necessary for our bodies and soules Can he or will hée not dooe that without those thinges wilt they binde and tye his grace vertue and power and inclose shut it in wax salt and water as they doe require by their prayers If those thinges be not charmes sorceries and enchauntmentes I knowe not what we may call charmes sorceries enchauntmentes Hillarius When they do coniure and blesse their welles and fontes christening places they gape ouer the water and blowe in it as though they had the holy Ghost within their throate and that they would shut him in it It is very néedefull that that holy Ghost whome they doe plunge and shutte in that water can swim or otherwise he shall bee in daunger of drowning Theophilus Euen as they doe with the water war so doe they with the fire and incenie vppon Easter euen when they blesse their Pascall of wax Eusebius Sith that all that is done vnto the honour of God can it be but good Theophilus Howe can it be to the honour of God to attribute vnto the creatures the honour which beloÌ„geth vnto him Or to shut vppe and lymit his grace vertue and power by them And to ouerthrowe and tourne vpside downe altogether the order of God and the vse for which hée hath created them for hée hath not created the water salt fire the ware for to purifie the soules for to oriue away the Diuelles and for to be remedyes to all corporall and spirituall diseases But he hath created the water for to drincke for to wash awaye the filthinesse of the body for to refresh sprinckle and helpe the naturall necessities for which God hath ordayned them As much must wée vnderstande of the fire salte and ware and all other creatures whiche cannot serue vs but accordinge to their naturall properties and according to the ordinaunce of god Wherefore whosoeuer altereth and chaungeth that order of nature and vse of the creatures otherwise then he ought attributinge vnto them any other propertie then that whiche God hath gyuen vnto them hée blasphemeth God and is worthy to be taken for a Sorcerer and a Magitian For wherein doth a good Phisitian and a Philosopher differ from a Charmer and Magitian but in this that those doe followe the order of God in his creatures and their naturall dysposition and those héero doe peruerte and ouerthrowe it and wyll by woords charmes and coniurations chaunge their nature and bring them to other effectes then God hath appointed them Eusebius By thy reasons thou doest also abolysh the vse of the Sacramentes Theophilus That is an other thinge forasmuche as it is ordeyned of GOD who maye make hys creatures to serue to what it pleaseth hym For hée which is the Lord may vse them eyther after that order as hée hath appointed them of nature or miraculously aboue nature Although that who so would attribute vnto the water of Baptisme or vnto the breade and wine in the Lordes supper that whiche you doe attribute vnto your waters saltes fires inceuse and waxe shoulde bée greatly to be rebuked For all the vertue and efficacie of the Sacramentes doe depende of the promise of God of which you haue nothinge in your ceremonies invented and forged by your owne sence and vnderstanding wythout the worde of God no more then the Magicians and enchaunters haue in their witchinges and inuocations Wherefore we cannot repute and take such superstitions followinge the manner forme as you doe holde but for such as those haue bene of whiche you haue taken the example Hillarius But how can it bée pleasing and agréeable to God to forsake and renounce Iesus Christ his sonne and the Christianitie for to make themselues Panims or Iewes Tell me Eusebius if thou doe not thincke that the Chaldeans and Persians are worthy to be accompted and taken for Idolaters to baue had the fire in so great admiration that they haue worshiped it as God Eusebius Who doubteth of that Hillarius Now what reason haue you for to excuse your selfe of that same Idolatry more lawfully then they Theophilus That Idolatry is the most auncient which hath bene almost amongest men chiefely before that there was any vse of Images And I doubte not but that wée referre it vnto the Idolatry of the fire followinge also the opinion of Sainct Hierome and of Lyra that which Moses calleth Vr of the Chaldees For notwithstanding that that name is taken for the place wherein Tarch the Father of Abraham dwelled yet neuerthelesse it is very lyke that that place hath taken his name of that fire which the Chaldeans worshipped as wée sée dayly that many Townes and Villages dooe take their name of the Gods Sainctes and Patrons whiche are there adored honoured as are S. Claudus S. Hippolite Sainct Denis Sainct Iames others innumerable For Vr signifieth in the Hebrew and Chaldee tongue fire and furnayse And vnto that agréeth well that which is spoken off in the booke of Iosua that Tareh the Father of Abraham was an Idolater although there bee no mencion made that hée worshypped Images and Idolls But it was bicause he was defiled and infected with that Idolatry of the Chaldees for the which Abraham departed from his countrey in not worshypping the fire in stéede of the true God. Hillarius That Idolatry hath not bene onely among the Chaldees and Persians But it is also spredde abroade amonge other Nations who of longe time haue in lyke manner worshypped the fire vnder the name of Vesta who was in greate honour and estimation amonge the Troyans before the warre of Troy and from thence hath bene wyth the other Gods caryed into Italy by Aeneas and so came vppe the custome to kéepe a continuall fire in his Temple at Rome within a Bore or Pyxe as they doe nowe the holye hoaste For that cause the Poetes manye times dooe call it the Troyans fire and the fire of Laomedon the founder and buylder of troy The Greekes also dyd the lyke in Athens and Delphos And Seruius wituesseth that they kept it also in the Temple of Iupiter and of Minerua by which they woulde vnderstande the earthly heauen and the celestiall fire And Stâ—abo hath written almost the lyke that is to say that there was an olde Temple of Minerua Poliade in which was kept a Lampe continually burning and there was a Couent of Nounes I thincke that Pope Sabinianus dyd take example of the samo when that he constituted and ordeined that Lampes shoulde be continually kept burninge in the Temples as Platine and Volaterran dooe witnesse Theophilus If they had the lyke that of which Sainct Augustine maketh mencion which was inextinguible in a certeine Temple of Venus whiche the Panims had they woulde make of it a great myracle and would esteeme it for a goodly relike For he sayth that it contimeth alwaies burning in the aire abroad without euer being put out or quenched eyther with the winde
or touching them as the son of y Centurion But euen as thereby hée woulde declare that al procéeded from his vertue and power not of the creatures Also sometime hée vsed them for to let vs to vnderstande that when hée woulde they shoulde serue hée gaue them such vertue and propertie as it pleaseth him for to learne vs that wée ought not to despise the meanes that hée hath gyuen vnto vs how vile soeuer our reason iudgeth them to bée For whatsoeuer they may bée so that hee hath ordeined them and that wée haue hys promise wée muste not doubt but by them hée doth that which hée hath promysed Therefore hée hath taken thinges which had not of their owne nature the vertue to bringe to passe those effectes to whiche they haue bene applyed that all men might knowe that from hym onely procéeded the vertue and not of any ordinary or naturall cause But these miraculous woorkes are nothinge at all lyke vnto those which our Priestes doe and theire ceremonies haue not such promises If by that they could remedy she corrupt waters as Eliseus did we will acknowledge the gyft to woorke myracles to bée in them which was in Eliseus But to what ende serueth the salt in the water Hillarius To what ende serueth it to bée put into the mouthes of the little children when they baptize them Theophilus As much as their spittle profited the infants béeing put into their mouthes vppon the tongue and vppon the eares Hillarius Mée thinckes that I doe see Apes which would counterfet al y woorkes of Iesus Christ At the least wise all their dooings are as those of the Apes which doth but little and yet euill If they could by their spittle make the little children and those that are dumme speake or make the blinde sée and the deafe heare I would counsaile them to vse it often But if I had a little childe I would not haue that such swinish pockie Merchaunts as are among them should breath ouer his face nor put their spittle in his mouth They doe call their salt y salt of wisdome And in stéed to season vs to make vs wise through the salt of the woord of God They salt vs in the throat at the baptisme I thincke that they feared y the wine would not abide drincking that we should not be good bibbers Wherefore they would season vs in good time I beléeue that they greatly feared least we should become Turkes and least we should cast vp the wine if they salted not wel the throate as men doe vnto their shéepe If they coulde with their salt make the fooles to become wise I woulde thinck it good to salt al the foolish people as men do salt the fat larde throughout all the body not onely in the throat Thomas I would not giue y counsaile For then the salt would ware very déere if Saloman hath said true wryting that the number of the fooles are infinit Hlilarius Thy reason is good For y inconuenience which thou speakest off would follow and an other more greater To wéet that S. Maturyn who healed the fooles should loose his occupation Besios that I beléeue that the salt although there be great quantitie store of it wil not much profit y soules when the Priestes doe mingle them with the Water For the disease is very incurable But for to retourne to our Priests I doo beléeue that of that salt Water they would make such potage for the soules as my Mother did once make for hir selfe for me my little brother which were not much aboue twelue or xiij yeares of age without putting into it eitheir Oile or Butter bicause that she would haue vs to fast with hir with bread water For if ther had bene any fatnesse in the broth or potage it had not bene a perfect fast If it bée so our Priests on this side the sea which dwell farre from it should haue better coulour cause to salt season the water then those y dwell hard by it For if they would make potage for the soules they shall finde inough of such sodden Water in the sea they shall not néede to seeke after the example of Eliseus for to make him their Authour For he was neuer such a Cooke But they must giue the honour of that inuētion vnto Pope Alexander the first of that name For if they will purge the dead through water I woulde gyue them counsaile rather to wash them altogether with hotte Water as the Panims dyd theirs and call that washing the last bath or washing euen as our Priests doo call their last an cling or vnction the latter Sacrament In which they doe héerein differ from the Panims that they anoynted men a lyttle before they dye the Panims anointed them afterwardes Wherefore their vnction was a little more latter But least you should thincke that I speake wythout authoritie as many Diuines and Preachers doe when they doo preache their owne fables and dreames I will bring out first for mine Authours that auncient Poet Ennius saying When death vvith dreadfull dart bereft king Tarquin of his life His body vvasht and nointed vvas by handes of his ovvne vvife And Virgile speakinge of the burninge of Misenus sayth Some brought the Water vvarme in Caudrōs hot they set in flowre The body colde they vvash a precious ointment on they powre If the water could any thing profite the deade it were better to make for them a great bath to plunge all their body in a great tub of Water and to wash them well for a good space then to sprinckle them so little For me séemeth that that manner of dooing is more proper for to kindle the fire of Purgatory if the Water doth descend thether then for to quench it And the same I wyll proue by authoritie and by examdle I wyll first proue it by the authoritie of many good Phisitions which say that when a man is very drie for want of drincke it is better for him to drincke a good draught at once then to sippe often For that same doth not quenche the heate that is in the body but kindleth it the more And to the ende that it doe not séeme that they speake that wythout reason they doe also alleadge the example of the Smythes the which I will bring foorth for my seconde argument which is infallible inasmuch as it is alwayes confirmed by experience For wée sée that when they woulde haue their coales burne well and to giue great heat they sprinckle thē with water which they haue alwayes ready wyth a little sprinckle or besome as the Priestes haue them in their holy water stocke There is yet an other reason for which I doe finde the manner of the Panims better and more lowable bicause that at the leastwise that shall serue for the dead for to proue whether
they bée dead or not For it chaunceth oftentimes through some disease that the spirite is so locked and enclosed in the body that man loseth altogether his breath in such sort that one can by no meanes perceiue it but iudgeth him to bée dead and so hée is deceiued By that meanes sometimes some haue bene buryed quicke The which thing ought very much to bée feared in all suffocations and chokings and chiefly of the matrice of women and also in the time of the pestilence or plague wherein many times it hath bene found that they haue brought to bée buryed those who were found aliue Wherefore it is not méete to bury any dead body to sodeine especially when hée dyeth sodeinly For y may very well sometime happen vnto man which we haue proued in some beastes namely in the Dormouse which haue bene found so fast of sléepe in the Winter that it is not possible to awake them As it hath ben many times proued in some of them who although they were cut a sunder in the middle did not wag nor stur vntill such time as they are put into hot sething water And to that ende and pourpose many Historiographers and namely Pliny maketh mention of one Attilius Auiola Lucius Lamia that after that their bodies were cast vpon the woode for to be burned after the custome of the auncient Romaines did stand right vp when they felt the heate of the fire and there taried stil For none could succour helpe them bicause y fire was kindled about them but were burned all aliue Thomas Those haue no néed to go into purgatory For they haue ben purged inough alredy Hillarius For y cause y panims dyd not burne the bodyes of those that dyed incontinently but kept them seauen dayes and washed them in hot water and bewayled and lamented them with a loude voyce many times as we doe vnto those that doe sounde or faynt when any fayntnesse of heart hath taken them And after when they haue bewayled them the last time they doe burne them the eight day and the nynthe day they bury their ashes For that cause doe they also celebrate the nyne dayes feaste for the soule of the dead Thomas If that which you speake off be true we do but a lyttle differ from them For our priests doe cry after them with so loud a voyce that if they be not deafe or altogether dead they would awake Hillarius There is no difference but that we are more foolish more mad then the Panims For the Panims do not crye after the dead but vntill they are burned and their ashes buryed But our Priestes doe crye after them ouer their Tombes and Sepulchers twentie thirtie fortie yea a hundreth yeares after their death and although they are altogether consumed to duste But I finde them a greate deale wiser and better aduised in that matter for that they doe sprinkle theire Sepulchers with water onely and not with wine as the Panims that did shed out great aboundaunce of wine and milke vppon the Sepulchers and more lyberally then those doe the holy water Thomas They were very fooles doe they thinke that that wine descendeth into Purgatory for to giue drincke to the soules of the dead or the bodyes that were in the Sepulchers HIllarius We are asmuch fooles if we do thinke that the holye water wherewith we sprinkle the Sepulchers and Churchyards doth descend into Purgatory for to quench and put out the fire For when the priest maketh his Asperges in the Masse and in casting the holy water vppon the people if he doe sée any that putteth not off his cappe or bonet for to receiue that holy coniured and charmed water he cryeth out vppon him and calleth him Lutherian and Hereticke Neuerthelesse if their holy water had such strength to penetrate and goe thorow into Purgatory it is meruayle if it cannot aswell pearce and goe thorow a cappe or bonet without putting it of the head Thomas From whence thinke you that that manner to sprinkle the Scpulchers with water did first come Hillarius Truly I know not excepte it be done in stéede that as the Panims after the burninge did sprinkle with water all those that were there present for to purifie them from the pollution and filth that they might receiue in approching nigh the dead with which they did thinke themselues defiled And in stéede that the Panims did purifie those that be alyue our Priestes will purifie those that bée dead and when they are vppon the earthe and vnder the earthe Or peraduenture that custome first came or tooke his beginninge for that the Panims did decke and beautifie their Sepulchers with goodly flowers Afterwards they sprinkeled them with water to make them continue the longer fresh and swéete The which is vsed at this day in the country of Bigore in the Citie of Bagnieres hard by the hills Pyrenes And amonge some other Christians aswel in Almaigne as in other countryes who doe put hats or garlands of flowers eyther of Baye or of Iuye within the béere vnder the body of the dead bicause they should kéepe a long time their verdure and swéetnesse But bicause peraduenture you may desire the witnesse of all these things which I haue now declared vnto you of the Panims I would y you should heare theÌ„ speake themselues as already before we haue done it translating word for woorde their Latine verse into Englishe rime to the end that they may kéepe the better their stile Marke well then the Prince and chiefe of the Poets touching the cryes and lamentations that they make after the dead speaking after this manner of the burying of Polidorus And holy bloud in basins brought we poure and last of all We shright and on his soule our last with great cryes out wee call And as touching the effusion of the wine the sprincklyng of the water and of flowers the which he hath comprised altogether marke what he sayth at the funeralls of Misenus â—Hen falne his sinders were and longer blase did not endure His reliques remaine of dust with wines they washed pure Then Choryney his bones in brasen coffin bright did close And sprinklyng vvater pure about his mates three times he goes And drops of sacred devv with Olyue palmes on them did shake And compasse blest them all and sentence last he sadly spake To fields of ioy thy soule and endelesse rest we doe betake And in an other place speaking of the Anniuersary that Aeneas did for his father Anchises sayth â—E from the counsel came with thousaÌ„ds thick in mightie throÌ„g Vnto his fathers tom be in mids of all his Princes strong Two bowles of blessed vvine in solemn guise he cast on grouÌ„d And milke in basins tvvayne about the tombe he poured round And tvvayne of sacred bloud then all the graue he spred layd With flovvres of purple hevves and thus at last
full lovvd he prayd Thou hast heard the words of the Poet or at the least the sence of them which haue giuen mée occasion to thinke that which I haue tolde vnto thée Neuerthelesse it may bée that our priests haue inuented that manner to sprinkle the Sepulchers with water for to spare the wine the whiche they had rather drincke then to shedde it and they will not bée so prodigall in spending the wyne so much as they doe the water Thomas We doe not spare it therefore For we are compelled to giue drinke to the soules all the yeare Hillarius We are the more fooles But our Priestes are wiser then the Panims For they haue no regarde to giue the soules drinke nor to poure it vppon the earthe for to sprinkle the Sepulchers but doe poure it into their bellyes and sprinkle their consciences and will keepe the lawe of Numa kyâ—e of the Romaynes saying Doe not poure out the wine vppon the ashes and Sepulchers of the dead Thomas They are then the Lieuetenaunts of the soules but I would haue no such Lieuetenants at my table I had rather to giue them charge to fast for mée then to eate had rather haue them héerem my Lieuetenants But let vs also speake of the wynnowings that you haue set foorth for the thirde manner of Purgatory y which the auncients had and vsed I know not whether we vse them towards the dead But I haue séene them vsed towardes those that be alyue I haue séene them vsed towardes those that be alyue I haue séene the priestes to winde the women and lyttle children with the platine messell and corporall cloth in the Masse But I know not to what end the winde can serue for y soules in Purgatory but for to blow their fire Hillarius I would counsayle them to haue a Fanne as the Panims had which was made holy for to make their holy winnowings When I haue throughlye considered it I doe thinke that our Priestes and Monkes cannot giue so good reason of y that they do as y Panims And for to tell the truthe mée thinketh that they are lyke vnto those Emperiques that haue but one receyte for all diseases and complexions for al ages times and countries who doe kil more then they do heale or for to make y comparison more proper they make me to remeÌ„ber those Surgions which doe grease those that haue the goute and the pocks whome they cause al to passe thorow their furnace for to melt them all anew Theophilus Sith that they dispise and contemne the Gospell and that by the same they will not be made newe creatures forsaking their olde Adam the concupiscence of their flesh it is good reason that they haue such Smithes and melters for to make them new agayne And sith that men doe make no punishment God through his iust iudgement will make them to feele that fire for to quench the fire of concupiscence which burneth in their heart and vaines if they can consider it which is for theire profite and to draw them from their whoredome Thomas Men haue now founde out that they can heale thorow the dyet without melting them Hillarius I doe greatly feare that if our Priests Monkes learne none other occupation and science that they finde out none other drougs for to purge sinnes that they shall not finde héereafter any great trade but shal be constrayned to make the dyet themselues and the Alcumy with their téeth the which they doe feare greatly For men will giue them so lyttle to eat that I greatly doubte that they néede not to learne to faste and to lyue in more greater sobrietie and abstinence for to coole them a little For sith that the fire hath begun to kindle with in their furnace as Theophilus hath sayd and that all is consumed and burned except hell it is much to be feared that the register and rentall of theire reuenues with all their rentes that come vnto them yearely of Purgatory be not altogether consumed and melted I doe thinke that there is no better remedy for to correct their whoredome to learne them sobrietie and to kéepe a good dyet then to take from them their Purgatory Wherfore y Souldiers were not altogether euill aduised nor did not euill vnderstande that matter who aunswered to those holy fathers in stéede of a great curse when they saluted them with their Pax vobis pax sit huic Domini Dominus auferat vobis Purgatorium O holy father say they They doe praye that the Souldiers may haue peace and the Souldiers to the contrary doe pray for them that God would take from them their Purgatory And doe shew the reason For wee lyue saye they by the warre as you doe of Purgatorye and you would take it from vs and giue vnto vs peace Wherfore we pray vnto God that he would also take from you the Purgatory and you shal be as much estonished as we and doe thinke that you shall haue no more to eate their we haue Thomas You are of his opinion whome I demaunded not long since the exposition of a place that is in the Gospel in which Iesus Christ speaking of him y was possessed with a Diuell whom his Disciples could not heale saith This kinde of Diuells cannot be driuen out but by fasting and prayer Hillarius What exposition doth he giue vnto thée vppon the same Thomas That the Priestes and Monkes were of that kinde of diuells that they cannot be driuen away but by prayer and fasting and therefore saith he giue them nothing to eate but let them fast as long as they haue made you fast and pray vnto God for them Hillarius Beholde a verie good receite the which will not cost verie much at the Apothicaries Theophilus But wée must not so iest and scoffe with Gods woorde Thomas Notwithstanding he that aunswered vnto me so and vnto many other that were present was one of your people and one of your goodly gospellers Theophilus I denye not but that wee haue many such which are good gospellers in not giuing any thing vnto the Priestes nor yet in offering any thing vnto them But that is not sufficient Sith that they accompt the Priestes and Moukes for Diuells I woulde gladly that they should practise with themselues that doctrine of Iesus Christ and that they woulde not be onely gospellers in eating of flesh all dayes a like and in not offering no more vnto the Priestes nor vnto their images But that they woulde giue themselues to pray vnto God to deliuer his Church from false prophets and sheperdes and for to prouide true Priestes that doe confesse and preach his gospell And to the ende that their prayers should be the more feruent done with greater faith I do also desire that they woulde liue more soberly then they haue done and that they would fast after the manner of the true
eate them as well as our holy father and in stéede to hide them from him she séeketh euery where for to deuoure thē with him Wherfore we may very well giue credit to the Poets accompt them as Prophetes herein For me thincks that they haue truely prophesied and figured 〈◊〉 those Gods which we haue I would that the Princes would better aduise themselues in their doings and that they doe not vnto the Pope as Augustus Caesar did vnto Iulius vnto whom he sacrificed thrée hundreth men before his Alter the ninth of March of those that yéelded themselues Thomas I know not what to say of your matters and am much abashed that Eusebius holdeth his peace all this while without speaking any woorde that he taketh not the quarell in hande the matter in earnest for to defend the holy mother the church to which he beareth so great zeale How much doth purgatory cost thée euery yere Eusebius Eusebius I will not make thée accompt nor I wil not haue the trumpet blowen when I do any good déede Thomas I will tell thée the cause it that be true that they say you and I haue lost much money our matter fareth very euill Wherefore me thinckes you shoulde answere something and alledge some reason against that the they say or otherwise me thinckes you wil be vāquished that you do proue all that which you haue heard of them Eusebius What reason will you that I alledge vnto people without reason It maketh me to tremble to heare their blasphemies and I doe meruaile how God can suffer them insomuch that in hearing them me thinckes that the earth should open hir mouthe and swallowe them vp A lyttle thing would haue made me to haue gene away and I am amazed how I could heare it so long Theophilus Haue you found our matters so out of reason Eusebius But what reason is there to mocke so wyth God with our holy mother the Church I do greatly feare that God will not giue you grace to go from hence into purgatory But that he wil send you into hell that you shal be of the number of those vnto whom Iesus Christ will saye Goe ye cursed into euerlasting fire For I wel know by your owne words that you do smell of the brimstone and fagots and that you are rancke heretickes I doubt not but the there hath ben a great many burned that haue ben honester men then you are Hillarius Nor I also doubt it she cannot denie but that the tyrants haue burned many holy Martyres for the Gospel of Iesus Christ doe yet still vnto this day a great many honester men then we For if they had not bene good honest men they would not haue by their bloud sealed the witnesse of the truth Thomas I do wel perceiue that Eusebius wil leape by and by vpon the Asse and will be in a rage if men do vere him much Eusebius Who would not be in a rage bearing such matters It were inough to make all men aliue in a rage that haue any zeale vnto the holy catholike Church Thomas Forasmuch as thou thinckest that wée are so farre past reason I pray thée to aunswere vnto that which I wil aske thée And if thou haue any good reasō shew it foorth for to draw mée from errour heresie if thou thinkest the I am fallen into any Eusebius I will not dispute nor plead with you but I had rather follow the counsaile of sainct Paul who commaundeth me to reiect him that is an hereticke For it is forbidden to dispute with them And I do wel know that I shall profit nothing but to be peruerted if I were not very strong in my faith For as farre as I can perceiue you are already to obstinate and hardned in your heresies and as saint Paul sayth Euill woords corrupt good manners Theophilus You haue spoken your minde But before that you do condemne vs for heretickes we must be vanquished of heresie And if it should be so that we should fal into any errour heresie yet thou canst not cal vs hereticks except it be knowne vnto thée that we were the authours and inuenters of sects or that we were obstinate and hardned in errour and that through praise arogancie presumption or couetousnesse for some worldly gaine or profit we woulde speake against the truth For according to S. Augustines diffinition such men ought to be taken for heretickes But I beséech God we be not led with such affection And when you shall know perfectly that we are heretickes yet sainct Paul doth not commaund vs to reiect an heretick at the first dash but after once or twice admonition when he sheweth himselfe incorrigible And as yet you haue not admonished nor corrected vs wherfore you cannot lawfully accuse vs neither of obstination nor yet of heresie And to the ende that wée should giue the lesse occasion I am content to heare patiently all that which you will say and beléeue that I shall receyue reason for paiment vpon this condition also that you wyll heare mée talke with me quietly as though you did count me for your Christian brother vntill such time as you haue vanquished me by your reasons that you did fully know my obstination Thomas I would gladly sée Eusebius skirmish with you But in the meane time I would also as gladly heare that some would speake of dinner and to let that skirmish alone till afterward For I do sée the the sunne is already very hye and thincke that we haue forgotten to dine For I haue a stomacke that barketh as the hungry hound which kéepeth me the I cannot forget it Hillarius Thervnto I am thy compalgnion Therfore I finde thy counsaile good I know not how it is with you but with me I haue a good appetite to drinck Eusebius God knoweth that you are yet fasting at this masse For you haue accustomed to fast Hillarius Although I haue broken my fast twice yet you ought not to be abashed although that I am much altered For we haue bene all the day about that fire of Purgatory which hath so altered me that I thincke that all the holy water of the Priestes cannot quench the fire and the thirst which is in my throate Eusebius I dooe beléeue verye well that you loue the wine better then he water that the same is the holy water that you require Hillarius I do also beléeue that you are not much contrary from mine opinion and I do not thinck how good a catholike soeuer you be that you would chaunge with a priest a pinte or quarte of wine for a quarte of his holy water At the leastwise I would not for I doe finde the one better and more profitable then the other I know not how the soules of Purgatory do like of the water but I do like better of the wine And if I must néedes drincke water I had rather
to mingle it with a little wine then with salt as the Priests do in their holy water Eusebius They do it not for to drincke Hillarius I beléeue it well for they are not so deintie they loue the wine as well as I. But wherefore doe they it Thomas For to deface purge the sinnes by the sprinckling thereoff Hillarius I am ashamed of their folly One may very well say vnto them as Diogenes said vnto a certeyne Panim who sprinckled himselfe with water for to purge his sinnes after their auncient manner O miserable man saith he if thou hast sâ—â—led in thy Grammer and committed a fault and incongruite thou canst not be absolued w sprinckling of the water how dost thou then thinck with the sprinckling of the water to be absolued and washed from thy sinnes Thomas It séemeth vnto me that if you haue such great thirst as you say you wil not begin to enter into a new matter for to make vs fast any longer Theophilus Admit it were so that we had a day of fasting For it is now Lent although it were not yet I do beléeue that Eusebius would haue fasted peraduenture Thomas also And when we shal be all vnder the Popes religion we must theÌ„ fast the Lent al out or els at the leastwise a great part thereoff Hillarius It is true and it is better for vs to fast at libertie then through compulsion But sith that ye be all of that minde let vs goe then to dinner ¶ Finis primi Dialog THE SVMME OF THE seconde booke SIth that we haue already declared in the first Dialogue the agreeing of the Platonicall Poeticall and Papisticall Purgatory and the diuers manners of purgations that haue bene aswell among the Panims as the Christian Idolaters and howe all those things were inuented by the Priestes for to serue their auarice and rapacitie the which was more greater in them then it was euer in others Now we wil bring in declare and sette foorth perticulerly their other practises the office which thei do for the dead how at the funeralls burialls mortuaries they follow more the errours and abuses of the Panims then the examples of the true seruaunts of God aswell in their singings and lamentacions that they make for the deade as in torches lyghtes belles ryngings and sepultures Therefore I haue intituled this Dialogue The office of the deade In which also we will declare what is the honour that is due vnto the deade what ought to be the burialls funeralls and the sorrowing of the Christians what hath bene the beginning in making coÌ„memoration prayers for the dead Also we will declare the principall poynts of the Masse of Requiem that they doe sing for the dead and wee will proue by their owne words that they doe pray rather for the Saints and Saintes and for those that are in Paradise in ioye and celestiall rest then for those which are in paynes be it in Purgatorie or in any other place according to their owne doctrine and how by their owne praiers they sufficiently testifie and witnesse that in their doctrine there is nothing that is certeine and that they holde not those whome they doe iudge to be in Purgatory as assured of their saluation It shal be also declared what is the true Purgatory of Iesus Christ and the true satisfaction of the Christians towards God for their sinnes and how the Papisticall Purgatory and satisfactions doe disagree altogether from the promises of god the remission of sinnes by Iesus Christ It shal be declared in lyke maner for what cause God doth chastise and punish the faythfull in this world and not in the other what are the good workes and wherefore God will iudge men by them and how we must watch and do penaunce and trauayle whilst we are in this lyfe without trusting vppon the good deedes that other will doe for vs after our death Item what are the good deeds that we ought to doe for the dead and wherein we may succour helpe them and the great iniury wrong that the Popes and the Priestes doe vnto Iesus Christ and to all the Christian people holding them in the sincke and dungeon of their peruerse doctrine and traditions What fishermen they are and what their flouds and ryuers are wherein they fish and catch the golde and siluer and not the men what are their relicks and holy bodyes and how they do abuse the dead bodyes to the great dishonour of God and of his Saints as the Coniurers and Sorcerers doe And wherto serueth all that which is done at the burialls and chiefely to those which are buried in the habite or coole of Saint Fraunces And in the ende we declare how Iesus Christ contayneth in himselfe all that which is needefull for vs both in lyfe and death For to enter then into the matter Theophilus bringeth the other in order THE SECOND DIALOGVE which is called the office of the dead THeophilus You did erewhile complayne bicause that in speaking of Purgatory wée were so affectioned after it that it hav almost made vs to forgette our dinner But now I doe feare very much the contrary that the dinner doth make vs forget purgatory and the residue which yet remained to be thought on Hillarius You know very well that the Priestes haue accustomed to breake their fast and to eate the soppe in the wyne in the middest of their Masse Wherefore it were good reason that we did pause a lyttle in the middes of our Masse for to breathe our selues For we haue sayd and sunge inough for the dead for to drinke once And yet wée are more beneficiall vnto them then the Priestes For wée haue not dronken vppon their costes and expences Thomas Therefore you are so much the soberer For me thinkes that you haue not druncke very much according to that that you say you were a thirst Hillarius I toke that which sufficed me and no more and was content For it doth to me more good then all that which the Priestes and Moonkes haue eaten and dronken in the name of the dead doth profite the dead It is already longe since that I would haue brought in for you that but I doe alwayes wayte when that Eusebius would beginne But I know very well that the dinner hath a lyttle abated his choler and that the aduice and counsayle of Seneca is good who counsayleth those that are subiecte to ire choler not to fast nor to take in hande any wayghty matter if they do finde themselues by experience to be more enclyned to wrath before they haue eaten then after bicause that hunger increaseth it the more Eusebius Therefore doe you breake your fast so willyngly in the morning and are so much afraide to fast You must not impute my choller vnto fasting but to your importunate and wicked tongue For he must haue great patience which would not be moued to wrathe through your
Antipapes of the churche of Iesus Christ true lawful Popes of y of Antichrist y which hath not onely of trepasse but also passed repassed trepassed which neuer shall finde rest For they must firste passe into Purgatory after repasse for to put them out againe to passe all ouer for to put them in the Popes paradise But as slowly as they can when they can gette no more money Wherefore it must needes be y there are lakes ryuers at the least insomuch as y Poets doe declare it sith that we must so much passe and repasse Thomas But how can y fire water agrée together if there are so many riuers deepe waters it seemeth to me y it is great folly to cast y holy water vpoÌ„ y graues vpoÌ„ y dead sith that they haue such slore below with them If I were below in Durgatory within that fire which is so hot burning I would finde the meanes if it were possible to get me neere vnto those riuers would plunge my selfe therein as a Ducke and a Coote Hillarius I would not that the Priests should sing pray for mee that I might be deliuered from y deepe lake for I had rather to be a fish and to dwell therein alwaies Thomas Thou cause be no better at thine ease For thou shalt be alwayes in the fresh water and maist drinck when thon wilt Hillarius That should be a goodly pastime for y drunckardes if those slouds were of wine for those that dwell vpon the mountaines if it were of milke as in the time of Saturne and in the time of the golden Age if the witnesse of the Poets be true But I rather feare that those are not alwaies that as the Poets haue sayd and that one cannot alwaies attribute vnto them their auncient names Although that the Pope raigneth there in stéede of Pluto For the one is called Lethe y is to say obliuion An other Acheron that is to say without Ioy An other Stix that is to say sadnesse An other Cocytus that is to say mourning and lamentation An other Phlegeton that is to saye heate Now what other thing can there be in the Popes Purgatory if it be such as they haue described vnto vs I finde it in nothing to differ from the Poeticall hels Wherfore they doe no great wrong if they do sing Deliuer them from the déepe lake and from the Lyons mouth Syth that that roaring Lyon is there it must of force bée that it is hell But they fayle in this that they haue not directed their prayer vnto the Pope and hys which haue caste the soules therein and holde them there and not vnto Iesus Christ who handeleth not so cruelly those of his faythfull seruauntes But truely those which wyll not drincke of the fountaine ef life of our Sauiour Iesâ—s and of hys goodlye swéete riuers which are more sweeter then either wine or milke are well worthy to drincke of those bile and stincking papisticall Cesterns and to be plunged and drowned in those pits and infernall lakes and to lyue in the yron Age. Eusebius Thou blamest the Sophisters but I neuer sawe a greater Sophister nor greater slaunderer When the Priests doe pray that Iesus Christe woulde delyuer the soules from the déepe lake is it not easie to be vnderstanded that they speake not of a lake full of water but that woorde is taken by translation and comparison for to declare and shew foorth y depth of y miseries in which sinne leadeth the poore sinners Theophilus But hath not Iesus Christ thorow y bloud of his testament deliuered all the true Christians from those broken pits that wyll holde no water euen as he hath brought the children of Israell from the bottome of their captiuitie and misery accordinge to the prophesie of Zachary dost thou thincke that Zachary hath lyed Hillarius Thou doest call me sophister and slaunderer but if thou finde that that I do say so straunge I would gladly knowe of thée out of what floud came the soule which the fishermen of the Byshop Tibaud dyd take in a net in steede of a fish Thomas Truely I now perceiue that thou doest mocke men too plainely Hillarius If I mocke thou must then impute the fault to that great Doctour Barleta of the order of the preaching Fryers who hath written that goodly example in his Sermon that he made of the paines of Purgatorye and sayde moreouer that the fisher men dyd bring that net vnto the Byshop vnto whom the soule cryed Praye for me in thy masses to whom the Byshop demaunded what art thou the soule aunswered I am a soule that haue accomplished héere my penaunce And as soone as he had caused a trentall of Masses to be song for it it was deliuered from hir paines Now what doest thou thincke how was that soule brought thether I can coniecture none otherwise but that it did swim bpon the top of the water as the Troutes Salmons and Eles many otheâ— fishes doo which go against the swéet water and do depart from the sea and lakes for to enter into the riuers For I doubt not but that there is stinckinge mudde myre and durte in those papisticall lakes and that the water is verye muche corrupted salt and bytter wherefore I am not much estonished if that the soules haue such great desire to depart out of those stincking Cesterns for to refresh themselues and to drawe of the water in the sountaines of our sauiour Iesus Christ and in those plesaunt riuers and flouds of that delicious and pleasaunt garden wherein the golden age continueth for euer and of that goodly Paradyse the whiche God hathe planted and in the myddest of which hée hath sette the trée of life for to make vs pertakers of his immortalitie And as for mée whatsoeuer Sophister thou call mée yet I coulde not gyue better solucion to my question nor I knowe not whether in Sorbonne one myght finde a more fitter But leaste thou shouldest not thincke that I doe speake wythout authoritie I wyll alledge vnto thée the wytnesse of the Poets and the same of Cicero who alledgeth that he fauoureth greatly the history of Barleta and the exposition that I haue made vppon the same Marke then the horrible and sharpe verses that those soules which departed from hell did speake as some man hath translated it into our tongue From the infernall lake I came and grisly goulfe of hell Where soules in fire brimstone plungd in endlesse tromeÌ„ts dwell Thus hauing passed Acheron that foule and stincking sloud And eke escaped Gerberus the dog that is so woode Vpon the sharpe rockes creepe I must and doe by penaunce so Till time I haue sulfilde the same in pangs of paine and vvo Thou doest heare the language that the same soule did speake although that Cicero did mocke of those fictions and of such a
hard cruell yet notwithstandinge before the face of the Lorde the death of his Saincts are precious The Panims themselues that haue had any vnderstanding were not muche carefull of the buryall although that many superstitious Idolaters haue thought that it bringeth greate hurt vnto those that haue not bene buryed Now euen as the cost which is done about the dead bodyes for their buryalles profiteth lesse vnto them then to anye other As muche may we thinke iudge of all the suffrages and cost that is done for them after their death and buriall as Saincte Augustine doth playnelye declare vppon thys place of the Plalmes They call their landes after theyr owne names What is that They bringe saith hée breads and wine vnto the graues and call it there the name of the dead How much or how often dost thou thincke that the name of that rich man hath bene called vppon afterwardes when men were dronken in remembringe him and one droppe of colde water dyd not discende to quench his hot tongue Men doe serue their bellye and not the soules of their parentes and friendes There commeth nothing vnto the soules of their deade but that whiche they haue done wyth them being alyue But if béeinge alyue they haue done nothing wyth them there commeth nothing vnto the dead What reproch had the men which vnderstoode not what they should doe wyth their ryches when they lyued and which dyd thincke that they should bée blessed if they had a memoriall in a Tombe of marble stone as an eternall house or if their parents friends vnto whom they shall leaue their goods do call their lands after their names But on the contrary they ought to prepare for themselues an euerlasting house in good workes They ought to prepare for themselues the immortall life to send the cost charges before them to follow their works to haue good regard of their néedy cōpaignion to giue vnto him with whom they do walke not to dispise Iesus Christ to wit his poore members lying ful of botches sores before the gate who hath sayd Inasmuch as you haue done it vnto one of the least of these my brethren ye haue done it to me Doth not héere Sainct Augustine cléerely say that man must do his good déeds almose not vnto the sat Moonks Priests but to the poore members of Iesus whilest the hée is héere in the way For after the he shal be out of this world the good déds almose the their parents friends do bestow of their riches profiteth them nothing at all Wherto also agreeth the which S. Hierome speaketh off saying he which shal not obtein pardō of his sins whilest the he liueth in this body shal so depart this life he perisheth to god leaueth to be Although the be do make himself subject to paines By those dronken bankets of whch Sainct Augustine speaketh off wée may sufficiently vnderstand what was the custome of the Panims which for an affection that they dyd beare vnto their parents friends for a desire that they had and also for a pompe and glorye haue dedicated some of them the thirde the seauenth ninth or tenth day others the thirtie or fortie daye for to make remembraunce for the dead and to offer for them and make feastes and bankets And haue not ordained those dayes wythout putting superstition to the number of them And yet neuerthelesse wee doe sée that the Christians altogether and wholly haue followed that manner of dooinge as it appeareth bothe by their practise and also by the booke of Durand Although that Sainct Ambrose others after him haue made Sermons decrées against that custome the which notwithstandinge coulde not be so cleane taken away and abolished but that that superstitō continueth almost euery where For men do celebrate the seauenth day tenth day anwersaries or yeare mindes wyth great bankets and pleasures as it appeareth by the canons and decrées in which it is written after this sorte No Prieste shall in any wise presume to be droncken when hée commeth to the yeare minde or to the trentenarie or to the seauenth daye or ternary of any office for the dead or to anye contraire or brotherhoode And that hée drincke nor quaffe when hée shall hée desyred for the loue and in the name of the Sainctes or for the loue of the soule of him that is deade nor that hée doo not also compell others to drinike and that he doo not play the glutton and fyll himselfe to muche wyth good chéere at the request of an other And that hée presume not to rehearse and recyte iestes and vnlawfull scoffinges playes and vaine fables nor by anye meanes to singe And that he suffer not that one shoulde make before hym vyle games and toyes and that hée consente not that one shoulde bringe before hym false visages and maskes of Dyuelles For that is dyabolicall and forbiden of the holy Canons We maye well vnderstand by that decrée of the counsayle what honestie the Priestes and Christians haue kept in such bankets sith that they must make lawes by the counsailes and wherein they differed from the Panims Wherefore if the good auncient fathers haue made anye memory of the deade it was after that sorte and manner as wée haue already spoken off and for to abolysh by that meanes the superstitious fashions of the Panims and to chaunge them to better manners sith that they cannot pluck them away altogether For if such religion was pleasinge vnto God it was meruayle that God dyd not as well ordayne certeyne feastes sacrifices and ceremonies for the dead as he hath done in all other thinges and many which séeme not to be so necessary as those héere doe estéeme the offering for the dead whom they doe grieue more then any commaundement that God hath euer gyuen If that were cōprised in the loue that we owe vnto our neighbour how could the spirite of God holde his peace Iesus Christ and saint Paul his Apostle who haue so much stroue against it and commaunded loue towardes our neighbour and haue not once spoken any word to make prayers almoste nor sacrifices for the dead If that same had bene necessary and according to the will of God why would they haue more hidden it from vs then any other thinge howe can that which Iesus Christ and also his Apostles haue sayde be true that they haue declared and manifested vnto vs all the wyll of God Doe we not then vnto them greate iniury to make that a commaundement of loue and charitie of whiche they haue neuer spoken off But I am not abashed sithe that almost in all other thinges the Priestes dooe followe the Panims and the Iewes the Mosoycall Ceremonyes abolyshed by Iesus Christe howe they haue not followed them in this matter and that they doe not absteyne to come néere the deade and to assist them at their buryalles as
fashion of mourning among the auncients 123 Manners and life of Pope Iohn 139 Manicheans 140 Man without meanes and howe he vseth the exteriour things 148 Mantell or cloake of Iuno 149 Marriage forbidden 139 Marriage forbidden among the Panims at certeine times 136 Saint Marie le Rounde 137 Saint Margarete 138 Mars 149 Masses for the deade first begun 180 Massalians and Romaines 123 Masse for the deade 1â—7 Masses priuate and particular 185 The Caster Masse of the whooremonger Priests 147 Masse what company it ought to haue 188 Maske of Sathan 138 Matter to make the Ashes 171 Meanes that we must keepe at the mournings and funeralls and the viees of the Panims 120 Memento of the quicke and deade 189 Meria 169 Metellus 160 Mondayes dedicated to the deade 129 Monica 176. 193 Mortie of the supper taken from the people 187 Montanus hereticke 169 Mourning vndecent for Christians 122 Mourning of Samuel and Paul. 125 Mourning of the auncient Israelits 125 Mourning for the liuing and those that be sicke 125 Mourning for the dead 117 Mute the Goodesse 168 Multitude of Masses forbidden 188 N. Names of the Popes chaunged 189 Natiuitie of Alexander 156 Nauclerus 116 Nensuains 127 Numa 129 Nymphes of the Priests and of the Panims 133 O. Obey for conscience 143 Obiection 117. 14â— Obsequies of the Greekes in September 130 Odilo the good Abbot 138 Office of Mercure 131. 131 Office of a wise man. 123 Olimpias 156 Onction with oyle and extreame onction 126 Opinion of Saint Augustine touching Purgatorie 191 Osiris and Serapis 150 Order of the Christian assembles 178 Ordinance and vse of mariage 144 Order vse of creatures turned vpside-downe 153 Order of Saint Benet 188 Order of the dead 181 Oracle of Apollo 132. 133 Originall of priuate Masses 183. Originall of Images 181 Orphens and Erridice 131 Our Lady 166 Ouid a Prophet of the Pope 135 P. Palladium 160 Palis a goddesse 168 saint Pansard 140 Pantheon and all saints 137 ' God pardoneth not the moytie 199 Pascall taper 158 Perfumes holy 171 Persians without Temple or Images 156 Philosophie Pitagorieall 119 Phocas 138 Place of the 1. Samuel 21. Chapter 144 Place of Ioel. 2. Chapter 144 Plaister for all sores 153 Pluto of the Christians 131 Pope Sergius 150 Pope Felix 191 Pope Pelagius 116 Pope Martyn 146. 190 Pope Eugenius 190 Pope out of the faith 198 Pope what God he is 142 To possede and keepe his vessell in honour 141 Power of the Pope 131. 198 Power of the fire vpon the Gods. 155 Prayer 169 Praise of Tertulian 177 Praxiâ—les 1â—8 Predecessors of the Papists 135 Preparation to the Lords table 14â— Priest stroken 153 Prose and sequence for the dead 166 Preparation to the Bacchanales 146 Prouerbe of the Moukes 145 Procession of Mars 136 Procession of the feait God and the holy fire 158 Prolerpina and Hecate Queene of Heauen and Hell. 166 Profite of sackcloth and Ashes 170 purgatorium sacrum quod vocant FebruÌ„ 130 Purgations of men and beasts 168 Purgatory and his beginning 180 Purgatorie reiected of the Greekes 190 Purgatorie is for all men or els it is not 169 Purgatory receiued by the Greekes 191 Purgatorie in this worlde 194 Purgatorie for the quicke deade 171 Of Purgatory a question 181 Purgatious 162 Punishment for dispising the soules 135 Purifications of women 149 Purification after the funeralles 120 Purification 149 Put on sackcloth and ashes 169 R. Raigne of Antichrist and the working of iniquitie 197 The honorable recantation of Berengarius 188 Recyting of the Psalter 126 Remembrance of the dead in the supper 182 Representation of the Euangelical light 151 Requeseant in Pace of the bawde 133 Robes of the Priests doing myracles 149 Rogations 140. 149 Rome old and newe 128. 135 Romulus and Remus Lemuria 129 Rudiments of Religion 170 S. Sacraments 134 Sacrifice of the Alter and of a Mediatour 182 Sacrifice of praise thanks giuing 182 Sacrifice to the infernall Gods. 149 Sacrifice in the auncient Church what it signifieth 178 Sacrifice of the Martyrs 179 Sacrifice of reconcilietion 182 Sacrum Purgatorium quod vocant Februm 130 The saying of the Turke touching the Popish Masse 186 Scismes and Antipopes 190 Scrip of Mercury 131 Selling of God. 143 Seperation of the husband and wife for a time 144 Septanarii 119 Septuagesima 140 Sergius 189 Seuerus 14â— Shrofe Sundaye 146 Shadowes hauing teeth and bellyes 133 Shadowes of the dead 133 Sigismonde 190 Signification of a Comet 139 Signification of Februarie 130 Signification of the fire of the perpetaal Holocauste 157 Sinne against the Pope 197 Sinne against the holy Ghost 197 Sunne against the Pope and against God. 142 Sinnes beniall deaced 163 Sinne mortall 163 Soules and wandering shadowes 135 Statutes for the communion 189 Suffrages of the dead 196 Superstition of Gregory 145 Supper what sacrifice it is 182 Supper deformed 183 Supper for the dead 172 Supper populer 187 Supper despised 189 Supper sacrifice of redemption 189 To take the Supper for the dead 183 T. Table set for the soules 133 Tacianus 141 Thanmus 150 Temeritie to affirme 196 Temples burned in Asia 155 Temple of Diana burned 156 Temple of Diana Ephesian 156 Temple of Fortune 152 Ternatii 119 Theologia Academica 162. 196 Thelogia Aquatica 162 Three Popish crownes 131 Theseus and Pyâ—othus 131 Time ordinarie for the mourning of the Israelites 118 Time prescribed for mourning 121 Times of sastings 140 Tytles of Christ 167 Tytles of Images 155 Tytles of the Goddesses of the Panims 166 Torches of the Christians 151 Translation of the bones of Ioseph 118 Translation of Iacob into the lande of Canaan 118 Transubstantiation 139. 187 V. Valentinian 152 The Uaile 172 Uertue of Iesus Christ â—anfferred to the creatures 153 Uictory of Canopus 157 Uicare at the tuble 187 Uicare of faith 187 Uigiles for the dead 149 Uisitacion of the sicke 126 Use of extreme vnction 126 W. Washings of the Turkes 164 Washings of the Phariles 146 The true washings 165 Two wayes onely 194 Water of seperation consecrated with the Ashes of an Heyfer 120 True holy water 165 The whippes of the Lupercalls 149 The kinde of wine 187 Witnesse of the faith of the Patriarks 118 Witnesse of saint Augustin against papisticall Purgasory 193 Witnesse of the most auncient doctours against Purgatory 194 Witnesse of Antichrist against his Purgatorst 199 X. Xerces 155 FINIS TABVLAE ¶ THE THIRD PART of the Christian disputations By Master Peter Viret Translated out of French into English by Iohn Brooke of Asshe next Sandwich 1. COR. CAPT. 1. XXX ¶ Iesus Christ is made vnto vs of God wisdome righteousnesse of sanctification and redemption MIEVLX VAVLT MOVRIR EÌ„ VERTV QVE VIVRE EN HONCTE ¶ Imprinted at London by Thomas East THE ARGVMENT AND SVMME of the fift Dialogue THomas declareth the causes for which he did enterprise and take in hande his vioage vnto Sainct Patricke And inasmuch as Eusebius could not mainteine his Purgatory by
such as haue not knowen him in this world VVherevpon shal be entreated the place of Saint Peter touching the preaching of Iesus Christ vnto the deade to the spirits that were deteined in prison for the end conclusion of all those matters the funeralles of purgatory shall be celebrated and he shal be buried For that cause this dialogue is called the Requiescant in pace of purgatory For he is deade and buryed THE SIXT DIALOGVE WHICH is called the Requiescant in pace of Purgatorye THOMAS Although friend Eusebius thou hast resisted Theophilus and Hillarie as much as thou canst and that thou hast fought valyantlye yet neuerthelesse thou couldest not so vertuouslye defende thy selfe but that the forewarde the winges and the hornes of thy armye and almost all the whole hoast is discomfyted and ouercome there resteth no more nowe but the arrierewarde If it defende it selfe no valyentlyer and that it bée no better armed then the others thou shalt carry no good newes to the Pope of that combatte and thou shalt giue him no greate occasion to receiue thee among his Capitaines and to reward thée ritchly Eusebius I doe not fight for the Pope but for the trueth It is to me all one who d ee gaine or winne the battaile so that the victorie abideth with the trueth and that Iesus doe raigne in his Church Theophilus I am very glade for the good affection that GOD hath giuen vnto thée and that thou art not like vnto a heape and company of ambicious and glorious men who what so euer euill cause that they haue will neuer confesse them selues ouercome and vanquished but estéeme their glory more dearer then the same of Iesus Christ Eusebius It is verye true that at the beginning I was much offended with your wordes But when I considered that which I haue hearde of you I knewe not well to which side to turne You haue alreadye very much ouercome and fayled me neuerthelesse I haue yet many places of the holye Scriptures which holde me in suspens and leaue me in a greate scruple and doubt in my conscience vntill such time as thou hast shewed me by liuely euident reasons that I must vnderstande them otherwise then they haue béene expounded vnto me or else you shall be constrayned to chaunge your matter and to denye and vnsay all that you haue saide euen vntill this present time Hillarius Propounde them all by order and Theophilus wil addres guyde thée to the true vnderstanding Eusebius For to kéepe the better order I wyll beginne by the olde testament and afterwards will follow the newe after the order by which the bookes of the same are disposed and set alledging out of euery one of them the pointes which may serue to my matters I will put forth vnto thée that which Thoby commaunded his sonne saying Set thy breade and wine vppon the buriall of the righteous But thou wilt aunswere vnto me that that booke is Apocripha or onely Ecclesiasticall and not Canonicall as thou hast already done of the same of the Machabees Theophilus Truely I may aunswere thée so But although it were Canonicall where too would it serue for thy matter Eusebius Very well following the interpretacion of Eccius which expoundeth it of the Almoses for to refresh the poore that they should pray vnto God for the saluation of the deade Theophilus He that woulde followe the exposicions of Eccius there is not a place in the Bible which he hath not corrupted and marred for to make it serue to the popish tyranny In the booke of Thoby in that place there there is no mention made of praying for the dead And although those words preceded thervnto he ought rather to haue saide Set thy breade vppon the buriall of the sinner then vpon that of the righteous For the sinners shal haue more neede of such prayers then the righteous But he saith altogether contrarye For hée addeth eate and drinke not with the sinners and wicked The which is better expressed by the Greeke saying Set thy breade vpon the buriall of the righteous and giue it not vnto sinners Wherefore it is most likest to be true sith that before he hath spoken of Almoses that he recommendeth by those wordes chiefely the righteous and faithfull euen as saint Paul aboue all other recommendeth those of the houshold of faith Nowe there are many manners and wayes to bestowe ones breade and wyne vppon the burialles of the righteous The first is in burying them honestly as Thoby did without sparing that which was there vnto néedefull and requisite For the Hebrewes by the breade wyne and water doe vnderstande all the things necessarie vnto man and vnto mans life The other is when we doe helpe our bretheren succour so their necessities that they dye not for want of vittailes nor goe downe to the graue without being buried If we doe otherwise we kill them when we fâ—â—de them not and that they do dye through our default The thirde is when we comfort thorowe Almoses the children and friendes of the deade Then we shed foorth our breade and wine vpon their burialles behold the holy water that they desire And it is a great deale better to doe after that sort then to playe the glutton with the gluttons drunkerds and wicked But the manner of spech is somewhat obscure bicause that the booke notwithstanding that it was written in Greeke yet neuerthelesse it keepeth the phrases and manners of the Hebrew speach Hillarius He that will then followe the counsell of Thoby must no more banket and feast the Priestes sith that he forbiddeth to giue his breade and wine vnto sinners and the wicked For there is not a people vpon the earth of a more execrable life nor which do more abuse the goods which GOD hath giuen vnto man Amongst whom one may well accompt and number Eccius for one of the principallest Captaines of God Bacchus For he was very angry that day he was not dronken in Wherfore it is no meruaile if he woulde mainteine the spitt and the fryingpan But yet no ueil 〈◊〉 although he and all such as he is would presse and take the words of Thoby by the rigour without admitting any exposition confirmable and agreable to the worde of God it should haue had more colour for to allow the auncient custome which the Panyms had to cary breade vpon the burialls and to powre thereon wine euen as already hath béene spoken then for to proue the bankettes of the priestes and the prayers for the deade Neuerthelesse we are well assured that neither Thoby nor any other holy man but haue had regard not to allow such supersticious Eusebius Let vs leaue of Eccius and the pristes and answere me vnto that which is written in the booke of the Psalmes We haue passed thorowe the fire and water and thou hast drawen vs out and set vs in ioye and comforte Howe vnderstandest thou that place
Canous of Lesus Christ The Emperors Pope do abolish the statutes of their predecessours Iesus Christ the eternall Plipe Plat. in vita Stepha 6. Formosus 1. Stephan 6. For mosus 1. Antibopes Schismatickes Christ Antechrist Rom. 6. a. 4 1. Cor. 15. b. 12 Ephe. 1. d. 28 2. b. 6 Coloss t. c. 18. Mat. 28. d. 20 Ephe. 3. c. 15 Daniel 7. 1 22 Esa. 9 b 6 Phll. 2. b. 10 Apo. â— d. 13 All Popes Antipopes Anticurists The Papisticall â—irges The lakes and internall finds Fire vvater Holy vvater vn profitable Fluds of vvyne of milke Ouid. Meta. 1 Flumina Iam lactis Iam flumina nectaris ibant The infernall fluddes their names interpretations Lethe AcheroÌ„ Styx Cocytus Phlogeton Psa 12. a. 3 55. â— 1. Iere. 2. c. 13. The significatios the deepe lake The lake without vvater Zach. 9. c. 11 A soule taken in a net Barleta feri 4 hebd 4. quadr de pe purg The Bishop Tibaud The papisticall lakes and â—ondes The â—luds of Paradise Esa. 11. a. 3 Geneâ— 2. b. 10 The tree of life Cicâ—ro Tuse q. li. 1 A soule drawen from hell Aueruus The forbidding of bookes The fluds of paradise Pyson Genes 2. b 10 Fluds bringeth golde Tagus Pactolus Ganges Hebrus Padus Eridanus Orcus Eurotos Peneus 4. ca. 8 Plin. li. 4 ca. 8 Pâ—neus accipii amnem EurotoÌ„ nec recipit sed olei modâ— super natatem breui spaicio portatuÌ„ abdicat penales aquas dirisque genitas argenteis suis miscere recusans The floude of Christ The ouerflowing of Tyber The floud Nylus and the fertility of Aegipt Strab. Geor. li. vlti Solin ca. 45. Seneca li. 4. natu quae Luc. Phar. 10 Plin. in panegy ad Traia Plin. natu hist li. 5. ca. 9 Nilometres Diodo sicu li. 1 Tibul. li. 1. ad Nilum Te propter nul los tellus tua postulat imbres Arida nec pluuio supplicat herba loui Claudia in con su Theo. Lene sluit Nilus sed cuÌ„ctis amnsbus extat vtilior Deutat bae Palaemon ex Diony Non alius tantum fluutorum ditat arenas Atque trahens limum complec titur vbere caÌ„pos The floud Nilus of the Pope Charibdis The dykes of the fortresses of the Papists To passe the floude Lethe To forget God. Esa 29. d. 13. Mat. 15. a. 8 A cl cron The kingdome of god Rom. 14 c. 17. Iere. 2. c. 13. Styx Cocytus Phlegeton Ihon. 14. d. 16 The holy ghost is called the comforter Claudiut Foelix qui phaitas prescindit vomere terras Nubila non spe rat tenebris coÌ„dentia coelum Nec grauiter slantes pluuiali frigore Coros Inuocat aut arcum varlota luce rubentem Aegyptus siue aube ferax inbresque serenos Sola tenet so cu ra poli non indiga venti Gaudet aquis quas ipsae vehit Niloque redundat Deu. 11. b. 10 To fish in the troubled water The fishers of Iesus Christ of Antechrist Mat. 4. d. 19. Luc. 5. c. 10. Fishers of gold and siluer Sub anulo pisca torto Fishers of soules The nets of the Priestes The vvaters of Aegypt To go out of Aegypt Exo. 14. c. 21 The taking of Babilon Cirus Darius Euphrates Pli. li. 3 ca. 14. Solin ca. 50. Xenoph. in Cir. hist li. 1. in cho Daniel 5. s 23 Ioseph lib. 10 ca. 13 The Prophecie against the Aegyptians Esa. 19 2. 5. The fisshers for saken Demetrius Act. 19 s 14 Diana the goddesse of the Ephesians Daungerous Martâ—ers Mat. 8. c. 2 â— Mar. 14. d. 32 Iohn 3. b. 19 Prayer for the lyuing The vvater of tribulation Psa 2â— c. 21 Psaâ— 6. e. 23 Esa. 8. h 8 Sennacharib Euphrates Strab. li. 16 Proc. li. 1. Pers bel Esa. 36. cap. 4. Reg. 18. and 19. cap. The Romish Sennacherib The deuouring Lyon. 1. Pet. 5. b. e The Lyon of the tribe of Iuda Apoc. 5. b. 5 Sampson and Dauid Iudg. 14. a. 5. 1. Sam. 17 c. 35 Esa. 31. b. 4 Mat. 6. b. 13 Luc. 11. a. 2 Iohn 17 b. 9 1. Pet. 5. b. 8 Repugnaunce of doctrine The Papisticall doctrine is vncertaine Deleyueraunce from hell Traianus delyuered from hell Saint Ignatius lo. Maio. 4. sent dist 45. quae Saint Machayr Saint Brandun Alrus in fine sui 4. Iudas out of hell Diuers opinioÌ„s of the deliuerance of Traianus Tho. in 4. dist 1. 3. Argu. 2 10. Maio. 4. sent dist 45. qua 1. Barl. ser 3. Hab. 4. sermo de pen. inser Priuiledges Extra derog sur li. 6 Virg. Aenci. 6. Our master Iohn Maioris 4. sent dist 45 q. 1. The Author of the history of Traianus Damascenus Supple chro Bergons li. 9. â—latin in vit Celest 1 The time of Gregory Bergo li. 10 Maio. 4. sent dist 45. q. 1. Berl sermo de pen. inse Ne absorbeat eas Tartarus ne cadant in obsura The place of the Papisticall soules The fall of the soules Paradise The fall of Angels of man Genes 3. d. 24. 2. Pet. 2. a. 4. The Limbe Purgatory Three kinds of righteousnesse after Plato Ruth and Booz Ruth 2. d. 20 Works of mercy towardes the dead August de ciui dei li. 1. ca. 12. 13. que 2. c ani ma. 4. sent dist 45 c. de pompit The profite of the buriall Virgil. Facilis iactura sepulera Comparison of the rich and of Lazarus Luc. 16. c. 19 Luca. li. 9. phras aternus animaÌ„ colligit in orbes Non illue auro positi nec thure sepults perueniunt Psa 79. a. 2 Luca. li. 6 phars Nihil agis hac tra tales ne cadauera saluat An rogus haud resert Placido natura receptat Cuncta suni post capit omnia tellus 〈◊〉 Quae genuit coelo igitur qui non habet vinaÌ„ August in psal 94. cone 1. The benquettee for the dead To do good during our lyfe Preparation for the departure out of this lyfe Mat. 25. d. 40. Hierome in Esa of Forgiuenesse in this vvorld Daies dedicated to the dead Neeysia Lunata Euagismata Ceterismata Terchismata Triacas Parentationes Nouendialia Demealia Ratio diui off de off pro mort Rub. 7. The seuenth dayes and the yere mindes Dist 44. ex coÌ„cilio NauenteÌ„si Nullus A lesson for the Priests Quaffing for bidden Gluttony Maskes and Morrishes God hath not instituted feasts nor sacrafices for the dead VVherein the Priests doe folovv y Ievves Panims Ruth 1. b. 8 Ruth 2. d. 20 What good deedes God requireth for the dead Ruth Noemi The good deedes done vnto the dead by Booz Ruth 4. c. 10 Mat. 1. 3. 3 The Authours institutors of the funâ—ralls Pluto Diedo Aeneal Virg. Aene. 5 Ouid. Fast 2. 5 Romulus Plutar. in Romulo Plato de repub li. 12. After death the parents and friends can doe uothuig Diuers sacriliâ—ces for the dead for diuers causes Virg. Aene. 5 The opinion of the Rabius and Doctors of â—ae levvs touching the body The dwell Aâ—izel Geâ— of 3.