al menne to be saued and to com to the knowledge of his truthe Agayne dothe not the Lorde say by his prophet Ezechiell Eze. xviii .xxxiii. that he hathe no pleasure in the deathe of a sinner but that he tourne vnto him and liue Moreouer it is wrytten that GOD did shut vp all men vnder vnbelief for to shewe mercye on all men Rom. xi These places me thincke are altogether againste you PHILA Some in deede Aunswer when they haue once broughte in and aledged these places thinck verely that they haue won the victory but they are farre deceiued for these scryptures beynge well vnderstanded do make nothing against vs nor yet against our doctryne And fyrst of all wher Saint Paule saythe that God wyll haue al menne to be saued and to come to the knowledge of hys truthe it is mooste euident and playne that he dothe not speake ther of al men in general but of al estates orders and degrees of men DYDIMVS Thys is your exposition But what Scrypture doe ye bringe for to proue that it is so as ye say PHILA If ye had suffered me I wold haue made all thinges plain inough so that al the company should haue bene content Be like ye thincke that we are of the nomber of those which when they haue a peace of the scripture by the ende whiche seemeth to make for their purpose they do runne away withal not considering the circumstaunces of the place nor to what purpose the holy ghoste hath set it forth or spoken it The holye Apostle doth wryte thus Exposition of the texte aleaged out of i. Tim. ii Exhort therefore that aboue all thinges prayers supplications intercessiōs and geuing of thankes be had for al mē for kinges and for all that are in authority And because that no mā should thincke that it was agaynst all reason to pray for such vngodly kinges and princes as were open enemies of the truth and persecutors of Christe and of his churche he doth aledge certain causes why we oughte to do so Firste that we maye vnder them liue a quyet and peasible life in all godlynesse and honesty Secondly because that the same is good and acceptable in the sight of God our sauiour who wyl haue al men to be saued to come to the knowledge of his truthe Whereby the holy Apostle vnderstandeth none other thing but that God hath his chosen amonge all estates orders and degrees of men as wel among Kinges Prynces rulers and gouernors as among thē that be of an inferiour estate or condition thoughe it seemeth neuer so vnlikely vnto mans reason Els if we should take it vniuersally of all men as ye will haue vs to take it then shall we be faine to confesse that God did against his owne wil and appoyntment when he would not suffer his woord to be preached in Bythinia nor yet in Asia Act. xvi And againe when he did almoste by the space of four thousand yeres kepe the light of his heauenlye doctrine from all nations and peoples sauing only that he did geue his law vnto the children of Israell and sent his Prophets vnto them EVTRAPELVS This that our brother Philalethes saythe muste neades to be moste true For sythe that faith is the only meane for to come to saluation for by it only do we take hold vppon the mercye of God and that faithe commeth by hearing Rom. x. and hearing by the word when god doth kepe his word and gospel from any nation people it is a plain token sign that he wyl not haue that people to be saued nor yet to come to the knowledge of his truth How shoulde then the saying of the Apostle stande if we should take it as they do Therfore this must be the meaning of the holy ghost that god hath chosen of euery estate condition order or degre of men whome he wil haue to be saued and to come to the knowledge of his truth Wherby we do learne that god dothe aswel chuse the kinges as the subiects as wel the subiects as the kings aswel the rich as the pore and as wel the pore as the rich that there is no estate or condition of life out of the which he wil not haue som to be saued to come to the knowledge of hys truth Yet me thincke that this obiection might be answered another way DI. Which way I pray you Although the answer that our brother Philalethes hathe made hath in a maner satisfied me throughly yet notwithstanding woulde I be glad to hear what ye cā say besides EV. Think ye An other Aunswer to the last Obiectiō neighbor Dydimus that this word all is always such an vniuersal signe that it can not be restreined to some seueral kynde of thinges DyDI. I woulde fayne learn that of you i. Cor. vi EVTRA. When Saint Paule saithe that all thynges are lawfull vnto him but that all thynges bee not expedyente shal we gather therby because that he vseth this terme all things that it was lawful for him to playe the whoremonger to steale and to rob or to kil and murther DIDy God forbid that any man should go about to gather any such thing But rather we ought to vnderstande that there in that place he speaketh only of such things as be lawful by the word of God but yet not alwais expedient As for an example we know that all kind of meates of them selues are cleane vnto them that beleue and that it is lawful for them to eate what so euer either is sold in the market or set before them yet it is not alwais expedient for to do it For the scriptures bid vs to beware that we offend not our weake brethren EVTRA. It is very well marked of you Why thinke ye is the doctrine of the gospel which is conteined both in the olde and newe Testament called of the auncient wryters catholike that is to saye vniuersall Is it because that it is vniuersally receiued of all men throughe out al the whole worlde The true christian faith likewise is called the catholike faith Shal we gather therfore that al men generally haue this faith DIDYMVS We can not so doe Why the true faith is called the Catholike faythe But rather ought we to learn ther by that it is so called because that it doth generally and vniuersallye pertaine vnto all the true chyldren of god of whome only it is receyued and beleued And that likewise the true christian faith is called the Catholike faith because that vnyuersally all the true chosen and elect of god are endued wyth it EVTRA. In lyke manner neyghboure Dydimus when saint Paul sayth that God wyll haue all men to be saued and to come to the knowledge of his truth that same muste only be vnderstanded of those whō god hath chosen in his sonne Iesu Christ afore the foundacions of the world wer laid for to be felow heires with him
â—e shoulde affyrme mayntayn and â—pholde that God dyd forsee the â—orkes of them both and that in â—especte of them he dyd chuse the 〈◊〉 and refuse the other Rho. 1. we should 〈◊〉 greate iniurye and wronge vnâ—o Paul as though he had not sene that which is so plain and manifest vnto vs. And verily it is a token that be had not seen it syth that he dothe expressely write that when they had yet done neyther good nor euyll the one was chosen vnto saluation and the other vtterly cast a way there by to proue that the dyuine Predestination of God is not grounded in mens workes deseruinges Predestination is not grounded on mens workes and deseruinges Agayn when he had made this obiection whether there was any vnrighteousnesse with God he might for a most plain and sure defence of the iustice and righteousnesse of God haue aunswered and sayed that God did rewarde Esau according to his wickednesse whiche he did forsee should be in hym but he flieth to a contrary solution affirming boldely that the wicked are stirred vp that the power oâ— God may be shewed on theÌ„ and his glory and name declared through out al the hole world And at lengthe bringeth fourth this cause thaâ— God hath mercy on whom he wil Ex. xxxiii and whom he wyll he maketh hard harted Ye see how he doth attrybute both to the only pleasure and wyll of God Therefore if we can assign none other cause why God doth shew mercy on hys electe but onely hys blessed wil and pleasure we shal also be fain to confesse that he doth reproue the other only because that it is his plesure so to do For when it is sayed that God doth shew mercy on whom he wil and whom he wyll againe he maketh harde harted men are admonyshed and warned thereby that they oughte to seke for none other cause of his diuine Predestination but onely hys blessed wil and pleasure DYDIMVS Verely ObiectioÌ„ Wher the cause of predestination oughte to be sought thys is a very strauÌ„ge doctrine and which can sarcelye sinke in to my heade For why shuld god be angry with his creatures bi whoÌ„ he was neuer offended before For it is the property of a tiraunt not of a righteous iudge to appoint and ordaine vnto destruction whom he wyll Therfore men might haue a iust occasioÌ„ to complaine of God if by his bare arbiterment and wil and without their own merite deseruing they shoulde be predestinated vnto euerlasting deathe Aunswer PHI. In dede suche obiections are made coÌ„monly for to subuert the doctrine of predestination and for to make it to be hated and abhorred of all men but we oughte not therefore to be affrayed to speake of it as far fourth as the worde of God and the scriptures wyl leade vs and shew a light vnto vs. First and foremost then wheÌ„ any suche obiections be made or when any suche vayne thoughtes do aryse in oure heartes we musse consyder and weyghe wyth oure selues that the holye and blessed wyll of God The wyl of God is the most perfecte is the moste consummate and perfecte rule of iustyce and equitye and that therefore what so euer he wyll we muste compte it most iust and righteous onely because that he doth wyll it rule of iustyce Therefore when it is asked sayth Saynte Augustyne why God dyd this thinge or that thinge Contra madi Li. 1. Ca. 3. We muste aunswer that he dyd it because that it was hys wyll so to do If thou goost any farther askynge whye it was hys wyll so to do Thou doest aske a thing which is bothe greater and higher than the wyll of God which thinge can not be founde oute Let this suffise vs least seckynge rasshelye that thin ge whyche is not we do not fynd out that same thing which is Let this I say suffise vs if at least we intende to reason and talke with reuerence of the secretes of the lord our god Which though he caÌ„ sufficientely wythouste vs defende hym selfe wyth hys iustyce against the malepartenesse of the vngodlye whyche are not affrayed to sklaunder God openly and to blaspheme hys holye and blessed name when takynge awaye all maner of excuses from their owne conseyences hee shall proue them giltye and condempne theym yet leaste they shoulde tryumphe to muche hee doothe minister vnto vs bothe armoure and weapones agaynste theym in hys holye woorde Therfore when any of them shall aske vs whye God hathe from the begynnynge ordayned some vnto deathe which beynge not yet borne nor gotten coulde not deserue the iudgement and condempnation of deathe For an aunswere we wyll aske them agayn wherein they thynke that God is bounde vnto manne and what they thyncke hee oweth vnto hym if hee wyll consyder hym in hys owne nature As we be all infected wyth synne God can not byt hath vs not of a tyrannous cruelty but of a most iuste and ryghteous equytye Nowe if all men be of their owne nature subiecte to the iudgement and condempnatyon of Deathe what wronge canne it bee sayd that God dothe vnto them whom he dothe Predestinate vnto death Let all the chyldren of Adam come fourthe and reasonne wyth theyr maker whye they are by his deuine prouidence made subiect vnto euerlastynge miserye What shall they be able to saye I praye you when on the contrary he shal call theym to the knowledge of them selues and byd them to beholde and looke vpon theyr owne fylthye and corrupted nature If they be all taken oute of one infected lompe it is no maruayle that they be subiecte vnto dampnation Of oure owne nature we be al subiecte to deathe Let them not therfore accuse God of iniquity and vnrighteousnesse because that by his eternall iudgement they are ordained vnto death which of their own nature they be subiect vnto DYDIMVS ObiectioÌ„ And this corruption which ye alledge to be the cause of theyr damnation doth come of the fall of Adam But I haue hearde some of you say that Adam dyd fal by the deuine Predestination and ordenaunce of almightye God Is not God therefore vnrighteous to punishe them for the same corruption that they be fallen into by his owne Predestination ordenauÌ„ce PHILALETHES Aunswer As touchinge the fall of Adam whereby we are all made subiecte to euerlastynge death and condempnation Of the fall of Adam I wyll speake of it no farther that I am able to bringe Gods worde for my warraunte If God did foresee that the fall of Adam shoulde be to hys glory and that by it not onlye hys mercy but also his iustice should be knowen and declared through oute all the hole world we canne lay no vnryghteousnesse to hys charge though by his deuine Predestination and ordenaunce Adam did fal For The true ende of al creatures all manner of creatures both in heauen and in earth are made to this end that their
he doth deliuer some ObiectioÌ„ froÌ„ euerlasting death condemnation making them felow heirs with his sonne Iesu Christ of his heauenly kingdoÌ„e and that be suffreth other to pearishe in their owne naturall corruption then is he as our brother Albion said before a partiall God and an acceptour of persons which thing the scriptures do deny vtterly Therfore I may conclude that either the worde of God dothe disagre wyth it selfe or that in the election of God there is some respect of merits deseruings PHI. First foremoste when the scripture doth testifi that ther is no respecte of persones with God Answer this worde persone is not taken in that signification that ye wene Howe thys worde person ought to be vnderstanded For it signifieth not the manne hym self but is taken for those thinges that being sene with the eies do eyther get vnto a man fauour grace and dignity or elsse purchase vnto him contempt shame and hatred suche as be commonly richesse myghte noblenesse of byrth great offices in the common weale and other like Such as do bring contempt shame and hatred are pouertye bashnesse of byrthe beggerlinesse and other like thinges which the world doth commonlye abhorre When Peter then and Paule also affirme that there is no respect of persons wyth God their meaning is Act. x. Rom. ii Gala. i. that God in chusing of men hath no respecte to the richesse and birth or to the nation and countrye or to anye other thing that the world hath in admiration but that he chuseth as well the pore as the rich and as wel the gentil as the Iew. Where vnto the blessed Apostle S. Iames dothe agre when he saithe Iames. i. that in iudgement God hath no respect vnto richesse Likewise Saint Paule doth wryte Ephe. vi that what good so euer a man doth he shall receiue it again of the Lord whether he be bounde or free Therefore there shall be no repugnaunce nor yet contrarietye in the scriptures though we saye that God doth of his mere goodnes and mercye and accordinge to hys good wyl and pleasure chuse some vnto life euerlasting refusing and reiecting the other Howe be it the matter mighte be answeared more plainly thus They be wont to ask how it cometh to passe that of two that haue deserued in like or rather that haue deserued nothinge yet God in his election doth passe ouer the one chuse the other vnto him self This ought dilygentely to be noted I do ask them again whether they think that ther is ani thing in him which is chosen that dyd moue God to chuse him or not If they coÌ„fesse that ther was or is nothing in him worthy the election of god which thing thei must nedes grauÌ„t and confesse then it shal folow that God had no respect vnto the man but that he did take occasion in hys own merci for to do good vnto him That therfore God doth chuse one man and refuseth or reproueth an other it cometh not of any respect that he hath vnto the person or vnto the man but of his mere goodnesse and mercy which truely it is lawful for him for to shew and declare where and whensoeuer it pleaseth his deuine maiesty Therfore some do falsly and wyckedlye accuse god of vnrighteous dealing and of iniquity because that in hys Predestination he doth not behaue hym self a lyke towardes all men DYDIMVS Wherfore I beseche you If he doth fynde al men gilty ObiectioÌ„ let hym punysh them all in like if he finedeth them vngilty let hym with hold the rigour of hys iustice from them al. Aunswer PHILALETHES What meaneth this neighboure Dydimus Ye deale wyth God as though ye would that he shuld put away mercy all together or if hee sheweth any that he should cleane put awaye iudgemente equitye and iustice from hym selfe What is it I pray you that ye do require If all men be giltye saye ye lefte theym all suffer lyke punishment We confesse that we bee all gyltye We be al of oure owne nature the chyldren of damnation and do of oure owne nature deserue euerlastynge Deathe and dampnation but we saye that the mercye of GOD dothe succoure and delyuer some euen whome it pleaseth hym DYDIMVS Whye then Let his mercye succoure and deliuer all ObiectioÌ„ PHILALETHES But we answer again that it is mete and conuenient Answer and right also that in punishyng some he dothe declare him selfe to bee a righteous iudge If ye can not abide this what other thinge do ye but go aboute to spoyle God of hys mercy or if ye graunt that he may be merciful to graunt him that he shal do it on that condition that he shall forsake vtterly his iustice and equity Therfore the sayinges of s Augustine are moste worthye to be marked Sith saithe he that in the fyrste manne all the hole lompe of mankinde Epi. cvi did fall into condemnation the vessels that are made of it vnto honoure are not the vessels of theyr owne ryghteousnesse but of the mercy of god And that some are made vessels vnto dishonour it ought not to be imputed vnto anye vnrighteousnesse or iniquitye but vnto iudgement Again that God doth recompence due punishmente vnto them De predo gratia whome he doth reproue and geueth vndeserued grace vnto them whome he dothe chuse he is deliuered from all blame by the similitude of a creditoure similitude in whose power it lyeth to forgeue some the hole debt and to make the other to paye to the vttermooste farthinge Therfore God may geue his grace to whome he wyll because that he is merciful De bone perseue Cae. xii and not geue it vnto al men because that he is a righteous iudge In geuinge that vnto some whych they do not deserue he doth shew his fre mercye and grace and not geuing it vnto all men he doth declare what we all do deserue ALBION I praye you brother Philalethes declare a lyttle more plainly vnto vs the similitude of the creaditour and of hys debtoures PHILALETHES If a man hath many debtours that do al owe vnâ—o him the lyke summe of monye doth it not lie in his power to forgeue some of them the hole debte to cal vpon the other for that whiche they owe vnto him euen for the vttermost farthing Who can laye any thing to his charge if he wil do so ALBION No man I trowe shall be able to blame hym for it PHI. Then mark this brother Albion we are al debtours vnto god For we haue all deserued euerlasting condemnation That then he doth of his fre mercy and goodnesse forgeue some and some againe he doth deale extremely withal according to his righteous iudgement who shall be so bolde to blame him for it ALBION This similitude maketh the matter verye plaine and deliuereth the deuine predestination of almightye GOD from all manner of blame that menne can laye vnto it
through the enuy of the deuil cam death into the world whereby any man may easelye gather that the wyse man doth speake there of Adam being in the most perfect estate of his fyrst creation in the which if he had continued and abiden stil obeying the commaundement that the lord hys God had geuen hym neyther death nor hell could haue had anye power vppon hym he shoulde haue bene immortal he shoulde haue lyued for euer no destructyon at all shoulde haue come neare hym or touched him God then had created hym to be vndestroyed if he had not through disobedience broken his commaundement For it is wrytten in the booke of Iesus the son of Syrach Eccle. xv otherwise called Ecclesiastions that Lorde gaue him his commaundementes and preceptes sayinge if thou wilt obserue the commaundementes and kepe acceptable faithfulnesse for euer they shal preserue thee By this then it dothe plainly appeare that by breakinge of the law that was geuen him he did bring both him self and all his posterity into vtter perdition DIdy Question Mighte not the Lord throughe hys almighty power haue letted hym from doing so PHILALETHES No manne dothe denye Answer to it but that God myghte haue preserued him from fallinge because that he is almighty DI. And whye did he it not PHILALETHES Because that he would not But why he would not we leaue that vnto him as we said before For we muste not be wyser than it behoueth Howe be it thys matter hathe bene sufficientlye discussed before therfore we wil come againe to our argumente Ye haue hearde alredy that man was created to be vndestroyed if he had not throughe dysobedience broken the cōmaundement of god and that by his transgression and fall he dyd bringe bothe him selfe and all that came of him in to vtter destruction so that by reason of it all the whole lompe of mankinde is subiect vnto damnation and vnto death euerlastinge When we saye then that God did of this lompe of dānation chuse some euen afore the foundacions of the world wer layed for to be the vessels of his mercy and for to be felowe heyers with his sonne Iesu Christ of his heauenlye kingdome and that again he did ordain and appointe som for to be the vessels of his wrath and the examples of hys iustice we do in nothynge varye from the scryptures that ye haue aleaged laste For those places are to bee vnderstanded of manne beynge as God created hym fyrst and we speake of man beyng made through his owne folye We were all in Adams loynes when he fell transgression and fall the child of perdition in whose loynes we wer all when he fell wherby it foloweth that we al are naturally the chylden of wrath Therfore when he doth rayse and styrre vp some for to be the vessels of his wrathe as we haue sayed many times before alredy he doth thē no wrong nothing can be layed to his charge for it For he doth but as they do deserue and though he shuld withoute any exception dampne vs all he should do vs but ryght Question DIDY But syth that it was not the wyll of God as Esdras sayeth that man shoulde come to naught why did he suffer hym to fall after thys sorte I canne not yet well vnderstande thys PHILALETHES Aunswer Thys place muste be vnderstanded as the other that we expounded euen nowe It was not the wyll of God that man should come to nought if he had contynued and abyden styll in the same estate that he was created and put in at the first But syth that man hath contrarye to the wyll and cōmaundemente of almightye God broughte him selfe throughe hys disobedience rebellion to naught I meane to endlesse myserye and calamitye God oure heauenlye father for to declare hys mercy did chuse some from amonge his sede for to enheryte eternall felicitye and life euerlastynge And some agayne for to declare and sette fourthe hys iustyce he dyd appoynte and ordayne to be euerlastingelye dampned in hell fyer EVTRAPELVS And what absurditye were it I praye you to saye that almyghtye God our heauenlye father doth as a mightye potter make of one lompe of claye whych of hys owne nature is alredye subiecte vnto euerlasting damnation some vessels to honoure and some to dyshonoure Doth not the blessed Apostle sainte Paule wryte Rom. ix that God willing to shew his wrathe and to make hys power to be knowen dothe brynge forth the vessels of wrath whyche are ordained to damnation that so he may declare the richesse of hys glory on the vessels of mercy whiche he hath prepared vnto glory DyDIMVS Ye had made me almoste to forget a thinge whyche I thought to haue asked our brother Philalethes EVTRAPE What shoulde that bee DyDIMVS He said euen now that Adam did contrary to Gods wil bring him selfe to naughte by his owne disobedyence and rebellion But howe can this be For is it not wrytten that no man is able to resist gods wyll Rom. ix Obiectiō Sith then that it was not the wyll of God that he should be broughte to nought how could he contrarye to Goddes will bringe him selfe to naught Aunswer PHILA Ye shall vnderstand neighbour Dydimus that the holy scripture doth speake of Gods holy wil two manner of wayes Fyrst and foremost The will of God is two manner of way considered in the scriptures it doth ascribe vnto him I meane vnto God an absolute wil. And this will of God is hidden from vs and can in no wise be resisted For what so euer God doth once determine accordynge to that absolute wil of his it shal neuer be altered Again al the whole world shall neuer be able to wythstand it And therfore we saye that God is almighty because that he is able to do whatsoeuer he wyll Secondly the scripture doth speke of the deuine and blessed wil of god as it is declared and setforthe vnto vs in Gods holy word whereby we do learne what God will haue vs to do and what he will haue vs to leaue vndone We do al contrarye to this wil of our heauenly father when we do breake his holye lawe and commaundements Syth then that God by geuing our fyrst parent Adam a law and commaundement did declare vnto him what he woulde haue hym to doe and what he woulde haue him to leaue vndone when he did through hys disobedyence breake the lawe and commaundemente of God he dyd contrarye to Gods wil brynge hym selfe to naught and to vtter destructyon in the whych God leaueth them whome he hathe apoynted and ordayned to be the vessels of hys wrathe and the examples of his deuine iustice for to be glorified by their damnation DYDIMVS Obiectiō If God doth apoynte and ordayne some to be the vessels of hys wrathe and examples of hys iustice for to be glorified by theyr dampnation whye dothe then the blessed Apostle sainte Paule saye i. Tim. ii that God wyl haue