not be called a blessing of the land but of some part within the land And againe yf it be passiue only and enioyned by them-selues and not actiue so as they procure nor yeild not the same freedome to others where they may then is it absurdly called a blessing or benediction for that theeues also and the worst men of the world among them-selues or to others of their crew do not vse persecution Matth. 12. Marc. 3. Luc. 11. nay diuels also as Christ signifieth do not fight one against another and yet that this is not true in protestants but that they persecute one another also where they fal to difference of opinions is a thing so euident as needeth no proof and the examples alleadged by me before out of all the sects of Germany Switzerland and other countreys KeÌ„nit epist. ad Io. Georg. Elect. Brandeburg and namely that out of Kemnitius do euidently coÌ„uince yt with infinite proofes for that none of them getting the vpper hand in any place doth permit the other sect be yt neuer so brotherly to subsist with yt but dryueth them out euen the ridged Lutherans the soft and these the other wheresoeuer they preuayle as the Puritans also in Geneua HollaÌ„d Scotland France do not suffer any one congregation of softer Caluinists or English ProtestaÌ„ts to stand with them and on the contrary side whether our English protestants haue suffered their brethren Puritans to liue in England without persecution or noe or whether they haue had halcyon or halter dayes One side of protestants doth persecute the other these later yeares past vnder Protestants the hanging of Penry and other of thesame ghospel may testifie as also the many and greeuous complaints wrytten by them-selues published in print Lib. 2. of dangerous positions cap. 10. and registred these later dayes by the ProtestaÌ„ts in their foresaid bookes where the Puritanes cry out say among other things This land is sore troubled with persecution there iâ— no place nor being for a faythful Minister of the word our blood cryeth for reuenge an inquisition much like that of Spayne is among vs o lamentable case o heynoâ—â— impietie Ministers are in worse sorte oppressed now then they were by the Papists in Q. Maries tyme Complaâ—â—â— of persecutioÌ„ by Puritanes besydes whorish impudency halter axe bands scourging racking our Bishops haue nothing to desend themselues withal the Clinke Gatehouse white Lyâ—n and the Fleâ—â—e are their onlie arguments If I say Hieremy Ezechiel c. were aliue agayne they would be sent to the Marshalsey Lo good reader these piteous complaynts and many more do make and poure out one sort of ghospellers against the other when their owne ghospel brethreÌ„ cry out so much of persecution what may Catholikes do and how is this then a peculiar blessing of Protestants to be free from persecuting yet harken to our knight how he freeth all from suffring at their hands not onlie those of their owne religion Pag. 21. Sir F. proueth his ovvn men to be vvolues but also of ours The wolfe sayth he persecuteth the lambe not the lambe the wolfe Wel what of this this is a certayne sentence true in it selfe but proueth nothing for your sense nay rather I might inferre against yow thus Yow do persecute greuiouslie by your owne brethrens testimony them that be lambes by their profession Ergo yow are wolues by your owne sentence but harken yet further what he sayth also very confidentlie euen of Catholikes Freedome from persecution in England VVastvvord Pag. 21. Yow shal sayth he neuer be able to proue so farre as I could euer learne that any one eyther Priest or lay man learned or vnlearned hath in thiâ— land for these fortie yeares byn put to death only for being of a contrarie religion Heer I doubt not but all England wil cry shame to this shameful and shameles lack of shame for what chyld in England is so ignorant of thinges thaâ— passe as he knoweth not this to be a notorious falshood hauing hard of aboue a hundred Priests put to death for being Priests See tvvo Apologyes for the Catholikes vvith other treatises and for being ordeyned to that function beyond the seas and for defending the fayth belonging to the function as by diuerse treatises written of this matter doth appeare And if this were not so of the killing of so many men for only religions sake yet is there no persecution but death wil Syr F. say that his Protestants do not persecute for that they kil not all that be different from them in religion Persecution against Catholikes doth he not heare and see and know the numbers of them that be daylie apprehended imprisoned arraigned and condemned in their goods and liberties for standing in their fathers fayth and resisting protestants nouelties and innouations is this no persecution Is this the blessed freedome which protestants ghospel hath brought in Surelie I wil end and shut vp this absurditie with those wordes of S. Augustine against Iulian the famous heretike Aug. contr Iul. lib. 1. c. 7. Si nesciens hoc dixisti cur non miseram respuis imperitiam si sciens cur non sacrilegam deponis audaciam If thow hast said this by ignorance why dost thow not reiect thy miserable vnskilfulnes if wittinglie why doest thou not leaue of so impious audacitie and so much of this OF THE OTHER FIVE imagined blessings that remayne to wit deliuerance from exactions long peace power in forrayne countryes wealth of the land and multitude of subiects increased seauenfold CAP. XI BESYDES the blessings hitherto recyted which haue byn such and so goodlie as yow haue heard discussed our knight to make vp the number of ten hath added fyue more to wit Deliuerance from intolerable exactioÌ„s Long peace at home Great power abroad in forrayne countryes VVealth great riches increased with in the land And finaly great multitude of subiects seauenfold increased aboue that they were at her Maiesties entrance Which blessings though the very propounding of them to English eares be so ridiculous as they need litle examination and much lesse coÌ„futatioÌ„ yet for honoring of our knight that is the propounder I shal be forced to say a word or two of each of theÌ„ aduertising the reader first which yet he wil of himself obserue A seditious shift of syr F. especiallie by the last words of this enumeration that the knight playeth notably the part of Scogan in the treatie of these blessings running behynd the cloath of state as often I haue warned before and shal be forced more often hereafter and so conioyning her Maiesties gouernment with his ghospel and change of religion in the prayse and disprayse of that which hath ensued as if they could not possibly be seuered in the effectes of blessings and cursings therof proceeding which poynt I hold to be most false and flattering assuring my selfe presuming also that any man of iudgement
the first that if this woodcock or any of his crew can shew any one noueltie as an article of fayth in our religion which was not beleeued in the Apostles tyme and in all ages since by the professors of the Catholike fayth eyther explicite or implicite as diuines terme it we shal yeild in all the rest for that we hold the foresaid rule of fayth deliuered by the Apostles to haue byn ful and perfect and that whatsoeuer poynt of fayth hath byn determined of since by general councels confirmed by Popes hath byn no new thing but explication only of that which was before deliuered by the Apostles albeit not so expreslie knowne to all In the second poynt also we hold that if O.E. or his mates can shewe any one heresie taken for an heresie by the general Churche since Christs tyme vnto Luthers or after to be holden by vs truely and in the same sense wherin it was condemned for an heresy and holden by those heretykes if this I say can be truly shewed and not as this vice cometh in with fustian-apes for veluet telling vs a tale of the Coliâ—ridians that offred Sacrifice to the Virgin Mary and other like from whom he cannot deny but that we differ most manifestly though his forehead be neuer so hard If this I say can be prooued that any one heresy is truely among vs and not the similitude only or shadow therof then wil we aske no further proof of any thing against vs for that we hold absolutely that eyther all or none is trew in our religion but on the contrary syde we shal shewe and demonstrate most clearely that they hold many old condemned heresies in the self same sense wordes and meaning wherin they were condemned by the vniuersal Churche held by those heretikes And this is the true difference betweene vs and them to wit that they obiect to vs shadowes and resemblances of heresyes but we conuince them of true heresy in deed IT IS FVRTHER shewed by diuers cleare examples that O. E. and his fellowes do playnly dispayre of all certayne meane or rule to try the truth among them-selues or with vs. CAP. XVII NOtwithstanding that sufficient hath byn said before in diuers chapters of this first encounter to shew that Protestants haue no sure rule or certayne meanes at all for agreement in matters of Religion Sup. cap 3.4 5.15 16. or for consent or assurance therin yet for so much as this is a most principal poynt to be wel vnderstood deeply pondered by euery man that loueth his eternal lyfe and saluation I haue thought good to treat one poynt more in this chapter which is the confession of our aduersaries them-selues in this behalfe though not in playne words yet in manifest deedes which are not nor ought to be of lesse authoritie then wordes And first of all I wil shewe this by their passing ouer without answere this whole matter being the most principal of all this first encounter when the warder vrgeth them most earnestlie in the poynt it selfe and both of them I meane both the K t. first the minister after him do answere directlie no one woord vnto the whole demonstration which is a playne confession that they cannot answere it but yet to shewe it more euidently and to conuince them in this place I wil repeate agayne what the warder said before I would aske S. F. sayth he or any such man as he is Pag. 4. that determineth so resolutely that his only religion among so many others as are extant at this day is true and all others false wheron doth he ground his certaintie Tvvo vvayes of tryal proposed Two onely meanes can S. F. haue to guyde himselfe in this case first that he hath receaued this doctrine of such or such persons preachers ministers or doctors whose learning and knowledge in this behalfe he trusteth absolutely and then is his whole fayth buylded vpon the credit of man as is euident and consequently is nothing worth nor no fayth at all The other way is that he beleeueth it for that it is founded in Scripture but this way to S. F. must needs be as vncertayne as the other yf not more for that to be sure that it is soundly grouÌ„ded vpon Scripture he must first read himselfe his whole beleefe expresly in Scriptures which is much for a man of S.F. occupation to do and then he must be able to iudge of many other poyntes belonging to the same as namely that the book is surely Scrâ—pture that he readeth And then that the translation which he vseth is trulie made out of the learned tongues Hebrew Greeke and Latâ—n And lastly he must be sure of the true sense and exposition which also are hard matters for a man of S. F. learning and much more for others that know lesse then he Yea and when all is done yf he had all these helpes needful for such a matter as he hath not yet were it but a priuate maÌ„nes opinioÌ„ consequently his fayth should be grounded but vpon his owne particuler iudgmeÌ„t which maketh no fayth at all but opinion only as often hath byn sayd for that fayth must haue Gods expresse authoritie for her foundation So that to conclude the first blessing which S. F. in particular thinketh to haue receaued by this change of his religion is in effect that whereas before when he beleeued the Catholyke and vniuersal fayth of Christendome deliuered vnto him by the vniuersal Churche as founded on Scripture which Churche Christ his Apostles gaue him expresse commission to credit his beleef was properly fayth founded vpon a rock that could not fayle now hauing left that fortresse cast him-self into the waues of new opinions he hath nothing certayne at all but so much as he list to chose of him-self or of other mennes opinions which choise is properly called heresie for that the word heresy in Greek as all learned men know signifieth nothing els but a certayne election and choise in matters of Religion to wit when a man leauing the commoÌ„ coÌ„sent of the general Churche â—â— ooseth only to follow that which his owne priuate iudgment induceth him vnto And to make this more playne how all these people haue no other rule of beleef A playne demonstration against sir F. but only what their owne fancy leadeth them vnto I aske S. F. not of any Catholyke Doctor nor of any ancient Father as S. Augustine S. Ierom or the rest whom easely he would coÌ„temne but rather of his owne Doctors Martyn Luther Iohn Caluin Theodore Bâ—za such others whom he supposeth to haue byn seruants of God and indued with his holy spirit all the world knoweth that they were more learned then S. F. yet why should he beleeue his owne iudgement more then theirs in pointes of fayth wherin they differ from him as Luther about the real presence and the number and forme of Sacraments and many other points
somwhat yow may ghesse by that which here hath byn said VVherfore to draw to an end of this his preface to draw our doughtie Minister out of the dyke of imperrinent discourses after a litle ruffle of choler wherin he saith that the proud and presumptuous Iesuite calling himselfe N. D. had presented his vvard-vvord to her Maties Counsel he telleth vs what an heretical new enterprise he hath taken in hand A nevv â—raking chaleÌ„ge of O.E. to wit besyds the answering of the ward-word to make an other chalenge of his owne I haue sayth he to meet him at euery turne vvith my ansvvere to this noddy conioyned a briefe discourse and in certayne nevv Encounters dravving him into a nevv combat proued that Popish religion is neyther Catholique nor ancient nor true religion nor the true Church of Christ nor the Popes agents that haue byn executed for traytors true martyrs c. Thus he vaunteth what he would do as Goliath did 1. Reg. 17. Dabo carnes tuas volatilibus coeli c. but what he wil performe when he cometh into the feild where he and I must try who is the Noddy that we shal see after And I am content the reader be both looker on and Iudge yf the sturdie minister receyue more blowes then he expected and returne home beaten back and syde in this first combat about the Ward-word then may his frends bemone him if they list while other do laugh and then shal we haue litle need to enter into his new combat which he offreth after this but if he proue himselfe a man in the first then may he more be trusted in the second As for my presumptioÌ„ in presenting my defence and ward vnto the Lords of her Ma ties Counsel No presumption to haue offred the VVards-vvord to the Lords of the Counsel I see no reason besyds this Ministers anger and disdayne why it should be so called or taken seing their honours are publique iudges vmpyres by office for all sorts of persons to haue refuge vnto And for so much as the iniuryes offered by the Watch-word as a famous libel as wel to great forrayne Princes and nations as to honorable worshipful and most honest subiects did touch the honour and publique weale of our kingdome and nation very neare to whom should I haue gone for remedy in this matter but only to their Lordships should I haue made my mone to the Puritanical and tyrannical Presbytery of S r Fâ— Ministers or to the rude rable of O. E. his pyratical compagnions we haue seene the issue of both these sorts of late and therby may we gather what equity we should fynd at their hands seing the Prince whom they most flattered hath found at their hands so egregious treachery and conspiracy To their Honours I appealed then with iust reason shal do now agayne in the end of this my book to cal these two defendants to account of the crymes of flattery forgery sycophaÌ„cy vsed by theÌ„ in this their writing to the end that if my seueral warnings which I am to geue them after all the Encounters do not worke some good in them yet at least wyse their honours authority and respect may make them blush and put them to silence Last of all the Ministers conclusion is this not vnlike to the premisses This sayth he I may boldly say that I haue not follovved the aduersaryes vayne in scurrilous scoffing nor his vanity in ruffinlike bragging Boldly yow may say it S. Minister but how truly your writing it self wiâ—-shew afterward and hath in part already And I doubt whether euer any of your coate yf yow haue any certayne coate to be knowne by and be not of euery coate haue so much exceeded in all these three poynts of scurrility vanity or rayling as yow haue done for which cause yow are forced also to put on the visard of O. E. for couering your shame It followeth further But vvhy shouâ—d I goe about say yow to excuse my selfe before the faultes be proued percase it is no fault to vvrite as I haue done Lo heere an other qualification of the matter before he denyed it now he putteth it in doubt and percase but heare yet further And vvere it a fault sayth he yet I trust thou vvilt beare vvith my vveaknes seing as the Apostle sayth O. E. calleth his rayling vveaknâ—s all of vs offend in many things Heere Io is the last refuge and excuse of all to wit by vveaknes that all do offend in many things To the first if it be weaknes of brayne and wit it is pardonable for that it is forcible but if it be weaknes of manners and honestly it is a fowle fault in a prelate and preaching deane that should strengthen others To the second though all offend in many things yet that it is no iust excuse in euery thing for yf this answere might be admitted at Newgate sessions when those good fellowes are brought foorth to be arraygned of their offences then fewe or none would go to Tyborne but as there in those kind of people many wickednesses are pardoned and some offences punished the one in mercy the other in iustice so it should be with this fellow also and may perhaps one day if he come to an indifferent session In the meane space I am content to conclude as he doth to the reader and in his owne words Read sayth he vvith indifferency and vveigh my allegations and compare deligentlie my defence vvith the Noddyes chalenge and then vse thy libertie in iudgement to discerne vvho is the Noddye THE FIRST ENCOVNTER ABOVT BLESSINGES AND CVRsinges brought in by change of Catholike Religion in England THE ARGVMENT This first Encounter about blessings and benefites cursinges and calamityes ensuing vpon the change of Catholyke religion in our Country or threatning to ensue vvas the first and principal matter taken out of S. Francis Hastinges Watch-word by the VVarder to be incountred vpon as an argument both of moment and vtility to be handled and vvel considered as sufficiently appeareth by the VVarders discourse therof vvhervnto both the knight and his aduocate O. E. hauing replyed N. D. maketh this reioynder diuiding the same for more perspicuityes sake into 19. Chapters vvhich follovv in order A BRIEFE SVMMARIE of all that before hath byn said or now is to be added about this first Encounter of Blessinges and cursinges by change of Catholike Religion CHAP. 1. TOVCHING the seueral argumentes of the Watch-word and Ward-word in general as also of this secoÌ„d reioyneder combat betwene Sir Francis and me in this his VVast-word and my Warn-word as in like maner the late arriual of O. E. his Wrangle-word sufficient hath byn said before in the preface to the whole worke as also in the epistle to O. E. himselfe and in the annotations vpon both their letters to the Reader so as now we are only to treat of the proper subiect of this first
and discretion wil be of my opinion that whatsoeuer good effectes haue come to our common wealth by her Maiesties gouernment or rare partes of Princelie commendations A note to be diligently obserued and which truelie may be termed blessings might haue byn as great as all these or farre greater vnder Catholike religion and especiallie in her Maiestie if it had pleased almightie God to haue blessed her and the realme with the continuance therof and contrariwyse whatsoeuer cursings and calamities on the contrarie syde haue ensued or may ensue herafter by the change of religion these are proper effectes and necessary consequeÌ„ts of the new ghospel and not of any defect in her Maiesties gouernment and this foundatioÌ„ being presupposed in all that I shal say let vs passe on to examine in a word or two the most ridiculous vanitie of these fiue blessings folowing which he calleth corporal accompting his former spiritual For the first of them which is deliueraÌ„ce from intolerable exactions â— Blessing deliuerance from exactions if he meane it of the realme in general as his marginal note may seeme to importe which often yet disagreeth in sense from his text let the Escheker books be compared of the tributes payments contributions and exactions that were vsed in EnglaÌ„d in former dayes before this new ghospel came in and since I meane of the summes that were payd in old tymes when Catholike religion bare rule and protestants were not knowne those that later Princes by reason of troubles warres suspicions and other like occasions rysing especially by difference in religion haue byn forced to take of their subiects since the yeare of Christ 1530. or there about at what tyme K. Henrie began vpon the aduise incitation of Cranmer Cromwel and other Protestants to breake with the Pope and churche of Rome let these summes I say be coÌ„ferred and then our knight if he be a good Auditor or Eschequer man wil for very shame stryke out this blessing and mentyon it no more But yf he meane this blessing especiallie or principallie of our Clergie men this day in England for that they pay nothing now to the Pope as in the texte and prosecution of this blessing is set downe then let the wealth and ease of the old and new Clergie be compared togither or rather the pouertie and beggerie of the one with the honor and splendor of the other and so this controuersie wil quicklie be decyded and S.F. beaten from this first corporal blessing of his new Cleargie to a Spiritual which is Matth. â— Beati pauperes spiritu blessed are the poore in spirit for in body and purse they are already miserable as them-selues euery where complayne The pouertie and myserie of the protestaÌ„t cleargie none more grieuously or more spitefullie in secret as before hath byn touched then his champion O.E. alleaging these reasons that the most of them hauing much to pay both to Prince Patron in steed of the Pope and litle to receyue the gleebe lands of their benefices being commonlie swept to their hands and their charge of women and children so great as the parishes do commonlie feele when they dy their beggerie must needs be intollerable wheras on the other syde in Catholyke Countryes yf they contribute any thing to the Pope as to their head for better maintenance of his state and gouerment of the whole Churche it is neyther so great a matter and commonlie â—â—t out of the greater benefices that caÌ„ better beare it and in recompence of that agayne he defendeth them against the intrusion or vsurpation of seculer men vpoÌ„ their liuings which importeth them much more as by experience of Catholyke Countryes and Kyngdomes is seene then is the contribution they make to Rome though it were so great and greuous as our K. maketh it in K. Henrie the 3. his â—yme alleaging a certayne complaynt of our English Churche to Pope Innocentius 4. in a general Councel at Lions an 1245. against his collectors officers in England which being taken out of Iohn Fox whom this man yet wil not name maketh no more against the Popes Authoritie A calumniation of Ihon Fox act â—on Pag. 241.242 c. nor yet conuinceth him of abuse that way then yf at this day the same complaynt should be made by the Churche of Spayne as diuers tymes it is against the lyke collectors or officers there or when any complaint is made in England of any of her Ma ties officers that abuse themselues in their collections for couetousnes vpon the Clergie at this day wherof I presuppose there would not want complaints if all Ministers should be willed to vtter their greifes therin And what then doth Syr F. and Fox vrge so much against the Pope the complaynt of some in England against his officers at that tyme VVhy Pope Innocentius required a collection of mony for recouering the holy land when the publike necessitie of christendome oppressed by Turkes and Saracens inforced Pope Innocentius as general Father of all to lay some contribution vpon the cleargie of England and other countryes for defence therof to which effect also in the very same councel of Lions he had appoynted and declared king Lewes of France for Supreme general and yet was not the summe exacted such nor so great but that more money in these our dayes hath byn sent out of the realme in one yeare by these meÌ„nes liking and good approbation for defence of heresie and rebellion in France Flanders Scotland and other countryes theÌ„ was in this many other tymes in those dayes for maintenance of the whole Churche and Christianitie and yet coÌ„playneth not our knight of this which subiects now feele for that it is present but of the other past and gone which they feele not wherby is seene his indifferencie that they seek nothing but matter of complayâ—â— and cauilling against the Pope and hâ—â— doings As for long peace which is an other blessing of his both sweet profitable as he termeth it â— blessing long peace I know not what or why I should answere seing Aristotle teacheth that to go about to proue or improue by reasonâ— that which is open and manifest to our senses is to wearie reason and offer iniurie to sense who seeth not therfore what hath passed in England since protestant religion first entred in K. Henryes dayes for if we talke oâ— domestical styrres and tumultes among our people we haue had more within these 70. yeares to wit from the one or two and twentith of K. Henryes raigne downwards vnder him and his three children respecting religioÌ„ only then in a thousand before his dayes and more then in many ages for any cause whatsoeuer setting a syde the contention for the crowne betweene the two houses oâ— Yorke and Lancaster which cannot go by reason in this accompt for that it was a particular quarrel of certayne Princes of the bloud royal not rysing of
deed he doth sufficiently manifest him-selfe in this place by so many hems and hammes as he vseth in puritanes defence saying he trusteth God wil direct them to agree Pag. 13. and that howsoeuer some dissent hath appeared as though in deed it were not yet he doubteth not but it shal be seene to the world that it is concordia discordia with a discord that hath concord in yt c. Thus he salueth the matter for his tender affection towards the Puritans wheras his Champion O.E. talking of this diuision sayth playnly and resolutely of them Infra cap. 15. 16. as we shal treate more at large after-ward that they are no more to be counted of protestants society then the Papists that are of the Popes retinue and thesame do say the Puritanes of protestants as before out of their owne wordes hath byn declared VVHAT THE CHAMpion Minister O.E. sayth to this matter of cursings and how absurdly he behaueth him-selfe therin CAP. XIII HOWSOEVER our masked minister hath byn silent in the former blessings yet wil he shewe him-selfe vocal now seing his name consisteth of onely vowels about this opposite argument of cursings and with his verbositie he wil supply the K t. breuitie wherof we haue spoken and complayned in this chapter for yow must vnderstand and yow shal perceaue it by the proof that this vowel minister is a great vaeunâ— parlar The manner of O.E. his ansvveriug and foloweth vp and downe the warder snatching and snarling at euery word almost he sayth but without rithme or reason order or method shame or modestie but only sayth or denyeth as it turneth best to his fancy for the present thinking the victory to consist in out-talking his aduersary or contradicting whatsoeuer is said and that he is the conquerer who hath the last word true or false and by this briefe note yow may square him out hereafter in all his answere as by tryal yow shal see First then to begin with that which the warder layeth downe of diuers difficulties already growen in England by change of reliligion he sayth Pag. 12. that to this the state of things them-selues wil answere lawes are ordinarily executed no man is wronged eyther in his person lands or goods but he may haue remedy religion is truâ—â— preached and professed c. Yow see how farre how plausibly he may runne counter in this poynt VVhether change of religion be daungerous and how substantially he proueth that there be no difficultyes by his owne onely denyal but yet marke reader how soone after he putteth a moderation to this general assertion granting some difficultyes but denying the true cause Secondly sayth he we say that howsoeuer wâ— stand true religion is neyther the case of trouble nor danger for if that were so then were all Princes states that professe religion in the same case Pag. 13. Loe how wyse a man he sheweth himselfe to be first in his proposition and then in his inference his proposition is impertinent that true religion bringeth no trouble for we talke of protestant religion which is foolery for him to presume that we graunt it to be true religion and besydes this we talke not of religioÌ„ it selfe but of the changement which in religion eyther true or false may breed troubles in any common wealth but especially the change of Catholike religion hauing bin for so many ages established and so many Princes and Monarches of the Christian woorld professing the same His inference that all protestant Princes by this reason should be in trouble is an ydle non consequent for their cases may be different their states vnequal the máner of change vnlike and the proceeding therin after an other fashion but yet whether the protestant Princes of Christendome haue gayned or no by the change or whether they be or may be in more daunger of troubles for separating themselues from the Catholike body of christian Princes than yf they had continued in their Fathers religion I leaue this to wyse men to iudge and tyme to try And this to his first inference but besydes this he hath a second in the same kynd no lesse foolish that if change of religion bringeth trouble then all catholike Princes that haue not changed must enioy peace Fond inferrences and be out of daunger which is true so farre foorth as coÌ„cerneth this daunger arising by change which is of no smal importance seing it deuideth not only betweene them and other Princes of different religion but betweene them also and their subiects and if Catholike Princes haue had their troubles also or daungers in our dayes it hath bene eyther for other causes or for that some in their states haue gone about to alter religion against thesayd Princes willes as in France and Scotland Flanders and other places and so consequentlie change of religion though not intended by them hath byn the cause of their said troubles and dangers But heare out the minister yet further lastly sayth he yf religion now professed were the immediate cause original of any trouble like to ensue then should not the Papists haue byn the principal meanes to moue warres rebellions against the state nor the only practisers against her Maiesties person safety as we haue found them to haue byn Thus he sayth but how it hangeth together God knoweth or the diuel that taught him to make this malitious consequence against innocent men for I see not by any Cambridge or Oxford logicke how this illation may be founded if chaunge of religion bring troubles ergo why do Catholikes moue troubles he hath brought this kynd of arguyng from the campe no doubt for he neuer found it in schoole And as for the calumniation of this wicked assertion that Catholikes are the only moouers of warres and practisers against her Maiesties safety the instance I trow of his late M r. the Earle of Essex and the Puritanes Essex atteÌ„pt the hopes of his follovvers and other hungry protestants that set him a worke wherin this fellow also perhaps hoped to haue no smal share if things had succeeded doth sufficientlie cleare vs and so both the forme of his argument prouing him vnlearned and the substance and matter dishonest I leaue him for this first onset and come to the second for thus he goeth forward against me Pag. 14. Yow see sayth he this Noddy hath neyther reason nor truth in his discourse c. he telleth vs that by alteration of Religion in England Scotland Ireland Flanders France haue tasted of many miseries tumultes calamityes desolations he should haue said of many blessings frendly fauours This needeth no reply if the reader be of any iudgment for he can see the impudency of the assertion And then going forward to answere my enumeratioÌ„ of so many battails murders distruction of so many couÌ„tryes prouinces townes cittyes noble houses linages c occasioned by diuersitie and change of religioÌ„
where the noddiship trulie lighteth when the matter is tryed I am content to remit it to the readers iudgment And heere the verie first clause of his speech conteyneth no smal noddytisme to wit the bringing in for an instance the later east churches that haue fallen to schisme and heresie also namely about the holy Ghost as our aduersaries wil not deny wheras my assertion was that one head was acknowledged by aâ—l Catholike people of Christendome so as the instance of the late greeks since their fall doth make nothing to the purpose and that the ancient greeke Fathers did acknowledge the preeminencie of the Churche of Rome aboue all other Churches and consequentlie also of her gouernour and Pastor the Pope is most euident euen at this day by their owne wrytings yet extant as by Ignatius his Epistle ad Rom. Iren. at large aduersus haeres lib. 3. cap. 3. Athan. apolog 2. Epiphan lib. contr haereses 68. Basilius Epist. 52. Nazianz. carm de vita sua Chrysost. Ep. prima secunda ad Innocentium Greeke Fathers acknoleging â—he principalite superiorite of the RomaÌ„ Churche Cyril ep 10. ad Nestorium ad 11. clerum populum constantinop â—heodoret epist. ad Leonem Papam Zozâ—mâ—n lib. 3. hist. cap. 7. All which ten ancient greeke Fathers let any man read in the places cyted for that they are to long here to be set downe then let him iudge also of the second noddytisme when he sayth that the ancient Churche was vtterlie ignorant of this matter for if the ancient greeke Churche did acknowledge it how much more all the ancient latyn fathers and doctors And this may be sufficient for this first ioynder about vnitie oâ— fayth in Catholikes let vs passe to the second about the meanes to iudge or know the truth THAT PROTESTANTS not only haue no agreement or vnitie among them-selues in matters of religion but also are depriued of all sure meanes and certayne rule wherby to attayne therunto CAP. XIIII THERâ— foloweth in the Ward-word that not onlie the Protestants haue no present vnion in doctrine amoÌ„g them-selues In certaynty of beliefe among protestants See of this sup cap 4. num 10. but also that it is impossible that euer they can haue it which is as great a spiritual curse and malediction as may be and this for lack of due meanes to procure or establish the same And to this purpose the K. is hardlie posed by the warder about the certaintie of his fayth and religion to wit how he can haue any and by what infallible meanes he can be sure that he is in the right way and not in heresie and seing that he and his do make scriptures their onelie assurance this dependeth of the true sense he is asked and vrged whether he hath this certaintie of Scripture by his owne reading onlie and iudgment or by the credit of some ministers that enterpret the Scriptures in this or that sense vnto him and whether soeuer of these two wayes he stand vpoÌ„ it is shewed and proued to be vncertayne the first depending onelie of the owne iudgment the second of others who being priuate men hauing no more assurance of the holie Ghosts assistance then him-selfe The curse of vncertainty among protestants can be no more sure or infallible then the first wherof it foloweth that a protestant hath not nor can haue any further certainty of the truth of his religion then humaine iudgement or probabilitie can giue him which is a miserable curse and no fayth at all except he wil flie to his inward spirit and inspiration which is farre more vncertayne and perilous then the other all which is contrarie in the Catholyke Churche and in the way and meanes of tryal which she foloweth and consequentlie that the certayntie is farre different for securitie Furthermore the K. is sore vrged in this poynt of vncertaintie about disagreeing not onlie from the old Catholyke doctors of the primitiue Church but also from his owne the new yea those that first brought this later light of his religion yf it were light into the world as Luther zwinglius Caluyn and such others and he is demanded how he can dissent from theâ—e men as he doth in so great poynts of doctrine See before cap. 3.4.5 yet haue no certainty of beliefe seing these men were as learned as he and no lesse illuminated by his owne confession and yf they were deceyued in some poynts they might be in all c. From this curse of varietie and vncertaintie of doctryne and beliefe the warder passeth to an other no lesse markable brought in by change of old religion which is dissolution of lyfe and manners which protestants them-selues do not deny in their writings as before hath byn shewed The curse of euel lyfe Sup. cap 6. and yf they would the experience of England it selfe is sufficient for proofe and the warder declareth it by playne demonstration wherunto notwithstanding it seemed good to the K. to answere with deepe silence not so much as muttâ—ring any one thing for his defence so as heere I would thanke him as S. Augustine in a like case thanked Faustus the Manichie Aug. contra Faust. manich lib. 2. in fine Gratiae tibi agende sunt vbi nonnulla sic vidisti te refutare non posse vt ea malles summo silentio praeteriri Yow are to be thanked in that yow saw and therby confessed some things in my book to be so vnanswerable as yow choose rather to passe them ouer with deepe silence then to say any thing vnto them Then foloweth in the ward-word another treatise of temporal effectes by change of religion which he reduceth also to two heads First what was liklie to haue fallen out if this change of religion had not bene made in her Ma ties tyme and then what hath ensued vpon the said change and for the first he handleth eyght poyntes liklie to haue folowed 1. The strength and felicitie her Ma tie should haue had by all liklihood through the vnion of her subiectes 2. The securitie therof ensuing 3. Maryage and noble yssue of her Ma ties body 4. The establishment of succession 5. Vnion with Rome and sea Apostolyke 6. Ancient leagues with forayne Princes mainteyned 7. much bloody warre in our neighbors kingdomes had byn auoyded 8. diuers important damages and peryls at home by aâ—l liklihood had neuer rysen all which great felicities hauing beene eyther lost by change of religion or greatlie weakned and put in daunger he sheweth further that the contrarie effectes of curses calamities haue or may ensue therby and hauing layd them foorth he finally concludeth thus All these inconueniences and calamities had byn auoyded Pag. 1â— 4 or the most of them if chaÌ„ge of Religion in England had not byn made so that the innumerable benedâ—ctâ—ons which this poore man would neads threape vpon vs by that change do come to be in effect
te prolatam in qua non author esse debes sed custos non institutor sed sectator non ducens sed sequens c. This pawne or pledge is a thing geuen yow in credit and not inuented by yow a thing which yow haue receyued and not deuised a matter not of wit but of doctrine not of pryuate vsurpation but of publyke tradition a thing brought downe vnto yow not brought forth first by yow a thing wherof yow must not be author but keep only not the fownder but a follower not a leader but one that is led Thus sayth he of the rule of faith in his tyme which rule also serueth vs no lesse at this day against all sorte of protestants then it did them at that tyme against their aduersaryes but rather much more for that our prescription of this rule is by many hundred yeares elder then theirs was and so this shal suffise about this matter of the Ecclesiastical rule of fayth what yt was and what the auncient Fathers did thinke and esteeme therof and now we wil examine a litle what styrre the minister maketh about his goodly rule of the present particular Churche of England OF THE ENGLISH rule of beliefe set downe by O. E. And what substaÌ„ce or certaintie it hath how they doo vse it for excluding Puritanes other Protostantes and of diuers shameful shifts of O. E. CAP. XVI NOTHING is more true in that kynd then the saying of the philosopher A â—ift lib. 1. Phis. Contraria iuxta se posita clarius elucescunt That contraryes being layd togeather do make each other better seene and vnderstood as a ragged garment layd by another that is fayre and pretious maketh the ragges and patches more euident and contemtible and euen so this ridiculous new deuised rule of O. E. if we compare it with the former auncient rule commended vnto vs by the old holie fathers we shal see more perspicuously the vanitie therof for that he sayth Pag. 19. As for our selues that is the Protestants of England all of vs professe the doctrine of Iesus Christ according to that rule that was established by the common consent of England and whosoeuer doth digresse from this is not of our societie c. But here I would aske him what rule this is and in what yeare it was established by whom and how many and what authoritie they had to establish or to make any new rule from the old receyued before in matters of religion See the statutis anno Henr. 8.25 c. 14. an 26. cap. 1. an 27. c. 15 19. an 31. ca. 14. an 34. 35. cap 1. for yf he speake of K. Henry the 8. his dayes when the first chaunges beganne and when diuers new rules were set downe in parlament with this expresse commendation that they were taken out of the pure and syncere only woord of God I doo not think that O. E. wil admit them or stand vnto them though Iohn Fox do hold all that tyme of K. Henrie his mutations after his breach with the Churche of Rome for the tyme of the ghospel and so doth terme it euery where In K. Edward dayes also he being head of the Churche An 1. Ed c. 1.2 11. an 2. 3. cap. 1.21.23 though but 9. yeares old there was two or three new rules made and altered about matters of religion and their communion book all pretended out of the word of God with reuocation of that which K. Henry the Father and his Parlaments out of the same woord had appoynted before which rule also vnder K. Edward I do not know whether our ProtestaÌ„ts wil allow in all poyntes now but sure I am our Puritanes do not nor wil not as appeareth by theire owne bookes what assurance then is there in this mutable and controuerted rule of so fewe yeares in age But the most important question is who and what men and by what authoritie they made this rule The Warder knew no other when he writ but the Lords of the ParlameÌ„t and so called it parlament religion wherwith O. E. is very angry Pag. 19. and sayth where he calleth our religion parlament religion he speaketh like himselfe that is falsly and slaunderously for albeit the same be receyued by authoritie of the Prince state yet is it Christs reâ—igion and not the Princes Soone spoken but how doth he proue it here is styl that old shifte of petiâ—io principij hissed out by learned men which consisteth in setting downe that for a principle which most needeth proof as heere where our minister wil needs haue his religion to be Christs religion whether we wil or no and that it was but receyued and promulgated only by the parlament but then must I aske him agayne what authoritie besydes the parlament hath determyned it to be Christs religion as also that the Puritans religion is not Christs religion notwithstanding they pretend Christ and his Apostles no lesse then doth the protestant and then if we fynd that the only authoritie that defyneth this matter is the Parlament allowing the one and condemning the other for that scriptures of themselues can not do it quia actiones sunt suppositorum as a litle after he vrgeth and then must needs the credit truth of English religion depend of the parlament and therof worthelie be called Parlament religion But harken good reader what an example he hath found to auoyd An example making against himself that his religion may not be called Parlament religion The Emperors Gratian Valentinian and Theodâ—sius decreed sayth he that all people of their gouernment should hold the doctryne of Peter the Apostle Pag. 19. taught by Damasus bishop of Rome and Peter bishop of â—lexandria that they should beleeue one God and three persons yet I hope this Noddy wil not cal the fayth of the Trinitie an imperial fayth See this haÌ„dled more largely before in the annâ—t vpon the letter of O. â— to the reader c. Yes surelie Syr Noddy-maker I would cal and proue it so if the case were like that is if these three Emperors had determined this fayth as of theÌ„selues and by their imperial authoritie and that it had byn a different beliefe from the rule of fayth receyued before throughout Christendome as your parlament religioÌ„ was and is hauing no other ecclesiastical Authoritie â—or her establishment but only the authoritie of your Prince and parlament which defyned it to be trew religion and coÌ„forme to the word of God and determined that the other which was there before in vse to wit the Catholike to be opposite and contrarie to thesaid word and therfore to be abolished so as the allowance of the one and reprobation of the other proceeded from the parlament But the proceeding of the foresaid three Emperors in this their alleaged decree was farre otherwise which O.E. if he had had any more wit then a Noddy would neuer
diuersity of religion in England hath byn cause of the warres and tumults round about vs which yet Fraunce Flaunders and Scotland do testifie how true or false it is or that any doleful alteratioÌ„s haue byn made at home which he saith is lyke that the warder â—eemeth to haue byn hired to speak in a lamentable voice and to shed some few teares for compassion of the domages receyued both by cleargy and nobility and the deathes of so many Priests as haue byn executed for religion which he with a loÌ„g ydle discourse wil needs goe about to prooue that they were truly traytors both by our common ciuil and imperial lawes But this extrauagant excursion of his about those late martyrs I am to answere afterward more at large in his new chalenge wheras he maketh this one of his articles that our Priests dy not for religion but for treason And albeit future ages wil be more indifferent iudges in this matter as more free from passion therin yet to vnderstand better the state of the question I would aske of this wyse states-man lawyer as he maketh him-selfe who both heere and euery where els calleth me noddy whether yt be lawful to all sâ—ates hauing taken to them-selues a forme of religion to make any articles of the opposite religion matters of trâ—ason And whether yt had byn lawful to Catholyks in Q. Maries dayes so to haue done against protestants and whether the treasons so made be true and properly treasons and the offenders rightly to be called traytors And when he hath answered me this VVhether our Priests be traytors or martyrs and I shal haue prooued to him out of their owne wryters and chroniclers as I can and by their owne publyke records that this is the state of our question with them that many or most of our Priests haue byn executed only for those articles of treason that were so made then wil yt be easy to iudge and discerne what kynd of traytors they are who for those transgressions haue byn put to death and executed Then wil all this vayne fellowes babling out of books of imperial and comon lawes about treasons of other kynds be quite cut of and proued childish and to no purpose Wherfore to draw at length to an end of this Encounter I doubt not good Readers but thow doest see by thy wisdome how not-with-standing the double reply made by the K â— and minister the warders discourse about these blessings and curssings remayneth yet whole and firme And albeit the minister hath brought more words theÌ„ the K t. yet no more substance but rather lesse and both of them much fraud and folly as in the admonition following in part shal appeare THE VVARNING and admonition to Sir F. H. and his frendes as also to his aduocate proctor O. E. vpon the first Encounter of blessings CHAP. XIX AND now for the conclusion of this Encounter I think is not amisse to the end that this my answere and reioynder which I call a Warn-word may do his duty and performe so much as the name and title importeth I am to bestow vpon the K t. in this place a breife and frendly admonition or warning wherby he may him-self yf passion wil suffer him to see the truth or others at least wayes that are more indifferent lesse passionate in the cause then he coÌ„sider the difference of our manner of proceeding in this affayre to wit the plaine and round dealing on our side going directly to the matter and the shifting and shufling on his to auoyde due trial and how that with no probability of reason or truth can he stand in the controuersy taken in hand of his blessings brought in by change of religioÌ„ his defence wherof is so impertinent false and from the matter as before yow haue seene yet for better memories sake and for some aduertisment to the K t. to look ouer his owne faults I shal breefly heere put him in mynd of that which hath passed in this Encounter First the charge of notorious flattery in bragging of so many blessings come to England by change of religion seemeth to ly stil vpon him more heauy then before for that he hath answered substantially to noe one argument of his aduersary to the contrary and the shift of passing ouer whole treateses and discourses of the warder yea foure or fiue as is prooued without any reply or mention Cap. 1â— argueth great weaknes in his cause The other shift also of excusing his flattery by the flattery of Canonists yf it were true is very vayne and ridiculous The new ten deuised blessings are such so poore Nevv deuised blessings as noe man would haue brought them in but he that eyther for lack of iudgment decerneth not what is for him nor what is against him or whome necessity forceth to expose him-selfe to the laughter of all men For who wil not laught to see vnity brought in for a blessing among protestants that cold neuer yet agree in the poynts of their religion nor euer wil or can and whose badge of dissension and disagreement is so notorious aboue all other heretyks before them Vid. cap. 3. â— 5. 6. Who wil not laugh also and bite his lip to see good woorks abstayning from persecution assigned for two other peculiar blessings considering what passeth in England and what in other countreys I passe our the rest as false or foolish or both vntil I come to the tenth that is copious generation of children which in respect of the marriage of their friars monks ministers we yeild vnto them but deny it to be a blessing especially to those parishes that by force are coÌ„strayned to maintayne their copious brood of spring to this I cal to witnesse the Churche-wardens parishioners This then is folly to bring in such sorts and sutes of blessings as euery chyld may see there vanity and laugh at them But that which ensueth of frauâ— fleights and deceyts is farre worse Variety of shifts which may be discouered by the variety of shifts noted in his whole discourse as namely that which was last recyted of passing ouer and dissembling all his aduersaryes principal arguments reasons allegations without mention at all or els mentioning them only in a word or two without further answere in lyke manner his not quoting places of books or chapters of the authors which he cyteth when he wil deceaue is a new trick neuer vsed perhaps before by any that hath written of controuersies though the other of misalleadging corrupting peruerting forcing them against their owne expresse meaning hath I grant byn vsed by diuers and cheefly by the patrons and grandsyres of English protestancy Vid. cap. 9. 10. Iewel and Fox whome this man principally followeth but yet so as he out goeth his maister yf it may be in that art as by the examples alleadged before of abusing S. Hierome S. Augustine S.
Angels or no Cap. 6. num 6. num 8. Whether the name of Lucifugi scripturarum or scripture-battes vsed by Tertullian do properly agree to protestants or Catholyks Cap. 6. num 24.25.26 c. Whether ignorance be held by Catholyks to be the mother of deuotion Cap. 7. num 1.2 c. Whether ignorance in some points coÌ„cerning religion may in some people be comendable and meritorious as S. Hilary saith or no ibid cap. 8. num 3. Whether the distinction of fides implicita and explicita be a true necessary distinction for the saluation of many mennes soules which caÌ„not possibly be saued wiâ—hout the vse thereof Cap 7. num 6. Whether it be true that Catholyks teach that laymen must not medle in matters of Religion and how farre they are to medle Cap. â— Why the Cath. Churche doth vse Index expurgatorius against the corruption of heretyks and their books how it must be vsed and what great good ensueth therof Cap. 9. num 23.24 c. Whether S. Thomas of Canterbury were a true martyr and of his miracles Cap. 10. 11. Whether his case were lyke the case of S. Iohn Bapt. with his King or of S. Ambrose with his Emperor or no Cap. 10. Whether the miracles wrought by S. Thomas of Canterbury after his death were true miracles and did proue him a Saint or no. Cap. 11. Which is the better spirit and more conforme to scripture and the old fathers to beleeue easily miracles or to discredit them cap. 11. num 19. How true saints may be knowen and whether Fox-made saincts or Pope-made Saints as S.F. calleth them are more substantially Canonized Cap. 11. num 15.16 c. Whether Catholyks do hold that the Pope or any comming from him is to be obeyed though he commauÌ„d blasphemies Cap. 12. 13. Whether the merits and sufferings of Saints may be lawfully mentioned in our prayers as motiues to mooue God with all Cap. 12. Whether no man may say to the Pope vvhy do yovv so though he lead infinite soules to hel as O. E. cauilleth Cap. 13. num 17.18 c. Whether Catholyks do vse the Popes pardons for their cheefest remedies against all sort of sinnes as heretyks do accuse them Cap. 14. In what degree or sense pardons are auaileable to Christians ibid. num 8. cap. 15. num 1.2.3 c. Whether Iames Clement that slue the last K. of France were absolued for the fact before the committing therof Cap. 15. Whether it be true that K. Iohn of England was poysoned by a monk or that the monk was absolued for the same before he comitted the fact as Iohn Fox and S.F. do hold cap. 15. num 4.5 c. Whether the doctrine of saluation by only faith be a common cartway to hel for all libertines or no cap. 16. The third and fourth Tables as wel of shiftes and wilful falsifications by Syr Francis and O. E. as of the principal matters conteyned in these two Encounters are to be seene in the end of the book AN ANSVVER TO A CERTAYNE VAYNE AND ARROGANT EPISTLE OF O. E. minister vnto N. D. author of the Ward-word SMall contentment geÌ„tle reader can any Christian modest man take that hauing to handle a graue serious cause seeth himselfe drawne or rather driuen from thesame to contention of wordes by the insolencie and importunitie of his quarrelling aduersarie 2. Tim. 2. which teÌ„deth to nothing as the Apostle also noteth but to the subuersion of the hearer and yet when we are forced to this disorder somwhat also must be sayd least silence in speach shew diffidence in truth and that a foole as the Scripture insinuateth if he be not answered in his folly begin to thinke himself wyse Prouerb 26. We haue signifyed before in our preface how a certayne contentious minister desyrous to be doing and to play a parte but yet not without a visard in respect of the follyes perhaps he was to vtter resolued to mask and cypher his name vnder the letters of O. E. and then hauing pervsed the reply of S. FraÌ„cis Hastings to the Ward-word and misliking as it seemeth the same as insufficient he bâ—ckled himselfe to make in his owne opinion a better defence though in other mens iudgment of two bad this is farre the worse both in respâ—ct of the substance of matters and controuersies handled wherof this man treateth no one groundedlie any where but only quarrelleth at the words and sentences of his aduersarie as also in regard of his outragious intemperate speach which runneth alâ—o oftentymes both to turpitude scurrilitie the reason wherof we thinke to be in parte for that the minister perswading himselfe to be masked presumeth to vtter any tâ—ing as vnknowne and I am content for this tyme to let him so passe though in deed his deportment be such against all kynd of Catholique men neuer so learned vertuous worshipful or honorable as no way he deserueth any such fauour and that I could dismaske him he may perceyue by diuers poynts which afterward I shal haue occasion to touch Now â—hen letting passe this we shal looke into the argument of this present Epistle of O.E. to N.D. which yow shal see to consist of three principal poynts Tâ—â—e poynts of â—his Epistle to wit notorious folly apparant falshood ridiculous vanitie in bragging vauÌ„ting let vs see them all in order This Epistle prefixed before his booke hath this inscription To N. D. alâ—as Noddie O. E. vvisheth knovvledge of truth c. and then beginneth he his Epistle thus Sir N.D. or Noddie or hovvsoeuer it shal please yovv to style your selfe being a man but of tvvo or three letters c. Heeâ—e yow see beginneth a graue contention betweene O. E. and N. D. about the worde Noddie which none but a Noddy in my opinion would euer haue brought into examination especially in print â—or that N. D. being but consonants and hauing no sound of their owne cannot make Noddie excâ—pt yow ad the sound of O.E. vnto them that are vowels to geue lyfe vnto the word wherof it foloweth that seing consonants are but the material parte of a worde and vowels the formal O. â— must needs be the formal Noddie and that N.D. doth but lend him a coople of consonants to make him a Noddie and thus much for the name it selfe But as for the nature and essence of a Noddie to which of the two it doth best agree shal appeare afterward in the discussion of matters throughout this whole combat and one poynt of a Noddie yow may presentlie perceaue in these verie words alleadged wheras O.E. obiected to N.D. that he is a man but of two or three letters which is answered sufficientlie by numbring onlie how many letters O. E. do make and so agayne afterward and verie often in his repliâ— he obiecteth to N. D. that he durst not put downe his name at length which yet himselfe being at home vpon his owne ground and among
daungerous fishing it may be presumed he liked wel inoughe the matter though perhaps not the manner and so til a new captayne be found the enterprise mustly raked vp in the ashes and out cryes be giuen againe against Catholykes as the only men that by peace vnion and pacification do seeke the ruyne both of Church and common wealth But this arte now is vndeâ—stood so I doubt not but it wil be considered of accordingly by her Ma tie and her wise councel whatsoeuer false allarme or sayned counter-word the sentinels of the aduerse part do giue out for their commodytie And this is sufficient for a warn-word in this affayre The rest that followeth in his Epistle is of no moment vntil he come to delight himselfe somwhat with a certayne fensing allusion to the title of the ward-word saying I doubt not but so to breake the strength of all your cheefe wards for all your fensing skil as to leaue yow at length to your hanging ward The hanging vvardâ— Ibid. Pag 4. which prooueth alwayes a daungerous ward yf it be sharply followed by the assaylant Lo heer threates that go before arguments wherin I confesse both him and his to be very eager and sharpe assaylants and that no fencers nor swashbucklers nor cutters as they cal them of Queene hiue or other kilcowes could euer follow the fray more sharpely vpon Catholikes then he and Topclif and such other haue done for these many yeares by hanging so many Priests and other seruaÌ„ts of Christ that haue rested vpon this hanging ward of patience and suffering for ancient religion which ward yet hath prooued much more glorious then dangerous to them their hope and assurance depending of the promise inuiolable of their Captaine and Master assuring them vpon his honour and power that no one heare of their head shal perish which they haue seene performed in all former suffering and martyrdomes for the same cause and so do hope it wil be in theÌ„ for which respect they coÌ„temne easily whatsoeuer the malice of maÌ„ can worke against theÌ„ And so Sir your bloody iest of haÌ„ging ward returneth to yow againe without applause of any that hath feeling of piety or humanity There followeth further in his epistle The violence saith he of the Puritane spirite is added by â—â—m the wardeâ— â—or a reason why he is prouoked by me by which words for all his differeÌ„ce made betwene Protestant and Puritane both of them are apparantly knowne to proâ—esse Christ Iesus crucified in religion c. â— F. vvil not tel vvhether he be a Puritane or noe Here is first to be noted that our K. by no meanes can be forced throughout all his whole book to declare himselfe cleerly whether he be of the Puritan faction or no only in this place he would fayne deny as yow see all difference of those names professioÌ„s which being ridiculous to all English euen children that know the contrary and I am to shew it largely afterward in the very first EncouÌ„ter * Cap. â— yet he blusheth not to deny it heer yea further he endeauoreth to proue yt by a strong demonstration saying that both of them do professe Christ Iesus crucified in religion But graunt that Christ be crucified againe in their religion and that both protestant and puritan do conspire therin is this sufficient to proue them both to be of one religion And do not all the Anabaptists Trinitarians and other sectaryes of our tyme confesse the same that is Christ to haue byn Crucified also in their religion Yea all the old heretikes except only such as denyed the manhood of Christ did confesse Christ crucified And we Catholykes in like maner whome yet he reiecteth as most opposite to him and his do we not professe that Christ was crucified how then is this agreement in Christ Iesus Crucified brought in for a sufficient argument of their vnity in beleefe and Doctrine A foolish argument of agreemeÌ„t betvvene Protestants Puritans Consider good reader what notable arguments yow are like to haue in the rearward and rest of his book seing these and other like are put in the vauntgard There ensueth yet further in his epistle This encounâ—ereâ— saith he seemeth to glory that the yeares of her Ma â—â—â— grow on fastâ— but the God of mercy I trust wil prolong her daâ—es Pag 5. Ibid. to the holding out stil of the Popes vsurped authority c. Heere are two apparant abuses Calumniation and flattery calumniation and flattery calumniation in that the Encounterer nameth not her Ma â—eâ— many yeares by way of vaunt but by way of sorrow and compassion to the Realme comon-welth The flattery consisteth in that the K. wil needes persuade her Ma tâ—e of holding out stil which as euery man desyreth to be long yet this stil is so grosse and palpable a flattery as no man of iudgment and grauity can but scorne him for yt especially since the Essexian assault which may be presumed would haue abbreuiated this stil yf it had preuayled if not in the Earles own intention yet in many other of the puritan hot brotherhood that egged him on to this attempt A litle after when I persuade to vnion of hartes and good willes in England by tolleration and mittigation in matters of religion he as though there were no need therof answereth thus As for his vnity yf yt be vnity in verytie as his is not no Christian man can or wil refuse that Pag. 7. but praise God for that and yf our vnthankefulnes bereaue vs not of yt we enioy that already by vnder her Ma â—â—â— with great comfort Heere yf by we he vnderstand all his new gospel brethren to wit Lutherans Suinglians English Protestants and Puritans as in the rest of his booke he holdeth them for true brethreÌ„ then how this we do agree in vnity of verity all men that haue eares or eyes do heare see which matter yet shal be examined more largely in the first Encounter * cap. 3.4 5. 6. following where our knight doth assigne it for the first and most special blessing of their religion to haue this good vnity in verity amonge them But in the meane space for that he doth seeme to restrayne his speech somwhat in this place to EnglaÌ„d alone by saying that they enioy it already by and vnder her Ma tie it is not hard to see or iudge what vnity in verity there is betwene protestants and Puritans at home Comfort of protestants and puritans See the book named the suâ—uâ—y of preteÌ„ded â—oly discipline and how comfortable a matter it is to the Puritane party to be restrayned by her Ma tie and her Bishops as they bee to exterior vnity with the Protestants for to the interior no force wil preuayle and what great and singular ioy they take therof yt appereth in part by their seueral bookes of heauy complaynts about this matter L. Daungeâ—rous
and partaker of his golden purposes As for that which foloweth of recusant Catholikes that they do enioy their lands goods country and libertie notvvithstanding they are secretlie reconciled to the Pope and do adhere to her Maiesties enemyes as by a marginal note he sayth doth appeare by diuers letters of priests ready to be shevved Catholykes enioying their goodes and libertie for there enioying I would the ministers ioy were not greater in his benefices and then I doubt not but he would be more calme then now he is his hawty wyues hayre would soone grow through her french veluet hood but for their adhering to enemyes testified as he sayth by Priests letters we haue as litle reason to beleeue him against Priests not shewing their letters as they should haue to write any such vntruth which we beleeue not but take it as a stratageme deuised to set vs at diuision among our selues The whole discourse next ensuing is so bitter spiteful so ful of gore blood poyson as it needeth his visour of O. E. to vtter thesame for that the cunning compagnion though he be content to fawne and flatter be knowne vnderhand therby to gather vp some morsels for the present yet fearing perhaps somwhat the future and considering that both tymes and matters and men may change he thought good to pâ—euent afterclaps by couering his true name and to purchase securitie for tyme to come with the losse or diminishment of some prayse present And therfore walking out of sight in this behalf he playeth egregiouslie the syrebrand telling her Maiestie and her counsel O.E.A. notorious fyrebrand of sedition that too much extraordinarie fauour and remissnes tovvards Catholikes hath caused diuers rebellions both in England and Ireland and that it hath dissolued the very synevves of gouernment that it is more profitable and expedient to excute lavves then to pardon offenders c. All which this sycophaÌ„t chaunted out lustely at that very tyme and season to fil vp her Maiesties eares when his Lord and yong king Essex was most busy in plotting her Maiesties ouerthrow vnder pretence of meeting at puritane sermons and seing that this plot was layd in Ireland from whence this minister vnder pretence of running away for feare of punishment of some vntemperate words spoken came into England not long before his maister as heere is reported it may be he came about this negotiation and fearing least it might be discouered before due tyme he took in hand to write this book of all-arme against Catholikes to disguyse and shadow the other A treacherous deuise and to diuert mens eyes another way but for this let her Maiesties wyse counsel looke vnto and prouide as they shal fynd need I am only to proceed in refuting of his malice and folly let them punish his treacherie and knauery if they fynd it After his spite is spit ouâ— against the Catholikes he cometh to aduauÌ„ce highlie Sir F. Hastings wach-word Bragging of Sir F. book and sayth that the good knight of a zealous mynd tovvards religion gâ—ueth the vvord to his countrimen And I say N.D. giueth the Ward and who geueth or receyueth most venewes let our countrymen be iudges as they may also of this champion his successe who seing his good knight dryuen to the wal with more hast then good speed cometh running to his succour receauing for his gaine the first broken head as wrangling sticlers ar wont to do and so I suppose yow wil say also when ye see al that passeth Yet doth he with a conâ—ident interrogation commend vnto vs the whole worke saying vvhat one sentence in all the vvhole discourse can be noted vnvvorthy eyther a true Christian or a loyal subiect or a vvorthy knight wherto I answere that there wil so many sentences be found in the treatise folowing vnworthy of al three poyntes mentyoned to wit Christianitie loyaltie and chiualry as if this worthy champion can defend them he wil shew him selfe worthie to be knighted also and to haue a K. for the first letter of his title But to returne agayne to the prosecution of this mans inuectiue against Catholikes their liues honours liberty and goods all which he impugneth at one tyme and for some florish and shew of proof he alleageth first certayne examples of Scripture where kings of Iuda were reprehended for permitting vnlauful woorship and then out of the old Roman lawes recounted dy Cicero and Vlpian â— Reg. 1â— â— Paral. â—3 Cicero lib. 3. de legâ— bus Vlpian l. quo ties ff de poeâ—is which do prescribe diuers kyndes of punishments for malefactors and â—hirdly out of the lawes of ancient Christian Empâ—rors that willed heretikes to be punished and with this thinketh that he hath proued very substantialâ—y that Catholike men also may must be puniâ—â—ed in England But thus to reason at randome is much like to boyes argumenting in Sophistry Petrus iacet in lectulo ergo hâ—â—ulus siat in angulo these examples haue no affinity or coherence with our cause but only so much as they make against this Noddy His argumeÌ„t against him â—elfe and for vs for if old Roman lawes do gyue general authority to the body of the common wealth to punish particular offencers non è contra as Cicero signifieth in his booke de legibus then foloweth it in good reason that the Catholike christian churche being the vniuersal body of Christs common wealth vpon earth hath authoritie to punish ProtestaÌ„ts Puritanes Lutherans Arrians or any other sect that doth or shal aryse but not that theâ—e haue authoritie or may haue to punish the other for matter of religion though they sâ—ould get superiority of temporal power in any place of the world for that they are but particuler men and members of members at all and the other the body and true common wealth to whom only it appertayneth to punish And leâ— * O. â— Oules eie but sâ—ewe me one example from the beginning of Christendome that euer any man or woman in any age was punished as an heretike by the Christian common wealth for sticking to the religion of the Pope of Rome and it shal be sufficient for all I aske but one example out of all antiquitie As for the examples alleaged by him of Asa and Manasses kings of Iuda who notwithstanding 3. Reg. 15. 2 Paral. 33. Idolatrous vvorâ—hip on hils among the levves out of the Temple pre-figured heresves among Christians Hierem. in c. â— Amos in c. 12. O see Aux de vriâ—â—tate ieiunâ— cap. â— Deutt â—3 Aug. de ciuit Dei l. 1â— cap 51. Cypr. lib. de vn Eccl. Hier. in cap. â— Ezech. in c 1â— Osee in c. 1â— Zach. in c. 8. â— an Aug. enarrat in Psalm â—0 part â—9 sup lib Iosue cap. 27. their other good zeale did not remooue the vnlawful seruice and sacrifice accustomed on hils and high places they make nothing against vs but
do follow the prophane peruersitie of Eutiches condemned in the late Councel gathered at Calcedon and do not so beleeue in all poyntes of fayth as the 318. holy Fathers of the Nicene Councel VVho are heretykes by the sentence of auncieÌ„t Christian Emperors An Domini 457. and as the 150. venerable Bishops gathered together in the Councel of Constantinople or the other two councels folowing of Ephesus or Calcedon sciant se eâ—ie haereticos c. let them know that they are heretikes This decree made Valentinian and Martian Emperors of the east and west nyne and twenty yeares after the former decree And the like made the Emperor Maximilian after the late Councel of Trent against all kynd of Protestants LutheraÌ„s ZuingliaÌ„s Anabaptists Caluinists and the like condemned by the said Councel so as the same reason that moued Valentinian and Marcian almost 1200. yeares agoe to proclame them heretiques that were condemned by the Councel of Calcedon in their dayes wherin Leo primus B. of Rome had the chiefe hand and confirmed the same The same I say moued Maximilian the Emperor of our dayes to proclame for heretiques all protestants condemned in the Councel of Trent gathered in his tyme by like authoritie as that of Calcedon was but yet let vs see one deduction furder Of what religion think yow were these Emperors that made these lawes against those heretikes or what communion were they of for by this we shal see who they were whom they condemned Did these Emperors then agree with the Church and religion of Rome and acknowledged that for the cheefe and head church of Christianity and the Bishops therof to be head Pastors For if they did then condemned they such as did not the same then or do not thesame now This poynt then let vs explayne good reader and therby also learne the sutle shifting of this shuffling Minister Truly the first decree of al Iustinians Code which is a collection of all Christian Emperors decrees being of Gratian The religion of Gratian Valentinian Theodosius Valentinian and Theodosius whose first words are Cunctos populos c. Doth appoynt and command all Christian people both of the Roman and Greeke Empyre to follow the fayth and religion of the Roman Church deliuered to them by S. Peter and continued vnto that day which say they Damasus the Bishop of that Citty doth follow as also Peter Bishop of Alexandria whosoeuer did not follow this vnity of Religion should be counted infamous heretikes This is the substance of that first decree which being so tel me now if this doth touch our protestants or no who can abyde neyther Roman B. nor Roman Religion Thesame three Emperors in an other Decree do describe vnto vs what manner of heretikes they would haue punished Leg. omnes de haerer lib. â— Coâ— tit 5. in these words Haereticorum vocabulo continentur latis aduersus eos sanctionibus debents succumbere qui vel leui argumento à iudicio Catholicae religionis tramite detecti fuerint deuiare VVho are truly heretiâ—es Those are heere called heretiques and to be punished by our lawes made against them whosoeuer shal be detected to dissent and disagree euen in any smal matter from the iudgment and path of Catholike religion Thus say they And seing in their first Decree they do declare that the Roman religion vnder Pope Damasus was the only Catholike religion to be folowed it is easely seene whether Protestants or Papists at this day be comprehended vnder these penal lawes made against heretikes or no And finally that we may see by one Emperors playne decree what religion they were of and of what society and communion and whom they accompted true Catholikes and whom heretikes yow must know that in the fore-said Code of Iustinian there is a letter of Iohn the first B. of Rome written to the said Emperor Iustinian whose tytle is this Gloriosissimo clementâ—ssimo filio Iustiniano Ioannes Episcopus vrbis Romae c. wherein among other prayses which the Pope geueth him one principal was that notwithstanding he was Emperour of Constantinople and that some emulation now began in that Empyre against the Citty of Rome yet he persisted in his Catholike due obedience to the said Church of Rome head of all other Churches amore fidei sayth he chaeritatis studio Cod. lib. 1. leg inter claras tit â— edocti Ecc is disciplinis Romanae sedis reuerentiam conseruatis ei cuncta subijcitis ad eius deducitis vnitatem ad cuius authorem hocest Apostolorum primum Domino loquente praeceptum est pasce oues meas quam esse omnium verè Ecclesiarum caput Patrum regulae principum statuta declarant pietatis vestrae reuerendissimi testantur affatus c. Yow being moued by the loue of faith studie of charitie wel instructed in the discipline of the Church do continue your reuerence to the Roman sea and do subiect all other therunto bringing them to the vnity of this Churche to whose fouÌ„der the first of all the Apostles Christ gaue this precept feed my sheepe which Churche as wel the rules 10.21 and traditions of ancient Fathers as the decrees of former Christian Princes haue declared to be truly the head of all other Churches And the same do testifie your Maiesties most reuerent speeches and behauiour towards the same This wrote the Pope to him which letter he putting into his said Code or book of Statutes as a most honorable monument answered the same and made a decree theron which beginneth thus Victor Iustinus pius faelix Imperator c. Ioanni S mo Archiepiscopo Alme Vrbis Romae Cod. ibid. leg nos reddentes lib. 1. tit 3. Patriarchae c. Nos reddentes honorem Apostolica sedi vestri Sanctitati c. We rendering due honor to the sea Apostolike and to your Holinesse which alwayes we haue desyred as becometh to a Father we haue endeauored in honour of your beatitude to bring to the knowledge of your Holines all things that do appertayne to the state of all Churches for that it hath byn alwayes our study to keepe and conserue the vnity of your Apostolike sea and of the holy Churches of God which vnity hath alwayes hitherto perseuered immouable without any contrariety and consequentlie we haue byn careful to subiect and vnite all priests of the whole east couÌ„tryes to the sea of your Holines Thus beginneth he his decree which is ouer loÌ„g to be here all inserted but any man may read it wherin the Emperor with great humility and affection professeth his due subiection and of al his Empyre to the Church of Rome naming her in expresse wordes Caput omnium Ecclesiarum head of all other Churches and that whatsoeuer doctryne is different from the doctryne of this Church is heretical by which rule he condemneth for heretikes in this and in two other that follow immediatly and
are extant in the Code both in Greeke and Latyn Nestorius Leg. eum recta â—eruâ—torem ibid. Euthichâ—s Apollinaris as dissenting from the Roman Church and Bishops therof Now then let the reader iudge whether these lawes of the Emperors made against heretikes do touch vs or protestants And so much of this second poynt The third poynt also touching S. Augustine his approuing S. Augustin alleaged by O. E. against himself and commending much these Emperors for punishing heresyes for making lawes against heretikes is altogither for vs in like manner and fully against protestants August lib. 1. contr Ep. Parmâ—n cap. 6. 10. ep 62. 166. Aug. ep 4â— ad Vincent for that S. Augustine dealing specially in this pointe against the Donatists Circumcellians who denyed the visible Church dispersed ouer the whole world and restrayned it to their sect only in Africa as euery sect of our Protestants doth at this day to the particuler place and Society where they liue it is easely seene who were heretikes and who to be punished by S. Augustines opinion to wit those that do rise vp against the vniuersal knowne and visible Church of their tyme do condemne it or are condemned by it and let Sir minister bring but one example to the contrarie in any age from Christ to Luther and it shal be sufficient to wit that any man condemned by the general knowne and visible Church of his tyme for an heretike was not held and taken for such by any of that tyme or any tyme after that was not an heretike himselfe let Oules eie I say spie but one exaÌ„ple of this out of all antiquitie and it shal be sufficieÌ„t Wherfore to end all his matter about Imperial lawes for punishing of heretikes and approuing therof both by the Apostle and by S. Augustine which yet other Protestants hitherto did neuer vrge as this witles minister doth let the reader marke this firme deduction and playne demonstration all those foresaid Christian and Catholike Emperors so much comended by S. Augustine and other Fathers following after him to wit Gratian Valentinian Theodosius Marcian Arcadius Honorius Iustinian and others A manifest deduction demonstration against nevv sectaties that made lawes against heretikes they held the Roman religion in their dayes to be the Catholike and true Christian religion though diuers of them were of the Greeke Church and Empyre They professed the Bishops of Rome to be the heads and cheife leaders of this vniuersal and visible Catholike Church as before hath byn shewed by the example of Gratian ValeÌ„tiniaÌ„ Theodosius to Pope Damasus of Arcadius Honorius Theodosius the second S. Augustine Pope Innocentius primus and of Iustinian to Pope Iohn the first and consequeÌ„tlie they pronounced for heretikes all those that did rise vp apart vnder particuler Authors differing in opinions from this vniuersal church as Arrians Donatists Montanists and the like This vniuersal visible and external Church hath endured euer since vnder Popes and Emperors and other gouernors of Christianitie vntil the tyme of Pope Leo the tenth and his successors and of Emperors Ferdinand Charles the fifth Maximilian and their followers when Luther began to brake out from that Church and against that Church and others following his example since that tyme. Now then I would aske by what equity or reason this later brood comming forth of this Church and rebelling against it can cal those men heretikes that remayned in the fayth of the foresaid Church and moreouer wil say that they must be punished by the same lawes that the foresaid Catholike Emperors made against those that impugned that Churche This I say I would haue our new Oedipus to answere and in the meane space the discrete reader may consider how it can be answered by him so blush for him that hath not byn ashamed to bring in so cleare a conuiction against himselfe One onely sillie shift or pettie cauil this minister perhaps may run vnto as dyuers of his fellowes are wont with a brasen affirming that the visible Catholike and Roman Church when Luther began was not the same that it was when those Emperors made those lawes but theÌ„ I would aske him when it changed and how and by what meanes so great a body so generally planted so strengthened and fortifyed not only by Gods spirite but also by learned men Doctors Councels in euery age could come to be changed and perish without testimony of any one wryter or historiographer without noyse coÌ„tention or contradiction of any The Emperors are knowne that liued and raigned in this meane space and except two or 3. as Leo the third called Isaurus and his sonne Constantine the fifth surnamed Capronius which fel into heresyes and were noted and condemned by the same Churche all the rest liued and dyed in one Religion of their ancestors The Popes also from Ioannes primus before mentyoned to whom Iustinian the Emperor wrote his decree vnto Leo decimus wheÌ„ Luther begaÌ„ne are in nuÌ„ber about 17c all of one religion nor can it be shewed that any one Pope impugned his predecessor in matters of fayth This demonstration is as cleare then as that 3. and 4. do make 7. for when Luther and Lutherans began their new sects A most â—leere palpable demoÌ„stration our Churche was held for the only Catholike and true Churche of christendome and so did both Luther Zuinglius and Caluin hold it also before they fel when the one was a Fryer the other two Priests and all three said Masse how then by their falling from it the said church should be made no church and their new congregations to be the only true Cathol Church and that they should come now to-call themselues Catholikes and vs heretikes and that we should be punished for heretikes by the former Imperial lawes made against themselues and their lyke this I say is a mysterie and metamorphosis that passeth the reach of all sober men and none but mad heads can eyther say it or beleeue it for that by the same argument may English Puritanes at this day which is a yonger brood of protestaÌ„ts as yow know in our country taking some port or towne in England fortifying themselues therin cal Parlament Protestants to account saying as they do that they are the elder church and that they wil punish parlament Protestants with the same Parlament lawes which Protestants made of purpose to punish them But I am ouerlong in a matter so cleare and therfore I craue pardon of thee good reader and wil here end and so much the rather for that I am to handle this poynt more at large afterward against O. E. in his new chalenge to wit who be heretikes and who be not for that he wil needs take vpon him to defend this mad desperate paradox that papists be heretikes protestants Catholikes but I think we shal shake him out of his clouts when he cometh to that combat
Encounter which is this that S ir F. H. being entred into a serious contemplation in the height of his careful watch ouer England and thinking to imitate perhaps herin the spirit of some hidden prophet whome he desired to resemble estemed it not only expedient but incident also to the vigilancy of the office of a general watchman taken vpon him by his owne election not by any mans coÌ„mission to forwarne the people not only of great and mighty fayned daungers hanging ouer them from Catholikes but also of innumerable new deuised blessings benefits and benedictions abounding among them and flowing to them daylie by the fortunate chaunge of ould religion into Protestancy The subiect of S F. book breaking forth into these words of fervour Pap. 2. Yf I should take vpon me to enter into the enumeration of all the beneâ—its and blessings that from the Almightie haue byn powred vpon this litle Isle of England c. And herevpon coÌ„cludeth that seing they had gotten so greatly already by the bargaine they should be merry and go forward and neuer thinke of returne c. and this was the beginning of his watch-word To which the Warder thinking it expedient to oppose himselfe VVard vvord taketh vp S. F. for a false and flattering Prophet by these wordes of Esay Esay 3. my people they that say thou art blessed are those that deceiue thee shewing further the great inconueniences hurts daungers damages and pernitious effects of such flattering tongues in common wealthes that himselfe doth contradict himselfe in this very poynt soone after talking nothing els but of feares frights and terrours by daungers and miseries imminent to our countrey A brag of blessings examined without specifying or setting downe to the coÌ„trary any one particular blessing at all comen hitherto to the realme or like to come by their new gospel but only feeding them with those general fayre words of fleering adulation which the warder holding for fond and contemptible in so manifest and important a matter reiecteth them without further answere And then passing on to the poynt it selfe more in particuler he reduceth all benefits and blessings that haue happened to England or can happeÌ„ vnto two general heads or branches that is spiritual touching religion and temporal concerning the common wealth and in both these kinds he sheweth by many weightie arguments that not blessings but cursings not benefits but calamityes haue are lyke to fal vpon our couÌ„try by this fatal vnfortunate change of Religion giuing manifest examples in both sortes and concludeth with a brief repetition of all and this is the summe of the warders answere to this first Encounter of imagined blessings But vpon this poynt replyeth now agayne the K. in this his Apology or defence A vayne reply by the Knight which vpon iust causes as yow shal see I haue termed a VVast-word and first of all he maketh a solemne florish by detesting all flattery and alleageth diuers sentences of sundry Poëts and Philosophers in despraise of flattery and then addeth that there is farre greater flattery in Rome to the Pope then he vseth in this place and further that there was no contradiction betwixt his words of present daungers now imminent to England and of former blessings by their ghospel receyued so as though England be not blessed at the present yet hath it byn heretofore and then letting passe all that euer the warder hath said in the examination of the foresaid two heads of spiritual teÌ„poral blessings he bringeth in ten new benedictions freshly framed out of the forge of his owne imagination to the supply of his former want assuring vs that they are proper fruits of his new ghospel ghospellers Ten nevv fresh blessings And that they haue ensued by the former change of religion which blessings benedictions he auoweth to be vnity of doctrine Liberty of reading Scriptures in vulgar languages Publique prayer in English exercise of good works more then beâ—ore freedome from persecution deliuerance from intolerable exactions long peace power in forrayne countryes wealth of the land multitude of subiects seuenfold increased since the beginning of this change of religion This is the summe of his Apologie to this Encounter VVarn-vvoâ—e replyeth our which cometh agayne the warneâ— now who before was only a warder as yow haue heard and besyds his wards warneth also the watchmaÌ„ of his wants in this his VVast-word shewing first that all his defence is but verbal and impertinent speach and consequently iustly termed by him a VVast-word for that to flatter and detest I flattery at one tyme is no defence or iust excuse of flattery but rather folly and impudency ioyned to flattery and that it litle easeth him or helpeth his cause if there should be so great flattery in Rome as he sayth seing that this iustifieth not nor authorizeth any flattery vsed by him in England that it is vayne and ridiculous to vaunt of blessings past and not present seing the present and future is that which importeth most and not that which is past and more ridiculous for that if they were true blessings which are past they were brought in and lefte by the old Catholique religion and if they be not now present it is for that the new religion hath lost them that the ten new felicityes now freshly deuised and brought in by the K. are neyther true in themselues nor in the nature of blessing but rather quite contrarie and others nothing pertinent to the purpose and diuers of them of no consideration at all but rather fond and contemptible mockeryes And finally that S r. F. his running out of the feild The Knight flyeth the true coÌ„bate and flying from all the wayes of tryal offred by the warder both about Spiritual and temporal blessings and cursings is a playne argument that he dareth not ioyne really and substantially in the combat but only to florish for fashion sake and to make a shew of skyrmishing in the ayer for holding vp his credit with the bare name of a new Apologie keeping himselfe warily notwithstaÌ„ding within his owne listes only and farre of from the true Encounter and running now and then when he is sore pressed behind the cloath of state that is to say protecting himselfe with the name authority of her Ma tie and of the present gouernment where all other arguments fayle him for his defence and this in general is the summe of all this Encounter with the K. Now must we come to examine what his Minister champion or martial procter O. E. hath brought in his supply coming foorth after the other And first in general I must say in his prayse and commendation The argumeÌ„t and summe of O. E. his â—nsvvere that he is farre more impertinent impudent and impotent in his wryting rayling then is the K. or any other perhaps that euer took pen in hand for hauing taken the visard of O. E.
promised to geue him a place also in the enterlude when his turne cometh and when he bringeth any thing different from the former or worthy the mentioning PROCTOR O. E. IS called vp the stage to tel his tale to help out S r. F. in this matter of flattering the state and how he playeth his parte farre worse more ridiculously then the knight himself CAP. III. I Haue promised the gentle Reader to exhibite a short view of the principal pointes which Proctor O. E. bringeth after S r. F. if any may be called principal of so paltrie wares in his late VVrangle-word freshlie come out of England which bringeth such trash so stuffed with impotent and impudent rayling as maketh S r. F. seeme many tymes a graue moderate writer though often also he wil not yeild to the other we shal compare both so yow may iudge First this O.E. setteth downe my beginning of the Ward-word thus VVrangle-vvord Pag. 9. Diuers impudencies of O. E. He beginneth with a longe tale of flattery saith he of the harmes ensuing therof and at his first setting out entereth into a common place as it were into a common Inne pleasing and resting himselfe but tyring and harrying his reader with his nâ—edles fooleryes By this yow may see the mans veyne desyring to say somewhat and aduenturing to say any thing true or false for that the matter of flatterie in the Ward-word is but touched in a word or two and the application insueth presentlie his humor therfore is discouered in vsing so base a similitude of common Innes and common places therto adioyning wherwith it may be this minister is more delighted then euery one of his fellowes But let vs heare him out further VVhat skilleth it saith he to know what a daungerous beast a flatterer is VVrangle-vvord Ibid. and who denyeth but that flatterie is an odious thâ—ng but what is this to vs can he shew that S r. F. is a flatterer no nay he doth â—ot so much as goe about to proue any such matter nor doth he apply his common place to his purpose but leaueth it as a fragment borowed out of some Fryarlâ—ke declamation Let any maÌ„ read the first Page of the ward-woord and then tel me whether this Minister haue any sorehead at all though his head be great enough who saith that I do not so muche as goe about to proue any such matter against S â— F. that he flattered the State the whole butte of my discourse in that place being nothing els but to shew that S. F. and his fellowes who preach so many blessings of England by change of Religion from whence yt hath receuâ—d indeed so many manifest hurtes and dangers must needs be famous flatterers And this Minister an Archparasyte that blusseth not to persuade S. F. that I durst not so muche as goe about to proue flattery against him when notwithstanding that was my whole argument as before yow haue heard But wil yow here an other impudency as gros as this and thereby learne to know the man heere at the very beginning harkeÌ„ then what he saith of the Warder for talking of difficulties rysen and rysing by change of Religion His aduersaries saith he do easely discouer his notorious ympudency VVrangle-vvord Pag. 1â— and his frends do rue his simplicitie seing him to take as graunted and boldly to affirme that all men see and acknowlege the difficulties that aryse out of alteration of Religion when none eyther see it or iustly can affirme any suche matter Lo gentle Reader what he saieth and whether it be notorious impudencie in me to say that some difficulties haue rysen in England and other countryes by alteration of Religion or in him to hold this for impudencie and further to affirme that no man can see or truly affirme any suche matter of this I say be thow thy self iudge who perhaps daylie feelest some part of these difficulties by the troubles feared as rysing from this fountaine and origyn But now to go forward in this matter of flattery how doth this minister proceed therein after the K. yow shal here his method O. E. a famous flatterer First he setteth downe a long recital of the personal praises of her Ma tie out of Bishop Ozorius a Portugal in his Epistle wrytten to her very neere 30. yeares ago and out of Petrus Bizarrus an Italian in his storye of Genua and is glad by this occasion to say somewhat wherof he may hope to receaue a good fee withall to make yt seeme that we are enemies of her Ma ties praises which is calumnious parasitical for we do disioyne the harmes ensued by chaÌ„ge of Religion â—rom her Ma ties gouernment and do most willingly acknowlege the personal praises of her Ma â—ie seperated froÌ„ Religion wherof the Warder layd not the fault on her nay rather expresly excepted yt though this coÌ„panion in repeating his woords omitteth that parte of purpose and most malitiously not being desyrous the Warder should shew so dutiful affection and good opinion of her Ma ties person and therby cut of the argument of this cauillers long and ydle babbel fownded vpon this calumniation The false dealing of O.E. the Warders woords I haue related in the former Chapter and forteenth paragraph where yow may reade them and thereby iudge of the true dealing of this false Minister or rather the false dealing of this true Mynister which I accompt all to be one But let vs go forward After his discourse of the praises of her Ma tie he entreth to shew that Catholikes do maligne and enuy these praises and yet was Ozorius a Catholike whom he alleageth for the greatest prayser and so was also so far as we know Bizarrus the other praiser O.E. Pag 2. And to proue this he runneth about the whole world to seeke witnesses for besides Sanders Harpsfeld Ryshton Englishmen Bozius and Ribadinera the first an Italian the second a Spanyard out of all which notwithstanding he alleageth noe one woord but their bare names he desyreth also King Salomon to beare him witnes in these woords The wicked doth abhorre those that walke aright Prouerb 29. assuring vs that by the wicked are meant the Catholikes and by the other parte of the sentence her Ma tie and from Salomon he leapeth againe to Clement 7. and Paulus 3. Popes of Rome for their sentences against King Henries mariage with Lady Anne Bollen and the legitimation of their Children alleaging woordes which I thinke not fit to be repeated in this place and so should be haue done also yf his discretion had byn as great as his head Indiscretion and temeritye of O.E. seing they are now past and forgotten and were written when her Ma tie either was not yet borne or of that Infancy as she could haue no part in any fault there obiected Yet this prating companion to seeme to say somewhat in hatred of Catholikes flatterie of
all matters being by both their iudgments to be referred and all other iudges and trials left a side as they require they come to fal out presently about the sense and interpretation wherin it is affirmed by their owne wryters that so many men so many myndes and so many diuers interpretations among them-selues of the selfesame words of scripture are to be found as yow may see set downe at large in another book of the softer Caluinists set forth by the same publike authority as the former and intituled A suruey of the pretented holy Discipline imprinted at London An. 1593. especially in the 31. Chapter whose title is this How and with what disagreement they wrest and misconster the scriptures c. Where hauing shewed by many examples that fiue or six diuers interpretations are giuen sometymes vpon one and the selfe same sentence of scripture by these his puritane brethren He addeth further these wordes Suruey c. 31. Caterbraulis of ProtestaÌ„ts and PuritaÌ„s Vnto these Caterbraules and pitiful distractions which now I haue shewed I might ad a great heape of other confusions all proceeding from such intollerable presumption as is vsed by peruerting and false interpretation of the sacred Scriptures And agayne whosoeuer doth deale with the Scriptures in this sort as these fellowes do wel may he speake proud things exalt himselfe promise mountaynes brag of the Prophets Apostles but in the end all cometh to nothing c. Loe heere what this brother sayth of the rest of the caterbraules and pittiful distractions from them of their intollerable presumption in peruerting and false interpreting scriptures of their swelling pryde in bragging of hauing the prophets and Apostles on their syde when they haue nothing but vanitye yet these brags of scriptures prophets and Apostles must be good and currant proofe when they deale with vs against the authoritye of the vniuersal Churche as yow shal see by O.E. in the next Chapter and when we tel them of any diuision among themselues they wil deny it on all handes as Syr F. doth heere of the Puritanes and O. E. afterward though he hath written against them most spitefully and doggedly for he hath no other style as it seemeth and fynally let all men iudge but especially the reader whom it most importeth for his instruction with what truth and conscience Syr F. can say and wryte as he doth matters staÌ„ding as I haue shewed that not only the professors of their ghospel in England but all other Churches also in Christendome where the ghospel is imbraced are of one Iudgement and thervpon coÌ„clude with this hypocritical prayer to mock God withall And in this blessed vnitie grounded vpon veritie the Lord for euer keepe vs. Whervnto I say also amen so long as they remaine enemies to Gods Catholike Churche wherin only veritie and vnitie is to be found AN ANSVVERE TO three fond obiections or interrogations of Syr F. with an addition about O. E. who is called vp agayne to the stage to tell his opinion about this first blessing of vnitie in veritie CAP. VII AND this now might be sufficient for refutation of this first ridiculous blessing set downe by the knight were it not that I am forced to follow him yet a litle further into an other poynt which is that he forseing how albeit this first blessing of vnitie among them could be proued as it cannot yet might it not be alleaged for a peculiar blessing of his men except it could be shewed also that it were singular to them alone and not commoÌ„ also to Catholikes before they and their religion sprong vp for if we had vnitie also in fayth before them then cannot vnitie be accompted their blessing more then ours for which cause he endeauoureth to shewe that Catholikes had no vnitie of fayth before Luthers ghospel began which paradox he wil needs proue by three graue interrogations which I pray yow note and therby obserue the mans singular wit and learning Yow vaunt sayth he of a general vnitie before alteration of religion Pag. 13. but how worshipped yow one God when yow worshipped so many Idols To this I answere that if we worshipped Idols Three foâ—d interrogatioÌ„s â—f the K. and so were Idolators this error was so vniuersally receyued among vs as euen in this poynt also we had vnitie which protestants cannot shew in their errors and falsityes as before hath byn declared And so this question is both ydle and easy to answere for the consequent but for the antecedent it is most false for we deny that any Idols were among Catholikes August de vtilitate ieiunij tomo 9. â—ub finem S. Hier. in c. 6. Amos in c. â—2 Ose. S. Augustines and S. Hieroms sentence is cleare and sound as before hath ben noted that heretikes are the Idolaters of the new Testament for adoring their own fansies Secondly he asketh agayne how we could haue vnitye when as we were so miserably rent into innumerable sectes of fryers and monkes To which I answere that all these professed one fayth without any difference in any one article of beliefe And consequently this question is more simple then the former for that difference of habytes or particular manner of lyfe breaketh not vnity of religion Thirdly he asketh and vrgeth yet more sharpely how caÌ„ yow haue one head of your Churche vnles yow reiect Christ that is the onely head To this I wil answere out of his owne wordes that we can haue one external and ministerial head vnder Christ by the same reason that himselfe in the same place sayth that English Protestants haue one head of their Churche which is Christ the Lord and his substitute annoynted their Soueraigne Q. vnder him So that yf it do not exclude Christ among the Protestants to haue a womaÌ„ head of their Churche vnder Christ much lesse doth it exclude Christ among vs to haue a man head a Priest head of this reason I am content to make any man iudge And with this I wil end my treatise of the first benediction of vnitie in veritie which is as truly and fitly applyed to Protestants as if a man should assigne it for a special blessing of Greeks and Germanes aboue other nations neuer to exceed in drinking or of those of Guinea neuer to fal out or fight among themselues who neuer lightly are occupyed in other things And lastly I wil close vp all with the sentence and prophesy of no worse a man then Martyn Luther himselfe Luthers prophesye of Protestants coment in Psalm 5. who wryteth thus Certè non alia ratione confligit Deus cum haereticis quam vt inter illos existat factiosus quidam dissensionis spiritus ex â—llorum enim discordia interitus quoque perditio consequitur Trulie God doth not fight by any other meanes with heretikes then by permitting among them a certayne seditious spirite of dissentioÌ„ by which their ouerthrow also and perdition doth ensue Thus
Augustine explicaâ—eth himself so had he vttered or not fraudulentlie concealed thesame the question had byn out of doubt S. Aug. in Psalm 9â— For thus sayth S. Augustine Qui iubilat non verba dicit sed sonus quidam est laetinae sine verbis vâ—x est enim animi diffusi laetitia exprimentis quantum potest affectum non sensum comprehendentis He that doth Iubilate or hath this Iubilation meant by the Prophet doth not vtter any words for it is a certayne sound of inward ioy without words it is a voyce of our mynd ful of Ioy and expressing her affection as much as she can but not attayning to expresse the ful inward feeling therof Thus doth S. Augustine explicate himselfe And in an other place more playnlie yet Aâ—g in Psal. â—â— asking this question quid est intelligas iubilationeÌ„ what is meaÌ„t by the Prophet when he willeth thee to vnderstand iubilation and then answereth vt scias vnde gaudeas quod verbis explicare non possis that thou maist know wherof to reioyse without being able to expresse thesame in words Lo heere the truth of these good fellowes that alleadge vs Doctors so flatlie against their owne words and meaning About the vvords of S. Paul 1. Cor. 14. to speake in a knovveâ— tonge And this were sufficient to end this controuersie but that the K t. hath a florish more out of S. Paul who most diuinely sayth he treateth this matter in his fauour belike in his first Epistle to the Corinthians 14. Chapter And that Caâ—etan moued by those words of the Apostle thinketh that prayer should be made in vulgar tongues To the first it is euident ynough by the place it selfe that those words of the Apostle make nothing at all for publike seruice and that the former partes therof are playnlie spoken of prophesying exhortations when christiaÌ„s did meete in the primitiue Churche Cypr. epist. ad Pomp. Quiâ—inum Aug lib. 2. dâ— bapt cap â— Basil. quest breuiteâ— exâ—l q. 27â— Amb in 1. Cor. 1â— which exhortations to the people he would haue in a knowne language which all did vnderstand not in forayne peregryne tongues which many did speake by gifte of the holy ghost And so do enterpret this place S. Cyprian S. Augustine S. Basil S. Ambrose and diuers other Fathers And in the later part of the Apostles words where he speaketh of praying and singing that it should not be in a peregryne tongue he cannot be vnderstood to speake or meane of publike seruice in the Churche for that this publike seruice was already in the greeke toÌ„gue at Corinth whether he wrote this Epistle and in no peregrine or straÌ„ge language but such as was vnderstood by all all being Grecians consequentlie it had byn impertineÌ„t in S. Paul to persuade that it should be in a knowne language S. Paules true meaning Paul Eph 5. vers 20. wherfore his meaning was of certayne spiritual songs which diuers inspired by the holy ghost in the Primitiue Churche did breake foorth into ex tempore in their meetings of which S. Paul sayth to the Ephesians Be not drunken with wyne which leadeth to vncleanes but be fâ—l of the holy ghost speaking one to another in psalmes and hymnes and spiritual songes singing and reioycing in your hartes to Christ. Col. 3. vers 16 And agayne to the Colossians Singing in your harts to God by his grace in Psalmes and hymnes and spiritual songes These songs therfore comming of aboundance of the holy Ghost and oâ— that inward Iubilation of hart before spoken of in the primitiue Churche it fel out that some Christians by the gifte of tongues very ordinarily in those dayes did vtter sometymes these their affections in strange languages as in the Arabian Persian and other like tongues which neyther theÌ„selues perhaps nor others did alwayes vnderstand and sometymes others interpreting by thesame giâ—â—e of tongues that which they spake without vnderstanding â—ift of toÌ„ges to the first Christians as is playne by the text of S. Paule who therfore for the common consolation of all exhorteth them to vtter theire â—eeling and suggestions of the holy Ghost rather in a knowne tongue then in externe languages and this of priuate meetings and spiritual reioycing of those first Christians amoÌ„g themselues But as for publike prayer and reading of scriptures in the Churche who knoweth not that they were read in the Hebrew tongue in the Churches and congregations of Iury and in the Greeke tongue among the Corinthians and other Grecyans and east Churches in Latyn among the Romanes as before hath byn shewed and no probabilitie that S. Paul did euer mislike the same consequentlie could not meane therof in this Epistle And though Caietan should haue any other singular interpretation or illatioÌ„ of his owne in his commentarie vpon this place it is farre from the meaning of the Apostle as yow haue seene and different from the exposition and sense of ancient Fathers whom we are to follow before him yet in the very beginning of the same commentarie he hath these words Caet comeÌ„t in cap. 14. 1. Cor. vniuersus textus iste loquitur propriè de donis linguarum prophetiae vt tractando textus ipse testatur All this text doth speake properlie of the giftes of tongues and prophesying as the text it selfe in handling doth testifie which if it be true then can nothing for publike seruice in vulgar tongues be proued out of it thus much of this OF THE FOVRTH AND fift blessings affirmed to haue byn brought in by Protestantes which are aboundance of good woorkes freedome from persecution CAP. X. HAVING byn ouer long in the examination of the former three blessings The fourth blessing good lyfe of Protestants I meane to be much shorter in the rest wherfore there foloweth the fourth blessing which Syr F. bringeth in as peculiar to protestants for otherwise it were no blessing obteyned by change of religion which is the rare and singular good lyfe of ProtestaÌ„ts called by this blessing bringer Pag. 18. their exercise in workes of true pietye and in his marginal note and ranke of blessings The exercise of true Holinesse which is a straÌ„ge blessing if a man consider wel of it that the exercise of good works and true holynes was brought in onlie or principallie by Protestants of our dayes for first the experience of the whole world wil deny it and cry out against it and secondlie there best frends who speake most of their faith wil and do renounce their woorks as for example Erasmus among other Fox in the lyfe of Bilney and other first protestants Erasmi Ep. ad Carth. apud Surium an 1â—â—6 whom Fox euery where would nedes make their first founder and fauourer though himself deny and detest them after experience had of their liues saith thus Neminem vidi meliorem deteriores omnes I neuer saw any made better
voluntarie warres Ibid. Pag. â—7 as honorable respects hau moued vs to vndertake So are his words and consider heere discreete reader the wit of our newe councelor which maketh our warres voluntary vpon wantonnesse of wealth and not vpon necessitie as the wysest Princes are wont to pretend when they demaund helpes of their subiectes Moreouer as this K. is lauish in bragging of riches and voluntarie warres so is his boasting playnlie Thrasonical when he talketh of his owne going and assistance to the same warres For in his Epistle of his wach-word to the Reader he telleth him verie seriouslie with big wordes that to himselfe he hath set downe this law Thrasonical boasting that shal neuer be repealed that if his wealth were millions if he could bring thousands of fighting handeÌ„s to the feild yf his lyfe were ten thousand liues his wealth his strength his lyfe and all should goe to be spent hazarded and ended against that Antichrist of Rome and the ambitious tyrant of Spayne c. And that with confidence boldnes and assurance of the goodnes of his cause he and his fellowes with hart and hand wil be prest and ready to take their places and to marche in the feild and their to set forward with a swift foot against these enemies c. Did euer glorious Thraso vpon the stage speak bigger wordes then these and yet I do not heare that the K. in fact is so great a kil-kow as heere he maketh him-selfe nor yet that in such warres as haue byn offred voluntarie or inuoluntarie hath he aduentured any one lyfe or brought any one troop of fighting handes to the feild nor hath byn so swyft of foot as he is in wordes but rather hath bene content to look on whiles others marched and to sit at home with his Ministers whiles other men went to fight and consequentlie that these wordes and wishes are farre greater then his actes and gestes And so much of this blessing Wherfore now to come to the last blessing which is multitude of people The 10. blessing encrease of people encreased mightilie as he sayth since her Ma ties first entrance to the crowne a great blessing of God sayth he powred vpon this land which God at the least hath seauen-fold encreased to the number that at her entrance she found Pag. 27. If I should stand with this computist about the precise number of seauen-fold encreased and aske him how he knoweth it or who wil beleeue it or how probable it is that the people of EnglaÌ„d should be seauen tymes as many now as they were fortie yeares agoe I should I thinke pose him hardlie and proue him perhaps no lesse lauish in this then in the former but yet supposing it were or be so how can this benediction so poore a one at it is be attributed as peculiar to his new ghospel seing that other religions engender also besyds Protestants And for example let vs imagine that Catholike religion had endured stil in England for these later 40. yeares or that the Iewes or Turkes religion had byn in steed therof would not the people haue encreased also vnder them thinke yow yea much more vnder the later for that they professe Poligamy and the multitude of many wyues and yet were it much simplicitie to say that this encrease of Children were a special blessing of their religion or testimonie of the truth therin conteyned And the like may I say of ProtestaÌ„ts though I confesse that in this poynt of generation I do yeild them some priuiledge aboue Catholikes for that all sortes do marrie among them and fewe or none do thinke of those Eunuches commended by Christ who geld them-selues for the Kingdome of heauen Holy Eunuches Math. 19. but rather all kynd of states sexes vocations offices and ages as wel fryars monks nunes priests chaplaynes ministers and bishops as all others do fal to maryage and multiplication and consequentlie no maruaile if the people haue encreased more then before but whether this be a blessing or a cursing a benefit or a burthen to the common wealth let the Parishes and Parishioners of England be asked who by statute are bound to maintayne their brats when the parents are not able And with this I wil end this goodly ranke of blessings which are so vayne and fond as I may say to S.F. for bringing them foorth as S. Augustine said to Faustus Manicheus about a like foolish narration Aug. lib. 16. contr Faust. Manich. cap. 2â— O hominem se cogitantem dictorem sed alium non cogitantem contradictorem vbi est acumen tuum Oh fond man that thought onlie how himself might speak or tel vs blessings and not thinking what an other would answere where is thy wit and then goeth forward to aske him further An in mala causa non posses aliter sed mala causa te vana loqui coegit malam verò caeusam habere nemo te coâ—git Could yow do no otherwise then yow haue done in so euil a cause trulie your euil cause might force yow to speake so vainlie as yow haue done but no man forced yow to haue an euel cause A brief addition about O.E. Yt may be good reader thou doest maruale why O. E. is kept so long from the stage seing that I haue promised him a corner now and then to tel his tale but the truth is that his parte came not in til now for that he maketh no seueral tract of blessings as doth the K. but only a particular brief enumeration of ten that is six spiritual foure teÌ„poral called corporal by the K t. of which kynd yet he maketh fyue and lyke number of spiritual so as the Minister according to his vocation is more spiritual by one blessing then the K t. and lesse corporal though perhaps not lesse corpulent They disagree also in the order names and substance of their blessings as before I haue shewed laying both their listes together now we shal examine how they wil ioyne in defending them-selues and their ghospel froÌ„ the curssings which the VVarder threapeth vpon them as ensuing by change of religion and in this poynt part of this first Encounter I shal be forced to alter somwhat the manner of my answere already made to S.F. therby to geue roome for the Minister to enter with him OF THE CONTRARY effectes to blessings that is to say of cursinges rather and calamities brought in by change of religion both spiritual and temporal and how Syr F. and his minister do answer them CAP. XII AFTER the short ydle defence which our knight in the beginning of this Encounter did shape to the charge of flatterie as before yow haue heard he entred presentlie for better iustification of the vauntes made in his Wachword into the enumeration of the former ten blessings which now we haue examined and after that presentlie shutteth vp his whole Encounter as though all were dispatched and he had answered all
haue brought in being a matter that doth cleerlie coÌ„uince him his religioÌ„ of noueltie heresie For that GratiaÌ„ ValeÌ„tinian his sonne being Emperors of the west The decree of the 3. Emp. examined and Theodosius of the East all three do agree to commend to their subiects the romane fayth and bishop of thaâ— place to wit Damasus theÌ„ sitting in that chaire vnder payne of heresy infamy and other extreeme punishments which poynt for that the false minister after his fashion durst noâ— put downe clearly as the woords themselues do ly in the text least therby he should discouer ouer much the truth I meane to do it for him in this place without other fee for my labour then to proue him a cosening companion and alleaging them brokenly to his owne purpose Cod lib. 1. de summa Triâ—it c. CuÌ„ctos eâ— Cunctos populos sayth the decree quos clementiae nostrae regit imperium in tali rolumus religione vessarâ— quam diuinum Petrum Apostolum tradidisse Romanis religio vsque adhuc ab ipso iâ—sinuata declarat quamque Pontificem Damasum seqâ—â— claret Petrum Alexandriae Episcopum virum Apostolicae sanctitatis c. our wil is that all people whom the Empyre of our clemency doth gouerne shal lyue in that religion which diuine Peter deliuered vnto the Romanes as the religion by him taught and enduring to this day doth playnly shewe which religion lefte by S. Peter it is euident that Damasus bishop of Rome doth folow as also Peter bishop of Alexandria a man of Apostolical holynes c. to wit that according to Apostolical discipline and euangelical doctryne we all beleeue one deity of the Father the SoÌ„ne the holy Ghost with equal maiesty in holy Trinity and this law whosoeuer doth follow we command that they do imbrace the name of christiaÌ„ Catholikes the rest whoÌ„ we esteeme as mad and furious men we wil haue to beare the infamy of heretical doctryne and to be punished first by God then by vs. This is the decree of these three Emperors against heretiks for neere 1200. yeare agoe wherin yow see they remit themselues all three though one were of the east Empyre to the Romane religion and to Damasus the Pope his beleefe with whom the Patriarke of Alexandria for the east Churche did also agree and heere is nothing determined of religion as yow see by their owne authoritie but only that such as followed the Romane â—eligion and Pope of those dayes should be compted Catholikes and the rest heretikes which if the parlament of England had done in these our dayes as all ancient parlaments were wont to doe as appeareth by our statuâ—es then could not the religion authorized by â—hem be called parlament religion no more â—hen this can be called Imperial though pubâ—ished and protected by Emperors Now then gentle reader consider how many folâ—yes or Nodytismes which the minister obiected alwayes to me be by him coÌ„mitted in alleaging this one example of these Emperors and on whom they light but the principal is that being alleaged by himself and for himself it maketh wholie against him ouerthroweth quite his cause which may be accoÌ„pted doltisme also in the deane besydes Nodytisme for it sheweth first the whole difference betweene these Catholike Emperors decree Poynts of the Emp. decree contrary to O. E. for defence of religion and the modernal decrees of our Parlaments that take vpon them to appoynte and defyne religion in England it sheweth that the Romane religion was receyued by S. Peter and had endured so vntil their dayes which was more then 400. yeares it sheweth also that Damasus Pope of Rome was then the cheife gouernor of christian religion throughout the world it sheweth that these Emperours accounted him for their head and not he them in matters of religion it sheweth how humbly these Emperors did submit themselues to the decree of the councel of Nice made before their dayes about three persons in one God-head confirmed by Pope Siluester and continued by Damasus and it sheweth how obedientlie and christianly these Emperors did hold them for Catholike christiaÌ„s whom thesaid councel and Pope Damasus did hold for Catholiks and condemned those for infamous heretikes who did dissent from their obedience in religion and now whether our later Parlaments of England haue done the same by the councel of Trent and Popes confirming defending the same as our former parlaments were wont to doe I leaue to the reader to iudge and whether this law of these Emperors were wyselie brought in by O. E. or no but let vs passe yet further in examyning this rule for tryal of truth The minister hauing shifted of wittilie as it seemeth to him the exprobration of parlament religion by the foresaid example of the Emperors falleth to range and roue wyde far and to obiect to vs that in Q. maryes dayes our religion was established more by parlament then by authoritie of the Apostles that we are deuided among our selues and haue more then 200. diuers opinions about the Sacrament of the L. supper that the vniuersal Churche could not deliuer vs our fayth Diuers manifest false obiections quia â—â—tiones sunt suppositorum that our fayth is neyâ—her Catholyke nor hath any certayne grouÌ„d â—t all but is buylded vpon the particular opiâ—ions of this or that mutable and â—ulearned â—ope that it is not ancient but ful of late noâ—eltyes and old heresyes and other such stuffe â—ithout end prating much and prouing noâ—ing so as no Mountebank in Italie could â—â—ewe him-selfe lesse shameles or more ridiâ—â—lous And to say a word or two to euery one of â—â—ese fooleries before rehearsed the religion â—â—at the parlament established in Q. Maryes dayes was it any new religion VVhat religion vvas planted by parlament in Q. Maries dayes or differenâ— from the rest of Christendome or did the parlament then do any other thing then thâ— former edict or decree of the Emperors thaâ— commandeth men to hold the ancieÌ„t reâ—gâ—â— of Rome descended from the Apostles anâ— follow the Bishop of that Churche theÌ„ liuiâ—â— as head of all Christendome And as for the two hundred different oâ—â—nions that Catholykes are said to haue let â—â— E. and all his compagnions together proued two only that are real differences and tâ— maynteyned by Catholykes being opposâ—â—â— one to the other and that in poynts of fayth â—â—deed and I shal yeild and pardon all the othâ—â— hundred nyntie and eyght differences that 〈◊〉 obiecteth but if he cannot proue this of 〈◊〉 only as neuer he wil be able then are thâ— not two hundred differencies of ours but â—â— lyes of his and agayne do yow note for auâ—â—ding cauillations that I require two real â—â—ferences in matters of beleef for of other câ—â—â—cumstances that touch not preciselie belieâ—â— our schooles and learned men lawfully mâ—â— haue diuersitie of opinioÌ„s as about the manâ— how bread is conâ—erted into Christs flesh the Sacrament
try out truth among them after loÌ„g proof that Scripture alone wil not do it yf O. E. and his compagnions wil accept of his offer to go and pray with them in the feilds of Holland to stay the Sunne they may chance to agree together at the next new moone to whose wanes and changements I leaue both them and the progresse of their religion and meane only to say a fewe words more about the fruits of good works and temporal benedictions and so to end this first encounter wherin I haue byn ouer long already OF THE FRVITES OF vertue and good workes praetended to haue followed by change of religion as also of eyght temporal inconueniences which may be called curses or maledictions insued by thesame and how O.E. behaueth him selfe in this controuersye CAP. XVIII THow wilt not forget good reader I hope how in the tenth chapter of this Encounter we examined the fourth blessing of the new ghospel assigned by S.F. to be good lyfe En. 1. cap. 10. and holy woorks of Protestants aboue other men for otherwise it could be no special blessing of their ghospel where I shewed first that seing this blessing was testified only by them-selues not by their neighbours that liued with them and ought to feele the effectâ— of this blessing it was vayne and rather to be esteemed a brag then a blessing which I confirmed for that the warder comming to thâ— immediates and particulars wherin and bâ— what meanes good workes might be tryed discerned whether protestants or Catholykes abound more in them the K t. slippeth a syde and letteth passe the whole declaration of the warder without so much as a beck or nod at it for which respect I haue thought conuenieÌ„t to repeat thesame agayne in this place in the Warders owne words for that they are not many and to see at least what the Aduocate minister supplyeth for his ClieÌ„t the K t. in this behalf thus then wrote the warder After assurance stabilitie and vnion in beleef the next greatest spiritual benedictions that can be expected of any doctrine Pag. 6. VVhat effectes of vertue nevv religion hath vvrought are the good effects of vertue which it worketh in mennes mynds manners as it was foretold by Esay the Prophet that Christs doctrine should so alter mens conditions and natures that such as were most fearce sauadge and wicked before should by this doctrine become most humble Esa 11. kynd and gentle The wolfe sayth he shal dwel with the lambe and the parde shal lye with the goate the calfe lyon and sheep shal abyde together and a litle chyld shal be able to gouerne them all Wel then hath the protestants doctryn wrought these effects of peace meeknes manâ—uetude and agreement I haue touched beâ—ore the bloody tragedyes raysed in France â—landers Scotland and other places vpon the â—â—rst rising therof I might ad Switzerland and â—ermany where their owne stories do testifie â—â—at aboue a hundreth thousand people were â—ayne within one yeare by the rebellion and warres of the couÌ„trymen against their lordes Sledan for the controuersie of religion such humilitie obedience and meekenes of hart imprinted presentlie this new doctrine when it came But let vs see other effects Christs doctrine exhorteth to penance to mortification of the flesh to continency virginity fasting praying almes voluntarie pouerty renouncing of the world and the lyke Are there more of these effects now adayes in England or before or are their more in Syr. F. and his men then in ours doth he and his ghospellers pay their debts better then Catholykes doe or keep better houses or more hospitalitie or rayse their rents lesse or take lesse fynes or vse their tenants better or lend their neighbours more money without vsurie or do they help to marrie more poore mennes daughters and other such lyke good works of charitie Is pryde in apparel gluttony dronkennesse lecherie swearing and forswearing couetousnes crueltie falshood deceipt theeuerie lack of conscience oppressing of poore men more or lesse now adayes in vre or before when yet this change was not made Let S. F. answere me to this and not he only but the whole country round about him and then let him tel me with witnesses whether they be spiritual blessings or curses that haue ensued vpon this change of religion so much commended by him and so I shal passe to weigh his temporal benedictions which perhaps he esteemeth farre more theÌ„ these spiritual Thus he To all this treatie of the fruits of vertue vertuous lyfe in Protestants S. F. answereth not so much as one lyne and therfore his prating Proctor to helpe out his maister must needs bestyrre him-selfe to say som-what but how fit to the purpose and state of the question his owne words shal shew for thus he beginneth Pag. 23. I answere sayth he that the doctrine of the ghospel hath wrought good effect in all true Christians and albeit euery one do not so square their liues according to Gods lawe as they should yet compart our people with the Papists nay with the Priests and Popes them-selues whom they call most holy * For his office and not for his person I make no question but they do sarre excel them Loe heere this fellow is quick and resolute he maketh no question of that which is most in question or rather which is all the question whether protestants in all countryes where they lyue be of better lyues generally then Catholykes or that which is the same in effect but yet more easie to be discerned whether the world since the rising of Luther and Caluins new doctrine which this man calleth the ghospel Sup. cap 17. nu 10. though before he haue coÌ„demned the same in diuers poyntes as yow haue heard the manners of men haue byn generally better or worse for that according to the warders discoursâ— Christs owne words true religâ—on and reformation bringeth euer with it better lyfe and behauiour of men this then is the true state of the question whether protestants religion haue done this or no wherof we haue shewed the negatiue part before out of their owne wryters and the meanest man woman or chyld that lyueth at this day yf they haue heard of things past or can behold matters present with any iudgement wil easely discerne Yet this resolute Minister as yow see maketh no question to the contrarie and so from this general assertion passeth on to prayse exceedinglie the clemencie and vertue of protestant Princes and then turneth he to the contrarie which is his only plausible common place to dilate and delight him-selfe I meane against Rome and her Popes But the whorish synagoge sayth he of Rome yow must not maruaile of the speech for that whores and knaues in his ministerie do ofteÌ„ meet shee is red with the blood of saincts no tyger was euer more fearce and cruel Thus in general and then layeth he load vpon Popes Card.
Bernard others hath in part byn seene but wil more appeare in the other incounters following especially the second and seauenth The other shifts also of repeating againe often the things before answered as though they had neuer byn answered of accusing others for excusing him-self of running behynd the cloath of â—tate thrusting her Ma ties person and gouernment betwene him his aduersary his bold impudent assertions of things manifestly knowne to be false as that the puritans and protestants are all one and that there is no difference of religion betwene them Admonition and conclusion and other such lyke all these poynts I say haue byn sufficiently layd open before as they fel out nor need they any new repetition here againe but rather admonition to wit that the K t. would with some indiffereÌ„cy coÌ„sider of these points and enter into contemplation of a good conscience remeâ—bring rather his eternal good theÌ„ his teÌ„poral honour and therwithal these words of S. Augustine to Iulian. Aug. cont Iul. lib. 5.6.7 Etst coram hominibus sit dura frons tua erubescat saltem coram Deo mens tua Albeyty our forehead be hard and blush â—ot before men yet let yow mynd at least blush before God which were noe lesse wholsome then holy counsel for him yf he would follow yt And this was my exhortation and Warn-word to S. F. before I saw the supplement of his proctor O. E. which being much more shamelesse bytter and false then any thing vttered by the K t. I was tempted to take this sentence of S. Augustine from him and bestow yt vpon the minister but in the end I resolued to leaue yt common to both and to the end yow may consider how fitly the foresaid sentence as wel of a shamelesse mynd as of a shamelesse forehead doth fal vpon the masked minister O. E. yow must remember how he hath behaued him-selfe in the former combat how euen at his very first calling vpon the stage he shewed vs a notorious cosening trik about falsifying a place of S. Augustine Vid. Cap. 3. Stechus Eugobinus in naming the Pope God and at his next goying vp he telleth certayne notorious lyes Cap. 13. which all the world cannot excuse adding ther-vnto a lyke falsification about the counsel of Lateran Cap. 15. his impudency also foolish inconstancy and contradiction to himself is to be remembred in his third admission to tel his tale further his egregious folly in setting downe his English rule of faith wherby he would exclude the a Cap. 16. in annot vpoÌ„ hiâ— epist. to the â—ead puritans and no lesse folly is discouered in alleadging Cath. Emperors decrees quite against himself And his grosse ignorance is laid forth by occasion of his argument Aâ—â—iones sunt suppositoruÌ„ therby to prooue that Catholyks receaue not their faith from the vniuersal Churche Finally his atheisme and irreligious iudgement is discouered and conuinced not only by that he saith the differences betwene Lutherans b Cap 17. Zwinglians Caluinists Puritanes not to be any essential points in matters of religioÌ„ but also by his coÌ„temptible speches of the first Doctors fathers of his owne religion especially yf any of those two books named by me before Cap 6 7. and wrytten against the Puritanes â— meane the Suruey of disciplinar Doctrine and Daungerous positions were written by him as some wil say wherin the whole story of the deformed Churche of Geneua by Caluyn VVickednes of Caluyn Pharellus Beza and others Pharellus Beza and others and their actions councels drifts and attempts about the same are so set downe and printed by publike authority in EnglaÌ„d that yf a man would study to describe notorious wicked men and catylines of their countrey without conscience he could not set it downe nor expresse it more liuely theÌ„ it is done in the foresaid books against the foresaid new prophets and their cheefest northen schollers to wit Iohn Knocks and his fellowes in Scotland and Goodman and his mates in EnglaÌ„d which argueth no faith or conscience in any of them but only to say and do for the tyme as the tyme serueth and as their proper lucar ease ambition and sensuality requireth and herby may be warned the discreet reader to look to his soule and saluation seing these men for them-selues do seeme to make that the last and least part of their care or cogitations feeding vs with many faire words of blessings but filling vs with myseryes The end of the first Encounter THE SECOND ENCOVNTER ABOVT FALSHOOD AND LYING OBIECTED TO SYR F. AND OF certayne absurd groundes and principles fayned by him to be in Catholyke doctrine And how he dischargeth him-self therof THE SVMME OF THAT which before was set downe betweene the watchman the warder CAP. I. AS in the former first Encounter the knight in his vaunt of vanitie VVatchvvord and vanitie therof height of heretical pryde went about to persuade vs yea to lay before our face the inestimable and innumerable blessings which our country for sooth had receyued by change of Catholyke religion into Protestancie so for better confirmation of this so loftie a dryft he took vpon him in this second Encounter to make declaration that in Queene Maries raygne and former tymes vnder Catholyke English Princes there was uothing els but darkenesse cloudes mistes shadowes ignorance blyndnes want of learning lack of light and other such calamities and miserable obscurities for proof wherof he setteth downe as it were by way of preface or preparation to his designed treatise certayne preambles forged by him-self as for example that the only desyre to read vpon the book of God the old or new testament was held for heynous heresie in former tymes so farre foorth that for this only act or desyre men were brandled to the slaughter and then passing further on to the depth of his discourse he setteth downe fower famous grounds or principles of Catholyke doctryne all put in order by him as most sure and consequent the one of the other which he calleth general grouÌ„ds and Maximes of our religion The first that ignorance is the mother of deuotion The second that lay men may not medle with matters of religion The third that the Pope and euery least masse-priest coÌ„ming froÌ„ him must be obeyed though he commaund that which is blasphemous before God The fourth that the Popes pardons are ready remedies for all synne among vs though neuer so greiuous euen immediatly committed against God him-self For answere of all which fancyes the Warder hauing made a competeÌ„t declaration to shew first how fond and ridiculous a maÌ„ner of proceding this was The VVarder his defence against the VVatchman the first parte and is in our K t. after so much folly and flatterie vttered in his former tale of blessings throughout the first EncouÌ„ter to enter now into so shameles a course of forging falsifying and lying for
defacing of our doctryn and doings he sheweth first of all the smal reason the K t. had or hath to contemne so proudlie as he doth the Clergie of Q. Maries tyme and of former ages for darknesse ignorance and blyndnes declaring by diuers particulers that they were farre more learned then those that since haue stepped vp in their places and possessed their roomes And from this he passeth to shew that the foresaid two preaÌ„bles about reading scriptures and the punishment of death ther-vnto said to be assigned are no wayes true in any playne meaning sense or interpretation but feigned by the K t. him-selfe and consequentlie can not euer be proued or defended and by occasion of these preambles About reading of scriptures the warder entereth into examination of the things theÌ„-selues declaring how farre the reading of holy Scriptures in vulgar languages is permitted to all men among Catholykes and what restraynt is made therof towards some for what causes and reasons and vpon what necessitie and what is the true state of this controuersie betweene vs and Protestants as also what hurt profit damages or commodities haue or do insue therof with alleaging both reasons authorities and experiences in that behalf To all which discourse of reasons and experiences set downe at good length by the warder and conteyning in deed the principal substance of the controuersie the K â— answereth no one worde nor so much as mentyoneth the same in this his reply but passeth to other matters as by the combat of this insuing Encounter yow wil manifestlie see and behold and pittie the poore K t. for this weaknes The second parte of the vvatchmans impugnation and vvarders defence After this cometh the warder to handle the second parte of this Encounter to wit about the foresaid foure absurd positions grounds and maximes set downe by the K t. for ours which the warder prooueth to be neyther Maximes nor minimes of Catholyke Doctryne for that to proue them Maximes all Catholyke wryters must hold them and to proue them minimes some one at least must hold theÌ„ but that neyther of these can be prooued And consequentlie that they are no positions or principles of Catholyke religion but fictions rather of heretykes and false impositions of the K t. And for the first that ignorance is held by vs to be the mother of deuotion The first forged position for that the watchman bringeth no other proof but only that reading of Scriptures was forbidden to the lay sorte at which distinction also of laytie cleargie he seemeth to iest hervpon the Warder taketh occasion first to proue by many old testimonies the vse and antiquitie of this distinction wher-vnto the K t. in this last reply returneth not any one word of answere and after this agayne the warder declareth largely that this position is neyther Maxime nor minime among Catholykes and that ignorance is neyther held for the mother daughter or kinse-woman of deuotion which he proueth both by the definition of deuotion it self out S. Augustine S. Thomas and others as also by the effects shewing that deuotion is grounded vpon knowledge not vpon ignorance though vpon perticular causes the learnedest men are not alwayes the most deuoute All which discourse the K t. thought good to passe ouer with silence as wel as the former without taking any notice therof in this his last reply and therby yow may see whether yt be more and more substantial that he leaueth vnanswered then that which he answereth About the second position imposed vpon Catholykes The second position that lay men must not medle with matters of religion as the vntruth therof is more apparant then any of the rest so was there lesse written in the refutation but that necessitie inforced the warder to defend S. Thomas of CaÌ„terburie dishonored and slaundered intollerably by the K t. wher-vnto what he answereth in this Wast-woord now and how for defence of his former falshoods he intangleth him-self in diuers new difficulties and inextricable absurdityes shal be seene afterward in the particular discussion of matters that ensue In the third position that the Pope or meanest Priest coming from him is to be obeyed vnder payne of damnation though he command blasphemie The third faygned position c. The warder is more briefe in lyke manner for that the euident falshood therof is apparant to all yet writeth he so much as is needful for a manifest briefe confutation and how litle the K t. hath to answere for deuising of this position and laying it so falsely to Catholykes charge yow shal afterwards see discussed And finally about the fourth and last forged ground of Catholyke religion The fourth false ground to wit that our chiefe remedy for sinne though it were committed immediatly against God him-selfe is to vse the watchmans words A pardon from his Hol. and absolution from his holie Priests but yf the decrees or ordinances of their Romish Synagoue were transgressed hardly any mercy was to be had c. About this I say the warder obserueth only the apparant cauils ignorances and falshoods of the watchmaÌ„ as first that the greatest sinner immediatly committed against God him-selfe are to be remitted among vs by pardons which is a malitious cauil for that we hold such pardons to be auaylable only for the payne due to venial sinnes or for remitting the temporal punishment remayning after mortal synne forgeuen before Secondlie that he conioyneth together Popes pardons and the absolution of Priests in the Sacrament of pennance as though they were both one which is ignoraÌ„ce for that the later remitteth all sinne and the first not And thirdly that the transgressors of the decrees and ordinances of the Churche can hardlie euer obtayne mercie and that they are more hardly pardoned then the grossest sinnes committed against God himseâ—f the warder sheweth to be a most malitious fiction without any grounde or colour of truth To all which obseruations and deductions of the warder the K t. answereth nothing at all in this last replie but filleth vp paper with tales eyther deuised by himself or taken out of Ihon Fox as for example of one â—esselius a merchant of Pardons and of the absolution of one Symon a Monke that is forged to haue poysoned K. Ihon and other such stuffe which yow shal heare discussed and refuted afterward and therby see and perceyue how iustlie this last replie of S â— Francis is called a Wast-word And so we shal passe on to the particular examination of matters point by point ABOVT THE GENERAL charge of false dealing layd to sir Francis in this Encounter and how euil he auoydeth thesame by committing new falshoodes treacheries CAP. II. FIRST then the general charge layd to our K t. throughout this whole second Encounter concerneth two poyntes to wit falsitie and falsifying the later wherof hath this differeÌ„ce from the first that it is both witting and willingly committed and
deceyts day and night geuing them-selues ouer to lustes of the flesh being spotted with adulteries and besydes all this most of them did hault in the articles of their fayth And after this he cometh to talk of religious orders in lyke sorte Religious men also corrupted and principally of those that hauing no possessions liued by almes and were most corrupted and set on by wicliffe against those that had possessions of whome WalsinghaÌ„ sayth suae professionis immemâ—res c. possessionatis inuidentes c. being vnmyndful of their profession and enuying such of other religious orders as had possessions in tantum illam veritatis professionem suam maculabant vt in dâ—ebus illis c. They did spot so farre foorth their profession of truth as in those dayes yt was in euery mÌ„anes mouth that this is a Fryar ergo a lyar This is the discourse of WalsinghaÌ„ wherin yow see first that he speaketh not of all fryars nor against the profession it selfe of fryars which he sayth was the profession of truthe but against such as being forgetful therof and brought â—o maligne and enuie other orders that had possessions which was the art and doctrine of Wicliffe became lyars so as these were S r. F. his fryars and not of S. Francis as before I noted and when he telleth their faults he vttereth the shame of his new ghospel Fox in Calend 2. lan which begane in England by VVicliffe as Fox doth testifie who maketh this first prophet of theirs a Saynt and kalender Martyr Fox monumeÌ„t Pag. 421. though he died in his bed at his benefice in Lincolneshire as Fox denyeth not yet such was his talent in making martyrs And besydes this he discouereth to the Reader to much false dealing in that amoÌ„g all the faultes of Bishops nobilitie comonaltie and religious orders touched seuerally as yow haue heard by his author walsingham he culled out only the lying of Fryars Syr F. taken in false dealing and those not of ours but of his fryars who were made lyars not by their owne institution or by our religion but by the principles of Wiclifs Doctrine which S.F. acknowledgeth I think for his Consider then the mannes wit in alleaging this exaÌ„ple and his truth in handling the same And by this one iudge of the rest though there wil not want other occasions after to coÌ„template also the same much more And hitherto now we haue talked of the general charge of lying and falshood layd to S r. Francis and how he hath sought to auoyd the same by recharging vs and some of ours againe with like fault which as if they were true and could be verified they deliuer not him of his fault so being found also to be false they double his former error and make him more culpable to which effect and for iustifying more the charge layd vpon him of bould false assertions we are now to examine some other particulars of lyke qualitie For more clearer performance wherof I shal set downe some lynes of the Warder which conteyne the first controuersie or charge Thus then he wrote at that tyme. But before S.F. cometh to the matter that is VVardvvord Pag. 1â— to set downe those absurd principles of ours he maketh for his preface a certayne poetical descrâ—ption of the darke cloudy and mistie state of things in Queene Maries tyme in these words It is not vnknown sayth he to many yet liuing neyther can it be altogether hidden from the yonger sort that lyâ—ed with them what a darke mistie cloude of ignorance which brought in popish Idolatrie Deuised darknes and all manner of superstition did ouer shade the whole land c. And againe after In these darke cloudy dayes least the sunshine of knowledge should disperse the mistes of ignorance and geue light to the dimme of sight c. Doth it not seeme that this graue geÌ„tleman describeth the lake of Auernus in Italie or some foggie marsh in England or some smokie kitchen or woodhouse of his owne without a window when he speaketh of our famons country in sormer tymes for aboue a thousand yeares the state of England and the Princes people nobilitie and learned men therof had continued in that Egyptian or rather Cymerian darknes which this gentleman describeth vnder clouds mistes and shadowes vntil his new sunneshine doctors came to inlighten the same And it was accompted then as wyse learned holy valiant noble and florishing a kingdome aswel for religion as otherwise as France Italie Spayne and other reading the scriptures in English could not iudge whether matters of doctrine and religion taught them by their Prelats were true or no as though now they could do it by english reading and that for this cause and for lack of Scriptures in English a number of lving miracles were beleeued and in steed of Christs blood the blood of a duck was worshipped as the blood of Hales was playnly proued to be Syr Francis posed in dicerning a duckes blood from other and openly shewed at Paules crosse in K. Hen. dayes which yet I would aske our Kâ— how a ducks blood could be discerned froÌ„ other blood after so many yeares All this I say and many other such manifest vanities See aftervvard cap. 6. vvhat O. E vvryteth also of this matter and knowne vntruthes as that Bishops in Q. Maries tyme did not preach nor others for them except certayne strawbery sermons of â—â—otting fryars and the lyke These bold assertions I say and contumelious irrisions being knowne to be false aswel by aâ—l that are yet liuing and sawe those tymes as by the books of Homelies and sermons yet extant I meane not to stand vpon the answering in this place but to passe ouer to matter of more substance and to consider of an example or two of ignorance in Q Maries tyme and before For this Kâ— for a ful and irrefragable proof that all was ignorance among Catholykes before the light oâ— Luthers Gospel began to shine VVastvvord Pag. 32. The storie of D Bassinet a â— frenche Apostata Fryar he bringeth vs the only examplâ— as he sayth of D. Bassinet â— man of great learning and autâ—oritie in France whâ— confessed his owne ignoraÌ„ce vntil he fel to read the Scriptures though he had byn a Iudge vpon heretiks beforeâ— Look heere gentle reader the important proof that he alleageth for his purpose cyting only Iohn Fox his Acts and Monuments in the Margent Fox edit ver Pag. 862. but neyther he nor Fox do alleage any one Author where we may read the storie for this is also Fox his shift among others wheÌ„ he meaneth notorious treacherie and yf the whole narration of this Bassinet confessing himself to be ignorant before he fel into the new ghospel were true what authoritie or credit may the saying of an Apostata Fryar fallen into heresy haue against his former state and condition is it maruaile yf he say that he was in ignorance
interpretations are then in holy Scriptures The ministers ridiculous circuling Here is one circle heare an other Is he hath bestowed the gifte of interpreting scriptures on the Churche how should the people be better assured of the excellency of the Churcâ—es interpretation then by seing the same confirmed by scriptures This is the second circle more foolish then the former And mark heere good people the assurance which these men doe teache yow for your safty in reading scriptures when yow vnderstand not the letter of the Scripture first saith he yow must goe to Christ the best interpreter and when yow vnderstand not Christs interpretation yow must returne to the letter of the Scriptures to know the excellency of Christs interpretation and yf yow vnderstand neither then must yow goe to the interpretation of the Churche and yf yow vnderstaÌ„d not that then must yow goe backe againe to the scriptures to assure your self as he saith of the excellency of the Churches interpretation Intricat dealing of hereticks about vnderstanding of scriptures But in all this going and comming turning and wynding I would aske our whirle-headed Minister who shal be iudge or where shal the stay be or how can symple people discerne of these things which he prescribeth One wil think he hath the letter with him anâ— other the sense and spirit a third the inspiracioÌ„ of Christ a fourth the interpretatioÌ„ of the Churche then wil all foure fall out where and what and which is the Churche and must returne to the Scriptures againe and to their owne fancies and interpretations about this and all the rest And this is the graue and sure direction which O. E. deliuereth vs. To my other instance and example of the Eunuch Apostle afterward of Ethiopia as S. Ireney and other fathers do cal hym to whom reading and not vnderstanding the Prophet Isay Iraeneus Christ by his Angel sent Philip to be his interpretor this fellow answereth nothing but that it was not Philip the Apostle but the Deacon who was sent But what of this yf it were so Doth this answere the argument The glosse vpon that place of the Acts saith Nie. de Lyre in cap. â— Act. that diuers learned men were of different opinion about that matter whether it were Philip the Apostle or Philip the Deacon that was sent to the Eunuche And Tertullian more neare to that tyme then our Minister by a thousand and foure hundred yeares Tertul. lib. de Bapt. c. 1â— and more learned then he by ten thousand and fyue hundred yardes doth call this Philip an Apostle twise within fiue lynes But what if it were Philip the Deacon what hurteth it my argument eyther of them is sufficient for our purpose to proue that this Eunuche being a principal cheef man and a Proselyt ore Iew by religion and not vnlearned in both their law and language as appeareth by his reading their scriptures yet had he need of an external interpreter to be sent to him by God Wherof is inferred that muche more vnlearned simple people reading scriptures traÌ„slated into vulgar tongues and for the most part corrupted by Sectaries to their hands haue need to be moderated and wel directed in this matter to the end they gayne and not leese therby whâ—ch poynt the Warder proueth by euident effects of infynit heresyes rysen by rash and vnreuerent reading of the Scriptures Luther in which respect Luther himself against other Sectaries ympugning hym by shew of Scriptures calleth it Librum haereticorum the proper book of heretikes whence all of them by euil interpretacion doe frame their heresyes Wee see also within the space of these fowre score late yeares since the Byble hath byn layd open to all sortes of people in all vulgar languages what a Sea of monstrous sects and diuisions haue flowed vpon vs wherof the Warder also giueth diuers particuler examples in England it self and those punished also by Protestants as of Ioane Burcher William Hacket William Ieffrey and others Vnto all which experience declaration this good fellow answereth breeflie thus It is not reading of Scriptures which he styleth rash reading vsed by lay people Pag 49. but neglect of scriptures bringeth forth errour and heresy So that say what yow wilâ— and proue what yow wil this fellow wipeth of all with a bare denial Yet whether neglect of Scriptures or rash or vnreuerent reading which he doth here bring in as opposit may not in some sense be the self same I leaue to discreet men to ponder and thereby the wit of this wryter And where as he saith that heretiks by Tertullian are called Lucifugae Scripturarum Ibideâ—â— the bars of scriptures for that they fly from the true light of scriptures I would pray the reader by this one place to ponder wel with himself of this the fraudulent cogging companion for he would haue it seme and to that end he brinâ—eth it in that Tertullian did assigne it for peculiar propertie of heretikes to fly reaâ—ing of scriptures wherof here we entreat which is so false as nothing can be more and â—â—at wel knoweth the seared conscience of his deceitful Minister A notable abusing Tertullian Tertul. lib. de praescrip aduers haeret cap. 15. seing that the whole â—earned discourse of Tertullian De praescriptioâ—us aduersus haereticos that is of prescriptions â—prescribing against heretikes is principally 〈◊〉 exclude them from tryal by scriptures â—herof they bragged and wherevnto they â—ould seme to runne as ours do now adayes 〈◊〉 this he doth from the 17. Chapter downewards and before he entreth into this demonâ—â—ration he vseth this Preamble Ipsi de Scriptuâ—agunt de scripturis suadent scripturas obtendunt â—c hac sua andacia statim quosdam mouent Heâ—â—tiks do treat of scriptureâ— do perswade out scripture doe pretend scriptures and with is their audacytie doe moue some peoâ—â—e c. And in the very book alleaged by our Miâ—â—â—ter out of Tertullian De resurrectione caruis sheweth that heretikes are great scripture â—n but to peruert and not to vnderstand them aright and that without scrâ—pture no heresyâ— can be founded Tertul. lib de carnts resurrect c. 40. Haereses saith he esse non possent si non perperam scripturae intelligi possent There could not be heresyes yâ— the scrâ—ptures could not be euil vnderstood And in the very particuler place and controuersy handled by him of the resurrection of the flesh and body against heretikes that denyed thesame vnder preâ—ence of scripture he saith to one of them Ibid. c. 10. Tenâ—s scripturas utbus caro infuscatur tene ettam quibus illustratur Thow dost alleage scriptures wherby the basenes and infirmytie of our flesh is set forth harcken aâ—so to those scrâ—ptures by whiâ—h thesame is exalted and gâ—orified And then passâ—ng ouer to an other poynt of proof he alleageth a place out of the Apostle 1. Thess 5. for resurrection of the flesh saying thus Age
what this or that man thinketh but that yow take counsel rather of holy scriptures and learne by them which are true riches indeed Thus saith S. Chrisostome and now let vs briefly examine how many wayes the K. hath peruerted this one place The abuse offred by S. F. to 5. Chrysostome to make it sound somewhat to his purpose albeit not muche though it were as he alleageth it But first of all he wresteth his whole meaning as before I haue noted which is the greatest sinne in alleaging any author that may be For S. Chrysost treateth a far differeÌ„t question from ours to wit of true and false riches as in the title of the Chapter he professeth and hauing handled it largely he concludeth in those first woords by me alleaged and guâ—lfully cut of and left out by S r. F. Quae cumita sint c. which things being so let not vs follow the opinion of the vulgar sort about true riches and pouerty but let vs consider thinges â—â— they be in theÌ„selues c. which woords do wholy ouerthrow S r. F. principal illation that vnlearned people should not follow other mens opinions to wit their Pastors in matters of religion but go try it in scriptures wherof S. Chrysostome neuer so much as dreamed Secondly the first woords alleaged by the K t. in Latyn Quomodo absurdum non est c. are not so in S. Chrysostome as yow see by those which I haue alleaged which is a token that he had them out of some Ministers notebook and read them not himself Thirdly the woord praeposterum left out in his translation importeth some fraud also for that this woord sheweth the comparison not to be betwene reading of scriptures other mens testimonies especially our ordinarie Cath. Pastors as he would haue it seme Fourthly those other woordes But for more excellent thinges simplie to follow other mens sayinges are not in the text as yow may see by comparing it but are deceitfully layd together to make men think that simple obedience or belief of our teachers in Gods Churche is here repreheÌ„ded by S. Chrisostome and that euery man and woman is willed to go to the scriptures And for this cause fifthly he translateth those woordes diuinarum legum sententiam the testimony of the law of God where as the sentence or determination of these deuine lawes heere spoken of by S. Chrysostome as they be conteyned partly in scriptures and partly in the traditioÌ„ of Gods Churche which was before scriptures were written so is it not necessary for euery man and woman to be remitted to reading of scriptures for learning them as heer is pretended It followeth sixtly in S. Chrysostome VVherfore I pray and besech yow all that in these things yow wil not stand vpon what this or that man thinketh c. Which woords S r. F. translateth thus I pray and besech yow that yow wil leaue what this or that man thinketh c. leauing out of purpose the woords that make most to the matters de hijs rebus of these things to wit of true and false riches which is the subiect handled by S. Chrysostome And S r. F. would haue his readerâ— thinke though neuer so vnlearned that he is prayed in all matters of Religion to leaue what this or that man thinketh though it be his Pastor or any other Cath. teacher and enquire all those things of the scriptures which is most absurd and furthest from S. Chrysostomâ— meaning And in these very last woordes of the K t. there be two or three shiftâ—s and manifest corruptions for where as S. Chrysostome sayth Scripturas sacras de eis consulatis he translateth it and enquire all these things of the scriptures adding the woord all of purpose to disguise the meaning of S. Chrysostome as though he would haue all matters by euery man and woman imediatly searched out from the scriptures as though he had not handled a particuler argument for which the scriptures were to be consulted against the vayne opinioÌ„ of vulgar men about true and false riches for which cause the K t. cutteth of also the next imediat woords following in the self same senteÌ„ce for explication of S. Chrysostoms meaning ac quae verae sint opes cognoscatis and that yow may knowe which are true riches And thus I haue byn longer then I thought to be in notifying vnto yow this maner of dealing of S.F. and his Minister as in the precedent Chapter yow haue sene also about the handling of Hosius when they cite any Fathers or Authors of moment against vs which commonly is with such fraud and deceit corruption and mangling as if the controuersy were for mens shuwes not soules or for shuw-soles or as if it were for some teÌ„poral and earthly tryfles and not for the euerlasting possession of hel or heauen But let vs see more of this kind of proceeding in the K t. It is reâ—orded saith he that some of the learneder sort of your Cleargie haue vsed to say among their friends Pag 54. Paralip Abb. vrspergen Pag 448. Sic dicerem in Scholis Sed tamen manet inâ—er nos c. I would say so in the Scholes but yet let it be kept secret amongst our selues I think the contrary These woords I do not fynd in the Author by him alleaged cited in the margyn and therfore God knoweth from what forge they come perhaps by some Ministers notebook that eyther deuised or corrupted them in cyting But suppose they may be found and that some Schole readers in matters eyther of philosophie or diuinity for he specifieth no science not belonging to any article of faith should say thus Impertinent matter brought in that in the schooles for not offending any part he would follow the coÌ„mon opinions of that vniuersity of schole though in priuat for himself he were of an other opinion what doth this proue or to what end was this brought forth by the K t. to confirme his principal propositioÌ„ that we forbid laymeÌ„ to medle in matters of religion do yow see what direct proofes they bring But harken yet further to another charge immediatly following more heynous then this The Fathers sayth he yow haue mangled and depraued where their testimonies were pregnant against your errors Pag. 54. as for example that plaine place of Gregory Nissene eam solummodo uaturam quae increata est colere venerari dâ—dicimus we haue learned to adore and worship only that nature which is vncreated where your Spanish diuines in their Index expurgatorius set downe this direction deleatur dictio solummodo put out the word only and sundry such places as both Of diuers Iudices printed and pablished in sundry contries our learned men haue discouered and in your Indices are to be found out c. Yf our Indices be extant Sir and that in print to shew to the world what we do in this behalf then is not necessary the
in Dei maâ—u non quâ—uis Euery man is not in the hand of God And finally Deus non colitur ab homine malo Serm. 55. God is not worshipped by an euil man c. In all which sentences yow se there is need of some censure examimation according as this Index doth note and albeit by marginal notes they are pretended to be taken out of auncient Fathers yet neyther is it alwayes so nor do they coÌ„teyne good doctrine as yow see it appertayneth to the sollicitude of the Cath. churche to giue notice therof where need is least simple people be deceaued And thus yow se that we haue iustified the practise of our Churche in this behalf and haue shewed the quarrels to be vayne and foolish and not sincerely treated by him and when all is sayd and considered yow shal fynd it farre from his purpose which is and ought to be to proue if he could that we forbid lay men to meddle in matters of religion which â—e proued first for that they had not the scriptures in English and then for that we peruert as he sayth the ancient Fathers with the ceÌ„sure of deleatur when any sentence lyketh vs not Of which two proofes whether is most from the purpose let the reader iudge who hath heard them both discussed The calling in of O. E. But wil yow heare now in a woord or two what S r. F. FraÌ„cis souldiar of supply O.E. saith in this point VVhat the minister O. E. saith about this controuersy First yow must imagine he had seene all both what the watchman and the Warder had said before and what Syr Francis also had replied and yet he commeth in with a flat new assertion as though he had seene nothing hitherto Pag. 5â— Likewayes saith he they teach that laymen may not medle with matters of religion that is that Princes haue no power to reforme the Churche nor make Ecclesiastical lawes Yea Syr Minister wil yow run out at that hole and is that the meaning of the K t. assertion How then followeth the second part that therby we make all laymen carelesse of God and all godlynes and how doth the K t. himself go about to defend it by saying that we barre â—ay-men from reading scriptures in English can this be vnderstood only of Princes and their authority to make ecclesiastical lawes Who euer saw such brasen faces as not to blush thus to disagree But harken to his inference vpon this bold assertion and confesse that he may beare the bel for impudency Yf the Papists sayth he do so remoue lay-men from gouernment in Eeclesiastical causes that they need not to care how God is serued then are they not wroÌ„ged by S r. Francis c. Who would loose tyme to dispute with this compagnion and much lesse to answere him in his â—rantick contumelious speech against F. Persons which all men knowing to be vniust and false and so to be prooued by infinit witnesses and to proceed only from a slaunderous and ignominious tongue of a lewd malitious minister is rather to be â—ontemned then answered And so this shal suffice for examination of this position ABOVT S. THOMAS of Canterbury whether he were a traytor or no as malitiously he is called by sir Francis and O. E. and what notorious impostures both they and Fox do deuise to disgrace him against the testimony of all ancient wryters CAP. X. BVt now we must come to a greater controuersy about S. Thomas Becket Archbishop of Canterbury whome Syr Francis without all occasion bringeth into controuersy among other impertinent points to maintayne matter of talk For his subiect being of lay-men debarred the scriptures and therby as he sayth made carelesse of God all godlynes how might it fal to his purpose think yow to rayle at this blessed archbishop martyred so long agoe and raigning now in heauen for so many hundred yeares but that such prince-parasits as these do think they cannot grace themselues sufficiently with Kings and Queenes now a dayes in EnglaÌ„d except they haue a fling at this hoâ—y man who stood in the gappe and lost his lyfe for the defence of his Churches liberty Wherfore S r. F. hauing both falsely and foolishly witten in the watchword that among Catholyks there was no more required at lay-mens handes to the exercise of pieâ—y but only to go deuoutly to masse and to confession once a yeare and then though he were to be taynted with the grossest sinnes yet Rome had a trick to hale them into the rabble of their saints and so to canonise them Yow se how liberal this gentleman is in canonizing that requireth no more perfection but once a yeare to go to masse and confession and then he addeth Of this we haue example of Tho. Becket in K. Henry the 3. his tyme whose treason to the Prince was apparant and manifest c. Thus saith he in his Watchword wherin the Warder tooke him vp for diuers vntruthes and absurdities as namely for saying that we hold it for sufficient perfection of holines to heare masse and confesse once a yeare and that a man may be a Saint with vs yea canonized though he be taynted with the grossest sinnes that may be That S. Tho. of Canterbury was such a one canonized in the tyme of K. Henry the third c. which last point to omit the rest about the tyme of the death A grosse error About the tyme of S Thomas his death and canonization of S. Thomas vnder K. Henry the third as this man saith and not the second is shewed not only to be false but of grosse ignorance also seing that K. Henry the 3. nephew to the second was borne more then 30. yeares after the death and canonization of S. Thomas to which represension of error in story I do not fynd that S. F. giueth any reason of iust excuse in this his reply now nor yet O. E. for him but rather as though nothing had byn said against him for it turneth to repeat againe the same error vnder pretence of a namelesse author though in the manner of telling his tale he would couertly seeme somwhat to answere the obiection for thus he wryteth To examyne a litle saith he the State of this Becket Pag 55. who was a traitor as I do affirme and not I only but * None euer except some late heretiks many before me against king Henry the second but to vse the words of my author taken vp and shryned for a new saint made of an old rebel 50. yeares after his death which was in the fourth yeare of king Henry the third c. But this being so notorious an vntruth if he meane of his canonization as by his former woords in the Watch word may appeare he being reprehended for it before as yow haue heard for modesties sake should at least haue named his author for some shew or defence For if it be Iohn Fox or
their orders inioyned and comaunded in such reuerence and regard must he and his Cleargie be had that the meanest maspriest coming with authority from him must be obeyed vnder payne of damnation though he command that which is blasphemous before God in christians and disloyal to men in subiects Impudent calumniatioÌ„ This is his narration From which saith the Warder yf we separate a manifestly or two with some fond exaggerations for without this kynd of leuen the poor knight can make no batch as for example that the Pope and his Cleargy must be obeyed though they commaund blasphemies against God and disloyalty against princes which is a 〈…〉 disobedience yf 〈…〉 order inioyned by th◠〈…〉 and the like 〈…〉 ouerlashings of the 〈…〉 obiecteth is rather 〈…〉 religion then any reproch at all For in that he saith we obey the meanest priest as the highest yf he come with authority of the highest he sheweth therby that we haue among vs true obedieÌ„ce and subordination and that for conscience sake not respecting so much the person that commaundeth as him for whome in whose name and authority he comandeth and therin we fulfil the precept of S. Paul Hebr. 1â— Obedite praepositis vestris subiacete eis ipsi enim peruigilant quasi rationem pro animabus vestris reddituri Obey your Prelats and humble your selues vnto them he distinguisheth not betwene high and low for they keep diligent watch ouer your soules as men that must render account therof to God And in other places he saith that this obedience must be with such reuerence Ephes. â— humility and inward affection as vnto Christ himself whose substitutes our spiritual Superiors be though neuer so meane or contemptible in mannes sight Thus it was answered then by the warder and more also added to that purpose out of diuers places of scriptures And how replyeth Syr F. now Can he defend these ouerlashing speeches Can he shew that any one Cathol wryter that euer put pen to paper held this most absurd ground The knight is vrged to aunsvver that he setteth downe 〈…〉 when 〈…〉 almightie God 〈…〉 vpon him 〈…〉 Now he should 〈…〉 substantially he 〈…〉 proof wherof saith he that which your owne men haue wrytten of the infinit power of the Pope may abundantly suffice namely though all the world iudge in any matter against him yet we ought to stand to the iudgmeÌ„t of him c. And whosoeuer is not obedient to the lawes of the Churche of Rome must be denied an heretike c. And though he draw infinite soules with him to hel yet no man may presume to say why do yow thus c. Lo heer good reader what maner of proof this knight bringeth First new assertions as idle and doubtful as the first and cytheth no one author in the margent where these things are to be found or discussed And secondly yf all were true this proueth the greatnesse only of the Popes authority to edificatioÌ„ not to destruction to good not to euil albeit the last point wherin he affirmeth that no man may say to the Pope why do yow thus though he draw infinite soules with him into hel it being an ordinary comon place as wel to all wryters and wranglers in their books as preachers praters against the Pope in their pulpits we shal examin the same afterwards towards the end of this Chapter against the minister O.E. for that he vouchsafeth to cyte some author for the same though falsly and fraudulently as yow shal see Now then let vs heare how our knigh◠〈…〉 the premises 〈…〉 And your holy 〈…〉 to tell vs in his 〈…〉 mory that Christ 〈…〉 Paul but him that 〈…〉 this diuinity we must obey â—â—â— Pope whatsoeuer Petâ—â— and Paul teach vs to the contrary And this I hope is a sufficient iustification of my accusation c. Lo how roundly he riddeth himself But yet note good reader 4. points of Syr F. diuinity out of this one sentence with a preface conuenient thervnto 〈…〉 kind of 〈…〉 His preface consisteth in qualifying the wrytings of D. Harding and M. Iewel calling the former an inuectiue and the later of blessed memory wheras all learned men that haue read the same with indifferency and diuers great protestants also conuerted by that reading wil and do testifie the contrary to wit that D. Hardings wryting against Iewel especially his last book called D. Hardinges vvorkes against Iuel The returne of vntruthes was rather a coÌ„uictiue then an inuectiue leauing M. Iewel with the commendation rather of a lying then blessed memory And so I dare auouch that any maÌ„ shal find him who hath tyme learning store of books patience indifferency to read and examin him Now then let vs examin the foure points before mentioned wherof the first is his ordinary slieght wherby he alleageth D. Hardings assertion about S. Peter S. Paul without telling vs where to the end that the truth of this citation may not be examined and for that 〈…〉 playing 〈…〉 iustly suspect 〈…〉 the proposition 〈…〉 which is as 〈…〉 of vs now not â—◠〈…〉 sitteth in their chaire Which if it be to 〈◊〉 S. Peter S. Paul being now absent cannot personally determine all matters as when they were here in earth but haue left their successors in their place to be obeyed as themselues Why should this propositioÌ„ so much mislike our K t Sure I am that he dareth not deny the same or equiualeÌ„t therof in the magistrats of diuers citties Princes teÌ„poral successors And yf a man for examples sake should aske him whether God do commaund English men at this day to obey the Queene that now raigneth in matters belonging to her gouernment or rather VVilliam Conquerour first founder of this Monarchie or K. Henry the 8. her Ma ties Father and so in other Princes as whether the present K. of France be to be obeyed and respected or Hugo Capetus the first founder of his house No man wil doubt but that present Princes and gouernors are to be obeyed And yf in temporal successors this be to be obserued why not also in spiritual Is the K t. so simple as he seeth not the coÌ„uenience of this matter and that gouernours present and not past are to be repayred vnto for present resolution and decision of affayres If God in his Churche had willed men to obey S. Peter and S. Paul 〈…〉 wils 〈…〉 not known 〈…〉 expres writings 〈…〉 only their epistles 〈…〉 world nor were other 〈…〉 gouernors nor yet wrytings needful whiâ—â— yet is most absurd in all mennes sights for that all causes incident are not determined in S. Peter and S. Paul their epistles nor can all men read and vnderstand them and consequently is needful the authority of a present gouernour sâ—tting in their chayre and hauing thesame authority that they had which we beleeue to be in the Pope for necessary gouernment of the Churche Thirdly then consider
〈…〉 to agree about the poysoning of 〈…〉 wheras no one of them holdeth it 〈…〉 contrary as yow haue hard But how then commeth in this 〈…〉 cal story so much vrged and diligenâ—t thâ— forth by Iohn Fox in his lying acts and 〈…〉 Yow may read in Iohn Stow 〈◊〉 the place alleadged the first author therof for it was an author without a name whichâ— wrote about a hundred and seuentene yeares agoe and took vpon him to continew the fabulous story of Geffrey of Monmouth among infinite other fables telleth also this of King Iohns poysoning as he receyued it by some vulgar report The book was caused to be printed at the charges of one VVilliam Caxton and so comonly called Caxtons chronicle and in the prologue he wryteth thus In the yeare of our lord 1483. in the 22. yeare of the raigne of K. Edward the 4. at S. Albons so that all mâ—n may know the acts of our noble Kings of England are compiled in this book c. This went in the prologue and then in the end agayne he sayth thus Here endeth this present chronicle of England with the fruite of tymes compiled in a book and also printed by one sometyme scholmaister of S. Albons vpon whose soule God haue mercy Amen And newly imprinted in Fleetstreet at the signe of the Sunne by me VViâ—ken de word In the yeare of our Lord God 1515. 〈…〉 how this book was 〈…〉 withall many hundreds 〈…〉 in the book set downe after the 〈…〉 wyues tales naming no author 〈…〉 he had it for he liued almost 300. 〈…〉 the fact all the former authors 〈…〉 that liued with King Iohn or 〈…〉 to this mannes tyme excepting only 〈…〉 â—onicon that meÌ„tioneth it as a vulgar tale 〈…〉 polidore after him with like reiection all â—â—ners I say former wryters which best should know the truth not only made no meÌ„tion therof but set downe expressely other manner and causes of K. Ihons death as yow haue heard and yet would Fox of meere malice and against his owne conscience beleeue this author against all the rest and set it forth in print pagents and paintings as before hath byn sayd and all other English heretyks since haue followed him in the same impudency both in bookes sermons common speeches which sheweth that they do not follow reason nor seek truthe but only to hold the reader in error by any meanes of sleight or â—alshood whatsoeuer which ought to warne euery true Christian man who seeketh sincerely to know the verity of matters in controuersy and the saluation of his owne soule not to beleeue so easily these cosening people but to enter into better consideration of their doings especially of Iohn Fox the most fraudulent and perfidious wryter that euer put pen to paper in our language if I be not greatly deceyued who haue taken paynes 〈…〉 many others to examine the 〈…〉 wilful falshood of diuers of his 〈…〉 But to returne againe to Sir 〈…〉 Reader note one trick more of his 〈…〉 wing this story of K. Iohn to be as I 〈…〉 was not only content to vse Fox his frauâ—â—â—â— deceyue his Reader but would needs ad somâ— what of his owne deuise also For albeit thâ— former Chronicle of Caxâ—on if so it may be called do recount the summe of the matter most fondly as to the Reader may appeare yet doth he not tel that the monks name was Symon as S. Francis calleth him nor that his Abbot highly commended him for his zeale as Syr Francis addeth out of Fox his inuention who forgeth also that the monk alleaged for himself the prophesy of Cayphas Iohn 11. saying It is better that one dy then all the people perish and moreouer I am wel contented to loose my life and so become a martyr that I may vtterly destroy this tyrant and then with that the Abbot did weep for gladnes and much commended his feruent zeale c. All these speches and circumstances I say are added and much more by Iohn Fox and S. FraÌ„cis to the Story to make it vp more ful for that no such word is in the author CaxtoÌ„ but rather the contrary that both the monk and the abbot were very sorrowful And last of all it is most false which is the principal part of this Story for which it was brought in by Sir Francis that the Abbot gaue him absolution before hand for the committing of this 〈…〉 it had byn committed for 〈…〉 such matter at all in the story but 〈…〉 he asked to be shriuen and assoyled 〈…〉 of his sinnes but not that the 〈…〉 yeild ther-vnto and much lesse 〈…〉 was any mention on eyther part of 〈…〉 olution for the sinne to come but rather â—r his sinnes past as men are wont to doe when they go to warre or to lyke attempts where many sinnes are ordinarily comitted for which no man asketh absolution before hand as our two maysters heer wil needs haue the monk to haue done though in deed Sir Francis is the more impudent of the two for that Iohn Fox durst not to auouch this manifestly of absoluing aforehand for sinnes to come yet our knight blusheth not to affirme ytâ— without all warrant or witnesse in the world and so becommeth the disciple worse then his maister Fox setteth downe the words somewhat more cunningly and dexterously 〈◊〉 and Fox 〈◊〉 riue 〈…〉 hal 〈◊〉 most â—â—dulently to wit The monk being absolued of his Abbot a forehand went c. where yow see that he putteth downe the word a forehand with a parenthesis as added of himself if any would vrge him of falshood But S r. Francis taketh quite a way the parenthesis and affirmeth the matter absolutely saying He highly commended his zeale and gaue him absolution a forehand for committing of this wicked act c. And by this let the reader iudge of them both Maister and scholler doctor disciple and I haue byn the longer in diciphering their cosenage in this one example to the end that their malice and lack of coÌ„science being fully seene in few points may be held suspected in the rest For that most true it is that they who in matters of religion do falsifie and lye of purpose cannot possibly be thought to be true or religious in any thing nor to seek religion for religion but faction and self wil vnder the name of religioÌ„ let them say what they wil. And this shal suffise for this chapter where is nothing to be added about our minister O.E. for that he passeth ouer with vtter silence all that the knight hath handled in this place about the poysoning of king Iohn so as all the blame must light vpon himself his champioÌ„ not presuming to make any defence at all for him Now then let vs passe to that which ensueth THE SPEECH OF THE warder is defended wher he calleth the way of saluation by only faith the common Cart way of protestants the truthe of which doctrin is examined CAP.
corruption vsed by S.F. and Iohn Fox in alleaging the authority of Caesarius against the miracles of S. Thomas of Canterbury Encount 2. cap. 12. num 12. Syr F. conuinced of a notorious wilful calumniation about our Ladyes conception Encount 2. cap. 14. num 23.24 c. Sir F. abuseth Duraâ—d in alleaging him about pardons Enc. 2. cap. 15. n. 3.4 c. A notorious imposture of Sir F. and Iohn Fox about the deuised poisoning of King Iohn by a monk THE FOVRTH TABLE OF THE PRINCIPAL PARTICVLAR MATter 's conteyned in this book A. ANGELS whether they may be prayed vnto Enc. 2. cap. 6. num 8. Archbishop of Aix a most learned prelate greatly abused by S. F. and Iohn Fox Enc. 2. cap. 2. num 21. Arnobius abused by S. Francis as though he spake against Christian Images Enc. 2. cap. 3. num 17. Augustinus Stenchus falsified by O. E. the minister Enc. 1. cap. 3. num 10. 11. S. Augustine abused greatly by S. Francis Enc. 1. cap. 8. B. BAssinet a French Apostata friar made Doctor by Fox and S. Francis Enc. 2. cap. 2. num 20. S. Bernard his iudgment of the Popes titles of honour Enc. 1. cap. 3. num 15. S. Bernard his sentence touching mannes merits and Gods grace Enc 1. cap. 10. num 8. 9. About a Cath. man beyted in a Beares skyn Enc. 2. cap. 2. num 4. S. Bede his testimony notably abused by S. Francis Enc. 2. cap. 3. num 4. Blessings of England by the new ghospel are not present but past according to S. F. Enc. 1. cap. 2. num 15. Blessings of Protestants religion of 2. sorts and neyther of them true Enc. 1. cap. 4. num 4. Blessings of vnity among protestants Enc. 1. cap. 4. per totum Item the blessings of Reading seruice in English Enc. 1. cap. 8. per totum Item the 4. and 5. blessings aboundance of good vvorks and freedome from persecution Enc. 1. cap. 10. per totum Fiue other blessings Ibid. cap. 11. 12. Bookeseller of Auinion put to death for heresy Enc. 2. cap. 5. num 5. No books of old heretyks haue remayned to posterity and why Enc. 2. cap. 9. num 19. Buccanan the Scottish Caluinist what desperate docâ—rine he teacheth about deposition of Princes Enc. 1. cap. 6. num 3. 4. C. CAyetan Card. beguiled by Luthers flattery at Augusta Enc. 2. cap. 4. num 3. Caluyn how he rayleth against Lutherans Enc. 1. cap. 5. n. 5. What himself is called by Hesshusius ibid. n. 7. and by Ochinus and VVestphalus ibid. Who are true Catholiks at this day according to the decrees of Auncient christian Emperours obseruat n. 17. 18.19 c. Catholike faith manifestly deduced and demonstrated against new Sectaryes by the decrees of auncient Emperors obseruat n. 27.28.29 c. Charles the Emperour his decree and determination about Luther after he had heard him Enc. 2. cap. 4. nu 8. Chemnitius his censure of English religion Enc. 1. c. 5. n. 9.10 c. S. Chrisostome his testimony of priests authority Enc. 1. cap. 3. n. 13. Communion-book of English protestants how it is esteemed by the Puritans Enc. 1. cap. 6. n. 9. Commons and nobility miserably corrupted by Wicliffes doctrine Enc. 2. cap. 2. n. 10.11 c. Clanmer and Cromwels actions against Q. Anne Bullen Enc. 1. cap. 3. n. 7. Cuâ—sings brought in by the new ghospellers in steed of blessings Enc. 1. cap. 12. per totum Eight temporal curses or maledictions ensued by the change of Religion in England Enc. 1. cap. 18. per totum D. DArkenesse deuised by S. F. and pittifully described to be in the Cath. Churche Enc. 2. cap. 2. num 15. Deuotion whether shee be the daughter of ignorance or no Euc. 2. cap. 7. num 3.4 c. What true deuotion is ibid. num 17. How deuotion may be hindered more by a knowne then an vnknowne tongue Encount 2. cap. 7. num 18. E. EArle of Essex pittifully seduced by PuritaÌ„s Notes vpoÌ„ the epist. of S. F. num 5. 6. Item of the same obseruat num 5. The hope of his followers and of O. E. the minister in particular Enc. 1. cap. 13. num 13. Emperors Christian their lawes and decrees against heretyks do touch protestants and not Catholyks obseru num 10. English Religion what it is according to Chemnitius Euc. â— cap. 5. num 10. English seruice no blessing to the common people but rather vnprofitable and hurtful to deuotion Enc. 1. cap. â— num 7. Erasmus what he sayth of the protestants good liues in his tyme. Euc. 1. cap. 10. num 1.2.3 c. F. FIdes explicitae and implicita how necessary the disiunction therof is to be knowne Enc. 2. cap. 7. num 7.3 c. More things needful to be beleeued by some men then by others ibid. num 10. Fox taken in playne calumniation Enc. 1. cap. 11. num 4. Fox defendeth the most dangerous doctrine of Iohn Husse about deposing of Princes Enc. 2. cap. 3. num 24. Friars how deceytfully they are prooued to be lyars in K. Richard the 2. his tyme. Euc. 2. cap. 2. num 3. S. Francis Hastings His Puritanical presbytery at Cadbury and their ilfaâ—ored names In the ansvvere intituled certayne notes num 4. He wil not tel playnly whether he be a puritan or no. ibid. nu 7. Enc. 1. cap. 12. nu 7. He flieth the true combat in the first Encounter Enc. 1. cap. 1. num 6. He deuiseth 10. new fresh blessings of his ghospel Enc. 1. cap. 1. num 4. He agreeth not in his blessings with O. E. the minister and his Champion but ridiculously differeth from him ibid. num 8. He is contrary to himself Enc. 1. cap. 2. num 14. He leapeth ouer foure parts of fiue of his aduersaries argument Enc. 1. cap. 12. num 1. And when he speaketh he saith nothing of the points of most importance Ibid. num 6. Et Enc. 2. cap. 8. num 6. He denieth diuision or difference betwene puritans and protestants ibid. num 6.7 c. He excuseth his owne lying by the lying of fryars in K. Rich. the 2. his tyme. Enc. 2. cap. 2. num 6.7.8 c. He abuseth the testimony of Walsingham notoriously in the former place He doctoreth Bassanet an Apostata fryar and disableth the Archb. of Aix Ibid. num 20.21 c. He is takeÌ„ with falshood in that he alleadgeth of Iohn Husse his condemnation in Constance Enc. 2. cap. 3. as also about Luthers disputation in Augusta and VVormes ibid. cap. 4. He is worthy to ly for the whetstone Enc. 2. cap. 5. n. 11. He peruerteth S. Chrysostome notoriously about reading scriptures in vulgar tonges Enc. 2. cap. 9. nu 8.9 c. G. D. Gifford deane of Lisle defended Enc. 1. cap. 3. num 16. H. HEshufius a German Lutheran calleth Caluyn and Beza Epicures of Geneua Enc. 1. cap. 5. num 7. Heretyks who are at this day according to the sentence of Ancient Christian Emperors obseruat num â—8
byn sayd but only the temporal paynes due vnto syn after it is remitted But Priests absolution in the sacrament of confession is sufficieÌ„t to remit any syn if the penitent be contrite according to commission 〈…〉 â—um remiseritis peccata 〈…〉 â—inueritis retenta sunt who 〈…〉 shal be forgiuen and who 〈…〉 â—ayne shal be retayned 〈…〉 is a different matter 〈…〉 pardon Fourthly that the 〈…〉 decrees and ordinances of the Catholyke Church which wickedly he nameth the Romish Synagogue be more hardly forgiuen among vs then greater sinnes and those namely that be immediatly committed against God himself is a shameles slaunder and neuer taught by any Catholyke man in the world and so vnworthy to be further refuted Thus farre the Warder in examination and refutation of Syr Francis his follies and falshoods Cath. doâ—trine about indulgences and for perspicuous declaration of â—ath doctrine about indulgences which coÌ„sisteth in this 2. Reg. 12. 13. 14. that seing after the guilt of mortal sinne remitted as for example the murder and adultery of King Dauid remitted by God and signified by the voyce of Nathan the prophet there remayneth ofteÌ„tymes some temporal satisfaction and paynes to be borne by him that sinned for better satisfaction of Gods most exquisite iustice as we read that the death of Dauids sonne begotten of that adultery as also the insurrection of his sonne Absalon with other afflictions folowing therof assigned by God for this satisfaction after the guilt of the forsaid sinne was pardoned 〈…〉 our Sauiour Christ in his 〈…〉 which for the dignity of 〈…〉 finite valour beâ—ides the 〈…〉 he did merit vnto vs 〈…〉 of our sinnes as also grace 〈…〉 works were infinitely 〈…〉 that they were penal and 〈…〉 nothing to satisfie for his owne person he left in his Churche an infinite treasure of these satisfactory works to be applyed to satisfie for them that caÌ„not satisfie for themselues to which treasures do also appertayne though in a lower degree the satisfactory works of his saints done by his grace and vertue more then for their owne persons they had obligation to do or suffer Out of which publyke treasure of Christs Churche The treasure of satisfactory vvorks remayning in Christs Churche Catholyks do hold that the Bishops Pastors and gouernoures therof especially the cheef supreme Pastor of all may vpon iust causes and to persons penitent otherwayes wel disposed and not so wel able to satisfie for themselues in these temporal paynes dispense and distribut spiritual helpes to the assistance and supply of there wants and infirmities And this is properly that which we cal an indulgence or pardon when any thing is remitted or released that was dew to be paid of our parte in which sense also Esay the Prophet vseth the word IndulgeÌ„ce though in a more general signification when talking of Christ he sayth Esay 61. that he should be sent praedicare capâ—iuis â—dulgentiam to preach Indulgence to them that were in captiuity 〈…〉 vseth in his gospel 〈…〉 sentence 〈◊〉 Esay he 〈…〉 praedicare captiuis remissio◠〈…〉 to them that are 〈…〉 places though they 〈…〉 of all sinnes as wel 〈…〉 nishment thervnto beloÌ„g 〈…〉 by Christ yet hath the 〈…〉 word indulgence and applyed the same also by vse to this remission or mitigation only of temporal punishment remayning after the â—ternal guilt of mortal sinne is forgiuen by the Sacrament of pennance So that heerby we se that neyther indulgeÌ„ces do serue for the remitting of the aeternal guilt To vvhome indulgenceâ— aâ— auailablâ— nor are they auayleable to all sorts of men but to such only as are not in mortal sinne and otherwyse so piously disposed by deuotion in Gods seruice as they are capable of this Indulgence remission and fauour in Gods Churche And thus hauing briefly explaned what Catholyks do truly hold about this point which heretyks wil neuer suffer their readers sincerely to vnderstand we shal come to examine what S r. F. replyeth to the discouery of all those cauils and falshoods wherin the Warder took him trip they were foure if yow remember or wil vouchsafe to look back vpon them to all which he answereth no one word in particular but only this in general VVhat say I more in my accusation about 〈…〉 knoweth to be true 〈…〉 a general answere it 〈…〉 he meaneth I know not 〈…〉 he had a world of 〈…〉 he might haue alleaged 〈…〉 ours in all this world 〈…〉 one of these foure 〈…〉 which in this place are 〈…〉 his charge by the Warder and so haue saued his honour in this behalf but hauing produced none after so much bragging in his VVatchword and so much battery in the VVardword now to come and cry agayne that he hath a world with him when the tyme had byn to haue brought some forth is a pittiful plight for so honorable a knight to see him self in But what doth he answere nothing at all in particular think yow to all these charges of vntruthes layd vnto him but only that the whole world knoweth his assertions to be true Yes Ibid. Pag. 69. for thus it followeth in the same place The Cath. doctrine is as our champion sayth that the Popes and Churches indulgences auayle not to remooue mortal sinnes c. neyther doth the pardon remooue the guilt of sinne c. But Syr whatsoeuer your doctrine is in this point your practise is quite conâ—ary c. Mark heer gentle Reader wheras hitherto the knight hath charged our doctrine now being put to the proof he saith VVhatsoeuer our doctrine be yet our practise is to the contrary as though he had sayd that howsoeuer it be false and slaunderous which hitherto he hath affirmed of our 〈…〉 he shew that we 〈…〉 kynd of argument if a 〈…〉 vse against a Christian 〈…〉 doctrine for teaching 〈…〉 being dryuen from it by 〈…〉 and by shewing that 〈…〉 teach the contrary if 〈…〉 as S r. Francis doth from 〈…〉 and say as he sayth that whatsoeuer your 〈◊〉 be yet is your practise contrary and many wicked men are among yow ergo your religion is naught would any man cal this other then playne cauilling But what doth our knight prooue any one authentical poynt in this part also of practise though I do not deny but that some abuses may haue byn committed by particular persons About abuses of Indulgences in the vse of indulgences also as there want not euil liners among Christians doth he bring forth I say any one example of any one publyke practise to the coÌ„trary No truly but only sayth in general Pag. 70. that the Counsels of Laâ—eran Vienna and Trent haue made prouision â—or reformation of abuses about Indulgencâ—â— which maketh for vs rather then for him for that it sheweth we desyre that abuses or contrary practise should not be or if it hath byn it was not permitted by Cath. doctrine or publyke authority no more then wicked lyfe is in Christian religion
though much be practised as to our greef we see From this he passeth to alleage certayne ould verses cyted by KeÌ„nitius as true a wryter 〈…〉 as he saith in a stone in a 〈…〉 the Bituriges in Aquitany 〈…〉 nothing at all 〈…〉 only exhorting men to 〈…〉 in respect of the 〈…〉 by God and 〈…〉 of scripture themselues 〈…〉 our knight lacking other 〈…〉 them in against 〈◊〉 Some of them I shal alleage heare for examples sake 〈◊〉 Pag. 69. Hic des deuotè caelestibus associate Mentes aegrotae per munera sunt tibi lotae Ergo veni tote gentes à sede remotae Qui datis estote certi de diuite dote Hic si largè des in caelo sit tua sedes Qui serit hic parcè parcè comprendit in arce Syr Francis his translation Giue freely heer in heauen a place prepare Your sickly soules by giftes cleane purged are Come people then which dwel farre from this place Ye that do giue rest sure of mickle grace Yf thow giue freely heere heauen is thy hyre He that giues litle shal litle there acquire These verses alleadgeth S r. FraÌ„cis to make sporte at indulgences but if yow take away the simplicity of the latyn and poeÌ„sy incident to that age they contayne no absurdity at all but do set forth the force and vertue of almes in the very words almost that are found in scripture For in the 〈…〉 Daie dabitur vobis c. 〈…〉 giuen vnto yow In 〈…〉 words of our Sauiour 〈…〉 omnia vobis munda sunt 〈…〉 all is cleane and purged 〈…〉 the rest ending with the 〈…〉 in the last verse Qui parcè semini◠〈…〉 he that soweth litle shal reap 〈…〉 expressely of almes And with what folly theâ— are these things brought in by way of scoffe against pardons and indulgences which nothing appertayne vnto them and are sentences taken out of the scripture it self He addeth to this purpose a complaint of the Princes of Germany as he calleth them exhibited against the Popes pardons at a counsel in Norenberg Pag. 71. Malitious concealing of circumstances to deceaue the reader but he telleth not in what yeare this was nor what maner of counsel nor that these Princes were new protestants nor that Luther did endite this complaint for if he had told any one of these circumstances it would haue infringed the credit of his tale Ibid. Pag. 72 as that which he telleth of one Tecelius the Popes pardon marchaunt as he termeth him of whome he wryteth a iest how he was deceyued and cosened in selling of pardons but for that he citeth neyther author book time nor place I giue it the credit as such pulpit tales of Sir Francis ministers do require That old obiection also of Card. Como his letter to Parry wherin he is affirmed to say 〈…〉 pardon of all your sinnes as 〈…〉 answered For first it is 〈…〉 in his letter to Pope 〈…〉 from Paris when he 〈…〉 1583. discouered no 〈…〉 any particular enterprice 〈…〉 only in general that he 〈…〉 great matters for the 〈…〉 Cath. religion for recompence of the â—urts which he had done diuers yeares before by spiery for the state of England And this appeareth as wel by the letter yet extant as for that he vttering his whole plot to her Ma â—ie and her counsel at his first comming in was notwithstanding fauorably handled for a great space vntil falling into discontentment through want he practised with him that discouered his teachery Secondly the Popes graunt of Indulgence vnto him was meant only with due circumstaÌ„ces if he were contrite and confessed of his sinnes which is wont to be added coÌ„monly in all indulgences or is necessary to be vnderstood For which cause this obiection is to no purpose at all Wherfore I would leaue of in this place to speak any more of this argument of indulgences as vnable to be disprooued eyther in doctrine or practise by Sir Francis but that I must discouer one trik of his more about alleadging Durandus pag. 70. before I end my speech As for the authority saith he wher-vpon your indulgences are grounded your owne men confesse as namely among the rest Durandus De indulgentijs pauca dici possunt per certitudinem qui 〈…〉 ijs loquitur sancti etiam 〈…〉 Hieronymus Augustinus mit 〈…〉 gentijs c. Litle can be 〈…〉 indulgences because 〈…〉 speaketh expressely of the 〈…〉 Fathers Ambrose Hilary 〈…〉 make no mention of them 〈…〉 confesse that yow haue neyther warrant 〈…〉 nor of the auncient fathers for your popish 〈…〉 go they currant c. Howsoeuer they go currant Syr knight among vs yet go not yow curraÌ„t but do hault downe to the ground and that in three things about this one text First in the citation then in the deductioÌ„ or illation of the sense thirdly in the words themselues alleaged And let the reader consider whether falshood may be found in more points then these in the handling or alleadging of any author For the first though he name Durandus yet quoteth he no place The first shift where yow may find it which for the most part as before we haue noted implyeth lightly some deceyt or subtile trick in the allegation which he would not haue discouered as now by experience we haue learned and the third point shal declare For the second about the illation he maketh out of the words of Durand The second shift if they were all in all respects truly alleaged it is false and cauillous For if any Arrian or Anabaptist in the dayes of S. Ambrose Hilary and Ierome whome 〈…〉 haue made lyke 〈…〉 and sayd as they 〈…〉 of Homousion 〈…〉 as also the baptisme 〈…〉 to be found in 〈…〉 such and such auncient 〈…〉 Iustinus and others of that 〈…〉 thing of it ergo yow hold 〈…〉 neyther haue warrant in 〈…〉 of auncient Fathers This argument I say or illation against these doctrynes had byn as good as this of Syr Francis against pardons and yet had it byn naught and deceytful and the reason is for that albeyt those doctrines for the blessed Trinity and baptisme of children were not expressely conteyned in scripture yet were they sufficiently deduced therof And albeit those former fathers as Iustinus Irenaeus and others had not occasion expressely to handle or treat of these controuersyes being occupied in other matters yet neuer taught they the contrary other fathers following after them did teache testifie that doctrin to be Catholike which was sufficient And the very like may be answered by vs in this behalfe as by the third poynt of Syr Francis paltry dealing shal appeare The third point then is his fraudulent alleaging of the words of Durand The 3. shift leauing out some which are greatly to the purpose and do plainly insinuate the answere that now I haue giuen For first after Durand had said that the scripture did not 〈…〉 indulgences he alleaget◠〈…〉 scripture as Tibi