Abstain from all evil and follow that which is good and listen to the word within in the heart but this Gospel thou deniest and so must needst preach another Gospel and so art the accursed as Paul saith Then thou sayst Thus the poor Soul is most horribly carried away head-long c. into the belly of Hell c. thus much is the sum by turning the mind within to the Light which doth convince of sin and listning thereto and clapsing with the motions in the Conscience which do command to abstain from evil and to practice good and closing with something within which thou hast confessed is the Light of Christ hereby or thus is the poor Soul carried headlong and at the end of its life doth fall into the belly of Hell as thou sayst Let shame cover thee if thy heart be not altogether hardned was ever such Doctrine preached surely malice hath carried thee out of sence else thou wouldst not have uttered these things but it is answer enough to reckon thy confusion up into a sum and I leave it to every honest heart to read and judge thereof Then thou further sayst The Devil counterfeits the works of Grace and makes the Soul believe if it will be led by what is made known unto it by the Light or Conscience within it shall do well Answ. Wo unto thee that callst good evil and evil good Art thou not ashamed to utter thy mind so wickedly and impudently doth the Light of Christ within deceive or is not this Christs Doctrine I am the Light of the World he that follows me shall have the Light of Life and he that walks in the Light stumbles not and this shamelesly hast thou called the Doctrine of the Devil but if ever thou knowst God it must be by following and by being led with the Light within which God hath made known unto thee else the Light is thy condemnation eternally Then thou sayst The Devil counterfeits the new birth by perswading it is wrought by following the Light of the World c. Answ. This Doctrine is as wicked as the former and from as lying a spirit but answer me By what is the New-birth wrought and how if not by following the Light of Christ in the Conscience is there any other way to God but Christ Jesus who hath lighted every man that comes into the World and whereas thou beginst to scorn in thy vain mind at living upon Bread and Water and wearing no Hatbands and not speaking except the Spirit moves c. The Scorner and the Lyar go together the Lord rebuke thee thou false deceitfull heart and lying tongue it grieves thy lust to know any to live upon bread and water and it torments thy pride that any should forsake their pride and it is easily known of what spirit thou art and that thou goest on in thy own will before God leads thee and scornst to wait till the Spirit of God moves upon thee or scornst them that do wait but thou runst and art not sent like unto thy Fore-fathers and therefore thou dost not profit people at all Then thou accusest us of sad Blasphemies and horrible Doctrines but namest nothing and so slanderst without witness and take back thy own words for they belong to thee as is sufficiently proved in this Answer to thy Book let the wise in heart judge And thou hast said Thou wonderst that the ground do not open and swallow us up or else the Devil fetch us away alive c. And this most fully discovers thy spirit to be without the fear of God in any measure who utterst such wicked Language for which thou hast no example among all the Children of God and is not this horrible Doctrine and little less then sad Blasphemies It is answer sufficient to gather up thy confusion and send it thee to read if there be any honesty in thy heart repent and cease thy wickedness lest God smite thee with a Curse and make thee an Example of Destruction Then thou goest on and hast asked thy self a Question Is it not the Spirit of Christ that doth make manifest or convince of Sin The Question is good but thou hast consounded it in thy Answer and not answered plainly but hast covered Truth under the vail of thy many words Thou sayst There are two things that do make manifest and convince of Sin first the Law and secondly the Spirit of Christ. I query further Doth any thing convince of sin contrary to the Spirit of Christ if not then that which doth convince of sin is like unto or one in the Union or something as good in its Nature as the Spirit of Christ and thou instancest in Iudas whom thou sayst was convinced of sin by the Law without the Spirit of Christ to which I say the Law of God is spiritual and is not contrary but one with the Spirit of Christ in its union at least and that which let him see Christ to be innocent was not words syllables without him but must needs be within him so if I should say the Spirit of Christ was not in him yet was the Work of the righteous Law of God written in his heart which is spiritual and Christ Jesus was not without his own testimony in Iudas which is Light by which Iudas was and is condemned eternally And though Iudas was at the same time possessed of the Devil as thou sayest yet there was that within him also which disquieted and tormented the Devil which discovered the Devil with his works by which he saw his murderous mind and the Blood of the Just One I say it needs must be contrary to the Devil and to his works which condemned him I call it the Light of God which is spiritual call it what thou canst Then thou goest on and seems to shew a difference betwixt being convinced by the Law without the Spirit of Christ and the convincement by the Spirit of Christ but art confounded in thy discourse I say the power of the Law of God is spiritual and though thou make a little thing of it to be convinced by the Law of sins against the Law yet I make it a thing of weight And this is the condemnation that Light is come into the World and men love darkness rather then Light because their deeds are evil and the Law is Light as saith the Scripture and Christ is come to discover and reprove sin and I put thee to prove in all the Scripture where any such thing ever was distinguished as something to convince of sin without and besides or contrary to the Spirit of God and till thou provest it thus far I have answered thee concerning it Then thou sayst Though some say they are not only convinced of Sin but have gotten some power over it to abstain from those things forbidden in the Law yet thou further sayst This may be done as those blind Pharisees called Quakers think they do and be but natural men
the end and numbred thy work into a total sum which is a secret smiting and obscure shooting against the Manifestation or Belief of Christ within which there can be no Salvation without as I have proved and in words only I find thee exalting Christ without and worshipping the name of Mary like the Pope I have good ground so to judge And whereas thou callest the Doctrine of Christ within false Opinions and takeâ—â— in hand to discover it as in Page 203. I say to all honest men who have but any knowledge of the Letter of the Scripture thou art hereby sufficiently discovered who callst the chief thing which is the chief unto Salvation and without which can be none false Opinions God shall judge thee thou wicked heart and much more I need not say but shall leave this to the view of any that are honest to judge so have gone through thy Book and passed by many things only I have spoken to that in which thou hast treated any thing upon us and the Truth I have cleared from many Lyes and Slanders and thy Vail of false Reproaches is rent and our Innocency doth partly appear and thy vail of Hypocrisie is a little removed and thy deceitfull heart weighed and seen And as for the rest of thy Book whicg I have not medled with thus much I say of it I suppose you will confess it was all given forth by one spirit and it is proved some of it is given forth by a lying spirit then let the Reader judge what the rest of it can be though the words be true yet is thy spirit false and at the best what thou hast said is but bearing false witness as to thy self of a true thing I own the words and I deny the voice and here I deal plainly with thee Thou then askst a Question Doth not the Scripture speak of Christ within unto which I further add answer it as thou canst Doth not the Scripture say Christ is within except you be Reprobates And is not this thus much all are reprobate but they in whom Christ is within Answer iâ— plainness and darken not knowledge by words without wisdom And towards the end I find thee making up the sum of thy wickedness with this numbring the Quakers with Ranters Sin Death and the Devil I will not bring a railing Accusation against thee but the Lord rebuke thee thou unclean spirit who hast falsly accused the Innocent to clear thy self from guilt but at thy door guilt lodges and I leave it with thee clear thy self if thou art able And thy wicked Reproaches we patiently bear till the Lord appear for us and we are not greater then our Lord who was said to have a Devil by thy Generation and their measure of wickedness thou fulfils and art one of the Dragons Army against the Lamb and his Followers and thy Weapons are Slanders and thy Refuge is Lyes and thy work is confused and hath hardly gained a name in Babylons Record and by us so much of it at least as is against us is cast by as our spoiled prey and trampled upon in all thy reproachfull speeches who art unclean and of more price to us is thy hatred and envy then thy love can be except the gâ—und were better in which you stand Now a few words I may write in Answer to the Queries in the end of thy Book which thou directst thus Some Questions to the Quakers or a few Queries to those possessed with a Spirit of delusion in this Generation Question 1. If sayst thou that every man hath a measure of the Spirit of Christ within him why say the Scriptures That some are sensual having not the Spirit aâ—â— Christ saith The World cannot receive it John 14. Answ. Some men are sensual and have not the Spirit because they received it not some cannot receive it because they believe not in him from whence it comes yet is the measure of the Spirit given unto every man to profit withal as the Scripture saith And it is given to within him to reprove him of sin but few do receive it and when thou canst learn to distinguish between a thing being given and a receiving of such a thing then thou mayst be answered in thy self It is one thing in God to give the Spirit and another thing in the Creature to receive it He gives it to many that receive it not to follow it and to be guided by it thus far I answer and let them that are led with a spirit of Delusion answer thee further Qu. 2. What is the Church of God redeemed by from under the Law is it by something that is done within them or by something done without them If it be redeemed by something that worketh in them then why did the man Christ Iesus hang upon the Cross in Mount Calvery without the Gates of Jerusalem for the sins of his People and why do the Scriptures say That through this man is preached unto us forgiveness of sins c. Answ. The Church of God is redeemed by Christ Jesus which is revealed within all that believe and Christ Jesus wrought in them mightily and it was he that wrought in them to will and to do this is plain according to Scripture And the man Christ Jesus was hanged upon the Cross on Mount Calvery because they wickedly judged him to be a Blasphemer and through their envy persecuted him to death because he bore witness against them and as in their account he died and hanged upon the Cross for an Evil-doer and this is one ground at least why he hanged upon the Cross and the Scriptures say That through this man is preached the forgiveness of sins because there is no other that can forgive sin nor the blood of any other thing that can take away sin but the Blood of God as it is written And thus far I answer If thou wilt have more seek it from them who are led with a spirit of Delusion Qu. 3. What Scripture have you to prove that Christ is or was crucified within you risen within you ascended within you Answ. There is no Scriptures that mention any one of our particular names and thy Query is raised from thy mis-understanding of us so I judge but Christ is within us that we dare not deny and he is the Lamb that was slain in the streets of the great City which is spiritually called Sodom and Aegypt mind spiritually and he is now risen and ascended this we know through Faith in his Name And I leave thee to receive a fuller Answer from them that are led with a spirit of Delusion if they will give it thee Qu. 4. Is that very man that was crucified on Mount Calvery between two Thieves whose Name is Iesus the Son of Mary is he the very Christ of God ye or nay Answ. Yea he is the very Christ of God which was before the World was by whom the World was made who was made
or to persecute any for their Conscience and the exercise thereof towards God And now I come to the Accusation it self which is this in substance That the Quakers are Enemies unto and have sought to root out the true Protestant Religion The words are these calling upon the King to honour the Lord which saith he is done by establishing and preserving the true Protestant Religion which of late years hath been in great danger to be rooted out by Anabaptists Quakers and Atheists page 6. line 1 2 3. of his Book Answ. In answer to this divers things are considerable as to the manner of his Charge against us That this Accuser hath proceeded in the same manner and by the same spirit as the Iews Scribes and Pâ—â—â—isâ—â—s and chief Priestâ— proceeded against Christ Jesus for they numbred him with Transgressors as it is written and crucified him between two Thieves that they might add to his Afflictions and bring him under the greater reproach to Ages after and thus this Accuâ—â—â— hath done in numbring the Innocent People of God called Quakers with and among Transgressors even that he may the more add to their Reproach and have his Accusation heard before the King even that it might be received for truth as if the Quakers were no better then Atheists that deny God for for this end this Accuser in these Terms vilified us and made us equal in this account to the Atheists and thus numbered us with Transgressors and Sinners and that unto the King and for this end no doubt that we might be destroyed and cut off and crucified with such as deny the Lord God Oh how unjustly and unmercifully hath this our Accuser proceeded in thus dealing towards us let the King and all People consider 2. As for such as are Atheists who deny there is a God or who deny the true God that is and who live after the desires of their own lusts saying Let us eat and drink for to morrow we must die and there is no pleasure in the Grave nor state of happiness or misery after this Life such we do deny and have no Affinity Amity Union nor Fellowship with them nor they with us and this is well known through the whole Nation and fully believed in Bristol and I am perswaded in the very Conscience of this our Accuser he knows we are not such as deny God nor have any fellowship with such therefore how hainous is this man's Crime both to God and Men who hath abused the whole Nation with his Slanders and endeavoured to mis-use the King's Ears with false Informations and hath perverted his own Conscience in speaking contrary to it and hath vexed the Lord by his Lyes and all in this his numbring of us in Accusation with the Atheists as if we were one with them and no better then they 3. As for the Anabaptists so called the other Party with whom we are accounted and numbred in the Accuser's charge It is well known what difference there is between us and them and how that we have been opposite one to the other in Controversie about spiritual things and also in matters of Judgement about Government and fighting with carnal Weapons c. and they have dealt sometime with us and proceeded towards us too hardly and maliciously as some of themselves know in accusing us to the Powers of the Nation as this man hath done But I shall at this time say no farther of them then this There may be a sincerity and uprightness amongst them in many of them more then is in this our Accuser though there is no small measure of Error in Judgement in them as concerning many Doctrines and Practises held by them and it s not my work now to accuse them neither to reward them evil for their evil but only on this occasion I am forced to clear the truth for the better information of all and I do wish well to them and even that they may confess to the justness of God's Judgment in what hath befallen them in this the day of their reproof who have been too ambitious and hard-hearted towards others that have not been of their Way and Sect and now the Lord deals justly with them in bowing them under others and in defacing their glory which was of man and not of God But to the case in hand I return and say How unrighteous still doth appear the manner of this our Adversary's Charge for whatsoever the Anabaptists or any others may hold or do though I at this time shall neither justifie nor yet condemn all what they profess and practise cannot we be charged guilty of except it first be lawfully proved that we holâ— and practise the same things And as for us who are scornfully called Quakers which Title was given unto us of derision and nick-naming I cannot in this place say much of us lest I should be said to justifie our selves which I seek not to do because it is the Lord that justifies us neither do I love much to be heard in our own Cause when it is onely our own nor do I seek praise of men for us nor of men to be â—…ed yet this I may say on Gods account and in his cause and not of our 〈◊〉 we are the people of the Lord whom he hath called and chosen and 〈◊〉 and though hated of men yet it is for the Lords sake and not for any 〈◊〉 amongst men that can be chaâ—ged upon us And we are Worshippers of 〈◊〉 â—â—ue God in spirit and in truth and we are of God and they that are of 〈◊〉 are not against us but with us and as for any Doctrine or Practise in 〈◊〉 Religion held forth by us they are according to the Scriptures of Truth 〈◊〉 I assert and can prove if need require in opposition to any that shall â—â—â—y it for we are not of a new Religion as if we worshipped strange godds though by the ignorance of men we are so reputed but are of the same Spirit 〈◊〉 in the same way of truth and we walk in the same light and life even as tâ—â— Apostles and Churches of Jesus Christ were of and walked in in the days 〈◊〉 old and this I am ready to make proof of if so it come to pass even beâ—â—â—â— the King and the whole Nation and do further declare That whatsoeâ—â—â— Church-Government Ministry Doctrine and Ordinances Faith and â—â—â—ship and whatsoever Religion in whomsoever that is not according to the Scriptures of the Old and New Testament but differing from and coâ—â—rary to that Spirit of God that gave forth the Scriptures I do for my self and on the behalf of all them that are one with me utterly renounce and â—â—y and freely give witness against notwithstanding upon whatsoever foundation such Church-Government Ministry Doctrine Faith and Worship be builded if not upon Jesus Christ as the alone Foundation and according to the Scriptures and proveable thereby they are Antichristian and the Lord will confound
the Church of ROME who are in the said Book Villified and Reproached by the Name and Term of Antient Phanaticks And this is sent forth as an Answer thereunto to Pursue it Apprehend it and Condemn it as a Pamphlet of Calumnies and Slanders against the Protestants both of former and present Dayes who are all of them Scorned in the said Book the one as Ancient the other as Modern PHANATICKS Which is sent abroad as a Warning to ENGLAND to beware of the spirit of the Church of ROME lest it Exalt it self in Cruel Persecution against the PROTESTANTS and all that differ from it HOW Great and Miserable hath been that Darkness and Ignorance which hath over-spread the Nations and Kingdoms of the World since the Apostles dayes And how manifold is that Error into which many have been fallen even as into a Snare of Destruction And how woful is that Strife Division and Contention about Religion that hath highly abounded among the Christian People so called For the whole Christendom have been divided and in Opposition one part against another about the True God and his Worship and concerning the knowledge of Salvation by Jesus Christ And divers kinds of Religion Church-Government and Practices of Ordinances of Faith Worship have been extant in the World and Nations Countries have been all in Division Strife and Contention about these Matters and have been also persecuting one another violently unto Bonds and Death for and because difference in Judgment and Practices concerning Spiritual Things Papists against Protestants and Protestants against Papists and one sort of Christians so called against another and the men of such a Judgment and Faiâ—â— and Way of Religion have been persecuting and seeking to destroy all that have been contrary minded to them And thus have been the woful Divisions and evil Effects thereof in the World among Christians about Faith and Worship and Religious matters this has come to pass because of the spirit of Error Darkness that hath possessed the minds of men since the falling away from the Truth as it was once manifest among the Apostles And thus it s come to pass because of the erring from the Spirit of God and because that hath been wanting amongst men therefore have People been divers and divided about Matters of Religion each one sort following their own Invention and Traditions of men and also persecuting one another and killing and imprisoning one another because of the same and all this because the Spirit of Truth hath not dwelt in the Hearts of Christians as it did in the Apostles not led guided and taught them in true Unity and Fellowship as it did the true Christians in the dayes of old And while the Spirit of Christ hath been wanting and is not received into the Heart to mortifie guide rule and teach in all the Wayes of God and the whole exercise of Religion and Duty towards Him and while there is any kind of imposing and forceing of Religion by Laws of men upon Penalties and Forfeitures and setting up Worship and Church Government by that means and in that way without the immâ—… Teaching of the Spirit of Christ in the Conscience I say while this hath been and is continued nothing but Division Strife Contention Persecution and Nations and Peoples destroying one another about Religion hath been is or can be in the World amongst Christians And of this same to wit of Division and Contention about Religion with the Enmity of such as are so divided one against another to the persecuting and killing one of another that are contrary minded as it hath been brought forth in the World for Generations past we have here a sufficient large Testimony lately published in a Book called Semper Iidem or A Paralel of Phanaticks c. wherein is made mention of what Strife and Contention there hath been in former dayes among the false Christians and how they have cruelly Persecuted Burned and Destroyed one another in this Cause only for and because of the difference in Maters of Judgment and Religious Things and these Persecutions and Cruelties effected contrary to the Example of Christ and his Doctrine who hath exhorted to Love and Peace and not to Kill and Destroy and that a man should love his Enemies and not Kill and Destroy them contrary to which Doctrine the false Christians of all kinds have walked and acted since the dayes of the Apoâ—… who have been Apostatized and fallen from the very Life and Power of Godliness as held amongst the primitive Saints into Forms and empty Shadows being all in strife one with another about such things and have wanted the Spirit of Christ which should have led and guided into all Truth and exercised them in the true Worship of the true and living God who is a Spirit and is only truly worshipped in Spirit and in Truth but out of this Spirit and spiritual Worship the false Christians have been erred and so all divided and in Centention aâ— aforesaid and persecuting one another because thereof each one sort justifying their own Way 〈◊〉 Right and condemning that which hath differed as the Wrong and all as Hereticks that have been otherwise minded But as 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Book Semper Iidem c. I would gladly animadâ—… 〈◊〉 conâ—…ing it and do intend to write a few things by way of anâ—â—er thereunto and this is the present Occasion of my present work for having met with the said Pamphlet and perusing of it I found divers Considerations on my spirit to send forth in Answer to pursue the said Semper Iidem up and down the World till it returns again unto the place from whence it came to wit Unto the bottomless Pit out of which it lately arose and in reading the same Book I have principally observed the Mischievout End and secret Evil Intents of the Nameless Author more than the Matter it self contained and though the Author be Nameless yet is his nature and spirit known by his Book and for what end he hath concealed his Name I know not except he was ashamed of his Work and durst not Authorize his Matter by his Name but however the spirit end and intent of the said Nameless Person is perceived and known as much as any Tree can be distinguished by its Fruit and he is of an Envious Disposition of Heart and of Malicious Countenance and in nature and stock of the descent of Cain for his spirit is of an evil constitution hot and fiery and enclinable to destroy all that are not like-minded with himself in the Iudgment of Religious Matters and his proceedings and the end of his work is of an Intent and Purpose wicked enough if every Effect answers the Cause appearing and be not diverted from the End proposed by the Author and this I find by Calculation of his Birth and the Temper of his spirit and of the Time wherein his Book is published and by the Cause and End and Intent of the
thy ignorance is made manifest who bringst one Scripture to oppose another and knowst not the conditions in thy self from which Paul spoke and so art ignorant of what he spoke for I say there is a time without the Law and a time under the Law and a time dead to the Law and not under it and all these states Paul witnessed which we also in our measures are witnesses of which thou knowst not in thy self and so wrests Pauls words And whereas thou sayest Yet let not them think that we by this doctrine nourish sin having brought many Scriptures to plead for sin I answer being guilty in thy self thou art afraid and hath a jealousie lest we should lay it to thy charge and truly concerning thee we think nothing in this matter for thy heart and the secrets of it is made manifest in the Eternal Light by which thou are comprehended and answered and by which God will eternal judge thee therefore repent lest the wrath of God overtake thee and thou be swept away with the Beesom of destruction who hath falsly accused and slandered us with lies and false reproaches but now it s the time that Pilate and Herod is made Friends and Gog and Magog is gathered together to compass the Camp of the Saints about and even the Priests and their Crew and the Anabaptists and their Crew and all Sects is combined against the Truth but God is with us and in him alone can we rejoyce over you all for ever and ever and in him make our boast all the day long for this is our heritage every tongue that riseth up in judgement against us shall be condemned for the Lord is our portion and even the stone which is become the head stone of the corner and thou Howet shalt be grinded to powder by it who hath bent thy bow to shoot at the righteous therefore consider what thou hast done and repent lest God tear thee in pieces and there be none to deliver By one who is zealous for the Name of the Lord of Hosts called EDWARD BURROUGH Answers to several Queries Put forth to the despised People called Quakers by Philip Bennett who calls himself a Minister of Christ but is found a Deceiver Also Answers to several other Queries put forth by Iohn Reeve who lives in the City of London who calls himself The last Messenger and Witness unto the true God but is found a false Witness and a Lyar and a Perverter of the right Way of God A Paper being received which was directed to Rich. Roper and to his Quaking Friend which words comes from the dark carnal mind quaking and trembling which the Saints and holy men of God witnessed we own and witness therefore we do deny thee and all thy dark Divinations WHereas thou Philip Bennett in thy Note which thou hast written to Roper in Answer to a Letter which he wrote to thee wherein he charges thee to be a Lyar and a false Accuser and charges thee to bring any man to witness what thou hast spoken by them whom thou sayest denyed that Christ that dyed at Ierusalem and who they were that denyed that Christ that suffered at Ierusalem or else acknowledge thy self to be a Slanderer and in thy Paper thou gives no Answer at all to these words but sayest thou callest the Congregation to witness but doth not mention one in all the Congregation that will witness it whereupon the Lye rests upon thy head and thou found to be the Lyar and the Slanderer and the false Accuser And whereas thou sayest thou hast sent queries concerning that matter thy queries makes thee manifest what thou art many of thy own Tribe and Generation if they saw thy queries would be ashamed both of thee and of thy queries for hundreds there are in the world that know nothing of the true and living God and yet would see thee and thy queries not to be worth answering yet lest thou shouldst boast in thy filthy ignorance and darkness and for clearing of the Truth to the simple Something in answer to them 1 Quer. Whether was the Word made flesh or the Son of God made of a Woman more or oftner then once Answ. In this first query thou hast manifested what thou art to all the Children of Light and where thou art and what spirit thou art of a Reprobate a child of Darkness thou art thou mightest have spared the other nineteen queries for in this query thy spirit is tryed and in the Eternal Light seen and known Thou askest whether the Word was made Flesh any more or oftner then once which makes it plainly manifest that thou knowest noâ—â—â—at thou askest and that thou dost not know nor canst not witness the Word to be made Flesh once but art one of the Antichrists and Deceivers which Iohn speaks of that are entred into the World which cannot confess Jesus Christ come in the flesh and therefore thou queries whether the Word was made Flesh any more or oftner than once which query comes from thy dark polluted mind who is out of the Light and a Stranger to the Life and without God in the world amongst the false Prophets Antichrists and Deceivers which are in the world and in the Light of Christ which condemns the world ye are all seen known and made manifest and are turned away from by these who dwell in the Light which Light condemns thee and all thy Generation eternally and the Word made flesh we witness which dwells amongst us and we behold his glory as the glory of the only begotten of the Father according to the Scripture whereby we witness thee and all thy Generation to be in the Sorcery and in the Witchcraft deceiving and betraying the Souls of the Simple the Light of Christ in thy Conscience will tell thee so for that thou must be obedient to and witness before thou witness the Word to be made flesh once for thou art Darkness it self and the Light in thy Conscience if thou wouldst let it rise will be thy condemnation and when thou canst witness the Word to be made flesh once then thou wilt know whether the Son of God was made of a Woman any more or oftner than once But thou art the Dragon that wouldst devour the Man-child which the Woman hath brought forth who shall rule all Nations with a Rod of Iron and her Child is caught up to God and to his Throne and thou the Dragon and thy Angels are cast out into the Earth and therefore dost thou persecute the Woman which hath brought forth the Man-child but thou art overcome by the Blood of the Lamb and the Word of his Testimony and for thy other nineteen queries thou hast conjured them up in thy black Art out of the Bottomless-pit which is to be turned into perdition if thou hadst an ear thou mightst hear or a eye thou mightst read but thou art blind 2 Quer. Whether did the Man Christ Iesus the Son of God slain in
Weeping Wailing and Gnashing of Teeth But as for the Elect Wheat of Christ which thou sayest is the Children of Adam thou speakest thou knowest not what the first man is of the Earth earthly and he begat his Image and that which is earthly shall never inherit but are to have their portion with Cain where thou art that hast uncovered thy nakedness but the Elect and the Wheat shall be gathered into the Barn and they are not nor ever were they defiled but shall reign with the Lamb in the New Ierusalem for ever and ever where no unclean thing can enter nor nothing that destroys or defiles in that holy Mountain of the Lord if thou hast an ear thou mayst hear 6 Quer. What is that painful and shameful Death in utter darkness and where it is that is reserved for the Reprobate who are the seed of Cain and not of Adam or blessed Abraham Answ. Thou that queriest shall surely know it is Tophet prepared of old even for the King the burning of it is as Fire the Breath of the Lord doth kindle it it shall be destruction for ever and ever to that which hath given forth these queries and it is to be separated from God for ever among all Idolaters and Adulterers and Lyars the Unbelieving the Abominable and the Fearful in the Lake of Fire where the Worm dieth not nor the Fire goeth not out as for Adam in innocency thou knows nothing of him who art of Cain who slew his brother and must have thy portion with him and not with Abraham the promise was not to the Transgressor nor to Adam when he eat of the Tree of knowledg for the Lord said in the day thou eatest thou shalt dye he was driven from the Presence of the Lord into the Earth in the curse the Promise was to Abraham in Isaac is the Blessing not in Ishmael and here thou shewst thy ignorance but it is but like the former when thou joynest the Elect and Reprobate together Light and Darkness and in Babylon thou art but in that which was before Babylon was thou art seen and as for those dark spirits thou speaks of who minde nothing but their lusts condemning the glorious things of eternity because their carnal reason cannot comprehend them see at home for in the Light of Christ thou art seen that thou knowest nothing of Eternity by thy dark imaginations being naturally as a Bruit to the Light of Christ in thy Conscience I speak which will let thee see it is so 7 Quer. Are they not deceived Persons and utterly ignorant of the true God who judge men and women in darkness if they ask them Questions about the needfull things of Eternity is it not because they went before they were sent and so are of a bitter spirit for want of spiritual Light to satisfie the tender Christian Querier Answ. All who dwell not in this Light which is pure and eternal are ignorant of God and never knew God such judging shall be judged and by the Light which sees and comprehends all darkness thou art seen but the spiritual man judgeth all things and he is judged of none and all Judgement is committed to the Son and where he is made manifest he speaketh and judgeth righteously and those men and women who would be asking questions of Eternity and never came to the first principle to be guided by it the Light which leads to Eternity all such men and women are in darkness and that minde which is in the Earth and in the naturals shall never know and therefore they are judged to be in darkness and darkness cannot comprehend the Light Christ and his Disciples answered and judged that spirit which would have had a sign and called them Adulterers which Spirit we witness to the praise of God and to thee that put forth the queries I speak to thee in the presence of God whether thou putst them forth in simplicity and art ignorant or wouldst know or in the pride of thy heart and subtilty to tempt the Light of Christ will let thee see but thou art rich and full therefore thou must be sent empty away all who queries from that nature that would know but never come to obedience that is to be judged and judgment must thou witness and for a bitter spirit of envy that shall stand for thy self and that thou wantst spiritual Light is made manifest which curses that which God hath blessed as I have seen under thy own hand far remote from this City and that thou hast cursed them soul and body to all eternity which thou never heardst nor saw let shame strike thee in the face and stop thy mouth for thou canst not put a difference betwixt the precious and the vile but cursest thou knowst not what and speaks to that thou knowest not But as for them who have a desire to know the way to the Father we are ready to give an answer and to impart of the gift we have received and doth not break a bruised reed but the fat we feed with judgement and there thou art answered 8 Quer. It is not an infallible demonstration unto them who have a discerning Spirit that that man hath no commission from the true Spirit to preach or speak to a pâ—ople when for fear of his ignorance being discovered or for fear of losing his Heâ—â—ers â—e shall counsell them to stick close to the Word of God or to heâ—â—ken to the Light within thâ—â— in their Consciences without knowing what that is in the Conscience or what will be the issue of it if men be obedient to it or disobedient to it and to beware of false Prophets and not thinking in the least himself to be that false Prophet and thus borrowing Scripture language which we are the true Messengers of the Gospel doth he not in his pâ—…â—inder his Heâ—â—ers from reading the glorious things revealed unto the two last Witnesses and so thou sayst it is clear that the Spirit is not in them which was in Paul who gave theâ— leave to try all Answ. Here thy infallible demonstration is made manifest to be fallible and lying when thou layst that down to be a sign of them that have no Commission from the Spirit and not to have the Spirit because they exhort them to cleave close to the Word of God and to mind the Light which shines into the Conscience of every man which is the Light of Christ here thy Spirit is tryed that thou hast not the same commission as they had who spoke forth the Scripture and so thou preachest another Gospel for the Word of God endures for ever and by the Word which is eternall and which was in the beginning which tryes all things which searches all things comprehends all things and judges all things he that cleaves not close unto that builds upon another foundation and by the Word which endures for ever thou art seen not to have that Word neither knowest what nor where it
manifest from Mary's womb and was persecuted to death by the Scribes and Pharisees in whose steps thou treadst in asking subtil Queries to insnare the Innocent as they did read thy Example and thy self to be an Enemy to the Christ of God Qu. 5. Is that very Man with that very Body within you yea or nay Answ. The very Christ of God is within us we dare not deny him and we are Members of his Body and of his Flesh and of his Bone as the Ephesians were They that are led by a spirit of Delusion shall answer the rest of this thy Query if they will Qu. 6. Was that very Iesus that was born of the Virgin Mary a real man of Flesh and Bones after his Resurrection from the dead out of Josephs Sepulchre ye or nay for the Scrpiture saith he was and if so then did that Man go away from his Disciples and not into them in his Body as the Scriptures declare or did he with that Body of Flesh go into his Disciples as some fond Dreamers think Answ. What the Scriptures speak of Christ we own to be truth and own him to be what the Scriptures speak of him and all mens imaginations of him we deny and their falsâ— interpretations of the Scriptures concerning him and let the fond Dreamers who are in their thoughts be reproved for we dare own nothing to be truth but what the Spirit of the Lord bearâ— witness of according to the Scripture thus far I anwer in behalf of the Quakers let them who are led with the spirit of Delusion answer the rest which concerns themselves Qu. 7. Hath that Christ that was with God the Father before the World was no other Body but his Church if you say no as it is your wonted course Then again I aske you What was that in which he did bear the sins of his Chrildren if you say it was his own Body on the Tree then I ask you whether that Body in which he did bear our sins was or is the Church of God yea or nay Again if you say he hath no Body but his Church then I ask what that was that was taken down from the Cross c Answ. In this thou hast not only queried but Slandered therefore first thy Slander I do remove It is not our wonted course to say that Christ hath no other Body but his Church thou art herein as in other things a false Accuser but we say the Church is Christ's Body And it is sufficient for Salvation to know Christ Jesus to be head in us and over us and our selves to be Members of his Body and what thou intendst by making so many foldings in one Query it may be judged is to insnare and in that thou answerest thy self for us in somthing that thou mayst have a further ground to lay a deeper snare we do deny thee and thy spirit and see thee to be only feeding in thy imaginations upon the report of things without the Life and thy religion stands in disputes and controversies and querying and many words but our Religion stands in the exercise of a pure Conscience towards God and towards man whether we speak or be silent Thus I have answered thy Queries or so much of them as concerns us and as I have said if thou wilt be further answered go seek an Answer from them who are led with a spirit of Delusion and let them answer their part or else be thou unsatisfied for I shall not answer them to satisfie thee nor I may not feed thy Serpents wisdom nor subtilty which cannot receive of the things of God not understand a reason of the Hope of Christ in us if we declare it to thee For all throughout thy Book I do observe it is that which thou strikest against even Christ within which is our Hope of Glory And it is that Mystery which long hath been hid from Ages and Generations but now is made manifest and declared And though the wise of the World cannot receive it but speak evil against it yet is it dear unto us and so much more precious because despised by such as thee and thy Generation And such things are a testimony to us and against you and go thou with them that are led with a spirit of Delusion for you are one in Nature and the Children of God who are redeemed cannot but deny you together Some few Queries propounded for John Bunyan to answer Query 1. Whether is any man justified by Christ Jesus in the sight of God but he that follows Christ and is it not a work to follow him yea or nay and what is the sight of God Qu. 2. Whether will that Faith justifie a man which hath no works seeing the Apostle saith Faith without works is dead and what is that which works Faith and where is it within or without Qu. 3. Whether any man is justified but he who is born of God and whether doth he that is born of God commit sin and is that within the Creature or without him which works the new Birth Qu. 4. If Christ hath lightened all men as he is God as thou confessest then whether hath he not lighted all men as he is the Son of God and is not the Light of God sufficient in it self to lead unto God all that follow it yea or nay Qu. 5. Whether it is not the same Light in him that hates it as it is in him that loves it Iohn 3. if there be a difference in the Light shew it wherein it lies whether in its nature or otherwise Qu. 6. Whether it is possible that any can be saved without Christ manifest within if no then whether it is not the Doctrine of Salvation which is only necessary to preach Christ within and it is not the whole Mystery of Salvation God manifest in the flesh Qu. 7. Whether is it not possible that many may profess as much of Christ without as thou hast said of him and yet be damned and if this be the faith to profess him born dead risen and ascended without then is there any Unbeliever in England seeing all in the outward sound believe and professe as much as thou hast said yea or nay Quer. 8. Whether hath that man faith in Christ who is not changed in the Nature and is not the Lyar and Slanderer an Unbeliever and of the cursed Nature yea or nay Quer. 9. Whether doth any man receive Christ who receives him not into him if not shew how Christ can be received and whether many do not profess him which never received him Quer. 10. Whether to preach for Hire for Gifts and Rewards and to Divine for Money and to make Merchandise of People for so much a year for preaching to them is not true Marks and Signs of a false Prophet or can any give truer Signs of the false Prophets then Isaiah and Micah gave yea or nay Quer. 11. Whether must not the Devil be chained before Christ reign
the Foundation or Fundamental Principle of the Religion which is not in Form but in Power agreeing in the Foundation and in the whole building But Friends you seem to charge the late Powers of the Nation if not your selves yet some part of your Body which now are in power with great things with no less then to be Satans Seedsmen for if allowing difference in Forms be the dangerousest and fruitfullest Seed that ever was sown by the envious One as you say it is then who do you blame either the fore-going Parliaments of which some of you have been and so cannot be clear from that evil or the Protector himself and this seem to be a very great charge upon him whose judgment is appearingly to give allowance unto difference in Forms to be the Seedsman of Satan or to allow the envious One to sow the Seed which you call dangerous it is not Christians that are divided but the Sects and false Opinions men of corrupt minds Thus much in answer to the words as they are laid down but I rather chuse to speak to the mind or intent of the Penmans spirit of your Declaration which implieth an inclining to be against many Forms and to bind up all into one Form of Worship and so thereby though some which is evil would be shut out yet would the true spiritual Worship of the Saints above all assuredly thereby be excluded and the tender spirits of People who truly seek God would be oppressed But keep your selves from that evil I warn you lest you be broken and never bound up and lay no Law nor make no Law upon Religion but let Religion defend it self only lay your Law upon Peace-breakers and violent men and bind not mens Consciences to a Worship by your Precepts either made already or by such as may be made if you ease the Oppressed so God will establish you in peace if you fulfil his Will herein Again you say In not being fully sensible though the Lord in the depth of his wisdoms and righteous Iudgments hath for some years last past been overturning several Authorities in these Nations and hath as it were been pouring them from Vessel to Vessel he hath been pleased ever since his people publickly contended for his Truths still to set up Rulers who have allowed them the free exercise and profession of them Answ. Indeed you are not sensible of the righteous Judgments of God in overturning several Authorities in the Nation and therefore you go in the same abominations as they did who were overturned till you also be overturned as they were But take heed to your selves lest you be more then poured from Vessel to Vessel even spilt in the dust of misery and never more gathered again Your last part of this particular is false for we that are in the pure Religion and in the Exercise of our pure Consciences have not from some of you our Liberty but are cast into Goals and Dungeons and banished out of yoâ—â— Towns and Cities some of us by some that have been Rulers set up if this be doubted by you examine through your Nation true testimony may be given so that here you have spoken better of the Rulers then indeed it is and would make the Nation believe untruths to establish you though I condemn not all but my words are towards the Guilty that they may repent lest they perish in their iniquities and be cut off in their transgressions and the Curse be upon you all for the sake of some Again you say In that Athiestical and luke-warm Spirit too commonly aâ—…gst you whereby not only the Form but also the Power of Godliness is reproached and accounted as a vain thing but also too many have fallon from their first love and others esteâ—… themselves rich whilst they are miserable poor and blind and naked sins which â—…e the highest aggravated by being committed in Countries where the glorious Light of the Gospel shinâ—s clearest Answ. This you have confessed truly to your own shame in the sight of other Nations your spirit is not only luke-warm unto Righteousness but it is too â—â—mmon among some of you to be zealous and hot in persecuting the Way of Righteousness and indeed many of you are grosly fallen from your first Love and Integrity and thereby the Power of Godliness is not only reproached by you but persecuted and counted vile and they that live in it oppressed such is your zeal in your dead Form some of you that even you count the true Way and Worship of God madness and you are the men that esteem your selves rich while you are miserable and blind and naked and your sins are aggravated the more and higher because God gives you warning daily by the mouth of his Servants who hold forth the Light of the glorious Gospel and bears witness unto your faces against your Abominations and Idolatries committed by you yet for all this you continue in your iniquities and evil entreat the Messengeâ— of Peace unto you souls and are the men indeed which are Athiestical evâ—â— many by their work saying in their hearts there is no God and as truly as yoâ— have confessed your sins so must you confess the justness of the Judgments of God upon your own heads if you return not unto the living God and own the day of your Visitation Again you say In being more dissatisfied that you have not obtained all you aimâ—d 〈◊〉 then thankful that you have obtained so much as you now enjoy Answ. Verily this is not the least of your sins but exceed some others fâ—r you aim at that which you shall never obtain till you be thankful and walk worthy of what you enjoy and this is the way Ease the Oppressed and take oâ—f the yoke of the Poor and Needy and of the Lord you may be heard and seek not your own honour for that is the ground of dissatisfaction and unthankfulness among you and the cause why you abuse the Mercies which you do enjoy having lost the sence of the former dealings of the Lord with you Further you say All which with other the grievous sins of these three Nations caâ—â— aloud upon all the good People in them to lie low in the sight of our offended God and bâ— Prayer and Humiliation away which in our deepest distresses we have found both our Dâ—ty and Comfort to tread in to seek to appease his Wrath and that he would be pleased fâ—… his own Names sake to remove whatever accursed thing there is found amongst us and the as he is our God so we may be his People Answ. Indeed many more grievous sins are highly abounding in these three Nations your own oppressions and self-seeking honours and vain glories in your self-performed righteousness with your persecution of the Innocent by grievous unjust Fines and Imprisonment not regarding the cry of the Poor which lie under the heavy hand of Oppression of you subordinate Rulers these aboundantly add to the
People to save them or his Enemies that he should not recompence them but know ye assuredly that the Lord is the same and all those things are written in a Book and remembred by him and he will judge justly and righteously in his dreadful day Ah let it enter into your hearts serve not your selves altogether in the pleasures of this World but serve the Lord and this he requires of you let the oppressed go free and break every bond whereby the Innocent do suffer and this the Lord requires at your hands Oh but I feel great hardness of heart and rather a strengthening of cruel bonds than a breaking of them and you appear rather to be given up to work wickedness and to fullfill the largest measure of them that went before you than otherwise unrighteous Decrees are rather established than disannulled Oh what will be the end of these things and what will be your judgment when the Lord awakens himself as out of sleep who hath left you to follow your own spirits to try you that it might be known unto all what is in your hearts and behold perverseness lodges in them and while the Lord hath looked for justice amongst you even the cry of oppression hath been heard even a grieveous cry of unjust persecution and violence against the Seed of God and once you would have been ashamed of those things which now you act without shame so that which is in your hearts is poured forth in the sight of the World Oh ye Rulers of England the Rulers of the Heathen shall rise up is judgment against you even they that never professed so much as you have done they shall be rather justified than you whose wayes have been more equal than yours and less cruelty brought forth by them than by you unto their subjects and this makes your sin more great in that many of yoâ— were raised from low estate and you have exalted your selves more than is meet and have caused your very equals to groan under you by the heavy yoak which you have prepared for them well but the Lord hath listned and heard and a Book of remembrance is written and he will repay into your bosoms the time is not long when the Lord may scatter you and give you unto the will of your Enemies therefore be awakened and warned the day of your visitation is upon you all OH England that thou hadst known in this thy day the things that belong to thy peace Oh that thy Rulers and people had known how that the Lord hath called unto them Oh that they had considered-how that his hand hath been stretched forth all the day long and he would have gathered them as a Shepherd doth his flock but they have nâ—… known neither have they considered and therefore that which belongs to their peace will the Lord hide from their eyes the day of their visitation is spending apace and the night will come and no man shall be able to work and because the Lord hath called and you have not heard therefore shall you cry and the Lord will give no answer Oh Nation thou art filled with oppression and griveous iniquities and from the Head to the Foot thou bearest marks of great abominations in thee is found lamentable oppression of the Poor and great and grieveous Idolatries and Gods Rightous Soul is vexed in thee day by day the Just groans and mourns under the heavy hand of oppressors many of thy Goales do witness it where many Innocent and Upright People have suffered unjustly the loss of their Freedom without any ground or charge of evil laid upon them Oh what have thy Rulers done Judgment and Justice have they turned backward the cry of the Poor hath not been regarded and equity hath not found a place to enter Who would have thought that you who have been so high in Profession of the Scriptures should thus have dealt with them who are in the Life of the Scriptures this agravates your sin in that none hath been like you in profession of Religion and in pretences of Righteousness and yet you have exceeded others in persecuting and suffering of it the servants of the Lord but it is now made Manifest what lodgeth in your hearts under your fair covers of promises words and shews what deep Hypocrisie is this that you should profess Liberty of Conscience and yet have persecuted hundreds for the exercise of their pure Consciences Is not this to be taken notice of that you should profess that which you do not perform and will not the Lord plead with you because of it in his dreadful day which is hastening upon you as a thief in the night and the wicked shall not escape do you not think that he whom you persecute in his Members and his Members shall surely reign over you do not you know that he is sufficient to avenge himself of all his Enemies and do not you believe that he could command thousands of thousands to fight for him and to revenge his Cause Hath the consideration of these things no room in your hearts or are your hearts wholy shut up from all compassion towards the Lords people Surely to Vengeance will the Lord be awakened and he will tread you down as mire in the streets and as you have done and suffered to be done to the Lords people even so shall it be done unto you THere are only two Seeds in the World and there are but two and no more to wit the Seed of God and the Seed of the Serpent and these two are contrary one to the other in their bringing forth in their time and in their ends they differ in their Nature in their fruits and works and in their reward and these two are at continual enmity one against another and never was is or shall be reconciled the life of one is the death of the other and where the one doth live the other doth dye and where the one rejoyceth the other is made sorrowful and where the one is in Freedom the other is in Bondage and where the one is Ruler the other is a Slave and in Captivity and thus are they contrary where the one brings forth fruit the other is barren and the one is rewarded with the overthrow of the other and the one of these is ruling in every creature man and woman and growing and bringing forth fruit from it self through the Creature and the fruits of the one is blessed for ever and the fruits of the other are cursed for ever and betwixt these two there is no concurrence or agreement in any thing whatsoever but they differ in likeness and their fruits differ in appearance the fruit of the one is love and peace and unity the fruit of the other is hatred and envy and trouble and enmity the fruit of the Seed of God in the creature is truth and righteousness and faith and patience long-suffering and temperance and joy and peace in the Lord with all
this if thou canst that all men may see thy Folly for there is not many Christs but one Christ which is not only within but without not only without but within but is all and in all let him that readâ— understand Then thou sayst the Light wherewith Christ as he is God lighted every one is the Soul of man which is the Life of the Body and is a Creature and hath one faculty of its own Nature called Conscience Reply Now le ts try this Doctrine and consider what thou hast said it amounâ—… to thus much that Conscience is of the nature of the Soul of man and the soul is the Light of Christ as God Therefore thou hast said the Conscience is the Light of God which must needs be without sin this is more then I have or dare say I might here fitly ask thee if thou knowst what the word Conscience signifies in true understanding and yet though thou hast uttered this that Conscience is a Faculty of the soul which thou sayst is the Light of Christ as God which Light of God must needs be of the nature of God pure and not impure yet in the next page thou sayst Conscience is a poor Dunghill Creature in comparisâ—… of the Spirit c. and in another page calls Conscience poor so empty beggerly things c. What now Iohn Bunion is that which thou hast concluded to be the Light of God but a dunghill-Creature and low and empty and beggerly in comparison c. For shame cease such Divinity lest all thy Fellows reprove thee O how doth thy ignorant zeal lead thee into Snares and trape thy own feet And to confound thy self thou sayst Conscience which is the Light of God is Nature it self then it must needs be that every mans nature which is sinful say I it the Light of God O what horrible Doctrine this proves in its explanation Blush and be ashamed when thou considers then thou cries out in reproof O wonderful sayst thou That men should make a God and Christ of their Consciences I know none that doth it nor that ever spoke so highly of Conscience 〈◊〉 thou hast here done yet we say our Conscience bears us witness in the holy Ghost and this is our rejoycing the testimony of our Consciences 〈◊〉 if our Consciences condemn us not then have we confidence towards God and yet makes not God and Christ of our Conscience as thou secretly wouldst charge us withall Then thou goest on and wouldst seem to prove but canst not that somthing besides the Light of Christ convinceth of sin but thy reach is too short thoâ—… thou wind abroad and lets thy thoughts into the pit of thy own reason to bring up a thing to confound Truth but cannot for this is thy proof where they were all convinced by their own Consciences Iohn 8. Now all these I say weâ—… men come into the World and therefore according to Iohn 1. 9. were lighted with the Light of Christ and thou hast confessed that Conscience is the Light of Christ as God which is no less then I have affirmed then wherefore hast thou waded so farr when at the end thou art forced to confess my position thy words being explained that it is the Light of Christ that doth convince of sin and can find no other thing besides that then thou sayst here is somthing besides the Spirit of Christ that doth convince of sin c. But yet I say nothing besides the Light of Christ as thou hast confessed and that was that only which I affirmed in the tenth page of mine about which thou hast made all this stir and to no purpose as to prove any thing convinceth of sin but the Light of Christ and in that I said he that convinceth of sin against the Law leads up into the fulfiling of the Law which still I own though thou wouldst contradict it but canst not and I clearly see thou hast not reached the understanding of my words but answered thy own conceiving and not my words for I do not say or think that righteousness comes by the Law yet that is righteousness which condemneth that which breaks the Law if thou hast an ear thou mayst hear and as I said it is the Word of Truth the Righteousness of the Law must needs be fulfilled in Judgment upon you all and by Christ Jesus in you if ever you receive the Salvation to your Souls and thou hast not yet learned what I mean and though thou sayst that for justification thou lookst beyond the Law to the Son of Mary but I say thou must not look beyond it for condemnation who art in transgression and not reconciled to God through condemnation in the flesh for it will reach you to condemnation and thou sayst Thou understandst that I do in all my discourse disown Christ without by pretending to a Christ within To which I say thy understanding deceives thee who it may be feared blinds thy own eyes that thy Conscience may not condemn thee for slandering but while I am approved in the sight of God of those things whereof thou accusest me falsly and wickedly I matter nothing what a Lyers Judgements is of me my Answer to thy Query shall prove me clear and thee a Lyer herein that we own Gods Christ as the Scripture declares of him as I have said and the darkness of my words is to blind the eye of subtilty and not to deceive the hearts of the simple though thou wouldst say it see if thou now canst tell what I say And whereas thou art offended that I say many more things in thy Book I pass by as being not pertinent to the thing in hand my words are true for the thing in hand was proving us Deceivers and that was the most of which I medled withal or purposed to oppose and to other things that thou speakest of in short my answer was and is the words or of some of them I own and thy voice I deny without any blaspheming or error in the view of all the World though thou wouldst say it for whatsoever a lying spirit speaks I deny it to be the voice of Christ though it may be some of his words and thy spirit is a lying spirit And though thou art offended that I should say Fools loves to be medling yet its true enough is not he a Fool who is a Lyer and a Slanderer that understands not betwixt before a time and since a time judge in thy own Conscience and thy fair words as that it must needs be sayst thou That the Saints of God must be called Fool I say never presume the name of Saint but clear thy self of thy Lyes and Slanders and perverting Scriptures and learn the First principle of Religion Even that which Condemns thee And as to that which I say 〈◊〉 true that the Pope can speak as much of Christ without as thou I own it and may add I believe he can speak more then thou
of Christ without and with as good or better understanding though both a like far from the Kingdom of God yet in thy Answer thou askest me if I put 〈◊〉 difference betwixt the speaking of and beleeving in Christ without Yea I do a great deal for he that believes in him hath the Witness in himself of him and his heart is purifyed and he is a new Creature which thou art not but thou I suppose wouldst be reckoned a Believer nay for I think the Pope hath both more words and more good works and makes as much Conscience of lying and false accusing as thou for ought as may be understood of a tree by the fruits which is our way to judge as Christ hath given us example then is that I said thou hast answered thy self a question deceitful thou art offended and boasts thy self against me Charging me to be an Enemy to the truth and the liâ—â— in that I did not manifest thy deceit but now I shall therefore to stop thy proâ—… boasts in that answer thou calls it a sad doctrine which saith follow the Light which Christ hath enlightned every man withall and other such like things following that question which are deceitful and wicked and thou thereby art proved the Enemy to truth thy self and thou and thy words are both deceitful and therefore boast not thy self Then thou answers my Question which was doth not the Scripture witness that all who have not Christ are Reprobates the Question is sound and of worth to be noted and in thy answer thou sayst yet it is true to which I soberly Reply then what a condition are all in that hath 〈◊〉 Christ within nor no knowledge of him but what they have of him as he is without by the letter without do thou consider this and whether it be not of the chiefest prize to Life and Salvation to wait for him and seek for him within seeing all that have not him within are Reprobates But farther thou wouldst seem to manifest a great deal of folly in me when as the folly lies in thy own bosome and by thy confused words I understand thâ—… groundst thy Answer upon alye and false understanding and therefrom bringâ—… the false reproof as if I should hold forth that every man hath received Chriâ—… or the Spirit of Christ in him This I have never said but that every man hath the Light of Christ giâ—… him which I say is one in union with the Spirit of Christ and I say Christ 〈◊〉 given to all but all receives him not and I see thou understands not my forâ—… words that I write in answer to one of thy Queries thou canst not distingâ—… betwixt a thing being given of God and a thing being received by man so 〈◊〉 the folly is fallen back on thee take it who understands not my words 〈◊〉 opposes thy own conceivings and false understanding and though I might 〈◊〉 truly apply this word folly in that extent then thou applyed the like word 〈◊〉 thy self in this same page yet I leave it to the judgement of the serious Reader and say thy folly is want of wit in the World and not for Châ—… sake Then thou wouldst defend thy first wickedness in that thou saidst the Devil deceives Souls by perswading them to follow the Light within which all men have but my answer to it thou hast not reached in that I said 〈◊〉 that comes to Life eternal must follow the Light within which Christ haâ—… given which stands over thy head for ever to be truth but yet how bliâ—… art thou in confessing the Light within even Conscience to be the Light 〈◊〉 Christ as God and yet sayst the Devil deceives souls by bidding follow the Light within O abominable doctrine what doth the Devil deceive souls by bidding foâ—… the Light of Christ as God so Iohn Bunion's doctrine is let it be noted 〈◊〉 see thou thy folly how it is manifest and thy pittiful evasions are weighed 〈◊〉 stead of contradicting my former sufficient answer which thou could no 〈◊〉 reach to wrest or otherwise to answer it askes a question which I may ansâ— assoon as thou hast sufficiently replyed to my former answer and this is in 〈◊〉 an answer to it it is heresie to say that the Light of God or any Light of 〈◊〉 or Christ can or doth deceive the Soul and though thou stumble at it I said 〈◊〉 in saying that thy whole purpose is a secret smiting against the Light within 〈◊〉 the Reader judge And now to manifest thy ignorance fully thou hast confessed the Light witâ—… even Conscience is the Light of God hast not thou cause to repent of 〈◊〉 absurdities and blindness who holds forth that the Devil deceives Souls by the Light of God seeing thou canst find no Light within man but that which thou confessest is the Light of God Then thou sayes Thy whole design was first to shew Souls where Salvation is to be bad namely in Christ without and yet hath confessed all that hath him not within are Reprobates and such have not salvation by him without Consider therefore without Christ within no Salvation as I have said and thou hast confessed it Mark it then to clear thy self from contradiction which I charged thee with thou wouldst cast a confusion upon me in that thou says I would make a defiled Conscience the Law and Spirit of Christ to be all one This is falsly spoken I have never said nor thought that a defiled Conscience is the Law and Spirit of Christ a Lyer thou art to be noted and this Lye adds to the number and yet consider thou hast said several time that Consciences is the Light of Christ as God and now calls Conscience defiled Is the Light of God defiled Iohn Bunnion saith so O horrid read thou thy confusion and grievous Error which is brought to thy Door and there I leave it thou mayst Blush and all thy Witnesses at this and in that thou callst my Answer Scoulding against thy Epistle and persumptuously sayst The truth of which thou couldst be willing to seal with thy Blood Reply Scoulding I deny but I have reproved thy Lyes in the Authority of the Lord and be not so proudly pust up in boasting what sayst thou shall thy Blood go for this that the Quakers are Deceivers and that the Devil deceives Souls by bidding them follow the Light within which thou sayst is Conscience which thou confesses is the Light of God and that the Blood of Christ was shed before the World was and that the Scripture say so and that we deny that Salvation was compleatly wrought by the man Christ Jesus with several other things noted for Lyes what sayst thou Iohn Bunnion art thou so desparte as that thou wilt hazard thy Blood upon this account if it be so sure the Devil hath great power over thee cease thy boasting lest the Lord make thee an Example and though thou wouldst exhort me thy spirit I deny
prove the Light of Christ which thou confesseth every man hath to 〈◊〉 contrary to the Spirit of Christ I shall say every man hath that which is one 〈◊〉 union and like the Spirit of Christ even as good as the Spirit of Christ according to its measure these are my words Page 18. and I own them and thy answer to them is no contradiction nor just confutation of them but lyest 〈◊〉 saying I call Conscience and Nature it self the Spirit of Christ this is falsâ—… never spoken by me so that thou hast uttered a pack of railing words withâ—… any knowledge or fear of God instead of a sober Answer the blasphemy aâ—… great deal of ignorance and presumption appears not in my words they aâ—… truth and thou hast not proved that the Light of Christ is contrary to the Spirit of Christ Nay thy simple policy is too short when thou hadst done so then had been a time to have cast these opprobrious speeches at me like venome from a Viper but the weakness or strength of error and blasphemy and the great deal of ignorance and presumption c. is fallen at thy door and there I leaâ—… it clear thy self from it as thou art able who without any confutation of thâ—… words falls impudently to charge me thus highly and falsly from the words 〈◊〉 thou silent while the Reader judges Then thou goes about to defend thy first wickedness in that thou said the Devil doth deceive poor Souls by bidding them listen wiâ—… and turn the minde within and see if there be not that which doth convinceâ—… sin c. And my Answer to this is sound and stands over thee and unreproved by thâ—… though many words thou speakest yet from the Scripture doth not prove or 〈◊〉 honest Arguments that the Devil doth deceive any by bidding them to turâ—… the Light within which convinceth of sin if thou wouldst have cleared thy 〈◊〉 thou shouldst have proved thy assertion according to my desire I asked thâ—… was ever such a thing spoken that the Devil can deceive any by the Light 〈◊〉 Christ but to this not a word in proof but saith Every man hath not the Spirit 〈◊〉 Christ c. But further then I Query Doth the Devil deceive any by bidding theâ—… 〈◊〉 turn in and listen to that Light spoken of Iohn 1. 9. for that Light am I contending for and not any other contrary to it then thou sayst thou denyst beyond thy reach either to understand or contradict thou wants that Spirit which can examine of truth be it known unto thee and what are those unseemly expressions wilt thou slander always in secret without evidence and if these be they in that I said our innocency will appear when thy black vaile of Lyes is taken away and this is truth and is no way but seemly to be spoken to thee who art an Enemy of God then thou wouldst justifie thy former slander who said we wrest that Scripture Iohn 1. 9. And my answer is we take it without adding or diminishing which is true and no Lye nor wresting of it neither in thy Reply can I find that thou provest it though many words uttered little to the purpose with adding to thy former slanders in saying We would hold that that Light is the Spirit of Christ this is not spoken in all my Book but that it is one in union I say and not contrary to the Spirit of Christ but witnesseth of it and to it And thou further saith We say many things which thou knowest to be Blasphemy This is another Lye prove one Blasphemy And further thou sayst Christ as he is Mediator doth not enlighten every one that comes into the World c. Reply Well thy ignorance and wickedness vents it self forth apace let any man read that first Chapter of Iohn and see whether he doth not speak of Christ as Mediator he saith He was in the beginning with the Father and was made flesh and dwelt with the Disciples and his Life was the Light of men and the Light shined in Darkness and that was he which lighteth every man that comes into the World and he came to his own but they received him not but as many as received him to them he gave power to become the Sons of God c. What sayst thou Was not this spoken of Christ as Mediator Consider and be instructed rather then let thy Blood go for it however I leave thy Doctrine and Errors herein to be judged by them that are spiritual and for shame cease such Doctrine the more I rake among the filth the more vilely and odious it appears and for thy proof of this Doctrine thou bringst Mat. 11. 25. and sayst here the Father and the Son are speaking one to another but what doth this prove though it be so doth it any way follow that Iohn did not speak of Christ as Mediator Iohn 1. what vain productions thou bringst from thy impertinent proofs let them be weighed and taken notice of honestly and thou bidst me understand thus much That nature which is Conscience is the Light of God I understand thy blindness if this be so as thou sayst then mans nature is pure without sin as the Light of God is and this is error abominable contrary to the Scripture which saith All by nature are the Children of Wrath are all by the Light of God as thou sayst nature is Children of Wrath see thy Divinity and take it as it is truly interpreted I desire not to wrong thy words thou givest me to understand the greatest ignorance from those things that lately I have heard no not the like in England and it is very true as I said thy folly appears by thy much medling Then thou askst me What I will have the Light called wherewith every man in the World is lightned and because I do not call it the Spirit of Christ thou as it were murmurs because I have cut of thy occasion and thou canst not bend thy tongue with any seeming advantage against the Truth but in that I say the Light of Christ convinceth of sin which is true thou on a sudden produces thy bad consequences and askes if I call nature the Light of Christ and such like c. But they all do not prove the contrary so that which convinceth of sin is worth minding and taking notice of by all that ever are saved and as to that where I say that which may be known of God was manifest in them even in them that were given up to work unrighteousness c. I said the truth which thou are not able to contradict in equity though thou very ignorantly bendst thy answer as if I had said the Knowledge of God was made manifest in them when I say plainly in my Book that they 〈◊〉 turned from the Knowledge of God and yet that which might be kâ—… of him was manifest in them and this thou canst not deny And though 〈◊〉 words as layed down
confuted thine c. Do not boast but hear what I say thou sayst in that answer that Christ ascended to the right hand of the Father in your Nature Mark now thy Nature and your Nature who are one with thee is sinfull and wicked and of the Devil for so all Lyars are and it is Blasphemy to say sinfull wicked divillish Nature such as Iohn Bunions is and his Fellows is at the right hand of God in Heaven O horrible consider of this and see what thy begging an answer hath brought upon thee I deny though thou affirm it that thy and your Nature which is wicked or a man in that Nature is ascended into Heaven and therefore boast not thy self another time This nakedness of thine might have been covered but for thy own boasting and thou sayst Asts 1. proves it let the Reader search If he can find that Christ ascended in sinful wicked Nature such as theirs is who are one with Iohn Bunion and this is another Lye of the Scripture and though thou with much impudent confidence affirm the Quakers to be Deluders c. I say from that we rather love dispraise then praise and are as our fore-Fathers were counted Deceivers and yet are true and thou art deceived in thy own heart in that thou understandst my words that I should say as though there were no false Prophets now because I said they were in the Apostles dayes which is true and yet are they now too even it s witnessed by thee and thy Fellows who are in their steps who through coveteousness making merchandize of Souls and your people are ever learning and not able to come to the knowledge of the truth and goes for gifts and rewards and are false Accusers and such like Nay but understand me better for I say thou art a false Prophet and thou art now though thy root sprang forth in the time of the Apostles of which thou are a Beanch and thy Fellows And though I said that Antichrist was in the dayes of Iohn and this was before a Quakers was heard of my words I own pâ—…rs that that the Christians were called Quakers at that day if thou canst 〈◊〉 I allow not thee to be my Interperter except I found thee more honest 〈◊〉 doth condemn thy meaning upon my words and though thou sayst instead of moving our selves no false Prophets we prove our selves no Christians because I said that word Quaker was not heard of in those dayes Now consider are they no Christians now whose title or name without was not gives or heard of in the Apostles dayes then Protestants are no Christians nor Independants are no Christians nor Anabaptists are no Christians because they were not called so in the Apostles dayes and whilest thou hast thought to prove us no Christians hast cast out thy self also then thou art no better then we and what poor Arguments and vain consequence these are 〈◊〉 the wise consider I did not say there were no Quakers then but not a Quakers heard of viz. by that name for there were thousands of Quakers who trembled and quaked at the Word of the Lord Moses and David Iereâ—… Isaack Paul with many more Quakers and Tremblers though not then 〈◊〉 called but as I said such as thou hast such thou bringst and thy Master will accept thee Then thou sayst I fling durt in thy face because I said if we should diligently search thee we should find thee in their steps through feigned words through coveteousness making merchandize of Souls loving the wages of unrighteousness And further I said among them thou art found who art preaching 〈◊〉 hire and loves the error of Balaam who went after Gifts and Rewards oâ— Now thou seemest to be grieved and calls this a false Accusation But le ts try the cause admits dispute Art not thou in their steps and among them that do 〈◊〉 things ask Iohn Burion with whom thou art joyned close to vindicate 〈◊〉 and call him Brother hath he not so much yearly 150. l. or more except tâ—… hast some of it which is unrighteous Wages and Hire and Gifts and Rewards What sayst thou Art thou not in his steps and among and with him and then that do these things if he be thy Brother and thou so own him what is 〈◊〉 in him whom thou vindicates I lay upon thee but tell me who have 〈◊〉 thee deny him and the rest of the Independants in these things which 〈◊〉 knowst he doth act and in thy answer I cannot find thee fully clearing thy 〈◊〉 by denyal but sayst That spirit that lead me out of this Way is a lying spirit 〈◊〉 or what Way I say out of the way of preaching for Hire dost thou mean â—y it s a lying spirit in thee that goes in their steps and among them that goes in 〈◊〉 way and though thou bid me have a care of receiving by hear say what I bâ—… said and received in this is truth though thou evade it never so much As to that of some bidding thee throw away the Scriptures c Indeed upon such terms it might be spoken so as to be owned a Lyar and a Slandereâ— is an unfit Fellow to meddle with the Scriptures or to take the Name of the Lord or of the man Christ Jesus in his mouth and I may say truly what hast 〈◊〉 unrighteous person to do to take his Name and truth in thy mouth hateâ—… to be reformed And in that I say of thy crying against Christ within this is true who said there was nothing in thee nor any man without exception to be taken not in of as we may prove by witness though thou deny it then was not Chrâ—… within and what less is this then to cry against him when as thou deayd him within or else concludes he is not worth taking notice of And thoâ—… thou say I falsely speak of thee in saying thou callst the Doctrine of Christ waâ— in false opinions and take in hand to discover it but the falseness is in the who hath uttered that which is untruth and contrary to the Gospel and 〈◊〉 denyes it or would hide thy wickedness for thou having framed an objectiâ—… and speaks of some that are for a Christ within c. and then thou sayst the wilt discover the falsity of such opinions Now thou dost here reckon the Doctrine of Christ within a false opinion or among them at lest let the Reaâ—… judge and be thou silent for shame but all thou sayst clears thee not froâ— what I said of thee God shall judge thee thou lying tongue and deceâ—… heart Then thou chargest me with folly and to eat my first words and to be 〈◊〉 ble in judgement and to fight against the Truth c. From my question aâ—…e doth not the Scripture say Christ is within except you be Reprobates aâ—… not this thus much all are Reprobates but they in whom Christ is within a yet because I said the measure or manifestation of the
Spirit is given to eveâ—… man this thou hast catched at and wouldst prove it unsound but truth is oâ—… thee and both these are true and further I say that Christ is given unto 〈◊〉 World yea to all but all receives him not and they that do not receive him 〈◊〉 Reprobates though he be given but not received and the folly and figâ—… against truth is in thy self who says it is contrary to the Scriptures to say 〈◊〉 Spirit is given to every one thou here lyest of the Scripture as it s proved 〈◊〉 I do not befool my self in saying the words or some of them I own in 〈◊〉 Book though I have written against the Book for though thou speak Châ—… words and the Apostles words yet thy voice is the strangers and thy 〈◊〉 I deny what ever words thou speakst and is not bafooling my self and 〈◊〉 I could justly end my discourse and what is said is sufficient to manifest thee and me to the honest Reader And thus far thy weapons of Slanders are broken and thy refuge of Lyes are layd waste and this also is cast by as our spoyled prey of Babylâ—â—s treasure and trampled upon and know that we are of God and be that is of God heareth us and to our God shall all bow and before him tremble And whereas thou seemest to be greatly offended and stumbling very much at my answers to thy Queries because thy carnall conceptions is not satisfied nor thy vain minde gratified having as thou thinkst great occasion against me thereby which causes thy mouth to be opened in vapouring words aloft against the simplicity of the Gospel not understanding my words for the things of the Kingdom of God is a parable to thee and sealed from thee never to be known in the reason in which thou judgest But in short thus I Reply I did not purpose to answer fully to them to feed any mans wisdom with my knowledge of the things of Gods Kingdom for the Queries were not fully directed to the Quakers so that quench thy anger and according to my answer go seek a further answer or else be thou still unsatisfied from them who are led with a spirit of delusion for such a direction requires no full answer from me nor any of us who are in the truth and not in the delusion neither did I purpose nor do I at any time to answer fully to such things as are directed in a great part to others I am not a servant especially to them that are led with a spirit of delusion to fufil thy will But yet the short answers that I gave which was not in the behalf of delusion but for the truths sake I still own though thou cannot understand them but products many bad lying wicked consequences from them and my purpose was not to feed thy foolish wisdom in answering nor to satisfie thy reason to receive praise from thee or any man for so I know it must be in hearing and seeing thou must not perceive nor understand who art of the Generation hardened and in parable is the Kingdom of Heaven unto thee and I rejoyce the rather in being a stumbling to thee in that state wherein thou standed then that I should have gratified thee for I seek not nor receives honour from man in what I do but is covered from the Worlds knowledge and know this if thou cannot receive the Kingdom of Heaven as a little leaven thou shalt never know it But yet how wicked art thou in this also though not understanding me in what I said yet so fouly wronging me with above 30. false charges and slanders from my words which thou reaches not the knowledge of so it will be enough Reply to sum up thy Lyes and send them back to thee to seek them out and an evidence for them and the Querys and my Answers shall stand as they are to be judged of by honest men while we are both silent in our own cause they are to be seen at large in my first Book The true faith of the Gospel contended for c. in the 26 27 28 pages And whereas further I speak at the end of my Answers of Christ within the hope of glory and said it is that mystery which long hath been hid from Ages but now is made manifest and declared and though the wise of this World cannot receive it but speaks evil against it yet it is dear unto us and so much more precious because despised by such as him and such things are a testimony to us and against you viz. our Enemies c. As in my 29. Page of my first may be sâ—en and most wickedly this or part of it he calls babling and says he passes by it O horrible impudency What marvel that he should so belye me when as he hath called the very Scripture truth spoken forth in righteousness bablings and these things I leave the Reader to Judge of and all his Lyes thrown upon 〈◊〉 â—â—pudently and consider what ground this man hath from my answers to be seen in my first Book to broach out and belch out such a number of Lyes and Slanders in five sides of paper not any one of them charged against me falsly were spoken by me or ever in my thoughts to speak or ground given by any of my words for such productions as it is seen what lodges in the heart of such a Fellow even desperate wickedness who is without any 〈◊〉 or honesty who dare utter such things against the upright who hates not his Enemies but while I am clear in the sight of God from all his false Slanders I matter not what Iohn Bunion says of me who is as a man given up to wickedness who in less then a sheet of paper hath uttered thirty Lyes or more which I may particularly manifest before he can find evidence a great wickedness 〈◊〉 this mans Converts be good while himself is unconverted is he a Minister of Christ for shame let it not be told so well I beg not vengeance against him he leaves my answers to be read who will clear me from his lying consequences 〈◊〉 wickedly conceived and as wickedly uttered By one of Gogs Army against a Member of Jesus Now I come to reckon up his damnable Doctrines and errors which are contrary to the truth as will manifestly appear to him that is spiritual some of thâ—â— damnable without comparison Iohn Bunion said That Christs second coming is not his coming in Spirit for 〈◊〉 coming in Spirit is no coming He saith this or part of it is a lye made of hiâ— by me when as several Witnesses doth testifie in righteousness that those very words were spoken by him in Pauls steeple-house in Bedford Town Mâ— 23. 1656. as is witnessed and yet this man is so impudent that he deâ—â—â— what he spake or is ashamed of his words and so would cast the Lye upâ—â— me who is clear and the wickedness lies at his door and whereas he
the Holy Ghost Ans. His words are utterly false yet we say we have received the Holy Ghost which teacheth us and leadeth us into all truth and by it are we lead out of all Wickedness and Delusion and all wicked speeches which he brands us withall and these things are his own for he is seen to be in delusion and odious wickedness and wicked speeches And saith he They speak against the DOCTRINE of the SPIRIT and cryes down the love of the Saints and against the Ordinances of the Ministers of Christ. To this I have answered In the love and union with all the Saints we are and Ministers of Christ but against Hypocrisie we declare such who profess what they are not and use their tougues and saith the Lord saith when the Lord hath not spoken to them and sprinkle Infants and saith it is an Ordinance of Christ and singing Davids experiences in Rime and Meeter with many other things which the Priests hath in their practice such things we deny to be Ordinances of Christ and them to be Ministers of Christ which do practice them and this we do say by the Spirit of Truth But that we pronounce damnation against Gods Church and holy Servants this is false again and is but the fulfilling the number of his lyes and though he charge us secretly with preaching another Gospel then that which Paul preached is false and if we duely examine it will be he that will be found preaching another Gospel whose practice is found in many things contrary to them who were Ministers of the true Gospel and so the curse pronounced by the Apostle will fall upon him and not upon us in the day of Judgement 21. His one and twentieth Reason Saith he The Quakers themselves renounce 〈◊〉 words the Ranters and Papists as a deluded sort Answer To which I answer and say Yea not only in words but in lives lives also we utterly abhor the Ranters and Papists both in profession and practice and do know that Rich. Baxter is of the same spirit though differing in words But saith he The Ranters and Drunkards cryes out against the same Ministers same exercise and godly people as the Quakers do To which I answer What the Ranters and Drunkards may do in their wickedness and unclean spirits is one thing and what we do in the fear of God and tender love to peoples Souls is another thing but how uncharitable is this man in his judgment Let us try him as if I should say The Ranters and Drunkards and Prophane and all ungodly People they are our Enemies and do oppose and gainsay the Way of God and the people called Quakers and they Beat them and Reproach them and Slander them and doth much cruelty unto them and thus doth Richard Baxter of Kidderminster he reviles them and reproaches them and belyes them and therefore he is one with the Ranters and Drunkards and prophane people and he holds part of the Papists Ranters and Drunkards doctrine and practice And thus he is judged with his own Rule according as 〈◊〉 hath judged us by the same Rule and now say I as well as he of us Let any man judge that hath not forsworn all wit and reasons whether it is likely the Holy Ghost will inspire Richard Baxter and a company of Priests of Englâ—… to acquaint them with the same Points Doctrines and Practices which the Papists Ranters Drunkards and all prophane people exercise themselves in for as all they are Enemies to the Quakers so is he and his company Aâ—… farther I ask him Whether the same things be heavenly in Rich. Baâ—… and his company which be hellish in the Ranters and Drunkards And whether Richard Baxter hath not condemned himself and the Priests of England in condemning the Papists and Ranters and Drunkards and prophane people in acting the very same things to wit speaking against reproaching reviling and slandering and backbiting an innocent people of God called Quakers 22. His two and twentieth Reason And saith he If I have any Reason to 〈◊〉 weary of the Christian Catholick Reformed Religion what reason have I to turn Quaâ—… more then to any other Sect Why saith he how do they prove they are more in the riâ—… then any other c. Ans. To all this I answer this is according to his knowledge who sees 〈◊〉 difference between good and evil between such as serveth God and such as serves him not and how can this man be a Teacher of others that is so blind himself The true Christian Religion he is out of and in a Sect whose fruiâ—… are as bad as the Papists or Familists or any others for I believe not the worâ—â— of Sects could have brought forth more lyes and slanders and scoffing worâ—â— in one sheet of paper then he hath done in this which now I deal withal And as for our proof that we are in the right way to every man that hath an eye to see and an ear to hear and an heart to conceive it 's easie to be proved and such are satisfied but as for Unbelievers and Persecutors such as himself they must hear and see and not perceive and understand 23. His three and twentieth Reason Saith he The way by which they prâ—… is not producing any evidence for they renounce that and offers all from the Autâ—… of the spirit within them c. Ans. The way by which we prevail is by the the Spirit of the Lord which 〈◊〉 within us and that was the way whereby all the Ministers of Christ evâ—… prevailed by the authority of that But yet this is false we do not deny 〈◊〉 produce Evidence but is sufficiently able and hath done it to produce Eviâ—… out of the Scriptures to prove all things which we profess or practice for Religion But saith he They must prove their Commission by Divine miracles before 〈◊〉 reasonable man can believe it c. many that fear God and are in the 〈◊〉 Reason hath Believed us already and do see the Mighty Wonders of Goâ—… brought to passe and it cannot be believed by Richard Baxter no more 〈◊〉 Christ was believed of the Pharisees in whom the mighty Power of God 〈◊〉 made manifest for though he did miracles yet this Generation could not believe them And he tells of some that said he was 〈◊〉 so might they well do and not lye his blindness is made manifest at largâ—… And saith he But can I see the Witness in them that saith they have the Witness in themselves Nay because thou art an Unbeliever thou canst not but it thou wert a Believer in Christ thou wouldst feel the same Testimony in the Brethren but by thee we are not known and therefore by thee are falsly Judged for no other Testimony do we give or hold forth but the same which the Apostles did which we have received from Christ as the Apostles did and not by any authority of our own though he falsly says it but by the Authority
them and with a good Conscience they cannot swear but do deny it upon all Conditions because Christ hath commanded not to swear at all and the Apostle doth exhort above all things not to swear and therefore it is a matter of conscience unto many and not a matter of purposed wrong towards any man and though here it may be objected But for want of an Oath a just man may loose his just Cause because Judgment depends upon witness by oath to that I answer that is because the Law is not according to Christ by which the Judgment comes but is unjustly grounded upon the breach of Christs Command viz. swearing and whether ought the man to be blamed or condemned as a Transgressor who keeps Christ's Command and cannot swear at all upon any Tearms or whether that Law ought not to be corrected and regulated to be according to the Law of Christ and all that which is contrary in the execution thereof to be condemned and removed that a just man's witness may be given and taken upon occasion without an Oath and his just cause may go on against his Enemies by just judgment grounded upon the naked truth in plainness testified without swearing this is to be considered and though it be again obiected but many say some makes more Conscience and are more afraid to testify falsly upon Oath then upon bare words without an Oath so to have the truth known wholly that is the end of the Oath to this I answer a man that truly and uprightly fears God will be as much afraid and make as much Conscience of speaking falsly as of swearing falsly and out of a good Conscience will testifie as truly as if he swore and for others who fears to swear falsly and doth not so much fear to speak falsly without Oath this is because there is a greater punishment to such and it is accounted a greater offence among men to swear falsly then to speak falsly and for the correcting of that the punishment and offence should be changed and such as testify falsly without Oath may be accounted Offenders and punished as such who swears falsly and this will bind the wicked in a sufficient fear and cause them to be afraid of testifying falsly even as much as of swearing falsly if the testimony in causes among men of such evil persons who cannot make Conscience of lying nor speak the truth without swearing it ought the rather to be had and to be done by binding by a Law and punishing if he testifie a Lye then by causing him to continue in the breach of Christs command but however still I say such who out of a good and tender Conscience do deny to swear ought not to be persecuted and punished as great Offenders for while this is done the Law and good Government is perverted and authority is greatly abused to another end then wherefore it was ordained of God and that Law and authority must needs be unjust which oppresseth or punisheth the excercise of a good Conscience as for evill doing and this shews the blindness and ignorance of men in authority to whom the Law is committed who discerns not neither makes a difference betwixt things done in the Fear of God and in the excercise of a good Conscience towards him and things done out of an evil minde to evil inteâ—ts purposely and wilfully to do wrong and injury to mens persons and estates for all Magistrates ought to learn this and to distinguish that their power and authority may justifie the one and condemn the other that true justice and sound judgement may spring forth in the Earth and in the Nations that all the Upright and Well-doers may rejoyce and live in rest and peace and all the Workers of Iniquity and such as do Evil may be afraid and fear to offend just men and just Laws and thus would the Name of the Lord be great in the Earth among men and such a Government renowned for ever and such Magistrates would be a praise to Generations after them and a blessed example to Ages to come But now some may say and object how shall this be known and who can tell and discern of such Causes and who it is that do their Works out of the exercise of a good Conscience and who do their Deeds out of an evil Minde and to an evil intent and so is wrong dealing and worthy of punishment this is a doubtful Cause may some say and difficult to be known and understood But to this I answer and say To all such as have the Spirit of the Father and are led thereby and in their Judgement guided therewith this is an easie thing to discern and an easie matter to know and find out and such as cannot discern and distingush in such Matters have not the Spirit of God nor the spirit of true and sound Judgment neither is indeed ordained of God nor fit to judge the People nor the honour of a Ruler and Judge belongs not to such a one who cannot find out a matter nor know and judge between the precious and the vile how to justifie the one and how to condemn the other and indeed this is the reason and cause of so much Injustice and Oppression brought forth at this day because the spirit of sound Judgment is wanting and such as are set to judge hath it not to try and discern and give Judgment by it and therefore Light is put for Darkness and Darkness for Light and good is called Evil and Evil Good and true Justice and Judgment is perverted and turned backward and the guiltless is condemned guilty But I say if the work be done by a man out of a good Conscience and as a matter of Conscience then he doth it in the Fear of God and in the cross to his own will and in meekness and tenderness of heart not seeking himself in what he doth but is willing to suffer for the Truth sake and for what he doth and will not resist Evil or the false Judgments of men but patiently and quietly bears all things for the Lords sake and in all what he doth or suffers he gives the glory to the Lord who works his works in him and gives him strength and patience willing to suffer for them But again I do answer by men that have the spirit of sound Judgment to rule and guide them this cause is easie to be discerned and the difference may be known betwixt a thing done out of a good Conscience and for a good Conscience sake and a thing done out of an evil mind and purpose and to an evil end to the wrong and injury of another for the ground from whence the works do proceed are contrary and the spirit by which the works are wrought are contrary and the purpose and end to which they are wrought are contrary and the spirit of God and of sound Judgment may and doth put a difference betwixt the ground acting and end of
any honest man that is Spiritual who hath an Understanding to judge hereof Now I suppose themselves none of them are so ignorant as they will say The Scriptures are that WORD which was in the Beginning and which shall Endure forever But say they the Scriptures are another Word a Declarative Word or such like termes Now when we dispute or contend with any about the Word of God we dispute what that Word is which the Scripture saith is the Word and do deny that Word to be the Scriptures Writings though still we do own the Scriptures a Declaration of that very WORD of GOD and that the Scriptures in any place do call themselves the Word or signifie so much I do deny it and it is left for any of our Opposers to prove it that can if they do I will confess it to be the Word and revoke all that I have spoken to the contrary And as for thy Deductions and Consequences drawn from my words I do deny them for they are not to me but will turn upon thy self for thou sayest A strange kind of Assertion as if nothing of the Mind Will and Counsel of God were declared in the Scripture And whitherto can be the tendency of such giddy Doctrines then to a weakening of the Authority of the Scriptures and begetting Slightings and undervaluing Thoughts and that the effects may be lightly esteeming the Scriptures These and such Deductions hast thou drawn through thy Ignorance from my words from all which I am clear as having no Intent to any such things nor any Intent but to testifie to the Pure Innocent TRUTH And thy Deductions are far more ignorant and impudent then my Assertion is strange and let thy Consequences be what they will from my words the truth of my words will justifie me in the Sight of God and his Saints for I do honour the Scriptures above other Writings and give them the Authority and Esteem and Respect due unto them and more I dare not And some of thy pages I pass over as not worth taking notice of only I do say Thou hast wronged me in not relating so much as was spoken by us by far and in relating more then was spoken by thee or thy Party And the next thing I note is this where R. G. said he would and went about to prove That the Letter is the Word of God but was not nor is ever able to prove and thou hast changed the words of his Argument in thy Relation from what they were as he laid them down in the Dispute from called to owned for thus his words were laid down at that time said he That which Christ and the Apostles called the Word of God is indeed the Word of God but Christ and the Apostles called the Scriptures the Word of God Ergo. Now I denied and do yet that it can be proved That ever Christ and the Apostles called the Scriptures the WORD of GOD and neither do thy Proofs now nor his then of the minor Proposition prove That the Scriptures viz. the Writing were ever called the Word although it be true that the Pharisees made the Word of God of no Authority by their Traditions But that Scripture doth not say That the Letter is the Word which thing he was to prove or else he said nothing to the purpose And as to the other Scripture 1 Thes. 1. 13. that will not prove that the Apostle called the Letter the Word for it was the Gospel which they received as the Word of God and not the Letter The Gospel is the Word of God not denied by me but sealed unto but the Gospel is not the Letter and Writings but the Gospel is the Thing written of and that is it which the Apostle means to be the Word of God for that is the Word which he preached to the Thessalonians and which they received And so thy Arguments and Proof of thy minor Position is deny'd and so the major Position falls to the Ground And by this nor any other Argument can all you Priests of England prove the Letter of the Scriptures to be the Word of God which thing R. G. took in hand to prove but could not and would have cry'd against it in me as a great deal of Heresie for denying it but Error is fallen upon his own Head The next thing I note is in pag. 13. where thou wouldst seem to cover over R. G. thou sayest his words were not That I had the thing signified in my hand when I had the Bible but that I had that which declares of it Now to justifie him in Evil thou hast wronged me and the Truth for he did say when I held up my Bible I had in my hand the thing herein signified upon this very Occasion I holding up my Bible in my hand and saying to this very effect That in my hand I had the thing which did signifie in words of such and such things but I had not the thing signified And Richard Goodgrom made answer and said But I had the Thing signified and this some can witness Whereupon I made answer and said If it be so that I have the Thing signified in my hand then I have God and Christ and the Spirit and Heaven and Hell and Men and Beasts and all things that herein are written of and then he saw the Folly of his own Ignorance I perceive And much more might be related as upon this Subject which was said on both Parties which I desire not much to recollect only what I have said I can certainly remember and can justifie it And I must confess that Philip Taverner hath done pretty fairly though in some things he hath not done so And no was to the next thing charged against me in the Relation being placed the second though it is the third That evil Motions not consented to were not sin In the first private Meeting I remember my words were laid down thus and so I own'd them in the Dispute That Temptations or Motions unto evil are not sin to any man who doth not consent and obey to serve Temptations or evil Motions and they are not sin to the man except they be consented to by the man and this was proved in the Example of Christ who was tempted of the Devil and had motions to do evil yet did not consent nor commit sin for he resisted and overcame the Tempter and so the Devil's Motions and Temptations which were sin in themselves yet they were not sin to Him And this Proof then they could not deny neither can any sober or upright Man And so in the Dispute the thing was put to a farther Question thus But are not those Motions which arise out of a Man 's own Heart Sin except they be consented to To which I was willing to speak something and to own the very TRUTH and to justifie that there is a State wherein Evil Motions may rise out of a Man 's own Heart which are
and Worships be tryed and 〈◊〉 Church â—… Doctrines and Worshipâ— and Practices and whether they be 〈…〉 or ours that do overcome or are overcome let that deside the â—…ersie and whether it be you or we that are soonest overcome 〈…〉 prevail the one against the other in this Tryal and in these Proâ—… 〈◊〉 that which is Overcome and Prevailed against is not the True â—… against which nothing can prevail no not the Gates of Hell 〈…〉 your Church or ours cannot be prevail'd against by the other 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 be the true Church for that which is prevail'd against is not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Church and whether it be you or we that are elected and of the 〈…〉 which cannot be deceived if we â—e not elected and you Deceivers 〈…〉 possible you may deceive us but if we prove that we be in the 〈…〉 then you cannot deceive us and if we â—e in the Truth and of 〈…〉 Church then it will be Happiness for you to be converted and â—…rned â—… 〈◊〉 to the Tryal as sooâ—… as you will and if you be in the Election 〈◊〉 need not be afraid to be deceived by any for the the Elect cannot â—…ved whoever that be whether your Church or our Church be the 〈◊〉 Church and in the Election And if your Ministers among us do preach the same things and by the 〈…〉 Spirit and hold forth the very same Faith Principles Worship and â—…ces which we do and are of and it be proved they are of the same 〈…〉 and Principles we are of agreeing in all things then we will own 〈◊〉 to be Christ's Ministers And if our Ministers among you do hold â—…th that true Faith and Principle and Practices and Worship and by the 〈◊〉 Spirit as Christ and his Apostles did and prove what they say by the Scripâ—… then shall you receive them as the Ministers of Christ and renounce all 〈◊〉 you hold and profess contrary to what they hold and preach among 〈◊〉 And hereby things may come to a fair Tryals and the naked Truth may 〈◊〉 made manifest whether your Church or our Church be the true Church 〈◊〉 Christ truly descended from the Church of the Saints of old and â—…er your Ministers or our Ministers be the lawful Successors of the â—…es And we would willingly come to deal with you upon these termâ—s that it may be manifest who they be that are of the true Seed and who they be that are of the Election that cannot be deceived And we have many things more to write unto you and to query of you and to demand when we receive your answer and if you give us ground to accuse you we will thresh you and lay it to your charge by the Authority and Spirit of the Lord and if you answer us plainly we shall more perfectly know what to do To the POPE THou Mountain hear the Word of the Lord God thus saith thâ—… God unto thee I will lay thee low I will break thee down I wiâ—… the glory of all Flesh my Sword shall enter into the Hearts of my Eâ—… will slay the Wicked and I will cruâ—… the Head of the Ungodly and 〈…〉 grind the hard hearts unto pieces I will come in a day unexpected I 〈…〉 Door behold me and I will take Vengeance without Pitty upon all 〈…〉 mies my Hand shall not spare my Eye shall noâ— pitty but I will 〈…〉 rend and give unto thee and unto all Mankind the fruit of your 〈…〉 ings Innocent Blood cries unto me that hath been unjustly shed 〈…〉 Righteous Soul groans under the Altar unto me and now I am risen 〈…〉 begun to work in the Earth and I will go through Nations and 〈…〉 down under my Power I have raised a Seed which shall thrâ—sh the Moâ—… and my Word is gonâ—forth out of my Mouth which shall beat them to 〈…〉 and my Power shall knock at thy Gates and break down thy strength 〈…〉 shall prevail against thee Oh thou Mountain I whose Seat is high and whose Power is gâ—… who hath been able to make War with thee Thou hast swallowed up 〈…〉 and Needy and thou hast eaten up the Innocent as the Ox eateth up 〈…〉 thou hast continued for Ages and thou accountest thy self the most Aâ—… and thou hast been without fear of any man and thou hast not regâ—… Honour of my Name but exalted thy self altogether But now saith 〈…〉 the Dread of the Almighty shall come upon thee and the Majesty of 〈…〉 of Hosts shall appear terrible unto thee and thou shalt know there 〈…〉 that can do whatsoever he will and he will wound the mighty Men 〈…〉 shall heal them and he will vex all his Enemies in his Displeasure and 〈…〉 break them and none shall bind them up Thy glory and thâ— glory 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 whole Earth is as Grass before the Mower and as the Flower of the Field that 〈◊〉 soon withered and thy treasure and the treasure of all Nations is of no respect unto him the Strength of the whole Earth is Weakness before him and the Crowns of Princes he accounteth as the Dust he treadeth over it all and his Everlasting Arm reacheth beyond it all and he is awakened that will strike through Kingdoms and that will stain the glory of the whole Earth and thoâ— must know his Power and the Cup of his Wrath is full of which all Nations shall drink and none shall escape it Prepare thy self for the Anger of the Lord is gone forth and the Almighty is grieved because of the Abominations of the Earth and he will cast into the Fire and purge and purifie and new mold and correct Rulers Kings and Peoples for he hath long been grieved and born the Iniquity of the Nations but his Long-suffering is well-nigh finished for the Nations have provoked him to Anger and turned his Long-suffering into Fury and he hath put on the Garment of Vengeance and the time is at hand that Sorrow shall take hold on the Stout-hearted when he appears who hath been pierced and Anguish and Pain shall come upon thee and the World and the Day of Trouble and great Distress ye shall not escape the Rod of his Wrath shall smite you The Mouth of the Lord hath spoken it And although thou art exalted as a God yet thou shalt be a Man and not a God in his Hand that shall slay thee and although thy Seat has been high yet it shall be laid low as the Ground and thy Honour shall be laid in the Dust for thou art Dust and Ashes before the Lord and thou shalt be no more admired when Destruction shall come upon thee The Lord hath viewed thy Way and Path and they have not been upright before him he hath entred into the Secrets of thine Heart and thy intent hath not been hid from him and that which hath been done in secret shall now be laid open and all secret things shall now be brought to Light and all the Churches shall know that he searches the
strange and horrid Opinions which they have audaciously invented c. Answ. It is no strange thing that Truth be called Heresie and Error and that it be branded with a Name of strange and horrid Opinions and such like but we do acknowledge that in that Way which is called Heresie do we worship the True and Living God and wo will be unto them that put Light for Darkness and Darkness for Light But when these particular Things and their Answers are truâ—ly read and weighed then let spiritual Men judge for this Author must not be Judge in his own Cause whose judgement is corrupted and his wayes Abomination And it hath been the Work of that Generation of those called Ministers I mean for these seven years to cry out to the Magistrates and to send one Paper after another of this nature to them but what hath it advantaged them for hath not the Lord turned their Wisdom backward and even the Way which they have thought to destroy the Heritage of the Lord the Lord hereby hath made his Heritage more glorious and so theâ— have striven against the Lord and altogether in vain and their doings shall they eat the fruit of and receive the reward of their own Work And whereas the Author further saith Such as have saving work in their Souls and that kâ—â—w God and Christ c. cannot but bless God for keeping them from the great Blackâ—â—ss and Darkness that hath invaded the Souls of these deluded Wretches Answ. They that know the saving Work in their souls and that know God and Christ in Truth and Righteousness and that call upon him with an upright Heart we are all one with them and they with us And they alone that walk in the Light that Christ hath enlightned them withall are kept from the Darkness that doth invade the Deluded and as for thy envious reflection 〈◊〉 yâ—â—r deluded Wretches and such like these words are to thy self for they have no entrance into our Dwellings the Lord hath saved us by his right Hand and we bear them as his Reproaches for Righteousness sake And whereas thou sayest It is very sad that after so much preaching of the Gospel so many should take those things for new Lights which are but antiquated Errors c. Answ. It is very sad indeed that the Ministers of this Nation should have so fair a Profession upon them and should put the Nation to so much charge by giving them Tythâ—s and Stipends and Money and have spoiled peoples Goods and cast their Bodies into Prisons even of many hundreds that would not pay them And yet the Nation should be left in Darkness and like an untilled Wilderness notwithstanding all the Profession of preaching the Gospel for the Nation hath been like an untilled Field and like People like Priâ—â—â— like Shepherd like Sheep as it is especially amongst them where Shepheâ—â—s and the Sheep are risen in Rebellion against the Nation and have joyned with 〈◊〉 old Caveliers But this shews that your preaching hath been for Enâ—â— to your selves and for Money and that you have been Ministers of the Letter and not of the Spirit nor of the Power of God for had you been in the Life and Preachers of the true Gospel the Nations had been as a Garden at this day and not like an unploughed Field as we see they are people abounding in Ungodliness and in all Pride and Vanity which is a shame to Christianity Now People and Ministers have made a shew of the Gospel but have been without the Power in the Form of godliness and have had the Form but resisted the Power And indeed the Ignorance of the People will lie upon their Ministers who have been crying Peace to them that have walked after the Imaginations of their own Hearts and have not turned the Wicked from his wicked Way and the Scriptures are fulfilled upon them They have run but God hath not sent them therefore the People have not at all been profited by them But the Light of the Glorious Gospel is risen in mens Hearts aâ—d your Folly and Vanity is discovered and that makes you rage and swell as a foaming Sea now when your shame is seen you are casting out Slanders and Reproaches thinking thereby to seduâ—e the Minds of people thinking alwayes to keep the Magistrates on your side and to ride upon them and that they will establish you in Freedom and destroy them that are against you but the Lord is opening their Eyes to behold your Deceit and Madness and you will be left unto your selves and fall into the Pit that you have digged for others And whereas this Author doth further compare this poor People which he in scorn calls Quakers with several pestilent Hereticks as he calls them that have disturbed the Church and saith he They agree with the Adamites and Pharisees and Sadduces and with the Mannâ—chies with the Jews Turks Servebus and with the Soscinians and many more which he names and saith we agree with them and 〈◊〉 is to render us odious and as abominable as he câ—â— to mâ—n in Authority To all which I do answer What we do profess and practise for Religion we have not been learnt by Man nor been taught it by Men not our Gospel noâ— Religion but we have received it from the Lord and of him are we taught and by the Spirit led into all Truth and though thou hast done as the Pharisees did they reckoned Christ with Transgressors and crucified him betwixt two Thieves so though thou hast compared us with such and such whom thou callest Hereticks and it is possible many of them might be so And so thou hast shewed the spirit of the Pharisees and of the Murderers that denyed Christ and we are known unto the Lord what we are though not unto mortal Mans wisdom that perisheth And to whom shall we more truly compare the Ministers of England Are they not like those which Isaiah cryed against That sought for their Gain from their Quarter that were Greedy Dumb Doggs and like them that Ieremiah cryed against that said Thus saith the Lord when the Lord had never spoken to them nor sent them and are not you all like them that Micah cryed against chap. 3. That preached for Hire and divined for Money and that prepared War against those that would not put into their Mouthes as you do at this day and are not you like them that Ezekiel cryed against that made a Prey upon the Flock and made Merchandize of Souls and fed themselves with the Fat and did not feed the Flock but ruled over them with Force and Cruelty and are not you like those that Christ cryed wo against That were called of men Master that went in long Robes and loved Greeting in the Markets and uppermost Râ—oms at Feasts for you act those things that Christ cryed Wo against the Pharisees who did the same things and are not you like them that Paul spoke of That were
was come to search them and try them and would hew down their Idolatrous wayes and worships and works c. And in order to a fair proceeding with them the next day I was moved to write this following Paper to them by way of Queries as to lay some ground of Opposition hoping to have received their Answer that I might have joyned tryal with them for it was in my heart to search and oppose their Wayes and Practices and their whole Religion And these Queries were delivered to them in Latine though from them I have received no Answer to this day but the Queries stand upon them and my Charge they lie under charged upon them in the Name of the Lord. To all ye that profess your selves Devoted to the Service of God and Separation from the World and Mortification in your lives who are called by the the name of Fryars and Nunns in and about Dunkirk THe Mighty Day of the Lord God is come and coming upon you and all the World Awake awake ye that sleep in the Earth for the Dreadful God is arising to plead with you and to give unto all the World the Cup of his fierce Indignation because of your Idolatries and Hypocrisies and Abominations which have corrupted the Earth and are come up before him and have provoked him and the Cry of the Just who hath been smitten and laid slain is entred into the Ears of the Most High and his Sword which is the word of his Mouth is awakened to wound and slay all his Enemies And the Day of your Visitation is now come wherein the Lord is searching you and trying you that he may recompence you and this is the Word of the Lord to you Wherefore I am moved of the Lord to propound some few Queries to you for the tryal of your spirits and wayes to which I demand your Answer that all things may be brought to Light and true Judgement and that you may be judged justly and by the Spirit of the Lord cleered or condemned accorto your Deeds 1. Whether there were such order of Men and Women in the true Church of Christ in the Apostles dayes and where did Christ give Institution for such Worships Practices and manner of Life slouthful idleness and unprofitableness to God and Men as ye hold forth And whether any are bound to believe you and follow your Religion and Practices except you can prove by the Scriptures the Words of Christ or Example of his Saints and Apostles your Religion and Lives and Practices and Worships and whether you do admit of tryal in all your whole Religion by and according to the Scriptures and Writings of the Apostles yea or nay 2. Whether the World in your Hearts and the World's nature even the root of Lust the root of Pride Covetousness and the love of this World and its Vanities and the root of Idolatry is subdued in you to the Light in your Consciences I do speak and what is the root of all these things and what is it that subdues it Is it an outward abstinence by the force of Locks and Doors and Bolts or self-separation and secret Places that subdues the World's nature in Men and Women and is it by such means that Christ gives Victory over Sin and overcomes it in his People or is it not by the Power of God in the Heart onely and whether is it not damnable Hypocrisie in you to appear outwardly Holy and free from these things while yet the Nature and Root of all these things are alive in you and boyling up in the motions of them and is any outward thing the Cross of Christ and Christ crucified which mortifies to the World which the Apostles preached and rejoyced in 3. Whether is it a true denial of the World in you to deny it in one manner and place and to run into it and imbrace it in another way and place it doth not appear to me that you have denyed the World as the Apostles did For answer me where had they any such Seats in the finest and fattest Places of the Cities and Towns as ye have such great fine Houses and Gardens and such Revenues by the year as ye have staying all their dayes in a great House and spending their time in slouth and idleness as ye do they went up and down the World preaching the Gospel and had no certain dwelling Place but followed the Lamb of God in the Spirit and did not settle themselves in fat Places of the Earth continuing all their dayes as ye do therefore we judge that you are out of the Life and not in the spirit as the Apostles were in but are in the Form of Righteousness and Holiness without the Power So I demand an Answer to clear your selves if you can and to prove that you are of the true Church and that your Wayes and Practices are in and by the Spirit of God and according to the Scriptures 4. What is that Death that hath passed over all and reigned from Adam to Moses and whether it doth not reign yet in and over you and what is Moses's Ministration and whether ever through it you yet truely came and whether that part be subdued in you which the Law of God was added upon and whether are you come to Christ and know him as he was before Abraham and before Mary and how was he David's Lord and how his Son and is Christ within you born and revealed to you by whom the World was made and do you expect to be perfectly freed from Sin that ye shall not commit Sin in this Life upon Earth yea or nay 5. What is the Soul and what was its state and condition before Transgression and what is its state and condition in Transgression and whether may man come to be restored by the second Adam into the same estate while upon Earth as he lost in the first Adam yea or nay Friends I demand of you in the Name and Power of the Lord God to answer me these things in writing some of you and to subscribe your names that I may return you an Answer and query further of you for we are sent of God to visit you and to try you and if you be in the perfect Truth and would convert others to your Religion be plain with us and use your best Spiritual Weapons in your Zeal towards us and defend your Cause and appear for your God and if you doubt of your own Wayes and Practices and be not able to defend your Religion then let your Mouthes be stopped then turn from Idolatry for now is the Lord God risen that will judge ye and all the Earth righteously I am a lover of Souls but a Witness against all false Idolatrous Wayes of Antichrist and the Whore that hath reigned in the World and I am the Lord's Servant E. B. By the Scorners of the World called a Quaker These queries were sent to the Fryars in Latine ANd we were with
The Scripture was the Foundation of Foundations but when he heard this he ran away and fled like a Hireling and would not stay and I was and am ready in the Presence of God and any sober men to prove this to be false Doctrine and of the Devil and him to be no Minister of Christ who holds it forth And all you sober minded men may be ashamed of him who managed his work with so much wickedness and impudency while he staid and when it came to the very trial then he run away and would not stand though I desired him hereby did his guilt appear is flying the tryal and this is the substance of the Business though not every particular word and I have gathered it up to send you and him that when you see it and consider and read what you have done you may be ashamed of him and of your own unreasonableness And further He is already proved and may be more largely hereafter to be one that God never sent both by Conversation and Doctrine and no Minister of Jesus Christ and not only in the House but when we were come forth such was your Violence to the stopping of us when we were pasting and had not the Mayor prevented it our Suffering from some of you had been more then it was let the Fear of God strike you and let his Light search Wicked and Ungodly Hearts and repent of your doings and cease to do Evil and turn from your Deceiver if you love your own Souls and learn the Way of Righteousness and Peace which you have not yet known for in the broad way you are and the end of it will be unto your everlasting Destruction And to you this is a Warning and a Visitation from the Lord by a Lover of your Souls who is true though by you called and counted a Deceiver and this in Love to your Souls is sent unto you E. B. Here also followeth certain Queries to Christopher Fowler the same time to which he never yet could give any Sober Answer therefore I here insert them that he may yet give his Answer Christopher Fowler SEeing thou art a man so irrational and so unsober to speak and fairly to debate things in Discourse and thy Auditory so rude and inhumane in Behaviour and words therefore to thee these few Queries I propound to try thee whether thou wilt shew the spirit of a Man by writing more then by speaking seeing therein I have tryed thee to be more like a Wild Inhumaine Creature than a Sober and Upright Christian. Seeing the Scripture saith the Word of God was in the Beginning and the World was framed by it and it shall endure forever hence I query of thee I. Whether the Scriptures be the very Word of God yea or nay Seeing the Scriptures were not in the Beginning neither was the World framed by them neither can they endure forever hence I query of thee II. Whether the very Word of God be Scripture yea or nay Seeing it is confessed that which is written of and declared of in the Scriptures is the Word of God and the Truth which shall endure forever hence Iquery of thee III. Whether the Scriptures the Writings and the Thing or Subject declared and written of are not two distinct things so as one may have the one and not the other yea 〈◊〉 nay Seeing God and his Word Will and Mind is Eternal Infinite and Endless hence I query of thee if thou hast an Understanding answer IV. Whether God his Word Will and Mind is or can be contained or holden in Scriptures and Writings or but only part of the Declaration of him of his Word Will and Mind yea or nay Seeing such were false Prophets which preached for Hire and divined for Money and sought for Gain from their Quarter hence I query of thee V. Whether by this Rule art not thou proved a false Prophet who preachest for Hire and takest Hire for Preaching and hast a Quarter reading of some part of it from which thou seekest Gain answer in Plainness Seeing every Tree is known by its Fruit as Christ saith hence I query VI. Whether by this rule thou that bringst forth the same fruits as the false Prophets did viz. Lies Lightness Pride Covetousness and false accusing art not the same Tree viz. a false Prophet Seeing they were false Prophets who ran and were not sent and did not profit them the people at all but clothed themselves with the Wool and prepared War against them that put not into their Mouths c. hence I query of thee VII Whether by this rule thou art not proved a False Prophet who canst not prove that thou art sent of God neither are the people profitted by thee but are rude and wanton and wicked and thou preparest war against them that put not into thy mouth by suing them at law for Tithes c Seeing Scorning Lying Slandering Envy Hatred Lightness c. with much more of which thou art guilty are the fruits of the flesh and of the Divel hence I query of thee VIII Whether by this rule art thou not proved to be no Minister of Christ but of the Devil and a Servant to him and a Liver to the Flesh and not in the Spirit in whom these Fruits of Darkness and of the Flesh are abounding Seeing the Scripture saith the Word of God was in the beginning and Christ Jesus is the Foundation and no other can be laid hence I query of thee IX Whether by this rule thou art not proved a Deceiver and thy Doctrine false and Error and contrary to Scripture who said the Scriptures are the Word of God which were not in the Beginning and said that the Scriptures which are not Christ are the Foundation of Foundations and whether this Doctrine of thine doth not deny Christ and so art proved to be Antichrist answer according to Truth Seeing thou confessest thou hast Hire for Preaching yet sayst thou preachest not for Hire hence I query of thee X. Whether any of the People of Reading would give thee so much a Year if thou didst not preach to them and if no then whether they do not give thee so much and thou receive it because thou Preachest unto them or did they give thee so much before thou preachest or will they give thee any when thou dost cease to preach to them try them when thou wilt and prove thy self a true Prophet by Preaching some years and receiving nothing and till then I charge thee to be a false Prophet Seeing the Ministry which Christ Jesus sent by the Apostles did bring people that they needed no man to teach them but as the anointing within them hence I query of thee XI Whether by this rule thy Ministry is proved not to be of Christ Iesus nor thou sent of him by which none can come to this condition that they need no man to teach them produce any one if thou canst and so a Ministry of Anti-christ
and thou of the Divel Seeing they that abide not in the Doctrine of Christ have not God hence I query of thee XII Whether by this rule thou art not proved to be without Christ and without God who abides not in Christ's Doctrine but are called of men Master and stand Praying in the Synagogue and hast the chief Seat in the Assembly and contrary to Christ's Command Answer these Queries with the Spirit of Soberness if thou hast it and shew thy self a man if thou hast the Heart of a man and Repent of thy Wickedness and own thy Condemnation upon thy Former Words and Works I am a Friend unto thy Soul but a witness against thy Deceits E. B. And after which time for the space of two years I had no Communication with Christopher Fowler till this last nineth Moneth at a place called East-Hâ—â—sted where a Meeting of Dispute was appointed and challenged by some of his Brethren at which place again I met with this my Adversary where we had some hours Discourse and many particulars of False Doctrine fell from Fowler 's mouth some few of which hereafter follow First one of his brethren in his prayer before the dispute prayed to God to forgive them the Atheism that were in their hearts of him and his Brethrens Answer now an Atheist is one that denies God and Atheism is denying of God according to common reputation Atheism is so taken so that how shall such a Generation of men bring people to the Knowledge of God by their Ministry or how should they ever convert people to profit them who yet in their own Hearts denyed God as the man acknowledged in his prayer before the Lord and many witnesses the Poor People of England had thought that the Spirit of God had been in your Hearts but now we know that you deny God in your Hearts and you have confessed it to your own shame are you Ministers of Christ and yet denies God in your hearts and in whose hearts lodges Atheism Oh! let not people be deceived by you but repent ye that know not God but with your Mouthes confess him and with your hearts do deny him Christopher Fowler also affirmed that day That the Scriptures are the Glorious everlasing Foundation of Foundations Answ. And hereby it is made manifest that he hath totally denyed Christ and so proved with his brother confest in his prayer that indeed Atheism is in their Hearts and so he hath denyed Christ whom the Scriptures say is the Foundation and no other Foundation can any man lay and upon him were the Saints builded in their Faith and all their Practices of Religion for he is the corner Stone as it is Written and thus he hath dishonoured Christ in setting the Scriptures above him and taking the Honour from him and giving it to the Scriptures and I shall leave this his Doctrine to be considered with a query to these people of his Church in Reading whether he is worth hearing or giving Money to for preaching that holds forth such Doctrine and whether it is possible he should bring them to Christ who hath in effect denied him to be the Foundation and held forth that the Scriptures are the glorious everlasting Foundation of Foundations Much I need not say to uncover the error of sucâ— a Doctrine Again he affirmed That a man at one and the same time might be a Minister of Christ and a Deceiver Answ. And here all may see the weakness and Ignorance of this strange Paradox and indeed which is contrary to the Scriptures which saith No man can serve two Masters and it s very certain that he that serves the Devil doth â—ot serve Christ at the same time and he that serves Christ doth not serve the Devil and so his Doctrine is Antichristian which would make People believe that though they serve the Devil yet they are the Servants of God and this is as much as he hath said that one may be a Minister of Christ and yet a Deceiver now a Deceiver is one that follows the Spirit of the Devil and a Minister of Christ is one that followes the Spirit of Christ and these two Spirits are contrary and not both ruling in one man at one time But then to help the matter he said a man might serve Christ in Office but not in Love to which my answer was let him say whether he and the Priests of England did serve Christ by way of Office or Love both or either and I should prove the contrary but that we prosecuted no further Some other things were affirmed by him that day not now remembred He said That Christ was a Sinner from this Argument laid down by him all that dies â—â—e Sinners Christ died therefore c. These and such things he held forth all that day besides the unsoberness of his words and carriages towards me who called me a Dog divers times and did use very ridiculous jestures and words towards me even to his own shame in the sight of many people and the people of that County do yet well remember his unchristian-like proceedings and were ashamed of him but at last went his way and all his brethen and I was left among the people and I need not now mention for many even themselves know it what loss and disadvantage they sustained that day and Gods loving Truth was advanced and the advantage of it that was obtained on the Lords behalf but I being not yet as it were wholly satisfied but would endeavour further to the laying open deceit and to invade Antichrists kingdom the next morning after the dispute it was upon me to write forth and to send him this paper of Propositions following whereunto is annexed his Answer C. Fowler FRiend seeing thou art so high in thy spirit against us and against the truth which we profess and from time to time dost open thy Mouth so wide in Justification of thy self and thy Practices and in false charges against us and though we have had divers Meetings and the differences between us alwayes appeared greater and greater therefore this I propound unto thee Whether thou wilt give another Meeting of open dispute for the tryal of thee and thy wayes and of us and the truths which we hold forth for the satisfaction of the people and these things following I propound as the subject matter worthy to be handled which may discover thee and us to the satisfaction of all that desires in that case First What be the evident signes and tokens of a Wolf in sheeps clothing and whether thou or we in the sight of the people and of the Lord God can clear our selves to be clear and free from the marks and signs of such aforesaid Secondly Whether wilt thou stand to be tried in thy Ministry in thy Call to it Practice in it and Maintenance of it by and according to the Scriptures of the old and new Testament and wilt thou admit of tryal of thy Church and
the many horrid and hideous Errors which for some years past have abounded amongst us against the Authority of Scriptures the Deity of Christ the holy Ghost Trinity of Persons Immortallity of Souls Doctrines of Repentance Humiliation Sanctification Resurrection from the Dead the Eternal recompence of Heaven and Hell yea divers Sects encreasing every day in numbers power and malice and under the name of Quakers Ranters Seekers c. oppâ—gning the received Doctrine and unquestionable interest of Christ Iesus amongst us Answ. That many horrid Errors have abounded amongst you that is very true as in many particulars might be instanced But why do you maliciously charge the Quakers with opposing the Interest of Christ Jesus The Lord shall judge you in his Day when he makes it appear to all the World that those whom you charge with the contrary are the very Friends of Christ's Interest and have been patient Sufferrers for his Name sake under the wickedness of your Generation and as for the Ranters Seekers and others whom you have reckoned up together with the Quakers it is well known that we are in opposition in spirit unto all these and have given large testimony in the Fear of God against them though it is certain that there is many as upright and sincere men towards God among these Sects you have mentioned as any of your Congregations and though in some things they are condemnable yet in some things they are as justifiable as you are before the Lord And what the Seekers Ranters Familists and the rest mentioned by you do hold as in these things you have charged them with I will leave that for I am not now pleading their cause but the Cause of God and his People whom you in scorn call Quakers and though you have joyned them in Accusation with others yet I must separate them from others in my Answer and must tell you in the fear of the Lord that you have belyed them and falsly accused them out of your malicious hearts for they do not deny the Authority of the Scriptures but gives that authority to them which the Spirit of God that gave them forth hath formerly given neither do they deny the Deity of Christ but do say In him dwelleth the fulness of the Godhead neither do they deny the holy Spirit nor the Father Son and Spirit but say there are three and these three are one but as for your Trinity of Persons that is language beside the the Scriptures and we do affirm the Soul is Immortal and as for the Doctrines of Repentance Humiliation Sanctification Resurrection from the Dead the eternal Recompence of Heaven and Hell these Doctrines are publickly held forth by them in words and also in practice more then by your selves therefore with what face you could charge them with the denial of these things it is almost wonderfull and there are thousands of your Congregations that are and have been sometimes hearing in your City that shall bear witness against your Accusations and give Evidence that they have heard them whom you call Quakers give faithfull witness of and for all these things which you charge them with denial of Do you think that your Congregations are all so blind as to receive for truth what you have herein spoken nay I must tell you some of them are offended with you because hereof First in that you have reckoned the Quakers with Ranters and others between whom there is absolute opposition and not agreement neither in Doctrine nor Practice Secondly That you should charge the Quakers with such things as they are altogether clear of and known to be so by many but this is that your folly and weakness might appear and as you speak of encreasing every day in number power and malice some part of this is true for the Lord doth encrease his People daily in number and power by his Spirit but not in Malice and that is your torment the encrease of the Quakers which as they have begun to encrease so the Lord will continue them and you nor mortal men shall not be able to hinder neither the Magistrates Persecution nor the Ministers Instigation thereunto though you have joyned hand in hand against them for the Lord is with his People and his Authority and Power is theiâ— Defence and they are not in empty Forms as you say but in the Power of Godliness and as for your Ordinances and Ministry of which you speak something I have said to it already and more I shall say to it hereafter Your third Evidence is The odious Scandals of those that profess themselves to be the People of God as their self-seeking their unparallell'd breach of all civil and sacred Oathes whereby the Mouth of Iniquity is opened and the reverence of Religion abated so that to us say you there appears no visible way of repairing the credit of strict profession but by a severe punishment of Professors c. Answ. It is true many that do profess themselves the people of God but are not but by their lives and practices gives odious Scandals and are Self-seeking as you say but upon whom the guilt of this may be truly charged that remains to be sought out doubtless it lies as near your doors as any others for is not your pride and oppression by taking Tythes suing people at Law for Wages and casting them in Prison because for good Conscience sake they cannot pay you your seeking for your gain from your Quarter and your taking great sums of Money and preaching for hire taking so much yearly are not these odious scandals and very self-seeking practices which you are guilty of while you pretend publick good as for Breaches of Oaths and Covenants I wish you to search your own hearts for that Iniquity doth lie as near your Generation as any others witness that you and your Brethren have from time to time engaged to such and such things As first Did not you engage for the Government to be without King and House of Lords And did not you then cry up the Protector contrary to your Engagements and now cry up another And thus it is very evident that the guilt of breach of Oathes and Covenants lies near unto your selves which indeed opens the Mouth of Iniquity for the very Cavaliers and Prelates say you were once strict in your Way but now you have struck hands with them and are now your selves doing that which you cried out against in them And thousands in this Nation is abated in their affections from your Church and Ministry as knowing them to be upon a false Foundation and to be of Babylon and not of the Heavenly Ierusalem And what do you mean by severe punishment of Professors Do you mean to set up Ecclesiastical Laws again and that all must be forced to your Church Way and Religion Is it in your hearts to drive the Nation by force and if they will not to punish them with Fire and Fagot and Prisons If
this be your meaning as may justly be supposed it is the Lord deliver the Nation from you this is not the way to gain the credit of Religion but the further you go on in this way as you have formerly walked in the more will your Profession and Religion stink in the Nostrils of all good men Your fourth Evidence is Immensity and bounless liberty permitted assumed and freely practised by many to Write Print and Publish all manner of Blasphemies and Opinions c. the sad and wofull effects thereof appears in many some being in Apostacy others in luke-warmness and much decay in the Power of godliness c. Answ. As I have acknowledged 〈◊〉 there are without doubt many Errors Blasphemies and false Opinions extant in this Nation both Written Published and Maintained but upon whom and what sort of men this can truely be charged this is very doubtfull to many and your Charge being onely general no particular Answer can well be given onely it appears you would have none to Write Print or Publish but your selves or by your consent and you would tye the Nation up in the bondage of your own Spirits and you would be the onely Judges of Blasphemies and Errors but that we allow not for Enemies must not be Judges and it is very possible such is your Darkness that you may call Truth Error and Error Truth in some particulars but if you shall instance any particular Doctrines Blasphemies Errors and Opinions published and maintained in my next I shall freely give my witness against them if they be really so and against the people that holds them as well as your selves and more particularly I cannot now say and there is indeed wofull and sad effects of Errors brought forth in this Nation and many are in the Apostacy from the truth and in the luke-warmness also and the power of Godliness is decayed and they have the Form and holds that without the Power your selves may do well and your Congregations also to search your own hearts by the Spirit of the Lord in this case that the guilty may see and turn unto the Lord that his wrath come not upon them Your fifth Evidence is Sabbath Prophanation both in Opinion and Practice grown to a greater height than ever formerly the Iews Sabbath cryed up instead of the Christian Shops opened upon the Lords day yea some working the works of their ordinary callings in knitting and sowing of Garments in our Assemblies even in the Pulpits in the time of Gods publick Worship c. Answ. This remains doubtful to many what the true Sabbath is and whether the Lord doth require of this Generation the observing one day above another and if so what day it is that he requires the observing of as for the 7th day of the week we know that the Lord commanded the Iewes to keep as a Sabbath and to rest But that was never commanded to the Gentiles and as for the first day of the week which is called the Christians Sabbath that is doubtful to many whether God commands and requires the observation of that day by the Gentile believers yea or nay seeing that there is neither command nor binding example for it throughout the Scriptures if there be any I do desire that you would shew it in your next and by what authority whether from men or from Heaven the first day of the week is now kept by you as your Sabbath for really many are doubtful in this case and you would do very well if you have a command from God or example from his Servants in former Ages to discover so much unto the people And as for your calling it the Lords-day it is certain every day is his and not one day more then another and as for Shops opening and such things as you mention though every one that do such things may not be justified in the doing of it yet such a thing in it self may be justified if the Spirit of the Lord moves unto it and who shall limit the Lord And why may not others labour in their ordinary callings that day as well as you in your ordinary callings I mean your ordinary calling of preaching that is an ordinary calling it is certain because you deny any extrordinary calling in these days and so I only query this why others may not follow their ordinary callings as well as you for it hath been affirmed very lately by some that preaching was a trade and a function for men to get a living by and we do not question but there are many now in this Nation called Ministers that do preach for that end and would cease to preach if Mony and Tithes were ceased to be given them I speak this of some not of all which doth demonstrate that the way of your preaching is an ordinary calling which you labour in on your Sabbath-day Your sixth Evidence is the pouring out by many of aâ—â— Sects with a full mouth all manner of obloquy and contempt upon Ministry and Ministers of the Gospel openly interrupting them in the exercise of their Duty whereby they are discouraged in their Work while they are represented under the notion of Baals Priests Gehazaes Pulpited Divines distributers of Sundayes Doles Simonions Decimating Clergy common Incendiaries c. Answ. It is certain that the true Ministry and Ministers of the Gospel were in all Ages and now are contemned and despised and all manner of evil spoken against them for the Name of Christ but whether you are those true Ministers of the Gospel and your Ministry the true Ministry sent of Christ this is doubtful to many and by many particulars which might be instanced the contrary doth appear The Ministers of Christ in the dayes of the Apostles they never complained of being interrupted for they were haled before Rulers and commanded to preach no more in that Name and yet they were not discouraged thereby in their work nor when they were called Movers of Sedition and Deceivers and such reproachfull names they regarded not these things but as for you you seem to be troubled that any should speak to you or ask you 〈◊〉 Question or exhort you to repent if any out of good Conscience query with you concerning your Practice and Doctrine and if any exhort to Good and cry against Evil amongst you this you call interrupting of you in your Ministerial Duty and to Prison Houses of Correction and to Whips and Stocks must such go which was never the Apostles Practice never was any sent to Prison for opposing of them And what if the Ministers of England be called Hirelings and false Prophets and greedy dumb Dogs the practice of some of them doth prove it that they are so these things you must bear as coming deservedly and not unjustly upon you for the Servants of the Lord in all Ages ever cried against Deceivers and false Prophets and called them Deceivers and greedy dumb Dogs and Serpents and Vipers and Evil Beasts and
and rumors of Wars what are they to us What have we to do with them and wherein are we concerned in these things is not our Kingdom of another World Even that of peace and righteousness and hath not the Lord called us and chosen us into the possession of that Inheritance wherein strife and enmity dwelleth not Yea he hath broken down that part in us that is related thereunto and being dead in that Nature of Strife Bloodshed and Wars how can we live in strife and contention in the World or have fellowship with any therein And can we have pleasure in the confusion and distraction amongst men or joyn in any thing with them if so be we are quickened in the new life to God which is a life of love and peace and free from such things and if we are crucified in the life to this World out of which all these confusions and strife doth arise how can we live therein and therefore these things are nothing to us neither are we of one party or against another to oppose any by rebellion or plottings against them in enmity and striving with them by Carnal Weapons nor to destroy any mens lives though our Enemies so we War not for any nor against any for the matters of this Worlds Kingdom But our Kingdom is inward and our Weapons are spiritual and our victory and peace is not of this World And our War is against souls enemies and against the powers of darkness even by the Sword of the Spirit which God hath given us and called us to war therewith to convert people from sin and death and from the very occasion of wars and contentions about the things that are earthly and this is our calling and work at this day and these things all the Children of the Lord are to mind and to keep over the spirit of this World in all people which all this enmity strife and confusion that is up amongst men lodgeth in and out of it ariseth for these things are the fruits of the spirit of this evil and sinful World and the fruits of the Spirit of God are of another nature even Peace and meekness towards all and not enmity towards any in which Spirit let us live and walk admonishing all hereunto and Praying for our enemies and not hating them but doing good for evil and not rendring evil for evil but being meek and humble merciful and patient towards all and this is the true Christian life learned of Christ and this life is blessed in this World and in the World to come and them that live here are redeemed out of the World wherein is Troubles and Confusion Wars and Strifes But let us not heed any of these things for they Rise and Fall in their season and are brought forth effected in the changable and erring spirit which worketh not the honour of God but is in the dishonour to him And Friends let us be a people separate from all that live therein waiting for the deliverance of the holy seed in all and believing that through all these things the Lord will set up his Kingdom and thus it must come to pass BABYLON MUST FALL WITH A GREAT NOISE for in strife and confusion was She builded and therein hath She long stood and thereby must She fall and Tribulations must come upon the Earth that People may learn to fear the Lord through his Judgements And he will speedily do great things in the World which cannot be believed by many if it were told them for Hell and Death must be destroyed and both the Beast and the Whore must be taken alive and cast into the Lake of the anger of God But blessed are they that do wait upon the Lord and rest under his shadow and wait in his Counsel and receive his Instructions they shall see the marvellous works of his hand but the wicked and unbelieving shall be turned into darkness and shall not see the countenance of the Lord to refresh them but their sorrow shall be increased And as for me If I were no more this is the Testimony of my Love unto the Seed of God through these Nations who am a Companion to all that travel after Truth and Righteousness and that seek the Lord in their hearts that he may Rule and these things were upon me to send amongst the Flock of God to be read in all your Meetings Oxfordshire the 1st day of the third Moneth 1660. E. B. A VISITATION AND Presentation of Love Unto the KING and those call'd ROYALLISTS Consisting of I. An Answer to several Queries proposed to the People called Quakers from a supposed Royallist II. An Objection answered concerning the Kings Supremacy III. An Epistle directed to the King and those that go under the Name of Royallists IV. Certain Queries returned to them called Royallists to answer An Answer to divers Queries subscribed thus To the Quakers some Queries is sent to be answered that all People may know your Spirit and the temper of it and your Iudgment concerning the Times and Seasons and subscribed let your Answer be directed Tradite hanc Amico Regis AS concerning the Quakers that are scornfully so called We are at this day and have been ever since we were a People a poor despised and contemptible People in the eye of this World and deep Sufferers under the Injustice and Cruelties and Oppressions both of Rulers Teachers and People and we have been a prey to the Wicked and trodden down under the feet of Ambitious men that have been in power in this Nation and have Ruled in force and cruelty over us and this hath been ever since the Lord raised us up to be a People though we have not been offensive to any just Law or Government or to any sort of People otherwise then that we have given our Witness against Sin and wickedness in all People but we have not been Oppressors of others neither have we envied the persons of any but in all good Conscience have we walked towards all men doing no otherwise to any then we would be done unto and this is the very Law we walk by towards all men desiting the good of all and that all may come to Repentance and be Saved and what we are as unto the Lord if I should declare it could not be believed by many But we are his People and he hath chosen us and he is our God and we have believed in him and walked with him in the uprightness of heart and we have this Testimony in our own hearts if we die it is for him and if we live it is to him and though we have been and may be clouded with the Reproaches and Persecutions of an Uncircumcised Generation yet in the Lord's Season it shall be manifest even to the World and to our very Enemies that we are his People and chosen of him and he in the midst of us whom we serve and worship in Spirit in Truth and in Righteousness and
them The truth of these things being proved and rightly considered by the King 〈◊〉 all others no just occasion will be found for this our Adversaries Charge nor 〈◊〉 place can rightly be found in the heart of the King for the reception of the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 tion but may upon just tryal condemn both Accuser and Accusatiâ—â— I mean not destroy the man but reprove the Accuser and his lyes â—…er And now I shall proceed to the Accusation it self and shall lay open the folly 〈◊〉 â—â—norance of the matter of his Accusation as well as I have done the wickedâ—â—â—◠〈◊〉 the manner of it 〈◊〉 the true Protestant Religion hath been in danger to be rooted out by the Quakers 〈◊〉 This is the Charge it self â—â—sw If by true Protestant Religion the Accuser mean true Christan Reliâ—â—â—â— then I deny his Accusation utterly and do charge him to be a Slanderâ—… Lyer and False Accuser and must desire of the King that such a 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 taken notice of who hath abused and dishonoured him and that very 〈◊〉 in presenting him with Lyes and Falshoods for Welcomes which is inâ—… lesâ— then disgrace to both the Person and Office of a King What a 〈◊〉 â—â—tending so much to Love and Loyalty and so much rejoycing on his beâ—â—â—â—â—nd as if he were one of his choice Subjects and gave such reverence and 〈◊〉 to him and attempted so high as to be the Kings Informer and Instructer 〈◊〉 to be found a Presenter of Falshoods and Slanders against as good Subâ—… 〈◊〉 the Nation as himself O how abominable is this both to God and the 〈◊〉 and the whole Kingdom that these things should be much more that 〈◊〉 should pass unreproved for we are of the true Christian Religion as beâ—… 〈◊〉 have said even in the same way and of the same Spirit as were the holy 〈◊〉 and for that Religion we stand to do and suffer all things for that cause 〈◊〉 for the true Christian Religions sake But if this our Accuser by Protestant Religion mean the Sects of Lutheâ—…â—r â—r of the Sect of Calvinists so called or whomsoever else which I do 〈◊〉 heartily that I had the full intent of his mind of whom he means by the true Protestants for his words admit of divers acceptations and so a sound Answer can hardly be given while I do answer onely what I suppose to be his meaning by true Protestant Religion for there are divers sorts of Protestants Lutherans Calvinists and many others which are all Protestants and have protested against the Pope each one sort of them saying They are the true Christians and true Protestants yet are very much divided among themselves even to the killing and persecuting one of another so that which sort this man means and who of them are of the true Protestant Religion which we would root out c. this is doubtful I would I knew his meaning that I might give him a true Answer and sound for we may deny and oppose Protestant Religion or some part of it that is some Sects or divers sorts that have protested against the Church of Rome and yet be no Transgressors in the sight of God not many men for divers of the Protestants themselves are denying others of the Protestants and their Religion and it is my belief in this case that some have deserted the Pope and the Papists Religion upon bad grounds and have taken up a Religion as bad and no better then Popery not that I justifie Popâ—ry in all things but have a large Witness to give against it and men ought to protest against it yet I say some called Protestants in their Religion are as corrupt as any of the Church of Rome so on some account I may as lawfully deny Protestant Religion or some sort of them that do profess it as the Church of Rome for it is as corrupted some part of it and no more acceptable to God in the Profession and Practise of it This is spoken in general of it because his Accusation is general Now if I had his full intent whether he means Lutherans or Calvinists or what others if not them that are of the true Protestant Religion that we would root out then I should insist upon that particular sort and give my exception against them for I have many things to object at least and some things wholly to except against in the Protestant Religion or some sort of it not that I condemn or judge every individual man of the Protestant Religion for I believe there are many that are sincere and zealous towards GOD though with some Error in Judgement yet as to the Form of Worship and Constitution of Church and Ministry and Ordinances in the Protestant Religion it is much if not wholly differing and contrary to the Church Ministry Worship and Ordinances of the Apostles and true Christians in their dayes and more then this I now may not say a more full Answer I cannot give to this Charge except that I did know what sort of Protestant he intended which if I did I should utter my mind more large as to the Matter according as the Spirit of God gave me utterance And now that I have spoken of the manner and also of the matter of his Charge I shall hint partly of the end and purpose of his thus accusing as to the King His end intent and purpose of his thus charging us must needs be and it will appear to be out of Malice Wrath and Enmity for to incense and move the Heart of the King against us to destroy us as I have before mentioned And in answer to this some things most especially are considerable to the King and all his Friends 1. If he should upon the Report of this Man or any others let his Heart be moved into Rigour and Enmity against us and thereby seek intend or work Evil against us to destroy us he did but fill the Land with Violence Cruelty and Persecution and Innocent Blood and fill his Government with Oppression and Tyranny and provoke the God of Heaven against him to destroy him and overthrow his Kingdom and Power and Government and this would doubtless be the effect of receiving such a Mans Counsel and of his so proceeding if that he seek to pluck up what the Lord hath planted and if he dip hiâ— Hand in innocent suffering of God's People unjustly and if he reach forth his Hand to touch God's Anointed and hurt the Peaceable in his Land thâ—â— shall the Lord take him from his Authority and give his Dominion to another more worthy then he And this is for him to consider in the coolness of his 〈◊〉 2. â—f he did proceed to do any thing against us or be moved in his heart â—…unto barely upon the report of this or such other men without hearing Face to Face and lawful tryal in the matter and hearing our Answer and â—â—fence as well as our enemies Charge against us then all the Nations of
extream Reproaches as I have said in Contempt and Derision of that People and all this as if those People were guilty of heinous Crimes that it might appear to thee as if these Petitioners had done nothing but Iustice in what they have done and they seek to cover themselves and to hide their Wickedness before thee in what they have unjustly acted and this seems to be the Current of some part of the same Petition already presented unto thee like as if they had done no Evil though they have Unjustly Banished 〈◊〉 off Ears Whipped inhumanly and taken away lives as aforesaid And they would have thee believe they are Innocent towards thee and towards us whenas it is evident as the Sun at Noon-day that they are our Persecuters and that they have â—â—justly persecuted us unto Death for the Name of Christ and that also they are not unto thee as they Hypocritically feign themselves And therefore O King for the clearing of our selves and the Name of the Lord which we profess and for reproving of their bold impudent Insolencies both in what they have already done to us and now in seeking to cover themselves unto thee And also if there be any doubtfulness in thy Heart of these Matters for these Ends and Causes with Respect to the Fear of God and Honour 〈◊〉 the King I hereby presume to pursue their said Petition even unto thy Court and to wipe away the Slanders and Reproaches of Ungodly Men as much as possible hoping thereby thou wilt receive due and just Information in this matter of proceeding between us and them that thy just Judgment may be given accordingly And I shall transcribe some few of their own words presented to thee and thereupon spread some few Considerations before thee also and I pray God give thee an Understanding to judge justly in this and all other cases The first thing that I note is whereas they say That they have chosen rather the pure Scripture-Worship with a good Conscience in this poor remote Wilderness to â—it New-England among the Heathens than the Pleasures of England with subjection to the Imposition of the then so disposed and so far prevailing Hierarchy which we could not do without an evil Conscience c. say they The Considerations presented unto the King upon these words are divers 1. The Worship Doctrine Discpiline and Constitution of the Church of New-England is different and contrary and not purely according unto the Scriptures in the Administration of the Gospel nor in a pure Conscience purely guided by the Spirit of God though they seem to justifie their own Way and Case before the King and this may justly be made appear in his Presence upon good Occasion only at this time I assert the Case and if ever God gives oportunity I may prosecute it with Proofs and Evidences and that to the great Reproof of the Church so called of New-England who are not only in Doctrine Worship and Conversation contrary to the Scriptures but impudent and too presumptious to affirm their own Self-justification and Innocencâ— before the King when as it is manifest as the Day is from the Night that the Pastors and Members of the Church of New-England want the Spirit of God that gave forth the Scriptures and follow the spirit of Persecution Violence and Cruelty and are void of a Good Conscience both towards God and Men. To prove this there needs no greater Evidence than their own Deportâ—…nt towards the Harmless Quakers for these five years time who as I have said have spoiled their Goods and imprisoned their Persons cut off their Ears Banished them and inhumanely put them to Death and all this because of difference in Iudgment and Practice in Religious Matters when as no manner of Evil could be charged upon them in the things between man and man And if these be not works contrary to the Scriptures and the Spirit that gave them forth and contrary to a Good Conscience I am yet ignorant and must leave it to the Judgment of the King before whom this Matter is brought to receive his Judgment 2. Let the King consider how they have ignorantly condemned themselves in the same things for whith they have judged others for while they seem to complain of the Impositions of the Bishops which they stile prevailing Hierarchy if it was Transgression in the Bishops in dayes past to impose upon these Petitioners and to Persecute them for Non-conformists how much more are these men guilty of Imposition and Persecution of tender Consciences Nay they have exceeded in the same Transgression and become seven-fold guilty of the sins themselves which they complain against in others for they have gone further in Cruelty and Persecution towards the Innocent Quakers than ever the Bishops proceeded against them even so far further as the murdering of a man is more than cutting off his Ear And the Cause of the Quakers towards these Petitioners hath been as Innocent as ever theirs was towards the Bishops Oh hypocritical Generation who are condemning of others for that whereof themselves are guilty and imposing upon others in a far higher degree than ever the Bishops imposed on them witness their Law in New-England which judgeth every man to pay 5s per day who come not to their Assembly and imposing Fines of 40s and 50s apiece on such as meet together to worship the Lord which are evident signs of an evil Conscience as themselves speak The next thing that I note upon which the King ought to consider the Petitioners say concerning the Quakers Open Capital Blasphemers open Seducers from the Glorious Trinity the Lord 's Christ the Blessed Gospel and from the holy Scriptures as the Rule of Life open Enemies to the Government it self as established in the hand of any but men of their own Principles malignant Promoters of Doctrines directly tending to subvert both our Church and State By way of Answer to this let the King consider 1. The envious and detestable spirit of maliciousness of these Accusers and how vehement and fervent their persecuting spirit is drawn forth with reproachful Tearms in the highest degree like as if they could not utter sufficiently the Envy of their Hearts or as if they wanted words to demonstrate their Malignity and devouring Malice against that People whom they in scorn call Quakers and all this to present us Odious and Abominable before thee O King I say but this of them unto thee The Lord forgive them if they have not sinned unto Death and Unpardonably I have no desire of Revenge towards them but I leave Vengeance to the Lord who will recompence in his season neither do I desire to provoke or incense the King against them only Duty to God and the King teacheth me and Love Constraineth me and an absolute Necessity presseth much upon me to spread our Denyal of their Bitter and Malicious Accusations against us before the King unto whom we are thus foully accused And I say I
and the Papists by the Example of others against them Now I say The Wickedness of one will not justifie the Wickedness and Cruelty of the other for neither Party of them are justifiable in the sight of God but condemnable in such Proceedings and it was doubtless of Antichrist and the Devil in both Papists and Protestants to Destroy and Burn one another only for and because of Difference in Religion and wherein the Protestants did put any of the Papists to Death only for and because of Difference in Profession and Practice in Religion and because they were Papists herein the Protestants were acted by the same persecuting spirit of the Devil as the Papists were acted by against them so that I am not an absolute party with the Protestants against the Papists for I know that there is Error of Judgment amongst them both in Faith Worship and their whole Religion only my End is at present in pursuing Semper Iidem to confound his Bloody spirit of Persecution and Cruelty which I find him possessed withal as by his Discourse is apparent and also to put the Protestants in mind how their cause begins to be Reproached Vilified and Despised even in their own Land publickly in the Streets of their chief City which hath not been the like for above an Hundred Years And this is the End of my pursuing Semper Iidem with this Answer and I shall not much enlarge further only in the 11th Page there is one Passage worth observing There is instanced one Richard Woodman of Sussex who affirmed That he had the Spirit of God and can prove said he by the Scriptures that Paul had the Spirit of God as I my self and all God's Elect have Now saith Semper Iidem No Arguments nor Reasons could reclaim him from his Errors and so he was Burnt at Lewis because he said He had the Spirit of God and could prove that Paul had it Answ. There its manifest that this Martyr suffered for Truth and Righteousness sake as a Saint and Servant of God and for witnessing the Truth according to the Scripture which saith If any man have not the Spirit of Christ he is none of his which is manifest in the Scriptures that all that are Christ's and Members of his Church have and it is also manifest That the Papists have not the Spirit of God because they Burn such as do witness and testifie that they have it as here Semper Iidem hath given us an Instance that they Burn and Destroy such for Hereticks as say they have the Spirit of God he not believing that Paul had it but saith It is an Error to affirm it and yet this work seems now to be justified up and down London streets which is the double Iniquity and that which once many looked not to have seen that any being condemned and burned as Hereticks for saying They had the Spirit of God that this should be justified now in these Glorious Dayes of Light this seems almost incredible but that our Eyes behold it and causeth wonder in many what will be the Effect of such a bad sign appearing as a Justification of putting to Death the Innocent for no other Cause but in that he affirmed He had the Spirit of God And by this we learn to know how great the Ignorance Darkness and Blindness of the Church of Rome is and deserveth not the name of a Church if they be all of this mind to condemn men and Burn them for Hereticks for saying They have the Spirit of God and then an Hundred Years after justifie the doing of it to their shame and confusion let this be rehearsed who have themselves denyed that they have the Spirit of God and Condemning and Destroying others for saying they have it And this I leave to the Consideration of all the Protestants who must either deny that they have the Spirit of God or be Condemned and may be Killed as Hereticks for affirming it if so be the Church of Rome recover her desired Power and Pupose in England It s worthy to be minded while it may be 〈◊〉 lest the time come when it cannot be prevented And thus I have run through the main part of Semper Iidem and chiefly hinted at the principal Matters worthy to be taken notice of though much more might be said but that it is my property in all Cases to be as brief as may be for that is the best for the Understanding to contain what is spoken or written only shall not forget William Pryn who is stated in pag. 18. as one of our Modern Phanaticks I would not forget to mind him I say to answer his part and to clear himself if he can of the Aspertion of a Phanatick by which term he stands reviled though Semper Iidem fawneth upon him and flattereth with him and telleth him He is the only Person in this unhappy Paralel who hath given Testimony of his Reconcilement But what better is William Pryn for this Flattery I hope he is not yet reconciled to the Papists and become one of them if he be I desire he would let us know it and if he be not then Semper Iidem accounts him a Phanatick I shall say no further but shall leave him to answer for himself And now last of all for Conclusion I have some CONSIDERATIONS to present to the People of ENGLAND and particularly to the People of LONDON occasioned by the Publication of Semper Iidem 1. COnsider how the Ancient Martyrs as Wickliff Hawkes and Cranmer Latimer Ridley with many more who have been accounted by the Protestants themselves Famous for Piety and Faithfulness and Honourably esteemed Innocent Martyrs for their Witness-bearing against the Romish Idolatries and this for many years in these Kingdoms how I say they are now rendred Odious and Contemptible and Scorned and Slandered as Hereticks seditious factious Blasphemers and Phanaticks by the Author of Semper Iidem and this published openly through the Nation and up and down the Streets of London and this without rebuke from any in Authority that we know of I say this deserves serious Consideration That the Faithful Martyrs in their Day according to their Knowledge who were as the first Fathers of the Protestants-Church so called and did lay down their Lives and seal their Testimony with their Blood against the Idolatry of the then present Times and the Lives and Blood of these Men now to be made void and they that Martyred them justified as doing of Justice and they now reputed Hereticks and Phanaticks publickly this ought to be considered both in the Cause why it is thus and in the Effect of it if it be not restrained 2. Consider How that the generality of the People of England and London are reputed and stand under the present Reproach of being Phanaticks even all the People of England I say except the Papists not only the Separatists from the Church of England as Quakers Anabaptists Independents so called and