o mischief_n in_o those_o church_n and_o place_n where_o they_o live_v god_n have_v always_o witness_n against_o it_o and_o never_o blessing_n it_o with_o peace_n and_o truth_n i_o shall_v not_o need_v to_o relate_v the_o history_n of_o the_o anaptist_n the_o high_a form_n of_o independency_n and_o the_o church_n way_n what_o evil_n they_o fall_v into_o and_o the_o mischief_n they_o bring_v upon_o germany_n and_o how_o god_n curse_a and_o scatter_v they_o as_o for_o the_o brownist_n the_o middle_a form_n of_o independency_n the_o apologist_n themselves_o confess_v they_o have_v fatal_a miscarriage_n and_o shipwreck_n and_o i_o can_v tell_v a_o sad_a story_n but_o 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pure_a in_o doctrine_n etc._n etc._n the_o other_o make_v minister_n and_o people_n turn_v arminian_n socinian_o etc._n etc._n 2_o answ._n there_o be_v another_o reason_n why_o it_o may_v so_o fall_v out_o in_o the_o low-countries_n because_o presbyterial_a government_n have_v not_o its_o free_a course_n there_o in_o synod_n but_o it_o be_v much_o disturb_v over_o it_o be_v in_o france_n geneva_n scotland_n whereas_o by_o their_o canon_n and_o constitution_n in_o the_o netherlands_o there_o shall_v be_v a_o national_n synod_n once_o in_o three_o year_n they_o have_v not_o nor_o can_v procure_v one_o in_o twenty_o year_n and_o upward_o and_o whereas_o provincial_n synod_n shall_v be_v yearly_o they_o have_v they_o in_o some_o province_n but_o once_o in_o five_o and_o seven_o year_n beside_o there_o be_v other_o disturbance_n in_o presbyterial_a government_n which_o hinder_v the_o free_a course_n of_o it_o in_o holland_n many_o encroachment_n be_v make_v upon_o the_o right_n of_o their_o church_n due_a to_o they_o by_o virtue_n of_o their_o discipline_n and_o heretofore_o establish_v in_o a_o word_n that_o anabaptisticall_a and_o familisticall_a spirit_n in_o many_o and_o that_o corrupt_a spirit_n and_o principle_n in_o other_o with_o those_o principle_n of_o toleration_n do_v much_o check_n and_o stop_v presbyterial_a government_n from_o have_v its_o perfect_a work_n and_o bring_v forth_o its_o full_a effect_n the_o true_a reason_n of_o so_o many_o minister_n and_o people_n turn_v arminian_n and_o socinian_o in_o the_o low-countries_n be_v the_o want_n of_o synod_n which_o arminius_n and_o his_o follower_n always_o decline_v and_o by_o flatter_v the_o magistrate_n keep_v off_o for_o many_o year_n in_o which_o time_n so_o many_o fell_a whereas_o if_o presbyterial_a government_n have_v have_v its_o course_n and_o a_o national_n synod_n have_v be_v call_v yea_o but_o a_o provincial_n for_o the_o arminian_n to_o have_v answer_v in_o at_o first_o before_o it_o have_v so_o much_o
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