THE Divinity of Christ AND Unity of the Three that bear Record in Heaven WITH The blessed End and Effects of Christ's Appearance coming in the Flesh Suffering and Sacrifice for Sinners confessed and vindicated By his followers called Quakers And the principal matters in Controversie between Them and their present Opposers as Presbyterians Independants c. Considered and Resolved according to the Scriptures of Truth And more particularly to Remove the Aspersions Slanders and Blasphemies cast upon the People called QUAKERS and their Principles in several Books Written By Tho. Vincent Will. Madox their railing Book stil'd The Foundation c. Tho. Danson his Synopsis John Owen his Declaration Which are here Examin'd and Compared by G. W. And their Mistakes Errors and Contradictions both to themselves and each other made manifest As also A short Review of several Passages of Edward Stillingfleet's D.D. and Chaplin in Ordinary so called to his Majesty in his Discourse of the Sufferings of Christ And Sermon preached before the KING wherein he flatly Contradicts the said Opposers Mark 14.56 For many bare false witness against him but their witness agreed not together Coll. 2.8 Beware lest any man spoyl you through Philosophy and vain deceipt 1 Tim. 6.3 4 5 20. If any man consenteth not to the wholsome words of our Lord Jesus Christ c. he is puft up or proud c. Acts 24.14 After the way which they call Heresie do I Worship the God of my Fathers believing all things which are written in the Law and the Prophets c. London Printed in the Year 1669. An Epistle to the Presbyterians and Independants and their Rough Hearers who profess the Scriptures to be their Rule whereby they are examined and tryed and their wayes discovered 1 st WHether do the Scriptures speak of Three Persons in the God-head according to your own Rule in these express words let us see where it is written Come do not shuffle for we are resolved that the Scriptures shall buffet you about and that you shall be whipped about with the Rule 2 dly Where doth the Scripture speak of Christ's Righteousness imputed unto Unrighteous men who live in their sins and that in their Unrighteousness and Sins they shall live and die seeing that Faith purifies the heart from unrighteousness And he that believes passes from Death to Life and so from Sin that brought Death And he that receives Christ receives Righteousness it self by Faith in him the Lord the Righteousness this is Scripture 3 dly And where doth the Scripture say That a man shall not be made free from sin and that it is not attainable in this Life Let us see where ever Christ or the Prophets or Apostles preached such Doctrine Give us plain Scripture without adding or diminishing for Christ's bids men be perfect and the Apostle spoke Wisdom among them that were perfect 4 thly You that deny Perfection do ye not deny the One Offering Christ Jesus who hath perfected for ever them that are Sanctified Do you not deny the Blood of Christ Jesus in trampling it under your feet and the Blood of the new Covenant which Blood of Christ cleanseth from all sin and whose garments are made white by the Blood of the Lamb and he throughly purges his floor with his Fan and gathers his Wheat into his Garner 5 thly And did Christ make Satisfaction for the sins of men that they should live and die in their sins for he came to save his People from their sins and so he Died for them that they should not live to them but to God through him 6 thly Where do the Scripture speak of a Trinity of distinct Persons from Genesis to the Revelation give us plain Scripture for it without shuffling adding or diminishing you that talk so much of Scripture to be your Rule for the Father Word and Spirit this is owned according to Scripture and they agree in One. And we charge you to give us a plain Scripture that saith there are three separate Persons let us see Scripture we will have Scripture for it or otherwise be silent 7 thly And where do the Scriptures say That Christ the Light of the World which enlighteneth every one that cometh into the World is not sufficient to guide men to Salvation Christ saith Believe in the Light that you may become Children of the Light and Children of the Day and who walk in the Light there is no occasion of stumbling And this is the Condemnation that Light is come into the World and men love Darkness rather than Light because their deeds be evil And is not the Light sufficient that lets a man see whether his deeds be wrought in God read John 3. 8 thly Where doth the Scripture say from Genesis to the Revelation That the true Faith of God is without Works Hath not Faith works that purifies the heart Doth it not give Victory Will you deny the Works of Faith because the Works of the Law was denyed by the Apostle 9 thly Where doth the Scripture say That it self is the Word of God Do you not belye the Rule here For doth not the Scripture say That Christ is the Word and the Scriptures are Words read Exodus 20 and Revelation 22. He that adds to these Words and takes from these Words the Plagues of God are added to him So see whether you are not adders to these Words as it is made appear before And Christ saith My words that I speak unto you they are Spirit and Life c. And in many places of Scripture God saith My Words Doth not Scripture signifie Writing For all your high Schollar-ship you may go to the English School-Master and it will tell you what it signifies What is all the writing in Peoples hearts Is Paper and Ink in Peoples hearts Come do not cheat People but confess truth you affirm Scripture to be the Rule but are found contrary to the Rule But what is all the Scripture the Rule from Genesis to the Revelations to walk by and practice Or what part of Scripture is the Rule are Herods words Pharoahs words Nebuchadnezars words Judas words the Jewes words Jobs Friends words the Devils words the Offerings and the Sacrifices c. Come what part of Scripture is your Rule Distinguish For you say the Scripture is your Rule Is it all a Rule for practice Must we obey every tittle of it for we own the Scriptures more then you do which Holy Men of God gave forth Christ Jesus and the Apostles and Prophets and they made a distinction but you make none Do not go with your Malice and envious minds to possess the People and say That we dis-esteem the Scriptures for we esteem Scripture more than you do that have kept People under your Teaching that they might be paying of you and so make a Trade of them The Scriptures speaks plentifully concerning Christ being the Word of God God is the Word is not this Scripture And in the Beginning
Justification is within and the Mystery of Faith is held in a pure Conscience and the Conscience must be within must it not Reader And so here thou mayst see how these Presbyterians and Independants have erred from the Apostles Doctrine And in Rom. 5. and being Justified by Faith by whom we have access to God by Faith and Justified by Faith in Christ Jesus Gal. 2. And the Apostle saith I live by the Faith of the Son of God and the Just lives by Faith by grace you are saved through Faith Eph. 2.8 Luk. 2.5 thy Faith hath saved thee And do not the Presbyterians and Independants deny Christ's Doctrine who deny Perfection both the Doctrine of God and the Command of Jesus Christ and the Ministry of Christ Jesus and makes void all the Apostles Exhortation For God said to Abraham Walk before me and be thou perfect Gen. 17. And do they not deny the way of God which is perfect Psal. 18.30 And the Law of the Lord is perfect and Christ saith Every one that is perfect shall be as he is And be ye perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect Mat. 5. And Noah was a perfect man Gen. 6. Thou shalt be perfect with the Lord He hath made my way perfect 2 Sam. 20. Job was a perfect man and one that feared God and eschewed evil Job 1.1 God will not cast away the perfect man Now do you not say there is no Perfection Do you not give the Scripture the lye God made my way perfect Psal. 18. Mark the perfect man Psal. 37. And the Wicked may shoot at the perfect Psal. 64. And are not you them that shoot at the perfect with your dirty Arrows And Christ prayed That they may be perfect in one Joh. 17. Is not Christ's Prayer to be fulfilled or did he pray in vain Will you deny his Prayer you vain men Is not Christ's Prayers available The Apostle said He spoke wisdom among them that were perfect ye false Ministers say there are none perfect God comforts his People and Ministers and sayes His strength is made perfect in their weakness Herein is encouragement to Perfection by God's Ministers Be perfect be of good comfort but you say none can be perfect and so you are miserable Comforters And the Work of the Ministry Eph. 4. was to bring People to the knowledge of God to a perfect man and to the measure and stature of the fulness of Christ And are not you false Ministers and evil workers who say there is no Perfection you cannot bring them it seems to a perfect man you cannot bring them to the measure of the stature of Christ but runs up and down and fetches all the weaknesses of the Saints and applies them to People to hold up Imperfection to them as Paul Peter John and some others 2 Cor. 13. We wish your Perfection and Heb. 6. let us go on to Perfection And Col. 2. the bond of Perfectness So is it not clear here whose Ministers you are neither according to God nor Christ nor according to the Scriptures nor according to the Prophets nor Apostles By one Offering he hath Perfected for ever them that are Sanctified And what Hee is this but Christ Jesus And now it 's clear That you deny this Faith that Sanctifies and that you deny this one Offering mark for ever them that are Sanctified And so it 's clear That you deny the one Offering of Christ Jesus without the Gates of Jerusalem and sayes That none are perfect and no Perfection here You may as well say there is no Faith here And you that say also there is no Overcoming here you may as well deny Belief here for he that believes is born of God and he that is born of God overcomes the World and greater is he that is in you than he that is in the World So it is manifest That you have not this greater Birth in you to overcome the World and here you stand against all the Believers and all the houshold of Faith which Faith gives Victory And you say there is no Victory here And so what can you cry up but sin and Bawdy-houses And you would rather have your People go into Bawdy-houses then to go to the houshold of Faith which preaches down Sin and Imperfection For God is perfect his Way is perfect and he bids be perfect And the Ministers was to present every man perfect in Christ Jesus see Col. And you Preach up Imperfection for term of Life so Ministers of Satan for the Devil made man imperfect Christ makes them perfect and God made them perfect and said Be perfect So are you not all the blind Guides that leads into the ditch which is a corrupted place that People are corrupted not perfect but the true Ministers presented them perfect in Christ Jesus And so is it not clear That you deny the Blood of Christ and trample it under your feet For Christ Sanctifies his People with his own Blood Heb. 10. The Blood of Christ Jesus cleanseth from all sin 1 Joh. 1. Rev. And he hath washed us from our sins in his Blood And they overcame by the Blood of the Lamb And whose Garments were made white by the Blood of Jesus And do you not give the Apostle and the Scriptures the Lye and makes Christ's Blood of none Effect And sayes They are not made white they are not cleansed from all sin and that they must have a body of sin and death as long as they live and that they are not Redeemed to God Do you not make the Blood of Christ of none effect here which is to wash and to cleanse away that which is brought into Adam by the Serpent and deny Christ's Purchase who purchased his People and Justifies by his Blood and Redeemed through his Blood And what Redemption is this and Purchase is this and Justification is this if they be not Redeemed out of sin and evil and old Adam Christ hath Redeemed us to God through his Blood Rev. 5. Eph. 1. Are not you them that have counted the Blood of the new Covenant of none effect Heb. 10. and troden it under foot wherewith he Sanctifies and so are they that have done despite against the Spirit of Grace for do you not say the Spirit of God is not given to every man to profit withal only some have the Spirit say you Who are they then that vexes it and quenches it and grieves it And were not they wicked People whom the Lord gave his good Spirit to to instruct them Nehem. 9. they were such as rebelled against Nehemiah And here it is clear That you make Sects and denies the Prophets and Apostles Doctrine And you say That Christ doth not enlighten every man that cometh into the World Do you not here deny John's Doctrine and Scriptures and Christ himself who saith He is the Light of the World And deny that which People should believe in believe in the Light that you may become
in that to the Romans as also in that to the Galatians See Rom. 3 4. chap. and Gal. 2 3 4 5. chap. that they were the Works of the Law and not the Works of Faith without which they were Justified And as of his telling of the Deficiency of Righteousness inherent I say that Christ's Righteousness within is not Deficient who works both perfect Sanctification and Righteousness in true Believers and what is the end of seeking for a Righteousness without as T.V. saith if they must not really injoy Christ's Righteousness within And where do the Scripture say That they may seek for Christ's Righteousness Imputed without themselves How proves he this by Scripture c. his saying they can be Justified only by Faith whilst he excludes its Works it 's contrary to the Apostles Doctrine Jam. 2. Faith if it hath not Works is dead being alone and ye see how that by Works man is Justified and not by Faith only vers 17.24 T. V. Which Faith he putteth in opposition to all Works not only of the Ceremonial and Moral Law but also to all Works wrought in Faith which are works still such as Abraham's Works and David's Works were pag. 70 71. Reply The Justifying Faith which is Living and Real was never put in opposition to its own Work by either Christ his Apostles or Ministers nor to all or any Works wrought in it self by any but Antichrist and his Ministers such as T. V. and his Brethren have manifestly shewn themselves to be in this and other particulars For the Apostle Paul was so far from putting Faith in opposition to all Works wrought in it that he saith Do we then make void the Law through Faith God forbid yea we Establish the Law Rom. 3.31 And if while we seek to be Justified by Christ we our selves also are found sinners is therefore Christ the Minister of sin God forbid and I through the Law am dead to the Law that I may live unto God Gal. 2.17 Now this Living unto God being Crucified with Christ was by the Faith of the Son of God which Living unto God was in the Righteousness of Faith and not in sin for Christ is not the Minister of sin so that he doth not set Faith in opposition to its own Works as most falsly is affirmed but to those Works whether of the Law or other self-Works or Righteousness that were out of the True Faith which purifies the heart gives Victory Sanctifies and Justifies and the Saints knew the puting off the body of the sins of the Flesh by the Circumcision of Christ so that they did not carry a body of sin all their time about with them and a being buried with him in Baptism wherein also they they are risen with him through the Faith of the operation of God who haith Raised him up from the dead Col. 2.11 12. And that God would fulfil the Work of Faith with Power 2 Thes. 1.11 This Paul prayed for so he did not set Faith in opposition to its own Work As also Heb. 11. how amply is the true Faith without which it's impossible to please God demonstrated by the many Works and blessed Effects of it which did attend it in God's People in their acceptable obedience and subjection to him both in Doing and Suffering concerning which both Abel Enoch Noah Abraham Sarah Isaac Joseph Moses and many others are instanced for their faithful obedience and subjection As also the Apostle James chap. 2.20 21 22. plainly Contradicteth T.V. his putting Faith in opposition to its own Works wherein he might as well have put it in opposition to it self Who farther adds from Rom. 4.2 5. touching God's Justifying the ungodly That no Persons being the subjects of the Gospel Justification but as ungodly Reply Herein again he has wrested Scripture for the Apostle doth not say he Justifies them AS ungodly but he that believeth on him that Justifieth the ungodly it 's not as ungodly which were the believing Gentiles that were so ungodly there intended before they came into the Work of Faith and to partake of its Righteousness within for they were not Justified in ungodliness but from it Justifieth is not Justified the one being the Work a doing the other done which where it is so Effected by Faith that purifieth the heart therein the real Subjects of Gospel Justification are manifest not as ungodly but as Righteous being Washed Sanctified and Justified by the Spirit of our God and that in the Name and Power of the Lord Jesus 1 Cor. 6.11 Moreover T.V. hath Confessed That God doth not leave them ungodly where he removeth the guilt of sin he removeth also the filth of sin Justification and Sanctification being inseparable companions and that Justification is never without Sanctification pag. 70. Reply It 's well he has somewhat inclined to Confess to Truth though to the manifest break-neck and overthrow of his own Cause For now What 's become of his Justification of the ungodly of the Guilty as ungodly c. by the imputed Righteousness of Christ as his words are And when was that performed or wrought Now not till Sanctification be known that the filth of sin is removed Justification and Sanctification being inseparable companions and the one never without the other And surely people are not the subjects of Sanctification or Sanctified as ungodly or as in the filth or pollution of sin let the Readers but mark here how flatly this T. Vincent hath overthrown and contradicted himself and his corrupt Doctrine for an Imputation of Righteousness to the Unrighteous and a Justification in Sin and Transgression as ungodly c. whereas he that Justifieth the Wicked and he that Condemneth the Just they both are abomination unto God Prov. 17.15 And of this our Adversary is greatly guilty And as for Tho. Danson's Synopsis which he so highly commends as that the use of it may be great for the Establishing of Christians in the Truths c. By this he does but shew his own shallowness and weakness to Commend thus highly of such a silly confussed piece which hath also many Lyes and Falshoods in it as that sorry Pamphlet of T. D's as it will further be manifest and how apparently both T. V. and T.D. have Contradicted themselves and each other even in their principal Points And as for his putting off S. E. his Challenge to Fast and Watch as a Tempting of God and a God provoking sin to endanger self-murther And judges him as being Mad and numbred amongst distracted People Indeed this is as smooth a put off and excuse as he could readily have imagined to excuse himself from Fasting c. so that his Accusing S.E. as being Mad Distracted c. does neither prove him to be so nor does it destroy either S.E. his Confidence or Motion in the matter but sets it the more over T. V. and his Brethrens heads who are afraid their God should fail them and to enter upon this
and his own notions and conceptions which are not grounded on Scripture and therefore we may not have our Faith imposed upon by them as to accept of his humane conceptions and notions which cannot reach the nature of God for divine verities And how says T. D. That infiniteness being a property of the Divine Nature agrees to each Person subsisting in that Nature contrary to his worthy Master Vincent's saying that infiniteness is not ascribed unto the Personality but such like confusion and conrradiction we have enough of from them And indeed such nonsensical stuff as is in both their Pamphlets I have seldom met withal as one while T. D. saith We do not affirm the Person in the Godhead to be finite but infinite another while T. V. saith infiniteness is not ascribed to them another while T. D. saith pag. 14. That they are one among themselves only in respect of that wherein they agree not simply What kind of oneness or agreement doth he reckon is in the Diety if it be not simply Was there ever such darkness and confusion uttered and what blind Sophistry and silly Logick and babling do these men use and put upon the Immortal God whom with all their inventions airy notions and vain conceptions they can never reach the knowledge of neither will nor can their Heathenish Phylosophy tearms of Aristotle nor apostate Christians and Papists demonstrate or discover the Knowledge of either Father Word or Spirit to any people that want the knowledge thereof but make them more dark and ignorant and shut them up in more blindness as they have a long time done And his saying that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 may by a metalepsis yea must be rendred Person or Subsistent or some word to that effect and so tells that Just. Martyr applies 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to Father Son and Spirit pag. 17. Reply Surely T. D. is put very hard to it to word his Doctrine by his Anology and Metalepsis for his distinctions of Persons and his thereby rendring 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Person of necessity Where proves he this and those tearms by Scripture and if they signifie one and the same thing why is not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in Hebr. 1.3 and Chap. 11.1 as well as 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 As in Hebr. 11.1 Faith is the Substance of things hoped for it is not Person of things hoped for the same word that is for Substance in that is Hebr. chap. 2. verse 3. where it is speaking of the Son of God who being the brightness of his Glory and the express Image of his Substance Besides what ever Authors or Fathers so called did put names distinctions and tearms upon the Godhead which were either improper or unscriptural we must believe the Scriptures rather then them And do they count all Justin Martyr wrot One hundred fifty years after Christ to be of equal Authority with the Scriptures of Christ and the Apostles Or might not probably Justin bring in some of his Philosophy which is not Scripture And we do not read in the Scriptures either of three distinct Substances in God or three distinct Persons for where are they so rendred either in the Hebrew Greek Latine or English in Scripture from the beginning of Genesis to the end of the Revelations But if they be not three Substances as Tho. Vincent saith how doth T. Danson make 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 equivolent or apply both to Father Son and Spirit Is not here a manifest contradiction between these two Brethren unto themselves and their own Doctrine in this matter As for T. D. his Discourse about satisfaction there needs not much to be said unto it for that the matter hath been answered before as also in part he assents to W. P. in what he hath said for he T. D. doth not affirm any impossibility of forgiviness without a plenary satisfaction made as in the sence and notion some of them have c. And though he knows some worthy Persons do deny W. P's Affirmative yet he cannot joyn with them therein He saith also God is free in his determinations what attribute he will manifest and in what degree and manner and that between Justice and Mercy and their effects and all of his meer will interveens c. By all which in a great measure he hath confest to what W. P. hath writ in that case though in contradiction to his Brother Vincent as is evident But where he speakes of Vindictive Justice that God might onely have manifested when man fell as he does upon the reprobate Angels or Devils c. Now I query then Is this Vindictive Justice that which Christ under-went at God's hand and satisfied according to their Doctrine if they say it is where do the Scriptures say so or that God inflicted the same revengefull justice as I think they mean upon Christ that he doth upon the reprobate Angels or Devils and then make this the means and manner of full satisfaction for mankind let us have plain Scripture for this Doctrine was God's Love to man purchased by such revenge upon his innocent Son as he lays upon reprobate Angels or Devils or is it not rather blasphemous to suppose that Christ could ever be so far out of Gods favour as to construe his Sufferings to the height of revenge as goes against reprobate Angels and Devils and doth not this also accord with T. V. his Doctrine whereas Chrit was the beloved of the Father even his onely begotten the Son of his Love in whom his Soul delighted and was always well pleased both in his works and Sufferings both in his life and death for Sinners but angry with the wicked such as persecuted him and crucified him afresh unto themselves as he was also crucified in Spiritual Sodom and Egypt such Adversaries God will be avenged of but his pleasure shall prosper in the hand of his Anointed Seed Christ but these things T. D. his weak judgement as he confesseth it to be pag. 18. cannot reach And indeed in much of his Discourse about this matter he has talked more like a Lawyer then a Divine and has brought several similitudes which will not hold in matters of such high concernment But I shall not need much to take notice of his dark kind of reasoning in this particular which proceeds but from his weak judgemnt and private conceptions since the matter is answered elsewhere and the extent of his and their Principles therein is further manifest and handled about his and their Doctrine of Imputed Righteousness and his Arguments for Sin and Imperfection in all tearm of life yet a little to some particulars I may observe by the way of this point after he saith he shall give us his sence confessing that Satisfaction is not a Scripture phrase pag. 19. However we will chuse Scripture phrase rather then T. D's weak judgment and conceptions therein having
was the Word and all things were made by the Word and were all things made by the Scriptures And we say the Scriptures are a better Rule than your Directory for if the Scriptures be the Rule why do you set up a Directory to be your Rule What! will you bore out Peoples eyes that they shall not see how you dissemble And why did you make a Church Faith at Savoy in eleaven dayes time if the Scriptures be your Rule But it seems the Scriptures are not a sufficient Rule for you but your Directory and your Church Faith it seems is your Rule Scriptures are not sufficient to be your Rule And why do you deny Common Prayer and set up a Directory and a Church Faith of your own making And there in your Directory do you not set up your Imaginations and Meanings above Scriptures Come People will not sell their Wits Reason and Understanding Come People you all know that when you come to discourse with these Presbyterians or Independants about Scriptures who say it is their Rule they will presently fall and give it a meaning and say it is their Opinion and Judgement and conceive it to be so And so then the Presbyterians and Independants Meanings and Opinions and Thinkings and Conceivings and Imaginations and Judgements this must be the Rule and not the Scripture then you must not take it as the Scriptures speake The Quakers will take it Literally cry they and these have been the Presbyterian and Independant tricks this long time What think you do we not know your tricks And so you would make People believe what an Esteem you have of Scriptures when it is nothing but Meanings and old Directory and Church Faith Do you think we have forgot your old Malice and Envie when you haled above three thousand of us to Prison in the other Powers dayes and persecuted to Death about thirty three which stands upon Record to this day whose Blood you have drunk and mingled with your Sacrifice and whose innocent Blood lies upon your heads Was the Scripture your Rule to do thus Nay Christ bids you love Enemies let Scripture be your Rule Have you not been like Judas and the Persecuting Jewes and the Heathen that Persecuted the true Christians You have banished the Rule which is to love Enemies and love one another And Christ saith Freely ye have received freely give But you will not give freely for you have not received freely You will have the Club and the Bagg For what havock have you made of them that could not put into your mouths what Imprisoning and spoyling of Goods did you make when you had Power this is not Gospel this is besides the Rule You are worse than the outward Jewes for where did they ever take trebble damages of them that did not hire them It was time for the Lord to bring you down who are judged by your own Rule 10 thly And why do you belye the Quakers with saying That your good Works that is of self are the Meritorious Cause of Justification Answ. Christ Works all our Works in us and for us who is our Justifier S. F. hath sufficiently cleared this matter and answered you 11 thly And where doth the Scripture say The Works of Faith and the Works of Grace and the Fruits of the Spirit are sinful 12 thly And where do the Scriptures hold forth the Sprinkling of Infants and call it an Ordinance and tell of a Sacrament and call it an Ordinance Let us see Scripture for these things and that the Apostles practised them as you do and whether your practises were according to theirs And have you the same Power and Spirit as they had that gave forth Scriptures Answer plainly in plain words of Scripture that you do not err from the Words and Rule which you say is your Rule But do you not remember you Presbyterians and Independants what havock you made of the Goods of the People of God whom in scorn you called Quakers because they would not pay for the Bread and Wine you eat and drunk you drunk it your selves and eat it your selves and made them Pay for it did the Apostles ever do so to spoyl any ones Goods because they would not pay for their Bread and Wine they eat and drunk Come let us see your Scripture your Rule which you boast so much of for these things who make People believe it is your Rule let us see a Rule for this But you grumble because you have not Power to fall upon the Quakers to make them pay for your Bread and Wine you eate and drink as you have done formerly and then when you have done boast that Scripture is your Rule and you say this is Gospel this is Glad Tydings is it and then you spoyl their Goods for your Bread and Wine Where were you in the time of Persecution we could see but few of you then for then you slunk into Holes and Corners had out your Scouts and now when you have a little Liberty what a bawling you make against Quakers You are a little hungry bitten because you have not Tythes and Easter Reckonings and Midsummer Dues and Money of the Quakers for your Bread and Wine will you avenge your self of the Quakers 13 thly And do you not say That your Sanctification and Justification and your Prayers and Graces and Faith all are imperfect as manifest in you Is not Christ Justification and Sanctification And must you not Pray in the Spirit of God And is it not perfect What darkness is this Must not Christ be in you And is not he in you and Faith in you and the Spirit of God in you to Pray by And so if it be imperfect then it is your own Praying and your own Justitication and Sanctification and Faith and Application it 's of your own making and not Christ's for Christ is perfect who Sanctifies and Justifies and his Spirit is perfect Priest Danson Presbyterian how now Dost thou not bring Cardinal Pool and Aquinas and Aristotle to prove thy Assertions and thy Imaginations it seems Scripture is not sufficient Thou wouldst make People believe that the Presbyterians were against the Papists and Heathen both but now they must be the Presbyterians Patrons and yet could make People believe that the Scriptures were their Rule but this must be their Rule the Papists and the Heathen Read Danson's Synopsis of his Quakerism what a bundle of Lyes he hath drawn up together he may take them home to himself 14 thly And why do you Presbyterians cry against the Quakers Light which is Christ as being but an Heathenish light and now to oppose them you are fain to run to the Heathen and to the Papists to find Arguments and then tell People the Scripture is your Rule O Deceipt 15 thly Where doth the Scripture speak of an Humane Nature of Christ in Heaven Is not Christ and his Body Glorified and he the Lord from Heaven for is not
get some gain if you had Bawdy-houses but if you go to the People of God's Meetings then you will get no gain Well might William Pen say the Priest prayed whiningly and looked pale when you had lost your Easter-Reckonings and Midsummer-Dues Is not the Great Bason holden at Door What this is a new way Is it Whether brings in more profit to the Priests mouths Tythes and Easter-Reckonings and Midsummer-Dues or the Great Platter Now do you not cry up Bawdy-houses or any way so that you can get gain I wonder for all this idle time you have had that you could not Answer Samuel Fisher's Book amongst you for it stands upon your heads he hath Answered all your Principles and more then you have questioned Have you forgot your Regiment of Fighting Priests and how the Presbyterians and Priests beat the Quakers Read the Book of Fighting Priests how they tore the Cloaths off Lasses and young Men and drew their Rapiers upon them and broke their heads and shed their blood and yet you must have the Title of Gospelers but more like unto raging Heathens who imagine vain things against God and Christ and his People but the Lord hath broken your horn the wild beast and put him under a chain So we looked you would have given out a Book of Repentance for all your wicked Actions in the other Powers dayes and shewed forth a work of Reformation Do you not remember how you came with your Drums and Fiddles Independants and Presbyterians Is it not clear here to all People That you deny God and Christ and the Doctrine of the Prophets and Apostles in your saying That God hath ordained some Persons to be damned when God saith Ezek. 18.32 He desires not the death of him that dieth And in Isa. 1.18 it 's said Come let us reason together saith the Lord though your sins be as scarlet they shall be as white as snow and though they be red like crimson they shall be like wooll And vers 16. Wash ye make ye clean put away the evil of your doings from before mine eyes cease to do evil learn to do well And the Apostle saith in 1 Tim. 2.4 God would have all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the Truth And Christ hath given himself a Ransom for all to be testified in due time And Christ tasted death for every man and is a Propitiation for the sins of the whole world And his Blood was shed for all men And the Gospel is to be Preached to every Creature And Go and teach all Nations Matth. 28. Now is it not clear That these Presbyterians and Independants who say That Christ died but for some and offered but for some Have they not denied Christ's Blood for all men and his Propitiation for all men And in doing this they deny God's Will who would have all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the Truth And would they not lay the fault in God when the fault is in man by not believing And do they not make Sects here in saying he died but for some and would have but some to be saved and he shed his Blood but for some And the Scripture saith That all are gone astray both Jew and Gentile that he might have mercy upon All See Rom. 11.32 And they say That he will not have mercy upon all and do not you say That he will have mercy upon some contradicting the Apostle and the Rule For the Scripture saith Christ enlighteneth every man that cometh into the World and you say that he enlighteneth but some And the Scripture saith That the grace of God that bringeth Salvation hath appeared to all men and you say The Grace of God that brings Salvation hath appeared but to some and all have not received Grace And the Scripture saith God so loved the World that he gave his only begotten Son into the World that whosoever believeth in him should not perish but have everlasting life And do not you say he gave him but for a few and loved some of the World And do not you Contradict Scripture and God and Christ and the Prophets and Apostles words and so are found in an Erronicus Principled Spirit And so is it not clear that you deny Christ who died without the Gates at Jerusalem whose Blood was shed for all men and denies the Propitiation and Attonement for all men and denies Jacob's Prophecy who prophesied That the gathering of all Nations shall be to Shilo And you say That some of the Nations shall be saved not all and here do you not deny the very Scripture it self and God and Christ and the Prophets and Apostles words and denies their Doctrine And also Is it not clear that you deny the true Faith of God's Elect that the Just lives by And is not Faith the Gift of God And do you not say That Faith is not perfect Do not you hold Justification without and that it is without Man and Woman And doth not Faith heal See Matth. Mark Luke and the Acts. And was not the Church Established in the Faith Acts 16.5 Is it not called the Righteousness of Faith Rom. 4.13 And how that the Saints are Heirs by Faith and it is called the Word of Faith Rom. 10. And it is called the Spirit of Faith 2 Cor. 4.13 Gal 5.6 and Faith that works by Love So it 's clear that you are out of this Faith that lives in malice and hatred And the Scripture speaks of one Faith one Baptism Eph. 4. and the Unity is in the Faith and Faith gives Victory over that which hath separated from God And Faith is the Shield And the Saints was to strive together for the Faith of the Gospel 1 Thes. 3. Remember your work of Faith and put on the brestplate of Faith 1 Thes. 5.8 The work of Faith with Power and holding Faith and a good Conscience 1 Tim. 5.19 And have not you made shipwrack of this Faith in Christ Jesus and God to say Christ's Blood was not shed for all men and God would not have all men to be saved and hath ordained some to damnation Is not Faith called a Mystery 1 Tim. 3.9 Were not the Saints to fight the good Fight of Faith 1 Tim. 6.12 Are not you among them that have erred concerning the Faith and have overthrown the Faith of some in not believing the one Offering once for all his Blood for all his Death for all and so are become Reprobates concerning the Common Faith Tit. 1.4 And without Faith it is impossible to please God who is the Author and Finisher of our Faith which you made yours at Savoy in eleven dayes time in Oliver's dayes And the Just shall live by his Faith Heb. 2. and hearts purified by Faith Acts 15. and Sanctified by Faith Acts 26. Rom. 3. a man is Justified by Faith So it 's clear Reader that Faith Justifies Sanctifies and Faith purifies rhe heart and so this
Children of the Light as in Joh. 14. And deny that which should give People the Knowledge of the Light that is in their hearts the Light of Jesus 2 Cor. 4. And so People see what these men can Preach that deny true Faith true Belief true Apostles and Scripture and the Blood of Christ and the Offering and so denies God and Christ and his Commands and Preach up Sin and Imperfection and the Bawdy-houses and would have his Hearers rather go to a Bawdy-house than to go among the People called Quakers that Preaches up Perfection and the Blood of Jesus the One Offering that makes People perfect and Sanctifies them and must not People have Faith in them and Christ in them and the Blood in them sprinkling their Hearts and Consciences Reader I pray thee read the Scriptures for they were given forth to be read and believed and not for Presbyterians and Independants to make a Trade of them and keep People alwayes to be hearing them and paying of them the Holy Men of God did not give forth the Scriptures for that end that suffered many of them to death for giving them forth And so I pray thee Reader do not fell thy Wit and Reason any longer for they will put it up all in their Pokes and Bags and then lead them into a ditch and barren Mountain and so feed themselves of you and not feed you But the Lord is come to gather his People from off the barren Mountains and from their mouths that have fed themselves and not the Flock and sought themselves and not the Flock and made a Prey upon you and sought for your wooll hath bit you when you put not into their mouths and have sought for handfuls of Barley and a piece of Bread and hath born rule amongst you by their means and hath been the greedy dumb Dogs that could never have enough who have been slumbering Read Jer. 5. Isa. 56. Mic. 3. Ezek. 14. and so read how Christ marks out those false Teachers Mat. 23. And the Apostle to Timothy and Titus So no more but my Love that you may all come to know the Freedom in Christ from all the blind Guides G. F. Jo. Stubbs If that the Father Son and Holy Ghost be three distinct separate Persons not simply One or agreeing simply as the Priest saith then how far distance are they from one another shew us Chapter and Verse for this and make it good by Scriptures And let us see through all the Scriptures where ever the Holy Men of God did give such Titles or Names to God and Christ and the Holy Ghost as the Presbyterians and Independants have done as may be seen in this Book The Scripture saith That God and Christ and the Holy Ghost will dwell in Man then you Independant Presbyterian Priests Whether then that there is not three Persons in a Man dwelling in him that is a Person for the Apostle saith That your Bodies are the Temples of the Holy Ghost and that your Bodies are the Temples of God and that Christ is in you except ye are Reprobates The DIVINITY of CHRIST Confessed by us called Quakers And What we own touching the Deity or God-head according to the Scriptures THat there is but one God the Father of whom are all things and we in him and our Lord Jesus Christ by whom are all things and we by him That there are Three that bear Record in Heaven the Father the Word and the Spirit and that these three are One both in Divinity Divine Substance and Essence not three Gods nor separate Beings That they are called by several Names in Scripture as manifest to and in the Saints for whatsoever may be known of God is manifest in man Rom. 1. and their Record received as the full testimony of three by such as truly know and own the Record of the three in Earth and yet they are Eternally One in Nature and Being One infinite Wisdom One Power One Love One Light and Life c. We never denyed the Divinity of Christ as most injuriously we have been accused by some prejudiced spirits who prejudicially in their perverse Contests have sought occasion against us As chiefly because when some of us were in Dispute with some Presbyterians we could not own their unscriptural distinctions and terms touching the Father the Word and the Holy Spirit to wit Of their being incommunicable distinct separate persons or subsistences whereas the Father the Word and Spirit are One not to be compared to corruptible men nor to finite Creatures or Persons which are limitable and separable For the only Wise God the Creator of all who is One and his Name One is infinite and inseparable Deut. 6.4 Zec. 14.9 And the Father's begetting the Son and the Spirit 's being sent we witness to and own as He said Thou art my Son this day I have begotten thee Psal. 2.7 Heb. 1.5 And he hath sent his Spirit into our hearts Gal. 4.6 And that the Father is in the Son and the Son in the Father yea in the bosome of the Father Joh. 1.18 chap. 17.21 23. so that they are neither divided nor separate being One and of One infinite Nature and Substance Christ being the Image of the invisible God the first born of every Creature by whom all things were Created both in Heaven and in Earth Col. 1. Yea the Son of God is the brightness of his glory and the express Image of his substance Heb. 1.3 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 And that it was in due time God was manifest in Flesh 1 Tim. 3.16 As in the fulness of time God sent his Son Gal. 4. And the Son of God was made manifest to destroy sin 1 Joh. 3.8 And a manifestation of the Spirit is given to every Man to profit withal 1 Cor. 12. So the manifestation of the Father of the Son and Holy Spirit we confess to and own to be in Unity and so the only true God according to the Scriptures And that Jesus Christ being in the Form of God thought it no robbery to be Equal with God and yet as a Son in the fulness of time was sent of the Father and took on him the form of a servant Phil. 2.6 7. in which state he said My Father is greater than I 1 Joh. 14.28 And he learned Obedience through Suffering and was made perfect and is become an everlasting High Priest after the Order of Melchisedeck and is the Author of Eternal Salvation unto all them that Obey him Heb. 5. And God hath given us Eternal Life in his Son And unto us a Child is born and a Son is given to Govern whose Name is Wonderful Counsellor The Mighty God The Everlasting Father The Prince of Peace Isa. 9.6 And he is over all God blessed for ever Rom. 9.5 Even the true God and Eternal Life 1 Joh. 5. So that the Deity or Divinity of Christ in his Eternal Infinite Glorious State we really confess and
the Word and the Apostle called it the Word of Faith which was nigh them in their mouthes and in their hearts but saith T. D. It is not the Light within but the Scriptures as if he should say the Scriptures of the Old and New Testament were in their mouthes and hearts but this Word of which they give testimony was in the hearts of all the holy men of God that gave forth the Scriptures before they writ them and it was a Lamp to David's feet and a Light to his path and he hid it in his heart that he might not sin c. Psal. 119.11 verse 115. and the Word is for ever setled in Heaven verse 89. this was that which quickned sanctified and saved the Righteous in and thorow all Generations and of this the Scriptures or Writings do testifie in which are words of God but the Word was before they were spoke or writ And T. D.'s accusing the Quakers for not owning the Authority of the Scriptures is false for we are in the Spirit that gave forth and openeth and brings to the right use and end of them and in the same Spirit can and do make use of them not only to prove our Tenents and to Confute our Opposers but also to obey and practice the things contained in them which are truly moral and Christian as the Spirit of Truth doth direct and enable T. D. We are not now to expect any new discovery of Truth as to the matter revealed but only as to the person whom God enlightens gradually to discern the evidence of what is revealed in Scripture Answ. First If no new Discovery then what is in Scriptures then no need of Popish and Heathenish Authors to prove distinct and separate personal Subsistances in God nor any other such traditional distinctions which obscures the simplicity of Scripture Truth and darkens the minds of People but people should rather be referred singly to the Scripture Phrase and Language and to search them in the Light of Christ within Secondly if the discerning of the Scripture is from God's enlightning them people ought to be recommended to God to wait in his Light to know his Counsel and direction therein or otherwise they will remain ignorant of the Scriptures and Revelation of the things declared Again it s well that T. D. confesseth that there are Prophesies and Histories of things done before the Pen-mens birth as also personal experiences c. So now at length he doth a little assent to Truth as if he were a little convinced by S. Fisher's Answer to him that he doth not now bind up all to the Scriptures but confesseth that Prophesies Histories and personal experiences to be before the Pen-mens birth But herein he hath but manifested his uncertainty and wavering to and again one while opposing the Sufficiency of the Light and placing all upon the Scriptures as the only Rule another while upon the matter contained in the Scriptures which was before the Scriptures were written and was written on the heart of the Gentiles another while the Light within he seems to assent unto as in pag. 67. for them that have not Scripture another while Prophesies and Experiences where before the Scripture and thus at length the Spirit or Light that gave forth the Scriptures must be preferred as the most certain and universal Guide and Rule as indeed it is to all them who follow obey and believe in it and this Light the blind corrupt imaginary Teachers whose knowledge and profession is but natural and traditional cannot corrupt as they have done the Scriptures by their false glosses meanings and private interpretations contrary to the intent and end of the Spirit of God which gave them forth and which leads into all Truth and Righteousness for a further Answer to T. D. touching this matter I do refer the Reader to S. Fisher's Book titled Rusticus ad Accademicos And as for his accusing Quakers with error touching Baptism and the Lords Supper as to their ceasing and setting up the appearance of Christ within c. Answ. The one Baptism Ephes. 4.5 into the one Body 1 Cor. 12.13 and the eating drinking and supping with Christ at the table of the Lord in his house and Kingdom we own and experience but what Baptism it is he intends whether sprinkling Infants or John's Baptism he hath not discovered neither indeed doth it concern him now to make such a frivolous pudder against the Quakers upon this account for indeed we do not look upon him either as a true Minister nor as having a call either from God or man as one impowered to impose things he calls Ordinances its probable when he was Parish Priest at Sandwich in Kent in Cromwel's time he could shew a greater force for his impositions then now he can in Houses and Corners where he and his Brethren can creep and not only so but be ready to obscure and hide themselves if but a little Storm and Trial come He stiles himself sometime Minister of the Gospel at Sandwich but is not rather that report of him true that there he was given to Gaming Bowls and Nine-pins c But as to the appearance and enjoyment of Christ within we do confess him to be the Substance and the Living Bread and in him we are kept not only in a Living remembrance but also in a real Possession of the Power and Vertue of his Life having known a conformity to his Death which is more then a remembrance of it and we know him to be the enduring Divine Substance which ends all Types Shaddows and Figures and his Coming and Appearance in the Flesh wherein he went through the Types and Shaddows as Circumcision John's Baptism observing the Passover at his Supper and his Sufferings did make way for his coming in the Spirit as he consecrated a new and living way through the Vail that is to say his Flesh now the coming of Christ until which his Dispiples were to shew forth his Death in the observation of the figure this coming they did not put afar off as our Opposers yet do how long they know not it being already above Sixteen hundred years since and yet this his coming is still put off whereas the Disciples after they were with Christ at his last Supper were Witnesses of his coming after his Resurrection and also of his Spiritual Coming and Revelation in their hearts and now to suppose that what the Disciples did to shew his Death was till a third Coming not yet manifest is to overlook the two former as no Comings as also to render Christs own words and Promises ineffectual who said Verily I say unto you there be some standing here which shall not taste of Death till they see the Son of Man coming in his Kingdom Matth. 16.28 Mark 9. Luke 9.27 And as to 1 Cor. 11.23 24 25. wherein the Apostle repeats what Christ did the same night he was betrayed in giving the Bread and Cup
to shew his Death till he came c. However T. D. construes this it doth not prove the figurative or outward part or sign to be imposed as of absolute necessity upon all Believers till some other coming of Christ not yet come for his coming in the Spirit T. D. owns not to be the end thereof but where then is the mystery and inward and Spiritual Grace signified by the outward Sign so much talked of in your Catechisms but its evident T. D. is ignorant of the Mystery of the Body and Blood of Christ and Cup of the new Testament in his Blood which the outward Bread and Cup was but the sign and figure of we oppose the Popish opinion of Transubstantiation And however as to the Corinthians at that time among them there was strife and division contention and disorder one being hungry another drunk another asleep one being of Paul another of Apollo another of Cephas which the Apostle reproved therein as being carnal walking as men so that he could not speak unto them as unto Spiritual but as unto Carnal 1 Cor. 3.11 16 17 18 20 21 30. Now suposing that wherein the Apostle might or did condescend to their low capacity as not grown to that Spirituallity so as to see through the outward Shaddows this their Example was not to be a President not could it in Reason or Truth be enjoyned to all other that succeeded who were come truly to know the glory of Christ's appearance in Spirit and Spiritually to enjoy the Communion of the body and Blood of Christ where none of these disorders aforesaid have any place Now Paul in his second Epistle to the Corinthians Chap. 13.15 bids them examine and prove themselves saying Know ye not your own selves how that Jesus Christ is in you except you are Reprobates So here was the Bread he then referred them to which indeed was always the intent and end of his Labour and Travel to bring those that were weak to a Living and Spiritual sence even of this Spiritual Bread however because of their weakness and low capacity he might condescend unto them as in some things he did And whereas T. D. pleading for his Ordinances as before saith Pag. 72. They do not cease as to our need of them because it is not to be supposed consistant with Christ's Wisdom to continue an obligation upon us to the use of a means when the end is obtained viz the appearance of Christ within that is a full appearance or state of Perfection saith he but we having proved that there is no such state attainable in this life then if those Ordinances oblige till we be arrived at perfection they oblige and so are of use during term of life Answ. Where observe first however he hath granted that they are not obliging where the end is attained or not continued by Christ as an obligation where this his appearance is Witnessed which brings to a state of Perfection Secondly T. D. having not proved that such a state is not attainable on this side the Grave but the contrary being proved before against him and all his Brethrens sinfull Pleas Doctrines and Arguments for Sin and Imperfection in this life therefore this Spiritual appearance of Christ brings man beyond all mens Traditions and outward Ordinances so called and indeed who do know a beginning in the Spirit ought to wait for this Spiritual Appearance and Coming of Christ according to the Spirit 's direction which is most perfect and not to turn back again into the Types Shaddows and Figures nor into the weak and beggerly Elements of the World nor yet subject themselves to mens Traditions carnal Commandments imposed Doctrines and Preceps but to wait upon God in Spirit to serve and worship him in the newness of the Spirit that thereby they may know the Spiritual Washing the Baptism into Christ's Death and be Baptized by the one Spirit into one Body and so come into the House of God and to feed at his Table and partake of the Living Bread which comes down from Heaven and to drink of the Fruit of the Vine with Christ in his Fathers Kingdom which Kingdom he promised to his Disciples should come with Power even in their Age or before some of them that stood by should taste of death Mark 9.1 Luke 9.27 And as for T. D's saying The Apostle calls the Doctrine of Baptism a Foundation these are not the Apostles words neither did he teach Sprinkling Infants for saith he but leaving the Principles or beginning of the Doctrine of Christ let us go on unto Perfection not laying again the Foundation of Repentance from dead works and of Faith towards Gods and the Doctrine of Baptisms c. Now if Perfection which was the end of those Baptisms was the thing they were to go on unto as he exhorted surely then it was attainable for the Apostles exhortation was in the Faith and did not oppose Perfection as T. D. erroniously hath done but directed and led them forward out off and beyond the Shaddows and Figures unto the Substance and preached to present men perfect in Christ. And whereas T. D. hath charged us yet further with a great Error which is that there is no Resurrection from the Dead and to prove us guilty hereof he mentioneth a Letter of one R. Turner which Letter I have not seen nor do I know the man as also G. W. in his late Answer to William Burnet and G. F. junior in his Books bound up together Answ. How apparently T. D. hath belyed slandered and abused us in accusing so positively that we hold there is no Resurrection from the Dead is evident in many printed Books of ours and he hath neither mentioned my words nor G. F's I say his slander and false accusation herein against me in particular may be plainly detected out of that very Book of my own wherein Pag. 67. I have expressed these very words But the Resurrection according to the Scriptures of Truth and Testimonies of Christ and the Apostles we do believe and own as Recorded in John 5.21 24 25 28 29. and Chap. 11.25 Matth. 22.30 31 32. 1 Cor. 15.34 35 36 37 38. and so on 2 Cor. 5.1 Many other places might be cited These very words and Scriptures are thus set down in my Answer to William Burnet after which are some passages of a Dispute I had upon the same subject with that busie yet sorry Contender Matthew Caffin the Baptist whose impertinencies and ignorance at the Dispute was fully manifested as others of his Brethrens have been when they have appeared in the same unprofitable work against us And as concerning what G. F. the younger saith in his Books collected clears him also from T. Danson's impudent slander of holding there is no Resurrection from the Dead for G. F. affirmeth the contrary in pag. 209 210. in these very words Touching the Resurrection it s a Mystery which the carnal mind can never comprehend
they may be made perfect in one c. And God said Let us make man in our own Image after our likeness Gen. 1 26. Now if by us here is intended Father Son and Holy Ghost which is called Trinity then it follows that he was made in the likeness of all three and yet we do not read that God did consist in three distinct Persons nor that man was made in the Image of three Persons nor yet that three distinct and separate persons dwelt in him though God did promise after the Fall to dwell in his people and he and his Son and Spirit we do really own confess to and have a living sence and experience of to our Souls Comfort and everlasting peace So when we cannot well resent nor accept of mens invented terms put upon the Father Son and Holy Ghost it is unreasonable and injurious to accuse us with opposing any of them or denying their Divinity and the Unity of the Deity And where John Owen in pag. 91 92. to prove the Holy Ghost a Person and an existing Substance which he calls also a distinct and divine Person he quotes many Scriptures as Gen. 1.2 the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters Psalm 33.6 by the Word of the Lord the Heavens were made and all the Host of them by the Spirit of his Mouth these with many he urgeth for proof of the Personallity of the Holy Ghost So according to his Principle and terms which he puts upon the Holy Ghost as a distinct Person c. and according to J. O's meaning we must read the Scripture thus the Person of God moved upon the face of the Waters By the Person of the Lord were the Heavens made and all the Host of them by the Person of his mouth and so likewise upon Job 26.13 by his Person he hath garnished the Heavens and in like manner upon the rest of the Scriptures he bringeth in this case Now let the Reader judge whether such a meaning alteration put upon the Scriptures doth either look clear or sound well and whether it be not a corrupting Scripture and addition contrary to the plain innocent Language thereof and if such corruption and alteration upon Scripture may be admitted of how are they the only Rule or great Rule of speaking and treating about spiritual things J. Owen and his Brethen had better refer people to the Scriptures and leave them to a naked attention to what Scripture asserts rather then thus to pervert them or puzle and darken peoples minds with their humane inventions and Scholastick terms imposed in the time of Apostacy and Popery And concerning the Son of God and some accounting him the Light within men this J. O. numbers among the monstrous imaginations pag. 87. Wherein he hath not only struck at us who testifie to Christ as the Light of the World that lighteth every man and as being in the true Believers both their Light Life and Salvation but also J. O. hath herein opposed both the former Saints and Scriptures of Truth who testified unto Christ the Light as we do as also he owned himself to be come a light into the World and to be in his Followers He that is with you shall be in you I in them and they in me c. Pag. 103. J.O. queries how can the Power of God or a quality be said to be sent to be given to be bestowed on men Answ. Yes very well it may be so said Christ gave them power to become the Sons of God who believed on his Name and was not this God's Power had Christ any thing but what was Gods and the Saints knew the Power of God to work mightily in them so that this Doctor hath shewed himself very ignorant of the Power of God and its work which doth beget and restore man into the Image Righteousness and true Holiness of God and this is given and bestowed on such as believe in the Light within the Light of the Divine Power of God which giveth unto us all things appertaining to Life and Godliness And now touching their distinctions of Persons or Personal Subsistances in God J. O. saith pag. 114. The distinct apprehension of them and their accurate expression is not necessary unto Faith as it is our Guide c. nor are those brief explanations before mentioned so proposed as to be placed immediately in the same rank or order with the original Revelations Answ. If they be not necessary unto Faith nor yet to be placed in the order with Revelations meaning Scripture why then are these men so strict in going about to impose their terms expressions and explications which they have not in the Scripture upon peoples Faith and Conscience as if it were a matter of damnation not to receive a Faith concerning God under their traditional notions and terms However we believe what the Scriptures saith both of God Christ and holy Spirit who are one laying aside all these mens invented confused amusing Sophistry Cavils and their darkning terms as distinct and separate Personallities Substances Subsistances Modallities c. of which they themselves are guilty though J. O. accuseth others therewith pag. 116. And whilst these pretended accurate expressions are not necessary unto Faith why doth J. O. press them as proper expressions of what is revealed to encrease our light pag. 115. What apparent contradiction is this not necessary unto Faith as our Guide and yet proper to encrease our light as if the encrease of light had not a necessary relation unto both Faith as Guide and Principle both in and unto religious worship but to be sure that instead of encreasing light their dark invented scholastick Heathenish and Popish terms have encreased much darkness in the minds of people and kept many in great ignorance both of God and the mystery of godliness And whereas J. O. gives order or instruction that they that deny or oppose their explications are to be required positively to deny or disapprove the oneness of the Deity or to prove that the Father or Son or Holy Ghost are not God before they be allowed to speak one word against the manner of the explication pag. 115. Answ. A very unreasonable imposition and requiring to require any to deny the oneness of the Deity or to prove the Father Son or Holy Ghost not to be God because they may except against such invented explications as J. O. and his Brethren have brought out of their Heathenish Store-houses and Chambers of Imaginary and hath not he herein imposed upon the Objecters and begged the question taking it as granted that their explications are as true as the oneness of the Deity or as true as that the Father Son and Holy Ghost are God as if he had told us it is all one as true that they are distinct severed Persons as it is that they are God which it is not we have not ground to believe their explications herein to be equal for the Unity
Christ's Nature Divine and his Soul Divine which comes out from God And where is his Soul called Humane Come to the Accidence again thou that professes thy self to be a great Schollar tell us what Humane signifies 16 thly Thou speaks of Three Persons and a man is a Person What doest thou infer from this Is God a Man No he is a Spirit I tell thee the Scripture sayes so Is the Holy Ghost a Man It is call'd the Holy Spirit and Christ was a man the man Christ Jesus So it seems the Presbyterians can say little of himself but he hath learned something of the Learned Wotton in pag. the second but he doth not tell us what he is whether a Papist or an Heathen 17 thly Thou sayest the Soul is part of man's Nature Where doth the Scripture thy Rule say so For the Scripture saith God breathed into man the breath of Life and man became a Living Soul 18 thly Thou sayest the word Person cannot properly be attributed to the Father Son and Holy Ghost Why doth the Presbyterians rage so against the Quakers It seems you cannot agree among your selves because the Quakers speak as the Scriptures do Father Son and Holy Spirit and say the Scripture doth not speak of Three Persons as thou thy self in thy third page sayes the word Person cannot properly be attributed to the Father Son and Holy Ghost See how this man is in Confusion who saith sometimes there are Three separate Persons and another while the word Person cannot properly be attributed to the Father Son and Holy Chost But we do charge Danson and his Brethren to make this good by Scripture in plain words For the Scripture saith The Father is in the Son and the Son is in the Father and the Holy Ghost proceeds from them So how can you say they are separated when they are one in another but it shews you have little knowledge of God or Scriptures either 19 thly The Priest saith concerning that distinction in the God-head it cannot be apprehended by us and yet he will call them Three separated Persons and a Trinity and gives them Names which are not apprehended by you you might have been silent then in what you did not apprehend And yet you will lay Principles down concerning God the Son and Spirit which you do not apprehend your selves but presume above what is written and so go contrary to your Rule Should you not call the Father Son and Holy Spirit as the Holy Men did call them in the Scriptures 20 thly In the 4th page thou sayest The Father the Son and the Spirit are said to be Three yet but one God and yet thou sayest we do not know what to call those Three but Three Persons and there is that ascribed to them thou sayest Properties which agree not simply Answ. The Father Son and Spirit agree but that which you do ascribe do not agree with Scripture with them nor among your selves about them And if you do not know what to call the Father Son and Spirit but Three Persons you might have holden your Tongues then till you did know who calls them and gives them Names contrary to Scriptures and the Holy Men of God who called them Father Son and Spitit who were wiser Men then any of you 21 thly And again in thy 4th page thou sayest Thre Subsistents that is Persons though not strictly yet proportionably or Anologically so called in the God-head People Did you ever hear such a Mash We do charge this Presbyterian to make these words good by plain Scripture viz. Three Subsistents Three Persons and Analogically Is this a Scripture word People Where did the Apostles use any such dark words Hadst thou not this word from the Heathen Well Mark Reader he sayes there are Three Persons and Three Subsistents in the God-head and hath not he made Four here If there be Three in the God-head he hath made Four for what is the God-head God is One and he hath made Three besides see pag. 4. of his Book And so in the Title of his Book he speaks of Three Persons in the God-head Are there not Four then And in the said 4th page he sayes he thinks he hath answered all the Arguments of the Antitrinitarians he doth but think so it seems Answ. The Scripture saith 1 Joh. 5.7 That there are Three that bear Record in Heaven the Father the Word and the Holy Ghost and these three are one But he doth not say that they are separated nor distinct neither doth call them Persons And thus we call them as the Scriptures call them Father Word and Holy Ghost and the Apostle doth not say they are separate nor distinct and we are not to presume above what is written We charge you Presbyterians to give us printed Scriptures for these following words and let us see in what Chapter and Verse they are printed Come to the Rule and do not presume above what is written Concreet Abstract Predicate the Relative Co-eternity Co-essentiallity Co-equallity Communication of Properties Co-essentiallities Modallities Suppossitallities Incommunicable Subsistances and Hypostatical Unions Come are these words spoken in the Rule the Scriptures let us see the Chapter and Verse that we may see where such terms are spoken of the Father Word and Spirit which are one Had you not them rather from your old Logical and Philosophical Books And have not they been your Rule for such words and not the Scriptures which the Holy men of God spoke forth Thou sayest in the 12th page of thy Book That we must not take Man here for a Person but a Nature as you do God c. And yet before thou saidst That Man was a Person and so it is the Nature that is a Person and not the Man nor God but thou hast not defined to us what a Person is nor what the word Person signifies for all thy Schollar-ship And thou sayest Ye mean no more then the Name Man to be attributed to Peter James and John because the same human Nature specifically agrees unto them and so is the Name God attributed to each Person because the same Divine Nature subsists in each of them Answ. This is a dark thing to whom will you liken me saith God like Peter James and John or like unto some corrupt person The Saints were partakers of the Divine Nature What do you say of them therefore And where do the Scriptures speak that the Nature of God is so simple c. where learned you this word And where doth the Scripture use these words Accidents and Integrals of the God-head and this is your Conceptions and Notions of God and the Word and the Spirit as it 's said in the 13th page of Danson's Book It 's a Conception and Notion indeed For you say in the same 13th page The Conception or Notion that we have of the Father c. so it 's but a Notion and Conception it seems that you have of the Father and
then sayes suppose as a subsistent or Person c. But which of these terms it is this Notionist hath not declared to us in his 13th page And this Notionist goes on in the said 13th page and sayes Nor can we say that the Notion of the Father as one Person in the God-head includes the Son nor the Notion of the Son as one Person in the God-head includes the Father Reader Didst thou ever hear the like This is but a Notion of the Father and a Notion of the Son indeed And are these Presbyterian Priests like to interpret Scripture with their Notions Conceptions and Suppositions no no. No one knows the Father but the Son and he to whom the Son reveals him Nor none knows the Son but the Father and to know God and Jesus Christ is Life Eternal and none can call him Lord but by the Holy Ghost And so this Knowledge is beyond all your false Conceptions Suppositions and Notions And if the Holy Ghost the Saints bodies be the Temple of it which Holy Ghost leads them into all Truth And if the Holy Ghost be a Person then have not the Saints a Person in their bodies And why did not the Apostle say That their bodies were the Temples of a Person according to your Doctrine and Rule the Holy Ghost is a Spirit and so let us see that Scripture which gives the Holy Ghost the Name of a Person And he speaks again in his 14th page of Three distinct Persons are one with the God-head Now Reader is not here Four to wit Three Persons and the God-head But Reader we charge him to give us Chapter and Verse for this Doctrine for we must order him with the Rule And then he tells us of a Notion of the Father and including the Son it 's but his own Notion for if he had known him he would have spoken in a form of sound words whereby he might not have been reproved And again the Presbyterian sayes the Three Persons are distinct and the Rule is to be understood that they are One among themselves only in respect of that wherein they agree not simply Answ. Reader take notice he sayes The Father and Son and Holy Ghost which he calls Three Persons doth not agree simply Is not this contrary to Scripture What agreement is this which is not simply What! separate distinct Persons not agreeing simply Come what is this agreement then if it be not an agreeing simply Tell us what it is by Chapter and Verse thou sayes the Scripture is the Rule Where doth the Scripture say That the Father Son and Spirit doth not agree simply Didst thou not say That God was so simple that he admitted of no parts what agreement is this if it be not simple What is it then tell us Dost thou not abuse the Father Son and Spirit and Scriptures clear thy self and make this good That the Father Son and Spirit doth not agree simply if not simply then tell us how and give Chapter and Verse for it out of the Scriptures or else acknowledge thy self to be of a Sandy Foundation Seeing thou sayst A Man is a Person and God is a Person and the Scripture saith God is a Spirit and Christ was conceived by the Holy Ghost the begotten of the Father Was Christ the Image of the Father as he was of the Generation of Abraham or David or Adam or according to the Spirit Whether of these was he the express Image of his Father's substance because thou calls the Father a Person And the Scripture sayeth He suffered according to the Flesh which he did not die as he was God and the Scripture calls him Son of Man and Son of God and he being the express Image of his Fathers substance see the Old Translations And dost thou not in thy 16th page of thy Synopsis bring the Greek Philosophers to prove the Persons Yes How now Presbyterian Priest thou hast run beside thy own Directory and Scripture both but the Greek Philosophers must be thy Rule and Leader surely People will not alwayes have their Eyes blinded by you Christ is come to open them And in the 17th page of his Book the Presbyterian saith that Hypostasis must be rendred Person or Subsistent or some word to that Effect he sayes So People see it must be some word but what it must be he knows not and so in this manner they are giving Names to Christ and God besides the Rule of Scripture we charge thee shew us a Verse in Scripture that speak such Language and where one word may be put for another by Metalepsis and so leave People in Doubts and Questions you are going beside your Scripture and Rule that at last People shall not know what to call God and Christ. So the Presbyterians and Independants must give us Scripture For we will not be satisfied with your Notions and Whymsies and false Conceptions which you have from Aristotle and the Greek Philosophers and the Papists and Cardinals We do command you to give us Scripture Chapter and Verse Presbyterians and Independants for these things plainly seeing you are of late perked up in a way of scolding against us not like the Holy Men of God Patient and Meek and apt to Teach as you may see in the latter end of your Brother Vincent's Book Is that the Language of a Christian No He hath declared what spirit you are of Rabshecha's spirit railing and speaking evil of the way of Truth he thinks to overcome by Railing and complaining not by Love nay the Lamb must have the victory Whether or no was Christ's Blood shed for All men and by it Justifies All men they living in their sins and not believing in it are they saved by their saying they believe in the Blood and not believing in the Light which Christ Commands and become Children of the Light and they say they believe and yet not pass from Death to Life and from sin that brings Death And whether or no any are cleansed from all sin by the Blood of Christ but such as walk in the Light of Christ as in 1 Joh. 1. And so whether or no are those Justified who believe not in the Light of Christ nor passes from Death to Life nor walks not in the Light whether or no are those Justified by Christ's Blood and have not the Testimony of Justification in them as in the accompt to God Christ's Blood was shed for All men but for a man to come to partake of this Justification is it not to feel the Blood sprinkling the Heart and Conscience For the outward Jewes in the Figure had Blood sprinkled upon them in the outward Offerings Come answer us by Scripture Do not daub up People with untempered Mortar do you know the Mortar that is tempered Whether or no was Christ an Offering for the sins of the whole World and died for the sins of the whole World Whether or no all the sinners and ungodly of the whole World
are Justified by his Death and by his offering up once for all answer in plain words And whether or no you will make a Sect that he died for some ungodly and some sinners only for the sons of Adam were the sinners and ungodly But he that believes is born of God and they receive Christ and he gives them Power to become the sons of God and they know he died for them and have the Testimony of it and have the Benefit of his Death and Resurrection And what was the Light that shined in the Darkness and the Darkness comprehended it not What was the Spirit that the Wicked grieved vexed and quenched Where is it and what is the Spirit of Truth that reproves the World of sin Where is it that leads the Saints into all Truth Come we must have plain Scripture for these things What is the Law that God will write in the Heart and put in the Mind that all shall know Him from the greatest to the least that they shall not every one teach his Brother and shall all know the Lord What is that Light that shines in the Heart to give the Knowledge of the Glory of God in the face of Christ Jesus 2 Cor. 4. What is the Word of God in the Heart the Apostle Preached and the People was to obey it and do it And what was that Rule that Adam had and all the Holy Men in the Old World And what was the Rule of Enoch's Faith by which he was translated And Abraham's Faith who obeyed God and forsook his Countrey Answer these things by Scripture because you say The Writings the Scriptures are the Rule of Faith And Presbyterians and Independants have you forgotten all your Petitions and Addresses you Petitioned and made to the other Powers against the Quakers If you have forgotten them read William Caton 's Book of your Petitions and Addresses gathered up and down the Nation What you said of Oliver and Richard and how the People of God in scorn called Quakers the first beginning of calling them so was at Darby by one Bennet an Independant about 19 year since and then when the People called Quakers were gathered together in divers places to Worship God then you said they were Plotting together against Oliver whom some of you called the Light of your Eyes and breath of your Nostrils to bring in King Charles and Oliver said We would not hurt a Mouse at that time though he did cast many of us in Prison through you after that and then you Baptized us in your Prisons by cruel sufferings Of all men you should hold your Tongues in bawling so against us seeing the Light of your Eyes and breath of your Nostrils is gone And what was it not through some of you That the Act against Sturdy Beggars came forth upon which Friends at that time could hardly travel three or four miles from their own Houses but they were Whipped men worth three or four-score pounds or an hundred a year were Whipped for Beggars and Vagrants And then did you not get another Act That we must not speak to you in going or coming from a Steeple-house And how Friends were thronged in Prison up and down in the Nation by you Answer these Queries And thus you may see what a Havock you made in your Day but when Persecution came you durst hardly look out with your heads your selves And was there ever the like known or seen how your Brethren turns from North to South and from South to North and there they can turn and chop and change And yet you could tell us then That the Common-Prayer was Hell and Egyptian Bondage And we could hardly have a Meeting but you were incensing the Rulers against us That we were Plotting to bring in King Charles and how many in those dayes were put in Prison upon that account by you because we went to Meetings We can tell you we have a List of them And yet the Quakers were House Creepers said you when you had gotten the Mass-houses and Tythes and your Easter-Reckonings and Midsummer-Dues and straining our Goods for your Bread and Wine And who are become the House Creepers now Then you had gotten the old Mass-houses Oh! your filthiness comes to be made manifest to all men and you have made your selves ridiculous who are fighting against an innocent People that wishes hurt to no man but the good of all men And do you think that the Lord will nor remember and reckon with you for all these things Dare you look into the Book of your Actions and Consciences and see what is written there and see if they be not Recorded How now Presbyterians High Priests What is this your Doctrine that you now Preach up for your Hearers to go to a Bawdy-house as Thomas Vincent speaks What Liberty here do you give to Youth and your Hearers who sayes It 's worse to go to the Quakers Meetings than to a Bawdy-house You pleaded for a body of sin as long as you live but now it 's com'd out indeed when you plead for a Bawdy-house rather than Quakers Meetings it 's like the Presbyterian Priest knows where they are it appears as if he thought more of a Bawdy-house than of Christ and Vertue So it 's clear here you are Them that turn the People to Vice and from the Lord and his Truth Ellimas like seeking to pervert For the Quakers Meetings are in the Fear and Power and Spirit of God who meet together in the Name of Christ Jesus so it 's like you love Meetings at Bawdy-houses more then the Meetings of the People of God who meet to Worship God And if this be your Doctrine then you must enlarge your Brothel and Bawdy-houses as they do at Rome Legorn and Venice and other parts in Italy and then they will give you Tythes and Easter-Reckonings and Midsummer-Dues For have you not called Bawdy-house People good Church Members And have you not taken Tythes of them And would you not say The Peace of God to them for paying you Tythe Who would have thought that we should have had such Unvertuous Expressions from the Presbyterians that this stinking savour should have lyen covered under their Weeds Well the Quakers must Declare against all your Bawdy-houses which thou Vincent sayes Thou hadst rather thy People should go to than to the Quakers Meetings where the Word of God is Preached And so Presbyterians if this be your Doctrine to your People to send them to Bawdy-houses rather then to send them to a Meeting of the People of God we utterly deny you and your Bawdy-house too And is it not a shame to put in Print to tell the World That thou wouldst rather have thy People go to a Bawdy-house than to a Quakers Meeting For it 's like if thou wilt set up that House thou mayst have a yearly Revenue like thy Father the Pope out of your Bawdy-houses it 's like if you were there you might
own having known his Virtue and Power to redeem us from our vain Conversations and to save us from wrath to come And our knowledge of the only true God and our Faith in and concerning him and his Name unto our Salvation doth not consist in the traditional Names humane Inventions nor in Philosophical terms and nice School distinctions derived from Heathenish Metaphysicks which since the Apostles time men have put upon the God-head but in the living sense and feeling of his Divine Power Life and Love revealed in us by the Spirit of the Son of God whereby we have in his gift of Divine Light and Spirit received Life and Salvation from sin and death see Matth. 11.27 Luk. 10.22 Matth. 16.17 Rom. 1.17 ch 8.18 Gal. 1.16 Eph. 3.5 1 Pet. 15.12 ch 4.14 ch 4.13 ch 5.1 2 Pet. 1 3. Matth. 1.21 Also we judge That such Expressions and Words as the Holy Ghost taught the true Apostles and Holy Men mentioned in the Scriptures are most meet to speak of God and Christ and not the words of mans wisdom or humane inventions and devised distinctions since the Apostles dayes Finally We have received an Unction or Anointing from the Holy One which as it doth teach us we know a continuance in the Father and in the Son 1 Joh. 2. And for whom we know the Father is well pleased and in him we know the true Satisfaction Justification and Peace which all that abide in him enjoy and witness Now unto the Father Son and Holy Spirit the One Eternal Word The Only Wise Pure Perfect God who is Infinite Omnipotent Incomprehensible who giveth unto all Life and Being and is the Life of all and the Being of Beings who filleth all in all with his Presence Unto whom be Glory now and evermore saith our Souls G. Whitehead And for Definition of a Person or what a Person is we shall not need to go to Popish and Heathenish Authors as Thomas Aquinas Aristotle and others as some of these Presbyterian Teachers and others have done when they have gone about to demonstrate their Doctrine of a Trinity of distinct Persons in God And yet in Contradiction for a cloak they pretend the Scriptures to be their Rule wherein there is no proof of their calling the Father the Word and the Spirit three distinct Persons while the Scriptures be full and plain enough to prove define or shew what a Person is as namely a Man or Woman sometime the body the face or visible appearance of either c. But the Infinite God is not like unto corruptible man See first in the Old Testament so called as to Person Esau took his Wives his Sons and Daughters and all the Persons of his house Gen. 36.16 Joseph was a goodly person Gen. 39.6 The Number of your persons Exod. 16.16 No uncircumcised person Exod. 12.48 The person of the poor and of the mighty Levit. 19. The guilty person unclean person Numb 5.6 A clean person Numb 19.18 Thirty two thousand persons in all of Women c. Numb 31.35 Whosoever killeth any person vers 19. Numb 35.11 15 30. Josh. 20. 3 9. Abimelech the son of Jerubbaal hired vain light persons and slew his brethren the sons of Jerubbaal being threescore and ten persons Judg. 9. Note here that persons dyed or were slain But can it be said of the Immortal God whom they distinguish into three several Persons that he ever dyes And though Christ as concerning the Flesh or Person was put to Death so was not his Divine Life or God-head And again Not a goodlier person than Saul 1 Sam. 9.2 David a comely person 1 Sam. 16.18 When wicked men have slain a righteous person 2 Sam. 4.11 They shall come at no dead person Ezek. 44.25 Or will he accept thy person Mal. 1.8 These places before cited with many more are according to the English God accepteth not the person of Princes Job 34.19 which in the Hebrew is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Phene Sarim i. e. facies Principum the faces of Princes And the same word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Phene is in Gen. 1.2 for the face of the deep See likewise Gen. 4.14 Job 38.30 with many more places in the Old Testament so that the same word which is translated person having also relation to the outward face of men and things how can it be either proper seasonable or good Doctrine to Preach the Invisible Incomprehensible God under these terms of three distinct or separate Persons And whether it doth not render God or represent the Deity to be like visible men or finite creatures that are comprehended in time yea or nay And hath not this kind of representing the God-head produce those vain Conceptions and Imaginations in the minds of the Ignorant from whence they have formed the Images and Pictures of God and Christ and Holy Ghost made by men of corrupt minds in the night of Apostacy and Popery to the great reproach and abuse of the Name of God and Profession of Christianity in the World See also more Scriptures touching Persons to the same purpose as before Judg. 20.39 1 Sam. 9.22 22.18 22. 2 King 10.6 7. 2 Chron. 19.7 Psal. 26.4 Psal. 82.2 Prov. 12.11 Prov. 24.23 Jer. 52.29 30. Lam. 4.16 Ezek. 17.17 Chron. 27.13 Joh. 4.11 Zeph. 3.4 Mal. 1.9 And 2dly in the New Testament so called it appeares that the word Person or Persons is mentioned with the same acceptation as before in the Old As for instance Thou regardest not the person of men Matth. 22.16 Mar. 12.14 Luk. 20.21 In the Greek it is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 i. e. faciem hominum the face of men In the Hebrew it is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 phene haadam Doth not this still relate to the outward or visible appearance of man See also Matth. 27.24 1 Cor. 5.13 Gal. 2.6 Eph. 5.5 Heb. 12.16 2 Pet. 2.5 Luk. 15.7 Act. 10.34 17.17 Rom. 2.11 Jude 16. 2 Cor. 1.11 Eph. 6.9 Col. 3.25 1 Tim. 1.10 Jam. 2.1 9. 1 Pet. 1.17 2 Pet. 3.11 In all which it is evident That the word persons is attributed to men c. And as to that of 2 Cor. 2.10 where some of our English Copies have it To whom I forgave it for your sakes forgave I it in the Person of Christ The words in the Greek 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 are translated in facie Christi in the face of Christ And some of the Latins have it in conspectu Christi in the sight of Christ. And that in Heb. 1.13 where speaking of the Son of God In some of the English we have it thus Who being the Brightness of his Glory and the express Image of his Person In the Greek it is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 i. e. Et character substantiae ejus and the Character of his Substance It is not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of his Person As also in Heb. 11.1 Faith is the substance of things hoped for The same word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is
But if the separation relate to the Personallity or their distinctions of persons and not to the Essence then doth not this tend to divide God or to separate Father Son and Spirit who are in each other and how then are they three distinct coeternal coessential coequal Persons Or how are they three distinct increated persons of an infinite nature as before but another while not infinite in the Personality what wonderful confusion and gross contradictions are here and what strange boldness is it for men so dark in their understandings discomposed in their minds confused and incongruent in their Principles thus ignorantly to attempt to define or demonstrate the infinite Power or God-head which is out of their sight and beyond their earthly capacities who are so ignorant of God who is Light they count the Light within an Idol of our own brains as W. M. hath blasphemously done whereas it is the Light by which God hath shined in our hearts to give us the knowledge of his Glory in the face of Christ 2 Cor. 4. W.M. Read also Job 35.10 God thy Makers Heb. consult Mr. Carril on the place Eccles. 12.1 Remember thy Creators c. Isa. 54.5 Thy Makers is thy Husband in all which Texts the Trinity of Persons is denoted by words of the plural number Answ. Upon which I query is the distinction of three Persons derived from three Makers or three Creators Or dare they say That the Father Word and Spirit are three distinct severed or separate Creators and doth not this bespeak three Gods And what sense is it to say thy Makers is thy Husband from Isa. 54.5 where it is said Thy Maker is thine Husband the Lord of Hosts is his Name Is not this truly rendered See Pagnine's Versions 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Osiik i. e. factor tnus It 's neither sunt nor est factores tui And Eccles. 12.1 it's 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Borecha Creatoris tui in singular it 's not Creatorum tuorum And Job 35.10 it 's Osai factor meus not factores mei But whilst one God and one Lord is confessed how is it consistent that a plurality of severed Persons be in him as Makers Creators c. What ground have we to believe either Carryl or Madox herein more than Pagn and our English Translation with many others And notwithstanding this great stir they have made with their distinctions of separate persons incommunicable properties c. yet W. M. hath confest That the Names Properties or Attributes Works and Worship of God are frequently in Scripture given to each of these Three Persons so that they are one and the same perfect and infinite Essence one God by Nature c. but if he should distinguish personal Attributes from Attributes of God I ask what they are if not of God which if so how is infiniteness not applicable to them nor ascribed to them And how have you gone with your vain unscriptural distinctions to darken Counsel to darken Scripture to darken the minds of People by words without knowledge thereby going to demonstrate that to others which you cannot clear to your selves by demonstration As T. V. in his 26 pag. saith of the Trinity touching which he would have us Assent unto your terms and traditional distinctions upon Divine Authority which he cannot demonstrate by reason But how then shall we receive your bare Assertions upon Divine Authority when we have neither Scripture nor Reason nor yet any immediate Revelation from you for them must we pinn our Faith upon your sleeves or will you supply the places of so many Popes by Imposing an implicit Faith in those matters which you cannot demonstrate nor clear to your selves which then how can you clear them to others Which if this be the course you take to convince gain-sayers of your Doctrine you might have spared a great deal of labour in going about so confusedly to demonstrate your case to us and only have laid down your Doctrine of three distinct separate Persons in the Deity to which infiniteness is not ascribed as you have said in pag. 45. And so you might as well have said That we T.V. W.M. and T.D. do affirm it and therefore you must believe it or otherwise you are blasphemous Hereticks and so damned But we must have better ground for our Faith and a better Authority than Affirmations Revilings and Threatnings of men that are untaught themselves in those things which they presume to teach others W. M. I called them three Hee 's to try if you would own the Deity of Christ and the Holy Ghost under any title As the subject of this Tryal is very mean and weak to wit the calling them three Hee 's to prove the Deity so his trying of us hereby was altogether groundless since that we never disowned the Deity of Christ or Holy Ghost as falsely and injuriously is insinuated against us And since that three Hee 's will now serve instead of Persons he saying they are three Persons or three Hee 's to prove the Deity of Father Son and Holy Ghost Why have they made such a pudder for their distinctions of Persons But would it be a strong Reason to induce Infidels to the belief of the Deity of each because they are three Hee 's as he saith for are all Hee 's either God or yet Persons or Divine But I need say little to the shallowness of this Work Let the ingenious Reader judge of it But when he thinks he mends the matter by calling them three divine Hee 's his intent is that the Father is called Hee the Son is Hee the Spirit Hee which neither proves them three separate nor incommunicable Persons distinct subsistences or bottoms whilst both the Father 's a Spirit the Lord is that Spirit Christ a quickening Spirit all inseparable W. M. You by refusing to call them Three Divine Hee 's have made it manifest that your Quarrel is not with the word Person as some then apprehended but with the Doctrine or Fundamental Truth expressed by the three Persons viz. the Modal Distinction and Essential Vnion or Oneness of the Father Son and Holy Ghost Answ. It 's manifest that some of the Hearers that were present at our Debating this matter had a better apprehension and understanding of us than you prejudiced Teachers and Opposers had for some of them apprehended that we opposed your unscriptural terms and words put upon the Deity and not that we opposed either the Divinity or Union of Father Son or Holy Ghost neither did we in the least go to quarrel with any Fundamental Truth as most grosly and slanderously we are accused and misrepresented by thee W.M. who hast shewed thy self so far from either Truth Moderation or Reasonableness in this matter as one swallowed up with Envie and Prejudice And thy taking for granted that thy Model distinction and terms are Fundamental Truth and joyning them with the Oneness of the Father Son and Holy Ghost is but a begging
incommucicable properties wherein they are not Infinite as they have told us Is there finiteness in each person and yet each person God what gross darkness and blasphemy is this But then to mend the matter T. V. tells us This is such a Mystery as doth exceed the weak and narrow understandings of most inlightned and clear sighted Christians fully to comprehend Some by gazing too long upon the Sun become blind Surely then if it be such a Mystery as exceeds the understanding of the clear sighted it must needs exceed the dark understanding of T. V. and his Brethren And seeing as appears he was conscious to himself of his own dimness or darkness herein as by what follows also he should have let it alone and not troubled his head with things beyond his reach for he has confounded and marr'd his cause and not at all mended nor cleared it but if he hath assayed to demonstrate this Mystery as he calls it as one more clear sighted than the most inlightned his Work doth manifest the contrary And that God cannot represent himself otherwise than he is It 's true but where doth he thus represent himself as these men do with such invented terms vain tautologies and confusion We do not read such in all the Scriptures of Truth howbeit T. V. takes the boldness to Assert his Doctrine herein to be of Divine Authority and to be the Truth of God revealed in his Word and that if the Scriptures have revealed that there are Three distinct Persons in one Divine Essence it is a certain Truth c. This is sooner said than proved if that Word of God and Scripture could be produced that doth so reveal their Doctrine and say there are three distinct Persons in one Divine Essence Produce us such a Scripture among all the Writings of the Holy men of God in all the Bible and it shall end the Controversie otherwise let T. V. be ashamed of his Asserting it to be revealed in the Word of God And of his saying that in his Sylogism pag. 13. There is not a word but what is to be found in the Scripture whereas neither the matter manner nor expressions of his Arguments are to be found in Scripture As for Instance his Argument Pag. 13. The Father the Word and the Holy Ghost are either three Substances or three Manifestations or three Operations or three Persons or something else but they are not three Substances nor three Manifestations nor three Operations nor any thing else therefore they are three Persons To the first part Indeed they must be something to the Minor if they be neither three Substances Manifestations c. nor any thing else this renders them nothing and contradicts both the Major and Conclusion where they are something else which is three Persons he saith so the tenour of his Argument runs thus they are something but they are nothing he meant nothing else but three Persons therefore they are three Persons It would have held better thus but against himself If the Father the Word and Spirit be not three distinct Substances then not three distinct Persons but they are not three distinct Substances Ergo. unless he can shew us a distinct person without its own substance But his Brother T.D. saith A person is rationalis naturae individua substantia an individual substance of a rational nature see how flatly T.D. and T.V. have Contradicted one another herein one affirming they are three Persons because not three Substances the other That a person is an individual substance But if T. V. by saying There is not a word in his Syllogism but what is to be found in Scripture intends that every word particularly is to be found in Scripture the word Substance the word Manifestation Operation Person c. abstractively what proves this of his matter for the contrary may as well be asserted from bare words I never met with more silly kind of Arguing before And if so be his other Argument from the Property of the Father to beget of the Son to be begotten of the Holy Ghost to proceed from them both c. be an Argument sufficient to prove Three distinct Persons in the God-head with three incommunicable Properties c. Then doth it not follow as well That every spiritual perfect Gift that proceeds from God to man must needs be a Person and then so many Gifts or manifold Graces as proceed from him or are begotten by him are so many Persons in him which would be numerous indeed and amount to a Plurallity of Trinities for the Spitit is given variously and in divers Manifestations and the graces gift of God are many and manifold but the shallowness of this mans arguing who is it cannot see besides that Christ being the express Image of the Fathers substance and the Spirit the Life of both it 's neither scriptural nor reasonable to say that the Image and Life of One and the same thing should be either Two distinct and separate Persons from it or from their own substance so that still it follows that if the Three bearing Record in Heaven be One divine substance and not Three substances then not Three distinct or separate Persons As also God is called both the Word and Spirit Farther Mark the manner of T. V. his expressing his Doctrine viz. The Trinity of Persons in the Unity of the Divine Essence and the Unity of the Divine Essenee in the Trinity of Persons that three should be one and that one should be three that three should be distinguished but not divided that one should not be another the first should not be the second nor the second the third nor the second or third the first and yet the first second and third the same that the first should be in the second and the second in the first and both first and second in the third Thus far T.V. for his separate persons Reader Do but mark his Jigg here and what a whirling he has made like one distempered but where is his Scripture for all this see how he manages it pag. 26. he saith Reason it may be will leave us in our search after the Deity in the Trinity and the Trinity c. but where Reason faileth Faith must supply its room And then tells us of Mysteries which Reason cannot demonstrate to us and that in this Mystery of the Trinity we must Exercise our Faith though we cannot clear it to our selves by demonstration c. But sure whilst Reason hath so much failed T. V. and his Brethren in this matter that thereby they cannot clear it to themselves by demonstration it s very strange and unreasonable they should make such a stir in the dark as they have done to Impose it on the Faith of others and what tends this to but to force People to Exercise an implicite Faith whilst they have neither Scripture Reason Demonstration nor Revelation for that 's ceased they say to ground a Faith upon
Complacing Love in God Is there any Love in God that is not well pleasing unto himself or that is not of his Good Will or Benevolence which is confest to be saving Or if this Love of Complacency so termed was the Effect of Christs Satisfaction and not the other then was it not in Being in God before But if you say his Love of Benevolence so called or Good Will was only intended for a few or a certain select number and for them only he received Satisfaction or was Pacified doth not your Doctrine herein render him partial and unequal in his wayes whereas he willeth not the Death of sinners but rather their Return that they may Live and God's Love Good Will Patience Long-suffering Forbearance and Goodness is towards all in the first place till men reject it and is manifest in Christ towards Mankind and evidently testified both in his Sufferings Dying for all men and giving himself a Ransom for all to be testified of in due time and that by his Righteousness the free Gift of God came upon all men It 's not said in Scripture that God's Love of Benevolence was to the Elect only or that Christ died for a few only or was given a Ransom for Believers only but for All though All do not accept of the Good Will of God towards them nor of the Offering or Price which would purchase them to God out of their sins and thraldom T. V. Whether is it any absurdity to say that God should be at the Charges of his own Satisfaction Job 33.24 I have found a Ransom Reply In that place cited he should have set down all the verse where it 's said He is gracious unto him and saith Deliver him from going down to the Pit I have found a Ransom or an Attonement So that it 's manifest that this Ransom was all from the Graciousness of God manifest in God's delivering Man from going down to the Pit after that Man is chastened with Pain vers 19 20. and his Flesh consumed under the sence of God's Judgments then a Ransom is found through God's Graciousness to him who delivers his Soul from going into the Pit that his Life shall see the Light v. 28. Lo all these things oftentimes worketh God with Man to bring back his Soul from the Pit to be inlightened with the Light of the Living vers 29 30. Surely Elihu knew more of God's dealing and of his inlightnings thereby than they do who put his Work a far off from them and oppose his Light within being neither willing to wait under his Corrections nor bear his Judgments till they feel his Graciousness and partake of a Ransom thereby from the Power of Sin Death and Hell and to tell of God's being at the Charges of his own Satisfaction how does that agree with the former Doctrine That he never will nor can Pardon without Satisfaction made c. If the Graciousness and Satisfaction was in himself before surely what was performed by Christ for man was an effect of God's Graciousness to bring man to himself and it 's without Controversie that all that is in God and all the Gifts and Benefits proceeding from him to man-wards as also all his Works are acceptable and well pleasing to himself but his Works man ought not to put a far off from himself since that those things which are for man's deliverance and preservations of his Soul out of the Pit God worketh with man and he hath wrought all our works in us Isa. 26. And as for Believing and Obeying his Precepts as a Concurring Cause of Remission T.V. calls this Rank Popery as importing Justification by Works Reply What was said in that case was sufficiently proved from Scriptute and not at all refuted by T. V. when upon man's Return to God forsaking his evil way and believing in Christ the Lord has promised Pardon not to turn away his face but to shew Mercy c. 2 Chron. 30.9 Isa. 55.7 Jer. 31.31 33 34. Joh. 3.16 Acts 10.34 This is no Popery at all to assert Scripture and to confess the receiving of Remission through Repentance and Justification through Faith and that God hath wrought all our works in us and this we confess to and truly own though unjustly we are accused for Popery And if Grace and Justice be very well consistent as is confess'd from Rom. 3.24 25 26. I ask how this consists with your sence of Vindictive Justice else where And the Lord saith I am a just God and a Saviour there is none beside me Isa. 45.21 So he that is a just God is a Saviour and in this was manifest the Love of God towards us because God sent his only begotten Son into the World that we might Live through him herein is Love not that we loved God but that he loved us and sent his Son to be a Propitiation for our sins 1 Joh. 4.9 10. Now we knowing the Life and Power of Christ and having partaken both of the saving Vertue and blessed Effects of his Sufferings in the fellowship thereof in Spirit as also of the benefit of his Mediation and Intercession we must needs Confess him in all and the Love and Graciousness of God through all And whereas T. V. accuseth W. P. That his enumerating some of the Ends of Christ's mission into the World doth reach no higher then by his setting him forth as a perfect Example Reply Herein he hath wronged and belyed W.P. For in his Book pag. 9.16 17 18 19. W. P. brings several Scriptures both to prove God's Love and Graciousness in giving Christ as also the benefit of Christ to man for his Reconciliation Redemption through his Blood Salvation and Eternal Life through him which is higher or more then being a bare Example for hereby its evident that he was not only a perfect Living Example of Good to Man but a Minister and Giver of it as also the Worker and Author of mans Salvation As also W. P. in his 19. pag. Confesseth That Christ as being Attributed in his Doctrine Life Miracles Death and Sufferings to God as the Gift and Expression of his Eternall Love for the Salvation of men 1. In abolishing that other Covenant which consisted in External and shadowy Ordinances and that made none clean as concerning the Conscience 2dly In promulgating his Message of a most free and universal Tender of Life and Salvation unto all them that believe and follow him the Light in all his Righteousness the very end of his Appearance being to destroy the works of the Devil the which every man comes to experiment as he walks in a holy subjection to that measure of Light and Grace wherewith the Fulness hath enlightened him 3dly In seconding his Doctrines with Signs Miracles and a most innocent self-denying Life 4thly In Ratifying and Confirming all with great Love and holy Resignation by the offering up of his Body to be Crucified by wicked hands who is now ascended far above all
by him having left out and not stated his Arguments and then rails against his Consequences whereas he and his Brethren would not be so dealt by T. V· Take away Satisfaction then the Word and Spirit and we are false Witnesses then is our Preaching vain and you are all yet in your sins then you must all of you of necessity be damned and punished Eternally Reply Truly so they are like to be for all the help they are like to have from your Preaching especially if their being yet in their sins be a sign of it and that you are false Witnesses and your Preaching vain for so they are like to be in their sins all their Life time if they believe and drink-in your sinful Doctrine for sin and Imperfections remaining in all term of Life And as for T. V's bitter storm he brings forth of accusing and charging W.P. in the same words that Peter said to Simon Magus the Sorcerer or Witch Acts 8.9 21 22 23. and as having no part in Christ's Satisfaction and his heart not being right in the sight of God and to be in the gall of bitterness and bond of iniquity And further adds these words to render him worse viz. Wicked Blasphemies and Abominable and Heretical Assertions I hope W.P. will easily bear such vilifying without reviling again there being no matter of Argument nor Proof in them either to Convince or terrifie him and for the matter of Judgment against him he can Appeal to more Competent and Moderate Persons to judg in the case than T.V. hath shewen himself T.V. Pag. 67. God hath engaged to keep Believers out of a Course of Disobedience and if they do transgress in some particulars he hath threatned to chastize them which is not inconsistent with Christ's satisfying his Justice for their sins since chastizing is not an Act of Vindicative Justice but Fatherly Love Reply Here observe 1st That Chastizement and Revenge are two things 2dly If they be to be Chastized for Transgression it is to bring them into more subjection to God and conformity to Christ and not to leave them in sin and Imperfection term of Life under a Plea of the Debt being fully paid and full Satisfaction being made for them by Christ's under-going Wrath and Vindictive Justice which how do these stand with Free Grace Goodness Pardon Remission c. upon Repentance 3dly How does T.V. suppose Vindictive Justice or Eternal Wrath incurred by mans Offences to be laid on Christ which is not Chastizement as confessed and so he makes full Satisfaction the Effect of God's full Revenge on his Innocent Son as if one should say That God could not command Wrath but were bound thereby till he had Executed the Extremities of it upon Christ for so it hath been deserved by sin and sinners as if he had not absolute Power to shew his Love Good Will and Satisfaction therein for his own Names sake And is not this to render God more cruel than man or his Prerogative below that of Earthly Princes which is best known in shewing Mercy and forgiveness God can do whatsoever he will and his Will is chiefly to that which he most delighteth in to wit Goodness Mercy and Forgiveness that he may shew himself Gracious for to restore man to himself And he saith I will not contend for ever neither will I be alwayes wroth for the Spirits should fail before me and the Souls that I have made Isa. 57.16 And T. V. stating it as God's Revenge or Vindictive Justice on Christ and the Chastizement only on the Transgressors is not Scripture Is. 53.5 for it saith He was bruised for our Iniquities and the Chastizement of our peace was upon him Mark He was bruised and the Chastizement of our peace was upon him It is not said Vindicative or rather Vindictive Justice or the Revenge of our Peace was upon him for T.V. has Confessed a difference and Chastizement comes in Fatherly Love and not Revenge O Lord correct me but with Judgment not in thy Anger least thou bring me to nothing Jer. 10.24 And now this Correction or Chastizement from the Lord is known by his People in the time of their spiritual Travel and Warfare that they may be partakers of his Holiness and perfect Righteousness as they have partaken of Christ's Sufferings and known the Fellowship thereof But and if men continue in Rebellion against Christ rejecting his Love and Grace his Sufferings and Satisfaction will not free them from the severity of God nor from the Execution of his Judgement which is given to Christ to do who hath also Power and Authority to Execute Judgement because he is the Son of man that hath suffered and is that man by whom God will Judge the World in Righteousness Joh. 5.22.27 Acts 17.31 and by whom the secrets of men shall be judged according to the Gospel which he and his Ministers have proclaimed which is the acceptable year of the Lord to them that receive it who have thirsted after it and the Day of Vengeance of our God to them that reject the Love of the Truth and hate to be Reformed how highly soever they may boast of Satisfaction and Imputation c. CHAP. V. Touching the Presbyterian Priests and Professors Doctrine of the Justification of the Ungodly by an imputed Righteousness and T. V. his Plea and Proofs for it Examined FIrst he brings 2 Cor. 5.21 for his Proof viz. He hath made him to be sin for us that knew no sin that we might be made the Righteousness of God in him to which he adds as Christ was made sin for us though Innocent by the imputation of our sin to him for which he was condemned and punished so we are made the Righteousness of God in him though guilty by the imputation of his Righteousness unto us whereby we are Justified Reply Here T.V. has given us their sense of Imputation viz. That Guilty Persons are made the Righteousness of God in Christ and so Justified whilst in their sins by the Imputation of his Righteousness as much as to say when they are really unrighteous and actively sinners yet imputedly Justified and made the Righteousness of God in Christ which is a false and corrupt meaning put upon the Apostles words for there 's no Unrighteousness no Guilt nor Impurity in Christ for in him is no sin and he that abides in him sins not besides as Christ was made a Curse or Sin for us the Scripture doth not say So we are made the Righteousness of God in him For if these words As he So we which are added were true the Consequence would be As he was made to be sin for us who knew no sin nor ever could sin So we are made the Righteousness of God in him who never knew Righteousness nor ever can be Righteous What a gross corruption and perverting of Scripture is this and how contrary to the Righteousness of God to suppose guilty and sinful Persons to be
competent judge over them whilst he hath perverted them both in the former Powers days and now also and whilst in those days he did indeavour to insinuate into the Powers that then were against the Quakers he was plainly manifested and his Errors and Falshoods detected by those faithfull Servants of Christ Samuel Fisher Richard Hubberthorn and my self he might now have been silent from raking over his old silly confused stuff so long since answered and confuted since that from the ample Confutation and just reproof and discovery given against him by Samuel Fisher he could never yet clear himself nor hath essayed a Replication thereto but only a slight put off as will appear without either Truth or Reason and as for his commendation of the pains of his worthy Friend Master Thomas Vincent as he calls him he has little ground to applaud his pains for he has sufficiently manifested his envy errors confusion and shallowness as any unbyassed may see as also the palpable contradictions both to himself and T. D. so that they should first have studied to see a reconciliation and harmony between their own Principles before they had come thus publickly to engage but it is the Judgement of God upon them and such giddied spirits that one should oppose and contradict another till they are both overturned and broke to pieces in their war but if his worthy Friend Thomas Vincent hath done so worthily against the Quakers why doth T. D. take so much pains again after him why doth he actum agere as he saith his Answer is because of some reflections upon him also that as experience hath shewed there is a great deal of difference of intellectual gifts and that the Method Phrase and Notions of scarce any one man are acceptable to all he saith by which it appears that he was conscious or at least jealous that his worthy Master Vincent's work would not be so acceptable as his own but would give distaste and therefore he has endeavoured to smooth it over and to new moddel it in another phrase according to what he has imagined and learned out of Writers and old Authors both Popish and others but what saith he for not answering Samuel Fisher's Book against himself Jo. Owen Baxter and Tombs Entituled Rusticus ad Academicos which they were never able to answer nor to reply to T. D. excuseth himself as followeth viz. If any Quaker shall demand why I do not answer Samuel Fisher 's Book against me instead of writing against a new man I answer that I am guided in my neglect by the judgment of abler Persons then my self that that Book is but a Bundle of impertinent cavils c. Indeed this is a very easie way of answering which if we should deal so with T. D. what would he say to it and to such neglect but this doth not clear himself from Samuel Fisher's Answer but it stands over his head and if he was guided by abler persons then himself in not answering S. F. those abler persons for ought as appears might see T. D. so baffled and confuted that it was in vain for him to strive any further and if abler persons then himself did advice him in that case he should have followed the example thereof so as not to have meddled as he hath done to the further manifesting his weakness and folly and as for his instance of Biddles twelve Articles against the Holy Ghost's Diety t is no president nor instance for us as is most falsly insinuated against us whilst we never denied the Diety or Divinity of either Father Word or Holy Ghost And how doth he advise the Reader to be at pains to understand the positive grounds of the great Truths opposed by the Quakers as he falsly saith what must give the understanding thereof if not the Light of Christ within and how must sacred mysteries be known and what must bring to the right use of reason and to understand the Scriptures if immediate Revelation or Inspiration be supposed not attainable in these days Can the natural man with his natural understanding know the things that are spiritual surely no or know the right use of the Scriptures without the guidance of that infallible Spirit that gave them forth no sure for it is the Inspiration of the Almighty that giveth understanding And Seeing also that T.D. confesseth that Reason tells us the Nature and Works of God are above our reach and that God were not Gof if he could be comprehended by a Creature which if so that the Nature and Works of God are above his and their reach and comprehension why has he essayed so much by his natural understanding to define and distinguish the Godhead into three distinct Persons which he has no Scripture for nor yet Reason to demonstrate nor Revelation to ground a Faith upon in that case whilst the Presbyterians were wont to affirm Revelation to be ceased and to be sure God will not put the Seal of his immediate power to a falshood as is confessed so that whilst we have neither Revelation Scriptures Reason nor Seal of immediate Power for their Doctrines and distinctions put upon the Diety we have ground at least to question them if not positively to oppose them as unscriptural irrational implicite Doctrines and Traditions which hath tended to vail both the glory of God Christ and holy Spirit which we confess from people And now to T. D's definition of the word Person first from Aquinas as being an individual substance of a rational nature but his worthy Friend Tho. Vincent hath denied the Father the Word and the Spirit to be three Substances then I ask how they can be three distinct Persons whilst a Person is an individual Substance what contradiction is this But then T. D. saith Some think it viz. Aquinas his Explanation of Person liable to some exception and therefore he chuseth to borrow that of learned Wotton on 1 Joh. 1.2 pag. 2. that a Person is an individual Subsistance or Subsistent rather in an intellectual nature or a several or singular thing that subsists by it self c. A Man we call a Person a Person notes some one endued with Reason and understanding which is several and distinct from another a Person is intire of it self c. pag. 1 2. Concerning which I query first whether the Father the Word and holy Spirit be three several and singular things that subsist each by himself each one from another yea or nay Secondly whether a man being a Person is a competent instance for proof of his Maker being three several Persons and whether a man subsists by himself Thirdly whether Christ be several and distinct by himself from God and the holy Spirit several and distinct from both If yes where or in what place of the whole world or out of it is the one entire and severed from the other and how far distant one from another Fourthly And if the Father Son and Holy Ghost do
extends whether to enjoyn to the perfect obedience of Faith yea or nay seeing sin and corruption is so prevalent amongst you and so contended for surely where the excercise of the true and living Faith is experienced there is obedience to the Law of it or else what doth it signifie whilst persons remain in disobedience Further T. D. confesseth that we have an immediate dependancy upon God in our operations John 15.5 without me ye can do nothing Siorsima me separate or apart from me It s well he hath at some time assented to the Truth but how doth this contradict the greatest part of his own and his Brethrens work elsewhere in their pleading for imperfect obedience and their imagined imputation of Righteousness and Justification to the unrighteous and unjust for those operations which have a relation to an immediate dependence upon God which he that is in Christ doth experience and bring forth do accord with the mind and will of God which is the Sanctification of those that believe and with that most holy Faith which purifies the heart and these are not imperfect nor to be slighted as undeserving according to the vain notions of Priests concerning Faith its works and inherent Righteousness as they term it Pag. 47. T. D.. Their dependancy upon Christ in all the good they do is as near and intimate as the Branches upon the Vine by vertue of their natural union in bearing Fruit. Answ. This is also a Truth that grants a perfect obedience in them that have such a near intimate dependency upon Christ as the Branch hath that grows upon the Vine by vertue of the natural Union thereof this also contradicts their pleading for imperfection and sin in all obedience and works which also shews that they do not flow nor spring from Christ the true Vine as also that they have not union with him nor are Branches of him and indeed how they have not immediate dependency upon God in Christ whilst they deny Immediate Teaching Revelation and Divine Inspiration to be attainable in those dayes But seeing without or apart or separate from Christ men can do nothing how then can they be any thing without him as righteous or acceptable or justified For men must be something in that Relation before they can do any thing acceptable and it is the Spirit and Power of Christ which sanctifieth and maketh just and bringeth into the true Obedience Works and Righteousness of Faith and to live by Faith as the Just doth Pag. 48. But Faith as a work is not opposed to nor excludes it self as T. D. saith because in one sence it is opposed to the deeds of the Law for true Faith as a Work is the Work of God which is not opposed to it self besides it being the work of God to believe in Christ this hath not relation to those deeds of the Law that the Jews wrought out of him and out of or besides that Faith wherein they fell short of the Righteousness of the true and living Faith and of the perfect Obedience or Righteousness of the Law Now seeing he confesseth pag. 49. to a righteousness bestowed upon men by Faith I ask if that man is not a partaker and enjoyer of that righteousness by Faith Surely Faith and its Righteousness are not separate nor divided Also he confesseth Faith in God through the Messias is called a walking humbly with God Micah 6.8 To this I say whilst he thus considereth Faith as such a walking were it not very gross nonsence and contradiction to say that it excludes it self as before or that those works or effects of Faith viz. Walking humbly with God were opposed to the Faith it self which is the Root thereof But this is even like T. Vincent's affirming Faith to be opposite not only to the works of the Law but to its own Works Pag. 51. I find T. D. upon James 2.24 doth not distinguish betwixt the Works of Faith and the Works of the Law and so talks like an ignorant blind Guide with his vain babling and perverting of the Scripture to exclude perfect Obedience and Perfection from the Believers And seeing he granteth that Justification imports the Absolution of Sinners and the Approbation of a Believer which he distinguisheth betwixt Then it is to be minded that a Believer that is approved of is absolved being Justified and what from if not from Sin and Transgression Otherwise Faith that stands but in a bare profession without a living work of purifying the heart overcoming the World c. is but a dead Faith as T. D. in fine confesseth And we are Justified by works as our Faith is made perfect by works James 2.22 but these are not the works of the Law but the Works of the Living Faith which manifesteth Fruit to God and demonstrates the nature of the Living Faith But his telling of a Sinner being Justified in the sight of God where doth the Scripture say so he quotes Rom 3.23 to prove it but it doth not but only that a man by Faith is Justified without the deeds of the Law which deeds of the Law a man may be Justified without and yet not a Sinner nor without the Obedience Works or Righteousness of the True and Living Faith which Purifieth the heart and Justifieth from all those things from which they could not be Justified by the Law of Moses And as to his saying That we are made free meritoriously by the Law of the Spirit in us from the Law of Sin and Death The word meritoriously he addeth But the freedom of the Law of the Spirit in us from the Law of Sin and Death we do confess and that it is the same Law of the Spirit of Life that is in Christ and the Saints according to the Apostles Doctrine the Freedom of which we testifie is of Everlasting worth for that it is not wrought by our selves but by Christ and his Law and Spirit Pag. 52. T. D. saith That we observe that the righteousness of the Law is fulfilled in the Persons of the Saints Indeed we do observe it believe it and experience it and do not wholy put it off from us to be fulfilled in the Person of Christ as T. D. and some of his Brethren have corruptly done though we do confess that the Righteousness of the Law was fulfilled in Christ's Person but not therefore to exclude it out of us since that he was a faithfull Example to be followed as well as a Captain and Leader to guide in all the Wayes of Peace and true Holiness Pag. 52. And as we do observe that the Righteousness of the Law is fulfilled in the Persons of the Saints contrary to T. D. and his Brethrens observation and thereupon not only suppose but really assert a state of Freedom from Sin attainable in this life we do not place the Merit of Justification upon the Creatures imperfect obedience or works but origionally on the Spirit of Truth and its perfect work in which
evident that they were troubled condemned and reproved by his Witness in their Consciences or else how should they say depart from us if he never came nigh them nor ever touched their Consciences or why should they say we desire not the knowledge of thy Wayes if the knowledge thereof was not tendred to them And further If so be that the Gentiles as confessed were those in whom that which might be known of God was manifested and shewed unto them from the Creation to the being of God and his Eternal Power which discovery did leave them without excuse what was it that brought them to this understanding of the Eternal Power and Godhead from and through the Creation was it Spiritual yea or nay surely this clear sight and discovery in them did rise from that which might be known of God that was manifest in them and if this had not a sufficiency in it to save how were they left without excuse surely the fault was not to be laid upon God nor on his Light in them but to and upon themselves for disobeying it and not liking to retain him in their knowledge And seeing Christ is confessed page 63. to be set for a Light to the Gentiles Isa. 49.6 which saith T. D. is but a Prophesie of the Gentiles mercy in the time of Christ's actual exhibition in the Flesh. However this Mercy is of a large extent and for ever to be prized as in the fulness of time it is more manifest then before and now especially since it is thus openly declared and manifested it ought not to be thus opposed and slighted by men of corrupt minds which affirm it is an error to say that Christ enlightens ever man that cometh into the World and yet at length are forced to confess it as in these words viz. That it is Supernatural the Light of the Gospel of the Messias c. And thus they are confounded and broken to pieces and their wisdom turned backward by this convincing Light this stumbling stone this Rock of offence which they cannot avoid stumbling at and falling upon and breaking to pieces who set themselves against it and bring forth their vain imaginations to eclipse its glory as too many of this Generation hath done And now touching the Scriptures being a Declaration of the Word of God but not the Word nor the only Rule of Faith and Life which T. D. sets down as an Error wherein he hath no less then accused the Scriptures themselves with being Error For first we in calling them a true Declaration we call them what they call themselves Luke 1. as also that they are Writings given forth by the holy men of God and that which they call the Word we do also the Word was in the beginning with God John 1. and his Name is called the Word of God yet both the Doctrinal part and Historical part of the Scripture contained in the Books of the Old and New Testaments we own and never sleighted nor denied yet if we should look upon them as the only Rule of Faith and Life this would exclude the Rule and guidance of the Spirit for the only Rule must be infallible certain incorruptible obvious c. which leads into all Truth as either not sufficient so to guide or not to be owned as the Rule of Faith and Obedience to God c. and this would be contrary to the Testimonies of the holy men of God concerning it who followed it and directed others to it and to walk in this Spirit and therein they knew their several attainments and measures and herein was the Rule of the new Creature who worshipped not in the oldness of the Letter but in the newness of the Spirit Rom. 7.6 2 Cor. 10.13 14 15. Phil. 3.15 16. Gal. 6.15 16. And we know that without the guidance of this Spirit of Truth men can never come to a right judgment nor understanding of the holy Scriptures or Spiritual things And how then doth T. D. go to prove the Scripture to be the Word and the only Rule of Faith and Life whilst he hath granted that to bring a testimony of Scripture concerning it self were petitio principii a begging the question and were insignificant for their conviction which deny its Divine Authority What course then will he take to convince such seeing he himself doth but follow his notions conceivings and humane understanding while Divine Revelation and immediate Inspiration are laid aside and opposed in these dayes by such as he Pag. 65. he saith he will give a taste of our Arguments and leave our tenents to the judgment of the understanding c. What understanding and what Judgment must be the Guide and Rule of mens judgements and undertandings if the Light within must not be the Rule for after he hath asserted the Scriptures to be the only Rule of Faith presently he hath put himself upon a Hanck and shakes his own Foundation in confessing the Scriptures insufficient for the conviction of such who deny its Divine Authority otherwise it s but a begging the question to go to prove the Scriptures by themselves and now what he will erect as a Rule instead thereof for the conviction of such whilst he hath opposed the Light within and asserted the insufficience of the Scriptures shewing them not to be the only Rule is questionable whether he knoweth himself if he doth let him tell it to them that desire it And Pag. 66. It is to be observed one while he tell us of the Judgment of the Vnderstanding another while the matter contained in the Scriptures was the Rule before it was committed in writing and that the Gospel was preached to Adam And again when they affirm the Scripture to be the only Rule its intended to them who have the Scriptures and not to them that have them not Pag. 67. And presently after we must understand this point with connexion with the former the Light within So do but mark what confusion here is First 't is his own confession that the matter contained in the Scripture was before it was written Secondly That to them who have not the Scriptures something must be the Rule and what is it the Light within having no other way as he saith Now if the Light within and the matter contained in the Scriptures be a sufficient Rule to them which have them not in the Writing surely its sufficiency is not diminished by the writing but rather testified unto neither is it the intent of the Scriptures to draw people from either the matter or Light within which opens them nor to set up Scriptures as the only Rule instead thereof But then saith T. D. that very Scripture Rom. 10.8 speaks not of the Light within but of the Scriptures Answ. It speaks of the very same Word which Moses and the Prophets spake of which was before the Scriptures were written in Moses's time much of them was unwritten and yet he directed the people to
as in Pag. 31. he pleads for making use of other words expressions and phrases that neither are litterally nor formally contained in Scripture and so makes use of his conceptions and apprehensions of what is contained therein see pag. 30 31. But then again another while he saith Let us nakedly attend to what the Scripture asserts as in pag. 42. And in pag. 110. he tells us of manifesting what was revealed expresly in Scripture concerning God the Father Son and Holy Ghost so that many times he would make people believe as if he would nakedly and exactly keep to the Scriptures but then at other times his notions conceptions meanings and odd invented terms must be put upon them and men must either confess to those or else be liable to his and his Brethrens censures of being Socinians Hereticks Blasphemers and what not And though he hath appeared a little smother then his Brother Tho. Vincent hath done in his railing Pamphlet yet he hath wronged us by his false insinuations against us as if we denied the Diuinity of Christ and deserted our former Principles also he hath represented us as being in conjunction with those whom he accuseth of opposing or denying the oneness of the Deity and the Grace of Christ or the Father Son and holy Ghost to be God which we are not at all concerned in nor guilty of and our Books and Writings now and from the very beginning evince the contrary But then in Pag. 129. he confesseth That the objections these men principally insist upon are meerly against the explanations we use of this Doctrine and not against the primitive Revelation of it which is the principal object of our Faith c. Now if by these men he intends us called Quakers as is apparent he doth by his present discouse he hath then very much cleared us from other of his and his Brethrens Accusations and thereby hath also plainly contradicted both himself and them for here our objections are meerly against their explanations and not against the primitive Revelation or principal object of Faith so whilst the Revelation which is according to the Scriptures and the principal object of Faith is not objected against but owned and professed by us according to the Scripture it is very unjust and injurious either in him or his Brethren to insinuate against us as if we denied either the Divinity of Christ or the holy Spirit though as to their distinctions about Personalities Subsistances Modallities and the like invented terms and names which they put upon the Deity we must needs except against as not scriptural nor proceeding from any naked attention to what the Scripture asserts which J. O. doth but pretend to but from mens conceptions and traditions which are upheld by the wisdom which this world teacheth and not that which the Holy Ghost teacheth And then in Pag. 89. he goes to accuse and vilifie us in these words viz. Our Quakers for a long time hovered up and down like a swarm of Flyes with a confused noise and huming what falshood and scorn is here for such a Doctor to express begin now to settle in the Opinions lately by them declared for this is a false insinuation again what their thoughts will fall to be concerning the holy Ghost when they shall be contented to speak intelligeably and according to the usage of other men or the pattern of Scripture the great rule of speaking or treating about spiritual things I know not and I am uncertain whether they do themselves or no. Thus far J. Owen To which I say in the first of these expressions he hath scornfully and falsly accused us as also with beginning now to settle in Opinions for we are neither so beginning nor so to begin but are setled in the Truth out of and above mens invented Opinions about which are so many Divisions and Sects among them but if by Opinion he intends Socinianism as he calls and represents it his own testimony shall testifie against him as a false Accuser of us herein as in pag. 129. where he confesseth our objections to be meerly against the explanation they use and not against the primitive Revelation of it so then we are not guilty of such Opinions as either deny the Divinity of Christ or that tends to lessen him in any respect or offices relating to man's Salvation for our desire is and our endeavour hath been the exaltation of his Name Power and Glory over all neither have we been hovering nor in confusion as falsly he hath represented us and if he knows not what our thoughts will fall into concerning the Holy Ghost but is uncertain whether we do our selves or no he should therefore have been silent of accusing or reviling us as he hath done because it appears it is in his ignorance and uncertainty that he hath thus vilified us and insinuated against us he should have received a better information and knowledge of us before he had thus reviled us and not to have gone and bespattered and vilified a whole Body of People to render them odious from his own uncertain thoughts of them for he would not be so dealt by himself and the Reader may take notice that a great part of his Book wherein he goes about to prove the Divinity or Deity of Christ and the Holy Ghost in which he appears as one opposing some great Enemies among whom we are numbred we are unconcerned therein having never denied Christ's Divinity and if his own testimony may be of any value we are cleared by it as before in pag. 129. Alas poor man J. 0. has missed his mark in shooting thus uncertainly and at random against the Quakers And where he adds touching the Holy Ghost Whether he may be the Light within them or an infallible afflatus is uncertain Though it be uncertain to J. O. it is certain to us that have the Testimony and evidence of the holy Spirit in us which gives us both Life Light and Power and we know him to be infallible how deridingly soever he speaks of it as also according to the precious Promises of God which hereby we know in a large measure the fulfilling of we experience Christ to be in us and in that the Father Word and Spirit are confessed to be one Power Wisdom and Love and to be of one Divine Substance Nature and Essence this we neither do nor ever did deny and God is in his People and dwels in them and walks in them and the Spirit is sent into our hearts so they are not divided distinct and separate persons c. as may be read in John 17.21 to the end where Christ said that they may all be one as thou Father art in me and I in thee that they also may be one in us that the World may believe that thou hast sent me and the glory which thou gavest me I have given them that they may be one even as we are one I in them thou in me that
l. last r. invented p. 18. l. 25. for on and r. an end p. 19. l. 1. r. amounts l. 13. r. is towards p. 21. l. 27. r. It is in Christ. p. 27. l. 6. r. deserving p. 39. l. 35. for whether r. whither p. 45. at l. 26 27. the Reader may add or understand as given by divine Inspiration not mens fallable Judgments and Mistakes upon them p. 49. l. 17. being 〈…〉 for and r. or p. 55. l. 18. dele which p. 73. l. 7. in the Apendix r. principal p. 74. l. 33. for T. V r. T. D. p. 76. l. 16. dele three p. 77. l. 12. for 1 r. 5. p. 81. l. 16. dele and. Sometimes such defects have escaped as misplacing hath for have doth for do was for were are for is it for they saith for say and so on the contrary Such are not material faults to any but such as are critical who do not soberly weigh the intent of the matter An APPENDIX Wherein are some of the manifest Contradictions of Thomas Vincent William Maddox Thomas Danson and John Owen both to themselves and one against another With brief Animadversions or Observations upon their Contradictions which are about Principle Matters 1. Touching their distinction of Three Persons I Am sure from the Scriptures that the Father Son and Holy Ghost being of an infinite Nature are three Persons three increated persons subsistences or manner of beings pag. 16 17 18 19. Contrad T.V. In Contradiction to his Brother Maddox saith Infiniteness is not applicable to the Subsistence it cannot be properly ascribed to the Personality though there be three distinct Personalities to which Infiniteness is not ascribed pag. 45. Obs. See here is as much inconsistency between these two as between infinite and finite one making their being of an infinite Nature a proof or reason of their distinct Personalities or Subsistencies And the other saith Infiniteness is not applicable nor properly ascribed to them what gross contradiction and blasphemous stuff is here W. M. Each of these three persons is God his subsistence is his manner of being in the Relative property of the Father and so he speaks of the Son and Holy Ghost pag. 18 19. Contr. T.V. It is improper to say that either of the persons in regard of their personality or subsistence are finite or infinite pag. 46. Obs. This latter Contradiction then would have neither Father Son nor Holy Ghost to be either finite or infinite what gross nonsence and apparent Contradictions are these Contr. T.V. Christ is the Eternal Son of God by Eternal Generation pag. 36 47. Obs. He is now the Eternal Son of God before not infinite but again neither finite nor infinite in his Personality and yet the Eternal Son of God what mad distracted blasphemous work is this these men do make with their vain babling T.V. They are not three substances c. therefore three persons p. 13. Contr. T. D. The usual definition of person is an individual substance of a rational Nature which is neither the part of another nor upheld by another which Aquinus defends Sum Par. 1.9.29 art 2. a man we call a person c. pag. 1 2. Obs. See again how apparently these two Brethren contradict one another one saying a person is an individual substance c. yet the other saith They are not three substances therefore three persons whereas it follows therefore not three persons Contr. J.O. We must acknowledge the Holy Ghost to be a substance a person God yet distinct from the Father and the Son pag. 101. a personal subsistance pag. 114. Obs. Where note that this Doctor Contradicts T.V. his saying they are not three substances as also that he seems to make both substance person and subsistance to intend all one thing contrary to T. V. again But these words a Person God yet distinct from the Father and Son I cannot make sense of though they are from a Doctor for God is not a Person distinct from himself W.M. I called them three Hee 's to try if you would own the Deity of Christ c. according to the Scriptures we call them Persons or Hee 's in respect of their manner of Subsistence pag. 18 20. Contrad T. V. The word Person cannot properly be attributed to Father Son and Holy Ghost because they do not subsist in a several and distinct Nature of the same kind for if each of them had a several and not one individual Nature then they should not be only three Persons but three Gods Synopsis pag. 3. Obs. It 's very evident here that Thomas Danson has Contradicted both himself and the rest of his Brethren seeing the Father Son and Holy Ghost cannot properly be called Persons W.M. saith His comparing the three increated persons to three Apostles Paul Peter and John is blasphemy pag. 20. Contr. T. D. A man we call a person a person is intire of it self pag. 2. if Peter James and John each person be man c. Take man here not for a person but the Nature as we do God and 't is evident that we mean no more that the name Man may be attributed to Peter James and John pag. 12. David was a man and Solomon was a man they two agree in a third thing c. pag. 14 15. Obs. What less do their own distinctions and comparisons concerning them amount to than to Three Apostles or men that is each intire of himself as a Person is T. D. saith who hath apparently spoyled his own and his Brethrens Cause T.V. The Trinity of Persons the first in the second and the second in the first and both in the third pag. 25. Contr. T. D. A Person notes some one indued with reason and understanding which is several and distinct by himself from another p. 2. and in the Dispute they are three distinct and separate Persons in the Deity A person is intire of it self c. Obs. If the Father the Word and the Spirit be in each other and so inseparable then not three distinct nor separate Persons neither can one be several by himself from another T.V. That the Father Word and Holy Ghost are three persons pag. 13. is to be found in the Scriptures God hath revealed it in his Word the Scriptures hath revealed that there are three distinct persons in one Divine Essence pag. 26. Is Scripture truth pag. 4. great truth Contr. T.V. In this Mystery of the Trinity we must exercise our Faith Though we cannot clear it to our selves by Demonstration Reason cannot demonstrate it unto us pag. 26. 't is such a Mystery that doth exceed the most enlightned and clear-sighted Christians Contr. T.D. For Person Aquinus defends I chuse to borrow that of the Learned Wotton the Trinity's a Mystery so high that it rebates the sharpest edge of humane understanding p. 83. Obs. If this Mystery be so apparent in Scripture why can they neither demonstrate it nor clear it to themselves We should desire no clearer
Righteous whilst such as if God's Righteousness or Workmanship were impure This Doctrine has led many in the way to Hell and Destruction But T.V. in 2 Cor. 5. should have read vers 17. If any man be in Christ he is a new Creature old things are passed away behold all things are become new Which is a real change in that man that is in Christ from sin and transgression and not a Justification therein for the Spirit of God both discovers to man his sin and reproves him as a transgressor and one Guilty whilst therein and surely God does not accept of men as his own Righteousness and in Christ whilst his Spirit in them judges them to be both unrighteous and out of Christ for if he did that were to make God contradict himself and to speak quite contrary to his own Spirit which were very absurd and blasphemous to assert But had T.V. rightly minded and understood that of Rom. 8.1 2 3 4 he might have seen how contrary it is to his Doctrine before and himself therein confuted For 1st They that are in Christ Jesus walk not after the Flesh but after the Spirit and it s to such only to whom there is no Condemnation therefore Justification and this is not a sinful imperfect or guilty state 2dly The Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus hath made such free from the Law of Sin and Death 3dly God sending his Son to condemn sin in the Flesh was not to look upon man Justified in the sinful state or whilst he walks after the Flesh. But 4thly That the Righteousness of the Law might be fulfilled in such who walk not after the Flesh but after the Spirit and this doth absolutely confute T.V. and his Brethren And whereas for the proof of his Doctrine of Guilty Persons being the Righteousness of God he citeth Rom. 4.6 7. where it is said David described the blessedness of that man to whom God imputeth Righteousness without Works to which I say not without the Works of the True and Living Faith in Jesus nor yet without a subjection to the Law of Faith but without that the Works or Deeds of the Law of Works chap. 3.19 20 21 24 25 26 27 28. the Apostle did not exclude the Works Obedience or Righteousness of the true Faith from a justified state for if Paul had so done it had been contrary to James his Testimony who said Was not our Father Abraham justified by Works when he had offered up Isaac See Jam. 2. And Abraham believed God and it was counted to him for Righteousness We say That Faith was reckoned to Abraham for Righteousness Rom. 4.3 9. which Faith was not without its own Works although it be not the Works of the Law as Circumcision and others that were Types or Signs wherein the Righteousness of Faith doth not consist which they that are in the uncircumcision as the Gentiles that were the ungodly spoken of Rom. 4.5 11. chap. 3.29 do receive through Faith in Christ and become really partakers thereof being Justified from all those things from which they could not be Justified by the Law of Moses And so such are Justified or made Just or truly so Accepted of God not in sin or ungodliness but as Redeemed out of it and Sanctified from it See 1 Cor. 6.11 And blessed are they whose Iniquities are forgiven and whose sins are covered Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin This is no Proof for T. V. his sinful Doctrine for them whom the Lord doth bless and imputeth not Iniquity to are in the way of God and partakes of his Righteousness through Faith cannot feed upon an imagined Imputation or Justification in sin for in Psal. 32.2 David describeth the blessedness of such in these words Blessed is the man to whom the Lord imputeth not Iniquity and in whose Spirit there is no guile These words in whose Spirit there is no guile the Priests use to leave out in their talk of Imputation but as their Faith without Works or a real Obedience on the Creatures part is but a dead empty and feigned Faith So their laying a claim to and pretending a Justification by the imputed Righteousness of Christ whilst they are sinners and polluted pleading for Imperfection whilst here 't is but a false imagination of their own for though we confess that Justification is in the Righteousness of Christ by Faith in him and that this True and Living Faith and the Righteousness of it is reckoned to the true Believer yet we do not therefore grant that Sinners or Polluted Persons in that state are cloathed with this Righteousness nor that 't is imputed to them as theirs whilst they are out of it for they that have put on Christ are translated from sin and unrighteousness and so are made partakers of the Righteousness of Faith which T.V. saith is without us and so puts it a far off and yet cites Phil. 3.9 which plainly Contradicts his Doctrine for Paul having confessed Christ Jesus to be his Lord and suffered the loss of all things that he might win Christ it was that he might be found in him not having his own Righteousness but that which is through the Faith of Christ the Righteousness which is of God by Faith that said he I may know him and the Power of his Resurrection and the Fellowship of his Suffering being made conformable to his Death vers 9 10. Mark his winning Christ being found in him his not having his own Righteousness but that of Faith extends to a real injoyment of Christ and his being in him and not to an imagined Imputation in sin but to his knowing Christ and the Power of his Resurrection Fellowship of his Suffering and Conformity to his Death this was a blessed estate which all you that plead for Sin and Imperfection and a Justification whilst you are out of Christ or strangers to him being both unacquainted with his Power and Fellowship of Suffering and never came ye so to be conformable to his Death you being yet alive in your sins And as to T. V. his Argument or Syllogism it proves nothing of his Doctrine of impure or guilty Persons being Justified by Imputation for Justification by Faith in Jesus Christ and his Righteousness we never denied but this Faith is not a dead Faith nor without its own Works for it purifieth the heart but so does not your Faith who plead for sin by which you apply Christ's Righteousness whilst you are out of it and it without you as T.V. confesseth pag. 17. How hath he and the rest of you that own this his Doctrine soothed and daubed People up in their sins flattering them with a Pretence of Imputation and Justification therein when your Faith is but dead and empty as a body without a Spirit is dead That we are Justified by Faith without Works By what Faith and without what Works is mentioned and manifest according to Scripture both