Apostles faith was so strong as it needed no meanes to stirre vp the same And I would tell you you say vntruly but that your skore is so full that now you be desperate Of these two bastardly propositions conceiued and brought forth by your selues and not by me you frame a Contradiction saying therupon that I will turne â—re I burne yea with the turning of an hand turne the cat in the pan and then you tell my pupils they may be pestilent proud of such a turne-about tutor Here wee may beholde as your honest dealing with me so your eloquence and modestie Besides I auouching the Apostles strong faith after Pentecost able for miracles whatsoeuer and therefore vnlikely the Lord should appoint a peculiar course for them for so short a time as from his transfiguration till then you collect from hence the weaknes of their faith till Penticost which I graunt you and more then that namely that their miraculous faith was vtterly extinct at this time And therfore no vse of fasting and prayer for the extraordinarie work but onely as it serued to the vsual maner of the Church in this case But you wil proue the apostles miraculous faith might faile aâ—ter Pentecost because their faith failed sometimes in doctrine and 〈◊〉 That we may vnderstand your meaning what do y◠〈◊〉 by Doctrine what by iudgement Doctrine vsuall is publike teaching and instruction Iudgment priuate thinking and opinion Did the Apostles erre in publike teaching You saye The Apostles and bretheren which were in Iudâ—a thought the word of God was not to be preached to the Gentils Act. 11. 2. You ground this ouâ— of these wordes And when Peter was ascâ—nded to Hâ—erusalem they of the circumcision contended against him VVho contended with him The Apostles say you but without any warrant from the text It seemeth S. Luke hauing mentioned the Apostles in the first verse doth of purpose in the second vse these generall termes They of the circumcision to distinguish these contenders with Peter froÌ„ the Apostles It may be the Apostles did not yet â—o clearly vnderstand this mistery yet it is not likelie they were in this caâ—e no more but equall to the weake brethren whereby theâ— should ioyne in contention with them Grant we also an errour here it was only in iudgement not in doctrine And as for Peters not going rightly to the truth of the Gospell it was not error Gat. 2. 13. 14 either in doctrine or iudgement but a timorous dissimulation for the time Iohn his falling downe before an Angell was errour through Râ—ue 19. 10 sodaine passion not proceeding from setled iudgement much lesse auouched in publike teaching Considering therefore these places proue not that the Apostles erred in doctrine and iudgement and that the Lord doth principallâ— promise that the Spirit of truth should lâ—ad Ioh. 16. 13 14. 26. 1. Cor. 3. 10. Ephes 2. â—0 them into all truth and bring all things to their remembrance which Christ had told them whereupon they be called Skilfull Maister-builders and the Church is said to be built vpon the foundation of the prophets and apostles It is admirable you dare so considently auouch such an assertion vpon so little or rather no warrant and of so dangerous consequence You childishly cauill at my speech where I say Their faith did not faile them after they receiued the holy Ghost in â—ag 127. c That fâ—â—nesse as if I had attributed such a fulnesse to theÌ„ as is not incident to a creature and yet I expresly distinguish it by note of restraint Act. 7. 55. 13. 9. Luc. 1. 41. Act. 2. 2. 4 That fulnesse that is such a plentifull measure as I had spoken of before Such an one as was said of Stephen â—hat hee was ful of the holy Ghost and of Paul and of Elizabeth when shee brake forth into that heauenly salutation of the blessed virgin that she was filled with the holy ghost The same is said of Zachaâ—y when he prophecied and of the Apostles that they were filled with the holy ghost And all these in the Concret but in the Abstract without all limitation to haue the fulnesse â—f the Spirit belongeth onely to a diuine person the Father the Sonne and the holy Ghost So that whatsoeuer person hath the simple fulnesse of the Spirit the same is God as well as hee who hath the fulnesse of the Godhead Of Christ his fulnesse to whom the Father hath not giuen his Spirit by measure do all the elect receiue not the fulnes it selfe but grace for grace that is graces or gifts of the Spirit heaped vpon graces euery one according to the measure of the gift of Christ some eueÌ„ vntil their cup runne ouer All which discourse when at last you pag. 133. conclude that howsoeuer the Apostles were subiect to errour yet they could not posâ—iblie erre sâ— long as they heard the voice of Christ and but followed the onely directions of the spirit of truth And that they did neuer vniuersally erre Moreouer that they did neuer â—â—cline from the foundation it selfe lastly that they wâ—re recalled from their eâ—râ—ursâ— what singular thing do you ascribe to the Apostles that is not common to all beleeuers Are not the Apostles to be preferred aboue all other Ministers of the Gospell and beleeuers since theire dayes Yet you seeme to put them in the very same raâ—ke Nay you say in the top of the same page that there â—e some Fâ—stâ—noniâ—s of the Apostles which onely but slipped from humane infirmities and that these â—ow glorious soeuer in shew are not the testimony of Iesus therfore not the spirit of prophâ—cie you speake here very daungerously that I say no worse You argue the defect of the Apostles miraculous â—aith from their pag. 135. Act. 4. 29 30. 9. 40 〈◊〉 8. 8 praying in working miracles which rather is an argument for the continuance of it For if it had â—in vtterly extinâ— it had not bene to â—e obtained by prayer but if you say Prayer declareth the â—eaknes of it and that you meane such weaknesse as without prayer haâ— not beene able to effect the worke it is false 〈◊〉 hath beene oft â—emembred vnto you but if you take weaknesse for some lesse measure of Matt. 17. cheerefulnesse which had neede be stirred by inuocation of Gods holy name I graunt you such a weaknesse but this is too weake to strengthen any whit your cause you charge mee falsly in saying I denie that the apostles faith might did faile before they were filled with Doct. pag. 46 48 Doct. 49 pag. 136 the holy Spirit I know not how oft I affirme this which you say is the very point I denie Neither do I say it was but fortie dayes betweene Christ his transfigiâ—ation and Pentecost I do writtingly let passe manie of your lies it is a trouble to repeate them you see no inconuenience to approper these words This kind
you mention their swelling arising from the Mother their foming from the Epilepsie their extraordinarie strength from mania c. and so had a compounded disease percase of as manie seueral diseases as they had seueral effects Tel vs also whether you haue seene one partie afflicted at the same time with Melancholy Lunacie Phrensy Epilepsy Mother Convulsion and the Crampe Besides whether you haue known such an one diseased with all these grieuous maladies restored againe naturally to his health in one day When you haue resolued these doubts we wil hold our selues satisfied for this argument In the meane season it remaines for all your answere in as ful force as euer it did And here we may obserue how all that they prattle both here and else where of diseases whereby they woulde perswade that the passions of the Demoniaks were not supernatutural but might wel proceed from some natural disease themselues do ouerthrow in affirming they are Counterseits Againe I shewing that The toyes and fooleries and blasphemous speeches vttered by the parties in their supernaturall passions could not come immediately from God and good Angels and therefore no doubt from the diuell You answer first They were not supernaturall effects but this is your Cuckow song oft auouched neuer proued with anie reason that might so much as beseeme William Sommers one too renowmed in his time Secondly that this supposed impossibilitie pag. 15. for either God or good Angels to effect any such fantasticall vaine and filthy effects is too grosse and absurd Indeed you are the Maisters of absurdities you may bestow one where you wil as this is a notable one and not to be named that one should imagine the most Holy Lord and his holy Angels should immediately by themselues worke filthy effects The blasphemies which arise from hence are not to bee remembred There is neuer any filthinesse committed but either by the filthinesse of our corrupt flesh or by the working of vncleane spirits farre be it from vs we should once let it enter into our thoughts that it did first issue either from the fountaine or froÌ„ the streames of puritie The Lord his iudgements are tied to a seemely maner of effecting rightly vnderstood which you denie that is that all his iudgements should bee effected by meanes best beseeming their nature as iudgements of committing sinne are wrought by sinfull meanes the Diuel and wicked men and such like and not immediately by holy meanes for this was to confound light and darkenesse holinesse and sinne together It is lamentable that anie carrying the name of Ministers amongst vs should be so impiously blind and yet more lamentable that they which will sit at the helme wil suffer such impieties to be offered with their authoritie to the world Thirdly you answere That these vncleane effectes do no more argue an vncleane spirit then those holy effects as Confessing of Cor. 11. 4. Christ and Expounding the Creed argue an holy spirit As if you had cleane forgotten The diuell can transforme himselfe into an Angell of light If you had remembred this and your old crosse-row That there is no reasoning from contraries in common attributes you would neuer haue bewrayed such intolerable babishnesse Lastly say you All this inferres noreall inherency because the diuel can worke greater matters then these remaining without concerning which wee Pag. 15. 16. wil see God willing in that which followeth Againe wheras is vrged the Diuels entring in going out of the partie possessed you answere All these speeches and whatsoeuer text can possibly be alleaged throughout the whole Scriptures concerning either Angels or Spirits or Diuels are to be taken metaphorically and for â—ob 1. 7. Matt. 12. 43 Pâ—t 5. 8. this purpose you bring the diuels compassing the earth his walking through drie places and his roaring like a Lyon As if because in these places there is some Metaphor therefore all other must bee metaphorical too Nay then let vs conclude because these texts of Scripture be metaphorical therefore all the Scripture is metaphoricall and not onely those mentioning Angels and Diuels And so we shal reuiue the wickednesse of the Libertines of the Family of loue and of the Suenckefeldians acknowledging no literal sence of the Scripture but a figuratiue meaning inspired into themselues which only with them is the word of God VVhen you disputed of the Serpent in Euahs tentation you contended indeed The Serpent was onely meant figuratiuely yet seemed after to reiect this opinion and I liked well of it But I crie you mercie now I vnderstand you more fully Wel then the Angel Gabriel came to Marie and brought tidings of her Luc. 1. 30. Luc. 1. 12. c. Luc. 21. 43. conceiuing the Sonne of God was this done Metaphorically Was there also no such thing literally done as is reported the same Angel spake to Zachary concerning Iohn the Baptist whom hee should beget Was that in figure too that the Angels comforted our Sauiour Mar. 9. 22. before his passion Belike when the Diuel cast the child some time into the fire sometimes into the water there was no such matter Mar. 5. 7. indeed but onely by way of Metapher And when the Diuel cried VVhat haue I to do with thee O Iesus the Sonne of the most high God this voice was Metaphoricall Howsoeuer these and many like Scriptures are canonized by you to bee Metaphoricall yet your selues Metaphor are most properly a couple of the absurdest Dunses that euer put pen to paper You goe on and labour to ouerthrow the literall entring of the Diuel because in Marke it is said There was a pag. 17. 1 19. Mar. 1. 23. man in the Synagogue in an vncleane spirit If the words say you bee taken literally then the man was essentially inherent within the diuell I answere Neither are these wordes taken literally neither for this cause is the entring of Satan mentioned else where to be vnderstood figuratiuely The same thing may bee and is vttered sometimes by figure and sometimes by proper speech One while our Sauiour Christ cals himselfe The way and a Doore In another place he saith That they which beleeue in him shall not perish expounding in plaine tearmes that which is spoken by similitude else where As for this Scripture To be in an vnclean spirit is not as a thing coÌ„tained in a thing containing as water in a vessell and such like but to be in the power of an vncleane spirit as our vulgar tongue expresseth fitly when we say Such an one is in a Feuer M. Beza in opening the meaning of this speech vseth this selfe same example and you your selues call it A very apt resemblance Seing therefore it fitteth so wel let me demaund of you when we say A man is in a Feuer whether you thinke the feuer is within or without him You had thought to haue played you with this feuer but it shaketh you a little better then you were aware
beene so strange and extraordinarie in regard of his passions behauiour and speeches as I for my part neuer heard noâ— read of the like Few that haue seene the variety of his fits but they thinke the diuell hath the disposing of his body My selfe haue diuers times seene him and such things in him as are impossible to proceed from any humane creature The matter hath affected our whole countrey The Diâ—ines with vs generally hold that the child is really possessed And so much for him Wee see what the Bishop and Preachers of Chesse-shire their iudgement is touching this child What say nowe the Discoursers concerning him They after they haue for three leaues together scofted at his grieuous affliction for so the Bishop before tearmeth it in most prophane childish and scurrulous maner doe in the end pag. 76. affirme that he counterfeiteth and that this would soone apeare if be were well coniâ—â—ed a while with a three corded whip Is this the fruit of your visiting the child you had better haue kept you at home VVas this all the comfort the distressed boy and parents receiued from you Miserable comforters then are you Is this the mercy and all the bowels of compassion that is in you towards him that is Rom. 12. 15. in miserie O mercilesse men and voyd of all piâ—ie It appeareth you haue not learned to weepe with them that weepe VVell I can tell you of a couple of such merrie or mercilesse companions as your selfes that comming of late to one M. tames Charles of Wolroych in Kent to see his daughter Clemens Charles who is reputed to be possest with the diuell not without cause they scarce went so merrily home as they were at M. Charles and yet but a small thing befell them by the way Returning home they went by one M. Hooke his house of Darlton maister not long before to this maid at whose house she began to bee afflicted Now as they were on horsebacke before M. Hooke his doore and sporting themselues with him about the counterfeiting of this new vpstart counterfeit behold one of their horses staled bloud and as they were talking thereof loe the other did the like whereat they were somewhat appaulled How it fared with their horses after I know not but the day following they caried themselues at M. Charles more soberly whether they went on other horses But hereof ynough I will nowe proceede to your second Dialogue A REPLIE TO THE SECOND DIALOGVE THe second part of my Doctrine treateth That those eight before mentioned were verily dispossessed that by fasting and prayer the meanes appointed by God For confirmation wherof I knew no better rule then the example of men dispossessed in holy Scripture which is the onely true and vnsallible touchstone to examine both this and all other actions by These Answerers scorne these notes calling pag. 8â— them falsly pretended signes of dispossession from sacred Scripture and therefore pretermitting them require my argumentes as if the Signes from Scripture were no arguments at all It seemeth you haue found a veine of better mettal then the Scriptures froÌ„ whence your whole booke is so full stuffed with your owne shining drosse and is so vtterly destitute of this purified gold Yet you cannot beat me from them but I vrge them thus There were in our Demoniakes the selfe same signes or notes of dispossession precedent and subsequent which wee reaâ—e of in the Scripture Demoniakes and therefore the same dispossession you answere There were not the same signes in our demoniakes and first because they were meere cosonages as is confessed freely by the parties themselues vpon their owne oathes I reply the parties we speake of bee eight in number whereof onely Sommers hath made this cursed confession which was not free and voluntaries Detect pag. 127. as you vntruly affirme but extorted by Satan and his instruments as in my Detection I haue made manifest But what say you to the seuen in Lancashire It may be Sommers hath sworne for theÌ„ all for they as yet were neuer examined yet because we doubt of Somers general oath I pray you proue vnto vs who taught the children to counterfeit when and where and by what meanes they were taught what end might induce them to imbrace such teaching whether the parents were priuy to it and what they propounded in practising such wickednesse Yea put Sommers too into the roll shew vs what man is able by practise to do the things that either Sommers or they did And one woulde thinke a man of meane agility might quickly performe that which cofoning yong boyes and girles could Shew vs I beseech you these and such like things or otherwise if you cannot shew theÌ„ yet tel vs of cosâ—nage you shew vs nothing but your long eares brasen faces Secondly â—g 83. say you The signes in the Scripture Demoniakes were sensibly percâ—iued by the beholders but these in your pretended Demoniakes were not so by your own confession Belike all we that were spectators of our Demoniakes being at sundrie times a great multitude were all stricken with blindnesse with deafnesse and with a benummednes and yet we all thought we vsed our senses and I am sure wee were no sooner out of the place but we were able the Lord bee thanked to see heare and feele But you confirme this by mine own confession â—ct pag. 37 which saith that the spirit could not possibly be felt or seene I said so say so againe that Spirits cannot be felt or seene in their owne bare essence but as they make themselues knowne vnto vs by their effects I angling Sophisters will dispute That the nose of a mans face cannot be seene because that which we see is but colour or forme and the nose it selfe is neither of both Your eares ring it may bee with their noise which hath made you borrow an argument from them Thirdly you say The Signes we report are false which I would graunt you if your selues had learned to speake truth We must remember there are aboue two hundred witnesses hereof liuing at this day of which some haue deposed the same wee report of Sommers Fourthly say you Scripture Signes can argue no Dispossession now because like effects may arise froÌ„ naturall causes and coporall diseases By this your good helpe Atheists might ouerthrow all Possessions and Dispossessions in the scripture But howsoeuer you may be friendly to such vile wretches yet haue they no foothold from hence For neither those effects in those ancient Demoniakes nor in these of our time iointly wholy considered can proceed from naturall disease Naturall causes can bring forth no supernaturall effects as we haue demoÌ„strated these to be in spight of your seuenth Dialogue and what other treaty so euer you oppose against it Lastly say you A dispossession may bee without such apparant signes and therefore your signes precedent and subsequent do not necessarily conclude a dispossession
means to certaine men whereupon it must needs follow that there being an Apistia an vtter defect of miraculous faith in these Disciples it was not to be recouered by fasting and prayer You answere It was not 1. Cor. 12 9. begotton without meanes because it was giuen by inspiration of God By which you make the holy Spirit to bee a meanes whereas a meanes is but an instrument And the holye Ghost together with the other two persons of holie Trinity is alwayes a principall efficient Thus you confound heauen and earth together make nothing in the world to be done without means neither any thing in the world to bee more then ordinary for whatsoeuer is done by the same vsuall and neuer ceasing meanes must needs bee reputed ordinarie There be few places in the fielde more replenished in the spring with stincking nettles and weedes then your whole booke with such poyson full Hemlockes as these But with all we haue a Discourse of an Habituall Actuall miraculous faith pag. 114. whereof the habitual is begotten by the Spirit and the word Seeing therefore these causes cannot alwayes be effectlesse and that they be euer working in the Church till the end of the world it cannot be auoided but that Miraculous faith should be in the Church for euer And the rather if we consider what by your saying miraculous faith is which you define to be nothing els but an vndâ—uted perswasion by which we firmly beleeue that there is nothing impossible to God But all the faithfull do vndoubtly beleeue this and therefore we haue still Miraculous faith remaining amongst vs and shal haue so long as the Church soiornes on earth yea the very diuels beleeue this and so hauing miraculous faith by your leaden rule shall bee workers of true miracles I adde they which were endued with the miraculous faith had besides the perswasion of Gods omnipotencie an vndoubted perswasion of the will of God for the effecting of the wonderful matters which besides or contrarie to nature they atteÌ„pted for the good of the Church Now for as much as the knowledge and assurance of the said will of God is not to bee had from the word therefore the written word is not the onely ground worke of miraculous faith neither doth it come by the hearing thereof as you affirme For Actuall faith you will haue it a speciall motion from the spirit of God raised vp extraordinarily whereby the action of faith shall not proceed from the Habit as from the next cause as the action of iustice cometh from the habit of iustice and so in all other qualities of that kind but there shall be something in Actuall faith extraordinarily more then was in the Habituall If a man had your sharpnes he might quickly go beyond Actius Nauius that cut the whetstone in peeces with his rasor For the increase of miraculous faith by means it is but needles to stand vpoÌ„ it coÌ„sidering we affirm an vtter defect therof at this time in the disciples not some couered sparkes remaining in them to be raised into flames by fasting and praier For true miraculous faith how litle soeuer is able with out these helps to atchiue her desined worke But then you will say yea in effect do say that the Apostles did superfluously ioine praier pag. 116. with it I answer no more superfluously then the Church doth ioyne Sacraments with the word Faith of it self is sufficient to apprehend Christ vnto saluation and this faith is begotten by the word Yet Sacraments haue their necessary vse not to inable faith to that which it could not with out them but to confirme and strengthen it to doe her worke more cherfully and with fuller assurance Praier is the general instrument to be vsed in all holy workes what soeuer and therfore the Apostles had warrant for their praier were free from all will-worship therin I omit here pag. 117. 118 for breuitie fiue of your slanders and two contradictions wherewith you charge me my selfe being not author of any one of the contradictory proposions I prouing that these wordes in S. Mathewe this kind goeth not Matt. 17. 21 out c. belong not peculiarly to the Disciples say that if our Sauiour had rebuked them for not fasting praying they might haue excused pag. 119 120. 121. their want of time you trifle exceedinglye about this at last you affoord vs this worthy answere that considering our Sauiours staying in the mount which for all the circumstances you can alleadge can not be long they had time ynough to pray Antiquum obtinct Crito you must run your old byas impudently flap vs in the mouth with time for prayer wheÌ„ the question is of time for fasting and prayer Againe you wil haue these words This kind goeth not forth but by fasting and prayer to be no sever all reason rendred by our Sauiour why his Disciples failed in their purpose whereas we haue shewed it is a distinct thing from Miraculous faith and not necessarily ioyned with it and therefore not to concurre in making one reason with the â—ag 122. â—g 123. 124 same Moreouer say I â—f the Apostles in each weaknes of this faith must of necessity haue betaken themselues to fasting and prayer they should haue bene a whole day about a miracles the exercise of fasting requiring this space which would haue bene great hinderance to their speedy travell ouer the whole earth You answere This is Iudaisme Belike also it is Iudaisme for Christians to pray because the Iewes did so But vnderstand good Reader that the practise only of such cereremonies as the Lord appointed to be a difference betweene the Iewes and other people is Iudaisme not the exercise of such duties as be common to both That which you doubt what should become of the other part of the day if the diuell should be cast forth before noone beseemeth men which acknowledge no other seruice of God but for their owne turnes Is there no duty of thanksgiuing no request for strength to the party dispossessed no desire that the eye-witnesses might profit by it you would haue Christians serue God as the dog his maister for a bone The rest is vnworthy to be repeated so was this but that I would giue the Reader a taste But what say you that wil not haue a fast to continue for a day to A Walker alias â—â—g 5. Io. Deacon who in a booke of his called the Footpath to fasting saith that in the day of our fast we must be exercised in hearing applying and praying for the remâ—uing of God his iudgements euen from morning to night Do I you false tongues in pag. 48. and 49. of the Doctrine pag. 125. say that the Apostles should haue stirred vp their weake faith by fasting and prayer when I spend those whole pages to proue the contrary O palpable slaunder and extreame impudencie Likewise you say I affirme else where The
propounded an ordinance for al ages to come there is an ordinance without an appointed subiect to vndeâ—go the same Indeed this would be straunge for Accidents to walke alone without subiects It is a difficult matter to finde who should be the subiect of fasting and praver so likewise too of the Matt. 6. kingdom of God which our Sauiour ordaineth to be sought in the first place and food and rayment in the second if we could tell who g. 100. 〈◊〉 do it â—esides succeeding ages that could expell this cumbersom◠〈◊〉 shâ—uld haue more power the euâ—r the Aâ—â—stles bad which is false for the Apostles their saith not fayling could expell any diuell Further The Apoâ—â—les should â—aile in not dâ—claâ—ing this ordinance vnto vs concerning which ynough hath beene saiâ—e in the ninth Dialogue I astâ—y it 〈◊〉 establâ—shed ordiâ—ance in this place because M Darrâ—ll afâ—â—â—â—th it hath bâ—ene a â— ordinance frâ—m the beginning I answere I doe not refeâ—â—e the originall to this place but onely the Confirmation Iath 19 99 〈◊〉 12. 27 Act. 16. 13. no otherwise then I make Matrimony an established ordinance by our Sauiour Christ he reneâ—ing the institution of it Againe I argue the meanes of fasting and prayer from the example of the Iewes Church in our Sauiours time wherin some did cast forth diuels and yet were not in the number of our Sauiours Disciples neither did it in his name You answere I contrarie my selâ—e affirming â—lâ—e where they did it by the â—inger of God I reply â—ou do not contrary your selfe but are euer liâ—e your selues most absurâ—ly concluding the selfe same working of the instrument from the same maner of the principall agent whereas the chiefe doer being the same may and doth worke by the instrument diuersly Againe say you by mine â—wne consession this ordinance as then was not established I answere is was not so plainely as when our â—auiour confirmed it by these words yet in generall it was and practised in the Church before Moreouer say you Those in our Sauiours time besides â—th 7 22 his Disciples cast out diuels by miraculous faith only for which you alleage the seuenth of Matthâ—w I reply this scripture speaketh onely of the eâ—ection of Satan but sheweth not in what manner the same was performed nor when We do not leane vpon any doubtfull vncertainties as you would Rhetorically declare if ye knew how neither do we take the Lords holy name in vainâ— nor pray withâ—ut faith as you prate both without wit and conscience I passe ouer your fooleries concerning K. Wright your sixe lies at one clap contained 〈◊〉 103. 〈◊〉 104. in seuen lines as I can proue to your shame But what speake I of sixe when I dare say there be sixe hundred leasings in â—our two volumes VVe neede not take things of whole salâ— men by retale it â—s â—n eaâ—y matter to know bâ—â—our lâ—ing whose children ve are That Christs speech ought not tâ— be aâ—propriated to the Disciples hath beeâ—e declared Neither â—o I say and unsay as â—ou falsly charge me pag. 105. 106. The communication was betweene our Sauiour and his Disciples bâ—t the ordinance there mentioned is common to all â—et Physâ—alogus sit these variable answers as hee miscals them doth tell vs a tale of an Hâ—rmit which comming to a Farmers house and blowing his fingers to warme them and his â—ottage to coole them was sâ—nt packing by the Farmer as a dissâ—mbling câ—mpanion But to requite you tale what if the like Hermit had come to some good mans house and hauing on his face a faire shining visarce with A. W. written vpon it should vpon occasion haue his visard shaken off and vnder it shewe another face signed with I. De. Might not the good man iustly abhorre this double faâ—ed guest â—nd aâ—monish all honest companie to beware of him I will pardâ—n you your sport at fast and pag. 107. loose for a shilling though I might iustly make it sâ—t â—aster vnto you then you would vnloose againe in haste Put where is the contrarietie I pray you in making thâ—se words to â—ee spoken to the Disciples and yet not onely to be vnderstood of them You would collect it after this manner Because that weaknesse of faith and the kind of 〈◊〉 wâ—re the two in 〈◊〉 wherefore the child was not deliuered And that which is an impediment to anie is also proper to the same partie if we will beleeue your Metaphysiâ—kes For you must needs deriue your Assumption Hâ—b 3. 1â— 4. 1. 2. fâ—â—m hence As if the Isâ—aelites being shut â—ut of the land of promise for their vâ—beleefe this impediment should bee so proper to them that nâ—re but themselues should be excluded for the same which absurditie is of that nature that if your sticke of fast and loose were â— good sound cudgell you deserue to be well laboured about the shoulders with it â—ut what should I pursue your seuerall absurdities To â—ake after such scatterers were to fill a cart rather then ones lap In briefe for your whole dispute to prâ—ue these words only to belong to the Disciples Iâ— incredulitie and â—mission of Matt. 17. prayer and fasting were impediments onely to the nine Disciples for Peter Iames and Iohn were not of this number then they can be impediments to no body else And so Peter Iames Iohn should cast out any kind of spirit notwithstanding the like incredulity and omission of â—asting and prayer Yea all other Christians whatsoeuer should also in like manner For what should hinder them if they haue no impediment And what impediment can they haue these two being onely proper to the nine Disciples See now how prouidently you tie these words to the Disciples onely permitting larger power to all other Christians then to them The contradiction you here charge me with is lame It is palpably false that 1 pag. 49. of the Doctrine auâ—uâ—h there are some kind of spirits which the Apostles with all their power could not possibly expell but by prayer and fasting Of this very errour I do by sundrie reasons from pag. 44. of the Doctrine vnto page 48. confute Stapleton and Thyrcus which notwithstanding you charge vpon me againe sticke not to say that Stapleton Thyrcus and my selfe agree herein so shamelesse are you But specially you make your selues merie with a coÌ„tradiction pag. 111. 112. I answere The Disciples their not expelling the diuell out of the Lunatike when they were destitute of miraculous faith letteth not but that by miraculous faith they could expell any diuel These I trust may agree together without cutting the throat one of another That which you talke of helping their weake miraculous faith by pa. 113 c. fasting and prayer is already answered Further I shewing that fasting and prayer were not required as helpes in this place to miraculous faâ—th say that Miraculous faith is of that kind which is giuen without
to be inwardly rauening woules if they be to be iudged wolues not only which rent the meÌ„bers of our bodies in sunder but also much more they which by infecting men with pestiferous opinions deliuer theÌ„ to saran to be torne in peeces both bodies and soules In this case it will behooue the Christian Magistrate both Ciuill Ecclesiasticall to take order that such cruel deucuring beasts may be driuen from Christs fold that they would consider that they make not dissensions scandales contrary to the doctrine we haue learned which stand for the truth but they which oppugne the truth It is the rebell that makes ciuil war the faithful subiects wepons are not agaiÌ„st the peace but for the peace neither is it the dog barkiÌ„g in the night that disquiets the shepheardes but the Wolues approching the kepers stirring is to be commended the theues assaulting he is to be defended This vse then the Magistrate is to make of your doctrine generally all the Christians of this land are to take it as a watchword to auoyd you as Scorpions that they may know you to be men â—hil 3. 19. â— Tim. 3. 5. â—ud 16. which haue made your bellies your god to glory in your shame which haue a forme of godlynes haue denied the power of it whose mouthes speake proude things hauing the persons of men in admiration for aduantage sake These manner of men are fortold should come in these last dayes our Church doth already feele it by lamentable experience If thou shalt make this vse Christian reader â— Cor. 11. 19 of their booke it shall not bee altogether vnprofitable for thee For It must needes be that heresies should come that they which are approued amongst vs may be knowne The Lord therefore strengthen vs so many as be of this number to stand for his truth and giue vs wise dome to discerne those which would craftily vndermine it that all such wicked workers beeing defeated wee may constantly walke in the puritie of it till the day of our Lorde Iesus Christ to whom with the father and the holy Spirit be all honour and praise for euer Amen FINIS Here foloweth my answere to the Contradictions they charge mee with contradictiâ— 13. The Discoursers charging me with a shamfull companie of Contradictions no lesse then fiftie I first framed an answere to them with full purpose to publish it therein haue made it plaine there is not a contradiction But this my Treatise prouing much larger then I intended the answere to them being of litle or no vse saue only to cleare my selfe of this slaunder and to discouer their filthinesse which needeth not I thought good rather to suppresse then publish it yet so as I will giue thee good Reader a taste thereof and of their vpright dealing herein assuring thee of my credit that euen such be the rest of their contradictions Answere Darell say they in his Doctrine pag. 54. saith that prayer and fasting being vsed aright will certainly prosper either to the remouing or sanctifying of the iudgment But pag. 56. he saith their is no assurance to preuaile contrad 23 I answere There is no assurance to preuaile that is we can not be sure the partie shall be deliuered the meanes being vsed for so are my wordes Had then I sayd pag. 54. fasting will certainlie prosper to the remouing of the iudgement and no more I had contradicted that I say pag 59 but adding or sanctifying a child may see here is no contradiction Such a contradiction is this Certenly the Discoursers wil ether be ashamed of their contradictions or their sinne is the greater Assuredly they will not be ashamed of their contradictions And this The sun is either vnder a cloud or set It is not vnder a cloud In his Detection 163. Darrell saith fire hath poweâ—r to burne in the same pag. hath no power to burne Ans All that we reade Detection 163. is that Somers hand being in the fire was not burnt Would euer any man these two excepted hence collect a contradiction How many thousands in this land haue said the same and among them not a few that be learned yet I dare say neither learned nor vnlearned euer feared they spake contraries Shadrach Meshech Abednego being in the fire were not burned and yet they that cast them into the fire were burnt I trust you wil not say here is a contradiction But confesse both these to be true Fire naturally burneth but restrayned by God the ouer-ruler o nature it doth not burne Secondly you should first haue shewed where I say Fire hath power to burne before you told vs that I speake contraries â—ntrad 24. In his Dotrine pag. 2. he saith that it suteth altogether with Satans â—ature to be filthie or wicked in speech But Detection 175. he saith that it sutethe as well with his nature to vse good and holy speeches My wordes Detection 175. be Holy wordes haue beene vttered by satan Tel me is this a false proposition Or yet this vncleane and Ans blasphemous speeches sute excellently with the nature of the vncleane spirit If both these be true which none will deny with what truth doe you say that I speake contraries whereof the one must needs be false These men sure had forgot when they doted of this contradiction that the diuel is as well by nature subtil and in his subtiltie ready to transforme him selfe into Angel of light as vncleane and wicked Of this stampe they haue 18 contradictions more In his Doctrine 47. He saith the disciples by vertue of their so large â—ontrad 11 a commission could cast out a diuel of any kinde But pag. 50. the Lunatike child was possest with one of the worst kinde of spirits and that thence it came the disciples could not cast him out To make this contradiction they haue detracted part of my words Ans in either proposition In the former these if their faith failed not which words or words to the same effect in the aforesaid pag. 47. the two pages precedent I vse no lesse then twelue times In the latter proposition where I say thence partly it came they detract this word partly wherby I intimate the Disciples faith did at that time faile them when they could not cast the diuel out of the lunatike child so that their incredulitie was one let which oft els where I expresse And this you well knewe as appeareth by your next contradiction the twelft I meane What meant you then thus to separate and rent asunder those words which of purpose I had coupled together And by detracting that which in either of the propositions iâ— so materiall and in the one I inculcate so often to pretend a contradiction where you knew none was Who hath bewitched you to vse such curled deuises for the compassing of your contradictions A cursed pretence must this needes be seeing it can not be done in ignorance For you
my writings might make most for your purpose euen purposely maymed my writings which you deny and I affirme iudge thou indissirently betwene vs good reader And whether you will acknowledge and redresse the offred wrong whereof I complaine and which I trust to be a wrong I haue made manifest by this my Replie vnto all men to your owne consciences as you pretend you will nay seeme to abhorre not to do it if once the wrong shal be made to appeare saying God forbid that we should not doe it very willinglie in time both thou and I shall know And thus much for answer to their supposed contradictions For breuitie sake I omit my reply to the Absurdities wherewith you charge me and your slaunders conteined in them Here not vnfitly may I charge you with the contradictions Absurdities I find in your writinges and if it fall out so that your selues be found faultie in that wherof vniustly you accuse another then thereby learne henceforward to plucke rather the beame out of your own eyes then busie your selues so much about lesse then a mote in your brothers eye In their Answere page 55 and page 179 of their Discourses they say that the manifestation of Christ his deitie and declaration of his glorious spell were the maine ends of possâ—ssion and a little after that the possession of diuels were especially for these two ends therby in sinuating that there were some other ends or end Yet page 67 of the same booke they say that these were the two only ends of this vonderfull iudgement 2 In their Dial. dis page 58 they say angels doe euermore worke after an inuisible insensible and spirituall maner And the next leafe page 60 they say that angels in all their ambassages they do other manifest themselues by seeing and hearing or assist vs estsoonâ—s by some other sensible means And they bring Augustine flatly affirming that the angels do outwardly helpe vs by certaine visible apparitions or sights which they propose and offer before our eyes 3 In their Discourses pa. 42 they say the mind it selfe and it only is that wherein motion consisteth and the body is but the minds organon or instrument hauing naturally in it selfe no motion at all or no further motion at the most then for those only actions wherin the said mind whose organon it is imployeth the same But in pag. 74 of the same booke they affirme that the body it selfe hath and may accomplish or effect corporall operations and motions by it selfe alone without anie the direction moderation guidance or 〈◊〉 of the soule 4 In their Discourses pag. 116 they say the diuell did so bewitch and charme the Serpent as that through his craftie suggestion shee was very wel able to propound such a diuination or soothsâ—…ing as dâ—d presently circumuent or deceiue Fuah And in the same booke page 1 9 they say that a reasonable speech cannot possibly bee framed or vnderstood of anie but of a mind hauing vnderstanding and reason 5 In their Answer pa 50 they say These eight dâ—moniakes might be possessed though the diuell was not essentially inherent in anie one of their bodies But page 43 of the same booke they say The pâ—ssession of diuels whatsoeuer is ceased long since 6 In their Discourses 173 they say The Apostles might autheÌ„tically auouch for insallible truth whatsoeuer they preached But in their Answere page 126 128 129 130 they say that the apostles sometime failed in doctrine And a little after all these were their errâ—urs in doctrine and iudgement And againe It was expedient for the apostles to erre in some things that is some points of doctrine And this they vnderstand after the holy Ghost fell vpon them as is plaine by the aforesaid pages 7 In their Answer pag. 7 they say that wonders and miracles are flatly confounded but in their Dialogicall discourses 209 they say the diuel may worke wonders but can effect no miracles And pag 310 thus A thing effected by essentiall means howsoeuer it may be a wonder yet no miracle in any respect 8 In your Discourses pag. 352. for your parts you assure me that you are very farre from all suspition of a precompacted confederacie betweene Sommers and me Yet in page 42. of your Answere you say why should we wonder at all that two â—unning companâ—â—ns Meaning Sonnners and my selfe consedâ—rate together before should conclude such a course betweene themselues as the one by the helpe of the other should progmsâ—icate strange and meredâ—ble euents 9 In pag. 39. of their Discourses they tell vs There is not anie one sound Diuine that dâ—thâ—n t vnderstand Possession as they doe and none as I fondly imagine and yet in the â—pistle to the Reader prefixed before that booke that which they deliuer concerning possession and d sposs ssion of dâ—uels they call thâ—t priuate opinion and in page 195 of their Answere The Lord his lately revealed counsels Part of their absurd and vnsound Positions 1 Godby good Angels may effect fantasticall vaine and filthie effects Answers 15. 2 Good â—ngels may effect vaine and filthy effects ibid. 3 VVheresoeuer the Scriptures speake of Angels or diuels they speake only by metaphore ibid. 4 The Diuel hath no desire to be in any mans body Ans 22 5 The Iewes in Christs time did partly know the parties which were possessed from the often reuelation of the parties themselues answ 32 6 Godby his Spirit instructed the Cananitish woman mentioned Matth. 15 22 of her daughters malacie answ 33 7 The manifestation of Christs deitie and the confirmation of the Gospell the only ends of Possession answ 67 8 Christ hath put a finall end to the possession of diuels by his death and resurrection answ 66 9 The supernaturall actions or effects of the Diuel in Demoniaks cannot possibly be comprehended by humane senses Ans 69 10 The working of miracles was only in Christ and his Apostles dayes answ 90 11 God hath appointed plowing and sowing for a meanes of abundance or barrennes vpon the ground answ 172 12 Good angels do euormore worke after an invisible insensible and spirituall manner Dialogical discourses 58. This is to bee refuted by all those places where angels are said to haue appeared and spoken in visible formes vnto men 13 The body hath and may accomplish by her selfe alone corporall actions and motions without anie her soules direction moderation guidance or consent Dial. disc 74 14 The dead carcasse of a man or the body being separate from the soule may and doth also effect corporall actions and motions ibid. 15 The Diuel did so bewitch and so charme the Serpent as that through his craftie suggestion shee was very well able to propound such a diuination or soothsaying as did presently circumuent and deceiue Euah Dial. disc 16. Absurd that the Diuell should not onely thus make the Serpent it selfe to speake but also argue the matter like a reasonable creature 16 The apostles erred in some points of doctrine after the holy Ghost fell vpon them Yea it was expedient for them so to erre answ 126 128 129 130 17 It is verie erronious for able to imagin that the eyes may possibly be deceiued in discerning betweene spirits that is bodies assumed by spirits and true naturall bodies Dial. disc 157. You forget that Abraham and Lot were deceiued as appeareth by Gen. 18. and 19. FINIS I am to craue thy patience good Reader specially the authours for the late comming forth of this booke for I confesse it hath layen in my hands almost this halfe yeare