order to the Establishment of it i. e. he would not have failed to have told us who were to make up that Supreme Court and where it was to Sit. For these things were necessary to the end of it Shall we then say that Christ was not yet resolved where it should be Or that it was not fit to let it be known so soon But why not when he made Promises to the Apostles of being with them to the end of the World There can be no pretence why he should not then declare where the Supreme and standing Court of his Church was to be which was in all Ages to give Rules to the rest of the Church and to Determine all Points of Faith which came before them But did the Apostles Determine this matter after Christ's Ascension If they had done it we must have yielded because they had an Infallible Spirit But we find nothing like it in all their Writings They mention Heresies often and damnable ones they saw creeping into the Church they lamented the Schisms and Divisions in the Churches of their own Planting and used frequent and vehement Exhortations to Peace and Unity But why not a word of the Infallible Judge of Controversies all this while S. Paul wrote to the Church of Rome it self and even there mentions Dissensions that were among them as well as in any other Church What could not he tell them they were to make Rules and give Judgment for the whole Church Did S. Paul envy this Privilege to S. Peter's See and therefore took no notice of it That I suppose will not be said of him though he once withstood him to the face But how happen the rest of the Apostles not to do it Nay how came S. Peter himself writing for the benefit of the whole Church in a Catholic Epistle never to give the least intimation concerning it These things make it appear incredible to me that Christ or his Apostles appointed any such thing especially when the Apostles in their infallible Writings give such Directions to particular Christians as they do to prove all things and to hold fast that which is good to try the Spirits whether they be of God oâ— not What had they to do to try the Spirits or to prove any thing themselves if the Judgment of the matters of Faith were so given to the Church that others without farther enquiry are bound to submit to its Sentence And if Christ and his Apostles knew nothing of such an Infallible Judge we have no Reason to hearken to any who after their time should pretend to it For the Promise of Infallibility must be made by him and such a Commission can be derived only from the immediate Authority of Christ himself But the Defender saith The Holy Scripture assures us that the Church is the Foundation and Pillar of Truth I confess I cannot be assured from hence that the Church hath such an Authority as is here pleaded for suppose it be understood of the whole Church For how was it possible the Church at that time should be the Foundation and Pillar of Truth when the Apostles had the Infallible Spirit and were to guide and direct the whole Church It seems therefore far more probable to me that those words relate to Timothy and not to the Church by a very common Elleipsis viz. how he ought to behave himself in the Church of God which is the House of the living God as a Pillar and Support of Truth and to that purpose this whole Epistle was written to him as appears by the beginning of it wherein he is charged not to give heed to Fables and to take care that no false Doctrine were taught at Ephesus Now saith the Apostle If I come not shortly yet I have written this Epistle that thou maist know how to behave thy self in the Church which is the House of God as a Pillar and Support of Truâ—h What can be more natural and easie than this Sense And that there is no Novelty in it appears from hence that Gregory Nyssen expresly delivers this to be the meaning and many others of the Fathers apply the same Phrases to the great Men of the Church S. Basil useth the very same Expressions concerning Musonius S. Chrysosrom calls the Apostles the immovable Pillars of the true Faith. Theodoret saith concerning S. Peter and S. Iohn That they were the Towers of Godliness and the Pillars of Truth â—regory Nazianzen calls S. Basil The Ground of Faith and the Rule of Truth And elsewhere The Pillar and Ground of the Church which Titles he gives to another Bishop at that time And so it appears in the Greek Catena mentioned by Heinsius S. Basil read these words or understood them so when he saith The Apostles were the Pillars of the New Jerusalem as it is said The Pillar and Ground of the Church I forbear more since these are sufficient to shew that they understood this place as relating to Timothy and not to the Church As to what he brings of Scriptures not being of private Iâ—terpretation it is so remote from the Sense and Scope of the Place which relates wholy to Divine Inspiration that this is a great Instance of that private Interpretation which ought to be avoided viz. of minding only the Words without regard to the Sense of Scripture It was said in the Papers Thaâ— Christ left his Power to his Church even to forgive Sins in Heaven and left his Spirit with them which they exercised after the Resurrection It was farther answered That all this makes nothing for the Roman-Catholic Church not then in being unless she were Heir-General to the Apostles that the ordinary Power of the Keys relates not to this matter that the Promise of the Spirit made to the Apostles implied many Gifts not pretended to by this Heir-General as the Gift of Tongues Spirit of Discerning Prophecie miraculous Cures and Punish ments If no more be understood of Divine Assistance that is promised as much to keep Men from Sin as Error but the Church of Rome pretends only to the latter and yet it is granted too that it may err in matters of great Consequence to the Peace of the Christian World as in the Deposing Doctrine This is the Substance of the Answer let us now see what they Reply The force of what the Desender saith is this That though the Roman Church were not then in being yet as soon as it was it was a part of the Catholic Church to which the Promises were made and therefore the Roman-Catholic Church being the One Church of Christ these Promises must have their effect in her This is all I can make of it though it cost me more pains to lay their things together with an appeâ—â—ance of strength than to give an Answer to them The Roman Church it seems had not the Promises made to it but as soon as it was a Church she was a Part of the
the Scriptures for his Infallible Rule Now to judge the Sense of the Primitive Church about this Point there can be no method more proper or convincing than to consider what Course the Christian Church did take in the Controversies then started which were great and considerable And if it had been then believed that Christ had left such an infallible Authority in the Church to have put an end to them it had been no more possible to have avoided the mention of it than if a great Cause in Law were to be decided among us that neither Party should ever take notice of the Iudges in Westminster-Hall There were two very great Controversies in the Primitive Church which continued a long time under different Names and we are now to observe what method the Catholic Writers of the Church took for establishing the true Faith. And these were concerning the Humanity and the Divinity of Christ. That concerning the Humanity of Christ begun very early for S. Iohn mentions those who denied that Iesus was come in the Flesh i. e. that he really took our Nature upon him And this Heresie did spread very much after the Apostles times Ignatius made it a great part of the business of his Epistles to warn the Churches he wrote to and to arm them against it And what way doth he take to do it Doth he ever tell them of the danger of using their own Judgment or of not relying on the Authority of the Church in this matter I cannot find one passage tending that way in all his Epistles But instead thereof he appeals to the Words of our Saviour in the Evangelist Touch me and see if I be a Body or a Spirit his words are an incorporeal Daemon but it was usual with the ancient Fathers to repeat the Sense of Places and not the very Words And a little after he saith That these Hereticks were not perswaded neither by the Prophets nor by the Law nor by the Gospel And he advises the Church of Smyrna to attend to the Prophets but especially to the Gospel in which the Passion and Resurrection of Christ are declared Irenaeus disputes warmly and frequently against this Heresie and he appeals to the Testimony of the Apostles in theiâ— Writings especially to the Gospels of S. Iohn and S. â—aâ—thew but not omitting the other Gospels and the Epistles of S. Paul and S. Iohn And he calls the Scriptures The immoveable Rule of Truth the Foundation and Pillar of our Faith and saith That they contain the whole Will of God. It is tâ—ue he makes use of Tradition in the Church to those who rejected the Scriptures and he finds fault with those who took words and pieces of Scripture to serve their turn but he directs to the right use of it and doth not seem to question the sufficiency thereof for the satisfaction of humble and teacâ—able minds in all the points of Faith which were then controverted Tertullian undertakes the same Cause in several Books and several ways One is by shewing that the Opinion of the Hereticks was novel not being consistent with the Doctrine delivered by the Apostles as appeared by the unanimous consent of the Apostolical Churches which did all believe Christ had a true and real Body And this way he made use of because those Hereticks either rejected or interpolated or perverted the Books of Scripture But this way of Prescription look'd like Out-Lawing of Hereticks and never suffering them to come to a fair Trial. Therefore in his other Books he goes upon three substantial Grounds 1. That the Books of Scripture do certainly deliver the Doctrine of the Christian Church concerning Christs having a true Body 2. That these Books of Scripture were not counterfeit nor corrupted and adulterated but preserved genuine and sincere in the Apostolical Churches 3. That the sense which the Hereticks put upon the Words of Scripture was forced and unreasonable but the sense of the Church was true and natural So that Tertullian did conclude that there was no way to end this Controversie but by finding out the true sense of Scripture But the Author of the Defence brings in Tertullian as representing all trial of Doctrine by Scripture as good for nothing but to turn the Brain or the Stomach and that the issue is either uncertain or none I grant Tertullian hath those words but for Truths sake I wish he had not left out others viz. That those Hereticks do not receive some Scriptures and those they do receive they add and alter as they please And what saith he can the most skilful in Scriptures do with those who will defend or deny what they think fit With such indeed he saith it is to little purpose to dispute out of Scriptures And no doubt he was in the right for the Rule must be allow'd on both sides or else there can be nothing but a wrangling about it The first thing then here was to settle the Rule and for this the Testimony of the Apostolical Churches was of great use But to imagine that Tertullian rejected all trial of Doctrines by Scripture is to make him to write to little purpose afterwards when he combates with all sorts of Hereticks out of Scripture as appears by his Books against Marcion Praxeas Hermogenes and others And Tertullian himself saith That if we bring Hereticks only to Scripture they cannot stand Not because they went only upon Reason but in the end of the same Treatise he saith They made use of Scriptures too but such as were to be confuted by other Scriptures And therefore he makes the Hereticks to decline as much as in them lay the Light of the Scriptures which he would never have charged on others if he thought himself that Controversies could not be ended by them Clemens Alexandrinus speaking of the same Heresies makes the Controversie to consist chiefly about the Scriptures whether they were to be embraced and followed or not He saith None of the Heresies among Christians had so darken'd the Truth but that those who would might find it and the way he advises to is a diligent search of the Scriptures wherein the Demonstration of our Faith doth consist and by which as by a certain Criterion we are to judge of the truth and falshood of opinions Which he there insists upon at large He speaks indeed of the Advantage of the Church above Heresies both as to Antiquity and Unity but he never makes the Iudgment of the Church to be the Rule of Faith as he doth the Scriptures In the Dialogue against the Marcionists supposed to be Origen's this Controversie is briefly handled the point is brought to the Sense of Scripture as in that place the Word was made Flesh from which and other places the Catholic argues the Truth of Christ's humane Nature especially from Christ's appealing to the sense of his Disciples about the Truth of his Body after the Resurrection
A VINDICATION OF THE ANSWER TO SOME Late Papers Concerning the UNITY and AUTHORITY OF THE Catholick Church AND THE REFORMATION OF THE CHURCH of ENGLAND LONDON Printed for Richard Chismell at the Rose and Crown in S. Paul's Church-Yard MDCLXXXVII A VINDICATION of the ANSWER to Some late Papers c. IT was so tempting a piece of Honour to appear as the Champion of the Royal Papers that I rather wonder that no more than that these have shewed themselves to the World under so inviting a Character Which seems to have betray'd them into more than usual security presuming I suppose that they are to be looked on as a sort of Heralds in Controversis whose bearing the Royal Arms will keep them from being touched themselves though they bid defiance to others But where Truth lies at stake every one hath a Right to put in for it and whose Game soever any Person plays those ought to carry it who have the best Cards to shew I mean that in Debates of this Nature and Consequence other considerations ought to be so far laid aside that the strongest Reason should prevail But lest I be again thought to have a mind to flourish before I offer to pass as the Champion speaks in his proper Language I shall apply my self to the Matter before us Only taking notice that I am now glad to enter the Lists upon even Ground For although I thought I behaved my self with due Respect and Decency before yet I perceive the Measure of those things is so nice and arbitrary that it is very hard to escape Censures where the Distance is so great But those who live in the Country may mean and intend as well to their Prince as those who live at Court though they do not make so fine Legs nor are of so pleasing an Address The plain truth is Controversie is quite another thing from Courtship and Poetry It is like a Trial at Law which ought to depend on Evidence and Proof though the King himself be concerned in it And as we must give Honour to whom Honour so Truth to whom Truth is due and this without Respect of Persons it being a Case long since decided That Truth is greater than the King. If I thought there were no such thing in the World as true Religion and that the Priests of all Religions are alike I might have been as nimble a Convert and as early a Defender of the Royal Papers as any one of these Champions For why should not one who believes no Religion declare for any But since I do verily believe not only that there is such a thing as true Religion but that it is only to be found in the Books of Holy Scripture I have Reason to enquire after the best means of understanding the sense of those Books and thereby if it may be to put an end to the Controversies of Christendom This was the noble design of the two Royal Papers which are written with far greater strenght and spirit and closeness than these which are published in Defence of them But notwithstanding all their fair appearance I could not be convinced by the Reason contained in them and much less by the Defence of them Which I endeavour'd to represent as far as I could judge with Modesty and Civility But if I have offended in any thing against the strict Rules of good Manners I hope I may be the more easily forgiven since their Casuists allow involuntary faults to be in their own nature venial The Method proposed by the Paper for ending Controversies was by finding out a Principle for doing it as visible as that the Scripture is in Print This I could noâ— but extreamly approve as a very satisfactory method of proceeding and the Consequence I said would be that all Men of sense would soon give over disputing for none who dare to believe what they see can call that in Question The Author of the Râ—ply saith I mistook the meaning of the words which he saith was this That what ever Motives render it visible that a Book in Print is Scripture i. e. the Word of God the same or other Motives are as powerful to render this other truth as visible that none can be that Church but that which is called the Roman-Catholick Church The Desender saith The Church is more visible than Scripture because the Scripture is seen by the Church for which he brings S. Augustin 's Authority And if by saying that the Scripture is in Print be understood a tking out of Question then he denies it to be visible that the Scripture is in Print because many Men do call Scripture in question at this day and to question whether the Book in print be Scripture is manifestly to question whether Scripture be in print The Words of the Royal Paper are plain but these Interpretations of them so forced and unnatural that there needs no other confutation of them but to compare their confused Comment with the Text. It is as visible as that the Scripture is in Print that is it is a thing evident to sense for so it is that the Book called the Scripture or the Bible is in Print Now what is it which is affirmed in the Paper to be thus evident viz. this Proposition That none can be that one Church which Christ has here on Earth but that which is called the Roman Catholick Church But if it be certain as I doubt not to make it appear that what is called the Roman-Catholick Church is but a Part of that One Church which Christ has here on Earth then the plain result of this Proposition must be that it is a thing evident to sense that a Part is the Whole Now this looked so oddly that these Gentlemen were resolved that this should not be the sense of the plain words and therefore have endeavoured to put another sense if it may be called so upon them And if their Church can but interpret Scripture at this rate we are in a hopeful way to have a speedy and happy end of Controversies As to the Consequence I drew from hence that if Controversies could be determined by a Principle as visible as that Scripture is in Print all Men of sense would soon give over disputing for none who dare believe what they see would call that in question One saith The sooner the hetter So say I too upon good grounds But what would then become of the Noble Science of Controversie The other saith That Catholicks and Protestants are both Men of sense and yet they dispute about the Scripture which is in Print And what then This is to shew that the Scriptures being in Print is one thing and the Authority of the Scripture is another The one is a common object of sense in which all are agreed the other is liable to many Disputes and therefore could not be meant in the Papers But they have a notable Cavil against Mens believing what they
All his Demonstrations are out of Scripture and by the meer force of them he overthrows this Heresie And it was nothing but the clear Evidence of Scripture without any Infallible Judgment or Assistance of the Guides of the Church which did at last suppress this Heresie For no Council was called about it but as the Authority of the New Testament prevailed so this Heresie declined and by degrees vanished out of the Christian World. And it is observable That the greatest and worst of Heresies were supprest while no other Authority was made use of against them but that of the holy Scriptures So Theodoret takes notice That before his time these Heresies by Divine Grace were extinct So that the Scriptures were then found an effectual means for putting an end to some of the most dangerous Heresies which ever were in the Christian Church The other great Controversie of the first Age was about the Divinity of Christ which begun with the Ebionites and Cerinthians and was continued down by succession as appears by Theodoret's account of Heresies in his second Book Those who first embraced this Heresie rejected the whole New Testament and received only the Nazarene Gospel But after a while Artemon had the boldness to assert that the Apostles deliver'd the same Doctrine in their Writings and then the Controversie was reduced to the Sense of Scripture Paulus Samosatenus follow'd Artemon as Photinus afterwards follow'd him But Theodoret again observes That all those Heresies against the Divinity of Christ were in his time so extinct that not so much as any remainders of them were left but saith he The true Doctrines of the Gospels prevail and spread themselves over the World. And we may find what course was taken for putting an end to this Controversie by the management of it with Paulus Samosatenus In the fragment of an Epistle of Dionysius of Alexandria we read the Testimonies of Scripture which he produced against him and more at large in the Epistle of the Six Bishops to him who makes use of the very same Places of Scripture which are most applied to that purpose to this day To which they only add That this had been the Doctrine of the Christian Church from the beginning and all Catholic Churches agreed in it But here is no such thing thought of as Iâ—sallibility in the Guides of the Church for there is great difference between the consent of the Christian Church as a means to find out the Sense of Scripture and the Authority of Church Guides declaring the Sense by vertue of an Insallible Assistance the one is but a Moral Argument and the other is a Foundation of Faith. Theodoret further observes That there was another set of Heresies distinct from the two former in the Primitive Church which related chiefly to matters of Discipline and Manners and most of these he saith were so far destroyed tâ—at there were none thâ—n left who were Followers of Nicolas Nepos or Patroclus and very few Novatians or Montanists or Quartodecemans so that Truth had prevailâ—d over the World and the Heresies were either quite rooted out or only some dry and withered Branches remained of them in remote and obscure Places Which being affirmed by a Person of so much Judgment and Learning as Theodoret was gives us a plain and evident Proof that the Sense of Scripture may be so fully clear'd without an Infallible Church as to be effectual for putting an end to Controversies And altho we own a great Esteem and Reverence for the Four General Councils yet we cannot but observe that Controversies were so far from being ended by them that they broke out more violently after them As the Arian Controversy after the Council of Nice the Nestorian after that at Ephâ—sus and these Gentlemen believe that Heresy continues still in the East the Eutychian Controversy gave greater Disturbance after the Council of Chalcedâ—n than before and continued so to do for many Ages Which is an Argument that the Infallibility of Councils or of the Guides of the Church was not a Doctrine then received in the Church But I proceed to shew what means were used in the Primitive Church for putting an end to Controversies Of which we have a remarkable Instance in the Dispute about Rebaptizing Hereticks This was managed between St. Cyprian and other Bishops of Africa and Asia on one side and the Bishop of Rome on the other He pleaded Custom and Tradition the other That Custom without Truth was but ancient Error and that the matter ought to be examined by Scripture and many Reasons they bring from thence because Christ said in his Gospel I am Truth and the only way to prevent Errors is to have recourse to the Head and Fountain of Divine Tradition i. e. to the Holy Scriptures which St. Cyprian calls the Evangelical and Apostolical Tradition So that we have the clear Opinion of the African Bishops that this Controversy ought to be decided by Scripture But here the Replier saith That Right stood for the Bishops of Rome and a General Council determined the Point and the whole Church came to an Acquiescence If the Council was in the Right the Bishop of Rome was not if St. Cyprian represent his Opinion truly and he saith he did it in his own Words which are Si quis a quacunque Haeresi venerit ad nos nihil innovetur nisi quod Traditum est Now no Council ever determin'd so That whatsoever the Heresy was none should â—e Rebaptized For the Councils of Arles and Nice both disallow'd the Baptism of some Hereticks and therefore if the Council put an end to the Controversy it was by deciding against the Bishop of Rome as well as St. Cyprian The Donatists afterwards made use of St. Cyprians Authority in this Controversy which gave occasion to St. Augustin to deliver that noted Sentence concerning Scripture and Fathers and Councils viz That anonical Scripture is to be preferr'd before any other Writings for they are to be believed without Examination but the Writings of Bishops are to be examined and corrected by other Bishops and Councils if they see Cause and lesser Councils by greater and the greatest Councils by such as come after them when Truth comes to be more fully diservered It is hardly possible for a Man to speak plainer against a standâ—ng infallible Judg in Controversies than St. Augustin doth in these Words wherein he neither limits his Words to matters of Fact nor to Manners but he speaks generally as to the Authority of the Guides of the Church compared with Scripture Which are enter'd in the Authentick Body of the Canon Law approved and corrected at Rome only that part which relates to the correcting of Councils is left out But to make amends Gâ—atian in another place hath with admirable Ingenuity put the Popes Decretal Epistles among the Canâ—nical Scriptures and quotes St. Augustin for it too But the Roman Correctors were ashamed of so
gross a Forgery and confess St. Augustin never thought of the Decretal Epistles but of the Canonical Scriptures but yet they 〈◊〉 itle stand for good Canon Law. In the Controversy about the Church with the Donatists St. Augustin's constant appeal is to the Scripâ—â— and he sets aside not only particular Doctors hut the preteâ—â— to Miracles and the Definitions of Councils He doth not therefore appeal to Scripture because â—hey 〈◊〉 about the Church but because he looked on the Testimonies of Scripture as clear enough to decide the point as he often declares And he calls the plain Testimonies of Scripture the support and strength of their Cause If he then thought that Scripture alone could put an end to such a Controversy as that no doubt he thought so as to any other But we need not mention his thoughts for he declares as much whether it be about Christ or his Church or any matter of Faith he makes Scripture so far the Rule that he denouncess Anathema against those who deliver any other Doctrine than what is contained in them Nor doth he direct to any Church Authority to manifest the Sense of Scripture but leaves all Mankind to judg of it and even the Donatists themselves whom he opposed The same way he takes with Maximinus the Arian He desires all other Authorities may be laid aside and only those of Scripture and Reason used To what purpose unless he thought the Scripture sufficient to end the Controversy Against Faustus the Manichean he saith The Excellency of the Canonical Scripture is such as to be placed in a Threne far above all other Writings to which every faithful and pious Mind ought to submit All other Writings are to be tried by them but there is no doubt to be made of whatever we find in them The same method he uses with the Pâ—lagians an advises them to yeild to the Authority of Scripture which can neither deceive nor be deceived This Controversy saith he requires a Judg les Christ judg let us hear him speak Let the Apostle judg with him for Christ speaks in his Apostle And in another place Let St. John sit judg between us And in general he saith We ought to Acquiesce in the Authority of Scripture and when any Controversy arises it ought to be quietly ended by Proofs brought from thence But St. Augustin is the Man whom the Defender produces against me because against the Manicheans he saith he believed the Scripture for the sake of the Church and to bring any proof out of Scripture against the Church does weaken that Authority upon which he believed the Scripture and so he could believe neither The meaning wherof is this St. Augustin was reduced from being a Manichean to the Catholick Church by many Arguments and by the Authority of the Church delivering the Books of Scripture he embraced the Gospel which before he did not Now saith he You would make use of this Gospel to prove Manichaeus an Apostle I can by no means yield to this way Why so Do not you believe it to be Gospel Yes saith he but the same reason which moved me to embrace this Gospel moved me to reject Manichaeus and therefore I have no reason to allow a Testimony out of it for Manichaeus Not that St. Augustine seared any proof that could be brought from thence but he begins with general Topicks as Tertullian did against the Hereticks of his time before he came to close with them And such was this which he here produces For in case Manichaeus his Name had been in the Gospel as an Apostle of Christs appointing this Argument of St. Augustine had not been sufficient For there might be sufficient reason from the Churches Authority to embrace the Gospel and yet if the Scripture had been plain he ought to have believed Manichaeus his Apostleship though the Church disowned it As I will prove by an undeniable Instance Suppose a Jewish Proselyte to have argued just after the same manner against Jesus being the Messias the Apostles go about to prove that he was so by the Testimony of the Prophets No saith he I can allow no such Argument because the same Authority of the Jewish Church which perswaded me to believe the Prophets doth likewise perswade me not to believe Jesus to be the Messias If it be so far from holding in this case neither can it in the other For it proceeds upon a very feeble Supposition that no Church can deliver a Book for Canonical but it must judg aright concerning all things relating to it Which unavoidably makes the Jewish Church infallible at the same time it condemned Christ as a Deceiver But this was only a witty velitation in St. Augustine used by Rhetoricians before he entered into the Merits of the Cause And it is very hard when such sayings shall at every turn be quoted against his more mature and well weighed judgment What noise is there made in the world with that one saying of his I should not believe the Gospel unless the Authority os the Cathelick Church moved me And the Defender brings it to prove the Church more visible than Scripture Whereas he means no more by it but that the authority of the Church was greater to him than that of Manichaeus For he had been swayed by his authority to reject the Gospel and now he rejects that authority and believes the Catholick Church rather than him And this doth not make the Churches authority greater than Scripture but more visible than that of Manichaeus But if St. Augustin's Testimony here be allowed to extend farther yet it implies no more than that the constant universal Tradition of the Scripture by the Catholick Church makes it appear credible to us What can be deduced hence as to the Churches Infallibility in interpreting Scripture or the Roman Churches authority in delivering it The Arrian Controversie gave a great disturbance to the Christian Church and no less a man than the Emperour Constantine thought there was no such way to put an end to it as to search the Scriptures about it As he declared to the Council of Nice at their meeting as Theodoret saith It is true he spake to the Guides of the Church assembled in Council but his words are remarkable viz. That the Books of Scripture do plainly instruct us what we are to believe concerning the Deity if we search them with peaceable minds Methinks Bellarmine bestows no great Complement on Constantine for this saying when he saith He was a great Emperour but no greaâ— Doctor This had been indeed sawcy and scurrilous in others but it was no doubt good manners in him St. Hilary commends his Son Constantius because he would have this Controversie ended by the Scriptures and he desires to be heard by him about the sense of the Scriptures concerning it which he was ready to shew not from new Writings but from Gods Word Athanasius seems to
question the usefulness of Councils in this matter because the Scripture of it self was sufficient to put an end to it And elsewhere saith that it is plain enough to those who search for Truth And in general he asserts their sufficiency and clearness for the discovery of Truth When a Controversie was raised in St. Basil's time about the Trinity the best Expedient that great man could think of for putting an end to it was to refer it to the Scriptures In another place he commends it as the best way to find out Truth to be much in the study of the Scriptures and saith that the Spirit of God did thereby lead to all things useful Epiphanius was well acquainted with all the Heresies of the Church and the best means to suppress them and certainly he would never have taken such pains to refute so many Heresies out of Scripture if he had look'd on the Church as the Infallible Judg of Controversies For he not only undertakes to give the sense of Scripture for the ending of Controversies but he supposes all Persons capable of understanding it that will apply themselves to it Which he several times affirms in the consutation of his last Heresie I shall conclude with St. Chrysostome who speaks to this purpose to a person so offended at the Sects and Heresies among Christians that he did not know whom or what to believe â—he Scriptures saith he are plaâ— and true and it is an easie matter to judg by them if a man agrees with the Sâ—â—iptures he is a Christian if not he is out of that â—oll But men diâ—fer about the sense of Scripture What saith he hâ—ve ye not a 〈◊〉 and judgment And after the answering several other Cavâ—ls lâ— concludes Let us submit to the Divine Law and dâ—â— what is pleasing tâ— that and that will bring us to Heaven And in another place If â—e sâ—udy the Scriptures we shall understand both true Doctrine and a good liâ—e And again the Scriptures are the Door which kâ—â—p out Hereticks which establish our minds in the Truth and suffer us not to be seduâ—ed Thus I have given somewhat a clearer view of the sense of the Primitive Church in this mâ—tter than could be taken from two single passages of Tertullian and St. Augustin and I have been so far from swelling or enlarging this as far as I could that I have made choice only of these out of many others which I could have produced But if these be not sufficient a Volume will not satisfie which it were not hard to make on this Subject out of the Fathers 3 It is time now to examine the Inconveniencies alledged against Persons judging of matters of Faith according to the Scriptures 1 That God Almighty would then leave us at Uncertainties if he gave us a Rule and â—eft every one to be his own Iudg for that were to leave every phantastical mâ—n to câ—use as he pleases To this was answered 1 That this Objection doth not reach those of the Church of Englanâ— which receives the three Creeds and embraces the four General Councils and professes to hold nothing contrary to any Uâ—iversal Tradition of the Church from the Apostles times And that we have often offer'd to put the Controversies between us and the Church of Rome upon that issue To this Answer the Replier saith That they do not charge our Church with not profâ—ssing these things but for erring against her own Profâ—ssion and deserting that Church to which all these Authorities bear Testimony and of which her Progenitors and first Reformers had been Members and from whose hands she received what soever she had either of Scripture Creeds Councils or Tradition and consequently whose judgment she was bound to follow Whether we act against our Profession or not it is plain the Rule of our Church doth not by this Profession leave every one to follow his own fancy and to believe as he plâ—ses But wherein is it that we thus Act against our Profession Do we reject the â—reeds Councils and Universal Tradition in our Deeds Wherein In deserting the Communion of the Church of Rome And is the necessity of thâ—t contained in the Creeds here receiv'd In the â—our Councils â—y Universal Tradition For this I refer to the foregoing Dâ—scourse about the Unity of the Catholick Church But we receiv'd these thiâ—gs from the Church of Rome So we do the old Tâ—stament from the Jews must we therefore hold Communion still with them Are we bound therefore to follow the Judgment of the Jewish Churâ—â— But I do not understand how we receiv'd these things from the Authority of the Church of Rome We receiv'd the Scriptures from Universal Tradition derived from all the Apostolical â—hurches and so the Creeds and Councils and such an Universal Tradition is the thing we desire for the Trent-Creed our forefathers never knew or receiv'd as part of that Faith without which there is no Salvation But here the Defender grows brisk and saith All Hereticks since the first â—our General Councils may say the very same which I say for the Church of England and all before them the Equivalent Arius Macedonius Nestorius and Entyches might have said as much of the Crâ—eds before them and all complain of the Villainous Factâ—ns in the Church against them My Plea for the Church of England hath justified them all The same thing is said in sewer words by the Replier That this Plea justifies the Arrians and condemns the Nicene Fathers vindicates the Eutychians Nestorians and Donatists and confounds all General Councils Lest therefore I should seem to betray the Church of England instead of defending it I shall shew the Reasonableness and Equity of this Plea and its great difference from that of the Ancient Hereticks condemned by General Councils or the Ancient Church 1 The Ancient Hereticks were condemned by that Rule of Faith which the Church always receiv'd v z. the Scriptures but the Council of Tâ—ent set up a new Rule of Faith on purpose that they might condemn us for Hereticks viz. in making Tradition equal with Scripture which is directly contrary to the Doctrine of the Primitive Church as I have already shewed The method of General Councils was to have the Books of Scripture placed in the middle of them on a Table as the Rule they were to judg by And Richerius a Doctâ—â— of the Scrbon not only affirms the Custom but saiâ—h it was for 〈◊〉 Reason That the Fathers of the Councils might be admonished that all things were to be examined by the standard of the Gospel Bellarmin affirms the Council of Nice To have drawn its Conclusion out of Scriptures and the same he affirms of the 6th General Council and he might as well have done it of the rest their main design being only to establish the Doctrine of the Divinity and Incarnation of Christ. But the Case of Councils came to be very different when
lawfully give Divine Worship to any part of the World to be converted by the Missionaries who tell them the parts of the World cannot be God for he is Infinite and Immutable and Wise and Powerful which the Parts of the World are not and cannot be and therefore they cannot without Idolatry give Divine Worship to them the Mandarins require their giving the same Adorations that others do they refuse and say Whatever you may do who believe God and the World to be the same certainly it would be gross Idolatry in us who believe the thing you worship to be nothing but dull insensible parts of the World. And if now it should be asked By what authority they separate Is there not a plain answer By the authority of God himself who requires Adoration to be given to himself alone But who shall be Judg saith the Defender God himself will be Judg aâ— the great Day whether we will or not And I think that is more to be regarded than putting an end to Controversies If we be not sincere and faithful to him and his service if we do not act and judg with a regard to the Judgment of that day all the pretences in the world of a Judg in Controversies then will stand in no stead If we do use our careful endeavours to know the will of God and to do it we have great reason to hope God will shew mercy to us and then the Question will not appear of such wonderful importance Who shall be Judg here But we do not decline a reasonable Judgment in this world we only desire our Judges may be fair and equal and such as God hath appointed And if those who would judg for us pretend that they have a Divine Commission we desire to know who shall be judg of this pretence We have no reason to trust them and they will not trust us So that here we are stopt at first unless the Commission be produced which impowers those persons to judg who challenge such authority over our judgments A general indefinite obscure Commission which may extend to all other Guides in the Church as well as to them will by no means be sufficient Let us see whom Christ hath appointed in his own words and we will submit for we look on him as Supreme Judg and Legislator to his Church and if he hath thought fit to appoint an Infallible Judg we have done But we desire to know where he hath done it Hath he granted any new Commission from Heaven No. Is it to be found in Scripture Yes But then I pray observe you tell us Scripture cannot be Judg in any Controversie being ambiguous uncertain general mute flexible and what not and because it cannot hear Parties nor give a decisive voice it can by no means be a Judg of Controversies How then can the Scripture put an end to this Controversie when it can put an end to none Are the Expressions in this matter so particular so clear so peremptory that we cannot mistake about the sense of them If so then I perceive notwithstanding all the hard words given it Scripture may be Judg as well as a Rule because it is fitted to put an end to such a Controversie which is as doubtful as any and why not as well to all the rest We are not then afraid of this Question Who shall be Judg But we desire to be satisfied about it and to know not only who hath appointed him but who he is whether the Pope in Cathedrâ— or a General Council For this is very material for us to know since even at this day you are far from being agreed about it The Assembly of the Clergy of France have solemnly declared within few years That they do not believe the Popes Judgment to be Infallible The Clergy of Hungary have rejected and censured this Declaration as absurd and detestable and have forbidden any to read hold or teach the Doctrine and own the Pope to be the only Infallible Judg of Controversies A Sorbon Doctor in his Notes on the Hungarian Censure calls this the new Heresie of the Jesuits on the other side large Volumes have been Printed to prove that the right of judging infallibly belongs only to the Pope And now very lately comes out a Learned Book by another Doctor of the Sorbon to prove not only that the Popes Judgment is not Infallible but that it is a dangerous thing to believe it and that no man ought to do it unless infallible proof be brought of it But he proves at large that not so much as probable evidence can be brought for it either from Scripture or Tradition I pray now the Defender to tell me Who is the Judg Is the Pope Infallible or not It is easily answer'd I or no. And it is necessary to be answer'd if we must know Who is the Judg The common Evasion is That you are agreed that Popes and Councils together are but this is but an Evasion For the Infallibility is by virtue of Divine Promises â—â—d those must either relate to the Church as the subject of them or to the Successors of St. Peter in their capacity as such If to the former the Popes have nothing to do in it but as included in the Church if the latter the Councils have no Infallibility but the Pope To say the Council is infallible when confirmed by the Pope is Nonsense For either it was Infallible in its Decree or not If not it can borrow no Infallibility from the Popes subsequent Confirmation but the Popes Judgment may be said to be Infallible but by no means the Councils And Du Pin hath proved that there cannot be two Seats of Infallibility for whereever there is Infallibility it can receive no addition or force from another Infallibility and whatever is Infallible must be believed for it self and not depend on anothers Judgment And therefore I again desire the Defender to make no harangues about this matter but to answer directly Who is the Judg For we would sain be acquainted with this some body as he speaks but I am afraid his some body of Infallibility will prove a more pleasing dream than what he charges me with in what follows I had given a fair account of the proceedings in England upon the Reformation how the search began the Popes Authority to be discarded and the Articles of Religion to be drawn up which ought not to be looked on as particular Fancies but the sense of our Church All this he calls a pleasing dream I am sure the pretence of Infallibility is so but I related matter of fact which he hath no mind to meddle with but he runs again to his Who shall be Judg And concludes that I think between Churches there 's none at all I do think the Church of England in this divided state of the Catholick Church is under no Superior Judicature but that it hath sufficient power and authority to
every man must use his Understanding about it that was no more than was necessary in order to the believing the matters contained in it But if by being a Judg of Scripture was meant giving such a Judgment as obliges others to submit to it then it was denied that every man among us is allow'd to judg of it But yet we own the Authority of the Guides of the Church and a due submission to them but we do not allow them to be as competent Judges of Scriptures as the very Apostles This seems to me to be a full and clear Answer But the Replier offers some things against it 1. That I suppose Men cannot be deceived in understanding the Scriptures and consequently their Spirit is infallible I never said or thought that they could not be deceived but I 〈◊〉 they must use their Understandings to prevent being deceived and must judg of the sense of what they are to believe in the Scriptures in order to their own Salvation But he saith Whosoever uses his Understanding in opposition to the Churches Tradition makes himself a Judg indeed but not to his own Salvation To make this matter clear we must consider That Matters of Faith necessary to Salvation are of another nature from Matters of Controversie concerning the Sense of Scripture in doubtful places As to the matters necessary to Salvation to particular persons we assert the Scriptures to be so plain and the Tradition of the Church as to the Creeds so well known and attested that no man without gross and culpable neglect can mistake about them but in case of invincible or unaffected ignorance their Errors shall not be laid to their charge and so their mistakes shall not hinder their Salvation And herein we assert no more than we can justifie not only from Scripture Reason and Antiquity but from the best of their own Writers who assert 1. That there are some Points of Faith necessary to be explicitely believed by all in order to Salvation for altho they say there may be such invincible ignorance of them as may excuse from sin in not believing them yet without believing them they are not capable of Salvation As to the prima credibilia as Aquinas calls them he determines That every man is bound to believe them explicitely as much as he is bound to have Faith but as to other things a preparation of mind is sufficient to believe all contained in Scripture and so much explicitely as is made plain to him to he contained therein From whence it follows That by the Doctrine of the Schools every man is to judg what he is to believe for his Words are Quando hoc ei constiterit when it is made clear to him and how can any thing be made clear to a man unless he be the Judg of it 2. That particular persons may certainly know what is sufficient to their Salvation by the inward assistance of Divine Grace without depending on the Churches Infallibility This follows from what is mention'd before concerning the Divine Gifts which accompany Grace And so much is owned by Melchior Canus as to what is necessary for every man as to his own state and condition So that the greatest Divines of the Roman Church do yield all we contend for as to the Matters necessary to Salvation The only Question is about Matters of Controversie raised in the Church concerning the Sense of Scripture and as to these they yield these material Points 1 That an Implicit Faith as to what is contained in Scripture is sufficient and that particular persons are bound to no more till the Doctrine be made clear to them which appears from the words of Aquinas lately mentioned 2. That particular Persons may disbelieve many things determined by the Church without sin This Sancta Clara proves from Vega and others and he saith himself Their Ignorance in such cases is either invincible or at least such as excuses from sin And he farther saith 3. That it is the common opinion of the Schools and of their Divines That Laymen erring with their Teachers are excused from any fault and as long as it is out of obedience to their Teachers it is rather a meritorious Act. Let us now lay these things to the present Case and all the Difficulty will soon disappear As to the Matters of Salvation they grant that God will not suffer those to be deceived about them who do sincerely seek after the knowledg of them As to Matters of Controversie they are in no danger if they trust their Spiritual Guides And I asserted that we owned the Authority of Guides in the Church and a due submission to them But the Replier is not satisfied with this for he saith 2. That no other submission is sufficient but such as men lose I haven without it This is somewhat hard to understand Doth he in earnest think men cannot go to Heaven without a blind Obedience to the Church Is there no allowance to be made for Ignorance Education reasonable Doubts Is all other submission to Authority in the Church merely ad Pompam But this Gentleman did not take time to consider the Doctrine of their own Schools about these matters for I cannot imagine he could be ignorant of it But the Defender seems to be wholly unacquainted with it otherwise he could not talk so crudely and unskilfully as he doth about mens Judgment in matters that concern their Salvation And he may now see how far their own Divines allow particular persons to be competent Judges about matters that relate to their own Salvation and therefore I need give him no other Answer till he hath better informed himself about these things but we have been upon such a Point as may in some measure excuse him but not those who ought to understand their own Doctrine better 2. The next Argument to prove the Insufficient Authority of the Church of England was That she dares not bring the true Arguments against the other Sects for fear they should be turned against themselves and confuted by their own Arguments To this it was answered That the Church of England did wisely disown the pretence of Infallibility and made use of the best Arguments against Sectaries from a just Authority and the Sinfulness and Folly of the Sectaries refusing to submit to it To take off the force of this Answer two different Ways are taken 1. The Replier saith The Argument is as forcible without Infallibility as with it 2. The Defender saith Authority signifies nothing in this Case without Infallibility I shall consider them both tho both cannot stand together 1. The Replier goes upon this Ground That the Church of England can never justly charge Sectaries with Disobedience to Her because they may as well cast it in her Teeth that she disobeyed her Mother Church whether she were Infallible or not But the Force of this depends upon a double Mistake 1. That the Church of Rome
from the proceeding of the rest of Mankind that for my part I must be content rather to grope in the darkness of common Reason than be directed by the Light of this invisible Sun-shine The Defender here comes in with his Dish and his Stand which are Metaphors somewhat too mean for such a Subject and are apt to turn one's Stomach more than Repetition The Question is Whether those who allow the use of our Judgments in the choice of a Church have Reason to find fault with it in other thingâ— because the Difficulties about an Infallible Church are as great as about any other Point in Religion The Replier again saith The Church is a Noon-day Light. Then what Cimmerians are we Tully questioned Whether some God or Nature or the Situation of the Place hindred a whole Nation that they could never see the Sun But our Modern Geographers put an end to this Dispute telling us there are no People in the World who cannot see the Sun at some time or other And we are apt to think if there were such a Sun-shine of the Churches Infallibility we should be able to discern it unless the Light of it may be thought to dazle oâ—â— Eyes for we are as willing to find it as they but the Disâ—◠〈◊〉 〈◊〉 it are such as we cannot conquer And there need no Telescopes to find out the Sun. But the Defender will not yield that there are any suâ—â— Difficulties about the Church's Infallibility for he hath but oâ—â— thing to mind and that no Difficulty neither where or which the Church is I hope when he hath considered the former Discourses he will not think it so easy a matter to find out the Church he talketh of viz. One Infallible Catholick Church But the Difficulties about Scripture are greater as about the Canon Translation and Sense of it The Question proceeds upon a Person who in earnest desires to satisfy himself in this Matter Whether in order to his Salvation he must follow the Directions of Scripture or the Church And I doubt not to make it appear that the Difficulties are greater about the Church than the Scripture That which deceives Persons is that they rather consider the Difficulties after the Choice than before It is very true those who trust the Church have no more to do afterward but to believe and do as she directs for they are to examine no farther whether it be true or false right or wrong Vertue or Vice which is commanded the Church is to be obey'd But those who follow the Scripture must not only read and weigh and consider it well but when Doubts arise must make fresh Applications to their Rule and use the best Means for understanding it by Prayer Meditation and the Assistance of Spiritual Guides And this is far more agreeable to the Design of the Christian Religion as it was taught by Christ and his Apostles But the Difficulties of the Choice are now to be consider'd and let us consider what those are about the Church and then compare them with those about the Scripture If I choose a Church for my Infallible Guide in the Way to Heaven to which the Promises of Christ do belong then there are these Difficulties both which I think impossible for my mind to get over 1. I must exclude all other Churches in the Christian World from any share in these Promises And either I must condemn them without hearing them or examining the Grounds of their Exclusion or I must be satisfied with the Reason of it which I cannot be till I am certain that Church hath justly shut out all other Churches and challenged the Promises to her self alone 2. I must be satisfied that Christ did intend one standing Visible Church to be my Director in the Way to Heaven And for this purpose I must examine all the places of Scripture produced to that end and be Judg of the clearness and evidence of them i. e. I must conquer the Difficulties about the Scripture as to Canon Translation and Sense before I can be satisfied that I am to make choice of a Church 3. There is yet a harder Point to get over Suppose a Church must be chosen why the Church of Rome rather than any other What is there in the Promises of Christ which direct me to chuse that Church and no other Suppose I were born in Greece and there I was told I must â—huse a Church for my Guide to Heavâ—n If it must be so I will chuse our own Greek Church No it must be the Church of Rome What Reason or Colour is there for it Is it said so in Scripture No not expresly But what Consequence from Scripture will make me do it There are Promises made to the Church What then Were not our Churches planted by the Apostles Have not we had a constant Succession of Bishop in them Have we not four Patriarchs in our Communion and you but one For what imaginable Reason then should you exclude our Churâ—â—es from any share in the Promises of Christ But now as to the Scripture we are to consider 1. That no more is necessary as to particular Persons than knowing the things necessary to their Salvation which are easy to be known and are clearly revealed in Scripture if S. Chrysostom and S. Augustine may be bâ—lieved 2. That what Difficulties are objected about the Scripture must be all of them resolved by him that believes the Church as is already observed but the Difficulties about the Church's Infallibility do not concern him that relies on Scripture 3. That the general Consent of the Christian Church is of far greater Advantage for the satisfaction of a Man's Mind than the Authority of any one Church as about the Integrity of the Copies and the Canon of Scripture 4. As to Translations the Unlearned in all Churches must trust to those that are Learned for the particular examination of them but in general a private Person may be satisfied by these Conâ—â—derations 1. That Men will not go about to deceive others in a Matter wherein so many are concerned and in which it is so easy to discover any wilful Fraud 2. That since the Divisions of Christendom there are Parties still at watch to discover the Faults committed by each other in a Work of so publick a Nature 3. That where a Translation hath been review'd with great care after several Attempts there is still greater Security as to the goodness of it And this is the Case of the present Translation of our Church which was with wonderful care review'd and compared with the Original Languages by the particular Direction of K. James I. and therefore deserves to be esteemed above such a Translation which was never made out of the Original as to the Old Testament nor ever review'd and corrected by it Which is the Case of the Vulgar Latin and of such Translations which are made from it I had said that the Scripâ—ure may be a
see because Faith is of things not seen This Cavil had been as good against our Blessed Saviour when he said to Thomas because thou hast seen thou hast believed I hope upon second thoughts they will not tell him that this was improperly spoken and not like a Schoolman Call it what you will the single Question is Whether your Church will allow us to Judge of things according to the plain Evidence of Sense One saith It is impossible that any Man should be commanded not to believe what he sees Believing here is the Judgment of the Mind upon the Representation of Sense and will he secure us that the Church can never require us to judge otherwise than according to the Evidence of Sense I wish he would make his words good for I assure him he would remove a terrible block out of our way My Senses plainly tell me what I see and feel and taste is as much Bread after Consecration as it was before how then comes it to pass that my Judgment that it was Bread before was very good but although there be the very same Evidence afterwards without the least alteration to Sense yet then I am to judge just contrary i. e. that it is not Bread which I see and feel and taste just as I did before But he saith what is seen is only the form shape and sigure of Bread and Wine and that they believe to be there But alas This doth not reach to the point For the Question is not about external appearances but about the Iudgment of the Mind upon the Evidence of Sense I will make this matter plainer that they may know where the Difficulty lies When Christ's Body appeared to the Disciples after his Resurrection there was no dispute among them concerning the form shape and figure of his body but the doubt was whether from these they were to conclude that it was Christ's real Body or not If not they could not believe from the Evidence of Sense that Christ's Body was risen from the dead if they were let them tell us how Christ's Body comes to be so much changed and to lose those essential properties of a body which it once had and was judged by and farther what ground there is for us now not to allow that Judgment of Sense which Christ himself appealed to after the Institution of the Sacrament For if Christ had therein declared that our Senses are not to be our Rule of judging concerning his Body he would certainly not have appealed so soon after to the Senses of his Disciples concerning that very Body and neither he nor his Disciples have given the least intimation that what we see and feel to be one body we must believe to be quite another which we can neither see nor feel Did not two Angels appear to Lot in the figure and shapes of Men and the Holy Ghost descend in the form of a Dove And were they who saw them to believe according to the Evidence of Sense I answer that there is a great deal of difference to be made between Invisible Powers appearing under bodily shapes and a natural visible palpable extended body losing the Properties of a body abd becoming invisible impalpable and indivisible And withal there is a great difference between Spiritual Powers uniting the real particles of Matter into a Body and the making the Form Figure and Shape of a real Body to be where there is no substance of a body We do not pretend to judge by our Senses of Invisible Substances under outward appearances but of the Truth of a bodily Substance by all the Appearances of a body under all the Circumstances necessary for the right judgment of Sense The other saith he knows of no Church which allows not People to believe all they see May we then believe that to be still Bread which we see to be so No he saith the What of a thing is not the Object of Sense I perceive then our Senses are very impertinent things and only give an account of the Circumstances and not of the Substances of things But I pray did not the Disciples perceive the What of Christ's Body by their Senses How do we know the What of any bodily Substance but by them It is meer Collusion to say our Senses do not judge of Substances for our bare Senses judge of nothing but are the means of conveying the impressions or Representations inward whereby our Minds do paâ—s Judgment upon things And either we cannot know the Substance of any thing sensible or we must know the What of it as he speaks by our Senses We now come to the main business which for the clearer proceeding I shall put under three distinct Heads I. Concerning the Unity of the Catholick Church II. Concerning the Authority of it III. Concerning the Reformation of the Church of England I. Of the Unity of the Catholick Church ANd here the point to be discussed is viz. Whether that which is called the Roman-Catholick Church be that one Church which Christ has here on Earth 1. The first thing I objected against it was that a Part cannot be the Whole but that which is called the Roman-Catholick Church is but a Part and therefore it cannot be the One Catholick Church of Christ here on earth Here to prevent cavilling I must declare that I meant not the Roman Diocese or Province but all the Churches which live in Communion with and Subjection to the Bishop of Rome as Head of the Church and look on it as necessary to Salvation so to do And this I still assert to be but a Part of the Catholick Church and a corrupt one too The Author of the Defence saith all this Riddle of Part and Whole comes from my Inadvertence How so Because I confound the Roman Diocese with the Roman-Catholick Church No I assure him I did take it in their own sense for all that embrace the matters of Faith which are received in the Roman Communion And He need not fear my doing otherwise for I intend to discourse of no other Church but this and this I deny as so taken to be the One Catholick Church Doth not Catholic signifie all the Parts I am sure it ought to do so but I say it doth not when Roman is joyned to Catholick for then it excludes all those from being Parts of the Catholic Church which do not joyn in the Roman Communion and this I say is unreasonable And here I expected some Proof in so material a Point but there is not a Word farther than that Catholic comprehends all but I say again Roman Catholic excludes all that are not in its Communion As suppose any one should say the German Ocean is the whole Sea and to prove it should reason as this Gentlemen doth Ocean is the whole Sea is it not And is it the less the Ocean because German is added to it No the Ocean is just as large as ever it was but
external Visible Head which may sail but to Christ as the essential Head of the Church This is the express Doctrine of the Cardinal de Alliaco Ioh. Major Almain Gerson and many others and follows from the Decree of the Council of Constance Thus I have briefly deduced the Sense of the Christian Church in this matter from the Apostolical times and that not meerly from the sayings of particular Men but from publick solemn and undoubted Acts of the Church Which I have the rather done because the Defender saith we have no Antiquity on our sido in this â—ause but as much as since Luther I think I have produced a little more and too much for him to Answer It is time now to consider what proof the Replier brings that Catholic and Roman-Catholic in the Sense of Antiquity were one and the same thing He produces the Testimonies of Tertullian and Cyprian wherein the Church of Rome is called the Catholic Church Who doubts that in those days there was a Catholic Church at Rome For every particular Church which agreed in the Catholic Faith was then called the Catholic Church of such a place And innumerable Instances of this kind may be gathered out of Antiquity both as to the City of Rome and other Cities as well as that and surely they were not all Catholic Churches in his Sense when he agrees there is but One Catholic Church nay more even Parochial Churches were called Catholic as he may find in â—otelerius S Ambrose's Testimony signifies no more than that Satyrus coming into a Place suspected for the Luciferian Schism asked if the Bishop joyned with the Catholic Bishops i. e. with the Roman Church Which is no more than whether he agreed with his own Church for Satyrus was a Roman born But this would prove any other Church to be the One Catholic Church altogether as well as the Roman The Patriarch of Constantinople writes to Hormisda that he would not hereafter recite in the Diptychs the Names of those who were excommunicated by the Apostolical See. And what follows But he saith They were sever'd from the Communion of the Catholic Church And so were those excommunicated by the Patriarch of Constantinople But the words are who do not in all things consent with the See Apostolic but the plain meaning is of those who were cast out of Communion for the words are too Sequestrates à Communione Ecclesiae Catholicae And doth this prove the Roman Church to have any more relation to the Catholic than the Church of the meanest Bishop in the Catholic Church As to the calling of Catholics Romanists by the Gothic Arians that relates to the Roman Empire and not to the Roman Church And now let any impartial Reader judge whether the sense of Antiquity be not admirably cleared by these passages as to the making out Roman and Catholic to be the same But to proceed 3. I said farther that if the Roman Church believed it self to be the Catholick Church it must void the Baptism of those who are out of its Communion but since Baptism doth enter persons into the Catholic Church by its own Confession the Catholic Church which is owned in the Creeds must be of larger Extent than the Roman In Answer to this they both tell me this point hath been over-ruled long ago by the Catholic Church the Baptism of Hereticks being allowed to be good But since it is granted that Baptism doth enter Persons into that Catholic Church we believe in the Creeds doth it not evidently follow that the Catholic Church in the Creeds is larger than the Roman Communion For it takes in those which the other doth not Doth not the Catholic Church take in all that are admitted into the Catholick Church but many more by their own Confession are admitted into it than are of the Roman Communion and therefore it unavoidably follows that the Roman Catholick Church cannot be the Catholic Church believed in the two Creeds And although according to S. Augustine the validity of Baptism depends on the right form of words and not the good Disposition of him that administers yet Baptism where it is valid must have its due Effect which is entering Persons into the Catholic Church But say they Doth not Heresie c. cast them out of the Catholic Church Suppose it doth yet if Heresie do cast them out they were in the Church till they were cast out of it Their being allowed to be in it doth my business let them prove them cast out by Heresie when they please But the Defender saith I suppose what I should prove and then prove it by means of that supposition Here I am to seek for do I not prove from their own Supposition and not from mine that Baptism doth enter persons into the Catholic Church and therefore from thence I prove that themselves cannot believe the Catholic and Roman Church to be all one since they allow many multitudes to be entred into the Catholic Church which they deny to be of the Roman Church Yet he goes on that such persons are not truly Members either of the Catholic or Roman-â—atholic Church No then Baptism doth not admit Persons into the Catholic Church Which is very new Doctrine and fit only for new Converts and is directly contrary to the Roman Catechism which saith Baptism is the Gate by which we enter into the Church They were so far â—embers saith he as Baptism could make them And that I hope was to make them Members of Christs Body or else what becomes of the Council of Trent which so expresly asserts and that with an Anathema the Validity and Efficacy of the Sacraments in general and of Baptism in particulâ—â— And there is a special Anathema against those who say that Children baptized are not to be reckon'd inter fideles and I hope those are Members of the Catholic Church Is there Remission of sins Communion with the Holy Spirit granted out of the Catholic Church yet these are the Effects of Baptism owned by all Persons in the Church of Rome or else they cannot themselves be of the Roman Communion What is it then I pray to be as much Members of the Church as Baptism could make them What can make them more Members than Baptism doth According to their own Doctrine But they are as far off the Roman Church as they are off the Catholic Say you so then no more is requisite to make a Man a Member of the Roman â—hurch than is necessary to his Baptism This great News aâ—â— would be very welcome to the Christian World. I have hâ—â—rd of many Projects of Accommodation but none seem to be like this For then no more is necessary to make us Members of the Roman Church than of the Catholic i. e. owning the Creed and our Baptismal Vow Nay hold there saith he the Profession of the Catholic Faith is necessary to make one a true Member of
Rule without the Church but the Church cannot without the Scriptures The Replier like a fair Adversary mentions that which looks like an Objection viz. That there was a Church before the Scriptures were written and some Ages were passed before the Canon of Scripture was made and owned by the Church To which I Answer That when I said the Church cannot be a Rule without the Scripture it was upon the supposition that the Canon of Scripture had been long since owned by the Church and that the Church derives its Infallibility from the Promises contaiâ—ed in the Scripture But the Defender goes another way to work for saith he The Scriptures I say may be a Rule without the Church that is without Faithful for a Congregation of them is a Church What! in the Sense now before us as it is taken for a Guide Is every Congregation of the Faithful a Church in this Sense Then well-fare the Independents And this me-thinks makes Infallibility sink very low I do not say There could be no Church before Scripture nor that they had then no Rule of Faith nor that the Church depends on writing these are but mean Objections but I â—ill say That where a Church challenges her Authority by the Scripture it can signify nothing without it Which is so plain that I need not multiply words about it As to his Church-Security we have considered it enough already but it would make one mistrust a Security which is so often offered I said that suppose Infallibility be found in Scripture there is yet a harder Point to get over viz. how the Promises relating to the Church in general came to be appropriated to the Church of Rome From hence he insers That I have at last found the Promises of Infallibility to the Church there Is not this a rare Consequence Suppose I should say I know a Book of Controversy in the World that hath very little of true Reasoning in it but if it were to be found there it doth not reach to the Point in hand Doth this imply that I affirmed in the latter part what I denied before Is this finding out true Reasoning in the latter Period which was not to be found in the former There may be true Reasoning when it is not to the purpose So there might be Infallibility and yet the Church of Rome not concerned in it Suppose the Church of Jerusalem as the Mother Church might be Infallible by the Promises of Scripture what would this be to the Church of Rome But I never said or thought that there were any Promises of Infallibility made to any Church in Scripture Proâ—ises of Divine Assistance and Indefectibility I grant are made to the Church in general but these are quite of another Nature from Promises of Infallibility in delivering Matters of Faith in all Ages Yet if this were granted the Church of Rome as it takes in all of her Communion hath no more reason to challenge it to her self than Europe hath to be called the Face of the whole Earth As to his Sandy Foundation I tell him in short He that builds his Faith on the Word of God builds on a Rock and all other things will be found but Sandy Foundations 4. The next thing laid to our Charge is That we draw our Arguments from Implications and far-fetch'd Interpretations at the same time that we deny plain and positive words In Answer to this 1. It was shew'd that in many of the Points in Difference we have express words of Scripture for us As against the Worship of Images and giving Divine Worship to any but God and for giving the Eucharist in both kinds and praying in a Language we understand The Defender would have me produce the very Words to shew that the Scripture saith No to what their Church saith I or contrariwise He talked much before that we give the same Answer the old Hereticks did and now I think he hath matched them Shew us say they in Terms the direct contrary to our Propositions where the Son was said to be Consubstantial to the Father or the Holy Ghost was a Divine Person or the Blessed Virgin the Mother of God or that there are two Natures in Christ after the Union Will Reason and Consequences signify nothing when founded on the Word of God But I need not this answer for I assirm that the words of the first and second Commandment of the Institution of the Sacrament Drink ye all of this of S. Paul 14. of the first Epistle to the Corinthians against Publick Service in an unknown Tongue are so plain and evident that there is no Command of Scripture but may be avoided and turned another way as well as these And herein we go not upon our own Fancies but we have the concurrent Sense of the Christian Church in the best and most Primitive Ages in every one of the Points here mentioned And whether we are right as to the sense of the second Commandment and as to Divine Worship in general as to Christ's Institution amounting to a Command as to St. Paul 's Discourse Which the Replier insists upon next to the Scripture it self and the Force contained therein we appeal to the Primitive Church as the most indifferent Arbitrator between us 2. I answered That where words seem plain and positive they may have a Metaphorical or Figurative Sense as when God hath Eyes and Ears c. given him and the Rock was Christ. And so in the Words This is my Body it was a Sacramental Expression as the other was and the other words are figurative when the Cup is said to be the New Testament in his Blood and St. Paul notwithstanding those words called it Bread after Consecration Here the Defender will not bite the Light being too clear for him but descants upon denying plain words and so runs clear off from the Point which seemed to be chiefly meant by the Paper But the Replier is a generous Adversary and attacks what stands before him He endeavours to shew a Difference between God's having Eyes and Eaâ—s c. and those words This is my Body as to the receding from the literal Sense because saith he there is an implication of impossibility in the one but not in the other But withal he grants that if by This be meant the Bread it would have implied an equal impossibility I am very glad to see this Point brought to so fair an Issue For if I do not prove by the general Consent of the Fathers both of the Greek and Latin Churches that by This the Bread is meant I dare promise to become hiâ— Prosclyâ—â— 5. The last Thing objected is That our Church sâ—bsists only on the Pleasure of the Civil Magistrate who may turn the Church which way he pleases To this it was answered 1. That the Rule of our Religion is unalterable being the Word of God tho the Exercise of it be under the Regulation
3. By her constant appealing to the Primitive Church ever since the Reformation as the best Voucher for her keeping to the true Sense of Scripture And in truth one of the greatest Controversies between our Church and the Church of Rome is not about the bare Letter of Scripture but the best Interpreter of it Our Church still contending that the sirst and purest Ages of the Church next to the Apostles Times did certainly best understand the Sense aad Meaning of Scripture and the Church of Rome pretending that the giving the true Sense of Scripture belongs to the present Catholick Church which they would be thought to be against the plainest Evidence of Scripture and Reason As appears by the foregoing Discourses The Defender's Cavil against the Prayer at the end of the Answer would have held as well against Amen if it had been added to it But he was to answer all and therefore the very Prayer could not escape his Confutation or at least his putting an ill construction upon it which was far from the Intention of him that made it Who thinks it a part of a good Christian to be always a Loyal Subject As to the summing up the Evidence in his Conclusion I shall not follow him in it since I think the Cause so clear in the opening of it that I shall leave it as it is to the Reader 's Judgment An ANSWER to the DEFENCE of the THIRD PAPER I Have now done as to matter of Reason and Argument the third Paper chiefly relates to Matter of Fact which if I were mistaken in even the brisk Defender of it doth me that Right to say the Bishop of Winchester did mislead me For the whole Body of my Answer he saith is in effect a Transcript from the Bishop's Preface that I purloin his Arguments without altering sometime so much as the property of his Words That I have quoted him five times only in the Margin and ought to have quoted him in almost every leaf of my Pamphet In short if the Master had not eaten the Man saving Reverence could not have vomited This is a Tast of the Decency and Cleanliness of his Stile especially in writing for Princes and great Ladies who are not accustomed to such a sort of Courtship to others in their Presence But as course as the Complement is it clears me from being the Author of any Mistakes and lays the blame on the Bishop who is not able to answer for himself Yet as if I had been the sole Contriver and Inventer of all he bestows those civil and obliging Epithets upon me of disingenuous foul-mouth'd and shuffling one of a virulent Genius of spiteful Diligence and Irreverence to the Royal Family of subtil Calumny and sly Aspersion and he adds to these Ornaments of Speech that I have a Cloven Foot and my Name is Legion and that my Answer is an infamous Libel a scurrilous saucy Pamphlet Is this indeed the Spirit of a New Convert Is this the Meekness and Temper you intend to gain Proselites by and to convert the Nation He tells us in the beginning that Truth has a Language peculiar to it self I desire to be informed whether these be any of the Characters of it And how the Language of Reproach and Evil-speaking may be distinguished from it But Zeal in a new Convert is a terrible thing for it not only burns but rages like the Eruptions of Mount AEtna it fills the Air with noise and smoak and throws out such a Torrent of liquid Fire that there is no standing before it The Answerer alone was too mean a Sacrifice for such a Hector in Controversy All that standeth in his way must fall at his Feet He calls me Legion that he may be sure to have number enough to overcome But he is a great Prosicient indeed if he be such an Exorcist to cast out a whole Legion already But he hopes it may be done without Fasting and Prayer If the People continue stedfast to their Religion they are the Rabble and the only Friends I can perceive he allows us My good Friends the Rabble in one place and in another Our Author knows he has all the common People of his side What nothing of Honour or Dignity or Wit or Sense or Learning left of our side Not so much as a Poet unless it be Robbin Wisdom I pray Sir when was it that all our Friends degenerated into the Rabble Do you think that Heresy as you call it doth ipso facto degrade all Mankind and turns all Orders of Men even the House of 〈◊〉 Lordsit self to a meer Rabble If all the common People be of our side we have no Reason to be troubled at it but there is another thing of our side which you like worse and that is common Sense which is more useful to the World than School-Divinity But methinks he should not be angry with the common People when he takes such pains to prove That the Kingdom of Heaven is not only for the Wise and Learned and that our Saviour's Disciples were but poor Fishermen and we read but of one of his Apostles who was bred up at the feet of Gamaliel and that poor People have Souls to save as precious in the sight of God as the grim Logicians Would not any one take this for an Apology for the common People rather than for the Dutchess of York Whose Wit and Understanding put her far beyond the need of such a mean Defence Could she be vindicated in no other manner than by putting her into the rank of the Persons of the meanest Capacities But this is another part of the Decency of this Defence He had several pretty sayings as he thought upon this Subject and therefore out they come without regarding the Reflection implied in them on a Person of her Capacity as well as Dignity And so hâ— goes on in his Plea for the Ignorant i. e. for the common People as I am resolved to understand it Must they be damned unless they can make a regular Approach to Heaven in Mood and Figure Is there no entring there without a Syllogisin or ergotcering it with a Nego Concedo Distinguo This may pass for Wit and Eloquence among those I think he pleads for And so I am content to let it go for the sake of my Friends the common People But this is somewhat an unusual way of defending to plead for those he professes to despise and in such a manner as to reproach the Person he undertakes to defend From the Common People we come to Church-Mâ—n to see how he uses them And he hath soon found out a Faction among them whom he charges with juggling Designs but Romantick â—eroes must be allowed to make Armies of a field of Thistles and to encounter Wind-mills for Giants He would fain be the Instrumeâ—t to divide our Clergy and to fill them with suspicions of one another