Selected quad for the lemma: religion_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
religion_n	church_n	pope_n	rome_n	5,434	5	6.6788	4	true

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
B00820	A briefe replie of Thomas Udall, Gent. to a short memorandum, or shew of answere against his booke intituled: A briefe view of the weake grounds of poperie: by B.C. student in diuinitie.	Udall, Thomas.	1609 (1609)	STC 24508.3; ESTC S95630	21,665	59

Boniface the Arch-bishop of Mentz Hosius Eckius and others Against which Master B. C. reasoneth thus If Cardinall Cusanus neuer writ any such booke then there is no such blasphemie But Cardinall Cusanus neuer writ any such booke Ergo there is no such blasphemie I denie the consequence of the proposition though Master B. C. would insinuate by the question and answere That there had béene no other proofe to iustifie my accusation but that of the Cardinals saying But where is this blasphemie conteined In a Booke as he telleth vs of Cardinall Cusanus which is intituled De Authoritate c. Of the Authoritie c. What In that booke onely And not also in diuers other places and authors Why are all those omitted Why is this one singled out of the heard Surely because this seemed likely to admit some cauill they were out of daunger But is it a iust difference whether the blasphemie be in the Title of the Booke or in the booke it selfe For albeit it were not in the title of the booke as both Bishop Iewell and Doctor Downam affirme it is yet it is in the booke of his Epistles as I haue shewed in the Preface And to conuince euidently this blasphemie of the Cardinals I will shew once againe The Blasphemie mainteined is that they were to receiue the Communion in both kindes according to the Scriptures against which the Cardinall opposeth himselfe in diuers places of his Epistles and for the iustifying of his assertion he vrgeth these words as I haue set them downe in the Preface It is no maruaile saith he though the practise of the Church Nicola Cusa ad Bohem Epist 7 expound the Scriptures at one time one way and at another time another way For the vnderstanding or sense of the Scriptures runneth with the practise and that sense agreeing with the practise is the quickning spirit And a litle after he concludes And therefore the Scriptures follow the Church but contrariwise the Church followeth not the Scriptures Now that which precedes in authoritie is aboue that which followes and so the Church by their diuinity is auouched to bee aboue the Scriptures And if the Church follow not the Scriptures it is euident if God and his word be both one That he that is not with the Scripture is against it And so the matter of the Epistle is all one with that title of the authoritie of the Church and Councel aboue and against the Scriptures though the Epistle it selfe be not so intituled And that you may know this opinion or blasphemie is not peculiar to the Cardinall or to one Papist onely Eckius in his Enchiridion of the authoritie of the Church Answ the third hath set down that this position The Scripture is greater then the authoritie of the Church is to bee reputed amongst hereticall assertions and that the contrary proposition is Catholique And this blasphemie of theirs is so generall that you shall find this sentence often inserted in the Common Law The Church is aboue the Scriptures The other place of the Cardinals there noted is this This is the iudgement saith he of all them that thinke rightly that they found the authoritie Ad Bohem. Epist 2. and vnderstanding of the Scriptures in the allowance of the Church and not contrariwise lay the foundation of the Church in the authoritie of the Scriptures Now if this bee sound diuinitie then may your proud Clergie assume vnto themselues to bee Lords of the Scriptures For how directly so euer the Scriptures be against them as in this instance of the communion to be had in both kinds it is most directly they may giue it what sense they list yea expound it to day after one fashion and to morrow after another as shall please the Pope and his Clergie which can no way agree with the spirit of God who is alwayes one and the same And if this conuince not the Cardinals blasphemie See the 3. Epistle of the same booke pag. 838. where hee saith When the Church chaungeth her iudgement God also chaungeth his But admit I had failed in this proofe yet had the other testimonies bene sufficient to approoue the truth of my accusation if these and such like may iustly be tearmed blasphemies a Syluest Prier cont Lutheri conclusiones de potest Pap. That indulgences are warranted vnto vs not by the authoritie of the Scriptures but by the authoritie of the Church and Pope of Rome which is greater b Dist 40. C. Si Papa That they rather desire the ancient institution of Christian Religion from the Pope then from the holy Scripture c Eckius de Eccles That the Scripture is not authenticall but by the authoritie of the Church d Henric. Magist Sacr Pa●atii Romae ad legat Bohem sub Felice pap 1447. That the Pope may change the holy Gospell c. e Vid. Kempnit exam part 1. pag. 47. That the Scripture without the authority of the church is of no better worth then Esopes Fables And because I will bee as charitable to Master B. C. and as full of good wishes though I haue no hope of his conuersion as he is to me I could wish that he would not imploy his time so badly as to colour or iustifie such open and palpable blasphemie And surely would such as read both Popish and Protestants bookes Trie the spirits whether they be of God or no would not the Popish Priests prohibite the reading of our bookes would the Papists therin hold any indifferencie it were not possible that they could be so sedused with Popery B. C. Sect. 3. IN his fourth page thus he writeth Yea Arias Montanus a chiefe Papist in his Hebrew Bible writeth in the forefront and principall leafe of the booke There are addded saith he in this edition the bookes written in Greeke which the Catholike Church following the Canon of the Hebrews reckneth amongst the Apocrypha The true sense of Arias Montanus words is corrupted either by Master Vdall or some other from whom he had them by foysting in diuers of their owne That learned man in the edition of the Hebrew Bible Arituerplae ex officin● Christoph Plaut 1584. with the Latin interlineall interpretation in the Title page saith There are adioyned to this edition the bookes written in Greeke which are called Apocrypha Hee saith not they bee Apocrypha but that they are so called by some that is the Iewes who exclude them from their Hebrew Canon which he had there set foorth That other addition viz. which the Catholike Church following the Canon of the Hebrewes reckoneth amongst the Apocrypha vpon which the force of his charge dependeth are not in Arias Montanus where Master Vdall had them himselfe best knoweth T. V. IT is true that in the fourth page I haue shewed how the Papists dissent from the Fathers both auncient and moderne The reason there may thus be deduced That Church which dissents from the Fathers both antient

those Councels preferre the Councell before the Pope And yet Pope Martin the fift in the last Sessiō of the Councell of Constance approueth in his Bul all those decrees which were made by this Councell in matters of faith prayseth and confirmeth them And for the Councell of Basill The Diuines of Paris prayse and defend the authoritie thereof against Leo the tenth and their commendation and defence thereof is extant in print And if Master B. C. sinceritie were such as he pretends he could not be ignorant that Papists haue reiected those Councels which cannot be denied to be both lawfull and generall And if the vntruths you haue obiected against Master Bell and Master Rogers be no better proued you haue blotted much paper to little purpose For what are these exceptions against my booke but a ridiculous biting at the héele when you are wounded at the heart B. C. Sect. 8. THus much shall serue at this time for by Gods assistance I intend heereafter more to lay open the manifold maladies of his treatise and to shew with what weake engines he laboureth to vndermine the impregnable grounds of the Catholike Church God graunt that the happie newes of his conuersion may crosse these my designements whereof I see no cause to dispaire if truly zeale of religion and desire of saluation which so much he would seeme to thirst after hath embouldened him being a lay man to launch into the depth of these mysticall matters Let him not relie too much vnto those from whom he receiueth the substance of that he writeth least together with the losse of his reputation hee incurre also the daunger of eternall damnation and if vpon this small warning he findeth himselfe to haue bene deceiued wisedome would he should more carefully looke how he trusteth where hee hath bene abused and with greater diligence both to examine his owne writers and also to reade ours namely Cardinall Bellarmine where hee shall finde the most of his obiections answered as the Catholique author of that letter which hee hath put downe in his booke truely enformeth him To which that giueth no satisfaction alleaged by M. Vdall for answere to wit that Bellarmines reasons are by the learned of his side sufficiently handled and replied vnto when as the most of the arguments in his booke be answered by Bellarmine and nothing doe I find brought by M. Vdall to infringe his solutions which giueth me iust cause to suspect that hee is with the preconceyted sinceritie of his owne doctors carried away into error and so looketh litle into the Originals which if he did he culd not but find that which he pretendeth to seeke for if he shut not his eyes against the truth as he professeth he will not Which that he may doe I shall not forget to commend him to his mercy who desireth not the death of a sinner but that all should come to the knowledge of his name But if it shall fall out that he will still proceede forward in his former course yet I would wish him in writing to abstaine from all biting and bitter words which sometime he breaketh into that the quarrell of God may not be prosecuted like the quarrels of this world but with that modesty which becommeth the professors of diuinity and religion T. V. YOu see M. B. C. that I haue iustified and freed my selfe from all those vniust imputations wherewith you charged me And therefore since you ingage your selfe by this your promise To lay open the manifold maladies of my former Treatise and to shew with what weake engines as you phrase them I labour to vndermine the impregnable grounds of the Catholique Church I hope you will take warning by this little that hath bene shewed you to deale more sincerely in that which is to come wherein it shall be much for your owne credit and the reputation of the Catholique cause whereof you so much boast to be so impregnable that you answer not by patches and peeces picked heere and there for your most aduantage as your Cōmon custome is but that you set downe my words verbatim with the same equity that I haue shewed in this for if you deale otherwise I shall scarce iudge you worthy of any further answer And in the meane time I dare promise That your designemēts shal no way bee crost with the newes of my conuersion though I protest I will weigh the reasons that shall be deliuered by you hereafter with all indifferencie and good conscience Albeit I thinke it no such boldnesse as you censure it To launch into the depth of these mysticall matters since I hold it the dutie of euery Christian to know the grounds of his Religion to be infallible before he build his faith theron And for the relying vpon any man I neither haue nor wil further then truth shal warrant as nere as God shall mable me to iudge so that if I be deceiued which I see no cause yet to distrust it is error in my iudgment not euil affection in my will And whereas you wish me to read your Authors I may truly say I neuer refused to read any of thē nor conference with any how learned so euer Or how much so euer I might thereby haue disaduantaged my selfe and yet I was still more and more confirmed in the opinion I now hold and wherein I hope to die vnlesse Master B.C. will for the merite of winning soules make knowne some more certainty in the grounds of Poperie then I euer yet read or heard of You tell me That Bellarmine hath answered most of my obiections as the Catholique Author of that letter inserted by me hath truely informed me to which you say my answere giueth no satifaction And which yet is straunge you confesse my aunswere to bee this That Bellarmines reasons are by the learned of our side sufficiently handled and replied too Against which very absurdly in my poore opinion you reiterate the same speech againe and say That the most of the arguments in my booke be answered by Bellarmine and that you find nothing brought by mee to infringe his solutions Insinuating with more skill then sinceritie That you had vrged some particular instances therof whereto I had said nothing But if you had truely layd downe my answere in my letter it would much haue blemished the reputation both of your selfe and that Catholique Author That being so much vrged by me neither of you both could or would bring any such instance And how should I giue a solution to that which neitherof you both euer instanced though I much vrged it in my letter as these words there testifie viz. And whereas you referre me in the conclusion of your letter to Bellarmine de Pont. de Consiliis where you say I shall finde most of my obiections of the errors of Popes and Councels refuted so can I when soeuer you shall instance any such particular refutation which may ease you of some paines if it be so