doe not resist although our number be great S. Nazianzene Not though the people be prone to resist you S. Ambrose Not when the people are present and offer a defence S. Augustine yeelding the cause Because Christian subiection is to be performed in loue and not in feare or by constraint A doctrine for those times namely the first 600. yeares in generall vse saith your Bellarmine And continued after Christ the space of 1000 yeares saith your Beâ—â—laâ—â—s neuer changed till the yeare 1060. saith your Tolossanus Friburgens Espencaeus and others And shall we dare to remooue The ancient Land-markes of our forefathers CHAP. XVII Other Proofs of Protestants from Antiquity in two most Christian and potent Nations England and France THat this soueraignity of his Maiesty whereunto notwithstanding all Papall iurisdiction we doe willingly subscribe may be knowen to be as anciently as earnestly challenged I will only point at some few heads of examples of our ancient Christian Kings which Sir Edward Cooke his Maiesties Attorney generall in his alwaies reportable and memorable Reports hath lately published In the raigne of K. Edward the first a Subiect brought in a Bull of excommunication against another Subiect of this realme and published it But it was answered that this was then according to the ancient lawes of England Treason against the King the Offendor had beene drawen and hanged but that by the mercy of the Prince he was only abiured the Realme Compare this Bull which did only push at a Subiect against his benefice with that Bull which more mankeen goareth Kings to giue them their mortall wound At the same time The Pope by his Bull had by way of prouision bestowed a benefice vpon one within the prouince of Yorke the King presented another the Arch-bishop refuseth the Kings presentation and yeelded to the Popes prouision This Arch-bishop then by the common law of the land was depriued of the lands of his whole Bishoprick during life In the raigne of King Edward the third the King presented to a Benefice and his Presentee was disturbed by one who had obtained Buls from Rome for the which cause he was condemned to perpetuall imprisonment Compare this Bull of disturbing onely the Present of Kings with that which doth ordinarily violate the Kings person In the raigne of Richard the second it was declared in the Parliament R. 2. cap. 2. that England had alwaies beene fâ—ce and in subiection to no Realme but immediatly subiect to God and to none other and that the same ought not in any thing touching the regality of the crowne to be submitted to the Bishop of Rome nor the lawes of their Realme by him frustrated at his pleasure Compare this English King immediately not subiect to the Pope and the aboue mentioned Iesuâ—ticall principle All Kings are indirectly subiect to Popes In the raigne of King Henry the fourth it was confirmed that Excommunication made by the Pope is of no force in England Compare this Of no force in England with those excommunications which in these later times haue been made against England In the raigne of King Edward the fourth the opinion of the Kings bench was that whatsoeuer spirituall man should sue another spirituall man in the Court of Rome for a matter spirituall where hee might haue remedy before his Ordinary within the Realme did incurre the danger of premunire being an hainous offence against the honour of the King his crowne and dignity Compare this with their Acts who haue made no other sute at Rome but meanes to dispossesse English Kings of their crowne and dignity Many other examples of like nature I pretermit and remit the Reader desirous to be further satisfied to the booke of Reports Habet enim ille quod det dat nemo largius The conclusion is that that challenge of Soueraigntie which was in opposition to the Popes Buls ancient right and iustice in Kings which were predecessours be not traduced now as an irreligious impiety in the successors The like might be spoken of France but I hasten to the last Argument presuming that my studious Reader perusing the French stories will ease me of that trauell CHAP. XVIII The last Argument of Protestants from Reason IT will be sufficient onely summarily to recapitulate the Arguments dispersed in this former Treatise The first Reason was long since Christened for The Apostles saith your Sanders did chuse rather to suffer euill than to reuenge wherein they were seconded by other heroicall Martyrs of Christ Who thought saith your Tolossanus their faith glorified in this that being persecuted yet they performed obedience Questionlesse they had some reason heereof One is specified by S. Cyprian Christians must be Preachers of the supernaturall vertue patience and not of vengeance Another by S. Augustine that Induring the misery of this life they may auouch their hope of a life eternall And lastly by Arnobius Heereby to make distinction of Christian obedience from that other of Pagans that whereas these yeeld onelie obedience proceeding from feare of man ours should appeare to be from Conscience towards God The second Reason is politicke which is that of your Victoria that the Clergy be members of the common-wealth Ergo they ought to be subiect vnto the state temporall I will adde another of this kind which wee borrowed from your Acosta shewing that licence of deposing Kings is an occasion of much spoiles and bloudshed The third Reason is violent inforcing you by your owne confessions to grant our conclusion your confessions be of two kinds first The Pope hath not temporall Soueraignty ouer Kings directly but onely indirectly in ordine ad bonum spirituale that is as the temporall doth necessarily helpe or aduance the spirituall good of the Church But So you may as well say saith your Carerius that a King hath not iurisdiction temporall but only indirectly because his authority doth intend a spirituall good aâ— namely preseruation of iustice in a common-wealth And he saith truely as may be confirmed by Saint Augustine A king as a man saith he doth serue God by his owne good life as a King by gouerning other mens liues to see that they doe that which is good It is his office not only to ordaine lawes for the preseruation of the politicke peace but also to establish true religion From hence I conclude that if this your distinction be good The Pope hath temporall iurisdiction ouer Kings to depose them indirectly that is as far foorth as may be behooffull for Religion then must you grant that Kings haue iurisdiction temporall onely indirectly because their Office also is ordained of God in ordine ad Deum as a minister of God for defence of his Church If your position be false then hath not your Pope that power ouer Princes no not indirectly The second Confession I take from
the common-wealth and a King is as well a King of the Cleargie as of the Laitie therefore the Cleargie is subiect vnto the ciuill autoritie in temporall things for such matter is not ruled by any power spirituall a plaine demonstration The third Obiection from the prophecie of the old Testament and the euents of the new The Romish pretence This is the tenor of the late yongue Buls of Popes as of Paulus 3. Pius 5. and all their followers I the seruant of the seruants of God placed in the seat of iustice according to the Prophecie of Ieremie where it is written Ierem. 1. Behold I haue appointed thee ouer Nations to roote them vp and destroy them to plant and establish them doe excommunicate these Kings and their fauorites absoluing subiects from their obedience and commanding them to take vp armes to roote them out Is this the true sense of that Prophecie It was spoken to the Bishops of Rome in the person of Christ The Answer O arrogant glossers yea impudent glosers and peruerters of the sacred Oracles of God! Did euer Ieremie put downe Kings to root them out Hearken to your Lyranus No he did onely denounce Gods iudgements against wicked Kinges Hearken to that godly Pope Gregorie who sheweth that Ieremies act was onely By preaching and not by fighting If you demaund in whom this prophecie was fulfilled listen to your Doctor Capella It was fulfilled in Christ at whose comming Idols and false Oracles ceased and the Prince of the World was cast out Which Scripture lest the Pope might vnaduisedly applie to himselfe holie Bernard doth forewarne him to Beware of insolent pride for these wordes being applied vnto the Pastors of the church betoken onely an industrioâ—s ministrie but no predominant autoritie CHAP. VII The antiquitie of this pretended Papall power is examined from the Apostles times The Romish pretence THe Priest of the new Testament in the Priesthood of Christ haue more authoritie than that of the law ouer Kinges to depose them The Answer This is not probable except you can shew some footings either of Christ or his blessed Apostles or their holie successors in the purer periods of times But 1. Christ vsed not this ciuill iurisdiction For Princely autoritie as your chiefe Iesuite confesseth had beene supersâ—uouâ— in Christ whose end was to worke the worke of Redemption of man whereunto the onelie spirituall power was sufficient 2. Peter and the other Apostles neuer challenged temporall authority This also is confessed Apostles saith Carerius were subiect vnto the heathen Kings in all temporall respects because Pontificall gouernment is only ouer Christians within the church but the Heathens are said by the Apostle to be without 1. Cor. 6. Heereupon your Saunders doth conclude that Peter receiued of Christ no power ouer Heathen Kings He conceiteth a reason There is a double power of fortitude and Christian valour saith he The one in suffering aduersitie constantly the other in attempting and effecting hard matters couragiously that power of suffering as more excellent Christ chose as fittest for himselfe and his Apostles and their successors for the gaining of the world to the faith and therefore they did abstaine from armes and prescribe obedience The Romish insist As though there were not a difference of the condition of the church as of a vine there is one time to plant and water it an other to loppe and prune it The Answer As though the Church which before time was planted watred with the blood and deaths of holie Martyrs ought now for that is this mans scope to be lopped in the cutting off of the heads of wicked Kings Nay but if the patient suffering of the tyranny of Kings be as your Sanders truely said the more excellent Christian power than acting and working the death of Kings and that therefore that power was practized of our Lord Christ and bestowed on the Apostles for the confirmation of the glorious faith pardon vs if we fall at Iesus feet to choose the better part especially knowing that To all those who suffer vniustly for iustice there remaineth a crowne of iustice which the iust Iudge will giue in that day of Reuelation CHAP. VIII The primitiue Successors of the Apostles for the space of two hundred yeares and long after did acknowledge all Obedience temporall to all Emperours and Kings whether heathen or baptized although Tyrants or Heretickes or Apostatates yea euen then when they wanted no force to resist The Romish pretence IN former ages Christians said your Bellarmine did not depose wicked Emperours as Diocletian Iulian and such because they wanted force Which maketh some Catholicks said your Bannes now not resisting their Kings excusable because they want force For it is commendable said your Frenchman to suffer when thou canst not resist Otherwise Catholickes said your Creswell are bound to hazard their liues in this cause assooue as they can make resistance Whereunto might haue beeneadded your Cardinall Allen Ancient Bishops saith he might haue excommunicated the Arian Emperours and hauedefended themselues from them by force of armes but they did not by reason of greater forces of their Persecutors The Answer This is the very Arche of all your rebellious building which all your Iesuites haue erected and whereupon our bastard English Cardinall doth insist in his booke intituled A True and modest Defence for English Catholickes which how false and shamelesse it is I am now ready to shew vnto all true catholickes for their confirmation and to the others for their conuersion First in generall For. For the space of two hundred yeares we cannot reade saith your learned Tolossanus of any christians resisting Emperours of other times or in their most bloudy persecutions to haue raised any tumult in the Common-wealth no not then when they were able both by equall number and power to match them But heerin they thought their religion aduanced before all others and gloried in this behalfe to be called Christians who professed this as a most holy doctrine namely obedience to Magistrates True the patient Christian did aduance Christian religion by suffering vnder Kings but the now pragmaticall Christian God grant I may be a false Prophet by acting and plotting Strategemes in resisting Kings will ruinate the holy faith To Tolossanus agreeth your Cunerus saying The Martyrs of those times when they by reason of their multitude might easily haue conspired against their persecuting Tyrants Hearken you conspirators and be ashamed yet for the honour of Christ by performing obedience to the higher power chose rather to suffer then resist For as saith S. Augustine they would demonstrate their hope of the life to come and by their confessions and deaths whereby they gaue witnesse to the truth of God were called Martyrs witnesses whose number was so great that if it had pleased Christ to arme them and aid them as he did
may content vs to know that euen such Kiâ—gs beare in their office the image of God in whom God hath stamped andingrauen an inuiolable Maiestie not to be contemned Thus farre Master Caluin neither doth he euer restrain the outward power of any King except in those States where there is customably ordained for that purpose the Magistracie of those who are called Ephori and Tribuni plebis But when when they shall commaund any thing against the lawe of God then Caluin embraceth the doctrine of Saint Peter Act. 15. 29. We rather obey God then man but how not to obey man as actiuely to resist that is to rebell against him God forbid but onely passiuely which is not to do that which shall be wickedly commaunded Perpeti potiùs quà m à veritate discedere auâ— Ã pietate deslectere Rather suffer saith he then to betray the truth of God or to accord to iniquitie But reade and examine all the lines which euer Caluin penned and you shall not find one syllable that can preiudice his loyaltie Wherof more hereafter The moderate Answerer Beza also and the rest of that holy Synod defend the same The Reply Belike then this rebellious doctrine will be proued a Synodicall Decree among Protestants but if you should vow faithfully not to eate till you proue this I could easily prognosticate what death you should die But Beza as he succeeded Caluine a Doctor so in doctrine likewise Heare Bezas owne confession and it will proue him innocent you a slaunderer and your Popes the capitall delinquents in this kind 1 His innocencie Priuate men among whom I account inferior Magistrates in respect of their King haue no other remedie against Tyrants to whom they be subiect then amendment of their liues prayers and teares which God in his good time will not despise They alwaies prouided not to do but onely to suffer euil as Christ by his owne example hath taught vs. And if it shall so happen that we cannot obey the commaund of the King but that we must offend God the King of Kings then must we rather obey God then man But how so as likewise to remember that it is one thing not to obey another thing to resist and betake our selues to armes This kind of violent disobedience we may not vse Can any moderate spirit call this doctrine rebellious Secondly Your slaunder What our opinion is concerning subiection vnto Magistrates saith Beza a man may better be instructed by our writings then by the slaunders of such as number vs among the companie of intoxicate Anabaptists who renounce the authoritie of Magistrates which doctrine how much we abhorre none can be ignorant which doth not obstinately refuse to see the light Of which kind you must needes be seeing you had rather beleeue any libels against Beza then see his owne writings Thirdly your Popes capitall Offendors The impudencie of our Accusers saith Beza herein is most notorious that they who contrarie to the word of God haue openly subiected Kings and Kingdomes to their authoritie being themselues the most rebellious Sect vnder heauen in contemning Magistrates dare notwithstanding obiect the guilt of that crime vnto vs which they thinke to be a vertue in themselues and wherein they glorie and vaunt Which is most true as we haue proued out of your Bellarmine and others glorying in the acts of such Popes who haue deposed Emperors CHAP. VI. The Practises of Caluin and other Protestants of France obiected by this Accuser in diuers particular instances The first instance The moderate Answerer THese were instruments of all Rebellions and oppressions in the Monarchie of France wherein they tooke all authoritie from the King and Magistrate against King Francis whom they rebelliously persecuted The Reply For your proofes against Protestants in this your Answer you produce Genebrard Claudius de Sanct. Petrus Frar Coclaeus and such like all professed Aduersaries to the Religion of Protestants How moderate dealing this may be accounted will appeare when I shall oppose your owne Historians to condemne you and acquit the Protestants Two witnesses shall suffice who how farre they were from fauouring the Protestants you may iudge by their complexions for the first greedily relateth a Discourse wherein he calleth our Religion new and a plaine imposture The second is dedicated to Charles the then French King and to the Queene mother in which Historie he calleth the doctrine of M. Luther A multitude of absurd heresies Therefore you may not think these men partiall in our behalfe Both prouing 1. The pronenesse of Papists to slaunder the Religion of Protestants 2. That this accusation is a slaunder which is now obiected For the 1. I will alledge of many but one story published by them both False witnesses were brought against Protestants them of the Religion affirming that in a place at Maubert at a Councellors house great numbers of them had eaten a pigge instead of a pascall Lambe before Easter and after the candles being put out euery man tooke his woman and had his pleasure of her The Cardinall vpon these informations moued the Court the Queene mother tooke occasion hereby to reuile some of her Gentlewomen who were of the Religion but they desired and obtained means that the principall witnesses might be examined it was done two young boyes come foorth and affirme that then and many other times they had had the vse of your Councellors daughters but in the end the witnesses began to stagger and couertly to denie it The Councellor sought after for his Religion vnderstanding this shameful slander went with his wife and his two daughters yeelding himselfe prisoner for his Religion desiring that the cause of his daughters might be examined They were diligently searched by Physitions and women and found to be virgins and the young men did thus iustifie themselues that they did it in deuotion being perswaded that such an accusation against such Heretikes was good whether it were true or false But the virgins were cleared and yet their father remained in prison and the witnesses were not punished The second Concerning the present Accusation thus it standeth The Guizes who were no naturall Frenchmen not able to accuse the Prince of Condie of Treason Daniels case called him in question to be condemned of heresie for his Religion But what was the right cause of tumults There was deliuered an exact declaration to proue that those of the Guizes had decreed to put all the Princes of the bloud Royall to death as soone as they had cut off them of the Religion and they were euidently proued to be guiltie of his treason And the King could not otherwise iudge but that great wrong was offered to his bloud Then not the Protestants but the Spanish faction of the Guizes were guiltie of those broyles in the daies of King Francis Notwithstanding Though the Prince of Condie did acquit himselfe of Treason and boldly stood
to his Religion yet not long after they pronounced iudgment of death vpon him But King Francis fell extremely sicke and in his sicknesse made a solemne vow to all Saints in Pieardie that if it pleased them to help him he wold wholy purge his Realme of meaning Protestants all those heretikes And thus all Protestants were freed then from this designe the Saints of Piccardie belike were of your mind Protestants are no heretikes The second Instance of The moderate Answerer They raised such rebellions and civill warres against Charles the ninth wherein the King of Nauarre and Duke Nyuers with others were slaine The Reply I reade the storie in our foresaid Historicall collection of memorable accidents in France and others and I can find onely this thing memorable concerning this point that The King was then in his minoritie and the Queene Mother was regent who yeelded too much vnto the Guizes faction who persecuted the Prince of Condie and sought the destruction of all the bloud royall at length Duke Nyuers with King Nauarre in the warre against his brother at the siege of Roane are wounded and slaine See the cause of the Prince of Condie his defence In lan 1â— anno 1562 was made an Edict whereby permission was granted to them of the Religion to assemble without the townes and order was taken that either part Protestants and Catholikes might liue in quietnesse and peace with each other But a while after the Constable did deface all places of their assemblies and those of the Religion were cruelly handled This was the first beginning of the horrible troubles in France But were Protestants after this rebellious In those of Languidoch the King did pardon whatsoeuer they had done in their iust defence holding them for good subiects What was then the cause why the Prince of Condie and the Admirall did beare armes They vnderstanding that 6000. Switzers were now entred into France with intent to execute violence vpon them of the Religion they betake themselues vnto the King from whom they receiued no fauourable answer therefore they did flie for defence against those Switzers not suffering their throates to be cut by theeues After this was there concluded a peace the Prince of Condie doth lay downe his armes his aduersaries were contented onely to promise to do the like alledging that there is no faith to be held with heretikes Shewing themselues herein false and not onely faithlesse for you know Protestants are no heretikes The third Instance of The moderate Answerer The Duke of Guize was trecherously murdered by Pultrotus for that fact suborned by Beza and the Protestant Admirall The Reply The storie is that The Duke of Guize had appointed a day to take Orleance wherein he would not spare any man woman or child whomsoeuer and after he had kept his Shrouetide there he would spoile and destroy the towne Pultrot riding vpon a Spanish Ginnet shot the Duke with a Pistoll and slue him after was taken and tormented with hot tongs to make him confesse and then torne in peeces by force of horses Let vs leaue him if you will iustly executed by them come to the other vniustly slaundered by you for It was euidently knowne at his execution that Pultrot did it of his owne motion and particular intent thereby to free France and especially Orleance froÌ„ the violence of the Duke of Guize To this first Historian agreeth the second The King after he had examined the Admiral to â—ether with his Councel did acquit him of suspision and imposed perpetuall silence to all not to speake of it You therefore though no subiect might haue bene taught silence especially seeing that the confederates of the Religion among whom was Theodore Beza did condemne this fact of Pulirot as rash and directly contrary to the commaundement of God who will herein condemning all such desperate examples inspired onely with a diuellish motion that euery crime and offence shal receiue punishment according to the institution politike and forme of gouernment established in euery state at the discretion of the Magistrate The moderate Answerer Such were the miserable murders and calamities which they brought to that distressed kingdome that in the two first ciâ—… wars and rebellions aboue an hundred thousand were slaine as Gaspar Collen witnesseth The Reply It is not vnlikely but an hundred thousand were slaine but it is as probable that a thousand for an hundred of them were Protestants persecuted for their Religion who alwayes lay open to Popish trecheries as is plaine by the barbarous massacre wherein as testifieth your owne author there was slaine twentie thousand Protestants in lesse then one moneth by the furie of the Catholikes What could there be in the Protestant was it rebellion No but only constancy in Religion then persecuted by the malignant But what kind of motion might this be in those Catholikes which egged them on to this butcherie whether was it zeale or fury Christian iustice or Antichristian malice The Catholikes not content saith your Author to liue alwayes assured hauing the autoritie of the State for them aspired with a burning desire to bring to passe that which they had a long time plotted against their enemies But let vs leaue this Gâ—lgotha for so you made France by your monstrous massacres as then a place of dead mens sculs Whither shal your next voyage be CHAP. VII The Instances of the moderate Answerer in Heluetia The first The moderate Answerer LEt vs come to Heluetia and especially Geneua the Mother-Church of the Reformed M. Caluine the supreme head of thereformed there hath told vs before that Princes not agreeing with vs in Religion are to be spitted vpon rather then obeyed they are not to be numbred among men they are to be bereaued of all authoritie The Reply What absolutely depriued of all authoritie Proue this and I will as absolutely denie all his doctrinall authoritie whom by reading of your most learned Iesuites as Maldonate Ribera Pererius Salmeron Tollet and such others and conferring their expositions with Caluins I dare boldly affirme him to be of that excelleÌ„t iudgment that these your greatest Rabbies for their best expositions light their candles at Caluins to arch But to the point Caluin doth consider in the person of a wicked King two situations one as he sitteth vnder God the other when he exalteth himselfe to sit aboue God when he commandeth as a substitute and subordinate God hath commanded vs to obey man but when he commandeth contra Deum against God saith * Caluine he vsurpeth Gods throne and herein he looseth his royaltie which is to be obeyed A matter so reasonable that in the behalf of God the A postles in like case are content to appeale herein to the iudgement of his aduersary man Whether it be better to obey God or man iudge you To explane this by example If a Iustice of peace shall command
not what spirit you are of for the sonne of man came not to destroy but to saue the world Concluding from the same example negatiuely namely that the Ministers of the Gospel must not heerein imitate Elias The Application of this example and Answer Whom doe you seeke to destroy Protestants whom you call Heretikes but marke 1. these disciples desired to destroie Those Samaritânes namely the false worshippers which had long before forsaken the true religion of God and therefore now disliked Christ Because his face was as though he would goe to Hierusalem that is because of his religion for that he gaue some signification that he meant to goe to the feast at Hierusalem to solemnise the true worship of God according to the lawe Secondly what haue Protestants done They will not admit of our Priests and our high Priest and Vicar of Christ the Pope they doe reiect And these Samaritans in this place Would not receiue Christ 3. What therefore A generall destruction at one terrible blow and these desire to Call for fire to consume these Samaritans 4. Now who are you Men zealous of Gods glory and these for their zeale are Surnamed the Sonnes of thunder 5. To what end doe you breath fire and why are your mouthes so hot In ordine ad Deum euen for the glorie of God aduancement of the church of Christ So these wished fire from heauen namely that it comming by the prayer of Christ immediately from heauen God might be glorified in his Sonne 6. What ground haue you for such an attempt The example of Elias the same example did these Bonarges alledge saying As Elias did Notwithstanding all which Christ answereth you in them saying You know not what spirit you are of adding I am not come to destroie but to saue shewing that there is as much difference betweene a minde so resolued and a true regenerate spirit as is betweene Christ and Elias Law and Gospel destruction and saluation Thus the Sonnes of thunder and our Sonnes of powder being rightly compared there is only this difference They would not haue fire except from Gods owne hand from heauen an argument of their patience these as men desperate will worke it in many barrels in the earth as if it had beene from hell they consult with Christ Master wilt thou that we command you without all command yea against Gods forbid seeke the ruine of a Kingdome The Conclusion from the old Testament Seeing that 1. there was No soueraigntie either of Priests or People ouer Kings we are taught from the example of the people of God as saith your Cunerus With great patience to indure the tyrannie of mortall Kings yea when we haue power to resist And because they be next vnder God in earth in all their iniuries To commende the reuenge vnto God Nay he teacheth Kings an other excellent rule of policie fitting for the preseruation of all States which is He who succeedeth a King violently murdered of any though of a godly zeale yet ought he to reuenge his Predecessors death by the death of the male factors Thus much of the old Testament concerning the law of Subiection wherein we haue many lawes to obey Kings but none to resist We ascend to the new Testament sealed by Christ his death whose speech is true concerning the Ciuill law of the prerogatiue of Kings which he spake of the Morall law of God I come not to destroy the Law but to fulfill the Law CHAP. VI. The former Question disputed according to the state of the new Testament The Romish shewing the state of the question THe Pope hath all absolute and direct power and dominion temporal ouer all Kings Kingdoms of the world Which we prooue by consent of Diuines and Canonists And the Defendors of the contrary to be but meer Polititians Take heed there was a spirit that shewed a synopsis of All the nations of the world to our Sauiour and said All these will I giue thee he was no lawfull Doner but a lying Tempter From whom it may seeme this your doctrine had his stampe For to beleeue your owne Doctor to say that the Pope hath all temporall domimon ouer all the world is nothing else but a flattering of the Pope And False saith your Iesuite as I shall prooue You will not then contend for all the world what say you to all Kings in Christendome He hath ouer these indirectly that is as it may be behoouefull for the Spirituall good power temporall ouer all these By what law Not by Ciuill but Diuine law Well then this would be prooued either by Scripture or by tradition or at least some probable reason Obiections from Scriptures 1. Obiection The Romish pretence Saint Peter when he receiued of Christ the keies of the Kingdome of heauen he also receiued the temporall and ciuill sword and a right of erecting and destroying kingdomes as farre foorth as hee might thinke it behoouefull for the good of soules and to this end ought the Popeto use the ciuill sword This cannot be for By the kâ—ies of the kingdome of heauen as your Victoria determineth is signified a spirituall autoritie different from the ciuill iurisdiction as is prooued by the vse which is remitting and deteining of sinnes which no way can belong to ciuill autoritie Neither can any shew me any one Doctor of but reasonable antiquitie Peto vel ex millibus vnum who by keies vnderstand a ciuill power It were au excellent Art if you could make a sword of a paire of keies and as profound Diuinitie were it to turne spirituall regiment into politike 2. Obiection The Romish pretence Where it is said to Peter Iohâ— 21. Feede my sheepe is vnderstood the power wherby the Pastor may driue away a woolfe such an one is an hereticall Prince from his flocke Againe A Prince is the spirituall sheepe of a Priest but a Priest cannot be called the sonne of a Prince for Priests haue their spirituall Gouernour to whom they are subiect both in spirituall and temporall matters and to no other The Answer It was neuer read heard nor dreamed that Feed my sheep should signifie any temporall feeding as though Princes must be dieted corporally at the Popes discretion this will follow vpon your assertion because the metaphor Feede hath more significant relation to diet then to dominion Againe Scriptures doe often call Princes Pastors as your owne Doctors demonstrate and as plaine it is Kings are called nourcing fathers Es 29. And we will make no question but that Father is a relatiue to a Sonne and therefore a Priest may be a sonne vnto a Prince Lastly your deuice of exemption of Priests is too crude to be easily digested of any reasonable Diuine for as your Victoria saith Priests besides that they are Ministers of the Church they are likewise members of