give his Relation in the third Page saith If R. H. could have been quiet and let him alone he had not said or done any thing after the said-Dispare at Croton ended Reply By this J. C. would perswade his Reader that R. H. and the Quakers have lost by medling with him and that they have brought this Stuff to their own Head But sure it is the Quakers have not lost but gained Truth prevailing but the poor Unskilful Skirmisher both Rude and Distracted and that by his own Confession hath lost by medling with the Quakers this is very evident to many sober Impartial People I may say to some that once looked upon J. C. to be what he was not viz. a Minister of Christ but having discovered him like a Serpent in the Grass have turned 〈…〉 whom the Quakers both 〈…〉 and Writing have pro◠〈…〉 and Deceiver and this is 〈…〉 him yet this proud Vain boast◠〈…〉 and hardned in Error drowned in 〈◊〉 â—â—ceit which is as a Consumption to him wasting his Reputation amongst many sober Men and spurred on with Envy and Malice against the Truth and the Friends of it he is crying Conquest and Victory like a Man besides himself as well as the Truth a distracted Man Why not distracted in this as well as in his Prayers Would any but either a Foâ— or a Man distracted after he had left the Stage being sufficiently proved before he went a Lyar and Deceiver be so â—dacious and desperately Wicked as to publish to the World that he had over thrown the Quakers But what if a Man should query Hath John Cheyney with running away overthrown the Quakers A Fool might quickly Answer Yes but sure a Wise Man would be more deliberate he would not believe that such a Victory could be obtained by him that fled but rather the contrary not a Conquest to him that perks up and cries Conquest before he begins nor yet he that runs away and cries Victory when he is gone but rather he who having 〈…〉 Encounter and defeated his 〈◊〉 â—nds his Ground when his Adâ—â— fled Now that the Quakers were not overthrown there are some Hundreds of People can witness who were at that Dispute and know it right well who likewise knew that R. H. however it was with J. C. did not forsake the Stage and leave his Opponent thereupon And if I should not have put Pen to Paper I am satisfied there are some Hundreds of People who were there that day would not believe the Relation J. C. hath published of that Dispute but judge him to be a Lyar You for the Truth 's sake and for the sake of many Simple-hearted People who were not there but may take things upon Trust and judge my Silence a Consenting that J. C's Relation is true therefore as briefly as I may without wrong to the Truth I shall examine his Relation being now come to it J. C. p. 3. saith He divided the matter of his Dispute and Charge against the Quakers into 1st Matters of Doctrine 2dly Matters of Practice I think it pertinent to the matter here to insert the Charge I â—…t J. C. upon to prove viz. That the Quakers Religion is against God's Spirit this was the first Branch of one of the seven Changes recited before To prove this Charge J. C. asserted That the Quakers Religion held forth Blasphemy viz. That the Soul of Man is God and to prove it quoted G. F's Great Mystery p. 90 92. Reply I denyed that the Quakers held Man's Soul to be God and renounced that Doctrine as Blasphemy whereof G. F. and the Quakers Religion are clear Now J. Cheyney in his Relation says Having nothing that they could object but only that Fox doth not expressly say that the Soul is God Reply In this J. C. is a Lyar G. F.'s words I owned and said they did admit of no such consequence as that Man's Soul is God But I told him he wrested and perverted G. F's words and meaning as he did the Scriptures G. F. queried of the Priests Is not the Soul coming from God Infinite I affirmed the Breath of Life which God breathed into Man the Life and Spirit which came forth from God the Life of Man's Soul or by which Man became a living Soul was infinite and G. F's words as intended were sound J. C. affirmed There was n othing come forth from God which is infinite and without beginning I replied The Son of God came forth from God yet the Son of God was infinite and without beginning to which J. C. was silent This my Answer was according to Scripture John 8.42 Jesus said I proceeded forth and came from God this was he who said John 17.5 O Father Glorifie thou me with thy own self with the Glory which I had with thee before the World was Verse 24. For thou lovedst me before the Foundation of the World John 16.27 28 30. For the Father himself loveth you because you have loved me and have believed that I came forth from the Fathar and am come into the World Again I leave the World and go to the Father by this we believe that thou camest forth from God Again J. C. asserted There was nothing in Man that is infinite I replied The Breath of Life breathed into Man the Spirit of God in Man is Infinite This was according to Scripture Gen. 2.7 And breathed into his Nostrils the Breath of Life 1 Cor. 3.16 Know ye not that ye are the Temple of God and â—hat the Spirit of God dwelleth in you Mat. 10.20 The Spirit of the Father which speaketh in you Mark The Spirit of God was in Men dwelt in them spoke in them so according to the Scriptures God's Spirit which is infinite dwells in Man and speaks in Man even the Spirit of Truth which proceedeth from the Father John 15.26 So there is something in Man that is Infinite Now Reader is not J. C's assertion There is nothing come forth from God which is infinite and without beginning and that there is nothing in Man which is infinite plainly manifest to be contrary to Scripture Hath not J. C. denied the Son of God who came forth from God to be Infinite and without Beginning Hath he not also denied the Spirit of Trust which proceedeth from the Father to 〈…〉 Infinite and without Beginning 〈…〉 is not J. C. a Lyar against the â—criptures a Lyar against the Son 〈…〉 and a Lyar against the Spirit of Truth And is not this Blasphemy to deny Christ the Son of God who came forth front God and the Spirit of Truth which proceedeth from the Father to be Infinite and without Beginning For J. C. said expresly There was nothing came forth from God which 〈…〉 and without Beginning And is not J. C. a Blasphemer in denying the Son of God who came forth from God and the Spirit of Truth which proceedeth from the Father to be Infinite and without Beginning Let the Reader judge I have
examined J. C's Relation In this particular the substance whereof is The Quakers do hold Man's Soul to be God and that they had nothing they could object but only that Fox doth not expressly say The Soul is God As to the first the Impartial Reader may plainly see it is a false Accusation And as to the second It is a Lye which Lye doth stand deservedly upon J. C. who either was so buste pondering upon 〈◊〉 Notes and gathering up his Papers 〈…〉 he minded not what was said or 〈…〉 not that any more was spoken but what 〈◊〉 relates a thing scarce possible in a Drâ—â—utant if he was not distracted or else it is wilful Ignorance and desperate Wickedness in him to say Having nothing else that they could object c But he that is so impudent as not only to play the Hypocrite and Dissemble with God and utter Untruths unto him but publish it to the World as in his Book Call to Praâ— p. 141. I may not question but such a Man hath impudence enough to Lye against the Quakers and publish his Lyes to the World But God will judge the Lying Tongue Friendly Reader As for John Cheyney's Cavil against G. F. concerning the Soul it is already lately and soundly Answered by William Gibson in his Book entituled The Life of God which is the Light and Salvation of Men exalted which Answer take as followeth for thy further satisfaction It is judged meet to give thee the Advantage of seeing it here because when this Book comes to thy hand it may be thou may'st not have the opportunity of seeing his Concerning the Soul of Man JOhn Cheyney thou quarrellest at G. Fox's words where he saith something concerning the Soul in his Book entituled Great Mystery thou and some others of thy quarrelling Brethren would insinuate as tho' he did hold or affirm That the Soul is God but who reads his Treatise in the said Book upon that subject without Prejudice in the Fear and Love of God such may see that he distinguisheth plainly between Christ God and the Soul of Man see Great Mystery p. 91. where G. F. hath these words viz. The Soul being in the Death in Transgression so Man's spirit there is not sanctified And the Soul is in Death Again in the same Page after he hath uttered many words in answer to the Priest about the Soul he hath these words viz. So the living of the Soul and the Spirit sanctified that diligent hearkening is come to where the Counsel of God is stood in his Voice heard his Hand felt that the Soul is come up in that which comes from him from God that is Living and Immortal and gives a Creature its feeling and sensibleness through things and so the Covenant of God comes to be received wherein the Soul lives In the same Page he hath these words viz. Now where the Light is hated that of God within transgressed that doth pertain to the righteous Law of God and answers it there the spirit of Man is not sanctified and Man's understanding darkned the Higher Power is denied the Soul comes into Death transgressing of the Law is known the Witness buried which should guide the Mind whereby the Soul should live in the diligent Hearkening thereby comes Man to be defiled and his Spirit and Body and Mind whereby he glorifies Not God in his Body and Soul and Spirit Again in the same Page thus And every one that cometh into the World having a Light from Christ the Second Adam the Bishop of their Souls Christ the Power of God Again in the same Page thus So every Man that cometh in the World having a Light from Christ Jesus the Way out of the Fall the Second Adam Receiving the Light they receive their Redemption and Sanctification whereby their Spirits Bodies and Souls are sanctified J. C. Here G. F. speaks of the Soul of Man in several States and Conditions first in Death and Transgression It is very certain that G. F. doth not believe That God ever was or can be in Transgression And therefore it is certain that when he speaks of the Soul 's being in Transgression that therefore he doth not mean or intend that God's Essence or Being in any measure is in Transgression or ever can be to Again He speaks of the Living of the Soul and the Spirit Sanctified and saith That a ligent Hearkening is come to where the Counsel of God is stood in his Voice heard his Handâ—felt that the Soul comes up into where the Soul lives Note J. C. here he speaks of the Souls Living and of its Hearkening It is evident here That G. F. doth not mean â—nd or believe that God should hearken unto himself or that by not hearkening to himself that he should come into Transgression and Death or that by hearkening he should be Redeemed or Sanctified for G. F. 〈◊〉 that God is unchangeably 〈…〉 â—â—hout any Variation or Mutabilit◠〈…〉 G. F. speaks of receiving God's Counsel and standing in it by which the Soul comes to live Now it is certain that G. F. believes not that God could possibly go on act against his own Counsel and so come into Transgression and Death but it is 〈◊〉 that G. F. believes that when God's Counsel is not stood in by Many who was made a Living Soul that then he 〈◊〉 into Transgression and his Soul comes into Death and this was fulfilled in the first Adam who was made a Living Soul by his going out of the Counsel of God he became a Transgressor and his Soul was brought into Death thereby But as the Apostle saith The Second Adam has made Spirit which Second Adam is Christ the Promised Seed which bruiseth the Held of him that first led Man out of the Counsel of God whereby his Soul was brought into Death who believes in Him who lighteth every one that cometh into the World he raiseth the Soul out of Death being the Captain of its Salvation and the Bishop of it Again Soul being taken for Life as sometimes it is God is the Life of Lives or great Original Soul of Souls being that One Infinite Being by which all other Beings in the beginning of the Creation were brought forth and by whose Word Life and Power they eâ—ift and are upheld And G. F. speaking in answer to the Priests about the Soul saith God breathed into Man the Breath of Life and He became a living Soul for that which came out from God was the cause that Man became alive A Living Soul Upon the afore-cited words in Genesis G. F. p. 68. querieth of the Priest thus And is not this of God And God who bath all Souls in his Hand here and in this latter sense it doth appear that G. F. takes that word Soul for Life or that Breath by which Man lived or was made a living Soul and the Breath of Life by which Man lived or became a living Soul Is of God thus G. F. and the Quakers
searcheth all things even the deep things of God by which spirit they judge him and that wicked spirit that acts him and the works of both J. C. in pag. 18. concludes There is no Prayer made but there is Contradiction between the Heart and the Tongue he queries Dost thou perceive none If not thou art a graceless proud unhumbled Soul and altogether a Stranger to God and to right Prayer if yea then there is something of Hypocrisie in thy Prayer Reply No manvel if J. C. be distracted in Prayer for he is distracted about it and indeed about the most of the things of God he meddles with which are too high for him Doth he not conclude him to be a Stranger to God and to right Prayer a graceless proud unhumbled Soul who prays without Hypocrisie and that not to be right Prayer which hath not something of Hypocrisie in it or that there is no Prayer made wherein the Heart and Tongue perfectly go together This is in order to justifie his hypocritical Praying Dissembling with God and uttering Untruths to him that searcheth the Heart for he saith Far be it from me to say There is nothing of corrupt Nature within me defiling my Prayers What J. C. both before and here hath said of himself I believe that his Prayers are defiled and that there is Hypocrisie in them in this J. C. and R. H both agree But that Right Prayer is not without Hypocrisie and that he is a Stranger to God and right Prayer who Prays without Hypocrisie or that he is a graceless proud Soul who feels no Contradiction between his Heart and his Tongue but his Heart perfectly goes along with his Tongue in Prayer I deny and assert that right Prayer is without Hypocrisie and that he that Prays right his Heart and Tongue perfectly go together and he is not a proud unhumbled Soul neither a Stranger to God and right Prayer who perceives no contradiction between his Heart and his Tongue This is so evident a Truth that none who pray with the Spirit and with Understanding can deny John Cheyney tho' in contradiction to himself hath largely confessed hereunto in his Book of Prayer pag. 76. he saith The Spirit of God commands and moves to Prayer Pag. 7. All right Prayer must be in the Name of the Lord Jesus Christ which is not so to be understood as if the bare naming of Christ were enough Mark the bare naming of Christ is not enough for all right Prayer must be in the Name of the Lord Jesus Christ Now if so that God commands and moves to Prayer by his Spirit and that all right Prayer is in the Name of the Lord Jesus Christ as certain it is then all right Prayer is without Hypocrisie For God moveth not by his Spirit to Hypocrisie neither is there Hypocrisie in the Name of Christ Pag. 17. he saith Who knows how to pray to God farther than God shall teach and enable him Pag. 20. We could do nothing in Prayer without the special Help of God's Spirit Here again J. C. grants that none knows how to pray to God further than God teaches them and that nothing can be done in Prayer I suppose he means right Prayer without the special Help of God's Spirit Now it is plain that God doth not teach any to Pray Hypocritically and nothing being done in right Prayer without the special Help of God's Spirit there can be nothing of Hypocrisie in right Prayer for right Prayer is performed by the special Help of God's Spirit and the Spirit of of God is not the Author of Hypocrisie And since the Spirit of God cammands and moves to Prayer engaging both Man's Heart and Tongue therein it therefore follows that through the special Help of God's Spirit the Heart and Tongue of Man do perfectly go together â—n right Prayer otherwise the Prayer cannot be said to be right neither acceptable unto God But such as would pray without God's Spirit and would have others not to wait for the Motion of it like J. C. who tho' in his Book of Prayer he hath largely confessed to the Spirit of God in Prayer and affirmed That nothing can be done without the special help of God's Spirit in Prayer for the Spirit of God commands and moves to Prayer Yet in his Sermons of Hypocrisie pag. 218. he saith Do not tarry till the Spirit moves you to Prayer but when you have Time and Place convenient provoke your selves unto Prayer no doubt but such have Hypocrisie in their Prayers and are such as draw near to God with their Tongues but their Hearts are far from him Isa 29.13 Mat. 15.8 J. C. stiles himself a Gospel Minister and would by others be accounted a Minister of Christ yet he counsels People not to tarry till the Spirit moves them to Prayer c. But sure the like Counsel was never given by any faithful Minister of Christ for they knew they could not Pray as they ought but by the Spirit of God Rom. 8.26.27 And J. C. himself says pag. 20. of his Prayer Book Without the special help of God's Spirit we can do no Spiritual Work and right Prayer is sure a spiritual Work or Exercise and therefore not to be performed or done but with the Spirit of God Again p. 21. he saith When the Spirit of the Lord is from Man he can do nothing Prayer sticks in his Mouth like Choak-Cheese And yet this pretended Gospel-Minister would put People upon to Pray without the Spirit instead of tarrying as he saith till the Spirit moves them they must provoke themselves to Prayer This indeed is the Way to make them Hypocrites like himself and if I mistake him not he would not have People be sincere and throughout Christians Is it not then some Medium that he would bring them to Read him thy self and give judgment in his Sermons of Hypocrisie p. 225. he saith I had almost said Either be Sincere and Throughout Christians or keep where you are but by no means Do Neither Doth J. C. think it would hurt People to be sincere throughout Christians If not Why must they by no means do so Would he always keep them Learning and never have them come to the Knowledge of the Truth and be saved They who have Eyes to see with may see the end of this Ministry is to keep People in Sin though he may in words speak against it For tho' he hath not altogether said Either be sincere and throughout Christians or keep where you are yet he hath positively said By no means Do Neither And since to be sincere and throughout Christians is the one state hath he not said By no means be sincere and throughout Christians since he hath absolutely said By no means Do neither This I apprehend to be the drift of J. C's Advice that he would have Christians to have some corrupt Nature in them whilst they are here defiling their Prayers and not to be holy as God
am compelled to pray Hypocritically and Dissemble with God and utter Untruths unto him I shall not be able to cover or conceal my Wickedness from the World if I get to Heaven it must be by this Trade of Begging Here observe Dissembling with God and uttering Untruths unto him praying Hypocritically Luke-warm Prayers Distraction in Prayer Compelling himself to Pray that he might conceal his Wickedness from the World hath been J. C's Practice whereby it is apparent J. C. was not partaker of the Spirit of Holiness nor acted by it in such services but is of another spirit than the Spirit of God That the Quakers mortally hate J. C. is a false slander for the Light in which the Quakers have believed and walk hath taught them to have true Love to God and good Will to all Men but to oppose wicked spirits and deny all Wickedness Now that spirit whereby J. C. hath been acted in Dissembling with God and uttering Untruths unto him in Dissembling with God and uttering Untruths unto him in belying the Light and the Children of it together with their pure and undefiled Religion in Blaspheming the Light of Christ the Spirit of God calling it Diana Dagon a Dumb Idol comparing it to a Drunken Coash-man c. is a wicked spirit which together with J. C's Wickedness viz. his Lyes Slanders Hpocrisie Confusion Blasphemy c. The Fruits thereof the Light which shineth in Man hath shined in and through the Quakers the Children of Light plentifully to discover and â—lay them open to the Readers view which wicked Spirit together with its Fruits the Quakers are Enemies to and perfected ly hate And that many of J. C's own Way who agree with him in Opinion Hate him is no new thing for formerly the Lord set the Enemies of his People one against another and one helped to destroy another 2 Chron. 20.22 23. And the Lord is the same who for his Israel's sake is dashing the Potsherds of the Earth one against another and hath appeared and is appearing against this J. C. who hath hardened his Heart as Pharaoh and the Egyptians hardened their Hearts and set himself against the Light and Children of Light to close again the Flood which hath been divided by the mighty Power of God for the Children of Light to pass through and overwhelm J. C. that as he doth appear to many to be a Minister of Death he may likewise so appear to all People For the Truth 's sake that no Lye may rest upon it and for the sakes of the simple-hearted where this may come is this written that such who can see may see that John Cheyney's Tongue hath risen up in Judgment against Israel and God hath confounded him And what I have written I do do commend to every Man's Conscience in the sight of God And concerning this J. C. do thus conclude That in him these Scriptures are fulfilled Psal 7.15.16 He made a Pit and digged it and is fallen into the Ditch which he made his Mischief shall return upon his own Head And to God who is on our side who hath taken the Wicked in his own Craftiness and fettered him in his own Net my Soul ascribes all the Praise to whom be Glory for ever and ever A Salutation to Friends of the Men and Womens Meetings DEarly beloved Friends Brethren and Sisters with whom my Soul hath precious Unity in the Seed of God and pure Fellowship in the Life of Righteousness unto you all beloved of God and right well beloved of my Soul In the abiding Love of God am I your dear Brother in the Tribulation and Patience of the Lamb in Life drawn forth to write unto you and express something of that Life and Love that is upon my Heart in a living as well as fresh remembrance of you to whom I give the endeared and truly cordial Salutation of right brotherly Love My very Heart is knit to you and in Spirit I am present with you beholding your comely Order I am verily refreshed in your Life and abundantly comforted in abiding Love my Soul honours you in the Lord you Elders of Israel and for your Humility my spirit saith That you are worthy of Praise Your Condescention one unto another in the Truth and to the Truth in whomsoever it appeared your giving way hath been and is clear demonstration to me you have sought Truth 's Honour and not your own and therefore my Soul praises God let it be so for ever the greatest amongst you serving the least the younger submitting to the elder submitting also one unto another Indeed your remembrance hath lived much upon me since I parted with you and Breathings to the God of my Life have run thorough me for your preservation and increase in Unity with the Lord God and one another And my dearly beloved a consideration of your preferring one another in the Truth whereby the Truth hath gained the Preheminence hath even melted my Heart into tenderness of Spirit I have said Let it be so for ever Of a truth I can say to the Praise of God who hath honoured you The good Order of the Gospel is amongst you and where ever yet I have Travelled and what Methods soever I have veiwed in the midst of all I on your behalf have blessed God for his Wisdom wherewith he hath endowed you I hope finding you praise worthy without offence I may speak thus much of you I can bear my Reccord you having Wisdom have done justly and having Mercy obtained have Mercy shewed and that which is a Pearl indeed you have walked humbly with your God If I may live again to see you and in a measure of the fulness of the Gospel come unto you in the full performance of the same Duty let my Soul find you In the mean while dearly beloved in humility dwell and the Grace and Peace of God be daily multiplied upon you and let your fervent breathings and earning desires be for one another and in a tender healing Spirit be you always found and evermore live together in Love and for me your younger Brother who am outwardly separated from you and bound in Spirit for Travel in the labour of the Gospel Let your breathings in Life to the God of Life be That God will be pleased to give me a door of Utterance and prosper the work in his hand He hath called and yet is calling into to the Praise of his own Glory Dear Friends a long Epistle I intend not you are Elders ruling well to whom double honour for the Works sake I can freely give Having eased my Heart a little not questioning but to be rightly understood by you and in Life's Record more fully so be read by you My Life greets you all together and my Soul salutes you one by one with a Kiss of Love the God of Israel overshadow you with his Glory for ever My dear Companion salutes you all And by this you may know that in a few
often express it and truly so was he to me every Day every Way and in every Respect no Tongue nor Pen can relate the full of that Comfort and Joy we had in God and one in another Yet we find such hath been the Pleasure of God concerning them he hath loved to try them in the most near and dear Enjoyments that it might be manifest he was loved above all that no Gift or Gifts may be preferred above the Giver but that he may be all in all and over all who is and is to come God blessed for ever and ever And truly there hath been great Care and Watchfulness one over another and over our own Spirits to see that our Love though great was bounded and kept within its Compass the Truth being its Original the Alpha and Omega also Although it hath been the Pleasure of God to try me in the removal of so great a Blessing from me sure it is that I may be the more inward to him and have his Love always in my Remembrance who gives and takes away and in all Bless his Name My Soul travels that I may always follow his footsteps of Self-denial in all things that I may finish my Course in this World to the Glory of God as he did and have my part in that Mansion of Glory with him eternal in the Heavens though it be my Lot to stay for a time in this World of Troubles yet I have hope in Immortality and Eternal Blessedness when time in this World shall be no more My dear Husband was a Man very Laborious in his time though he had several long weak Fits of Feavers and Agues yet when a little well regarded the Lord's Business above all Besides his Travels about home and here in England he travelled through Scotland and twice in Holland and Germany since we were Married and had great Services for the Lord in many Places as I doubt not but Accounts may be given and through Mercy for two Years last had his Health well and is gathered to his place like a Shock of Corn in its due Season and rests with the Lord for ever I have sometimes considered the suddenness and manner of his Removal although it was ordered by Providence that I was far remote at that Time in in the Service of Truth which was with his free Consent and Approbation being brought on my Way by him so far as Talk-Hill in Staffordshire where we parted in great Love and Sweetness the Glory of the Lord resting upon our Spirits in which Breathings ascended up to the Lord for each other And though I saw not his going away yet have seen in what he went that it was full of Zeal and Fervency in the Love of God and Life of Righteousness So in pure Submission to the Will of God I conclude this short but true Relation of my Worthy Dear Husband whose Name and Memorial is blessed and will live and be of a sweet Savour in the Hearts of the Righteous through Ages I am Truths Friend and a well-wisher to the Souls of all People Eleanor Haydock Penketh the 15th of the 3d Month 1697. Ashort Testimony to the Lord's Kindness and to the Life Ministry Sufferings Services and Death of our Worthy Friend Roger Haydock who departed this Life the 11th Day of the 3d Month 1696. WE are deeply affected and bowed in Soul in a sense of the Lord 's free Love and Goodness unto us in looking upon and visiting us in the time of our Uncleanness when we were unworthy of the least of his Mercies Oh! then was his Arm revealed for our Help Redemption and Salvation a Work of so great Kindness as ought ever to be had in Remembrance in that neither we noâ— any of the Children of Men can sufficiently set forth so great a Favour the Concern is of great Moment the only begotten Son of God laid down his Life to effect it We Travel in our several Measures that we and all the Lord 's gathered People may ever dwell in a Worthiness that we may be in the Lords hand Instruments to work the appointed work of our Day And under this tender sense we found our Hearts open to give the Salutation of unseigned Love to all our dear Friends where these may come with this brotherly Exhortation That you may all stir up one another to the Duty you owe unto the Lord that as a Church and People of our God's peculiar gathering you and we may be presented to him without Spot or Wrinkle And dear Brethren the dealings of the Lord with his Instruments and faithful Servants and the removing of them from us hath considerable Weight upon our Spirits and raiseth a holy Desire in us that we and you may not abate but encrease our Zeal Diligence and Labour that the Lords good Work begun may not stop but go on and prosper and that the great Lord of the Harvest may never want faithful Workmen Next hereunto O Reader We recommend to thy perusal this following Account of our said Friend Roger Haydock First As touching the manner of his Life we having several of us known and conversed with him from the time of his Convincement can say of it His Conversation was without Covetousness of Self-denial he was a good Pattern in Habit Plain in Meats and Drinks very Temperate and in his Actions and Concerns Careful that what he did might answer the better Part in all and justly offend none Walking he would often say he preferred before Talking and laboured that others might walk as they had Christ for an Example Secondly As to his Ministry though we need say little because it was known in most places where these may come We have from good Experience this Account to give That he preached the Gospel freely both in this and other Nations always possessed with a Care that Life and Vertue might put him forth and manifest him to his Auditors very weighty and deep things did often drop from his Mouth and although he had sometimes sharp Arrows to shoot at Babylon and against all Hypocrites and Double-Minded yet many times a Living Sweet Consolating Stream was conveyed through him to water the tender Plants and very often a Morsel to the Poor and Needy Very tender and kind to his Fellow-Labourers yea to the least Child that from a right Concern opened a Mouth for the Lord and for the sakes of such did many times sit whole Meetings through in Silence very kind in that Respect to Strangers yea such was the Care of this good Man that Friends might truly reap benefit in their Meetings that in many of our Week-day Meetings he used to wait amongst us in Silence that none might too much depend upon Words or be surfeited through the multitude thereof And when at any time he had upon him a Concern to visit Churches in remote Parts his manner was to lay before and wait for the Concurrence of this our Meeting which many times occasioned
Thus But rather strengthen our selves in the Lord that we may according to our Membership be more capable to serve the Lord and his People as we had him and others for Examples it was a Portion of the Lord's Spirit that made him a Worthy in Israel that hath made me at this time thus Testifie of him so that I can say He being Dead yet speaketh God by his goodness grant to raise many such helps in Israel to the dignifying of his Name which this our dear deceased Friend sought Since I have known Truth above twenty Years and observed the Conversation of such as were in Christ before me I have beheld few if any more remote from self-Praise or Exaltation I believe while in this Tabernacle I shall not forget his Advice to me the first opportunity I had with him after I was convinced by him viz. Not to Attribute any thing to Man but give God the Glory and with what Reverence and Gravity these things were expressed his Humility at that time reached the better part in me and I hope will remain as a Nail fastned in a sure Place My Prayer to the Lord is that he may raise many such Ministers in his now Israel to the furtherance of his Name Truth and Holiness and that many may be willing as he was to spend and be spent to go to and fro that Knowledge may be increased What I have already testified of this my Father and Friend for in his Bonds he begat me hath eased my Spirit I loved him dearly in his Life and no less at his Death whose Savour reached to People of all sorts and his Death lamented I was several times with him in his Sickness and was concerned in Mind to go down a little before his Departure so that with many good Friends I was present and saw him put off this outward Tabernacle though to our Sorrow yet in a full perswasion that he died the Death of the Righteous prepared for that future felicity which a numberless Number is following after which neither Hell nor Death Beast or false Prophet shall be able to hinder Amen Amen Although I could further Amplify and Enlarge this my Testimony yet shall desist with Real and Ardent Desires to the Lord that he may order our Conversation aright and that all that names the Name of Jesus may depart from Iniquity and be sanctified to reign with the Righteous World without End Christopher Winn. Penkâ—th near Warrington in Lancashire the 3d of the 3d Month 1697. William Ellis's Testimony concerning dear Friend Roger Haydock I Have much in my Heart concerning our dear Friend Roger Haydock tho' I cannot express to the full what I know of him but however I shall say the less not questioning but that there are Testimonies in the Hearts of many Friends to his Worth and Faithfulness and Service in the Blessed and Holy Truth wherein we have believed and felt the Blessed Effects of our Faith to the great Comfort and Consolation of our Souls It was about twenty one Years the last 3d Month since I was Convinced of the Blessed Truth And though I have since that day had many Instructors in Christ yet I have not many Fathers for in Christ Jesus was I begotten by him through the Gospel and the Operation of the Holy Spirit which did Effectually open a door of Entrance in my Heart as it opened a door of Utterance unto him It was at a Meeting at Bradley near Skipton in Yorkshire where he declared the Day of God which was broken forth in this Age in great Splendor to Enlighten Mankind he spoke many things which reached the States of many in that day alluding from the State of Israel of old who passed through the Sea and saw the wondrous Works which the Lord wrought for their Deliverance yet some forgot him and made themselves Idols of their Jewels and Earings saying These be thy Gods O Israel who brought thee out of the Land of Egypt and then sat down to Eat and Drink and rose to Play With many more precious Words wherewith he did sound forth the glorious Gospel I was abundantly satisfied that day with what I had felt and heard So I took heed unto the Word in my Heart unto which I had been directed by him and it grew and Increased and my Faith Increased and I became according to my small Measure obedient thereunto and my Soul was in love with the Truth and the Followers thereof especially with him who had been the Instrument of publishing the same to me his Feet was indeed beautiful unto me and I could say in Truth Blessed be him that Cometh in the Name of the Lord I saw his Zeal and was sensible of the Sincerity of his Heart and Endeavours in his Life-time to promote to his utmost the great Name of God And when through Providence I came to be more Intimately Acquainted with him I was confirmed in my sense of him and his Love to God and Zeal for the Truth and have in many private Opportunities with him been abundantly satisfied in the sweet Society and Fellowship we have injoyed together and I am fully perswaded that his Root was in the Truth and that he was sensible that the Root bore him and he grew therein and laboured much to bring People to be established upon the Sure Rock Christ Jesus the Root of Life upon which the True Church is Built And I know his Labours in that Respect was great and the Lord saw his Faithfulness and poured out upon him the Spirit of Wisdom and Understanding and of a sound Mind to promote Good Discipline and Comely Order in his Church that She might be like the True Church of Old which John spoke of under the Similitude of A Woman who was clothed with the Sun and had the Moon under her Feet Which Glory did far Excel the Glory that attended Solomon in his best State for the sake of which the Queen of the South came far and was overcome with the Sight thereof Thus did he Labour and Travel in his Day spending himself that the Church might be adorned with the Comely Attire and Ornaments of the Holy Spirit and that the Name of the Lord Jesus her Head might spread to the Ends of the Earth Blessed be the great God of Heaven and Earth that raised up him and many more who could hold the Sword and be Expert in the War like the Cant. 3.7 8. Threescore Valiant Men of Israel who kept the Bed of Solomon Or like the Judges 20.15 16. Men of Benjamin who could Sling to an Hairs Breadth and not miss The Lord Raise up more such Faithful Labourers in his Vineyard and give them Wisdom and Zeal to Train up those who shall believe in the Truth in sound Discipline as well as in Word and Doctrine that he may Restore unto the Churc◠〈◊〉 1.26 Judges as at the First and 〈◊〉 as at the Beginning that Men may call them The City of
which is kindled against you because of these things and you perish not in his hot Displeasure And Friends You who are Called and Chosen and Faithful for a Remnant of such I know there is amongst you who keep your Garments unspotted of the World answering the Pure in all Dwell you in the Feeling of the weighty Life which hath seasoned you that in it you may Read me Feel me and Embrace me in the Arm of my Father's Love even as you are Read Felt and Embraced that tho' outwardly separated yet in that Inseparable Bond of Unity in which we are One and our place One even with the Son to behold his Glory we may lie down together and Solace our selves together in the Overcoming of our Father's Love whose Care is over us and whose Love flows towards us To whom be Glory for Ever and Ever Your Brother in true Love R. Haydock Lancaster-Castle the 2d of the 8th Month 1674. THE SKIRMISHER CONFOUNDED Being a Collection of several Passages taken out of some Books of John Cheyney's who stiles himself The Author of the Skirmish upon Quakerism In which is the Baseness Wickedness Contradictions Lyes Hypocrisie Unbelief Confusion and Blasphemy of that Skirmishing Priest Discovered and He Laid Open to the View of every one who shall read with a Single Eye Collected by a Friend to the Truth and a Well-wisher to the Souls of all People ROGER HAYDOCK Isa 54.17 No Weapon that is formed against thee shall prosper and every Tongue that shall rise up in judgment against thee thou shalt condemn This is the Heritage of the Servants of the Lord and their Righteousness is of me saith the Lord. Psalm 7.15 He made a Pit and digged it and is fallen into the Ditch which he made London Printed and Sold by T. Sowle 1699. THE SKIRMISHER Confounded c. JOhn Cheyney in his Book entituled A Call to Prayer c. in the Preface to the Reader saith thus I would be loth to fasten any Error upon any Person which I can perceive him not to hold and I would Candidly Interpret all Words so far as I can with Conscience and Justice to the Truth The next Page of the same Preface to the Reader thus I do not know 〈◊〉 by their Opinion of the Light within Devils and Damned Souls may be saved In his Book entituled The Skirmish c. p. 4. Penn 's Position doth justifie the Irish Rebellion the French Massacre the Marian Persecution the Ten Persecutions of the Primitive Churches the Gun-Powder Treason P. 13. of the same Book I would be glad to make the best I can of your Position Auimadversion Can there be greater Baseness than under pretence of Candor to be thus Absurd Is it not great wickedness in this Skirmisher to make such Ungodly Consequences of so Harmless a Position and yet afterwards say He would be glad to make the best he can of it Here followeth the PRIEST's Contradictions John Cheyney The Skirmisher against OR fighting John Cheyney Himself Assertion 1. CAll to Prayer p. 117. I dar◠say let the Light within alone and say nothing to it and it shall never move any Quaker or ungodly Soul to pray till Death or the Flames of Hell shall awake them 2. P. 119. A Quaker or any other may live a secure Flesh-pleasing Life all his Days and never have one effectual Motion to Prayer if he be ruled by the Light within 3. P. 119. The Quakers could hardly devise a more sin-pleasing Doctrine than never to pray without a Motion from the Light within 4. P. 109. Their grand Principle of the Light within is not consistent with Right Prayer 5. P. 76. The Spirit of God is a Spirit of Supplication he commands and moves to Prayer p. 20. The Spirit doth intercede in us we could do nothing without the special Help of God's Spirit without the special Help of God's Spirit we can do no Spiritual Work 6. Quakerism Subverted p. 18. The Light within tells me there is a God 7. Skirmish p. 13. The Light within which should be Man's Guide takes part with the Flesh and Satan against God 8. Call to Pray p. 111. They are no People of Prayer and make no use of Prayer P. 101. A Prayerless People of a Prayerless Religion Prayerless Pretenders to Holiness 9. Skirmish p. 13. If the Scriptures go farewell God and Christ and Heaven and all Law and Rule 10. O Lord thou know'st that I am what I profess my self to be Thy Servant sincere and upright John Cheyney Contradiction 1. CAll to Prayer p. 119. For though the Light may move yet it will be but a weak Motion and the Motion of the Darkness or Fleshly Part will overcome 2. P. 119. That which should Move them to Prayer the Light within is over-powered by the Darkness 3. P. 118. I 'll tell thee what keeps me from Prayer when my Conscience and the Light within moves me to Prayer my Sloth and Laziness my Deadness want of Life and Hunger and Spirit in my Soul 4. P. 3 4. Right Prayer is not meer Words nor a meer Work of Nature nor bare Humane Industry and Striving without the special Grace and Concurrence of God 5. P. 115. Their great Assertion that Prayer is not to be done without the Motion of the Light within some have confessed they never Prayed without the Motion from the Spirit of God P. 98. You need no Motion of the Spirit to tell you when to feed and cloath your Bodies but you need a Motion from the Spirit to put you upon to dress and feed your Souls 6. P. 101. Trust not that blind deceitful Guide within you the Light within you left it lead you into Everlasting Darkness 7. P. 61. When God and Conscience have called to this Duty a lazy carcarnal self 〈…〉 Mind has kept us away 8. P. 114. If Report be true when they do Pray for I have heard and believe that sometimes they Pray 9. P. 62. Must a hungry Man need a Scripture to tell him how often he must Eat No more doth a hungry Soul need a Scripture to tell him how often he must Pray Besides these Contradictions out of his Books I shall add one more out of two Manuscripts written with his own Hand which I think he will not deny and I am certain in this he hath no cause to blame the Printer as sometime he did but if he denies it I can both produce and prove it 10. Given forth by a weak Believing Christian and Disobedient Servant of Christ John Cheyney I shall here set down some of his Confessions to the Light Grace and Spirit of God and then discover his Lyes c. Pag. 120. THE Light then prevails Habitually and there is a kind of continual Exercise of the Soul by Internal Prayer Pag. 122. The Soul and Heart of Prayer is within seen to God Pag. 4. There is a great deal of Praying outwardly which is not right and sincere Praying outwardly Balling
and Canting Pag. 90. He that turneth away his Ear from hearing the Law even his Prayer shall be Abomination R. H. queries Is not the Law Light And where is this Law and the Ear also that should be turned to it witho◠〈…〉 or within Man Pag. 7. All right Prayer must be in the Name of the Lord Jesus Christ The bare naming of Christ is not enough Pag. 12. Whilst there is Grace in the Soul there will be a Root of Prayer Pag. 28. What is God to me if I have no Life or Spirit in me wherewith to seek him and apply my self to him R. H. queries Whether all Men have not need of Life on Spirit in them as well as Priest Cheyney wherewith to seek God and apply themselves to God And if so Why â—oes this Priest tâ—l the People The Quakers mangle God and Christ and cut them in pieces because they say God hath given People a Measure of Life Light and Spirit wherewith they may seek after and apply themselves to God Pag. 20. The Spirit doth interoede in us by a kind of a continual restless Motion and Importunity towards God Pag. 57. Wicked Poople were it not to still their Consciences they would not pray that little which they do R. H. queries Doth not the Light in the Conscience move them to Pray Is it as a drunken negligent Coach-Man Or rather Doth it not do its Office truly and is clear of the Priest's wicked Charge Hear him farther Pag. 84. This is the Language and Practice of Worldliness Stand by God stand by Christ and Eternal Life cense Conscience away Spirit let my Soul sink R. H. Sure God and Christ the Light and Spirit are not to be blamed since they are bidden Stand by and are turned from before the Soul can sink But what a Strait doth this bring the Skirmisher into who in his Book entituled Quakerism Subverted p. 31. tells us If the Light be blameless or in effect he saith for his words admit of the Consequence If there be any thing in Man though of God and not of Man that is Innocent and Blameless before God then the Quakers are in the Right and all that he hath writ as also his Skirmish must fall to the Ground and he must acknowledge himself to be utterly defeated and to have lost the Day Now that there is something of God in Man he also grants p. 28. of the same Book in these words There is something of God something of Satan Flesh and Spirit Light and Darkness Now to the Conscience of the 〈…〉 in the sight of God do I leave it 〈…〉 Judgment may be given betwixt the Skirmisher and the Quakers whether the Skirmisher be not utterly Routed Hear him farther Call to Prayer p. 103. So dangerous is it to resist the Spirit of the Lord and to imprison the Truth in Vnrighteousness and to go about to salve an Vlcerous Conscience by false Cures they may serve for a while but the day is at Hand when God will search in all R. H. The Priest grants the Spirit of the Lord may be resisted and the Truth in Unrighteousness imprisoned Now I query Whether this Resisting the Spirit and Imprisoning the Truth be within Man or without him Pag. 41. A Gracious Man saith the Priest may silently Worship God and Speak to God and so as none may hear but himself and yet be most fervent in Prayer And yet this Priest scoffingly saith p. 101 102. How many dumb and silent Meetings have you without either Prayer or Preaching P. 19. Men may give us Words and Forms to use but they cannot give us the Spirit of Grace and Supplication P. 17. 〈…〉 â—ows how to pray to God further than God shall teach and enable him R. H. querieth Whether it be not safe for all then to feel God's Spirit with them to teach them in Prayer Hear what the Priest himself saith Pag. 21. When the Spirit of the Lord is from Man he can do nothing Prayer sticks in his Mouth like Choak-Cheese Thus much by the Priest in Honour of the Light Grace and Spirit of God in Prayer I shall here add some of the Priest's Lyes and so proceed Pag. 122. The Quakers declare themselves to be Hypocrites Pag. 50. Christ answers Get you gone away with you to wit the five foolish Virgins ye are Workers of Iniquity I never knew you Pag. 140. I am passed through the Red-Sea Egypt is behind me I am escaped out of Sodom I am from under the Bondage of spiritual Pharaoh the Devil who once was my Father and Master Skirmish p. 2. The Quakers Profâ— build their Religion and Hopes upon the Scriptures Call to Prayer p. 15. God hears wicked Men in their distress and grants them many good things in answer to their Prayers Answ This contradicteth the Scripture If I said David regard Iniquity in my Heart the Lord will not hear me Psalm 66.18 Besides these there are many other forged Lyes in his Books which for Brevity sake I pass by at this time He tells the World p. 115. That he hath discoursed with some Quakers who have confessed to him that they never Pray without a Motion from God's Spirit R. H. queries Why should they pray without God's Spirit J. C. himself confesseth elsewhere as I have hinted before That nothing can be done in Prayer without the special Help of God's Spirit yet he blames the Quakers for refusing to Pray without the Spirit move them But had they not better do so than go before or without the Spirit and have their Prayer stick in their Mouths like Choak-Cheese as said John Cheyney before But in this I have reason to suspect Forgery That 〈◊〉 Quakers should confess to him They in many Years have not had a Motion to Prayer Now if his Tale be true let him give us the Names of such if it be false let his Iniquity stop his Mouth and let Shame come over him But to proceed Call to Prayer p. 42. God is a Spirit and he requires Spirit in every Performance and nothing but the Life and Spirit and Zeal and Fervency in all our Duties and Services will please him Mal. 1. and last Cursed be the Deceiver which hath a Male in his Flock and voweth and sacrificeth unto God a corrupt thing R. H. Well enough for the Downfal of this Skirmisher The Priest confesseth he hath a Male asserts God requireth nothing else neither will he be pleased with any thing else but Spirit Life Zeal and Fervency He grants That the Deceiver who hath a Male may sacrifice to God a corrupt thing to wit A Cold Distracted Lifeless Dead Prayer and such Prayers Offerings and Sacrifices are Abomination to God no more pleasing to him than was the cutting off of a Dog's Neck or offering Swines Blood and unto such Deceivers the Curse is due Now how near this Priest 〈◊〉 Prayers are thereunto read in his own Words published to the World which need little Animadversion
noted down and kept since the Dispute in which I have been as short as I well could 〈◊〉 and that the Reader may also perceive the Dis-ingenuity of J. C. who would have his Reader to believe That many Quakers spoke besides R. H. and yet on the other side none spoke but J. B. and that until J. B. gave him leave to manage an Argument he was silent which was utterly false Now I shall examine J. C's Account of this Dispute which is as followeth That J. B. giving him leave to manage an Argument for proof That the Spirit by which the Quakers are acted is not the Spirit of God that 〈◊〉 upon J. B. to prove Reply John Cheyney hath clipped the Charge the Charge was and that which lay upon J. B. to prove That the Light and Spirit the Quakers are led by and direct People to is the Spirit of Antichrist This being the Charge iâ— appears by John Cheyney's account That John Barber had not proved his Charge but it lay upon him to prove The wrong J. C. hath done us 〈◊〉 this◠〈◊〉 clipping the Charge But to bring them 〈◊〉 near together The Quakers are led by the same 〈◊〉 by which they are acted and to the same Spirit by which they are led they direct People This then says J. C. as stating J. B's Charge The Quakers are not acted by the Spirit of God then not led by the Spirit of God then direct not People to the Spirit of God therefore that the Spirit the Quakers are acted by led by direct People to is the Spirit of Antichrist This then lay upon J. B. to prove viz. his Charge and having stated it upon J. B. at the latter end of the Dispute and since laid it in writing before him that his Charge was false and in a few lines cleared the People called Quakers of it I shall at present acquiesce in J. C's grant that it lay upon J. B. to prove and shall now examine what he hath done in proof thereof J. C. tells his Reader He propounded an Argument That the Quakers deny the faithful Ministers of Jesus Christ and his Holy Ordinances and so we not acted by the Spirit of God Answ If propounding of an Argument were proof that the Argument propounded were true then J. C. hath done something in telling his Reader He propounded an Argument to prove the Quakers are not acted by the Spirit of God But if propounding of an Argument be not proof as sure it is not that the Argument propounded is true then J. C. hath done nothing as to proof in telling his Reader He propounded an Argument to prove the Quakers are not acted by the Spirit of God so his Argument ends in nothing But J. C. tells his Reader He proved the Ministers whom the Quakers do utterly condemn and separate from to be Christ's Faithful Ministers by this Argument They teach sound Doctrine lead Godly Lives are duly Called to the Ministry have their Call and Commission from Christ and he Seals and Confirms their Ministry with the Conversion of Souls And if his Reader will but take his word for it he says He made evident all these Particulars and took off all their Cavils and Exceptions And yet further if his word may but find credit with his Reader In the judgment of all equal Hearers and Standers-by the Quakers were clearly overthrown Answ If J. C's telling his Reader â—e proof that those Ministers the Quakers separate from are Christ's Faithful Ministers or if his saying be made evident All those particulars which was his Argument That they teach sound Doctrine lead godly Lives were duly called to the Ministry had their Call and Commission from Christ and that he seals their Ministry with the Conversion of Souls were full proof or any proof at all against the Quakers then in the judgment of J. C. his Reader might acquiesce That the Quakers were overthrown But if J. C's telling his Reader He proved and saying He made all those Particulars evident not shewing in the least wherein be neither full proof nor any proof at all as sure it is not then in the Eye of any Impartial Reader the Quakers cannot be overthrown This Reader is the substance of what J. C. hath done to prove what lay upon J. B. to prove First He propounded an Argument Secondly he saith He proved it Thirdly he saith He made evident all those Particulars But what wise Man will believe him Lastly he saith The Quakers were overthrown if thou canst credit him but whether thou canst or no this is all the proof thou must have for he quickly tells thee He will forbear to make farther mention of this Dispute Well what J. C. confessed lay upon John Barber to prove lies still upon J. B. to prove for all that J. C. hath either said or done and not only upon J. B. but upon J. C. and who by thinking to taâ—e the Thorn out of J. B's Heeâ— hath struck one full as deep in his own His proprounded Argument signifies nothing but to discover his Folly his saying He proved it is a meet Say-so and no more for he proved no more than J. B. proved and that was just nothing at all With Conversion of Souls of which J. C. boasts so much it was not confirmed that Day That J. C. was Victor and the Quakers Overthrown but on the contrary Truth that Day gaining and the Priests â—ing and that none of the meanest or weakest of their Hearers in the account of some of them in whom God's Witness being reached that Day since separated from them and joyned to the Quakers through believing in the Light wherein Fellowship with God is and with the Brethren also Therefore J. C. is a Lyâ— who says The Quakers were overthrown And although upon the fore recited Particulars I was not principally engaged with J. C. but rather my Friend Alexander Lawrence the matter being taken from J. B. and me yet I give Testimony 〈◊〉 my Testimony is true having the Evidence of God's Spirit with me That J. C. thereby to assume a Glory of a Conquest to himself hath Lyed wickedly in saying He proved his Argument and that the Quakers were clearly overthrown Therefore let his Iniquity stop his Mouth and shame come over him and let his Lyes perish that Truth may stand over his Head and take place with all Impartial Readers Since J. C. hath at least charged us to be revolted from the true Ministers and I may also say At the most but charged us for he hath proved no such thing I might write pretty largely to manifest That neither he nor any of his Brethren the Priests from whom we have turned away are faithful Ministers of Jesus Christ neither are truly called to the Ministry nor have Commission from Christ But because it is only the Examination of this Account concerning that Dispute at Croton I here intend and finding no Tract of his further to prove that he and his
Brethren are faithful Ministers of Christ duly Called and Commissionated by Christ but his bare Word which is of little esteem with many and it is nothing though it be so for I know not how that Man who plays the Hypocrite and Dissembles with God and utters Untruth to the Searcher of Hearts should have esteem with good Men for if he will lye to God he will lye to Men and what Credit shall be given to his Word And because several Brethren whose Books are extant in the World in which these things are thoroughly treated of have fully proved these things which may be seen by such as read them I say many have written and coplous and plentiful are the Books in which sufficient proof of these things may be seen by any who reads them with a single Eye yet I refer the Reader who is desirous to be informed to a Book entituled The Priests and Professors Principles and also to William Gibson's Book entituled The Life of God which is the Light and Salvation of men exalted which is an Answer to six of John Cheney's Books in which whoever reads if simple-hearted may be rightly informed and in pag. 10. of the said W. G's Book may read J. C's own Testimony concerning his Church which agrees not with his fore-cited Boast of their Ministry and Doctrine but contradicts himself So I shall leave the Dispute at Croton that I may examine J. C's Relation of the Dispute at Arley in which I expect to find him the same J. C. to boast of Victory though he fled the Stage which if so it prove it will something resemble the running Bird which when got home crows aloud upon his own Dunghil J. C. in p. 1. of his Warning to Souls saith For sundry Reasons he is purposed to make a brief Relation of his Dispute with the Quakers at Arley Reply In this the Man is well nigh as good as his word for of that whole confused Treatise which contains twenty five pages I think there is not above four pages if collected of what was spoken at that Dispute and of those four pages so far as I perceive not thrice four lines of what J. C. says I spoke and of those lines I think not six lines of what I spoke which Lines had they been left out then had J. C. according to his word made a brief Relation of his Dispute For his Relation made together with his whole Treatise I find not the recital of a word spoken by any Quaker in that Dispute but R. H. So that if the thing intended was a Relation of a Dispute with the Quakers herein J. C. hath come short for Roger Haydock is not Quakers but if it was as I rather think though mist in the making intended to be a Relation of his Dispute to tell his Reader what he said and what he did and what a Conquest he made and how the Quakers were overthrown though indeed it was quite otherwise much like his Account of the afore-mentioned Dispute at Croton in which there is not one word of what any Quaker said then J. C. hath on that hand over-reached especially in telling his Reader that R. H. spoke what he spoke not nay what he ever abhorred to think viz. That God did no where command us to walk according to the Scripture pag. 21. of his Warning c. To which at present I say It is a Lye and a wicked Slander and concerning it I shall say something more hereafter This is one Character of his Relation and no question but if he have that Impudence as to make R. H. speak as he would have him he will have Confidence enough to speak what he pleases for himself in composing his Relation in order to perswade his Reader R. H. was confuted and silenced and the Quakers were overthrown But if his Reader be a Wise Man he will not judge of things before the time Lyes are said to be light and often spread far and False Reports often get the start and go before and sometimes that side hath cryed Victory which hath run away Fools have believed them but Wise Men have waited to know the Truth who got the Day and to such the first Report to be false and the Folly of them that believe it was made manifest in due time But to come to J. C's Relation in order to examine it so soon as I can reach thereunto it is my purpose but by the way John Cheyney mentions a Paper which I came to him with the day after the Dispute at Croton which he saith was written to prevent a Brother of a Godly Acquaintance who was inclining to Quakerism in which Paper he saith He had charged their Religion to be Antichristian and Damnable Reply This Paper J. C. mentions was shewed me by a Friend several Days before the Dispute at Croton or that I knew to have a Dispute with J. B. who for the sake of the Young Man then lately Convinced desired me to write something in answer to it I perused it and found the Charges very wicked but there was no Name subscribed to it so I gave it to the Friend again looking upon it to be no other than a Reproachful Libel The Friend told me He believed J. C. writ it and was very urgent upon the Young Man's account to have it answered Whereupon I said Let some Friend shew it to J. C. and if he own it and will subscribe his Name to it something then may be done So the Friend took it with him After the Dispute at Croton I went for Lancashire and in Warrington met providentially with some Friends who were about to go to J. C. with the Paper they desired me to go along with them at whose request I took the Paper and went with them shewed it to J. C. who read it over afterwards owned that he writ it but would not subscribe it neither give it me again but alledged the Paper was neither Ours nor His but God's and Providence having ordered it to his Hand again he would keep it I told him Whereas he had wronged us if he would acknowledge it we would pass it by He desired after some debate about the Paper which he had in his hand to read it over again he read it that the standers by did hear it afterward he said to one of his Friends who stood by him He thought there was nothing in it but what might be stood by his Friend assented to what he said I told J. C. It was very unlike a Minister of Christ to give forth a Paper as a Minister and afterward desire to read it over to see whether he could stand by it or not he ought to have considered that before he gave it forth Yet still he refused to subscribe until some of our Friends would first draw him a Copy of it If he would have subscribed it after the second perufal of it I promised he should have a Copy of it before
believe and also that this Breath of Life cannot Transgress or be in Transgression though the Motions of it in the Soul may be quenched and it grieved for so it is when Man hearkens unto and takes Counsel at the Serpent who first drew Man from God's Counsel and thus as it is written God is grieved with the Wicked every day His displeasure or grief is because he would have Man to hearken to his Voice and be saved but Man will not as God complained of old They rejected all my Counsel and would none of my Reproof In this latter sense taking the Soul for that Life or Breath by which Man lived or became a living Soul this as G. F. saith p. 68. is infinite which he must needs intend as his own words do import being taken in their own proper and gennine sense It appears in G. F's Controversie with the Priests about the Soul that he takes up the word Soul and speaks of it under three Considerations 1st The Soul of Man in Transgression in Death 2dly The Soul of Man in the Restoration in Life and 3dly He speaks of the word Soul as being that Breath of Life which came forth from God by which Man Lived or Became a Living Soul which Breath and Life is of God's Being and Infinite as I said before Thus it appears that the Spirit of God the Light of Christ within the Breath of Life and the Quakers Religion and G. F. are all clear from J. C's wicked Charge and J. C. is a Lyar whose Work hath been both by Disputation and Writing to prove that the Quakers assert Man's Soul to be God and so charge God to be guilty of Sin because Man's Soul Sins therefore God Sins This Wicked Blasphemous Assertion and Consequence he would have fastened upon the Quakers which we do utterly deny But J. C. hath failed in his purpose and the Quakers are clear of holding Man's Soul to he God and J. C's false Charge That the Quakers Religion is against God's Spirit remains unproved and like to remain unproved What J. C. hath done is this He hath brought one wicked Charge to prove another by and both alike are utterly false And what J. C. intended Vnjustly to have fastened upon the Quakers is it not in a great measure justly fallen upon his own Head For whereas he says The Quakers do plainly hold Man's Soul to be God therefore when Man 's Soul Sins God Sins is it not clearly evident that J. C. plainly holds the Light within the Light of Christ in Man wherewith Christ lighteth every Man that cometh into the World John 1.9 something of God in Man Light and Spirit to be Man's Soul to have a hand in Sin to be guilty as being himself and in Hell to be a felf-tormenting Light I shall give some Quotations out of his Book entituled Quakerism Subverted and query a little thereupon and so leave it to the Impartial Reader to judge Pag. 21. of the said Book J. C. saith Every Man hath a Light within him and so we say that Jesus Christ is the true Light which enlightneth every Man that cometh into the World John 1.9 P. 28. Hath not every Man a Light within him Mark given him to be his Guide his Monitor P. 27 28. In every Man there is something of God and something of Satan Flesh and Spirit Light and Darkness Upon which I query If something of God in opposition to Satan Spirit and Light in opposition to the Flesh and Darkness is it not the Spirit of God who is a Spirit John 4.24 Is it not Light of God who is Light and in whom is no Darkness at all 1 John 1.5 J. C. says it is something of God Spirit and Light is it not then the Light and Spirit of God according to Scripture 1 Cor. 12.7 Pag. 34 35. he says If the Light within never did err nor can err it is the same to say the Soul of Man never did err nor can err P. 35. When we say The Light smiteth or convinceth excuseth or reproveth it 's but the same to say The Soul doth return upon it self Upon which I query Whether that which Convinceth and Reproveth the Soul for Sin be not the Spirit of Truth which reproves the World of Sin According to John 16.8 10. And if the Spirit of Truth which Convinceth and Reproveth the Soul for Sin then whether he doth not plainly hold the Spirit of Truth to be Man's Soul Pag. 34. he saith The Light hath a Hand in all Thought-sins inward Heart-Sins Tongue-sins and Life-sins Pag. 36. Every Sin I commit the Light within is guilty as being myself Pag. 34. The Light within in Hell is turned to a self tormenting Light Is it not clearly evident from these Quotations out of his Book that J. C. hath asserted the Light within the Light of Christ in Man wherewith according to John 1.7 Christ lighteth every Man that cometh into the World something of God in Man Light and Spirit to be Man's Soul To have a Hand in Sin to be himself guilty of Sin and in Hell to be a self-tormenting Light And is not this Blasphemy And is not J. C. a Blasphemer And if J. C's Religion hold forth and maintain this Doctrine Is not J. C's Religion guilty of Blasphemy And if J. C's Religion be guilty of Blasphemy Is not J. C's Religion against God's Spirit And hath not J. C made a Pit and digged it for the Quakers and their Religion and is not J. C. and his Religion fallen into the Ditch which he made Let the Reader judge The next thing in J. C's Relation that here I shall take notice of is in pag. 6. he saith The Quakers do utterly make void the Scriptures this saith he was prov'd at the Dispute Reply Was ever any pretended Gospel-Minister more void of shame than is this J. C. to publish such Lyes to the World What 's more false than to assert we make the Scriptures void And What 's less true than to say he proved it O wicked Man of slander in the one and shameless impudent Liar in the other I do believe I might have the Testimonies of some hundreds of People who were Auditors at the said Dispute that J. C's Relation is false if I needed thereunto But it may be he thinks the Title of a Minister of Christ will give him Credit where his Lyes are broached with People to believe what he says is true especially against R. H. by him stiled a Sect-Master R. H. expects to fare no better from him than the Disciples of Christ did from his Generation the Scribes Pharisees and Hypocrites who called them pestilent Fellows Seducers Enemies to the Law and Scriptures all which J. C. is guilty of against the Quakers as the Generation he is of was against the Disciples so it is evident he is in the foot-steps of that Generation J. C. might have remembred the Truth was by his fore-Fathers in whose steps he
Answ We truly and dearly own the Scriptures or Book called the Bible but the words contained in that Book are not all of equal Authority one with another See thy own Testimony concerning the Scriptures or Bible which is as followeth The Scriptures are not God Christ nor the Spirit but Laws and Doctrines Histories and Reports given by the Inspiration of God I say The words which God spake unto Man saying Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thine Heart and thy Neighbour as thy self Were and Are of greater Authority than those words which as History or Relation declare of the Wars and Battels of the Jews and other such Historical Matters and of greater Authority to and among Christians than those words that related to Circumcision the Blood of Bulls Goats and Rams and the Ashes of an Heifer c. these being Shadows and to pass away And the words of Christ who said to his Disciples I am the Vine ye are the Branches as the Branches cannot bring forth Fruit except they abide in the Vine no more can ye except ye abide in me And without me ye can do nothing My Flesh is Meat indeed and my Blood is Drink indeed Except ye eat the Flesh of the Son of Man and drink his Blood ye have no Life in you These words are of greater Authority than the Relation or Histories of the Apostles outward Travel by Sea or Land and they are of greater Authority than those words that speak of Paul's Cloak that he left at Troas mentioned in 2 Tim. 4.13 and all other such Historical Matters The People called Quakers do prefer and esteem the Book called the Bible or Holy Scriptures above any outward Writing or Book extant upon the Earth because of the Verity and Plenty of deep heavenly Sayings uttered by God unto Moses and the Prophets through the several Ages of the World and particularly and eminently through the heavenly Man Christ Jesus who was anointed with the Oyl of Gladness above his Fellows and filled with the Spirit without measure Nevertheless we do affirm that the Spirit of God in this Age hath moved several of us to write Books which have been Instrumental in his Hand for Good unto many with respect to their Immortal Souls God the Holy One changeth not neither is he to be limited and all our Books and Writings are not of equal Authority one with another some treat of our inward Experience of the Work of God in which are contained words that do direct Man and Woman to the Manifestation of the Spirit of God which is given them to profit withal to the Grace of God which brings Salvation to the Light wherewith Christ lighteth every one that comes into the World Some others of our Books do treat of our Sufferings and outward Exercises c. which though all of them be true yet some are of greater weight than others And Destruction comes upon People because they do not believe in and obey the Light Grace and Spirit of God which he hath given them to lead them out of Sin into all Truth Those who read our Writings without Prejudice may receive Good thereby as by Instruments which God makes use of and such who do so they will return the Glory to God as we do And those who read our Books in Envy and Malice the Murdering Spirit blinds their Minds and God doth condemn such And for J. C's saying He proved by Arguments the Scriptures rightly to be called by this Title The word of God Here the Reader hath no more but his say so which I deny to be any proof at all neither did he prove it but in this also is a Lyar. J. C. saith The Quakers acknowledge the Scriptures to be the Words of God by their own Confession every Scripture Word is God's Word Reply This is a dark Consequence J. C. hath drawn Though we own God's Words in the Scriptures to be his Words yet this doth not follow that we own every word in the Scripture to be God's Word For in the Scriptures there are words of the Serpent who is called the Devil and Satan words of wicked Men as well as God's words and words of good Men And hath not J. Cheyney here manifested his Falshood Let the Reader judge J. C. further saith R. H. in the Dispute denyed all Scripture to be given by Inspiration of God and would read the words 2 Tim. 3.16 All Scripture given by Inspiration of God is profitable leaving out Is c. Reply J. C. himself grants the word is not to be expressed in the Original Text but that the Original Text is read thus All Scripture given by Inspiration of God c. the word is not being expressed why then should R. H. be blamed for reading it according to the Original Text which was before the English Copy or Translation Yet there is extant some old English Bibles in which this Scripture is thus read All Scripture given by Inspiration of God is profitable c. And the word is and also the Conjunction and about which J. C. quarrels so much are left out But it seems J. C. will rather skirmish with his own Shadow than have nothing to do For what he grants to be true R. H. must if he can reach it be stigmatized as some Blasphemer But this way of skirmishing will never hurt R. H. nor stain his Reputation amongst good Men. R. H. acknowledged and doth acknowledge All Scripture given by Inspiration of God to be profitable c. But J. C. is Angry with him because he will not say All Scripture is given by Inspiration of God though he grants the word is not to be expressed in the Original Text therefore R. H's Reading is true And that all Scripture which is as much as to say All Writing is given by Inspiration of God I think J. C. himself If considerate will not assert for All Writing contains or comprehends every Writing that is written not only in the Scriptures of Truth the Books of the Prophets Evangelists the Epistles of the Apostles and other Writings of Truth extant but all other Writings extant of what matter or subject soever they treat If J. Chayney grants this that all Writing viz. all Books of what nature or kind soever that are written printed and published to the World are not given by Inspiration of God as sure he will then he grants all Scripture is not given by Inspiration of God for All Scripture comprehends all Writing and all Writing includes all Books that are written and all Books that are written are not profitable to the Man of God for Doctrine c. Then he must needs grant the Apostles Meaning was according to the Original Text with which the old English Bibles agree to wit All Scripture given by Inspiration of God is profitable c. This sense the Original Text will bear without any wrong to the Truth or the Apostle who spoke it forth To this the Apostle
This is so evident a Truth that whosoever hath an Eye to see with may run and read And for his saying We wickedly oppose the Spirit and his Holy Laws I say He wickedly Belyes and Slanders us for we own the Spirit in its place and the Scriptures in their place not opposing them And whereas he saith He quickly silenced me It is a Lye like the rest and he that published it is a Lyar whom having rebuked for it I leave it J. C. page 18. saith As to Matters of Practice he did before all the Assembly charge and prove them to be such as Paul describes Rom. 16.17 18. Men that serve not our Lord Jesus Christ but their own Belly and by good Words and fair Speeches deceive the Hearts of the Simple Reply That J. C. did charge the Quakers to be such as Paul describes c. I grant it being the second of the seven Charges in his fore-cited Paper of Charge that was disputed upon that day but that J. C. proved the Quakers to be such I deny and at the Dispute did sufficiently clear the People called Quakers from that wicked Slander and impious Change wherewith J. C. most impudently Charged them But J. C. relates the Argument whereby he proved as he vainly imagines the Charge against us in that we are Apostates and Turn-coats from the true Faith This is his Argument Reply That we are Apostates and Turn-coats from the true Faith is a Charge as false as the other which he intended this to have been an Argument to prove and this hath been J. C's accustomed way in essaying to prove his Charges against the Quakers viz. One false Charge by another Charge no more true than the former The true Faith is the Gift of God this we are not turned from it is delivered unto us as it was delivered unto the Saints it was their Victory and is our Victory even our Faith our Faith stands in God's Power we live by it The Just shall live by Faith Hab. 2.4 This is the true Faith by which the Just lives we are turned from such as have not the One Faith Ephes 4.5 For all Men have not Faith 2 Thess 3.2 And from such who having in some things the Form of Godliness but deny the Power thereof according as the Apostle exhorted some in his day 2 Tim. 3.5 And we are justified by the Lord in so doing So that J. C's Argument is a false wicked Charge we are not turned from the true Faith but from such as have it not But J. C. says He did with sober compassionate Zeal and a warm affected Heart make Challenge to R. H. to give any one Reason for their Apostacy Reply Sober Compassionate Zeal c. J. C. might well have omitted to mention who rather appeared sometimes that day like a Stage-Player than a sober Disputant I might say like one acting the Fool 's part in a Play at times he rather behaved himself than like a moderate Man such words as these in an airy spirit he vented forth I 'll be with thee anon Thou hadst better have kept that word in Thou hast now put a Weapon into my Hand I never thought of with these and the like Expressions stirring up some People to Laughter and putting them into an Expectation he would do some great Matter But alas Their foolish vain Hopes with his fond Conceit were both frustrated for when he had room to speak he acted but like a Fool with his wooden Sword made a Vapour but effected nothing save Shame to himself Now as to his Challenging me to give any one Reason for our Apostacy I answer No wise Man can expect that I should give any one Reason for our Apostacy who are not Apostatized but have the Evidence of God's Spirit that we have the Faith delivered unto us that was delivered unto the Saints for that were to give a Reason for what we are not Nay I am perswaded none but a Novice or a Fool would require it But this is not the first Distraction besides his being Distracted in Prayer J. C. hath run into J. C. saith R. H could give no Reason at all nor had any mind to argue it but shifted it off That the Quakers Religion Ministry Worship and Churches were opposite to theirs And if his Reader will take his word for it he saith He hath given R. H. and his Fellows an Argument at Croton which could not be answered or gainsaid by any of them then nor can they ever answer it Reply That the Quakers Religion Ministry Worship and Church are opposite to J. C's Religion Ministry Worship and Church J. C. hath asserted and if he do believe it what needs further Proof But would not J. C. have been shifting from the Charge and broaching new Matter He would sometimes have been begging the Question to have wrested me from the Charge but keeping him to the Point not giving him leave to Catechise me having put him upon the Proof of his Charge I kept him to it not suffering him to start new Arguments to lead from it he failed in Proof and came off with Infamy As to the Argument at Croton it was there gain-said and answered therefore J. C. is a Lyar who said It could not be answered or gain-said the Invalidity of which Argument may be seen in the former part of this Treatise where I have run it through J. C. saith He repeated the same Argument at Arley Dispute but that I declined the Arguing of it and was utterly unable to maintain my own Religion and to take off the Charge That the Quakers are Belly-gods and Flesh-servers Reply I declined not the Argument for the Validity of it but because it led from the Charge J. C. had undertaken to prove viz. That the Quakers were Belly-gods c. And it being gain said and answered already I shall pass it by only note to the Reader that J. C. said at Croton You own'd the Doctrine which was according to the Ten Commandments Lord's Prayer and Creed To which I replied The Doctrine of the Commandments which is To love God with all the Heart with all the Soul Might and Strength is owned by us and the Doctrine of the Lord's Prayer which is That the Will of God may be done in Earth as it is in Heaven we also own But that you who preach this for Doctrine live up to it we deny and therefore are turned from you And as to the Creed we believe in God and in Christ To this J. C. replied not I suppose that in all his Notes he had nothing writ in Defence of his Cause in this point and perhaps being accustomed to lean upon his Crutch he would not venture to go without it But however it was whether he would not or could not I shall leave it with the Impartial Reader to judge Yet sure I am his Silence was so far a Consent to my Assertion that all unbiassed Hearers could do no less