your whole Discourse So as I may see my Doom already set down in black and white that I must be Censured as one too busie or AllotroepÃoskopos playing the Bishop in anothers Diocese in our English Translation a busy body But I must beare it off with Head and Shoulders And as the Proverbe is Over Shooes over Bootes I have already waded through the Fords of your Dedicatory and now I must launch into the Deep of your Discourse And there 's now no returning Nor have I put my hand to the Plough to turn up your weeds by the roots to look backe or desist for feare to be censured as one too busie Yea all my businesse is about particulars and namely such as summed up together in the totall conclude you to be though not a profest Invader yet a most subtile and pragmaticall Enginer and underminer of that Truth of Christ in the Scripture which yet the Gates of Hell shall never prevaile against L. p. 4. Bellarmine of very great ability to make good any truth which he undertakes for the Church of Rome P. What one thing I pray which Bellarmine undertakes to make good for the Church of Rome as the Church of Rome is a truth I say as the Church of Rome For what he undertakes to make good for the Church of Rome properly must needs be some point of Popery or Popish Doctrine Otherwise he undertakes not to make it good as for the Church of Rome Now the Church of Rome as it is the Church of Rome namely the Papall Church holds not any one Saving Truth I say againe it holds not any one Saving Truth I shall prove this more particularly at after Yet you seem to intimate here that either all or most things so undertaken by him are truth But the contrary will appeare So as what things are in themselves false and erronious can by no humane ability either of that Champion of Rome Bellarmine or of the great Champion of the present Church of England be so made good as to deserve the name of Truth L. ibid. After Bellarmine hath distinguished â—o expresse his Meaning in what sence the particular Church of Rome cannot Erre in things which are de Fide of the Faith he tells us this Firmitude is because the Sea Apostolicke is fixed there And this he saith is most true P. Your last words here are somewhat darke whether we should take them for Bellarmines words he saith or for your owne assent therein And this he saith is most true This Later is the Likelier And then againe here is another doubt whether And this he saith is very true it be referred to the whole Sentence going before and alledged by you or onely to the Last Clause If to the whole Sentence then in Saying And this he saith is most true you assent that Romes infallibility consists in the Firmitude of the Sea Apostolicke fixed there Which you seem afterwards more expresly to contradict But if onely to the Last Clause your Speech hath reference And this he saith is most true then first you should have expressed it more Clearely and punctually as in some things you doe But taking it in the best sense you confesse it is most true that the Sea Apostolicke is fixed there thus you give occasion of Dispute about Peters being at Rome and of his being Bishop of Rome and if so whether consequently Rome be yet the Sea Apostolicke But because your words here are not Cleare enough and at after you declare your selfe herein more plainly what we have to say of this we will reserve to a fitter place L. p. 23. I shall ever be glad that the Church of England may have farre more able Defendants then my selfe P. Certainly the Church of England her selfe may be glad hereof to vindicate her Reputation which you by this your Defence have layd flat in the dust But May have seems to import that now she hath not at least now that Dr. White is dead Nor hath the Church of England any great cause to glory in either of you both as Defendants unlesse by the Church of England you understand that new Start-up Faction of Arminianized and Iesuited Atheists whose Standard-beares you have been and are to bring the whole Land backe againe to Rome and so to make a full League and Confederacie against the true Church of Iesus Christ. L. p. 29. Things not Fundamentall yet to some mens Salvation are neâ—essary P. How prove you this Seeing what is necessary to some mens Salvation is necessary to all and every mans Salvation And Fundamentalls onely to wit Such things as are de Fide of Faith are the onely things necessary to every mans Salvation According to the Athanasius his Creed Whosoever will be Saved it is necessary that he hold the Catholicke Faith which Faith unlesse a man keep whole and undefiled without doubt he shall perish everlastingly For the Catholicke Faith comprehends all Fundamentalls which to violate in any one particular overthrowes the Faith and cuts a man off from Salvation But your adding of other things besides and unto the Fundamentalls as necessary to Some mens Salvation doth necessarily inferre this Consequence that there be other things besides Christ which are necessary to Some mens Salvation And so you make Christ an insufficient Saviour to some men at least as to whose Salvation things not Fundamentall are necessary For things not Fundamentall are extra Christum out of or without Christ. Whereas the Scripture Saith of CHRIST That there is no Salvation in any other for there is none other name under heaven given whereby Dei sothenai emas we Must be Saved which words doe plainly evince that besides Christ nothing under heaven is necessary to any mans Salvation But give us some one particular instance of such things as being not fundamentall yet are necessary to some mens Salvation You tell us of certain I wot not what Deductions from the Articles of Faith which you make to be your Not-Fundamentall and yet necessary to some mens Salvation but for our better Information you particularize in nothing neither in the things nor in the persons for whose Salvation they are necessary but leave all in the Cloudes the fittest manâ—le to foldâ—up such foule and blind errours in L. p. 31. The Churches Declaration can bind us to peace and externall obedience where there is no expresse Letter of Scripture and Sense agreed upon P. By the Latitude of this Sentence you or your Church of England may as you have done by your Declaration prefixed to your Articles of Religion as before bind Ministers not to preach of those Doctrines of Grace as Election Predestination c. because though there be expresse Letter of Scripture for them yet the Sense is so farre from being agreed upon by your present Church as that you Say plainly they may be taken in two opposite Senses So as upon this your Churches Declaration of the ambiguities of your Articles you
those plagues written therein and threatned against Reprobates and Devils shal be most certainly inflicted in beliefe whereof they tremble What have they this Faith given them of God and is the Holy Ghost the Sole Infuser of it or any Infuser of it at all And yet I say This historicall faith is that which you Speake of here For you do in that 16 th Section consisting of about 30 leaves in folio Speake of that Faith alone which beleeves the Scripture to be the word of God the onely subject of that long and tedious Discourse wherein you have spent so much sweat to so small purpose And the words immediately preceding doe shew this And your words immediately following are to confirme it which you alledge out of Stapleton Saying The Holy Ghost did not leave the Church in Generall nor the true members of it in particular without Grace to beleeve what himself had revealed and made credible Wherupon you inferre a little after Till the Spirit of God move the heart of man he cannot beleeve be the object never so credible Thus we see your mind at full what Faith what Gift of God what Grace this is which you Say none but the Holy Ghost giveth to his Church namely not that faith not that gift of God not that Grace not that worke of the Holy Ghost whereby a man comes to beleeve in Christ and to be indued with the Grace of Regeneration and Sanctification the proper worke and gift of the Holy Ghost whereof the Apostle speaketh in the fore-cited place but such a faith such a grace as the Councel of Trent professeth and aloweth and so that which Stapleton and all other Pontificials write of which is common to all wicked men and Reprobates as we have elswhere fully proved L. p. 75. The world cannot keep a man from going to weigh the Scripture at the Ballance of Reason whether it be the word of God or not For the word of God and the Book containing it refuse not to be weighed by Reason And pag. 76. For Reason by her own light can discover how firmely the Principles of Religion are true but all the light Shee hath will never be able to find them false P. 'T is â—rue that mans naturall Reason being not bridled by grace is so head-strong that the world it selfe cannot restrain it within its owne bounds but will be medling But yet though Reason be not excluded from giving her voyce and assent to the Scripture yet She must know her place She must come in the Reere of all and as a hand-maid not as a Mistresse Nor is it Reasons office to bring her ballance to weigh the Scriptures whether it be the word of God or not for herein She hath no negative voyce but onely of assent So as in this respect as a Judge Gods word refuseth to be weighed by Reason much lesse can it be true that Reason by her own light can discover how firmly the Principles of Religion are true For mans Reason being but Naturall and Gods word Supernaturall there is no proportion between them and Reason can no more judge of Scripture in this respect then a blind man can judge of colours So as Reason must not come in with her ballance and weights till a man be illuminated by the Scriptures themselves and by the Spirit of God and then being convinced of the truth thereof She gives her full assent that the Scripture is the word of God The Apostle saith The naturall man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God neither can he know them because they are Spiritually discerned How say you then That Reason by her own Light can discover how firmly the Principles of Religion are true Point blanke against the Apostle The Lord openeth the heart of Lydia to attend to the things spoken of Paul Now if the naturall man by the light of his naturall reason receiveth not nor is thereby capable of the things of the Spirit of God contained in the Scripture but that they are foolishnesse unto him untill God open the heart and reveale those things by his Spirit as the Apostle saith then Reason cannot judge of Scripture by her owne light For what is Reasons light in a naturall man Surely darknesse it selfe unto Spiritâ—all things Ye were once darknesse saith the Apostle Darknesse in the very abstract Mans naturall understanding and Reason darknesse And therefore as Christ saith If the light that is in thee be darknesse how great is that darknesse And Rom. 8.5 They that are after the flesh tà tes sarkòs phronousin doe savour the things of the flesh but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit Spirituall things are as unsavory to a naturall mans Reason as wholesome meat is to an aguish palate They are unto him morÃa foolishnesse saith the Apostle And Rom. 8.6 The wisdome of the flesh is death and ekthrà emnity against God and it is not subject to the Law of God neither indeed can be Ye saith Ieremy Every man is brutish in his own knowledge Can you then hale the Scripture to the barre of mans naturall Reason which is brutish to be judged by it whether it be Gods word or no And David saith Surely men of low degree are vanity Yea say you Men of low degree but not so men of high degree of learning and parts But take all with you Surely men of low degrâ—e are vanity and men of high degree are a lye to be layd in the ballance they are altogether lighter then vanity What men of low degree vanity and men of high degre a lye Yea Surely yea altogether lighter then vanity it selfe being â—ayd in the ballance But in what ballance In the uneven ballance with the false Scales of your naturall Reason No but in the Ballance and with the weights of the Sanctuary your Reason must be weighed And this ballance of the Sanctuary is the Scripture If then your Reason must be weighed at the ballance of the Scripture and there be found too light yea lighter then vanity yea altogether lighter then vanity yea Surely altogether lighter then vanity yea a very lye then what weights can your Reason bring being altogether lighter then vanity it selfe whereby to weigh the Scriptures Or how shall Reason which is a lye with her unequall Ballance and false weights weigh verity it selfe But if all this will not put you out of conceit of your naturall Reason as an incomptent Judge of Scripture to be the word of God which must needs argue the truth of Scripture that mans Reason is blindnes darknes emnity against the truth brutish vanity a ly altogether lighter then vanity it self give me leave a little to put you to it You perswade your selfe that you can by the strength and light of your naturall Reason judge or weigh the Scripture whether it be Gods word and discover how firmely the Principles of Religion
are true for had you been perswaded hereof by Gods Spirit you would never have attributed so much to mans Reason but herein you have consulted altogether with flesh and blood having no acquaintance certainly with the Spirit of truth that leads his into all truth Now then by the Same Reason you may discover whether Christ be of God or no for he is the Summe Substance and Scope of the whole Scripture and so is called The word of God And Christ Saith Search the Scriptures for these testifie of me Doe you beleeve then that the Scripture is Gods word and therefore true Doe you beleeve all things in it to be true And to be a word of wisdome surpassing all the wisdome in the world Doe you beleeve this And that to obey and follow this word of God is mans chiefe wisdome and happinesse Doth your Reason apprehend this What say you then to that word of Christ If any man will come after me let him deny himselfe and take up his daily Crosse and follow me Doth your Reason comprehend this Is it not durus sermo a hard Saying as that to the rich man Vade vende omnia Goe Sell aâ—l and give them to the poore and thou shalt have treasure in heaven and come and follow me But all Gods Saints doe thus Mâ—ses accounted the Râ—bukâ—s of Christ greater riches then the Treasures of Aegypt and chose rather to suffer affliction with the people of God thâ—n to enjoy the pleasures of Sin for a Season Paul accounted all his Prerogatives losse and dung to win Christ. The Apostles forsooke all to follow Christ. You will Say A few poore 〈◊〉 nets Nay Saith Aug. they forsook not onely what they had but whatsoever they might have in the world Abraham when God called him forsook his native Countrey and all his friends Do you beleeve these men did wisely in doing this Doth your Reason apprehend so Do you thereupon Conclude that this Scripture is Gods word because it teacheth such things as the doing whereof brings a man to true happinesse Can you then be content to follow Christ upon his Conditions to forsake all and take up your Crosse dayly and follow him Can your Reason down with his or your Stomack digest this Or will you Say To forsake all is but matter of Councel not of Precept Yes certainly of Precept in those things especially the retaining whereof detaines us from Christ and are a barre to come to him and so to heaven Si in Limine Pater jaceat per calcatum perge patrem Saith Ierome If they old Father lye crosse the threshold to hinder thee from Christ tread on thy Father to come to Christ. If any thing stand in our affections in competition with Christ we must forsake it He that loveth Father or Mother or lands or honours more then me Saith Christ is not worthy of me For the amity of the world is emnity against Christ. Now if things in themselves good and lawfull being loved above Christ keep us from Christ and therefore must be forsaken then how much more such things as are in themselves evill unlawfull unwarrantable for a man to keep as being against Gods word and against Christ and against a mans salvation How then can your most refined Reason perswade his Grace of Canterbury to deny himselfe to abandon all that Grace to forsake his Hierarchy as being emnity against Christ and a Tyranny over his Church and therewith to account all his Dignities as dung to cease persecuting of Gods word Ministers People to abandon his counterfet and hypocriticall Devotion in in will-worship which is a vaine worship of God and in stead of all these to take up his Crosse dayly and to follow Christ in obedience in patience in humility in meeknesse in holinesse Doth your Reason apprehend this to be good to be the wisest and onely way to come to heaven and happinesse For this Gods word commandeth Then either follow this word as Gods word or els never looke to perswade the world that your own Reason can with her own light discover how firmly the Principles of Religion are true No no my Lord away with these vain Speculations and presumptuous Speeches which have not one crumb of Salt in them Will you professe you know God and in works deny him Do you beleeve the Scripture to be Gods word and yet by accounting the preaching of the Crosse foolishnesse make God a lyer But I will conclude with your last Clause Reason say you for all the light she hath will never be able to find the Principles of Religion false Nay certainly although you deny Reason any ability by her owne light to discover how firmly the Principles of Religion are true yet we will not deny unto her blind impotencie a Speciall faculty in finding them to be false not false in themselves but yet false in her own apprehension For is not this one of the main Principles of Religion to wit to know Iesus Christ and him Crucified This was the Apostles Chiefe Learning I determined saith he to know nothing among you save Iesus Christ and him Crucified But saith he The preaching of the Crosse is to them that perish foolishnesse but unto us which are Saved it is the power of God And who are they that perish Such as are wise in their owne conceit and prudent in their own understanding and Reason as the Apostle saith in the next words for it is written I will destroy the wisedome of the wise and will bring to nought the understanding of the prudent Such as exalt their own understanding and Reason to such a height as they presume therwith as with a Ballance to weigh whether the Scripture be Gods word or no and with the light thereof to discover how firmly the Principles of Religion are true And when they have said and done all their actions and practises doe plainly shew that they reject and despise the Scripture as being none of Gods word yea they Persecute oppresse and seeke all the wayes they can to destroy it and utterly to quench the light of it As will yet more clearely appeare by those things that follow L. p. 77. Though this Truth that the Scripture is the word of God is not so demonstratively evident à priori as to enforce assent yet it is strengthened so abundantly with probable Arguments both from the light of nature it selfe and humane Testimony that he must be very wilfull and selfe conceited that shall dare to suspect it And more plainly pag 80. The light which is in Scripture it selfe is not bright enough it cannot beare sufficient witnesse to it selfe The Testimony of the Holy Ghost that is most infallible but ordinarily it is not so much as considerable in this Question which is not how or by what meanes we beleeve but how the Scripture may be proposed as a Credible object fit for beliefe P. We are still in
did they speake this out of any disesteem of those Fathers but when they were I say so urged to defend the truth against the Adversaries of it by the evidence whereof they were able to make good what they sayd that those Fathers were but men and might erre Now for this who is more apt then your Lordship to cast in the dish of this precise party as you call them that they should upon just cause speake thus of your antient Fathers What would you say then if all this party should as one Man rise up and openly professe against you as a notorious enemy of the truth and of the Church of God in England and elswhere and of all pious sincere and zealous Preachers of the Gospell and that under the Name of the precise party which you so yoake with the Jesuites you doe maliciously not onely seek to undermine but even professedly to invade and oppugne the whole Kingdome of Iesus Christ as also your practises and this your Book can witnesse And how doe you come to know the thoughts of this precise party so well that you say they think their own preachings were infallible Surely you do but think so You might therfore judge more charitably But as I said of those Fathers so do I of these what they have a good and sure ground in Scripture for to preach and teach they may be sure and they know it to be the truth and so infallible As for those that preach of cursing and lyes as David speaks and suggest slanders and false reports into the eares of Princes and Courts against Gods Ministers and Preachers let them thinke and be assured too that what they preach or print is not onely not infallible but most malicious and detestable both before God and Man as tending also the blinding and so to the downfall of such as beleeve such falshoods to be infallible L. p 104. When the Fathers say we are to rely upon Scriptures onely they are never to be understood with exclusion of Tradition in what causes soever it may be had Not but that the Scripture is abundantly sufficient in and of it selfe for all things but because it is deep and may be drawn into different senses and so mistaken If any man will presume upon his own strâ—ngth and goe single without the Church And citing an excellent sentence out of Vincentius Lynnenâ—is quum sit perfectus Scripturarum Canon sibique ad ommia satis superque sufficiat c. Forasmuch as that Canon of Scripture is perfect and superabundantly selfe-sufficient to all things and if you adde this your note upon it in the margent And if it be sibi ad omnia then to this to prove it selfe at least after Tradition hath prepared as to receive it P. A little before you cite also Augustine seting downe 4 speciall notes and marks internall to the Scripture to prove it to be the word of God As 1. The Miracles 2. That there is nothing carnall in the Doctrine 3. That there hath been such performance of it 4. That by such a Doctrine of humility the whole world almost hath been converted And there also to the same purpose Lynnenâ—is who placeth the Scripture before Tradition And here againe That the Scripture is selfe-sufficient to all What room then for Tradition Or if Tradition have any place at all it were good manners for it to come behind as a Handmayd waiting on her Mistris But you can salve all with a wet finger or with one drop out of your pen If it be sibi ad omnia that is selfe-sufficient to all things then to this to prove it selfe at least after Tradition â—ath prepard us to receive it This is your own Addition or Comentary and Glosse of your own Mother wit which is as Tertullian saith of the old Roman Senate which had made a decree that none should be taken into the number of their Gods but such as the Senate it selfe should first think worthy and approve of So as Tiberius Caesar under whose Empire Christ suffered when he had heard much fame of Christ he moved the Senate that Christ migh be entertained for one of their Gods But the Senate for the foresaid Reason rejected it because they first had approved of it Whereupon Tertullian saith Ergo nisi homini plaâ—uerit Deus non erit Deus Therfore except it please man God shall not be God A fit parralell for this very purpose The Scripture by the consent of all the antient Fathers is abundantly selfe-sufficient to prove it selfe to be the word of God but the present Church hath a Senatus consultum a Decree Tradition which must first give her voyce and approbatiton that the Scripture is the word of God otherwise in vaine are all those Encomiums and Commendations of the Fathers though never so antient affirming and confirming the Scriptures selfe-sufficiencie even beyond all measure The Tradition of the present Church must first give her voyce Ergo nisi homini placuerit Scriptura non erit verbum Dei Therfore except it please man the Scripture shall not be the word of God Onely herein you goe beyond the Roman Senate for their Decree for the admiting of a God was by the generall voyce of all the Senators But yours is here from the sole and single Oracle of the Church of England The Chaire of Canterbury 'T is enough that you tell us with an if if the Scripture be Sibi ad omnia then to this to prove it selfe at least after Tradition hath prepared us to receive it Otherwise never talke of Fathers Authority all is in vaine The Scripture cannot be beleeved to be the word of God unlesse The Tradition of the Present Church prepare the way to receive it And at least you say which is no small deminution of the Sâ—riptures selfe-sufficiencie which you put with an if at least But of this sufficiently But let 's heare your Reasons further for your Tradition The Scripture Say you is deep and may be drawn into different sences and so mistaken that any man will presume upon his own strength and goe single without the Church So it seemeth your Articles of Religion are deepe as which not onely may be but are drawne into different sences and so mistaken and that by the presumption of one mans strength going single without the Church But for the Scripture though it be deep yet it affords us both line and Bucket sufficient to draw water out of those wellâ— of Salvation and so to give us a full tast whereby to relish and resent whose word it is except the Tradition and Authority of your present Church doe cut off our line and breake our Bucket The Scripture hath both Milke for Babes and strong Meat for Men. In the Sea both the Elephant may swim as AUG and GREG. saith and the Lamb wade and when it is by unstable men wrested and drawn into different sences and so mistaken yet it remaines the
when men sheere their Goates so in this respect you may safely say That when Romes errours and Superstitions are removed our Protestations and Seperation is ended And so may I. L p. 136. Protestants doe but protest the sincerity of their Faith against the Doctrinall corruption which hath invaded the great Sacrament of the Eucharist and other parts of Religion P. Well were it for you and your present Church of England as you have lately made it or would at least make it if you had such sincerity of Faith to protest against Romes doctrinall corruptions as true Protestants have But why doe you call the Lords supper The Great Sacrament of the Eucharist Is it Great because you give it a Name not known in Scripture Or because it is so grandized in the Church of Rome as it is made like the Great Diana of the Ephesians whom all the Pontifician world worshipeth Or it is Great comparatively to Baptisme because this is celebrated in the Font at the Church doore neere the Belfrey and That upon your high Altar which you have advanced at the chiefe as you esteem it and East end af your Chancels and of your stately Cathedrals Or Great because in your Devotion you bow towards that place whence it seems you look for your help yea so lowly fall down and worship before it as before the Lord your maker Or what is it that your Eucharist is become with you so Great a Sacrament Because it or your selfe is Great with Child of a young new God-Almighty But however For my part I reverence every Ordinance of God but I dare not make nor esteem them greater then God hath made them nor give them other Names and Titles then God hath given them least I either seem to be wiser then my Maker and their Author or should give more honour to them then is due this being as wofull experience hath taught the ready way to rob God of his honour to transferre it to the creature and set it up instead of God But loth you are I know to call the Sacrament the Lords Supper as the Scripture calls it least it might call for the Lords Table as the Scripture also terms it and so your high Altar should have no more Room in the Church But doe the true Protestants protest the sincerity of their Faith onely against the Doctrinall Faith which hath invaded your Great Sacrament of the Eucharist Yes you adde and other parts of Religion What be those That we may know those speciall Doctrinall Corruptions against which you say Protestants do protest the sincerity of their Faith For Rome hath many Doctrinall Corruptions against which true Protestants protest which you do not so much as mention in all your Book and such too as do â—â—atly overthrow the Foundation Christ. As Iustification by works for one which we have touched before Yea and Rome hath many and those most damnable corruptions which you are so farre from accounting corruptions as you make them Essentiall parts of Gods worship I name Altars for one Of which also before And these things we Protestants protest the sincerity of our Faith against But you are none of those Protestants as not professing much lesse protesting the sincerity of any such Faith L p. 138. A right sober man may without the least touch of insolence or madnesse dispute a businesse of Religion with the Roman either Church or Prelate as all men know Irenaeus did with Victor so it be with modesty and for the finding out or confirming of truth free from vanity and purposed opposition against even a particular Church P. This passage I cited before in my Preface to your Lordship yet I here recite it again because perhaps all wil be little enough to put you in mind therof For as I told you before the Greatnesse of the Cause hath caused my stile and Spirit to mount upon the wings of zeale for my Christ and for his Church in a higher degree and strain then ordinary And that for this you Censure me of insolence or madnesse as I feare it wil be the best defence you can make for your Cause alwayes excepted the Bill in Starre-Chamber I have no remedy but patience committing the Cause to him that judgeth rightly And as I have done it for the finding out of the truth so this hath caused me a great deale of moyle in digging and removing away a masse of earth and rubbedge which you had cast to hide this Treasure from us So as a purposed opposition was not it that set me upon this Great taske but yet I oppose you and purpose to detect your falsities so fairly guilded over with hypocrisie that you might not impose too much upon your Credulous Reader You aledge for this purpose the Example of Irenaeus arguing a Case with Victor Bishop of Rome which you say all men know But my Lord I suppose all men do not know it And because it is a matter both worthy and not unnecessary for all men to know it I will take occasion here to speake somthing of it as not impertinent also to our present purpose Towards the end of the second Century there was a difference between the Asian Church and the Roman about the Day of Celebrating the memory of the Lords Resurrection The contention grew hot as commonly men are most eagre in propounding their own devises in matter of Religion so as because the Asian Churches would not conforme to Victor Bishop of Rome he began to fume and to thunder and threaten them all with Excommunication Irenaeus who lived in France for this reproves Victor telling him that he ought not to proceed and deale so with Asian Churches for such differences as were of things at that time accounted Indifferent Some saith he fast one day before Easter some two some more some 40. houres together whereupon by the way it seems that those 40. houres were afterwards turned into forty dayes for your Lent Fast kaì cudèn élatton pà ntes oâ—uioi eirteneusà n tè kaì eireneúomen pròs alluious yet neverthelesse saith he all these lived peaceably together and we also are at peace one with another Kaì he diaphonìn tes nesteÃas tèn homónoian tes pÃstâ—os sunistesi And this difference about Fasting commendeth saith he the unity of Faith And he relates unto him also the examples of sundry of his Predecessors in the Sea of Rome who neither kept it themselves nor command of it to others and yet neverthelesse they that observed it not were at peace with those that came to them from the neighbour Churches or Congregations wherein it was observed Nor were any at any time cast out of the Church about the Manner or Custome But those Presbyters saith he who before you observed it not sent Commendations or kind salutations and greetings as tokens of Charity to those of other neighbouring Churches who did observe it And blessed Polycarpus sojourning at Rome in the time of
A REPLIE TO A RELATION OF THE CONFERENCE BETWEEN WILLIAM LAUDE and Mr. FISHER the Jesuite By a Witnesse of JESUS CHRIST JOB 38.2 Who is this that darkeneth Councell by words without knowledge 1 KINGS 18.21 How long halt you between two opinions If the LORD be GOD follow him but if Baal then follow him CANT 2.15 Take us the Foxes the little Foxes that spoyle the Vines for our Vines have tender Grapes IMPRINTED Anno MDCXL A SAD AND SERIOVS CONSULTATION OF A DISCONSOLAE MOTHER CHRISTS VIRGIN-Spouse with twelve of her Children about her whose names are Faith Hope Charity Zeale Humility Prudence Piety Patience Iustice Mercy Verity Prayer whose severall judgements the Mother requireth in a doubtfull case MOTHER MY Deare Children how doth the very sight of you revive my dolefull spirits almost drowned in the Dragons flood You are to me as that twelve-starred Crowne upon my head But to the purpose for which I have called you together though indeed you are never asunder nor absent from me and it is this You have taken notice of a notorious Booke lately published by the Prime Prelate of England which he calls a Relation of a Conference c. And how to that Relation a Sonne of mine no lesse known to you all then assisted by you in the worke hath made here a Reply and presented it to me But now how to improve and dispose of it for the best is the doubt The Relator the Prelate ingageth the King in it by two bonds the one of Patronage the other of Command as if the King had first commanded it to be published and now did give it Patronage and protection which if true it puts me in a straight what to doe with this Reply For who so fit to take notice of it yea and to give it Protection too if both the matter and the consequence of it being of so high a nature be well and wisely weighed It hath much perplexed me Now therefore give me your best advice And first Faith what sayst thou Faith Deare Mother put away from you all such perplexed thoughts 'T is true If we looke on worldly meanes with a carnall eye we are all in a straight But this is our safety 'T is well the world hath never an object to allure our confidence to pitch upon it And best of all when all the world is banded against us and our Christ. Is not he alone sufficient to cope with them Doth he not laugh at their proud but vaine attempts which are no lesse against him then against us Is not the Cause then his And are not we his And is not he for us Who then shall be against us What though Principalities and Powers and Spirituall wickednesses in high places be with all the power and pollicie of the world with all the craft and cruelty of the Dragon and Devill armed against us why still Christ is for us That 's sufficient Therefore there be moe with us then against us We are a little flock against a world of Wolves and Foxes Lyons and Beares but we have a watchfull and powerfull Shepheard whose Legions of mighty Angels those heavenly Hosts doe pitch their tents round about us We are his Paradise on earth which he defends continually with his Cherubims flaming sword that proud Apostates cannot so invade us as to take one Tree of life from us Let the wild Beasts then rage and warre upon us let the Aegyptian troopes pursue us as with open mouth to devuore us but stand we still and see the salvation of the LORD He that led his people through the Sea never wants power to deliver his when in most desperate straights Mother Cheare up Not a haire of your head shall perish The faithfull and True hath said it As for outward meanes if we have them we use them as Gods ordinances if we have them not nay if all be against us yet our Faith in GOD is the same and ever greater stronger and nobler without and against meanes then with them And much more is our GOD the same and his glory most shineth where outward meanes are either least helpfull or most opposite My resolution then is this The Reply in my judgement is very necessary to be published and withall as most pertinent and important to be presented to the King But whether he will read it or no leave that to GOD. We shall neither loose our labour nor reward For great is the Truth and shall prevaile what ever opposition Men or Devils make against it And in this Reply the true Faith is defended against the Prelates false and counterfeit Faith I have said Mother Well Hope what sayst thou Hope Deare Mother I am of the same mind and spirit with my Sister Faith By all meanes cast away all anxious and perplexed thoughts and be of good comfort though our Shippe be shrewdly weather-beaten and shaken yet Christ is at the sterne And I have already cast Anchor in the Havens mouth on a firme ground within the Veile When Noahs Arke floated over the toppes of the highest Mountaines in that dreadfull Deluge when the world was a Sea what Pilot safely guided and steered its course that it should rest upon the Mount Ararat Even the same Pilot we have to conduct us through these Floods to the Haven where we would be Let the Reply for truth against falsehood be published under Christs Patronage and protection that 's sufficient As for Men the lesse we hope in them the lesse we feare them And while we doe our duty with the one hand we lay hold on the Crowne with the other I have sayd Mother Charity what sayst thou Charity Deare Mother as my Sister Hope is the Anchor both sure and stedfast So I am the three-fold Cable not easily broken and therefore be of good comfort For Love not all the floods can drowne it Now for the Relation were those many passages in it noted by the Replyer some common slips of ignorance or humane frailty I would cast my large mantle over them but being of a high nature and full of impiety against GOD and CHRITT and the Holy Ghost and the holy Scriptures and against your holy Spouse-ship and against Faith and against Charity and so against all true Religion yea proceeding also from a Prime Prelate pretending great learning and knowledge and professing such singular eminencie and dexterity of wit and judgement as being the onely able Champion of the Church of England to defend the truth against a Jesuite and all this under the faire white veile of hypocrisie onely his Black-moores skin too grosly appearing in his malignant practises in persecuting the Truth and in those malicious and impious passages in his Booke so as he is left altogether naked of all plea of ignorance therefore I hold it fit that his hypocrisie should be unmasqued his bold falcities confuted his insollencie suppressed his impiety rebuked and the Truth maintained against him
Incendiary For behold Lord what havock is made in the Land What superstitions in will-worship what oppression of the Gospell what persecution of thy Ministers what effusion of their innocent blood What dispersion of their poore families What prophanation of thy holy Sabbaths What erection and adoration of Antichristian Altars and Images What suspension of the doctrines of Grace and Salvation What usurped Tyrannicall Domination over thy Ministers and People What imposition of the intollerable yoake of Ceremonies upon their necks bringing them againe under Antichristian bondage whom Christ by the shedding of his precious blood hath made free And what urging and pressing with furious rage reaching up to heaven the observation of all humane Ordinances while yea and whereby thy divine Ordinances are cast out And what wilt thou now doe to thy great Name Thou hast of late by terrible signes from heaven as it were by sound of Trumpet summoned the whole Land threatning to destroy it Surely the provocations are great were not thy Patience greater But thou expectest Repentance with Reformation of all these abominations But little appearance as yet and as little hope while such Books as this are Patronized and Authorized What then Lord Wilt thou therfore proceed to judge the whole Land for these things Surely the whole Land is defiled and so the cause were just But yet remember Lord that thou hast a remnant yet left therein that have not bowed the knee to Baal And consider withall that they are a Faction principally of some few persons as the Prelates that have caused such confusions in the Land And wilt thou destroy the righteous with the wicked farre be that from thee Shall not the Iudge of all the world doe right And even now do not thy People lift up strong cryes unto thee against their Aegyptian Taskemasters and Babylonian Lords And behold Lord what a desperate Leader this Faction hath got even as Iudas was to the Rowt the Primate and Metropolitan of all England those Antichristian Titles he so much vaunteth of who because he walkes in Factious and lawlesse by-wayes therefore hath this Fox for his better defence gotten upon him the Lyons skin pretending the King for the Author and Patron of all his practises Now the Foundations being thus cast down what can the Righteous doe But thou art in the holy Temple Thy Throne is in heaven wherein and whence thou swayest all Scepters here below Thou art the King of Kings and in whose band the Kings heart is as the rivers of waters turning it which way it pleaseth thee And thou hast of late mercifully turned his heart to grant to his Scottish People their ancient Christian liberty both by freeing them from Ceremonies and from the High Commissions thereby cutting shorter at least the Hornes of the Beast in the exercise of Prelaticall Tyranny Now ô Lord be pleased to perfect this thy worke both in Scotland and England and throughout all Christendome by causing the Kings of the Earth that formerly were as hornes to the Beast and had given their power unto him to hate the Whore and strippe her naked and that by throwing down the Hierarchy the maine Pillar of the Antichristian Throne which is advanced above and against the glorious Kingdome and Throne of our Lord Iesus Christ. And for this cause ô Lord open the Kings eyes clearely to see the notorious hypocrisie of his Prelate who under a Colour of Peace and Truth goes about to overthrow all true Peace and Truth in his Kingdome Let him see ô Lord how dangerous it is to maintaine or countenance an Antichristian Faction within his Kingdome Let him see how naked his Kingdome lyes at this time exposed to all the stormes of heaven through so many crying Sins and desperate iniquities which the whole Land groaneth under ready to sinke to the bottome of hell Let him see and be rowsed up to a more watchfull Care and diligent attention upon the grave and waighty affaires of a King and especially not to commit the Care of Religion to Romish Prelates which are no members of the true Church of Iesus Christ. And withall ô Lord quicken the Kings heart with a Coale from thine Altar even with the zeale of the Spirit of Iesus Christ to enter into a present strict examination of the State of Religion as it now stands in his Kingdome And because thou hast in mercy stirred up and strengthened a Servant of thine to discover to the King not onely the great dishonour his Name sustaineth but the great danger his Kingdome incurreth while such intollerable things are suffered as thy Servant hath in his Reply laid open Now ô Lord let it be thy pleasure to bring this worke to a full perfection by the publishing of it that so both the King and his People by taking knowledge thereof may come to see what a miserable condition they are brought into by one blinde guide and bold Prelate And let thy Spirit ô Lord awaken and quicken the minds of the Lords and Nobles of the King and State to consider what a base vassalage all those are brought under who suffer themselves to be made slaves to serve the lawlesse lusts of one domineering Primate and at length wisely to foresee the mischiefes which the Altering of Religion to the worse and reducing all back againe to Rome may and will certainly bring upon the Land and upon themselves too if not the more speedily prevented by a sound and serious thorow Reformation Make the great ones of the world ô Lord sensible that there is a judgement to come and that there is a terrible GOD above them that shall call them to a strict reckoning for all those ungodly practises wherein themselves have either been Agents or Instruments either Principalls or Accessories as in oppressing thy Word and Truth in persecuting thy faithfull Ministers and the like And Lord stirre up all thy people to fervent and continuall Prayer and strengthen them therein to persevere and watch untill an Answer come forth from thy Throne to all their Petitions and Supplications which from day to day they have and do and shall present unto thee Oh let not our God be angry with his people that pray unto him with unfained hearts and lips nor let their enemies Say Where is now their GOD But Lord stirre up thy strength and come and helpe us Put the wicked in feare O Lord that they may know themselves to be but men And shew some token upon thy servants for good that they which hate us may see it and be ashamed because thou Lord hast holpen us and comforted us And let the Atheisticall Scornfull world see that it is not in vain to serve God and to call upon him and to wait for him And now Lord avenge the Cause of Iesus Christ against Antichrist and break down Antichrists throne and exalt Christs Throne that himselfe alone may sit and rule and raigne over his People and the show◠of that King may
this Relator professeth and teacheth a blind Charity sutable to his Faith which he boldly affirmeth to be not a mistaken Charity in granting that a silly ignorant Papist so living and dying may be Saved by his Ignorance in that Religion conforming himselfe to his Religious life and on the contrary condemning such Protestants of stiffenesse and churlishnesse that are not of the same Charity with him though the Replyer proveth that there is no true Charity without true Faith and Verity And whereas the same Relator is shewed in this Reply to give much more liberty to your Majesties Protestant People to goâ— to the Romish Masse as being with him one and the same undiffering Religion with that of England then the Jesuite doth to his blind Romanist to come to the English Church And whereas the same Relator hath many passages wherein he makes a Generall Councell of Prelates Iudge in all Controversies of Faith ascribing unto them an Infallibility and in case they shall erre and that even in grosse things and points of Faith yet that all men are bound to yeeld obedience at least externall till another Generall Counsell equall to the former reverse those Errours whereupon by Consequence of this Prelaticall doctrine as the Replyer doth instance the Church of England it self is bound to observe the worship of Images and the forbearance of the Cup in the Sacrament c. decreed in Generall Councels and not yet reversed by other Generall Councels equall to those And whereas the Relator calls Transubstantiation Purgatory and the forbearance of the Cup but disputable and Improbable Questions the nature of which is to be taken indifferently Pro and Con And whereas he never once in all his Relation calls the Romish-worship of Images and of the Sacrament or any other Idolatry in all the Romish Church but onely by the name of Superstition abstaining altogether from the name of Idolatry as if with him the Roman Church were no Idolatresse And whereas he much lamenteth the Seperation and rent between the Protestants and Rome with the continuance of it although with the Iesuite he confesse that errour in Faith is just cause of separation And whereas he the same Relator doth cunningly yet palpably enough in sundry passages of his Booke as also he hath openly done viva voce at the High-Commission-Board exclude all the Reformed Protestant Churches beyond the Seaes as no Churches of Christ as not admitting the Hierarchy Finally also in his Book quipping Luther and in him all the Reformed Churches as having made a rent not onely from Rome with her corruptions but even from the Catholick Church it selfe which indeed in the Relators sense and difinition of the Catholicke Church is most true to wit from the universall Hierarchy And whereas he the Relator doth every where highly extoll his Ceremonies in Gods worship as without which he saith there is no light left to shine before men that they may see his Devotion and so glorify GOD therein most foulely and odiously perverting and abusing the holy Text of Scripture uttered by CHRIST to a cleane other purpose as the Replyer hath noted all which Ceremonies being a will-worship after the Tradition and Commandement of men the Apostle doth utterly condemn as wherby the very merits of Christs death are made of none effect who in his death destroyed All Ceremonies in Religion obliging the Conscience and not onely the Leviticâ—ll but all other whatsoever of humane Ordinance as the Replyer clearely proveth So as it is not left to any Power on Earth to impose the least Ceremony yea though it be of nature indifferent to bind the Conscience in the service of GOD seeing all such imposition is Antichristian Tyranny And whereas all Prelaticall Hereticall and Antichristian Faction erected by the Prince of darkenesse against Iesus Christ and his Kingdome as is apparent both by their profession and practice wherein they have nothing at all yea not any one thing to show wherein they resemble either Christ or any one of his Apostles except Iudas Christs Kingdome being altogether spirituall and not of this world but the Hierarchy a meere carnall and worldly Kingdome onely guilded over with the bare name of spirituall And whereas the Relator throughout his whole Booke bewrayeth his most palpable and profound ignorance and notorious blindnesse in the whole mystery of Faith and all true divinity in so much as when ever he Cites Scripture he still perverts it to a wrong sense and is not able to bring any proofe either from Scripture or Common Reason except from some of his Jesuiticall Authors for any of his Paradoxes and strange doctrines delivering all without Book tanquam è Cathedra as but of some Papall unerring Chaire upon the Authority of his bare word and upon meere trust And whereas the Relator saith That worth once misled is of all other the greatest misleader and who of greater worth in the Church of England and in the Esteem of Great ones too then the Great Primate himselfe whose very word with many is taken as a divine Oracle So as if the Church and State of England will but pin their soules upon this Leaders sleeve he will not fayle to lead them in that way the issue whereof seem it never so right in the eyes of credulity will certainly prove to be as Solomon saith the wayes of death And whereas by the Relator sundry occasions are ministred to the Replyer of instancing divers practises charged upon the Prelate as the principall Agent or Instrument of setting up sundry Innovations in Religion in the Church of England all which have been done under his Primacie as The republishing under your Majesties Name the Book for liberty of profane Sports on the Lords day with pressing Ministers to read the Sayd Book in their severall Congregations and upon refusall extreamely persecuting them and thrusting them from their Ministry and meanes with their poore wives and children The authorizing and licencing of some Doctors Books which cry down the Morality of the 4 th Commandement for the Sanctifying of the Lords Sabbath day The setting forth of a New Order to restraine Preachers from Preaching in the Afternoones on the Lords dayes much pressed by the Prelates and their Officers in all their visitations The setting forth of a Declaration in your Majesties Name prefixed to the Articles of Religion which the Prelates practises plainly interpret to be for the restraining and prohibiting altogether the Doctrines of Saving Grace to be preached and wherein the genuine sense of those Articles touching Grace which formerly were universally interpreted to have but one sence agreeable to the Scripture is confounded with the heterodox hereticall doctrines of the Pelagians and Arminians so as none can tell what to make of those Articles saving that by this meanes the Orthodox Ministers must not preach the truth and the Adverse party and Faction may find footing and countenance for their groundlesse and gracelesse heresies and all this to the manifest
in his innocent nakednesse then with his devised Fig-leaves how applyed to the Prelaticall Church 103 104. Prelates Service sensuall and heathenish as done to an unknown God fully displayed 104. Prelates pompous Ceremonies like the Cardinals Sumpter 105. No necessity of Prelates Ceremonies sith both Superstitious and Superfluous saving that they are all the Substance of their Religion 106 107. True Reformation ought to have no Ceremonies at all to bind the Conscience 107. Prelates Ceremonies strengthen Superstition and Idolatry and destroy true piety 108. What is that Substance of Religion which Prelates Ceremonies doe fence 106 107. And what strength they adde to his Religion how it is weaknesse not to see 108. Prelates Ceremonies are beggerly Rudiments yea Aegyptian bonds and Babilonish Chaines 108. How by the Prelates Ceremonies so eagrely urged the Jesuites win ground 108 109. Romes Reconciliation hastened by hossing up wodden Altars and hurling down golden Ministers 109. The Jesuites hale in Popery through the Prelates broad Gates he hath layd open ibid. 21. How the Prelate hath layd open the wider-gates of his Catholicke Church by pulling down the walls and bulwarks of Christs true Church 109. The Prelates wider-Gates whither they lead 110. The Prelate hath nothing to doe with the true Faith nor Communion with the true Saints ibid. He perverteth the Scripture Jude 3. falsely applying the Saints Faith to his boundlesse Catholicke Church 110. What Truth the Prelate professeth and with what singlenesse of heart 110 111. And his notorious hypocrisie in deluding the King 111. The Prelate puts all his Book upon the King as published in obedience to his Majesties command ibid. What we may expect from the Prelate who resolves to dye in that Faith wherein he hath lived ibid. And so what hope he can have of Gods favour 112. THE CONTENTS OF THE MAINE POINTS AND PASSAGES IN THIS insuing Reply to the Relation it selfe 2. WHat is that Church whose judgement the Prelate would have the people to depend upon 113. And not to be too busie with Seripture but moderately in things obvious 114. How the Prelate yeelds the Jesuite this that the Church of Rome is a true Church on whose judgement people must depend 115. The Prelate a Subtile underminer of the Truth 116. 4. The papall Church holds no one point of Saving Truth ibid. 23. How the Prelate vants himselfe for the great Champion of the Church of England 117. 29. How the Prelate overthrows Christ while he makes things not Fundamentall in the Faith necessary to some mens Salvation but tells us not who those be 117 118. 31. How the Prelate can bind all men to peace by his Churches Declaration yea though it be not the Churches 118. The dangerous Consequences hereof 119. 32. The Prelate selfe-condemned for adding things contrary and detracting things necessary 120. 35. How against the Prelate things considered in the manner of Beeing onely are fundamentall in the Faith Instanced in sundry particulars 120 121. The many absurd consequences of Popish Reall-presence ibid. 37. How the Prelate makes things which are fundamentall in the Faith not to be so to all men 122. See 117.118 If the Prelate doe at all discerne what the true Faith is what use he makes of it 122. 39. How the Prelate falsifies Lyrinencis and is loth to English some of his words 123. If the Church of Rome be Lupanar Errorum a Stews of Errours 't were good that all should know her in plain English to be so to avoyd her though the Prelate be loth English men should know it ibid. How the Prelate applauds the Iesuite Stapleton in a grosse point of Popery whom Dr. Whitakers in the Chaire at Chambridge confuted 124. How therein the Prelate prefers Stapleton before Bellarmine who comes nearer to the Truth ibid. 40. How the Prelate is justly as an Enemy to Assurance of Salvation and so of true Saving Faith 124. 43. How the Prelate makes it whether for a penny Beliefe of Scripture or the Creed hath the Precedencie of a Prime Principle of Faith 125. 44. The Prelate allows some Traditions for Apostolick though not fundamentall in the Faith ibid. 45. The Prelates Faith of Christs Descent into hell which Article is by the Replyer discussed 126 to 129. 47.48 For default of examining the Articles of the Creed by Scripture the Prelate overthrows two Articles The Catholicke Church and the Communion of Saints 129. 51. Notwithstanding the Prelate we ought boldly and publickly to affirme The Truth against errour 132. 53. The Prelate submits the Faith of the Church of England to the judgement of the Fathers whether her Articles be according to Scripture How by those Fathers he is condemned 132 133. With what limitation the Church within the first 400 or 500. yeares may be sayd to have been at the best 133 134. How the Replyer declines the occasion of entring into a comparison between the truly Reformed Protestant Churches and that within the first 500. years after the Apostles 134. Conformity to Popish Rites a Pretence to bring Papists to Church as the Christians anciently intertained Heathen manners to draw them to be Christians 134. Augustine complained of Ceremonies then when if the Prelate say true the Church was at the best ibid. 62. The Prelates false professed Faith concerning the Catholicke Church in the Creed which he defines to be the Society of all Christians 135. 66. How the Prelate jumpes with Bellarmine for a word of God as well unwritten as written 135 136 137. Baptisme of Infants a Doctrine of Scripture not an unwritten Tradition We ought to repaire to Scripture in all doubts of Faith 137. 72 73. How the Prelates words not well examined may make us beleeve he is no Arminian but Orthodox in the Doctrine of Grace while he abuses the Scripture most palpably and grosly 138 139. 75 76. What the place and office of naturall Reason is in judgeing of Scripture against the Prelate magnifying naturall Reason to the vilifying of Scripture the blindnesse and vanity thereof in judging of Divine things and matters of Faith 140 141 142 143. Vnsanctified Reason how it judges the Scripture to be false 143. How the Prelate is put to his naturall Reasons pregnancy in matters of Faith 1â—2 77. The Prelates extreme blindnesse or malice in saying The Scripture is strengthened with probable Arguments from the light of Nature and humane Testimony to convince men without which it is not so demonstratively evident of it selfe 144. At large confuted 14â— to 149. A secret power in Scripture convincing a naturall man in the reading or hearing of it preached that it is the very word of God 148 149 150. See also A motion of the Replyer to the Prelate how he shall make tryall of the Scriptures powerfull sufficiencie to convince him that it is the word of God 149. A comparison of the Scripture with the Sun 151. Gods word preached and not Church-Tradition the ordinary prime motive and instrument of Faith Illustrated
Pope not to be Antichrist and no necessity of frequent Preaching and none to preach but Bishops and Deanes and that onely and especially at the three Solemn times in the yeare Also another Book intituled the Femall Glory as full fraught thoughout with the most grosse blasphemous Idolatrous Popish Stuffe as it can hold and this in plain English allowed by one of your Chapleins or of London house and for ought I heare not yet suppressed or call'd in Besides many other of the same branne some whereof are printed but kept up under deck not daring yet to peep forth till the Storm as in Starre Chamber you call'd it raysed by BURTON and others be over and least they should be made Popish Martyrs in Smithfield as Salis his Devotions were which for feare were burned as afore Under your Primacy hath there not been a mighty stirring and stickling for the seting up of Altars c. yea of Images too and Crucifixes and that in Collegiate Churches or Chappels both in Oxford you being Chauncellour and in Cambridge where you want not a Vice-Chauncellour and which you indeavour in all the Churches of England Under your Primacie have not your pregnantest wits and profoundest Divines been set aworke to write Books to unmorallize the 4th Commandement for the perpetuall keeping of the Lords Sabbath day and so unbind Christians from the sanctification of the Lords day and their Books allowed by your Authority and Dedicated to great ones and much applauded by your Faction Under your Primacie have not your Doctors also written stoutly for your Altars and that even unto blasphemy Saying that the use of the Altar is to sanctifie the Sacrifice and without an Altar the Sacrifice is not Sanctified or dedicated by the Bishop Under your Primacie began not Ministers to be Suspended Silenced Excommunicated put out of their Benefices and Cures of Soules for refusing to read the Book of Liberty for Sports on the Lords day and to set up Altars in their Churches at their Ordinaries Command These these my Lord being thus doe you complaine of unsettlednesse Who hath troubled the Fountain The Wolfe above at the Spring head or the Lamb below To recollect then and recapitulate these things When Profanation of the Lords day is by publick Edict allowed when the Articles of Religion are made as the Delphick Oracles to be taken two contrary wayes when the Doctrines of Gods Grace are universally restrained and forbid to be preached when Popish Books publickly allowed in Print and Orthodox Books against Popery restrained when Altars set up in all Churches where there was none before when Books published by Authority to disanull Gods Morall Law when Books allowed publickly to maintain the seting up of Altars in Churchs when Godly Ministers by multitudes put down for not yeelding to those things which are contrary to the Laws of God and man and all this in the State of England where from the first Reformation such as it was have been universally and constantly maintained both by writing and preaching the morality of the 4th Commandement for the sanctification of the Lords Day the Articles of Religion concerning Grace to have but one Orthodox sense the free and unrestrained preaching of Gods word and confuting of all opposite Errours that the Pope is that Antichrist that the Lords Supper was to be celebrated onely at the Lords Table that Ministers Conformity was extended no further then was limited by the Law all these things considered in the tumult of so many bold Innovations Innovation I cry you mercy Renovations I should say of old Popish ragges and outcast reliques for you disclaim Innovation against Gods law and Mans law what settlement what peace what tranquility can be expected and then again al these new Attempts for Uniformity and Conformity coming in under and with your Primacie can they vindicate your Reputation from a generall opinion of your being the most perillous and pernicious Instrument of unsettling and troubling the State oâ— the Land and of Religion and you may if you will take Scotland in to boot with generall discontents and heart burnings to see the State of Religion thus turned topsie turvie And doe you complain notwithstanding that you cannot attain to an Orderly Settlement Stay my Lord be not so eagre See Scotland first settled before you proceed further in the settlement of England least you unsettle all Be not deceived in the confidence of your own active brain and borrowed power And see also how your Booke will take For Certainly therein you have run your selfe upon the Pikes get off as you can Your Reputation if you meane it for the Repute to be a good Protestant unlesse you meane it that you would be accounted what you are a member of one and the Same Church with Rome is now bound to the Stake ready to be Sacrificed for a whole-burnt Offering For what your Ordinary practises proclaimed to the world of you now in your Book you stick not openly to professe that you desire for the Church and State of England to be reconciled to the Sea of Rome So as your Book besides the turbulent matter in it like the Trojan horse full of armed enemies could not possibly have been borne into the world in a more unhappy time then now when you see two Kingdomes all in a combustion which the Sprinkling of your Romes Holy water wil be so farre from quenching or allaying that it will prove rather as Oyle to increase and feed the flame But GOD give the King the Spirit of Wisedome and Iudgement to see into these things betimes both for the preventing of further mischiefes and for the reuniting of the great rent between his two Kingdomes But as Iehu said to Iehoram when he asked Is it peace Iehu What peace said he so long as the Whoredomes of thy Mother Iezabel and her Witchcrafts are so many So what peace can be expected in the Land where such an Uniformity and Settlement is required as is so repugnant to the Laws of Christs Kingdome and conformable to Antichrists Tyranny and conducible to a reconciliation with that old Iezabel of Rome Certainly the case being so as Deborah said in her Song They chose new gods then was warre in the gates So when a Nation falls to advance higher and higher a new and false Religion where it had been formerly in some good measure cast out to set up Idolatrous and Romish Altars whereby Christ the true and onely Altar of true Christians as hath been shewed is denyed and renounced and to cry down Gods holy Commandements and to oppresse Gods holy Word in the Ministry of it and to persecute Gods faithfull Ministers and People and like the Aegyptians to oppresse Gods People more and more with intolerable burthens of humane inventions to the great reproach of Christ and the throwing down of his incommunicable Royall Soveraignty over his Church and People in matters of Faith and the worship of God Can peace or settlement
have stopped all the Ministers mouthes binding them to peace and externall obedience Although I cannot yet conceive how that Declaration should be the Church of Englands though published in the Kings Name and perhaps compiled in the Conclave of Canterbury And thus also that Order for the Altar of S. GREGORIES which yet is but Dormant in Cryptis not published in Print in which respect it cannot be called the Declartion of the Church yet must be of force to bind all Ministers to Peace and Obedience first to Peace not to speake a word against Altars for his Eares and next to Obedience that if he refuse to have an Altar set up in his Church himselfe shal be made a Sacrifice But why should such an Order thus bind I must crave pardon for making Question And the rather because your Lordship here gives us a Rule or Canon saying The Churches Declaration can bind us to Peace and externall Obedience where there is no expresse Letter of Scripture and Sense agreed on Now though we have expresse Letter of Scripture proving Christ to be the onely Altar of Christians as before is shewed yet because this sense is not agreed on by your Lordship and so by your present Church of England therefore men must be peaceable and obedient in that point and quietly submit to Authority in the admitting and the Adoring too if you will of Altars in every Church And so in all other your superstitious Ceremonies of what force is the expresse Letter of the Scripture where the Sense of it is not by you and your Church agreed upon To give an Instance or two more This is my Body the Sense of these words is not agreed on between your Church of England and that of Rome though you are in Substance both one Church what then Ergo Ministers are bound to Peace and Obedience in not medling to or fro with the manner How Christ is present in the Sacrament though your Article of the Lords Supper doth declare it both affirmatively and negatively how it is and is not but to content themselves with Really which is a very peaceable word about which Rome and you have no great reason to fall at oddes Againe for bowing at the nameing of the Name Iesus although you have no expresse Letter of Scripture for it no not Phil. 2.10 where it is Said En to onómati In or as your Translation hath it at the name of Iesus every knee should bow but it is not Said En to onomazethai tò onoma Iesoun or Iesous In the naming of the name Iesus every knee should bow So as that place is plainly expounded and agreed on by other places of Scripture as Isa. 45.23 and Rom. 14.10 as some of your old English Bibles note those places in the Margent over against the place as in that of Isaiah there is set in in the Margent Rom. 14.10 and Phil. 2.10 all which three places unanimously shew the universall Subjection of all Creatures in heaven and earth and under the earth to Christ in the day of Iudgement yet because this Sense is not agreed on by the present Church of England therefore her Declaration in her Canon binds all to Peace and Obedience to Peace in not speaking or writing against bowing at the nameing of the name Iesus nor in preaching to expound the Letter of Scripture Phil. 2.10 by the plain sense of other Scriptures as afore cited and to Obedience by bowing themselves when they heare that Name to be named So as your Lordships Rule here is very usefull for many things although you have neither Letter nor Sense of Scripture for them L. p. 32. The power of adding any thing contrary and detracting any thing necessary are alike forbidden No power of the Church can doe this P. This Sentence you alledge out of Vincentius and allow it So as it is to be accounted your owne Confession which I suppose you will not deny Whereupon you with your Church fall under just condemnation both for adding things contrary and detracting things necessary For you adde to the service of God as you call it your Altars and sundry other superstitionâ— which the Scripture excludes and condemnes and so are contrary and you detract things necessary as Preaching of the saving Doctrines of Grace Preaching on the Lords dayes in the after noon Preaching Week-day Lectures and Cathechising by expounding the Grounds of Religion Which things are necessary profitable and usefull to the people of God and which God commaundeth as 2 Tim. 3.15.16 and 4.1.2 Gal. 6.6 Let him that is Katekoúmenos Cathechised in the word communicate To katekounti to him that Catechiseth or instructeth him in all good things Thus you and your Church take upon you to do those things which are alike forbidden and which no power of the Church can doe though you can L. p. 35. Wrangle while you will you shall never be able to prove that any thing which is but de modo a consideration of the manner of being onely can possibly be fundamentall in the Faith P. Wrangle I will not but prove that some things which are de modo considered in the manner of being onely not onely may possibly but are really in that very respect fundamentall in the Faith So as to deny them or not to beleeve them is in it selfe damnable And hereof I shall give some Instances 1. Christs body in receiving of the Sacrament is to be considered in the mâ—nnâ—r of its being present to the beleeving Communicant In so much as to exclude such manners of being present as doe destroy either the Article of his perpetuall Residence in heaven till his câ—ming againe or the truth of his Naturall Body doth deny and destroy two Articles of the Faith 1. touching Christs sitting 〈◊〉 tâ—e rigâ—â— hand of God from whence he shall come to Judgemâ—â—â— and 2 ly that he was borne of the Virgin Mary with a true humane body As the Papists apprehending and beleeving Christs naturall body to be locally present in the Eucharist doe thereby overthrow his perpetuall residence in heaven till his coming againe and withall the truth of his naturall body which being a true naturall body with all its naturall properties cannot be locally or corporally in many places at one and the same time which yet the corporall presence in the Eucharist doth necessarily import And if the truth of Christs naturall body be destroyed as by the Manichees and other Hereticks Christ is wholly evacuated and shall profit nothing Besides this Popish beliefe of Christs corporall Presence in their Eucharist makes Christs natural body which hath its dimensions of length breadth thicknesse to be a meere fantasticall and imaginaâ—y body as being contained within the narrow circle and compasse of a thinne Wafer-cake and so they destroy Christs body And so also in that they beleeve they eat this body of Christ which is to destroy it as 1 Cor. 6.13 And this beliefe of Christs corporall presence as aforesaid
your Authority and Commendation should be brought to read the Scriptures and therein should find many Prophecies and among the rest how there should come False Prophâ—ts being Wolves in Sheeps Clothing pretending holinesse but Persecuting Gods Saints pretending Religion but oppessing Gods word pretending to be Christ vicâ—royes but tyrannizing over his people and such as should Apostatise from the Faith and set up Doctrines of Devils as in abstinence from certaine Meates and Marriage at certaine times and how Christ and his Apostles were humble and despised the world being crucified unto it and how they which were proud pompous Lords claiming to be their Successors follow none of their steps neither in diligent preaching nor practise of a holy life are such Antichrists as the Scripture hath foretold and how in the last dayes perillous times should come when men should be Selfe-lovers covetous boastors proud blasphemers unholy without naturall affection implacable covenant-breakers false accusers incontinent fierce despisers of them that are good Traitors heady high-minded lovers of pleasures more then lovers of God Having a forme of Godlinesse but denying the power thereof with many other like things which when they come to compare with the State of the present times and especially of the present Church and chiefly of the Prelates themselves and shall find most of these Prophecies fulfilled in these present times they will certainly hereupon conclude that these be those last dayes and perillous times wherin these things so long agoe foretold doe clearely shew that certainly the Scriptures are the word of God The next thing I note here is that you Say a man so probably led must compare the Scripture with it selfe and other writings What other writings I pray you shall he compare the Scriptures with Shall humane writings light him a Candle to shew him the Sun shining at noon day But thus humane testimony comes in for a Second Inducer And for all your previous inducement you must still at last joyne some thing of man with Scripture Well what 's the third Ordinary Grace And this with the Authority of the present Church may beget in a man an ordinary beliefe that Scripture is the word of God As it seemes such ordinary Grace brought King Agrippa to beleeve the Prophets to be the word of God yet for all that he was but almost perswaded to become a Christian. And this Ordinary Grace is it seems that Holy Ghost which you told us of before The Fourth is morall inducement Well admit this bring him to a morall beliefe or opinion The Fifth is a reasonable perswasion by the voyce of the Church Well what theâ— After all this the Scripture gives greater and higher reasons of Credibility to it selfe then Tradition alone could give Here 's then the upshot of all as we noted before you by these steps advance the Scripture to a Credibility So as all this while you have walkt the round and gone in a Circle and end just where you began for you began at Probability and end in Credibility whereas the Scriptures were credible at least that is such as might be beleeved before you taught this new way to come to the beliefe of them So as this your Conclusion comes to just nothing Only you seem to attribute some thing to the Scripture being assisted with those other inducements wherein it surpasseth your Tradition alone Which is such a comparison and commendation as you could not devise the like to abase the Credit of the Scripture But to conclude What a Tedious Dispute you make here with the Jesuite about that which when you have done all you can will never bring a man upon any sure grounds so much as to beleeve that the Scripture is the word of God much lesse to bring him to Saving faith in Christ. But what doe I speake of Saving faith Alas that 's no worke for your pen. You are for a Scholasticall Dispute here which is so jejune and barren that many Scholasticks would hisse it out of their Schooles much more Divines out of the Divinity Schooles as indeed nothing pertaining to true Divinity but to a Spoyling through Philosophy and vaine deceit as the Apostle Speakes But the summe of all your inducements the Prime whereof must necessarily be your present Churches Authority amounts to this That men being by a bond of necessity tyed to this your Church as without which he cannot come to beleeve Scripture to be Gods word and without this beliefe no faith of Salvation and your Tradition with all other helps cannot bring a man to that beliefe when all is done the Conclusion is that according to your Tradition no man can come to be Saved So as thus by this your new Doctrines you overturne the Foundation of Faith by the very roots leaving no footing for faith to stand upon whereby a man may have any hope of Salvation But I shew'd you before a short and sure way for a man to come to this beliefe and not onely so farre as to beleeve the Scripture to be the word of God but to beleeve that he hath his part of Salvation in that word And this way is by hearing the word of God preached For Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God And this faith being the Saving faith in Christ as it apprehends all the Promises of God in the Scripture to be true and to belong to him so it comprehends the beliefe of Scripture to be the word of God And this this word of God preached and heard is that voyce of the Church of Christ or rather Christs owne voyce in the Church calling men yea and instrumentally causing Gods Spirit effectually working in and by the word to beleeve unto righteousnesse and to confesse to Salvation whatsoever is written in the Scripture to be most true as being the word of God himselfe And besides this true Christians in all ages never beleeved and Authority Tradition voyce of men simply to be any necessary prime inducement to beleeve so much as the Scriptures to be the word of God L. p. 84. That divine light which the Scripture no question hath in it self is not kindled till these helps come Thy word is a Light So David A Light Therefore it is as much a manifestation to it selfe as to other things which it shewes but still not till the Candle be lighted not till there hath been a preparing instruction what light it is till Tradition of the Church and Gods grace put to it have cleared his understanding So Tradition of the present Church is the first morall motive to beleeve P. These words confirme your former with a little illustration A divine Light here you confesse to be in the Scripture But you meane some dimme Light At the best not bright enough not sufficient to shew it selfe to be the word of God And here That Light whatever it is is not kindled till these helps come 'T is but a
that seeth the Son and beleeveth in him should have eternall life and I will raise him up at the last day Marke here This is the Fathers will his resolution his revealed councell and purpose What That every one that seeth Christ not with bodily eyes here but with the eyes of his soule being illuminated by holy knowledge and so beleeveth in him should have eternall life and Christ will raise him up in the last day Here is Mans last happinesse to which God hath revealed tâ— us in his word that he hath resolved in his councel to bring Mankind by Faith and Knowledge together and without seperation as both seeing and beleeving And this doth the Scripture every where shew unto us Wherfore did God give some Apostles and some Prophets and some Euangelists and some Pastors and Teachers but for the perfecting of the Saints for the worke of the Ministry for the edefication of the body of Christ And Col. 2.2 That their hearts might be comforted being knit together in love and unto all riches of the full assurance of understanding to the acknowledgement of the Mystery of God What a high and admirable expression is here And 6.7 this is to be rooted and built up in Christ. Againe on the other side what 's the Cause and sourse of all wickednesse and infidelity superstition and Idolatry but ignorance of God and of his word As Ephes. 4.17 This I say therfore and testifie in the Lord that ye henceforth walke not as other Gentiles walkâ— in the vaâ—ity of their minds having the understanding darkened being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them because of the blindnesse of their heart c. So 1 Pet. 4.3 and Hos. 4.1 The Lord hath a controversie with the Inhabittnts of the Land because there is no truth nor mercy nor knowledge of God in the Land And vers 7. My people are destroyed for lacke of knowledge Because thou hast rejected knowledge mark it well my Lord I will also reject thee THAT THOU SHALT BE NO PRIEST TO ME. And on the other side againe The Lord saith I will give you Pastors according to mine heart which shall feed you with knowledge and understanding namely the people whom the Lord is in Covenant with But it seemeth your Priesthood standeth not with the nature and office of those Prophets which feed the people of God with knowledge and understanding You can teach the people a shorter cut to heaven and more easie for the Priest for you tell us God hath resolved to bring Mankind to blessednesse another way then by knowledge Wherin how farre you not onely dishonour but blaspheme the truth of God in Fathering such a foule and abominable lye upon him for this I leave you to that judgement which he hath revealed in his Word But you seem to doe all this in charity That the weakest among men may have their way to blessednes open A way open You meane surely the broad way and you know whither that leads and how the many such weake ones as you speake of goe in that way And broad and open your way had need to be both for the multitude of the travailers therein and for their blindnesse and for the darknesse of the way that so though both they and their guides be blind yet the way is so broad as they cannot possibly goe out of it so long as they do but follow their Nose which must be their guide for want of eyes But it may be you will alledge that saying of Augustine Indocti rapiunt regnum Caeloâ—um c. The unlearned and ignorant take by violence the Kingdome of heaven where we that be great learned Clerks are shut out Ergo the way is open for the weakest and shut against those that abuse their Learning to Gods dishonour and soules destruction But whom doth Augustine there meane by unlearned Ignorants that had no Faith nor true Religion in them Certainly ther 's no heaven for such The blind and lame come not within the fort of Sion But a true beleever may be unlettered or as they say not book learned yet not without knowledge For if he hath faith he hath a knowledge of God in Christ. And being Christs he hath the Spirit of Christ and this quickens him up â—o diligence in the use of all good meanes of saving knowledge as to heare Gods word faithfully preached for he knows Christs voyce and frequently read and conferred upon and he meditates on it his mind is much upon it as yours is of your honours and favour in Court how to keep them and he is still praying for increase of grace and faith and knowledge And my Lord many a such man I could bring that cannot a letter on the Booke that for all your seeming Learning would put you to your Trumps if your greatnesse would but descend so farre as to reason with him of the Scriptures and of Christ and so of faith and the like For there 's all his Learning And such unlearned ones they be who goe to heaven yea take it by violence as Christ saith when great Lord Prelates are shut out As Christ saith to the Pharisees The Publicans and â—arlots goe into the Kingdome of God before you for they beleeved Iohns preaching but ye when ye had seen it repented not afterwards that ye might beleeve him But you goe on in your blind way and say pag. 109. The way of knowledge was not that which God thought fittest for mans Salvation 'T is true not such a speculative knowledge as you speak of but God thought it fittest to bring men to salvation by a knowing Faith as before is shewed I will conclude this with the Apostles thunder As we said before so say I now againe if any man preach otherwise then that is delivered in Gods word let him be accursed And if the Scripture accurse him that leads the blind out of his way to which curse all the people say Amen then what curse is due to him that teacheth the blind such a way as leads to certain destruction of Soule and Body Shall not all the people say Amen to this curse L. p. 106. The Credit of the Scripture depends not upon the subservient inducing Cause that leads us to the first knowledge of the Author which leader here is the Church but upon the Author himselfe and the opinion we have of his Sufficiencie P. Doe you not make the credit of the Scripture to depend upon the Authority of the present Church when without this subservient inducing Cause you deny the possibility of beliefe that the Scripture is the word of God For you say expresly pag. 120. When I said Scriptures were Principles to be supposed I did not I could not intend they were prius cognitae known before Tradition Since I confesse every where that Tradition introduces the knowledge of them But if the credit of
Foundation being already layd For you say It is to build up the Truth for the benefit of the Church We have discovered before what the truth is you speak of through your Book which is as much to say as all that wherein you agree with the Church of Rome as one and the same Church for the benifit where of you have writ this Discourse to discredit the word of Truth So as by your building up of Truth is meant your pulling of it down with that hand that wrote this Book And for satisfaction of all men Christianly disposed that is of a peaceable Disposition and not perverse peevish and refractory but willing to meet Rome at least in the halfe way And in a word All your Labour is for Edification not for Destruction For Edification Wherin By rasing the Foundation of Faith the Scripture to build up the Tower of Babel againe in England And not for Destruction but onely of the Puritan Profession and Religion and the power of Godlinesse and the Purity of Gods worship and the sincere Preaching and Preachers of the word of God and in a word in rooting out the precise party where ever your Arme of flesh can reach them This being your practise too well known this must needs be your meaning and sense of these words of the Apostle For Edification and not for Destruction Which as you most wickedly pervert and abuse as you doe all other Scriptures to your false purposes so in this respect it is a Conclusion not unsutable to your whole Section while thus you make the word of God of no Authority by your Traditions And so here an end of this Section But not an end of the prosecution of the same subject still For it follows L. p. 118. You see neither Hooker nor I nor the Church of England for ought I know leave the Scripture alone to manifest it selfe by the light which it hath in it selfe No but when the present Church hath prepared and led the way like a preparing morning light to Sun-shine then indeed we settle for our Direction but not upon the first opening of the morning light but upon the Sun it selfe P. In the former Section 17. consisting of one page the Jesuite objecting your words The Bishop said That the Books of Scripture are Principles to be supposed and needed not to be proved your Answere is Did I say it needed no proofe at all to a naturall man or to a man newly entring upon the Faith yea or perhaps to a doubter or weakling in the Faith Can you think me so weake I doe but mention this by the way as taking notice with what a pretty slight you put off your recantation of that speech But the next passage will cleare this more fully Now this your Comparison of the morning light let us clearely see how weake and improper it is for your purpose For what is the morning light but a beame or beames of that Sun which as children of the Bridegroom doe usher him out of his Chamber signifying his neare approach These beames I say are of the very same nature of that light which is in the body of the Sun and do immediately issue and spring from it inlightning the Sky or that part of heaven above the Horizon which beames or morning light as the Sunne advanceth nearer to his Rising waxeth clearer and clearer unto the perfect day But now the Authority of the present Church which you compare to the morning light is no such beame of the Sun of Righteousnesse shining in the Scripture as in his Sphere as that it is of the same nature of the light of the Scripture For the Scripture light is Divine and Infallible but of Tradition you say I cannot find that the Tradition of the present Church is of Divine and Infallible Authority Which if you could by all the light in the Sky at noon day find you would be no Churle in hiding it from the world or puting it under a bushell But to hold you to the propriety of your Comparison which at first blush showes as faire as the first morning light you may know That the Sunne makes the beames to shine and not the beames the Sunne whereas you say The Authority of the present Church lights the Candle of Scriptures which otherwise gives no light and so makes it to shine Againe 2 dly The morning light is an Infallible Index or immediate foregoing token of the approach of the Sunne riâ—â—ng which it ushereth in but you dare not say yea you deny that the present Churches Testimony or Authority is infallible for the inducing of beliefe that Scripture is the word of God Thirdly the morning light so soon as ever it first peepeth or dawneth we say and that truly It is day but an Infiel or doubting or weake Christian upon the first hearing of the testimony of the present Church That the Scriptures are the word of God is not so infallibly Convinced and perswaded as therfore to beleeve it to be true Fourthly The morning light is alone a sufficient and infallible signe as being an immediate effect an essentiall quality issuing from the Sun of its neare rising but you confesse that though your present Church Authority be the Prime yet it is not the Sole Index or finger to point us out the Scripture to be the word of God but you joyne with it sundry other helps as before you tell us Thus no way can we find your Comparison proper or pertinent to your purpose being as a blind Horse that halts downright of aâ—l foure But this by way of application to the right purpose I conclude out of it That as the morning light which certainly and infallibly tells us of the approching of the Sun rising and which perswades every man whose eyes are awake of the truth therof is an immediate beame of that Sun and of the same nature and quality of its native and essentiall light So that which is both Prime and Sole in leading us Certainly and Infallibly to beleeve that the Scripture is the word yea and working also and begetting this Faith in us is the light or beame of the Scripture it selfe displayed by the Ministry or Preaching of the Word which is as the dawning of the day or the Day Stars first arising in our hearts as Peter speakes by meanes whereof we come actually not onely to beleeve without any other externall Cause that Scripture is the word of God but also to know and feele that the Sun of Righteousnesse hath now begun to shine in our hearts by the beame of his Spirit the immediate forerunner of his rising unto the perfect Day L. p. 120. A C. Cannot but perceive by that which I have clearly layd down before that when I said Scriptures were Principles to be supposed I did not I could not intend they were prius cognita known before Tradition since I confesse every where that
poore Sheepe and Lambs of Gods fold there you feare not most stoutly to make wide wounds and make no bâ—nâ—s of it Put true Protestants doe hold that the wider the rent is made between them and Rome the better it is I know this is to you as the widening of a ghastly wound But it is the truth Yet you put us in some hope to heare what you will say when you are forced to it As Cowards will fight most terribly when they are forced to it Though I hope you will not indanger Rome more then her errors indanger her own salvation L. p. 149. Nor can you say that Israel from the time of the separation was not a Church for there were true Prophets in it Elias Elizeus and others and thousands that had not bowed knees to Baal P. But I can say and that upon good evidence that Israel the ten Tribes from the time of their setting up and following the Calves were no true visible Church of God For they had no visible signes or markes of a visible Church Their whole Religion consisted in the worship of the two Calves neither had they any Leviticall Priesthood or Priests of Aarons order nor went they up three times in the yeare to worship at Ierusalem according the Law 1 King 12.28 29 30 31 32 â—3 Here was not one footstep of a visible true Church of God but of the Devil indeed whom they worshiped in the Calves But say you there were true Prophets in it True But that was upon some extraordinary occasion when they were sent and prophecied But for all their Prophecyings did the King and People abandon their Calves Yea when Elias had caused Baals Prophets to be slain or when Iehu slew all the remainder of them and their worshipers both he and the People followed the Calves still And besides they had not true Priests but those of Ieroboams Order And if they had no true Priests will you allow them for all their Prophets to be a true Church of God Doe you not exclude all the Reformed Churches beyond the Seas from being true Churches of God because notwithstanding all their Prophets to wit Preachers and Ministers of God they have no Priests no Prelates no Priesthood Would you account or call Rome a true Church if she had not her Priesthood Although her Priesthood is of no other Order then that of Ieroboam of humane Ordinance not of Divine Institution sacrificing Priests as those were Now as Ierome saith as you cite at after Vbi non est Sacerdâ—s non est Ecclesia Where there is no Priest there is no Church Israel had no true Priest and so no true worship of God Nor doth Ierome and so the antient Fathers when they used the word Sacerdos thereby meane any such sacrificing Priests as are at this day in the Church of Rome For the Fathers held no Transubstantiation ergo no sacrificing Priests Whereas your Romish Priests have no other Order but of sacrificing Priests expresly in their Ordination in these words Take thou a power to sacrifice the body of Iesus Christ upon the Altar or to the like effect And this by the way proveth Rome to be no better a Church of God then that of the ten Tribes was when they had their Calves and Priests sutable And as for those Prophets you speake of Elias and Elizeus were their Prophecies regarded Nay were they not persecuted by Ahab and Iezâ—bel and their Son Iehoram Yea and 100 Prophets of the Lord more whom good Obadiah hid in a Cave and fed with bread and water and so preserved them from Iezebels fury Yea and all the Prophets whom the Lord sent were they not persecuted by the State and Court of Israel Was not Amos forbid by Amasiah King Ieroboams Court-Priest to preach at Bethel saying Prophecy no more at Bethel for it is the Kings Chappell and it is the Kings Court And did not this Court-Priest complaine of the Prophet to King Ieroboam saying Amos hath conspired against thee in the midst of the house of Israel the Land is not able to beare all his words And it were well if there were no such Priests in Christian Kings Courts that doe such offices against the Lords Prophets and Preachers complaining of them to the King that they are a sort of factious Conspirators against him such as those whom you have called shallower waters as before and the Land cannot beare all their words although they speake nothing but truth which Gods word teacheth and gives them good warrant for But this by the way To return to Israel Is a people presently a Church upon the coming of a Prophet or Minister of God to preach unto them untill they doe imbrace Gods word and set up his pure worship amongst them But those ten Tribes still minced and contemned Gods word and persecuted Gods Prophets that were sent unto them and with a high hand maintained their Calfe-worship the Devils service though they pretend it was Gods service as Exod. 32. These are thy Gods ô Israel that brought thee out of Aegypt untill there was no remedy that the Lord gave them up to perpetuall Captivity Againe I cannot but a little wonder that your Lordship should so grosly forget your selfe as because of a Prophet or two to give such a state the stile of a true Church of God For do you any where allow a true Church which hath no Priests And it is cleare that Israel then had no true Priests but counterfeit such as Rome now hath So in this respect rather I suppose you mean that was then a true Church because of their Priests such as they were Baalish such as your Babylonish Priests as good an Argument to prove Rome a true Church But you alledge there were thousands among them that had not bowed knees to Baal 'T is true God told Elias when he complained he was left alone that he had reserved to himselfe 7000. that had not bowed the knee to Baal nor kissed his mouth But they were all so hid that you see the Prophet himselfe knew no such thing till the Lord told him They made no open profession of the true Religion And if they had any private meetings to pray together and to read and expound the Law will your Lordship call that a Church Though those Assemblies were indeed the true Churches of God But would not you if you had been in Amaziah the Priests stead have called those private meetings Conventicles and would have hunted them out with your Pursuivants And therefore those seven thousand not being of the Kings Religion nor Communion Ecclesiasticall with the other many thousands of Israel and lying hid in Corners here and there they would not denominate the whole state of the ten Tribes a true visible Church of God themselves living as it were invisible at least so invisible as though others took notice of their Persons where they conversed yet they saw not their Religion for
in matters of faith as the Shrine of your Predecessor S. Thomas of Canterbury with the keyes of his blind votaries And so much the more in these dayes as wherein you have put all England to a stand and stagger what to beleeve in point of Faith considering that the Articles of Religion like Meteors hang in suspense in the ayre no man knowing what to make of them whether they be white or blacke or what such Comets portend untill to that Edict of the Court that binds up the sense of the Articles fast asleep or in a slumber between Hawke and Buzzard or as a speaking in a dreame you shall superadde the Definitive Decree of the Chaire of Canterbury to interpret unto us what they have dreamed all this while But I suppose the Board calling you so much away from your Chaire you are the more willing and that in such a case of necessity to send all the faithfull to your Ordine primus at Rome and to Peters Chaire there if any such thing be there which may like Iunoes three footed stoole resolve all their doubts And so as you say to A C. Rome may thanke you for it But alwayes provided tha◠Rome first reduce her selfe as you say to the Observation of Tradition Apostolicke and then you will say Latinè plainly That it wil be then necessary for every Church and for the faithfull every where to agree with it to have recourse to Rome and to rest their Faith there where is the most Powerfull Principality And thus as well as I could I have pickt up your meaning wherein if I have come short you must pardon me and blame your selfe for your being no more perspicuous in matters of such moment as about consulting of Oracles considering that that of Apollo and Delphos was long agoe put to silence But to proceed L. p. 199. The Bishop of Rome hath no power from Christ over the whole Church to be Iudge in Controversies nay out of all doubt 't is not the least reason why de facto he hath so little successe because de Jure he hath no power given P. Not over the whole Church This seems to imply that the Bishop of Rome hath a power from Christ to be Iudge in Controversies over all the Churches at least within his own more powerfull Principality And consequently that the Primate of Canterbury hath the like power from Christ to be Judge in Controversies over the whole Church of England If you have yet it wil be some ease to the English that they have an Oracle so neare home to resolve them in all doubts so as they need not as formerly go trudge to Rome for the matter But neither to the Pope in his Powerfull Principality nor to you in your Primacy hath Christ given any power at all to be Judge in Controversies of Faith And because you have no Calling nor Commission from Christ therfore 't is true you say in this that the Pope hath no better successe And I pray you what successe have you had since you took upon you to sway the Crosier staffe of Canterbury and to be Judge in Controversies of Faith making and raysing controversies there where there was none before as namely in the Articles of Religion 'T is true you have put many a good Minister to Silence thrust many a one out of his Cure and Countrey levied your way for an universall Conformity to Rome prevailed much in your Designes that way but yet have you any great cause to boast of your successe all things Considered I say no more Verbum sapienti you understand me well enough And certainly when you cast up your reckoning you will find your selfe to be as much behind hand for successe as you do the Pope And your Reason is true because you have no power no Authority no Calling no Commission from Christ either to possesse such a place or to execute such an Office For as the Lord saith in Ieremie speaking of false Prophets I sent them not neither commanded them therfore they shall not profit this people at all saith the Lord. So neither have you reason to thinke that because you may do what you list in turning things upside down in seting up your Altars in suppressing Gods word in oppressing Gods Ministers in advancing your Arminian and Popish faction and you hitherto prosper therein while there is never a man left that dare so much as mutter a word against these your practises so great is your Power and so terrible your Cruelty and Ministers so Cowardly so as by this meanes your Cause and Course seems to prosper while you can crush any that shall interpose himselfe or lawfully in his place oppose your violent courses therfore Christ hath given you this power thus to tyrannise wherein you doe so prosper True it is that Christ hath given way to Satan to rage in these times because he knows he hath but a short time and hereby Christ will try and humble his people that he may doe them good and be glorified in their deliverance and in the destruction of all such Papall and Antichristian Tyranny L. p. 200. The Church being as large as the world Christ thought it fitter to governe it Aristocratically by Divers rather then by One Viceroy And I beleeve that this is true For all the time of the first 300. yeares and somwhat bettter it was governed Aristocratically to wit by the Bishops c. P. Here you give us occasion further to launch into the Deep of this Mystery that we may sound the bottome of it and so discerne what ground it floats upon mudde or sand or both although we have in part discovered it before Here you say and you say you beleeve it too it is an Article of your Creed that Christ thought it fitter to govern the Church Aristocratically by diverse rather then by one Viceroy And you give the Reason The Church being as large as the world We will first take an Assay of your words and then of your Reason For to a vulgar Reader some of your words are somwhat obscure and some also very finely couched that every eye cannot at the first discerne the Mystery of them And first for Aristocratically Aristotle the famous Philosopher and no meane statesman in his Politicks layes down 3 kinds of Civil Government taken in the better part The first is Monarchia which is a government by One the second is Aristocratia which is a Government of the Best Men the third is Democratia which is a Government Popular or of the People Opposite to these three he sets three sorts of bad Government the first is Tyranny which is opposed to Monarchy Tyranny ruling either without or contrary to the good Laws established but a Monarchy governing according to the established good Laws of the State Kingdome or Common-weale The second is Oligarchia which signifies the Government of a few and this standing in opposition to Aristocratia
to defend their ancient and accustomed Liberty Regiment and Laws they may not well be countod Rebells So he But this by the way But I have somthing more to say about the shaking of the Foundations of Faith and Good Manners though I mentioned it before but now upon this occasion And that is concerning Ceremonies of humane ordinance in Gods worship which being imposed upon mens Consciences is not onely a shaking of the Founâ—ation of Faith but an overthrowing of it for thereby Christ is denyed to be the onely King of his Church And therfore as the Kings of Israel did nothing in reforming of Religion and the worship of God but what was expresly commanded and prescribed in Gods Law so Christian Kings and Magistrates ought not to doe any thing no not to impose any one humane Ceremony or Ordinance in Gods service besides that which is written in Gods word otherwise the Foundations of Faith is overthrown Of such moment is the least Ceremony in Gods service that it is of the substance and Foundation of Faith L. p. 210. But 't is time to return For A.C. in this Passage hath been very carefull to tell us of a Parliament and of living Magistrates and Iudges besides the Law books Thirdly therfore The Church of England God be thanked shines happily under a Gratious Prince and well understands that a Parliament cannot be called at All times and that there are visible Iudges besides the Law-books and one supreme long may he be and be hapâ—y to settle all Temporall Differences which certainly he might much better perform if his Kingdome were well ridde of A. C. and his Fellows And she beleeves too that our Saviour Christ hath left in his Church besides his Law-books the Scripture Visible Magistrates and Iudges that is Arch-bishops and Bishops under a Gratious King to governe both for Truth and Peace according to the Scripture and her own Canons and Constitutions as also those of the Catholicke Church which Crosse not the Scripture and the Iust Laws of the Realme But she doth not beleeve there is any Necessity to have one Pope or Bishop over the whole Christian world more then to have one Emperour over the whole world P. It were time indeed for you to return from your Course when once there is mention of a Parliament For thriving If you mean that your Church of England hath of late dayes well thriven in her prevailing for the seting up of Images and Altars for bringing in more Superstitions into your Service for puting down sincerity Purity and power of the true Religion and of the Preaching of Gods word for suppressing the Doctrines of Grace forementioned for hampering the Puritans as you call them by puting down suspending and silencing of Godly and painfull Preachers and by crying down both the Doctrine and Practise of the sanctification of the Sabbath or Lords day and by smothering in the birth all sound and Orthodox Books against Popery and other Heresies not suffering them to be Printed and by licencing of Popish Books to be Printed and Publâ—shed and the like and if this be the way of the well thriving of your Church whomsover you have cause to thanke yet surely you have small cause to thanke God whose Name herein you doe abuse and blaspheme as perhaps your own Conscience may tell you as if he favoured such practises of yours because for a time he patiently suffers and winks at them and that in judgement to a sinfull Land and for tryall of his own servants and people and for a preparative to your certaine ruine if speedy repentance prevent it not For God is not mocked with such thanks though he be mocked but whatsoever a man soweth that shall he reape How then doth it concerne all Christian Magistrates to look to it least if they suffer Christs Kingdome to be betrayed into the hands of Antichristian Usurpers by giving way unto them to doe what they list while themselvs seem to sleep they provoke God too much For as Samuel sayd to the People If ye doe wickedly you shall perish both you and your King For my part though I will not joyne in Prayer with such a Profane Hypocrite as you are and an enemy of Iesus Christ and his Truth no more then the Apostle Iohn would be in the same Bath with that Heretick Cerinthus yet my dayly Prayer is and shall be that God would more and more let the King see how miserably he is abused and the Peace and safety of his Kingdome distracted and indangered both by the late violent practises which have been held in Church-affaires and now by the publishing of such a Book as this so notoriously perillous or rather most pernicious and so much the more in these times of troubles about Religion lately sprung up in the Iland of Great Britaine Which Book though it make many faire pretences for Peace yea Peace and Truth yet in truth it will prove the greatest troubler of Israel and the falsest friend to true Truth that the light hath seen these many yeares This I speake not by conjecture much lesse out of malice to the Authors Person but from the cleare evidence of the word of Prophecy in Scripture in such cases But how comes your Church of England to be so well seen in State-Mysteries I pray you as so well to understand that a Parliament cannot be called at all times Or by the Church of England doe you not meane the the Chaire of Catnterbury as the Church Collective or representative of England For you should better understand such State-matters especially for the not calling of Parliaments at all times or suppose it were at Notime or Nevermas least perhaps it might prove as a Frost to nippe your thriving and overforward spring then your Lordship For my part I am no States-man and so I leave State matters to States-men who should best understand them But if your A.C. and his Fellows be such troublesome fellows why doe you trouble your selves with them when a good honest Parliament might ease the King and Kingdome â—oo of that trouble provided that good Laws already enacted and by the next Parliament if ever there shal be any quickned by a new Law to put them in better execution there may be also a good season to bring forth such Visible Iudges as without straining the strings either of their Purses or Consciences coming clearly to their Benches and not making them as Banks but siting Rectè in Curia they may without feare of any Prepotent Prelate or Partiality in respect of Persons do Justice I passe now from the understanding of your Church of England to her Beliefe which you also tell us of She beleeves too What doth she beleeve That our Saviour Christ hath left in his Church besides his Law-books the Scriptures visible Magistrates and Iudges that is Arch-bishops and Bishops How Is this come already to be an Article of the Faith of the Church of
moderate man and saw more then he durst speake of And the same Rhenanus as was before touched in his Annotations upon Tâ—rtullian and I take it in that Book out which you cite this sentence De Corona Militis observes how sundry Heathen Ceremonies crope into the Church by occasion of many old men newly converted to Christianity whom it was hard to waine from their old Heathenish fashions which therfore were thought fit to be admitted as not hurting but profiting those old Heathen new Christians But godly and learned men as I said before could tell you what infinite dammage your tyrannicall pressing of your Ceremonies upon mens Consciences hath brought to the Gospell and so to the soules of men by depriving them of so many worthy Ministers onely for Non-conformity But this is one speciall end for which you so presse your Ceremonies to suppresse Godly and learned Preachers and so the sincere Preaching of the word of God that the people being brought up in ignorance and profanesse might be the lesse sensible of bearing the yoake of your Antichristian Tyranny over them But as for your Carnall Ceremonies which the Apostle saith are good for nothing pròs plesmonen in comparison of satisfying the flesh the carnall pride of will-worshipers we have spoken sufficiently before But Rhenanus addes a qualification so there be a meane kept I think you might have done well to have omitted this till you had been better acquainted with this meane of which before And the Author might have expressed this Meane a little more fully thus So there be either no Ceremonies at all or if any those very few and those few not pressed with rigor or necessity upon mens Consciences but left free to every one to use them or not according to the Christian liberty which Christ hath purchased for them as is said before Whereas you are not satisfied with a few Ceremonies nor with the Old but you must have New added with a Tot quot and all of them you presse so hard upon the Conscience as you wring blood And this is all the Meane you keep Lastly So the By be not put for the Maine that is say you so we place not the principall part of our Piety in them And doe not you so For you put your Altar and all the solemn Service and Ceremonies of Devotions and Adorations attending upon it even all your humane Inuentions and Will worship for the very Maine of all your Religion Do you not I know you willingly confesse it And what 's the By but Gods-word and the sincere Preaching thereof which you put By and by seting up your Altar-service do thrust out of the Church by the head and shoulders as is noted before And I say The Maine the All and some of all your Religion is your Altar On this your Goddesse all your other Devotions and Ceremonies as so many Hand-mayds give their devout attendance Your face prayeth towards your Altar your body boweth towards your Altar your second solemn service as the secundae Mensae for your daintier Cates must be served up upon your Altar which the maine Body of the Church must not tast of your Third service which is instead of the Preachers concluding prayer blessing after his halfe-houres Sermon must be served by your Priest at your Altar when with his blessing he dismisses the people with an Ite Missa est And all the while of your solemn Second and Third service your Serving men in their Liveries or Rich Copes stand and give their Attendance about your Altar your Crucifixes and Images like the Cherubims have their aspect and respect upon your Altar All must come and offer at your Altar while for joy your Organs merrily play Thus as the Romish Altar-service as Bellarmine tells us is the maine substance of all their Religion just so is yours That 's the Maine But What 's the By then Namely all the Intralls or Inwards of externall Devotion and worship these are the appurtinances these are the By. What are those Inwards The Inwards of True Externall worship are Faith Feare of God Love of God Zeale of Gods Glory sincerity of heart in spirit and Truth Now these with you are altogether the By for these you have layd quite By as before L. p. 280. F. Fisher reports After this we all rising the Lady asked the Bishop whether she might be saved in the Romain Faith He answered she might L. What Not one Answere perfectly related My Answere to this was Generall for the ignorant that could not discerne the errours of that Church so they held the foundation and conformed themselves to a Religious life Pag. 285. We have not so learned Christ as to deny salvation to some ignorant silly soules whose humble peaceable obedience makes them safe among any part of men that professe the foundation Christ. And pag. 288. some Protestants there be which doe as stiffly and as churlishly deny All Papists salvation as they doe us And 283. In this Our Charity is not mistaken and if it be mistaken Charity is better then none at all P. From all these words together we observe this one Maine That silly ignorant Papists living and dying in the Romish Faith may be saved with these conditions 1. If they discerne not the errour of that Church 2. So they profes the foundation Christ 3. So they conforme to a Religious life in an humble and peaceable obedience The second Maine I observe is That we ought not to deny to such in that case salvation And that upon these Reasons 1. Because we have not so learned Christ. 2. Because it is stiffnesse and Churlishnesse in Protestants to deny all Papists salvation 3. That in granting them salvation it is true Charity not mistaken 4. That if Charity herein be mistaken 't is better then none at all Of all these brefly First then I Answere That the Roman Faith being Infidelity it selfe 't is impossible that any living and dying in that faith can be saved And we have before proved it to be flat Infidelity and Apostacy Nor will it excuse any Ignorant that he discerneth not this Infidelity and Apostacy For ignorance though it excuse à Tanto as the Schoolmen speake from the muchnessâ— of sinne yet not à Toto from the Maine of sinne A man that is blind and knows not the danger of the way he walkes in doth as well fall into the pit as he that seeing runs headlong into it The Heathen knew not that they lived and dyed in Idolatry and Infidelity yet they were damned for all their ignorance Secondly for their Professing the foundation Christ Is Profession sufficient Many sayth the Apostle professe Christ that in works doe deny him being abominable disobedient and unto â—very worke Reprobate Is it enough then to professe all that is in the Creed did ignorant silly Papists know what their Latin-Creed meaneth and yet want faith Againe they professe as they are taught How is that
no salvation And that one Doctrine of Justification by works were there no more which all Papists professe and hold is alone sufficient to shut out all Papists living and dying therein from salvation This being so cleare should Protestants grant notwithstanding a possibility of salvation to any Papist living and dying in that Romish faith they should utter a manifest untruth and falshood and so should bewray themselves to be notoriously uncharitable How First to Protestant Professors 2. to Papists To Protestant Professors causing the weake at least to waver in their faith and make them the apter to be seduced by Romish Priests and Jesuites who prevaile not a little with vulgar Protestants and that by this very Argument which you hold That Protestants yea the Primate of Canterbury grant a possibility of salvation in the Roman Church Whereas we say the Jesuites deny salvation to be had in the Protestant Church Although I hope they will not extend this to the Church of England which you say is one and the same Church with that of which Rome is Againe secondly Protestants in not affirming this truth Then it is impossible for any Papist living and dying in the Roman faith to be saved should be very uncharitable to the Papists themselves For seeing them running on in a way which is full of false ground and deep pits covered over with green leaves and the end whereof is certaine and unavoydable destruction should they not cry out unto them to abandon that way and by all meanes and speed to get them out of it they were very uncharitable And the Scripture calls this hatred of our Brother As Levit. 19.17 Thou shalt not hate thy brothâ—r in thy heart thou shalt in any wise rebuke him and not suffer sin upon him And for ignorant Papists we are not to cast off all hope of them but erranti comiter monstrare viam shew those wanderers the right way instructing them with meeknesse proving if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledgement of the truth And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the Devil being taken captive of him at his will Ob. But for Protestants to have no better an opinion of Papists and of their Religion would as you tell us before make the rent wider which you are loth to doe The rent is too wide so to be sowed up with the rotten thread of your Charity Nay such your Charity keeps Papists the further off from the true Protestant Religion when they may be provided of salvation nearer home and that so easily too But however the truth must be spoken as you â—old us before As Augustine saith in the point of Predestination at the Preaching whereof some in his dayes as too many in ours taking offence he answereth Numideo tacenda est veritas c. Is the Truth therfore to be concealed because some unjustly are offended with it to their damnation and not rather to be spoken that he which is able to receive it may receive it to his salvation And here the Papists take offence at Protestants for speaking the truth it is not scandalum datum but acceptum not an offence given but taken And though some take offence yet others weighing by reason may thereby through Gods grace forsake their errour and imbrace the truth If they will not we have freed our own soules and Truth is Truth still We must keep our distance and not because they will not come to us goe the halfe way at least to draw them to us as before As the Lord saith to his Prophet concerning revolted Israel Let them return unto thee but return not thou unto them And if thou take forth the Precious from the vile thou shalt be as my mouth We must not mingle and confound the precious and pure gold with the base drosse not truth with errour not light with darknesse Yet for your part you say Thirdly Not to deny Papists salvation living and dying Papists to wit in the Roman Faith is not mistaken Charity and if it be mistaken Charity is better then none at all But first we have shewed that this is no Charity at all but an erronious opinion arising from a spirit destitute of the Truth and too much in love with the Romish whore And Secondly such mistaken Charity is worse then no Charity at all in this kind It were better if ye had no such Charity For your Charity towards your silly ignorant Papists in perswading them that they are safe enough in any society of men and there is salvation for them living and dying in the Roman Faith is a nuzzling of them in their ignorance and like the Apes Charity to her young one a strangling of them with too much hugging and bewrayes you to be of the spirit of those false Prophets that strengthen the hands of the wicked that he should not return from his wicked way by promising him life that dawbe with untempered morter that call evil good and good evil that put darknesse for light and light for darknesse and wo to such that say peace peace when there is no Peace Ob. But you will say shall we shut out silly ignorant Papists from Gods mercy Nay you your selfe shut them out from Gods mercy while you shut them up in their blindnesse and so from the meanes of Gods mercy For meanes of mercy they have none in their Popish Religion and blind faith and therein you lull them fast asleep while you tell them so long as they are ignorant of the Errours of Popery they are safe among any part of men Thus you shut them out from Gods mercy as much as in you is when we by shewing them the truth and their errour would lead them to Gods mercy Nor doe we deny but God may in the riches of his Grace and mercy prevent and overtake a silly Papist in causing him to imbrace Christ by Faith even when he lyes on his death bed and truly beleeving in Christ and so dying he is undoubtedly saved But dying thus a true Beleever he dyes not in the Roman faith but in the saving faith of Christ which the Roman faith is not So as thus dying within the Verge of the Roman Church yet he dyes no member of the Roman Church but of the true misticall body of Christ. And this Charity we have towards silly Papists praying that God would shew them mercy in delivering them from under Antichrists yoake to take Christs yoake upon them and bring them out of darknesse into his marvellous light To proceed L. p. 294 295. Io. Frith saith Of the presense of Christs naturall body in the Sacrament that neither side ought to make it an Article of Faith but leave it indifferent And B. Ridley we confesse all one thing to be in the Sacrament onely we differ in modo in thâ— manner of Beeing P And of this of Ridley you say ibid. 'T is well if some
whatsoever faith is requisite and necessary to salvation as the beliefe of Scripture to be the word of God as is shewed before And this saving faith is the faith of all them that are heires of salvation to wit of all Gods Elect and all the Saints But it seems with Father Bellarmine you have an Implicit faith for your ignorants and an Explicit for you that are great Clerks or the letter of the Creed for those and the sense for these But I handled this also before Onely you propound a Paradox which is no worke for your pen wherein you are the wiser not to take upon you to read or expound such riddles had you been so wise as not to have propounded â— And yet it is the worke of every good Minister of Chrâ—â—t to teach the people what to beleeve and to exhort them to grow in Grace and knowledge and Faith and so declare unto them the whole Counâ—el of God and to keep nothing backe and to build men up in knowledge more and more unto perfection As the Preacher saith Because the Preacher was wise he still taught the people knowledge yea he gave good heed and sought out and set in Order many Proverbs The Preacher sought to find out acceptable words and that which was written was upright even words of truth The words of the wise are aâ— Goads and Nayles fastened by the Masters of Assemblies which are given from one shepheard But this is not a patterne for you to follow neither by your tongue nor pen. You have other imployment for them But though we cannot set a bound to faith in respect of perfection of degrees yet we ought to teach the people all the parts of saving faith and knowledge striving unto perfection And besides it is the duty of every good Minister of Christ to limit and set bounds to all the negatives of faith in discovering all manner of sins and errours which are all contrary and enemies to faith and salvation For which end they must open all the ten Commandements as Christ did Mat. 5. and all other points of saving Doctrine in the Scriptures Now though you have not the skill or will to set bounds how farre men shall beleeve yet you want no will nor power to inhibit and restraine Preachers shewing them how little a way they must goe in teaching the people and so consequently how little a way the people must goe in beleeving and saving knowledge as in restraining and forbidding to preach the Doctrines of Grace as before forbidding Lectures and especially all Sermonâ— on the Lords day afternoon forbidding long Preaching at any time forbidding expounding of the Catethisme as many of your Prelates doe and the like Thus you can finely set men bounds how little thy shall beleeve or know of God to their salvation That 's a worke if not for your pen or hand yet for your head and not unlikely of your hand and pen too L. p. 327. The Romanists dare not beleeve but as the Roman Church beleeves And the Roman Church at this day doth not beleeve the Scripture and the Creeds in the sense in the which the ancient Primitive Church received them P Dare they not How then say you there is possibility of salvation in the Roman Church for any when it condemneth and accurseth saving faith and justification thereby with other saving truths For if the Papists dare not beleeve but as their Church beleeves then they are bound to good behaviour they dare not beleeve to their salvation And if they dare not beleeve to their salvation then they cannot be saved And if they cannot be saved what possibility of salvation for them living and dying in that faith And here Why do you noâ— say in the sense of the Scriptures themselves and not of the Primitive Church But you doe not like the Scripture sense except the Church interpret it You allow not Scriptures to speake for or testifie for themselves You are the same man still And as we sayd before you doe wisely in that to stoppe the mouth of Scripture as Ahab did Michaiahs for it never speaks good of you but evil alwayes L. p. 232. I will acknowledge every fundamentall point of faith as proveable out of the Canon as we account it as if the Apochryphall were added unto it P. As if Apocryphalls were any divine proofe at all of the fundamentall points of faith in Scripture or ought any way in that respect to be so much as named with the Scripture Apocryphalls saith Ierome may be read for instruction of manners but not for confirmation of faith as before L. p. 336. I have lived and shall God-willing dye in that faith of Christ as it was professed in the ancient Primitive Church and as it is professed in the present Church of England P. As you handle the matter ther 's a vast difference between the faith of Christ professed in the ancient Primitive Church and that which is now professed in the present Church of England For the Ancient Primitive Church taken properly and strictly as somtime in your Booke as before you put it was that wherein the Apostles lived Now will ye be tryed by the Ancient Primitive Church of the Apostles held and professed What say you my Lord for your faith in this case Will you put your faith and Religion to the tryall of the most intire and upright Jâ—ry the Twelve Apostles Certainly if you decline this tryall 't is a shrewd suspicion that the faith of yours wherein you are so resolute to live and dye is not right Therfore for shame of the world you must at least professe or pretend that you wil be tryed by the the Faith and Religion which the Apostles and the true Church of God in their time as being the most Pure Prime Ancient Primitive Church held and professed First then That Primitive Church neither held nor professed nor practised any Hierarchicall government of Prelates or Bishops but have câ—ndemned it in their writings the Scriptures of the New Testament And yet I are say you resolve to live and dye Primate of Canterbury and Metropolitan of all England Secondly The Apostles and the ancient Primitive Church in their Age and time had no Altars but onely the Lord Iesus Christ Heb. 13.10 as it is formerly proved but you and your Church of England both set up and worship Altars and â—each the people both by your Books and practise to do so too and force Ministers to erect Altars or force them out of their Churches And this Faith and Religion also I dare say you resolve to live and dye in Thirdly The Apostles and the anciciâ—nt Primitiâ—e Church in their time celebrated and sanctified every Lords day in holy duties onely and in preaching as well in the afternoon as in the fâ—â—enoon never forbidding but still exhorting to preach in season and out of season giving no liberty to vaine and profane sports and Pastimes either upon
such like baggage which it was stuft withall becoming a ridiculous spectacle to all the beholders So when your faire glorious guilden earthen pot striving with your Maker as the Prophet speaketh comes to justle with the godlen pot of Manna Iesus Christ and to be struck with a blow of his Iron-rod all that filthy inside of hypocrisie and infidelity shall fly out to become a laughing stocke to all the world which shall then see that GREAT WITNESSE of what sincerity was in your heart when you bleared ignorant mens eyes with the glaring luster of your externall worship Yea your externall pompous service as wherewith you think to please Christ argues you to have no other conceit of Christ then such as the Jewes had dreaming of a temporall Messias and an earthly Prince But let us heare your tale out And scarce any thing hath hurt Religion more in these broken times then an opinion of too many men that because Rome had thrust some unnecessary and many Superstitious Ceremonies upon the Church therefore the Reformation must have none at all For Answere in short All your Ceremonies are Superstitious and therefore unnecessary or if you will all unnecessary and therefore both Superstitious and Superfluous What necessity I pray you of your Crosse in Baptisme What necessity of a Surplice except to hide your poore Priests dublet when 't is either greasie or out at the elbowes What necessity of Kneeling at the Sacrament and so before your Altar And how can you sever these from Superstition What 's a signe made in the Ayre to signifie and set forth the life of a Christan and that also after Baptisme the seale of his vow to renounce the Devil and all his works and to be a souldier and servant of Iesus Christ And how is your Surplice a signe of sanctity when commonly he that weares it hath least holinesse and hath cause to blush when he hath no better signe to hang out then that which tells the world ther 's no true Sanctity within And when you so devoutly kneele before your Altar at the receiving of the Sacrament to which your Altar-men usually apply that in the Psalme O come Let us worship and bow downe and kneele before the Lord our Maker What is it a signe of Of your adoring Christs body imagined to be in the bread Or of your adoring the Altar as which you call Gods-Mercy-Seat and where Christ keeps his personall residence Or of your adoring the Crucifix upon or over your Altar Or is it a signe in generall of your humility or of your Idolatry rather or both together Idolatrous humility or humble Idolatry And so is it not a plaine signe of your pride and presumption in perverting the ordinance of Christ while you injoyne such gestures before an Altar in receiving the Lords Supper which Christ ordained not at an Altar but at a Table where a Supper ought to be eaten as a Supper sitting and not kneeling But say you ought the Reformation to have none at all Yea none at all of mens devising to bind the Conscience of any Christian. For els how is it Reformation if it retaine any thing that is either unnecessary or Superstitious Your Reformation is deformed with your Hierarchy and Ceremonies the very badges and Ensignes of Antichristian Tyranny and Romish Apostacie for thereby as is noted before you thrust Christ the King of his Church out of his Throne and put a yoake of bondage upon his peoples necks But say you Ceremonies are the hedge that fence the Substance of Religion from all the indignities which profanesse and Sacriledge too commonly put upon it You meane such Substance of Religion wherein Rome and you are both one Church that is Hierarchy and Ceremonies as is shewed before And you use your Ceremonies as the Traine and Guard of your Hierarchy and Principality which were contemptible without such Attendance And 't is not without need that you make such use of these beggerly Rudiments when you have no fence for your selves in Gods word And in one respect your Ceremonies may fitly be termed a hedge yea Sharper then any thorne hedge as the Prophet speaketh which who so offereth to thrust away must be as David saith fenced with iron and the Staffe of a Speare to be utterly burnt with fire in the same place otherwise they will pierce thorow his hand And this hedge of your pious seeming Ceremonies is a fence to your Hierarchy against Profanesse while profane ignorant persons led by their carnall sense are thereby more then halfe perswaded that Prelates when they are at their Church-devotion are pious and holy Men although they doe not so much as seem so out of the Church And againe Ceremonies you use as a hedge to fâ—nce you against Sacriledge for were it not for your pompous dayly Service and at Solemne Feasts in your Cathedralls you might be in some danger of having all those fat Corpses alienated to some other use then to the maintenance of a sort of Idle-bellies As once a Brother of yours answered being asked of King Iames to what use their Cathedrals did serve your Majesty quoth he is there dayly and Solemnly prayd for Although those Solemne prayers in regard of their fat feeding and customary Chanting and Roaring out of a Sort of ignorant Chanters may be thought to have but little vertue in them except it be for the poore Singing mens poverty whose allowance will scarce maintaine their Credit upon the Ale-house Score You adde And a great weaknesse it is not to see the strength which Ceremonies things weake enough in themselves God knowes adde to Religion it selfe but a farre greater to see it and yet to cry them downe All and without Choyce by which their most hated Adversaries Climbe up and could not cry up themselves and their Cause as they doe but by them Now as we said before Considering what your Religion it selfe is in Substance one with that Religion of Rome 't is weakenesse indeed not to consider what a Strength your Ceremonies doe adde unto it Yet what strength in Ceremonies so weake in themselves as you seem to acknowledge when you Say God knowes And indeed the Apostle calls them Weake and beggerly Rudiments But as weake as they be in themselves yet being backed with your Canons and Courts they prove strong enough to make the strongest to stoop and vaile bonnet unto them Yea are they not strong bonds and chaines to bind and captivate the Conscience of Gods people worse then either the Aegyptian or Babilonian captivity So as were it not for your Canons mounted and full charged these hedges or mud-walls would prove but weake enough to fence the Substance of your Relâ—gion And indeed this is the reason that so many cry them down All without Choyce because of that strength which they adde to your Romish Superstition your Religion it selfe and because on the other side they eat out the very heart
of true piety and the power of true Religion in all those or the most part who are insnared by them Although you call this Weakenesse in those that cry them all down But I hope this weaknesse is So crying especially reaching up to heaven will in time so prevaile with God as to batter them down and to dismount your Canon that holds them up But such consider not Say you that by this meanes their most hated enemies the Jesuites I suppose you meane cry up their cause and not els but by them Surely By them here if rightly taken 't will prove very true you Say By them that is by your Ceremonies For what is there whereby the Jesuites doe more climbe and cry up themselves and their Cause then your crying up of your Ceromonies This they professe in their Bookes and English Pamphlets which they scatter among the People that the Church of England is coming amaine towards Rome as being weary of her Religion or ashamed of it And all this especially since you have climbed up to the top-pinnacle of Canterbury Church And well you Say Their most hated Adversaries You say not Your most hated Addversaries the Iesuites for then you should account Jesuites no better then Puritans Though I think your Lordship can give no great good reason why the Jesuites should be the Most hated enemies of those that most cry down your Ceremonies except you will give the Jesuites precedencie of you in persecuting those men But I say your Zeale for Ceremonies is a fiery Chariot to carry the Jesuites to that heaven of their happinesse to wit Englands Reconciliation with Rome which is hastened and advanced by nothing so much as by hoysing up of Altars and other Idolatrous Superstitions and puting downe of good Ministers and all true Religion This this is the Ladder by which Jesuites Climbe up not now to the top of Tyburne but to the top of their Mount Tabor beholding the Church of England transformed into the Church of Rome being also so exceedingly helped up and advanced by this your handy worke now published for that end L. p. 21. In this insuing Discourse I have indeavoured to lay open those wider Gates of the Catholick Church c. P. So you have indeed having set open Englands broad Gates that That Great Whore of Babylon with all her Train and Trinkets her Superstitions and Idolatries may have the more easie reentry without so much as the ruffling of her Ruffe Nay rather then fayle as the Trojans at the Subtile Counsell of their perjured Sinon brake downe a great part of their City-wall to let in the Trojan horse which unknown to them was full of armed Greeks their Enemies by which meanes their City was surprized sacked and burnt So you having been a great Instrument of not onely Seting open the broad Gates and making them wider then they were before but of pulling downe the Walls and Bulwarks of the Church of England to wit in Suppressing Gods Word and Supplanting the most Painefull and Godly Ministers as the Watchmen of the City yea the Chariots and Hose-men of Israel and having prepared it by the Setting up of your Altars and Superstitious Service and Devotion attending thereupon all conformable to Rome doe in this your Book now published as with open voyce proclaime how happy a thing it were that the Church of England and of Rome were perfectly reconciled and reunited Againe you have in this also layd open those wider gates of your Catholick Church in that therein you have in some respects made those broad Gates that lead to destruction wider then they were before For at after in your Booke you can find a broad way for the silly ignorant Papists to find Salvation in the Church of Rome and so to be Saved living and dying in the Roman Faith But of this in its due place Onely you have altogether shut the Gates of the Catholick Church against all Reformed Churches beyond the Seas as having no Prelates and therefore no Churches As hath been noted You adde The Catholicke Church confined to no Age Time or Place nor knowing any bounds but that Faith which was once and but once for all delivered to the Saints Jude 3. P. My Lord what have you to doe with the Saints faith except that you indeavour to destroy it Or with those Saints except to persecute and root them out Or would you make us beleeve that you are one of those Saints Certainly then you must become another-gates Man then as yet you have shewed yourselfe to be Your Tyranny your Hypocrisie your Superstitions your Persecutions your Reconciliation with Rome must be utterly abandoned Except by continuing in them you hope to be the next Canonized Saint to Ignatius the Father and Founder of the Jesuites Society Lately Canonized by his Holinesse at Rome for his good Service for the Catholick Cause and so may you haply after 100. yeares come to be Canonized for the notable Service you have done in the Church of England for the Church of Rome if ever you shall bring them to a perfect Reconciliation And as for that Faith you Speake of as the bound of the Catholicke Church which you say you and Rome doe both professe we shall have occasion hereafter to speake more largely of it L. p. 22. I have delivered with a single heart that truth which I professe P. What truth it is which you professe we have in part already discovered in this your Dedicatory and shall further and more fully in your insuing Discourse But with what singlenesse of heart you have done it that we leave to the Judge of all hearts Onely where we find your hypocrisie so palpable as that we cannot chuse but use it as a Perspective to see into the constitution of your heart as where we find your words so directly contradicting your deeds and practises the clearest Indexes of your mind expressed and written in Capitall Letters we doe not spare to informe you of it both because the heart is deceitfull above all things and desperately wicked who can know it So as your own heart when you think it single may double with you and that others also taking warning by such a dangerous example as the greatest Prelate of England may not also be deceived and seduced by your deep dissimulations L. ibid. In the publishing whereof I have obeyed your Majesty discharged my duty to my power to the Church of England given account of the hope that is in me and so testified to the world that Faith in which I have lived and by Gods blessing and favour purpose to dye P. For your obedience to his Majesty we say no more having touched before how strong that backe had need to be that beares all your burthens so intolerable to be borne But is this the discharge of the duty of the Metropolitane of all England to the Church of England to compile and publish such a Booke to reconcile England with