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A00430 Catholique traditions. Or A treatise of the beliefe of the Christians of Asia, Europa, and Africa, in the principall controuersies of our time In fauour of the louers of the catholicke trueth, and the peace of the Church. Written in French by Th. A.I.C. and translated into English, by L.O.; Tradition catholique. English Eudes, Morton.; Owen, Lewis, 1572-1633. 1609 (1609) STC 10561; ESTC S101746 137,760 254

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concerning the wordes Sacrament and Mysterie As touching the word Sacrament noe Christian Nation is holden to vse it for it is grounded neither vpon Diuine law nor Ecclesiasticall Catholicke law The word is Latine and the Catholike Church neuer speaketh Latine but onely Greeke in the vniuersall Councels If therefore the Protestants will call none Sacraments but Baptisme and the Eucharist they doe nothing either against God or against the Church But these two Ceremonies are by them esteemed so holy and so authenticall and to haue such prerogatiues that they thinke it meete and reasonable to cal them by some peculiar name first because that they are common to all those of the Church secondly because that they haue a visible substance or matter ordained by Iesus Christ and thirdly because that the holy Scripture doth attribute very much vnto them But some will say the Protestants are contrarie to the East Church both in the name and in the thing it selfe for that Church beleeueth that there are seuen Mysteries Here is to be noted that as concerning the word Mysterie the Protestants haue not as yet put it in vse and haue not defined what that is which may be called Mysterie That word with them is further extended then the word Sacrament and which is yet more they confesse that the word Sacrament may be taken more largely and they protest that they will neuer be superstitious about words Chemnitius saith that it was neuer yet stood vpon but that absolution of Penitents might be called a Sacrament Caluin saith that Imposition of hands in anie Ordination may be called a Sacrament And the Apologie of the Confession of Ausburg saith the verie same Confirmation is commaunded in the Canons of the English Church and Caluin desireth that it might be vsed and practised The Annointing or Vnction of the sicke is likewise a Sacrament yea euen at this time as Monsieur de Moulin saith for the reason wherefore it is not vsed is because that men see not the effects of those daies As concerning Marriage if it be likewise taken simplie they neuer call it a Sacrament It is common both to the Iewes Turkes and Pagans but if one speake of the marriage of Christians considered as it is contracted and blessed in the face of the Church it may be called as the Patriarch Ieremie calleth it a Mysterie or a Mysterious action and a holy celebration And if all or the most part of Ecclesiasticall actions may bee called Sacraments then more properlie may they by them be called Mysteries for although that the word of God in it selfe be also called a Mysterie yet more particularly when it is emploied in some holy action The Churches of Affrica hold not for Sacraments neither the Chrisme nor the oile of Extreame Vnction as Zaga-Zabo one of their owne Bishops and Aluares who dwelt many yeares in Aethiope doe witnesse These men are more credible then Titelman and such like who neuer were there Peraduenture the Abyssins would expound them according to the beleefe of them of the East but seeing that here is nothing controuerted but words it will be no inconuenience to make this conclusion That there are seuen celebrations in the Church the which are called mysteries and two principall which may be called Sacraments QVESTION XXXIX Whether it be lawfull or needfull to pray for the Saints which are in Paradise THE EAST CHVRCH LIturgia S. Basilij Lord haue mercy vpon vs remember the Saints which haue pleased thee from the beginning our holy Fathers the Patriarkes Prophets Apostles Martyrs Confessors Euangelists Preachers and all the righteous which are dead in the Faith especially the holy blessed and euer-Virgine Marie Saint Iohn Baptist and Saint Stephan the Protomartyr THE SOVTH CHVRCH THe Liturgie of Cyrill of Alexandria O Lord haue pitty vpon our Fathers and Brethren whose soules thou hast receiued giue them rest call to remembrance our holy Fathers the Patriarkes Prophets Apostles and aboue all the rest the holy and glorious Virgine Marie Saint Iohn Baptist and Saint Stephan Graunt O Lord that the of soules them all may rest and repose in the bosome of our holy Fathers Abraham Isack and Iacob graunt that their soules may inhabite and dwell in a greene place by the waters of Comfort in the Paradise of pleasure from whence griefe heauinesse and sighings are chased away Raise their bodies in the day which thou hast ordained according to thy true promises which cannot faile THE LATIN CHVRCH BEllarmine The first question is whether the soules of the faithfull separated from their bodies and such as haue no need of Purgatorie are admitted to enioy the felicitie which consisteth in the cleere vision of God This hath beene the opinion of auncient and moderne heretickes that they are reserued vntill the last day in some secret receptacle where they see not God and are not blessed but in hope Tertullian affirmed it first Vigilantius followed him Guido attributeth the same to the Armenians The Grecians held it in the Councell of Florence Luther holdeth the very same error and Caluin also who bringeth no arguments to proue it THE REFORMED CHVRCH THe Councell of Wittenberge The State is all one of a Saint which is at rest in Christ and a faithfull man that dieth for he that dieth in the Faith is a Saint We doe thinke it a thing agreeable to a godly soule to make an honest mention of his Elders departed in the faith Charitie requireth that we wish and desire to the dead all tranquilitie and felicitie in Christ But there is no testimonie in the Propheticall and Apostolicall doctrine that the dead are helped by Prayers Watchings and Merits or that they obtaine in heauen a greater felicitie thereby ANNOTATION BEllarmine telleth vs that the Churches of Greece and Armenia doe beleeue that vntill the day of Iudgement the Saints doe not enioy that perfect felicitie which is called the vision or sight of God They thinke saith Vilamont that there are none there but the Virgine Marie and peraduenture the good thiefe And that the rest are in certaine Chambers where the Angels wont to visite them They would say lodgings whereof our Sauiour speaketh In my Fathers house are many mansions The Africanes doe beleeue the same as may be gathered by their Liturgie Bellarmine attributeth the same to Caluin As for the Syrians their errors saith Villamont are not so great as these of the Grecians for they beleeue that the righteous are in Paradise and the wicked in hell and that in praying for the dead their paines are diminished albeit there is no place to purge soules the Anaphore of the Syrians saith thus O Lord Creatour of soule and body remember those that are departed out of this world refresh them in thy Tabernacle passe them thither from horrible lodgings draw them out of darkenesse and dolour In like maner the opinion of the Apostolicke Churches is contrarie both to the Romane Catholickes and
not absolutely promised but to those which haue perfect righteousnesse The Catholike conclusion in this Question is That a man meriteth not properly eternall life by his good workes although that they be worthy of reward that is to say that they make a man fit to receiue a recompence through the grace of God QVESTION XVI Whether that there be a fire of Purgatory or other torment where the soules are purified or punished and whether the prayers of the liuing doe helpe to deliuer them THE EAST CHVRCH NIcholas The Grecians doe denie purgatory affirming that the prayers of the liuing doe nothing profite the dead Villamont The Grecians doe denie purgatorie but you make them amased if you aske them this question seeing that they beleeue not that there is a purgatorie wherefore then doe they pray for the forgiuenes of their offences They answere that it is to the ende God would put them in a more glorious place and that they are in Mansions where the Angels visite them often Sacranus The Moscouites affirme that there is no purgatorie but that there is onely two receptacles or places of receit for soules that is to say heauen and hell The booke of a Grecian touching purgatory saith thus We haue not receiued by Tradition from our Teachers that there is any fire of purgatorie or any temporall punishment besides and wee knowe that the Church of the East doth beleeue so The same Authour Our Lord in the Gospell according to S. Luke teaching what shall bee the condition both of the one and the other saith that Lazarus as soone as he was dead was carried by Angels into Abrahams bosome and that the soule of the rich man as soone as he was dead was carried into hell and there tormented And also by the bosome of Abraham hee signifieth the finall estate of the beloued of God in blessed rest and by hell and torments finall damnation and eternall paine And hath left no other place betweene both hauing any temporall paine and saith that there is but one bottomlesse pit beyond the which none can passe which seperateth the one from the other and ordained an extreame and vtter contrariety betweene them THE SOVTH CHVRCH ALuares Being ariued in the Church they lay not the body within the graue but lay it neare to it without singing any part of any seruice for the dead nor any of the Psalmes of Dauid much lesse those of Iob whereupon I desiring to know what they said they answered me that they sang that is to say they pronounced aloud the Gospell of S. Iohn intirely Annot. By this it appeareth that the Churches of the South beleeue not that there is a purgatorie because they themselues do not make praiers at the burying of their dead Damianus a Goes reporteth by heare-say that they bury their dead with Crosse and praiers but Aluares who dwelt many yeares in that place denyeth it Peraduenture the same Damianus tooke the lecture of the Gospell for a prayer Dauid Emperour of Ethiope We haue caused a Church to be built in honour of the most holy Trinity where the bones of our deceased fathers are buried who enioyes as we hope eternall felicity Annot. Our Princes of the Latine Church which beleeue that there is a Purgatorie are wont to say speaking of their deceased parents God haue mercy on their soules THE REFORMED CHVRCH THe confession of the Swizers We beleeue that the faithfull are transported to Iesus Christ straight after corporall death and that they haue no neede of the prayers and suffrages of the liuing We beleeue also that the wicked are straight-way cast into hell from whence they cannot come forth And that same which some men teach touching the fire of purgatorie is contrary to Christian faith I beleeue the forgiuenes of sinnes and the al-sufficient purgation made by Iesus Christ and his word Verily verily I say vnto you that whosoeuer heareth my wordes and beleeueth in him that sent me hath euerlasting life and shall not come into iudgement but passeth from death to life THE ROMAN CHVRCH THe Councell of Trent Forasmuch as the holy Catholicke Church guided by the holy Ghost hath taught according to the holy Scriptures and the ancient Traditions of the Fathers in the holy Councels and lastly in that holy vniuersall Councell that there is a purgatory and that the soules which are there deteined are helped by the praiers of the faithfull and principally by the acceptable sacrifice of the Altar The holy Councell doth commaund the Bishops that they take paines and study diligently that the good and holy doctrine of Purgatory which the holy fathers and Councels haue deliuered be receiued held taught and preached euery where ANNOTATION THis point here hath no difficultie for as touching the praiers which they make in the East for the dead wee will intreat in that question where it shall be debated whether it be lawfull to praie for the Saints which are in heauen Onely it is to be noted that the Councelle of Trent doth faine that the holy Scriptures doe warrant Purgatorie which the Churches of the East doe denie And if the true Interpretations of Scripture ought to be taken out of the Apostolicke Churches which haue retained it from hand to hand from their Fathers it followeth that those places of Scripture which the Church of Rome doth alleadge to proue Purgatorie are wrested by them to another sense as the Grecians haue shewed in their Apologie in the Councell of Basil And the Author of the Treatise of the fire of Purgatory before alleadged doth proue it very slenderly Moreouer many Romane Catholike Doctors and of very good estimation doe confesse that Purgatorie cannot be proued by the Scripture Amongst the rest Alphonsus de Castro auoucheth not onely that it is not proued by the Scripture but also that the Fathers doe seldome make mention of it especially the Greeke Fathers From thence saith he it commeth that euen vntill this present time the Grecians doe denie Purgatorie The Catholicke Conclusion thererefore here is this That there is no fire of Purgatorie nor any other torment where soules are purged and punished and that prayers serue not to deliuer them but rather are superfluous and vnprofitable if that they be made to that intention QVESTION XVII Whether the Pope or any other can giue Indulgences or Pardons to deliuer men from temporall punishment THE EAST CHVRCH IEremie Patriarch Gener. All these things ought to be done freely for Gods cause and not for any hope of gaine considering that there is nothing more agreeable to God then that Sacranus The Moscouites doe condemne Orders Blessings Priesthood Praiers Fastings Indulgences Iubiles and Ecclesiasticall offices and all that which the Church to wit of Rome doth dispence with by the authoritie of the Keyes In like manner they mocke at the obedience and authority Ecclesiasticall and yeelde no more to excommunication then to Indulgences THE CHVRCH OF THE
SOVTH ZAga-Zabo Bishop of Abyssin It is likewise the office of the Patriarch to denounce excommunication against the obstinate the obseruation whereof is so straight that they let him that is obstinate die for hunger They giue nor graunt no Indulgences THE REFORMED CHVRCH COnfess Sax. In times past those that did penance to the end that it might be perceiued that they desired Pardon with all their heart and to the ende that their example should profite others were not receiued vpon a suddaine but the absolution was deferred for certaine daies to the end that they might be seene to aske it publickely Afterwards superstition encreased so much that fasting was ordained and abstinence from women many yeares These wil-worshippes being too much augmented the Bishops againe released them The relaxation of such customes were called Indulgences The Monks doe not consider the Historie of these things if they imagine that they make satisfaction for eternall paine or the paine of Purgatorie and others of this life or do adde that satisfactions were ordained by the Church to the end that these paines should be qualified Well we say that this application of Indulgences by the which the Pope applyeth the merites of the Saints is inuented at his pleasure THE LATIN CHVRCH THe Councell of Trent Forasmuch as the power to conferre Indulgences hath beene giuen by Iesus Christ to the Church and hath beene vsed in very auncient time with the like power as it was diuinely giuen The holy Councell teacheth and commaundeth that the vsage of these Indulgences which are very necessarie for Christian people and approued by the Authoritie of the holy Councels ought to be receiued in the Church ANNOTATION THe Protestants say that the custome in times past was to appoint to repentant sinners a certaine terme during which by their good workes they might giue the Church testimonie of their repentance The same is as yet practised in the East and South Churches Ieremie Patriarcke of Constantinople discourseth hereupon as followeth Satisfactions are profitable if they be imposed as a medicine by the spiritual ministers that is to say for those that are Proude Couetous Gluttonous Incontinent Enuious Quarrelous or giuen to such like vices Who if they would conuert and repent ought to submit themselues to the rules made according to the aduise of the holy Fathers But if those satisfactions bee translated to the gaine and profit of those that giue them and not to the true end which is to prouide for the saluation of the Soule and to heale each sinne which is the intention for the which they were instituted In that fashion we doe reiect them and doe say that they were ordained in vaine which cannot by any meanes be denied And we doe pronounce remission of sinnes with some punishment adioyned for many considerations First to the end that a man for voluntarie affliction might escape the ineuitable paine of an other life Bring forth fruites worthy of Repentance saith S. Iohn Euery tree that beareth not good fruit shall be cut down and throwne into the fire to wit Euerlasting For God is not so much pleased with any thing as with affliction and therefore S. Gregorie saith Teares are recompensed with mercie Secondly to the end that the inclination of the flesh to voluptuousnesse which is the cause of vice should be taken away Thirdly to the end that that punishment should be a stay to the soule to the end it fall not into such like sinne or worse Fourthly to the end that a man should accustome himselfe to take paines for vertue is gotten with trauaile Fiftly to the end that a man might bee assured whether he perfectly hateth euill Neuerthelesse we doe leaue all these things in those that depart For we doe count that it is sufficient if in him that repenteth there bee a true conuersion Therefore we doe pronounce remission of sinnes according to the power of him that said If you remit sinnes they shall be Pardoned We beleeue that by the same meanes the punishment is pardoned for assurance whereof we doe giue the diuine gift of the Eucharist For repentance hath his seate in the soule of the sinner but not to vndergoe punishment is in the handes of God which for this cause hath really by his owne humanitie giuen remission as to the thiefe who did but desire of the Lord that hee would remember him when he came to his Kingdome See here the Doctrine of the Churches of the East touching satisfaction The Protestants doe proceede more compendiously they are content that in regard of vnknowen sinnes euery one doe apply according to his discretion the saying of S. Iohn Bring forth fruits worthy of repentance As concerning sinnes knowen by the most part of the Church satisfaction sufficeth not vnlesse it make a reparation or publike acknowledgment in asking pardon of God and the Church for the scandale and if the offence be knowne but to a few the same acknowledgement is made in their Consistories Those that refuse doe remaine suspended or excommunicated vntill that they doe obey and they giue no Indulgence There is also apappointed to the repentant a time of suspension from the Sacraments more or lesse according to the fault as well for a punishment as also to the end that the Church may see whether such repentance be true or fained by the fruits therof The auncient Church imposed punishments and sometimes so hard that they were constrained to release the rigor of them and that relaxation was called Indulgence The Churches of the South doe release or mittigate nothing at all and also reiect Indulgences in what sort soeuer they are taken for this euill proceedeth from appointing punishments so hard that they are constrained afterwards to reuoke them But if satisfaction doe consist in doing good workes It is very il done to dispence with men for doing all the good that is possible for them to doe The people of the East and of the South allow not of this abuse but they condemne rather the opinion of the Romane Church which ordaine satisfactions to auoide certaine paines of Purgatorie and teach that by Indulgences the said paines are escaped without performing or making of any satisfaction yea as if by Indulgences a man might be deliuered from the obligation whereby he is bound to God to doe all that is possible to obtaine pardon of him Also the Apostolicke Churches doe beleeue that there is neither Pope nor any other person which by Indulgences can deliuer men from the punishments that God inflicteth which if it be so that Indulgences do not deliuer a man from temporall punishments of this life as pouertie sickenesse and death it selfe how can they deliuer him from the paines of Purgatory For there is the same reason for the one as for the other It followeth vpon the premises that the Church cannot dispence with times and workes lawfully ordained for proofe and disproofe but may well release for iust and reasonable