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A69545 The diocesans tryall wherein all the sinnewes of Doctor Dovvnhams defence are brought into three heads, and orderly dissolved / by M. Paul Baynes ; published by Dr. William Amis ... Baynes, Paul, d. 1617.; Ames, William, d. 1662. 1641 (1641) Wing B1546; ESTC R5486 91,441 102

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Diocesan churches and Provinciall churches be Gods frame then we had no Churches in Britaine of Gods frame before that Austin was sent by Gregorie the great But here were churches from before Tertullian after the frame God requireth at least in their judgements Ergo. Now to come to open the termes and lay downe conclusions whether Diocesan or Parishionall Churches were at the first constitute First the word Church we understand here not figuratively taken Metonymically for the place Syn●ed for Ministers administring ordinances but p●operly for a body politick standing of people to be taught and governed and of teachers and governours Secondly it may be asked What is meant by a Diocesan church Answ. Such a frame in which many Churches are united with one head Church as partaking in holy things or at least in that power of government which is in the chiefe Church for all the other within such or such a circuit These phrases of a Diocesse a Diocesan B●shop or Church are all since the time of Constantine yea the two last much later A Diocesse seemeth from the common-wealth to have beene taken up in the Church from what time Bishops had Territories ample demaines and some degree of civill jurisdiction annexed to them For a Diocesse by the Lawyers is a circuit of Provinces such as the Romans Praesidents had or active an administration of those Provinces with jurisdiction L. unica c. ut omnes sudicet And in the Canon law sometimes Provincia and Diocoesis are used promiscuously Dist. 50. cap. 7. But the ancientest use of this word was to note the Territory or Countrey circuit opposed to the Citie Thus the Countrey churches are called Diocaesanae Ecclesiae cont tur c●p 8. Thus Baptismales Ecclesiae were contra distinguished to Parishionall These had every one a Diocesse and the inhabitants were called Diocoesani these Churches had a moity of houses dwelling in neighbourhood th●t belonged to them but at length by a Synecdoche the whole Church was called a Diocesse though the Canonists dispute whether it may be so called seeing the Diocesse is the meaner part by much in comparison of the Citie and should not give the denomination to the whole So at length the Bishop was called Diocoesanus and the Church which had beene called Ecclesia civitatis matrix nutrix Cathedralis grew to be called Diocesan But here we take a Diocesan Church for such a head Church with which all Churches in such a circuit hath reall union and communion in some sacred things Now a Diocesan Church may be put objectivè that is for a Chur●h in which are ministers and ministery for the good of the whole Diocesse though they should never assemble as the worship in the Church of Jerusalem was for all Judea and profited though absent Or it may be put formally for a body politicke a congregation of beleevers through a Diocesse with the ministers of the same having some reall union and communion in sacred things We deny any such Church A Parishionall Church may be considered Materially or Formally M●●erially as it is a Church within such locall bounds the members whereof dwell contiguously one bordering upon the other This God instituted not for it is accidentall to the Church may abesse and adesse a Church remaining one If a Parishionall Church in London should dwell as the Dutch doe one farre enough from the other while the same beleevers were united with the same governours the Church were not changed though the place were altered Secondly it is put formally for a multitude which doe in manner of a Parish ordinarily congregate such Churches and such onely we say God erected Now for some Conclusions what we agree in then what severs us Conclus 1. Churches of Cities Provinces Kingdomes may be called Diocesan Provinciall Nationall Churches as the Churches of the world are called Oecumenicall yea haply not without warrant of Scripture As 1 Pet. 1.1 writing to all those dispersed Churches speaking of them singularly as of one flocke 1 Pet. 5.2 The reason is things may be called not onely as they are really in themselves but according to some respect of reason under which we may apprehend them Conclus 2. That ●here may be a reall Diocesan Nationall or head Church wherewith others should be bound to communicate more solemnly in Word and Sacraments and in some more reserved cases concerning their government This was done in the Church of Judea Our men are too shie that feare to come to this proposition de posse I am sure our adversaries will grant us that our Parishionall frame might have beene so constituted Conclus 3. That there cannot be such a frame of Church but by Gods institution No Ministers can take this honour but they must as Aaron be called to it When nothing in nature can have further d●gree of perfection then the author of nature putteth into it how much more must the degree of perfection and eminence in things Ecclesiasticall depend on God We may reason from the Church of Judea as à pari to prove That there cannot be such a Church but that all subordinates must communicate with the chiefest head Church in some sacred things which may make them one Chur●h Thus there would not have beene a Church Nationall of the Jewes but that all the Nation had union and communion together even in the worship and ordinances of worship The men onely went up so the male onely were circumcised but the female representatively went up in them Object It is enough if the communion be in government which all our opposites grant necessary Answ. This maketh then rather one in tertio quodam separabili then one Church government being a thing that commeth to a Church now constituted and may be absent the Church remaining a Churc● The fi●st Churches of B●shops when now they were divided did keep all other who were the Bishops presbyters strictly so called and the people also in some communion with the head Church for in greater solemnities one and other went up thither See decret dist 3. dist 38. Conclus 4. We agree in this th●t Churches were in their first planting either not actually Diocesan being one congregation without any other subordinate or if they had any yet were they imperfect wanting many parts or members of particular Churches which belonged to them That wherein we contradict one another is we affirme that no such head Church was ordained either virtually or actually but that all Churches were singular congregations equall independent each of other in regard of subjection Secondly we say were there a Diocesan granted yet will it not follow that Parish churches should be without their government within themselves but onely subject in some more common and transcendent cases As it was with the Synagogues and that Nationall Church of the Jewes and as it is betwixt Provinciall and Diocesan Churches If any say there is not the same reason of a Diocesan Church and Parishionall for that hath in it