prophane nouelties of heresies Had they knowne of this infallible Iudge should wee not haue heard of him in this so proper a place and as it were in a cause belonging to his owne Court Nay doth not the writing it selfe of such bookes shew that this mattter was wholly vnknowne to Antiquitie For had the Church beene in possession of so easie and sure a Court to discouer and discard heresies they should not haue needed to taske themselues to finde out any other But the truth is infallibilitie is and euer hath beene accounted proper to Christs iudgement And as hath beene said all necessarie Truth to saluation hee hath deliuered vs in his Word That Word himselfe tells vs shall iudge at the last day Yea in all true decisions of Faith that Word euen now iudgeth Christ iudgeth the Apostle sits Iudge Christ speakes in the Apostle Thus Antiquitie Neither are they moued a whit with that obiection That the Scriptures are often the matter of Controuersies For in that case the remedie was easie which Saint Augustine shewes to haue recourse to the plaine places and manifest such as should need no interpreter for such there bee by which the other may bee cleered The same may be said if sometimes it be questioned which bee Scriptures which not I thinke it was neuer heard of in the Church that there was an externall infallible Iudge who could determine that question Arguments may be brought from the consent or dissent with other Scriptures from the attestation of Antiquitie and inherent signes of diuine authoritie or humane infirmitie but if the Auditor or Aduersarie yeeld not to these such parts of necessitie must needes be laid aside If all Scripture be denied which is as it were exceptio in iudicem ante litis contestationem Faith hath no place onely Reason remaines To which I thinke it will scarce seeme reasonable if you should say though all men are liers yet this Iudge is infallible and to him thou oughtest in conscience to obey and yeeld thy vnderstanding in all his detâ—rminations for hee cannot erre No not if all men in the world should say it Vnlesse you first set downe there is a God and stablish the authoritie of the bookes of holy Scripture as his voyce and thence shew if you can the warrant of this priuiledge Where you offiâ—me the Scriptures to be the law and the rule but alone of themselues cannot bee Iudges if you meane without being produced applied and heard yee say truth Yet Nicodemus spake not aâ—isse when hee demanded Doth our law iudge any man vnlesse it heare him first hee meant the same which Saint Paul when hee said of the high Priest thou sittest to iudge me according to the law and so doe we when wee say the same Neither doe wee send you to Angels or God himselfe immediately but speaking by his spirit in the Scriptures and as I haue right now said alledged and by discourse applied to the matters in question As for Princes since it pleased you to make an excursion to them if wee should make them infallible Iudge or giue them authoritie to decree in religion as they list as Gardiner did to King Henry the eight it might well bee condemned for monstrous as it was by Caluin As for the purpose Licere Regi interdicere populo vsum calicis in Coena Quarè Potestas 〈◊〉 summa est penes Regem quoth Gardiner This was to make the King as absolute a Tyrant in the Church as the Pope claimed to bee But that Princes which obey the truth haue commandement from God to command good things and forbid euill not onely in matters pertaining to humane societie but also the religion of God this is no new strange doctrine but Calums and ours and S. Augustines is so many words And this is all the Head-ship of the Church wee giue to Kings Whereof a Queene is as well capable as a King since it is an Act of authoritie not Ecclesiasticall Ministery proceeding from eminencie of power not of knowledge or holinesse Wherein not onely a learned King as ours is but a good old woman as Queene Elizabeth besides her Princely dignitie was may excell as your selues confesse your infallible Iudge himselfe But in power hee saith hee is aboue all which not to examine for the present in this power Princes are aboue all their subiects I trow and Saint Augustine saith plainly to command and forbid euen in the religion of God still according to Gods Word which is the touchstone of good and euill Neither was King Henry the eight the first Prince that exercised this power witnesse Dauid and Salomon and the rest of the Kings of Iudah before Christ And since that Kings were Christians the affaires of the Church haue depended vpon them and the greatest Synodes haue beene by their Decree as Socrates expresly saith Nor did King Henry claime any new thing in this Land but restored to the Crowne the ancient right thereof which sundry his predecessors had exercised as our Historians and Lawyers with one consent affirme The rest of your induction of Archbishops Bishops and whole Clergie in their Conuocation house and a Councell of all Lutherans Caluinists Protestants c. is but a needlesse pompe of words striuing to win by a forme of discourse that which gladly shall bee yeelded at the first demand They might all erre if they were as many as the sand on the sea shoare if they did not rightly apply the rule of holy Scriptures by which as you acknowledge the externall Iudge which you seeke must proceed As to your demand therefore how you should be sure when and wherein they did and did not erre where you should haue fixed your foot to forbeare to skirmish with your confirmation That though à posse ad esse non valet semper consequentia yet aliquando valet frustra dicitur potentia quae nunquam dueitur in actum To the former whereof I might tell you that without question nunquam valet and to the second that I can verie well allow that errandi potentia among Protestants be euer frustra This I say freely that if you come with this resolution to learne nothing by discourse or euidence of Scripture but only by the meere pronouncing of a humane externall Iudges mouth to whom you would yeeld your vnderstanding in all his determinations if as the Iesuites teach their Schollers you will wholly deny your owne iudgement and resolue that if this Iudge shall say that is blacke which appeares to your eyes white you will say it is blacke too you haue posed all the Protestants they cannot tell how to teach you infallibly Withall I must tell you thus much that this preparation of minde in a Scholler as you are in a Minister yea in a Christian that had but learned his Creed much more that had from a childe knowne the holy Scriptures that are able to make vs wise to saluation
lacke of Succession Bishops true Ordinations Orders Priesthood The fabulous Ordination at the Nags-head examined The Statute 8. Elizabeth Boners sleighting the first Parliament and Doctor Bancrofts answere to Master Alablaster The forme of Priesthood inquired of pag. 139. Chap. XII Of the Conclusion Master Wadesworths agonies and protestation The protestation and resolution of the Author and conceipt of Master Wadesworth and his accompt pag. 158. The Copies of certaine Letters which haue passed betweene Spaine and England in matter of RELIGION Salutem in Crucifiâ—o To the Worshipfull my good friend Mr. WILLIAM BEDEâ—â— c. Master Bedell MY very louing friend After the old plaine fashion I salute you heartily without any new fine complements or affected phrases And by my inquirie vnderstanding of this Bearer that after your being at 〈◊〉 you had passed to Conâ—tantinopâ—e and were returned to Saint 〈◊〉 in 〈◊〉 and with health I was exceeding glad thereof for I wish you well as to my selfe and hee telling mee further that to morrow God willing he was to depart from hence to imbarke for England and offering me to deliuer my Letters if I would write vnto you I could not omit by these hastie scribled lines to signifie vnto you the continuance of my sincere loue neuer to be blotted out of my brest if you kill it not with vnkindnesse like Master Ioseph Hall neither by distance of place nor successe of time nor difference of Religion For contrarie to the slanders raysed against all because of the offences committed by some wee are not taught by our Catholike Religion either to diminish our naturall obligation to our natiue Countrie or to alter our morall affection to our former friends And although for my change becomming Catholique I did expect of some Reuilers to be termed rather then prooued an Apostata yet I neuer looked for such termes from Master Hall whom I esteemed either my friend or a modester man whose flanting Epistle I haue not answered because I would not foile my hands with a Poeticall Rayler more full with froth of Wordes then substance of Matter and of whom according to his beginning I could not expect any sound Arguments but vaine Flourishes and so much I pray let him know from me if you please Vnto your selfe my good friend who doe vnderstand better then Master Hall what the Doctors in Schooles doe account Apostasie and how it is more and worse then Heresie I doe referre both him and my selfe whether I might not more probably call him Heretike then he terme me at the first dash Apostata but I would abstaine from such biting Satyres And if he or any other will needes fasten vpon me such bitter termes let them first prooue that in all points of faith I haue fallen totally from Christian Religion as did Iulian the Apostata For so is Apostasie described and differenced from Heresie Apostasia est error hâ—minis baptizati contrarius fidei Catholicae ex toto and Haeresis est error pertinax hominis baptizati contrarius â—idei Catholicae ex parte So that hee should haue shewed first my errors in matters of Faith not any error in other Questions but in decreed matters of Faith as Protestants vse to say necessarie vnto saluation Secondly that such errors were maintayned with obstinate pertinâ—cy and pertinacy is where such errors are defended against the consent and determination of the Catholik Church and also knowing that the whole Church teacheth the contrarie to such opinions yet will persist in them and yet further if there bee any doubt he must manifest vnto me which is the Catholique Church Thirdly to make it full Apostasie he should haue conuinced mee to haue swarued and back-slidden as you know the Greeke word signifies like Iulian renouncing his baptisme and forsaken totally all Christian Religion a horrible imputation though false nor so easily prooued as declaymed But I thanke God daily that I am become Catholique as all our Ancestors were till of late yeeres and as the most of Christendome still be at this present day with whom I had rather bee mis-called a Papist a Traytor an Apostata or Idolater or what he will then to remayne a Protestant with them still For in Protestant Religion I could neuer finde vniformitie of a settled faith and â—o no quietnesse of conscience especially for three or foure yeeres before my comming away although by reading studying praying and confeâ—ring I did most carefully and diligently labour to finde it among them But your contrarietie of Sects and opinions of 〈◊〉 Zwinglians Caluinists Protestants 〈◊〉 Cartwrightists and Brownists some of them damning each other many of them auouching their Positions to be matters of Faith for if they made them but Schoole questions of opinion onely they should not so much haue disquieted mee and all these being so contrarie yet euery one pretending Scriptures and arrogating the Holy Ghost in his fauor And aboue all which did most of all trouble me about the deciding of these and all other Controuersies which might arise I could not finde among all these Sects any certaine humane externall Iudge so infallibly to interpret Scriptures and by them and by the assistance of the Holy Ghost so vndoubtedly to define questions of Faith that I could assure my selfe and my soule This Iudge is infallible and to him thou oughtest in conscience to obey and yeeld thy vnderstanding in all his determinations of Faith for he cannot erre in those points And note that I speake now of an externall humane infallible Iudge For I know the Holy Ghost is the Diuine internall and principall Iudge and the Scriptures be the Law or Rule by which that humane externall Iudge must proceede But the Holy Scriptures being often the Matter of Controuersie and somtime questioned which be Scriptures and which bee not they alone of themselues cannot be Iudges and for the Holy Ghost likewise euery one pretending him to bee his Patron how should â— certainly know by whom he speaketh or not For to Men we must goe to learne and not to Angels nor to God himselfe immediately The Head of your Church was the Queene an excellent notable Prince but â— Woman not to speake much lesse to be Iudge in the Church and since a learned King like King Henrie the eight who was the first temporall Prince that euer made himselfe Ex Regio jure Head of the Church in spirâ—tuall matters a new strange Doctrine and therefore iustly condemned by Caluin for monstrous But suppose hee were such a Head yet you all confesse that hee may erre in matters of Faith And so you acknowledge may your Archbishops and Bishops and your whole Clergie in their Conuocation-house euen making Articles and Decrees yea though a Councell of all your Lutherans Calâ—â—â—nists Protestants c. of Germanie France Engiana c. were all ioyned together and should agree all which they neuer will doe to compound and determine the differences among themselues yet by your ordinarie Doctrine of
Protestants Church not the true Church Againe by that saying Haereses ad originem reuocasse est refutasse and so considering Luthers first rancour against the Dominicans his disobedience and contempt of his former Superiours his vowe breaking and violent courses euen causing rebellion against the Emperour whom he reuiles and other Princes most shamefully surely such arrogant disobedience scisme and rebellions had no warrant nor vocation of God to plant his Church but of the Deuill to begin a scisme and a sect So likewise for Caluin to say nothing of all that D. Bolsecus brings against him I doe vrge onely what Master Hooker Doctor Bancroft and Sarauia doe proue against him for his vnquietnesse and ambition reuoluing the Common-wealth and so vniuâ—tly expelling and depriuing the Bishop of Geneua and other temporall Lords of their due obedience and ancient inheritance Moreouer I referre you to the stirres broiles sedition and murders which Knoxe and the Geneua Gospellers caused in Scotland against their lawfull Gouernours against their Queene and against our King euen in his Mothers belly Nor will I insist vpon the passions which first moued King Henrie violently to diuorce himselfe from his lawfull wife to fall out with the Pope his friend to marrie the Lady Anne Bullen and soone after to behead her to disinherite Queene Mary and enable Queene Elizabeth and presently to diâ—inherit Queene Elizabeth and to restore Queene Mary to hang Catholiques for traitors and to burne Protestants for heretiques to destroy Monasteries and to pill Churches were these fit beginnings for the Gospell of Christ I pray was this man a good head of Gods Church for my part I beseech our Lord blesse me from being a member of such a head or such a Church I come to France and Holland where you know by the Hugenots and Geuses all Caluinistes what ciuill wars they haue raised how much bloud they haue shed what rebellion rapine and desolations they haue occasioned principally for their new Religion founded in bloud like Draecos lawes But I would gladly know whether you can approue such bloudy broiles for Religion or no I know Protestants de facto doe iustifie the ciuill warres of France and Holland for good against their Kings but I could neuer vnderstand of them quo lure if the Hollanders be Rebels as they are why did we support themâ— if they be no rebels because they fight for the pretended liberty of their ancient priuiledges and for their new Religion we see it is an easie matter to pretend liberties and also why may not others as as well reuolt for their old Religion Or I beseech you why is that accounted treason against the State in Catholiques which is called reason of State in Protestants I reduce this argument to few words That Church which is founded and begun in maâ—ice disobedience passion bloud and rebellion cannot be the true Church but it is euident to the world that the Protestant Churches in Germanie Francâ— Holland Geneua c. were so founded and in Geneua and Holland are still continued in rebellion ergo they are not true Churches Furthermore where is not Succession both of true Pastors and of true Doctrine there is no true Church But among Protestants is no succession of true Pastors for I omit here to treate of Doctrine ergo no true Church I prooue the minor where is no consecration nor ordination of Bishops and Priests according to the due forme and right intention required necessarily by the Church and ancient Councels there is no succession of true Pastors but among Protestants the said due forme and right intention are not obserued ergo no succession of true Pastors The said due forme and right intention are not obserued among Protestants in France Holland nor Germanie where they haue no Bishops and where Lay men doe intermeddle in the making of their Ministers And for England whereas the Councels require the ordines minores of Subdeacon and the rest to goe before Priesthood your Ministers are made per saltum without euer being Subdeacons And whereas the Councels require three Bishops to assist at the consecration of a Bishop it is certaine that at the Nags-head in Cheap-side where consecration of your first Bishops was attempted but not effected whereabout I remember the controuersie you had with one there was but one Bishop and I am sure there was such a matter and although I know and haue seene the Records themselues that afterward there was a consecration of Doctor Parker at Lambeth and three Bishops named viz. Miles Couerdall of Exceter one Hodgeskin Suffragan of Bedford and another whose name I haue forgotten yet it is very doubtfull that Couerdall being made Bishop of Exceter in King Edwards time when all Councels and Church Canons were little obserued he was neuer himselfe Canonically consecrated and so if he were no Canonicall Bishop he could not make another Canonicall and the third vnnamed as I remember but am not sure was onely a Bishop Elect and not consecrated and so was not sufficient But hereof I am sure that they did consecrate Parker by vertue of a Breue from the Queene as Head of the Church who indeed being no true Head and a Woman I cannot see how they could make a true consecration grounded on her authoritie Furthermore making your Ministers you keepe not the right intention for neither doe the Orderer nor the Ordered giue nor receiue the Orders as a Sacrament nor with any intention of Sacrificing Also they want the matter and forme with which according to the Councels and Canons of the Church holy Orders should be giuen namely for the matter Priesthood is giuen by the deliuerie of the Patena with bread and of the Chalice with wine Deaconship by the deliuerie of the booke of the Gospels and Subdeaconship by the deliuerie of the Patena alone and of the Chaliâ—e emptie And in the substantiall forme of Priesthood you doe faile most of all which forme consists in these wordes Accipe potestatem offerendi sacrificium in Ecclesia pro viuis mortuis which are neither said noâ— done by you and therefore well may you bee called Ministers as also Lay men are but you are no Priests Wherefore I conclude wanting Subdeaconship wanting vndoubted Canonicall Bishops wanting right intention wanting matter and due forme and deriuing euen that you seeme to haue from a Woman the Head of your Church therefore you haue no true Pastors and consequently no true Church And so to conclude and not to wearie my selfe and you too much being resolued in my vnderstanding by these and many other Arguments that the Church of England was not the true Church but that the Church of Rome was and is the onely true Church because it alone is Ancient Catholique and Apostolique hauing Succession Vnitie and Visibilitie in all ages and places yet what agonies I passed with my will here I will ouer-passe Onely I cannot pretermit to tell you that at last hauing also mastered and
become no true Church to wit when it shall so erre damnably But then it followes not There is now no saluation in it and therefore come out of it now When you shew that I shall account you haue done wisely to goe out of it Shew that in anie one point and take me with you In the meane while for my part I shall sooner trust that chapman that shall say to me Loe here is a perfect yard I will measure as truely as I can and when I haue done take the yard and measure it your selfe then him that shall say here is thus much yee shall not neede to measure it but take it on my word yea though one of his Apprentices should stand by and say he could not deceiue mee though hee would as Benedictus a Benedictus tels the present Pope Volens nolens errare non potes Where you relate your endeauour to defend the Church of England and tell of the Puritanes reiecting those Arguments you could vse from the authoritie of the Church and of the ancient Doctors interpreting Scriptures against them flying to their owne arrogant spirit I cannot excuse them for the former nor subscribe to your accusation in the latter Perhaps you haue met with some more fanaticall Brownists or Anadaptists whom here you call Puritans But these that are commonly so called which differ from the Church of England about Church gouernment and ceremonies onely giue indeede to little to the authoritie of men how holy learned or ancient soeuer Which is their fault and their great fault especially in matters of this nature yet they flye not to their owne spirit as you charge them That which you adde that you perceiued the most Protestants did frame the like euasions when you came to answere the Arguments against them on the other side when you shall shew this in particulars I shall beleeue it In the meane while I beleeue you thought so for commonly mediocrities are aggrauated with the hatred slandered with the names of both extreames But in the question betweene the Popish faction and vs you might easily haue discerned why the argument from bare authoritie is not of such validitie For ceremonies and matters of order may be ordered by wise men are not the worse but the better if they be ancient yea if they be common to vs with Rome which Puritans will by no meanes allow In doctrin if holy men yea if an Angell from heauen shall innouate any thing wee are not to admit it Now the controuersies betweene the Romanists and vs are most about doctrine and they exceede as much in extolling the authoritie of the ancients in their priuate opinions and incommodious and strained speeches as the Puritans in depressing them We hold the meane and giue as much to the authoritie and testimonies of the Fathers as may stand with the truth of holy Scriptures and as themselues deferre to the writing of others or require to be giuen to their owne Next you tell of your following their opinion who would make the Church of England and the Church of Rome still to be all one in Essentiall points and the differences to be accidentall Confessing the Church of Rome to be a true Church though sicke or corrupted and the Protestants to be derined from it and reformed This opinion is not onely as you write fauoured of many great Schollers in England but is the common opinion of all the best Diuines of the reformed Churches that are or haue beene in the world as I shewed in part of another worke which as I remember you had a sight of Wherein yet I feare you mistake the tearme accidentall which doth noâ— import that our differences are but sleight and of small confideration but that all those opinions and abuses which we reforme and cut off are not of the Faith but superfluous and â—oraine yea hurtfull and noisome to it as the weedes are to the corne which ouer-grow and choake it And to follow this similitude the state of the Church vnder the Romane obedience and that part which is reformed is like a field ouergrowne all with weedes thistles tares cockle some part whereof is weeded and clensed some part remaines as it was before which makes such a difference to the view as if it were not the same corne But being better considered it will be found all the difference is from the weedes which remaine there and here are taken away Yet neither here perfectly nor all where a like but acâ—ording to the industrie of our weeders or conueniencie of the worke with care of the safetie of the good corne By this Parable you may see what is to be hoped of your labour to reconcile most of our particular controuersies For although I doubt not but in some it may be performed where the difference is rather verball then reall and in the manner of teaching rather then in the substance of doctrine And if moderate men had the matter in handling the flame of contention in a great many more might be troden downe and slaked suppose the sparkes not all extinct yet in some other it is as possible to make the weede and corne-friends as your and our opinions where there is none other remedy but that of our Sauiour Euery plant that my heauenly Father hath not planted shall be rooted out Neither doth this impossibilitie arise more out of the nature of the things then the affection of the persons For the Pope and the Court of Rome which are those that domineere on that side doe no lesse out of the feare of their owne ruine deadly detest all reformation then the reformed out of their present view and former feeling the tyrannie of the Papacie which they see doth excommunicate and put to cruell death all that are of this way And which is a prodigious thing where they tolerate the blasphemous and professed enemies of Christ euen with allowance of the publike exercise of their Religion there doe they burne men professing Christs religion according to the ancient and common rule thereof with that vprightnesse of conscience that if they had as many liues as there be Articles thereof they would giue them all rather then renounce any of them As for the Protestants making the Pope Antichrist I know it is a point that inrageth much at Rome But if the Apostle Saint Paul if Saint Iohn in the Reuelation describe Antichrist so as they that doe but looke vpon the Pope well must be forced to say as the people did of the blinde man in the Gospell some this is â—e others he is very like him if himselfe and his flatterers doe and speake such things as if all others should hold their peace doe in a sort proclaime I am he what can the Protestants doe with the matter I will take the liberty here to relate to you what I saw while I was in Venice the rather because it is not impertinent to our present purpose And though perhaps you may
modestie neuer vsurped this Title full of arrogancy neuer heard it with patient eares To this let it first bee considered that the Censors of such things as come to the Presse are not to bee imagined such Babes as not to know what will please or displease his Holinesse Especially in writings dedicated to himselfe a man may be sure they will allow nothing the second time and after some exception and scandal taken at it but what shall bee iustified How much more in the Popes owne Towne of Bologna and when his Chaplaine could not bee allowed to print it at home But to let all these goe wee may haue a more sensible proofe how the Pope tastes these Titles That which hee rewards hee approues Benedictus was shortly after made for his paines Bishop of Caorli How worthily hee deserued it you shall iudge by his booke which at my request vouchsafe to reade ouer and if there be any merit you shall sure get great meede of patience in so doing That you may not doubt of the Popes iudgement concerning these Titlâ—s you shall further know that the matter being come to the knowledge of the Protestants in France and England made them talke and write of it broadly namely the Lord of Plessis in his Mysterium iniquitatis and the Bishop of Chichester in his Tortura Torti This gaue occasion to the Cardinall Gieurè to relate in the Officio Santo at Rome of the scandall taken hereat and to make a motion De moderandis titulis It was on foot sundrie moneths At last the Pope reuoking it to himselfe blamed those that had spoken against these Titles and said they were no whit greater then the authoritie of S. Peters Successor did beare To returne thither whence I haue a litle digressâ—d In the question whether the Pope bee the Antichrist or no for my part I despaire of all reconciliation For neither doth there appeare any inclination at all in the Pope to reforme any thing in Doctrine or Gouernment nay he encroacheth daily more and more vpon all degrees euen among his owne subiects and resolues to carry all before him at the brest with his Monarchy and infallibilitie On the other side the Reformers partly emboldned with successe partly enforced by necessitie chiefly tyed with band of conscience and perswasion of truth are not like to retract what they haue affirmed in this behalfe and whatsoeuer their differences be in other things in this point they haue a maruellous vnâ—tie amongst them These in France hauing beene molested for calling the Pope Antichrist haue beene occasioned as I haue heard some few yeares since to take it into their Confession thereby to iustifie themselues accorâ—ing to th' Edicts of Pacification giuing them libertie to proâ—esse their Religion In England as you know it is no part of the doctrine of our Church yet a commonly receiued opinion Howbeit this is so farre from hindering that the reformed Chuâ—ches and those which heretofore were or at this present are vnder the Popes obedience be one Church that is all members of the Catholike that the Protestants without this cannot make good the other For Antichrist must sit in the Temple of God and that is in the Church as Chrysostome and Theophylact interpret it and Gods people could not be commanded to goe out of Babell if he had none there CHAP. V. Of the safenesse to ioyne to the Roman being confessed a true Church by her opposites BVt you concluded hence that seeing many of the best learned Protestants did grant the Church of Rome to be a true Church though faultie in some things and contrarily not onely the Romanists but Puritanes Anabaptists and Brownist denie the Church of England to be so therefore it would be more safe and secure to become a Roman Catholike c. This discourse hath a pretâ—e shew at the first blush and perhaps was vsed to you since your comming to Spaine as it was to some there before At my comming to Venice I fell vpon certaine letters and reports set forth as it was told me by F. Posseuine and not vnlike by his mindefulnesse to all occasions to aduance the credit of his societie Amongst them there is one said to be a true Relation of the manner how M. Pickering Wotton was conuerted to the Catholike Roman faith indited as it is said and subscribed by himselfe before his death In which by a certaine Father of the companie of Iesus an Englishman by nation the like discourse was vsed as it is said to him That hee should consider well that he and other Protestants did not denie that the Catholikes might be saued in their faith whereas all the Catholikes that either liued at the present or euer were hold it as a most certaine Article of Faith that the Protestants and other heretickes cannot be saued out of the Catholicke Church therefore if he should become a Catholike he should enter into that way which was safe by the consent of both parts This consideration be saith moued him not much then But after praying to God as he was also aduised by that Father to direct him into the right way if hee were out of it suddenly hee saw a certaine light very clearely before his eyes in forme of a crosse Whereupon incontinently there was offered vnto him such a heape of reasons and arguments by which was shewed that the Catholike faith is the onely way of saluation and that of the Protestants on the contrarie most absurd and abominable that most euidently he was conuinced without any the least doubt And these reasons which then offered themselues to him were for the most part such as hee did not remember that he had euer heard them in all his life Thereupon with vnspeakeable ioy he called backe the Father told him what had hapned praied him to heare his confession and he examining him vpon all the heads of the Catholike religion which he most firmely and entirely beleeued heard his confession c. But this narration deserues little credit First creating Master Wâ—tton for the greater glorie of their triumph a Baron vnlesse the Fathers in Spaine or Posseuine in Italie haue a â—acultie to create Barons Next it is a very improbable thing that Master Wotton dying of a Calenture should haue so good a memorie as to indite so exact and artificiall a Narration with such formalitie and enforcements in fit places as any Reader of vnderstanding must needes perceiue came out of a diligent forge and needed more hammering and fyling then so But that of all other is most Legendlike that howsoeuer this motiue of yours is vsed yet it is not made the effectuall inducement but a heape of reasons in the twinkling of an eye and causing him not onely to beleeue in the grosse but to be able to giue acâ—ount of all the heads of the Catholike religion that is all the points of controuersie at this day betweene the Romists and the reformed Churches in a fit of an Agâ—e in
the twinkling of an eye Excuse mee this is beyond the blinde begger that recouered his sight at Saint Albans that could tell the names of all colours as soone as hee saw them What then Was not Master Wotton reconciled and saw he not a light in forme of a crosse Yes and this your motiue was vsed to him also and perhaps moued him more then all the heape of reasons besides But shall I tell you here what I haue heard from the mouth of one that was himselfe then in Spaine that both could know the truth of this matter and had no reason to tell me a lye sith what hee said came freely from himselfe without feare or hope or almost enquirie The Gentleman being sicke and weake in his braine the Father that Posseuine tels of brought vnder his gowne a picture and vpon a sudden presented it before him this might be the light in forme of a crosse perhaps a very image of Christ crucified which together with the lightnesse of his fancie occasioned that your motiue though it selfe also very light might carrie him as a little weight is able to sway much where the beame it selfe is false If this be true as I take the liuing God to record I faine no thing but doe relate what hath beene told me as on the one side I doubt not but God in his mercie did interpret of the Gentlemans religion according to his right iudgement and perswasion in his health and not according to the erronious apprehension of his fancie in his sicknesse which euen in his best health was euer very strong in his sleep as some that haue conuersed with him haue tolde mee So on the other side they shall beaâ—e their iudgement whosoeuer they were that would with so cruâ—ll a craftinesse take aduantage of his infirmitie and make his storie after a stale to draw on others As for the heape of Arguments to conuince the Protestants faith to bee absurd that must bee by the way the Articles of the Creed Posseuines Catholike Hyperboles are well enough knowne in Venice and hee hath beene there told to his head That if in things past whereof hee might haue beene informed hee proues a most lying Historian it might more easily fall out that hee should proue a most false and ridiculous prophet in things to come And in truth he hath proued so hitherto Wherefore I reckon these garnishments of Master Wottons peruersion to bee like the rest of his newes touching the Conquest of Moscouia by Demetrius that Impostor whom he boasteth in a manner to haue been the Scholler of his Societie Wâ—ere hee tells the world that the army cried out often God and the prayers of our Fathers the Iesuites haue subdued the hearts of our enemies and inclined them vnder our Noble Prince Demetrius That Demetrius turning to the Priests of the company of Iesus was heard to say Loe that which you foretold mee O Fathers in the time of that sorrowfull flight of ours is now come to passe to wit that as the Lord God had afflicted mee much so on the contrary hee would much comfort mee and that therefore I should not doubt of a full victory These wordes Posseuine stamps in his former Relation in Capitall letters But when this bold enterprise was ouerthrowne and this suborned fugitiue slaine and shamefully dragged vp and downe the streets of Mosco then loe the repors were That a light was seene ouer his body in the night time c. Let them that walke in darknesse follow such lights as these be Wee are no children of the night nor of darkenesse Leauing therefore those vnheard of Arguments which Posseuine hath not onely cunningly drawne a veyle ouer that wee may not see them but exempted by priuiledge of a miracle that wee may not try them this which he hath shewed vs let vs bring it a little to the cleere day-light And euen at the first view it is apparent that this Argument is meerely forraine not drawne from any thing à parâ—e rei as what the true Church is what it teacheth or such like but from opinion and testimony What men say of that of Rome and of the Reformed Churches c. Now opinions are no certaine grounds of truth no not in naturall and ciuill matters much lesse in religion So this Argument at the most is but Topicall and probable Let vs see the parts of it And first that ground The testimony of our selues and of our contraries is much more sufficient and certaine then to iustifie our selues alone Surely neither the one nor the other is sufficient or certaine It is true that if other proofe faile and we will follow coniectures hee is in probabilitie an honester man that others beside himselfe say well of then hee that alone testifieth of himselfe And yet according to truth this latter may bee a right honest man and dwel as we say by ill neighbours or where he is not knowne or requires not the testimony of other men Whereas the other being indeed a knaue is either cunning to conceale it or hath suborned other like himselfe to say for him or dwells bâ— honest men that iudge and say the best And in this very kind our Sauiour attributes so little to testimony as he pronounces a woe to them that all men speake well of So in our case it is more probable I grant if there were no other Argument to cleere it but opinion and most voyces that you haue the true Church and are in the way of saluation then wee because we giue you a better testimony then you doe vs. But it is possible we are both deceiued in our opinions each of other wee through too much charitie and you and others through ignorance or malice Herein vndoubtedly we haue the aduantage of you and the rest and doe take that course which is more safe and sure to auoid sinne that if we doe faile of the truth yet we be deceiued with the error of loue which as the Apostle saith hopeth all things and is not puffed vp Wee auoid at the least that gulfe of rash iudgement which mee thinkes if the case bee not too to cleere wee should all feare With what iudgement yee iudge yee shall bee iudged Thou that iudgest another condemnest thy selfe But that you may a little be ter consider the weaknesse of this discourse if the testimony of our selues and our contraries were sufficient and certaine to make truâ—h and euer more safe and secure to follow that side which hath that testimony it had beene better to haue become a Iewish Proselyte in the Apostles times then a Christian â— For the Christâ—ans acknowledged the Iewes to be the people of God heires of the promises and of Christ and stiled them Brethren notwithstanding their zeale to the ceremonies and tradiâ—ions of their Fathers excused their ignorance bare with them laboured to giue them content in all things Whereas they to the contrarie called those that professed
Christ Heretickes and Sectaries accursed them drew them out of â—heir Synagogues scourged them cast them in prison compelled them to blaspheme as you doe now Protestants to adiuâ—e though in other cruelties I confesse you goe farre beyond them By like reason a Pagan in Saint Augustines time should rather haue made himselfe a Christian among the Donatists then with the Catholikes For the Catholikes granted the Donatists Baptisme to bee true accounâ—ed them Brethren The Donatists to the contrary renounced their Brother-hood and Baptisme both rebaptized such as fell to their side vsed these formes to their friends Saue thy Soule become a Christian like to those vsed by your Reconcilers at this â—ay Lastly consider if this ground of the testimony of our contraries for our part and their lack of ours for theirs be sure you haue iustified the cause of the Protestants in the maine question which is the better religion For whatsoeuer a Protestant holds as of Faith you cannot deny to bee good and Catholike nor any Christian man else For hee binds him to his Creed to the holy Scriptures and goes no further and in these he hath your testimony for him But hee denies many things which you beleeue and accounts them forreine yea repugnant to Faith as the Popes infallibilitie Transubstantiation Purgatory worshipping of Images inuocation of Saints In all these you speake onely for your selues in some of these you haue not vs onely but all other Christians your opposites to say nothing of the Iewes and Turkes whom I might as well chocke you withall as you doe the Protestants with Anabaptists So by this reason our profession is more safe and secure and questionlesse is more Catholike then yours Neither haue wee in this discourse the Argument onely as you see very appliable and fauourable to vs but which I would entreate you by the way to obserue the conclusion it selfe often granâ—ed by moderate and sober men of your owne side viz. that our course is in sundry things more safe then yours As in making no Image of God In trusting onely in the merits of Christ. In worshipping none but the Trinitie In directing our prayers to our Lord Iesus Christ alone In allowing Ministers to marry In diâ—ers other points also many of your side say the same with the Protestants and defend vs from the imputations which others of you lay vpon vs as is shewed in the Catholike Apologie by the Reuerend Bishop of Chester This to the proposition Let vs come to the Assumption where you mince too much the Protestants opinion touching the Church of Rome when you make them say It is peraduenture faultie in some things Nay without peraduenture they say It is corrupt in doctrine superstitious and Idolatrous in religion tyrannicall in gouernment defiled in manners from the crowne of the head to the soale of the foot no soundnes in it as the Prophet saith of another like it yet the vitall parts not perished readie to die yet not dead A true Church though neither the Catholike Church nor yet a sound member of the same That also is false in the assumption that the Puritans denie the Church of England to bee a true Church Vnlesse the Puritans and Brownists bee with you all one which you haue made diuers Sects aboue and then are you to blame as to multiply names whereof I haue told you before so now againe to confound them What is now the Conclusion It would be more safe and secure to become a Roman Catholike But the Proposition wil not inferre thus much simply but onely in this respect For Topicall arguments as you know hold onely caeteris paribus We must then inquire if there be no other intrinsecall arguments by which it may bee discerned whether cause bee the better whether pretence to the Church and Truth more iust more euident Whether it may bee warranted to returne to Babell because God hath some people there when as he commands those that are there to come out of it How safe it may bee willingly to ioyne with that part of the Church which is more corrupt in Doctrine and Manners when wee may continue with that which is reformed These points were to haue been scanned ere you concluded and executed as you did And such Arguments there want not Christ our Lord hath giuen vs amongst others two infallible Notes to know his Church My Sheepe saith hee heare my voice and againe By this shall all men knowe that yee are my Disciples if yee loue one another What shall wee stand vpon coniecturall Arguments from that which men say We are partiall to our selues malignant to our opposites Let Christ bee heard who bee his who not And for the hearing of his voice O that it might be the issue But I see you decline it Therefore I leaue it also for the present That other is that which now I stand vpon the badge of Christs sheepe Not a likelihood but a certaine token whereby euery man may know them By this saith he shall all men know that yee are my Disciples if yee haue charitie one towards another Thanks be to God This marke of our Sauiour is in vs which you with our Schismatikes and other enemies want As Salomon found the true Mother by her naturall affection that chose rather to yeeld to her Aduersaries plea clayming her childe then endure it should bee cut in peeces so may it soone bee found at this day whether is the right Mother Ours that saith giue her the liuing child and kill him not or yours that if shee may not haue it is content it bee killed rather then want of her will Alas saith ours euen of those that leaue her these be my children I haue borne them to Christ in Baptisme I haue nourished them as I could with mine owne breasts his Testaments I would haue brought them vp to mans estate as their free birth and parentage deserues Whether it bee their lightnesse or discontent or her enticing wordes and gay shewes they leaue me they haue found a better Mother Let them liue yet though in bondage I shall haue patience I permit the care of them to their Father I beseech him to keepe them that they doe none euill if they make their peace with him I am satisfied they haue not hurt me at all Nay but saith yours I sit alone as Queene and Mistris of Christs family hee that hath not me for his Mother cannot haue God for his Father Mine therefore are these either borne or adopted and if they will not bee mine they shall bee none So without expecting Christs sentence shee cuts in peeces with the temporall sword hangs burnes drawes those that shee perceiues inclined to leaue her or haue left her alreadie So shee kils with the spirituall sword those that subiect not to her yea thousands of soules that not onely haue no meanes so to doe but many which neuer so
vniforme concord with the Protestants at this day in such matters as appeareth by the common rule of Faith the Creede and so hath also the Church vnder the Popes tyrannie As to the Trent-additions they are forraine to the Faith as neither principles nor conclusions thereof neither can your selues shew vniforme consent and concord in them and namely in the 11. of them in any one age especially as matters of saluation as now they are canonized How much lesse can yee shew it in all other conclusions of Faith whereabout there haue beene among you as are now among vs and euer will bee differences of opinions without any prejudice for all that vnto the vnitie of the Faith of the Church and title to the name of it As for Wicliffe Hus and the rest if they haue any of them borne record to the Truth and resisted any innouation of corrupt Teachers in their times euen to bloud they are iustly to be termed Martyrs yea albeit they saw not all corruptions but in some were themselues carried away with the streame of error Else if because they erred in some things they bee no Martyrs or because wee dissent from them in some things we are not of the same Church both you and we must quit all claime to Saint Cyprian Iustine Martyr and many more whom wee count our Ancients and Predecessors and bereaue them also of the honour of Martyrdome which so long they haue enjoyed You see I hope by this time the weaknesse of your Argument CHAP. X. Of the originall of reformation in Luther Caluin Scotland England c. IN your next Motiue taken from the originall of Reformation before I come to answere your Argument shortly coucht in forme I must endeuour to reforme your iudgement in sundrie points of storie wherein partly you are misse-led and abused by Parsons and others of that spirit partly you haue mistaken some particulars and out of a false imagination framed a like discourse First for Luther it was not his ranâ—our against the Dominicans that stirred him vp against the Pope but the shamefull merchandize of Indulgences set to sale in Germanie to the aduantage of Magdalen sister to Pope Leo X. Beleeue herein if not Sleidan yet Gâ—â—cciardine l. 13. And of all that mention those affaires it is acknowledged that at the first and for a good time he shewed all obedience and reuerence to the Pope The new Historie of the Councell of Trent written by an Italian a subiect and part of the Church of Rome as should appeare by the Epistle Dedicatorie of the Reuerend and learned Archbishop of Spalato prefixed to his Maiestie speaketh thus of the matter Questo diede occasione c. This gaue occasion to Martin to passe from Indulgences to the authoritie of the Pope which being by others proclaymed for the highest in the Church by him was made subiect to a Generall Councell lawfully celebrated Whereof hee said that there was neede in that instant and vrgent necessitie And as the heat of disputation continued by how much the more the Popes power was by others exalted so much the more was it by him abased yet so as Martin contayned himselfe within the termes of speaking modestly of the person of Leo and sauing sometimes his iudgement Againe After his departure from the presence of Cardinall Cajetan at Augusta hee saith hee wrote a letter to the Cardinall confessing that hee had beene too vehement and excusing himselfe by the importunitie of the Pardoners and of those that had written against him promising to vse more modestie in time to come to satisfie the Pope and not to speake any more of Indulgences prouided that his aduersaries would doe the like This was Luthers manner at the first till the Bull of Pope Leo came out dated the ninth of Nouember 1518. Wherein he declared the validitie of Indulgences and that hee as Peters Successor and Christs Vicar had power to grant them for the quicke and dead that this is the doctrine of the Church of Rome the Mother and Mistris of all Christians and ought to bee receiued of all that would bee in the Communion of the Church From this time forward Luther began to change his stile And saith he as before hee had for the most part reserued the person and iudgement of the Pope so after this Bull he resolued to refuse it and thereupon put forth an Appeale to the Councell c. You see then how submissiuely Luther at first carried himself But extreme tyrannie ouer-comes often a well prepared patience Touching his causing rebellion also against the Emperour yee are misse-informed his aduice was asked about the association of the Protestants at Smalcald hee said plainly hee could not see how it could bee lawfull further then for their owne defence Ioh. Bodin in his second Booke de Repub cap. 5. hath these wordes We reade also that the Protestant Princes of Almaine before they tooke armes against the Emperour demanded of Martin Luther if it were lawfull He answered freely that it was not lawfull whatsoeuer tyrannie or impietie were pretended He was not beleeued so the end thereof was miserable and drew after it the ruine of great and illustrious houses of Germanie As for the warre in Germanie it began not till after Luthers death neither was it a rebellion of the Protestants the truth is they stood for their liues The Emperour with the helpe of the Popes both mony and armes intended to roote them out and although at the first the Emperour did not auow his raysing armes against them to be for Religion yet the Pope in his Iubilee published vpon this occasion did not let to declare to the world that himselfe and Caesar had concluded a league to reduce the Hâ—retikes by force of armes to the obedience of the Church and therefore all should pray for the good successe of the warre That Luther euer reuiled the Emperour I did neuer till now heare or reade and therefore would desire to know what authors you haue for it Touching other Princes namely King Henrie the eighth I will not defend him who condemned himselfe thereof It is true that he was a man of a bold and high stomacke and specially fitted thereby through the prouidence of God to worke vpon the heauie and dull disposition of the Almaines and in so generall a Lethargie as the world then was in hee carried himself as fell out somtimes very â—oisterously But arrogancie schâ—sme rebellion were as farre from him as the intention itself to plant a Church As to his Vow-breaking lastly if that Vow were foolishly made and sinfully kept it was iustly broken perhaps also charitably if hee would by his owne example reforme such as liued in whoredome and other vncleannes and induce them to vse the remedie that God hath appointed for the auoiding of them to wit honorable marriage All this matter touching Luther vnlesse I be â—eceiued you haue taken from 〈◊〉 Harding that at least touching his
the present state of Geneua did then require But bee it and for my part I thinke no lesse that herein hee was mistaken to account this to bee the true forme of Church policie by which all other Churches and at all times ought to bee gouerned let his error rest with him yea let him answere it vnto his Iudge but to accuse him of ambition and sedition and that falsly and from thence to set that brand vpon the reformation whereof he was a worthy instrument though not the first either there or any where else as if it could not bee from God being so founded for my part I am afraide you can neuer bee able to answere it at the same Barre no nor euen that of your owne conscience or of reasonable and equall men For the stirres broiles seditions and murthers in Scotland which you impute to Knox and and the Geneua Gospellers they might be occasioned perhaps by the reformers there as the broiles which our Loâ—d Iesus Christ saith he came to set in the world by the Gospell Possible also that good men out of incoÌ„siderate zeale should do some things rashly And like enough the multitude which followed them as being foreprepared with a iusthatred of the tyrannie of their Prelates and prouoked by the opposition of the aduerse faction emboldned by successâ— ran a great deale further then either wise men could foresee or tell how to restraine them Which was applauded and fomented by some politicke men who tooke aduantage of those motions to their owne ends And as it happens in naturall bodies that all ill humors runne to the part affected so in ciuill all discontented people when there is any sorance runne to one or other side and vnder the shew of common griefes pursue their owne Of all which distempers there is no reason to lay the blame vpon the seekers of reformation more then vpon the Phisitians of such accidents as happen to the corrupted bodies which they haue in cure The particulars of those affaires are as I beleeue alike vnknown to vs both and since you name none I can answere to none For as for the pursuing our King euen before his birth that which his Maiestie speakes of some Puritans is ouer-boldly by you referred to Master Knox and the Ministers that were authors of Reformation in Scotland Briefely consider and suruey your owne thoughts and see if you haue not come by these degreesâ— First from the inconsiderate courses of some to plant the pretended Discipline in Scotland to conceiue amisse of the Doctrine also Then to draw to the encreasing of your ill conceit thereof what you finde reported of any of the Puritans a faction no lesse opposed by his Maiesty in Scotland then with vs in England So when we speake of religion though that indeede be all one yee diuide vs into Lutherans Zwinglians Caluinists Protestants Brownists Puritans Cartwrightists whensoeuer any disorder of all this number can be accused then loe are we all one and the faulâ— of any faction is the slander of all yea of the Gospell it selfe and of reformation Iudge now vprightly if this be indifferent dealing From Scotland you come to England Where because you could finde nothing done by popular tumult nothing but by the whole state in Parliament and Clergie in Conuocation you fall vpon King Henries passions you will not insist vpon them you say and yet you doe as long as vpon any one member of your induction though it matters little whether you doe or no since F. Parsons will needes auerre that hee liued and died of your religion Here first you mention his violent diuorcing himselfe from his lawfull wife Wee will not now debate the question how his Brothers wife could bee his lawfull wife you must now say so Whatsoeuer the Scriptures Councels almost all Vniuersities of Christendome determined Yet mee thinkes it should moue you that Pope Clement himselfe had consigned to Cardinal Campegius a Breue formed to sentence for the King in as ample manner as could be howsoeuer vpon the successe of the Emperours affaires in Italie and his own occasions he sent a special messenger to him to burn it But what violence was this that you speake of The matter was orderlie and iudiciouslie by the Arch-bishop of Canterbury with the assistance of the learnedest of the Clergie according to the ancient Canons of the Church and lawes of the Realme heard and determined That indeede is more to be maruelled at what moued him to fall out with the Pope his friend in whose quarrell he had so far engaged himselfe as to write against Luther of whom also he was so rudelie handled as you mention before hauing receiued also for some part of recompence the title of the Defender of the Faith hauing beene so chargeablie thankefull to the Pope for it All these things considered it must be said this vnkindnesse and slipperie dealing of Clement with him was from the Lord that hee might haue an occasion against the Pope and that it might appeare that it was not humane counsell but diuine prouidence that brought about the banishment of the Popes tyrannie from among vs. His marriage with the Ladie Anne Bullen her death and the rest which you mention of the abling or disabling her issue to inherit the Crown I see not what it makes to our purpose The suppression of the Monasteries was not his sole Act but of the whole State with the consent also of the Clergie and taken out of Cardinall Wolsey his example yea founded vpon the Popes authoritie granted to him to dissolue the smaller houses of religion on pretence to defray the charges of his sumptuous buildings at Oxford and lâ—swich wherein if it pittie you as I confesse it hath sometimes mee that such goodly buildings are defaced and ruined wee must remember what God did to Shâ—loh yea to Ierusalem it selfe and his Temple there And that Oracle Euery tree that beareth not good fruit shall be cut downe and cast into the fire You demand If this man King Henry were a good head of Gods Church What if I should demand the same touching Alexander the Sixth Iulius the Second Leo the Tenth or twentie more of the Catalogue of Popes in respect of whom King Henry might bee canonized for a Saint But there is a storie in Tullies Offices of one Lutatius that laid a wager that he was bonus vir a good man and would bee iudged by one Fimbria a man of Consular dignitie Hee when he vnderstood the case said Hee would neuer iudge that matter least either hee should diminish the reputation of a man well esteemed of or set downe that any man was a good man which hee accounted to consist in an innumerable sort of excellencies and praises That which hee said of a good man with much more reason may I sâ—y of a good King one of whose highest excellencies is to bee a good head of the Church And therefore it is a
question which I will neuer take vpon mee to answere whether King Henry were such or no vnlesse you will before hand interpret this word as fauourably as Guicciardine doth tell vs men are wont to doe in the censuring your heads of the Church For Popes he saith now adayes are praised for their goodnesse when they exceed not the wickednesse of other men After this description of a good head of the Church or if yee will that of Cominaeus which saith hee is to bee counted a good King whose vertues exceeds his vices I wil not doubt to say King Henry may be enrolled among the number of good Kings In speciall for his executing that highest dutie of a good King the imploying his authoritie in his Kingdome to command good things and forbid euill not onely concerning the ciuill estate of men but the religion also of God Witnesse his authorizing the Scriptures â—o be had and read in Churches in our Vulgar tongue enioyning the Lords Prayer the Creed and ten Commandements to bee taught the people in English abolishing superfluous Holy-dayes pulling downe those iugling Idols whereby the people were seduced namely the Rood of Grace whose eyes and lips were moued with wires openly shewed at Pauls Crosse and pulled asunder by the people Aboue all the abolishing of the Popes tyranny and merchandise of Indulgences such like chafer out of England Which Acts of his whosoeuer shall vnpartially consider of may well esteeme him a better head to the Churâ—h of England then any Pope these thousand yeeres In the last place you come to the Hugenots and Geuses of France and Holland You lay to their charge the raising of ciuill warres shedding of bloud occasioning rebellion rapine desolations principally for their new religion In the latter part you write I confesse somewhat reseruedly when you say occasioning not causing and principally not onely and wholly for religion But the words going before and the exigence of your argument require that your meaning should be they were the causers of these disorders You bring to my minde a story whether of the same Fimbria that I mentioned before or another which hauing caused Quintus Scaeuola to bee stab'd as F. Paulo was while I was at Venice after he vnderstood that he escaped with his life brought his action against him for not hauing receiued the weapon wholly into his body These poore people hauing endured such barbarous cruelties massacres and martyrdomes as scarce the like can be shewed in all stories are now accused by you as the Authors of all they suffered No no Master Wadesworth they bee the Lawes of the Romane religion that are written in bloud It is the bloudy Inquisition and the perfidious violating of the Edicts of Pacification that haue set France and Flanders in combustion An euident argument whereof may bâ—e for Flanders that those Geuses that you mention were not all Caluinists as you are mis-informed the chiefe of them were Romane Catholikes as namely Count Egmond and Horne who lost their heads for standing and yet onely by petition against the new impositions and the Inquisition which was sought to bee brought in vpon those Countries The which when the Vice-roy of Naples D. Petro de Toledo would haue once brought in there also the people would by no meanes abide but rose vp in Armes to the number of 50000. which sedition could not bee appeased but by deliuering them of that feare The like resistance though more quietly carried was made when the same Inquisition should haue beene put vpon Millaine sixteene yeeres after Yet these people were neither Geuses nor Caluinists Another great meanes to alienate the mindes of the people of the Low-countries from the obedience of the Catholike Maiestie hath beene the seueritie of his Deputies there one of which leauing the gouernment after hee had in a few yeeres put to death 8000. persons it is reported to haue been said the Countrie was lost with too much lenitie This speech Meursius concludes his Belgick history with all And as for France the first broiles there were not for religion but for the preferring the house of Guisâ— and disgracing the Princes of the bloud True it is that each side aduantaged themselues by the colour of religion and vnder pretence of zeale to the Romane the Guisians murthered the Protestants being in the exercise of their religion assembled together against the Kings Edict against all Lawes and common humanitie And tell â—ee in good sooth Master Wadesworth doe you approue such barbarous crueltie Doe you allow the butchery at Paris Doe you thinke subiects are bound to giue their throates to bee cut by their fellow subiects or to their Princes at their meere wills against their owne Lawes and Edicts You would know quo iure the Protestants warres in France and Holland are iustified First the Law of Nature which not onely alloweth but inclineth and inforceth euery liuing thing to defend it selfe from violence Secondly that of Nations which permitteth those that are in the protection of others to whom they owe no more but an honourable acknowledgement in case they goe about to make themselues absolute Souereignes and vsurpe their libertie to resist and stand for the same And if a lawfull Prince which is not yet Lord of his Subiects liues and goods shall attempt to despoile them of the same vnder colour of redâ—cing them to his owne religion after all humble remonstrances they may stand vpon their owne guard and being assailed repell force with force as did the Macchabees vnder Antiochus In which case notwithanding the person of the Prince himselfe ought alwaies to be sacred and inuiolable as was Sauls to Dauid Lastly if the inraged Minister of a lawfull Prince will abuse his authoritie against the fundamentall Lawes of the Countrie it is no rebellion to defend themselues against force reseruing still their obedience to their Souereigne inuiolate These are the Rules of which the Protestants that haue borne Armes in France and Flanders and the Papists also both there and elsewhere as in Naples that haue stood for the defence of their liberties haue serued themselues How truely I esteeme it hard for you and mee to determine vnlesse we were more throughly acquainted with the Lawes and Customes of those Countries then I for my part am Once for the Low-Countries the world knowes that the Dukes of Burgundy were not Kings or absolute Lords of them which are holden partly of the Crowne of France and partly of the Empire And of Holland in particular they were but Earles And whether that title carries with it such a Souereigntie as to bee able to giue new Lawes without their consents to impose tributes to bring in garisons of strangers to build Forts to assubjects their honors and liues to the dangerous triall of a new Court proceeding without forme or figure of iustice any reasonable man may well doubt themselues doe vtterly denie it Yet you say boldly they are Rebels and aske
Common Prayer c. without any particular mention of the booke or forme of ordering Ministers and Bishops Hence grew one doubt whether ordinations and consecrations according to that forme were good in Law or no. Another was Queene Elizabeth in her Letters Patents touching such Consecrations Ordinations had not vsed as may seeme besides other generall words importing the highest authoritie in causes Ecclesiasticall the title of Supreame Head as King Henry and King Edward in their like Letters Patents were wont to dâ— that notwithstanding the Act of 35. Hen. 8. after the repeale of the former repeale might seeme though neuer specially reuiued This as I ghosse was another exception to those tâ—at by vertue of those Patents were Consecrated Whereupon the Parliament declares First that the Booke of Common Prayer and such order and formâ— for consecrating of Archbishops andâ— Bishops c. as was set forth in the time of King Edward the Sixth and added thereto and authorised by Parliament shall stand in force and be obserued Secondly That all Acts done by any person about any consecration confirmation oâ— inâ—esting of any elect to the Office or Dignitie of Arch-bishop or Bishop by vertue of the Queenes Letters Patents or Commission since the beginning of her reigne bee goodâ— Thirdly That all that haue beene ordered or consecrated Archbishops Bishops Priests c. after the said forme and order be rightly made ordered and consecrated any Statute Law Canon or other thing to the contrary notwithstanding These were the reasons of that Act which as you see doth not make good the Nags-head-ordination as F. Halywood pretends vnlesse the same were according to the forme in Edward the Sixth dayes His next proofe is that Boâ—er Bishop of London while hee liued alwayes set light by the Statutes of the Parliaments of Queene Elizaboth alleadging that there wanted Bishops without whose consent by the Lawes of the Realme there can no firme Statuee bee made That Boner despised and set not a straw by the Acts of Parliament in Queene Elizabeths time I hold it not impossible and yet there is no other proofe thereof but his bare word and the ancient Confessors tradition of which we heard before Admitting this for certaine there might bee other reasons thereof besides the ordination at the Nags-head The stiffenesse of that man was no lesse in King Edwards time then Queene Elizabeths And indeed the want also of Bishops might be the cause why he little regarded the Acts of her first Parliament For both much about the time of Queene Maries death dyed also Cardinall Poole and sundry other Bishops and of the rest some for their contemptuous behauiour in denying to performe their dutie in the Coronation of the Queene were committed to prison others absented themselues willingly So as it is commonly reported to this day there was none or very few there For as for Doctor Parker and the rest they were not ordained till December 1559. the Parliament was dissolued in the May before So not to stand now to refute Boners conceit that according to our Lawes there could bee no Statutes made in Parliament without Bishops wherein our Parliament men wil rectifie his iudgement F. Halywood was in this report twice deceiued or would deceiue his Reader First that he would make that exception which Boner laid against the first Parliament in Queen Elizabeths time to be true of all the rest Then that he accounts B. Boner to haue excepted against this Parliament because the Bishops there were no Bishops as not canonically ordained where it was because there was no Bishops true or false there at all His last proofe is That D. Bancroft being demanded of M. Alâ—blaster whence their first Bishops receiued their orders answered that hee hoped a Bishop might bee ordained of a Presbyter in time of necessity Silently granting that they were not ordained by any Bishop and therefore saith he the Parliamentary Bishops are without order Episcopall their Ministers also no Priests For Priests are not made but of Bishops whence Hierome Quâ—d facit c. What doth a Bishop sauing ordination which a Presbyter doth not I haue not the meanes to demand of D. Alablaster whether this be true or not Nor yet whether this be all the answere he had of D. Bancroft That I affirme that if it were yet it followes not that D. Bancroft silently granted they had no orders of bishops Vnlesse he that in a false discourse both where propositions be vntrue denies the Maior doth silently grant the Minor Rather he iested at the futilitie of this Argument which admitting all this lying Legend of the Nags-head and more to suppose no ordination by any Bishops had beene euer effected notwithstanding shewes no sufficient reason why there might not be a true consecration and true Ministers made and consequently a true Church in England For indeed necessitie dispences with Gods owne positiue Lawes as our Sauiour shewes in the Gospel much more then with mans and such by Hieromes opinion are the Lawes of the Church touching the difference of Bishops and Presbyters and consequently touching their ordination by Bishops onely Whereof I haue treated more at large in another place for the iustification of other reformed Churches albeit the Church of England needs it not To confirme this Argument it pleaseth F. Halywood to addâ— That King Edward the Sixth tooke away the Catholike rite of ordaining and in stead of it substituted a few Caluinisticall prayers Whom Queene Elizabeth followed c. And this is in effect the same thing which you say when you adde that Couerdale being made Bishop of Exceter in King Edwards time when all Councells and Church Canons were little obserued it is very doubtfull hee was neuer himselfe canonically consecrated and so if hee were no canonicall Bishop hee could not make another canonicall To F. Halywood I would answere that King Edward tooke not away the Catholike rite of ordaining but purged it from a number of idle and superstitious rites prescribed by the Popish Pontifical And the praiers which he scoffes at if they were Caluinisticall sure it was by prophecie for Caluin neuer saw themâ—ill Queene Maries time when by certaine of our English exiles the Booke of Common Prayer was translated and shewed him if he saw them then Some of them as the Let any and the Hymne Veni Creator c. I hope were none of Caluins deuising To you if you name what Councells and Church Canons you meane and make any certaine exception either against Bishop Couerdale or any of the rest as not canonicall Bishops I will endeauour to satisfie you Meane while remember I beseech you that both Law and reason and Religion should induce you in doubtfull things to follow the most fauourable sentence and not rashly out of light surmises to pronounce against a publike and solemne ordination against the Orders conferred successiuely from it against a whole Church Wherein I cannot but commend Doctor Carriers modestie