Selected quad for the lemma: religion_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
religion_n	church_n	discipline_n	government_n	3,314	5	6.9877	4	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A39309	A sober reply, on behalf of the people called Quakers, to two petitions against them, the one out of Norfolk, and the other from Bury in Suffolk, being some brief observations upon them published on occasion of Francis Bugg's exposing one of the said petitions in print, and commending the other, &c, with many unjust aggravations and misrepresentations in his late book, falsly stiled A modest defence, &c.	Ellwood, Thomas, 1639-1713.	1699 (1699)	Wing E628; ESTC R5881	8,677	18

A SOBER REPLY On Behalf of the People called QUAKERS To Two Petitions against them The One out of Norfolk and the Other from Bury in Suffolk Being some Brief Observations upon them Published on Occasion of Francis Bugg's Exposing One of the said Petitions in Print and Commending the Other c. With many unjust Aggravations and Misrepresentations in his late Book falsly stiled A Modest Defence c. It is an Honour for a Man to cease from Strife but every Fool will be medling Prov. 20. 3. London Printed and Sold by T. Sowle in White-Hart-Court in Gracious-Street 1699. A Reply on Behalf of the People called Quakers to Two Petitions against them c. THat we may not build too large a Porch to so small an House we shall only premise That the Christian Religion hath often Suffered but never taught or countenanced Persecution That it was the Persecuting Jews not the Persecuted Apostle who cry'd Men of Israel help Acts 21. 28. That these Petitioners against us have nothing to Charge us with of Immorality nothing against the Publick Peace nothing but what concerns our Religion Which is an implicit Acknowledgment at least that they are in the same Streight to find out Matter of Accusation against us that Daniel's Adversaries were in to find Matter against him who thereupon ingeniously confest We shall not find any Occasion against this Daniel except we find it against him concerning the Law of his God Dan. 6. 5. We begin with the Norfolk Petition as that which we understand was contrived first and probably led on the other Petition We cannot without Resentment take notice of the great Growth and daily Increase of the Quakers and the Mischief and Dangers from thence threatning this Nation Observation We hope we may without incurring their Resentment observe That the Jews of old took notice and that not without Resentment of the great Growth and daily Increase of the Christians in the first Age of the spreading of the Gospel and of the Mischief and Dangers they apprehended did from thence threaten their Nation John 11. 48. Which Misapprehension of theirs made them bend their Forces against the Innocent Christians to Suppress Destroy and Ro●t them out Whereby they brought upon Themselves and their Nation the Mischief and Dangers they feared God avenging by the hands of the Romans and their own one against another their Evil Treatment of his Son and Servants Pet. 'T is observable with what restless Zeal their deluding Teachers ramble into all parts of these Kingdoms Obs. 'T is probable the little Zeal unless for Maintenance the Petitioners have observed in their own over-rested Teachers makes the Zeal of those they Petition against so observable to them But they may do well also to observe which if they will not it may be hoped They to whom they have Petitioned will how much this Charge of Restless Zeal renders us like unto the Apostles and Primitive Christian Teachers whose Restless Zeal would not suffer them to sit down and rest in a Fat Benefice with a Curat to perform the Service for them But made them Travel into most of the then Civilized Parts of the World as the Acts of the Apostles and Ecclesiastical Histories shew And though their Enemies then were more modest than to call it Rambling yet they failed not to call them Deluding Teachers as these do us Pet. And as we suspect many Romish Emissaries under their Disguise Obs. The Petitioners should have done well to have given the Ground of this Suspicion of theirs if they had any to give that it might have been examined But to Suggest for it is probable this came è Suggesto out of the Pulpit For Justices we hope would deal more justly so Scandalous a Matter upon a bare Suspicion without assigning any Ground for it is to speak modestly of it an Evil-Surmising and against Charity For Charity we are assured 1 Cor. 13. 5. thinks no Evil. And since Charity is so excellent a Christian Vertue as to be preferr'd to both Faith and Hope verse 13. We are sorry to find so little Charity among the Justices and Grand Jurors of Norfolk This Suspicion of Romish Emissaries going under the Disguise of Quakers is indeed an old Scandal rais'd by our profest Enemies the Priests above Forty Years ago and by them industriously spread and kept up ever since on purpose to Traduce us to the better sort of People But is it not strange that if this had been true not one single Instance could be given not one Proof made in all this time of one Romish Emissary found among the Quakers This alone is enough to baffle the Slander which it hath done already with considerate Persons Therefore without taking further notice of it here we will conclude with Queen Elizabeth's Motto used while she was Princess Persecuted and a Prisoner viz. Much suspected by me Nothing proved can be Pet. And boldly spread their Venemous Doctrines every where Obs. This Venemous Epithet so ill becomes Justices and Grand Jurors that we are not willing to think it theirs but rather imposed on them by some of their dictating Teachers But passing by the Venome of it we cannot but observe here likwise how much they make us even in this also to resemble those whom we desire and labour to imitate the Apostles of our Lord. Whose Boldness in Asserting the Christian Faith and Spreading the Doctrine of their Holy Religion which no doubt their Opposers the Priests of that Age and such Rulers as those Priests could insluence thought to be wrong though they seem to have been more modest than to call it Venemous made even their Adversaries Marvel who yet were so ingenuous as to impute their Boldness to their having been with Jesus Acts 4. 13. Pet. Attempting to infect and shake the Minds of weak Protestants Obs. Had not those Protestants weak Teaches they would not be such weak Protestants Nor will it peradventure upon due Consideration be found a Dis-service in the Quakers if by their Zealous Preaching they excite those Teachers how unwillingly soever to be more Zealous more Assiduous more Laborious and Diligent in Preaching to strengthen their weak Hearers Pet. And Assuming Rules of Discipline Power in matters of Religion and Forms of Government Repugnant to the Establish'd Laws of this Kingdom contrary to the very Acts of Toleration and not allow'd to any other Dissenters Obs. We presume it is intended in all the Branches of this manifold Charge with respect to themselves only and we hope it will be so understood That if we assume Rules of Discipline in Church Matters they are for our selves only Power in Matters of Religion for and amongst our selves only As for Forms of Government though they are Ambiguous Words and such as we do not use amongst or of our selves Yet as there ought to be Government in every Religious as well as Civil Society and a Form or Forms of such Government So we know of no Form

of Government in our Religious Society no Rules of Discipline no Power in Matters of Religion among us that is Repugnant to the Establish'd Laws of this Kingdom relating only to Civil Matters nor contrary to the Acts for Toleration Nor with Submission to our Superiours do we see how those Acts could be truly called Acts of Toleration to Dissenters if they did not Tolerate each sort of Dissenters to Assume Rules of Discipline Power in Matters of Religion and Forms of Church Government for and amongst themselves while nothing is thereby done Repugnant to the Publick Peace Nor do we understand but that the same is allow'd to and practic'd by all other Protestant Dissenters Pet. Vouching in all their Actions Divine Inspiration for their Warrant and the Indulgence of the Government for their Indempnity Obs. In All their Actions is too large an Expression and shews the Petitioners spake by rote But if we vouch Divine Inspiration for our Warrant in some things which relate more immediately to the Worship and Service of God and undertake withal to make appear that That Inspiration is not disagreeable to the Divine Testimonies recorded in the Holy Scriptures we hope our Warrant will not be disliked for being Grounded on Inspiration nor that Inspiration for being Divine And that the Indulgence of so Indulgent a Government will be sufficient to Indempnifie us in our Peaceable Performance thereof Pet. How apparently their Blasphemous Books and Pernicious Principles tend to subvert the Fundamentals of Christianity and undermine the Civil Government are sufficiently Demonstrable Obs. Demonstrable Not yet Demonstrated then it seems tho' for these Forty Years and more it has been endeavoured Hard Words and Ill Names may easily be put upon the best Books and Principles And there is no Book or Principle which may not by Perversion and Misconstruction be made to look and sound Ill. But sure we are and always ready to make appear that neither are our Books Blasphemous nor our Principles Pernicious The Eundamentals of Christianity we heartily Own and Assert as Boldly and Vigorously as any And how far we have been from undermining the Civil Government our Practice well known throughout these Kingdoms is the best Demonstration Pet. The Publishing whereof by pretended Permission of the Government is of most dangerous Consequence Obs. Pray give the Government leave to judge of that So long as the Church of Rome could stop the Publishing of any Books or Principles but her own the Christian World lay very Snug in a deep Sleep of Darkness and Profound Ignorance which she had lul'd it into which was what she desired And if the first Reformers had been debarr'd the Liberty of Publishing their Books and Principles the Reformation must either not have been be gun or greatly retarded in the carrying of it on and Popery might have prevailed still It is a sure Maxim that Truth is Strongest And therefore they who have Truth on their side and who know their own Principles to be Sound need not fear the Publishing of Principles by others for if those Principles publish'd by others be true they co-operate with theirs and therein they have Cause to rejoyce If false they have thereby a fair Occasion given them by exposing and confuting the Errors thereof to illustrate more clearly and establish more firmly the true Principles asserted by themselves and for that they have no cause to be Sorry Thus for the Petition out of Norfolk the Prayer of which shall be considered together with that from Bury which will help to explain one another The Petition from Bury speaks in the Name of The Alderman Assistant Justice chief Burges and Burgesses of the Common Council in behalf of themselves and other the Inhabitants of that Burrough And in it they say Pet. That we considering all Ancient Hoeresies which have vexed both Church and State were never so formidable in their Rise and Progress as are the Quakers Obs. Are then the Alderman and Burgesses of Bury acquainted with and versed in All Ancient Haeresies Or do they rely upon the assistance of their assistant Justice Or do both They and He take this upon trust from some not very trusty Parson Have they read examined considered the vexation the Spoil the Havock of both Estates and Lives and almost Desolation made in both Church and State by the Arian Haeresie alone so tragically set forth by Ruffinus Socrates Scholasticus Theodorit and Sozomen in their Ecclesiastical Histories Or if they have can they without blushing say The Arrian Haeresie and all other Ancient Haeresies were never so formidable in their Rise and Progress as are the Quakers Who are the Quakers formidable to unless to the Priests And wherein to them Unless the Quakers Zeal which they so complain of makes them fear that they must both Preach better and Live better or else they will be in danger to lose the best of their Hearers and perhaps with them what they value more than them some of their Maintenance But they say Pet. We have too just a Cause of dreading the Subversion of our Government by them if not carefully prevented and suppressed Obs. Our Government What do they mean The Government of the Burrough of Bury St. Edmonds by the Aldermen assistant Justice chief Burgess and Burgesses of the Common Council there We never understood that any Quaker hath attempted to meddle with their Government or intrude into it but rather that some have declin'd it when invited thereunto If they mean the Government of England we hope they will not so appropriate it to themselves as to exclude their Fellow-Subjects from a Share in the Care Support and Preservation thereof which we and all other Protestant Dissenters have as much reason as they with respect to our Estates Liberties and Lives to wish and seek the Welfare and Safety of And we humbly appeal to the Governours themselves whether we have given any just Cause by our Carriage Deportment and Behaviour to and under the Government for any to Dread the Subversion of the Government by us Pet. Being in their Clandestine Constitutions opposite to the Condition of our established Polity Obs. What they mean by Clandestine Constitutions we know not nor what by the Condition of their established Polity But this we know that as we have nothing which we call Constitutions so neither any thing that is Clandestine or done in a Clandestine way among us Pet. And in their Principles of Faith Anti-christian Obs. So did the Church of Rome object to the Protestants in general upon the Reformation as Bp. Jewel in his Apology for the Church of England observes Clamant hodie passim says he p. 7. Nos omnes esse Haereticos discessisse à side c. They cry out now a-days That we are all Haereticks That we are departed from the Faith c. But if that was a false Charge against them we are sure this is not a true Charge against us For we sincerely and heartily own all

that is written in the Holy Scriptures concerning Christ with respect to his Conception Birth Life Miracles Doctrines Sufferings Death Burial Resurrection Ascention Mediation and future Coming to Judgment Which we take to be the Sum of true Christian Faith and which whosoever rightly believes ought not we think to be accounted Anti-christian in Principles of Faith Pet. Of Government Anti-monarchical Obs. One would think this Arrow also had been taken out of the Popish Quiver against Protestants so exactly does it resemble what the same Jewell in the same place says the Papist charged them withal Where having recited a large Beadroll of particular Slanders cast upon them Clamant says he nos id agere et querere ut Monarchiae et Regnorum Status evert antur c. They cry that we do these things with purpose thereby to overturn Monarchies and the States of Kingdoms We doubt not but this was unduly charged upon them But nothing could be more falsly suggested against us whose avowed Principle and known Practice it has always been to yield a peaceable and quiet Subjection to the Powers which God hath set over us Pet. In point of Doctrine Anti-Scriptural Obs. We deny that and are ready to undertake the Proof of every Doctrine we hold by and from the Scriptures Pet. And in Practices Illegal Obs. This also if it relate to Civil matters we deny as utterly false and may we hope with modesty say That no People are more conformable to the Laws in things Civil than we And if it relate to Religious Performances as it seems to do by the words next following viz. Having their Weekly Monthly Quarterly and Yearly Meetings We shall need to say no more to it but this That if we and other Dissenters could have actually comply'd with whatsoever the Laws required in Matters of Religion there would not have been room for Indulgence or need of an Act of Toleration Pet. Having their Weekly Monthly Quarterly and Yearly Meetings which we cannot but reasonably believe tend not only to the Subversion of our Laws but of our Religion also to us of greater concerns than our Lives Obs. To Believe is one thing to believe reasonably or to have Reason to believe is another thing Which if these Petitioners pretend to have they should if they expected to be believed have assigned the Reasons of their so believing Well known it is to the Nation in general and to the Government in particular that we have had Weekly Monthly Quarterly and Yearly Meetngs and those the same that now we have and for thesame Services many Years before the Government was pleased to grant the present Indulgence yea and that in the times of the greatest Troubles and hotest Persecutions Which was an Evidence beyond bare saying so That our Religion was of greater Concern to us than our Lives But what one single Act or thing have any or all of those Meetings of ours produced in all this time that has tended to the Subversion of the Laws or Estáblished Religion Do not both the one and the other stand now at this very day as Safe and Firm as ever they did at least for us Can it reasonably be supposed that if those Meetings of ours had so dangerous a Tendency as to Subvert the Laws and Religion of the Nation the Piercing Eye of the Government should not see it as well and as soon as the Aldermen and Burgesses of Bury How come they now all of a sudden to be so Eagle-Ey'd to pretend to see that which their Betters and who have much better Advantages for seeing could never yet see For can it be imagined that if our Governours had seen or suspected our Meetings to have so Evil and Dangerous a Tendency as is here Suggested they would so Propitiously have Indulged those Meetings and granted us a Toleration thus to hold them We wish these Petitioners would think well of this and consider whether it was decent for the Aldermen and Burgesses of Bury thus to Impeach the Wisdom and Conduct of the Government Hitherto they have spoken in the Accusative Case They now turn to the Vocative Invoking the Parliament against us As therefore we have made brief Observations on the Charges Let us now as briefly take notice of the Prayer in each Petition which we chose to consider together because one seems to explain the other That out of Norfolk must be acknowledged to speak the more modestly of the two For it Prays the House of Commons To take these things the Charges in the Body of the Petition mentioned into Consideration that the said Principles and Practices may be strictly Examined and Censured or Supprest as they shall appear to deserve and as in their great Wisdom shall seem expedient Nor is it wholly destistute of some Shew of Tenderness towards us For it prays This may be done With whatsoever Tenderness to the Persons and Estates of these People But as it can hardly be conceived how Principles and Practices flowing therefrom especially where Divine Inspiration as these Petioners say is vouched for Warrant thereof can be Supprest without exercising great Cruelty the Oppósite to Tenderness on the Persons or Estates of the People whose Principles and Practices they are So if the Prayer of the other Petition from Bury which was Formed after this and comes from their near Neighbours may pass for a Comment upon the Norfolk-Text it will not be very difficult to find what in the softer Norfolk Dialect is meant by Suppressing our Principles and Practices For the Alderman and Burgesses of Bury say We therefore oblig'd in Duty to God and our Country do humbly pray your timely Consideration of our Jealousies and remove our Fears if not by totally Suppressing yet at least by preventing their after Growth and Increase amongst us Here after an acknowledgment that ali those High Charges exhibited against us in the Petition are grounded but upon their own groundless Jealousies they how mannerly let others judge offer the Parliament Hobson's Choice either totally to Suppress us or at least to prevent our after Growth and Increase which perhaps cannot be done without totally suppressing us or if it could must needs tend to a total Suppressing of us Now if they who have declared their Religion to be of greater Concern to them than their Lives could find in their Hearts to have so much Charity for their Neighbours as to admit our Religion to be of greater Concern to us than our Lives which we think we have given a full proof of to say no more as ever they have done they might thence reasonnably conclude that we will part with our Lives rather than with our Religion and that there is no way totally to Suppress us but by Cutting our Throats or Knocking out our Brains Which must therefore be supposed to be their Meaning And would they have the Honourable the Commons of England in Parliament Assembled undertake this Inhumane Piece of Butchery to desile