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cardinal_n of_o lorraine_n be_v a_o principal_a member_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n and_o the_o second_o clergy_n man_n in_o the_o latin_a church_n yet_o he_o speak_v of_o the_o misery_n of_o france_n say_v in_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n if_o you_o will_v demand_v who_o have_v cause_v this_o tempest_n and_o fortune_n i_o can_v say_v nothing_o but_o this_o that_o this_o fortune_n be_v come_v by_o our_o mean_n cast_v we_o into_o the_o sea_n by_o we_o he_o must_v understand_v the_o roman_a clergy_n judas_n that_o betray_v christ_n give_v a_o true_a testimony_n against_o himself_o when_o he_o say_v i_o have_v sin_v in_o betray_v innocent_a blood_n and_o the_o limb_n of_o antichrist_n may_v give_v a_o true_a testimony_n against_o antichrist_n now_o whereas_o you_o say_v that_o they_o communicate_v with_o the_o roman_a church_n i_o grant_v they_o do_v in_o some_o thing_n or_o else_o they_o have_v not_o be_v member_n of_o that_o church_n but_o not_o in_o all_o for_o not_o in_o those_o thing_n they_o do_v disavow_v reprove_v condemn_v and_o that_o this_o may_v the_o better_o be_v understand_v i_o will_v enlarge_v my_o discourse_n herein_o chap._n viii_o what_o it_o be_v to_o communicate_v with_o other_o how_o far_o we_o yet_o communicate_v with_o the_o roman_a church_n and_o wherein_o we_o refuse_v to_o communicate_v communio_fw-la est_fw-la multorum_fw-la unio_fw-la quid_fw-la communio_fw-la quid_fw-la communion_n be_v the_o union_n of_o many_o they_o that_o agree_v in_o one_o opinion_n be_v so_o far_o unite_v they_o be_v one_o they_o that_o enjoy_v any_o thing_n in_o common_a be_v so_o far_o unite_v 12._o rom._n 12._o the_o church_n be_v one_o body_n 12._o 1_o cor._n 12._o christian_n be_v several_a member_n of_o this_o one_o body_n as_o therefore_o the_o member_n be_v many_o be_v unite_v in_o one_o body_n and_o do_v communicate_v in_o divers_a of_o the_o self_n same_o thing_n from_o that_o one_o body_n and_o communicate_v one_o unto_o another_o the_o service_n 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most_o uncertain_a that_o as_o well_o you_o may_v conclude_v that_o judas_n do_v not_o betray_v christ_n or_o peter_n deny_v christ_n fisher_n and_o therefore_o if_o protestant_n have_v have_v any_o pastor_n teach_v true_a doctrine_n in_o all_o age_n doubtless_o their_o name_n will_v be_v extant_a in_o history_n yet_o extant_a rogers_n i_o have_v already_o show_v your_o antecedent_n to_o be_v false_a if_o universal_a not_o to_o prove_v if_o particular_a and_o so_o this_o conclusion_n if_o particular_a i_o grant_v if_o universal_a i_o deny_v and_o say_v that_o a_o universal_a conclusion_n can_v follow_v out_o of_o particular_a premise_n you_o know_v the_o unquestioned_a rule_n conclusio_fw-la sequitur_fw-la deteriorem_fw-la partem_fw-la chap._n xii_o fisher_n which_o be_v presuppose_v and_o grant_v as_o master_n rogers_n seem_v to_o grant_v by_o grant_v master_n fisher_n four_o proposition_n i_o do_v not_o see_v how_o master_n rogers_n can_v deny_v master_n fisher_n five_o proposition_n 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year_n make_v no_o express_a mention_n of_o this_o or_o that_o ergo_fw-la no_o such_o thing_n be_v or_o be_v of_o no_o force_n rogers_n the_o subject_n of_o our_o discourse_n be_v humane_a history_n and_o humane_a authority_n and_o what_o i_o speak_v you_o grant_v but_o you_o extend_v it_o beyond_o the_o bound_n of_o our_o then_o subject_a and_o more_o than_o i_o will_v grant_v to_o divine_a authority_n to_o the_o word_n of_o god_n to_o the_o scripture_n i_o say_v the_o authority_n of_o man_n be_v like_o himself_o uncertain_a his_o work_n weak_a and_o unperfect_a like_o himself_o but_o the_o word_n of_o god_n be_v like_o himself_o certain_a strong_a and_o full_a of_o perfection_n and_o therefore_o the_o argument_n draw_v from_o divine_a authority_n be_v certain_a though_o negative_o in_o those_o thing_n which_o the_o word_n of_o god_n propose_v and_o profess_v full_o to_o express_v but_o in_o man_n it_o be_v otherwise_o as_o in_o the_o next_o chapter_n i_o will_v express_v more_o full_o fisher_n yet_o when_o the_o negative_a argument_n be_v ground_v in_o a_o already_o grant_v affirmative_a proposition_n as_o it_o be_v in_o this_o our_o case_n the_o negative_a argument_n be_v of_o great_a and_o undeniable_a force_n rogers_n this_o i_o grant_v that_o negative_n be_v so_o far_o depend_v upon_o affirmative_n as_o that_o they_o can_v be_v understand_v they_o can_v be_v define_v they_o can_v be_v demonstrate_v without_o affirmative_n and_o so_o they_o may_v fisher_n as_o for_o example_n if_o we_o do_v grant_v this_o proposition_n if_o such_o or_o such_o a_o thing_n be_v holy_a scripture_n will_v have_v speak_v of_o it_o or_o the_o father_n of_o the_o first_o 300_o year_n will_v have_v make_v express_a mention_n of_o it_o if_o i_o say_v we_o grant_v this_o we_o can_v not_o deny_v the_o aforesaid_a negative_a argument_n usual_o make_v by_o protestant_n to_o be_v of_o force_n against_o we_o rogers_n i_o do_v not_o see_v what_o i_o shall_v mislike_v in_o this_o only_o 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absolute_o grant_v his_o four_o proposition_n all_o these_o grant_n be_v find_v in_o one_o leaf_n and_o half_o a_o page_n and_o yet_o i_o never_o grant_v it_o fisher_n which_o be_v grant_v if_o he_o will_v make_v a_o good_a answer_n as_o he_o pretend_v he_o must_v first_o set_v down_o name_n of_o protestant_a pastor_n in_o all_o age_n and_o not_o content_v himself_o with_o name_v some_o who_o he_o think_v to_o be_v protestant_n and_o with_o say_v he_o have_v go_v half_o the_o way_n rogers_n yet_o more_o grant_n i_o must_v again_o deny_v the_o grant_n this_o be_v right_n petitio_fw-la principij_fw-la a_o beg_n of_o that_o which_o be_v in_o question_n i_o have_v oft_o enough_o deny_v it_o yet_o you_o will_v never_o leave_v beg_v it_o belike_o you_o think_v to_o wrest_v it_o from_o i_o with_o importunacie_n it_o will_v never_o be_v i_o pray_v you_o look_v back_o see_v what_o i_o answer_v to_o your_o five_o proposition_n there_o you_o shall_v read_v thus_o in_o the_o five_o proposition_n 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which_o be_v denounce_v against_o those_o who_o add_v unto_o the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o will_v you_o say_v that_o we_o profess_v any_o faith_n beside_o that_o which_o be_v contain_v in_o scripture_n this_o be_v your_o easy_a answer_v master_n fisher_n to_o deny_v that_o we_o profess_v that_o which_o we_o do_v profess_v in_o all_o our_o book_n in_o all_o our_o school_n in_o all_o our_o pulpit_n in_o all_o our_o discourse_n of_o this_o subject_n viz._n what_o we_o ought_v to_o believe_v you_o will_v as_o easy_o answer_v the_o other_o argument_n let_v we_o see_v the_o argument_n and_o your_o answer_n 2._o arg._n a_o signis_fw-la thus_o the_o faith_n which_o have_v testimony_n of_o antiquity_n universality_n and_o consent_n of_o father_n and_o other_o writer_n in_o all_o age_n have_v visible_a professor_n in_o all_o age_n but_o the_o faith_n of_o protestant_n have_v these_o testimony_n ergo_fw-la the_o faith_n of_o protestant_n have_v visible_a professor_n in_o all_o age_n to_o this_o you_o answer_v by_o deny_v the_o minor_a or_o second_o proposition_n thus_o the_o protestant_a faith_n have_v not_o testimony_n of_o antiquity_n universality_n and_o consent_n ad_fw-la part_n master_n fisher_n which_o article_n of_o the_o apostle_n creed_n do_v want_v the_o testimony_n of_o antiquity_n universality_n and_o consent_v which_o of_o those_o book_n receive_v for_o canonical_a of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o name_v of_o i_o a_o little_a before_o want_v these_o testimony_n of_o antiquity_n universality_n and_o consent_v be_v it_o genesis_n or_o exodus_fw-la or_o any_o other_o book_n of_o moses_n be_v it_o the_o psalm_n or_o proverb_n or_o history_n that_o want_v this_o testimony_n or_o be_v it_o esay_n or_o jeremie_n or_o ezekiel_n or_o daniel_n or_o any_o other_o of_o the_o prophet_n be_v it_o matthew_n or_o any_o other_o of_o the_o evangelist_n or_o apostle_n name_n the_o man_n name_v the_o church_n name_v the_o time_n if_o you_o can_v then_o say_v your_o easy_a answer_n be_v no_o answer_n 3._o arg._n ab_fw-la exemplis_fw-la thus_o name_n of_o such_o as_o profess_v the_o protestant_n faith_n in_o all_o age_n christ_n and_o his_o apostle_n st._n john_n ignatius_n polycarpus_n justinus_n martyr_n irenaeus_n tertullian_n clemens_n alex_n origen_n cyprian_n lactantius_n athanasius_n cyrill_n hierosol_n ambrozius_n nyssenus_n hieronimus_fw-la ruffinus_n chrysostomus_n augustinus_n cyrillus_n alex_n theodoretus_n socrates_n sozomenus_n fulgentius_n evagrius_n gregorius_n primus_fw-la beda_n damascenus_n alcuinus_fw-la thus_o have_v go_v half_a way_n i_o conclude_v with_o this_o argument_n the_o protestant_a faith_n be_v that_o which_o be_v contain_v in_o scripture_n be_v receive_v and_o teach_v by_o all_o the_o orthodox_n father_n but_o the_o father_n above_o name_v be_v all_o orthodox_n ergo_fw-la now_o what_o answer_n do_v you_o master_n fisher_n give_v to_o this_o argument_n of_o i_o not_o a_o word_n unless_o to_o deny_v the_o conclusion_n be_v 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i_o deny_v if_o the_o delay_n of_o seven_o or_o eight_o year_n for_o baptism_n do_v exclude_v they_o out_o of_o the_o church_n because_o many_o thereby_o be_v deprive_v of_o baptism_n than_o a_o short_a delay_n of_o forty_o day_n or_o eighty_o day_n shall_v exclude_v man_n out_o of_o the_o church_n because_o many_o child_n may_v die_v at_o twenty_o or_o thirty_o day_n old_a and_o yet_o we_o know_v many_o church_n in_o the_o world_n as_o the_o coftie_a in_o egypt_n do_v not_o baptise_v their_o child_n before_o the_o fourti_v day_n though_o they_o shall_v die_v without_o baptism_n primus_fw-la th._n a_o je_n lib._n 7._o p._n 1._o c._n 5._o so_o th._n ibid._n c._n 6._o leo_fw-la primus_fw-la the_o maronites_n who_o patriarch_n reside_v in_o syria_n baptise_v not_o their_o male_a child_n till_o forty_o day_n nor_o their_o female_n till_o eighty_o day_n after_o their_o birth_n he_o be_v a_o pope_n of_o rome_n which_o command_v that_o baptism_n shall_v not_o be_v minister_v at_o any_o 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that_o they_o ought_v to_o believe_v and_o offend_v if_o they_o do_v not_o but_o not_o with_o so_o great_a danger_n as_o if_o they_o believe_v not_o the_o former_a what_o mean_v these_o two_o distinction_n and_o that_o which_o i_o cite_v out_o of_o aquinas_n and_o by_o which_o i_o explicate_v my_o own_o distinction_n of_o fundamental_a and_o accessory_a i_o mean_v res_fw-la fidei_fw-la per_fw-la se_fw-la per_fw-la accidens_fw-la if_o this_o be_v answer_v to_o except_v against_o the_o ground_n of_o father_n schoolman_n jesuite_n and_o reform_a divine_n without_o frame_v one_o argument_n against_o they_o it_o be_v easy_a answer_v indeed_o whereas_o you_o say_v that_o none_o of_o the_o author_n by_o i_o allege_v not_o luther_n himself_o hold_v the_o entire_a protestant_a faith_n be_v untrue_a and_o you_o bring_v no_o proof_n but_o a_o false_a supposition_n that_o all_o protestant_a doctrine_n different_a from_o the_o faith_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n may_v be_v call_v doctrine_n of_o 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vel_fw-la per_fw-la se_fw-la well_fw-mi er_fw-mi accidens_fw-la be_v neither_o essential_o nor_o accidental_o the_o object_n of_o faith_n that_o which_o you_o allege_v out_o of_o athanasius_n i_o willing_o embrace_v i_o receive_v his_o creed_n i_o have_v often_o profess_v it_o in_o public_a but_o what_o be_v that_o to_o your_o new_a creed_n i_o find_v in_o athanasius_n his_o creed_n neither_o purgatory_n nor_o indulgence_n nor_o transubstantiation_n nor_o invocation_n of_o saint_n nor_o seven_o sacrament_n nor_o worship_v of_o image_n whereas_o you_o say_v i_o must_v hold_v it_o in_o the_o uncorrupted_a sense_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n i_o do_v embrace_v it_o but_o i_o will_v not_o understand_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n or_o the_o pope_n for_o the_o catholic_a church_n as_o you_o do_v the_o catholic_a church_n never_o receive_v your_o purgatory_n your_o half_a communion_n your_o worship_v of_o image_n as_o i_o have_v show_v already_o i_o will_v obstinate_o maintain_v nothing_o 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of_o image_n show_v what_o respect_n you_o have_v to_o scripture_n by_o your_o new_a creed_n you_o show_v what_o reverence_n you_o have_v to_o general_n counsel_n see_v the_o council_n of_o chalcedon_n decree_v have_v repeat_v that_o which_o be_v common_o call_v the_o nicene_n creed_n conc._n isidor_n fol._n 83_o and_o urge_v by_o the_o grecian_n in_o the_o council_n of_o florence_n surius_n tom._n 4._o sesse_n 5._o ferrariae_n habita_fw-la lib._n 7._o c._n 1._o de_fw-fr loc_fw-fr the._n pag._n 422_o 423._o de_fw-fr rebus_fw-la muscovitarum_fw-la pag._n 38._o in_o apara_fw-la sacr._n in_o diamperi_n conc._n that_o no_o man_n shall_v write_v or_o say_v other_o creed_n and_o whosoever_o do_v if_o bishop_n and_o clergyman_n let_v they_o be_v depose_v if_o monk_n and_o lay_v man_n let_v they_o be_v accurse_v what_o regard_v you_o have_v to_o the_o unanimous_a consent_n of_o the_o father_n appear_v by_o your_o doctrine_n that_o the_o virgin_n mary_n be_v conceive_v without_o original_a sin_n contrary_a to_o chrysostome_n ambrose_n augustine_n bernard_n and_o all_o the_o holy_a man_n that_o make_v mention_n of_o that_o point_n as_o your_o own_o canus_n confess_v and_o so_o you_o be_v innovator_n schismatic_n and_o heretic_n despise_v and_o excommunicate_v by_o all_o other_o christian_a church_n in_o the_o world_n by_o the_o grecian_n as_o appear_v by_o posevine_n your_o own_o jesuit_n by_o the_o indian_n as_o be_v acknowledge_v by_o the_o same_o author_n by_o the_o coftie_a of_o egypt_n and_o consequent_o by_o all_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o jacobite_n the_o aethiopian_n and_o other_o acknowledge_v all_o subjection_n unto_o the_o patriarch_n of_o alexandria_n so_o that_o upon_o you_o alone_o that_o curse_n be_v fall_v nec_fw-la amet_fw-la quenquam_fw-la nec_fw-la ametur_fw-la ab_fw-la ullo_fw-la you_o hate_v you_o condemn_v all_o church_n of_o the_o world_n and_o they_o condemn_v you_o you_o account_v they_o for_o schismatic_n and_o heretic_n and_o they_o you_o for_o 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