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A47617 An answer to the Bishop of Condom's book entituled, An exposition of the doctrin of the Caholick Church, upon matters of coutroversie [sic]. Written originally in French. La Bastide, Marc-Antoine de, ca. 1624-1704, attributed name. 1676 (1676) Wing L100; ESTC R221701 162,768 460

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that the Images being properly onely for the people as the Council doth intimate and the people almost alwayes abusing them as the most sincere persons do confess the Images therefore are properly onely for those who abuse them As to what concerns Reliques it will onely be needful to apply hereto what hath been spoken in general and in particular touching the object of Religious Worship and touching the invocation of Saints and the veneration that is given to Images For as to the Doctrine we have almost the same reasons against all these different obiects of Worship And as to the practice all the World knows that there are yet far greater abuses committed in the Worship of all that they call Reliques of Saints than in that of Images What we have in particular touching Reliques may be reduced unto two principal Heads the first that neither the Council of Trent nor the Catechism nor the Bishop of Condom say that Reliques have no virtue nor that we ought not to place confidence in them as they all do say of Images Ibid. de ●●voc Sanct. c. de cultu Sanct. On the contrary the Council teacheth that God confers very great graces by means of Reliques and the Catechism speaks stronger and more openly that God makes use of them to heal the lame and the blind to raise the dead and to exorcise devils and to drive them out of the bodies of living men By which passages the Council and the Catechism on the one hand recommend the Worship of Reliques above that of Images for the virtue which they would have believed to be in Reliques And on the other hand themselves in some measure overthrow the principal reason which they alledge to justifie the Worship of Images which is that they believe there is no virtue in them As for the Bishop of Condom he shelters himself from all these difficulties in not saying whether there is or is not any virtue in Reliques And here is the second thing which is to be observed touching Reliques in particular that the Bishop of Condom seems not to consider them but as marks of reverence and affection which are borne for the persons we love and honour From whence he draws this consequence That if God P. 36 37 38. all jealous as he is of the love of men doth not look upon us as if we divided betwixt him and the creature when we love our neighbour for his sake the same God howsoever jealous of the respect of Believers doth not behold them as if they divided the Worship which they owe unto him alone when they honour for the respect which they bear unto him those whom he himself hath honoured And in the end he concludes that these outward marks of reverence not being absolutely nec●ssary the Church may extend more or less these exteriour practices according to the diversity of times and places not desiring that her children should be servilely subject unto visible things All the World may see how this discourse is turned and sweetned and how it seems to open a way to some Reformation but if these opinions be sincere and approved by all those of the Roman Communion let them at least make appear that their actions do answer their words If they will onely honour the Saints the true honour of dead bodies is burial and as for apparel and other things which served for their use let them be carefully preserved if they please but let them not incense them and let them not expose them in the House of God to become an object of Worship Let them not suffer the people to trust in Reliques that they should carry them with them as preservatives against danger of Fire of Shipwrack and against the Devil himself and that thereby their hearts cleaving unto the things which they have before their eyes they become more negligent of praying unto God and having recourse to him alone No persons have greater respect and veneration for the memory of Saints than we have let there be no mixture of Religion nor Worship no not the very terms for as for us it is our unmovable Foundation that God alone ought to be the object of our Regilion and that there ought not to be any sort of Religious Worship given to any but unto God onely God will have us to love our neighbours which are living members of our Lord Jesus Christ and which are not things inanimate or the dead parts of living members as are the Reliques for this is the reason for which the Council will have men to have a veneration for them But who doth not know that even in this love for our neighbours there may be an excess and that God may be displeased thereat God permits us to love goods and riches as gifts from his hand but this love doth often extend too far and God is offended at it The Scripture calls coveteousness Idolatry we every day say that men do idolize what they love when they love it to excess It is the same thing in a manner as to the honour that is due to Saints God will have us to love and honour their memory that we should praise them that we should propose to imitation their Faith their Zeal that their names should be in veneration and blessing amongst us but he will not we observe no measure he will not have us give unto them the same marks of Honour as we give unto himself and he not onely forbids that we should divide this honour betwixt him and the Saints but he will also have us not communicate the least part of it unto any but himself alone Now to end this article of the worship of Saints of Reliques and of Images if the Bishop of Condom will do any thing that is sincere and solid if he will cure the disease and not palliate it that is if he will leave the Foundations of Faith whole and intire and dispel a considerable part of our Controversies as he saith it is his design to do it is not enough to change some terms or to fasten them nor to insinuate as he doth that the Church of Rome may use some moderation in the outward signs of this Worship whilest in the general it is seen that at the bottom the Doctrine and practice of the Roman Church is all along one and the same As for us though it may seem that there is less appearance of evil and superstition in the manner of the Bishop of Condom's speaking than there is in that of the Council of the Roman Catechism and the other Doctours of his Communion we can look neither upon the one nor the other but onely as humane inventions And to conclude these very sweetnings of the Bishop of Condom himself being far from giving us any ill opinion of our Reformation rather confirm us the more that the worthy and moderate persons of the Roman Church do themselves at least condemn a good part of what we condemn
those which he hath already accomplished for our Salvation Wherefore it is not to be wondred at if he gives unto every one of us the proper substance of his Flesh and of his Bloud he doth it to imprint in our hearts that it is for us that he took them and that it is for us that he offered them as a sacrifice And a little afterwards he adds Our adversaries have very well seen that simple figures and simple signs of the body and bloud of Jesus Christ would not satisfie Christistians accustomed to the bounty of a God which gives himself so really unto us therefore it is that they would not be accused to deny this real participation of Jesus Christ in their Sacrament Behold here the reason that he saith hath forced us to approach unto the Church of Rome but Christians are then either very ingrateful or very difficult to be contented if they are not satisfied that Jesus Christ died for them that these sacred signs assure them of it and that they serve them as an effectual and saving means to raise their hearts and their Faith unto Jesus Christ They have then the ears of their understanding close stopped if it be true that these sacred signes joyned unto the Word do not yet tell them plainly and loud enough that Jesus Christ became man for them that his body was broken for them and that lastly his bloud was poured out for the remission of their sins The Opinion which the Church of Rome adds that Jesus Christ is present being very far from better setting forth his death incumbers as I may so say the conception of it as hath been shewed before because it represents the body of Jesus Christ in a living state under dead signs and moreover the way of giving these signes in a language not understood or ill understood makes much less impression in the hearts than the way wherein it hath been shewed they are given amongst us But in fine where is the reason of this consequence The Love which Jesus Christ hath for us induced him to dye really for us therefore it is the part of this Love to give really unto us the proper substance of his flesh and of his bloud What bond or what necessary consequence is there of one and the other of these things From what time and in what place hath it been known or usual that it is a sign of love in any to give his proper flesh to eat to them whom he loves I do not say onely by morsels as some possibly may say the Capernaites understood the words of our Saviour but in any manner or under any coverts under which it may be put For although God doth testifie his Love unto us by incomprehensible effects though his ways are not our ways grace doth not for all that destroy nature his ways are above our ways and even contrary to what ours have of evil and irregularity but not at all to what they have that is good and right which proceeds from God himself What there is incomprehensible in the effects of his Love is nothing as to the manner as we may say but to the degree or rather the infinity of this Love it self For as to the other point we in some sort conceive all that this infinite Love makes him do for us by a comparison though very imperfect of what an intire Love doth make us doe one for another To pay for another is the true office of a Friend and to dye for another hath always passed for a true test of Love Joh. 15.13 Greater Love hath no man than this that a man lay down his life for his Friends To dye for an Enemy is a generosity that hath had no example amongst men before the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ Jesus Christ dyed for us who were originally his creatures but were become his enemies This is that which this Love hath in it incomprehensible and nevertheless this Love which was foretold by the prophets was accomplished in the time that was foretold But neither prophesie nor reason nor humane manners ever yet taught us that Jesus Christ should give us his real flesh to eat with the mouth of our body as a token of the Love that he hath for us and when Jesus Christ said unto his Disciples John 6. That he would give his flesh for the life of the world and that whosoever did not eat his flesh had no life in him seeing that this word offended many it doth not appear unto us that our Saviour condemned their surprise but onely that he presently explained this speech unto them and that he made them understand that they should receive it spiritually The Gentlemen of the Roman Church do always fall into this error that although they do not directly deny that the communion which we have with Jesus Christ by Faith is very real of its self sufficing to salvation as they do confess in particular of the communion which we have with him either by the Word or by Baptism nevertheless always when there is any mention of the Mystery of the Eucharist they have this impression reigning in their minds which overbears all others that Jesus Christ cannot give himself really unto them but when they believe that he gives his proper flesh to be eaten with the mouth of their body It is from this apprehension that the Bishop of Condom faith here again that Jesus Christ makes as tast his bounty by things as effectual as those which he accomplished for our salvation as if the Faith which he gives as and the communion which we have with him by his Spirit even out of the Eucharist were not all of these effectual things and as effectual as it is true that he dyed for us Let us now come unto the Objections which the Bishop of Condom makes against some of our expressions to prove that we are approached nearer unto the Church of Rome pa. 146. In the first place he seems to contradict himself for he says afterwards that the more we explain our selves the Gentlemen of the Roman Church and we upon this Article the more contrary we find our selves one to another he gives also the reason for it which is that the more we consider the consequences of Transubstantiation the more we are discouraged with the difficulties which sense and reason discover in it This doth not import that we are approached nearer Besides there are very few persons who should hear him say that we are approached unto the Church of Rome but would believe that the reason is because some of our late Synods or some of our more famous modern Doctours had relaxed somewhat of our Doctrine either in the sense or in the expressions In the mean while there is nothing less than this All this accusation bears onely upon three diverse Expressions drawn from our Catechism which is as it is known the ancient explanation of our Doctrine The Bishop of Condom
and that by consequence they acknowledge thereby in some sort that a Reformation is useful and necessary VI. Of justfication THE THIRD PART The method which the Bishop of Condom hath observed requires that after the Worship of Saints c. we examine his Doctrine concerning Justification the merit of Works of Satisfactions Purgatory and of Indulgences It is true as the Bishop of Condom saith that the Article of Justification is one of the chief things which gave occasion of reformation to our Fathers Very few are Ignorant what was the state of the Latin church at that time On one hand presented it selfe the Doctrin of the merit of works the necessity of satisfying Gods Justice in this life or endureing the fire of Purgatory after death to compleat what was wanting of this satisfaction on the other hand was to be seen an extraordinary irregulatity in the life and manners as well of the Clergy as of the people and by consequence no likelihood of salvation neither by works nor by those satisfactions and in fine there appeared no other Object before the eyes of men but Purgatory or Hell In this state of the Church the Pope opens the Treasures of his Indulgencies distributes his Agnus's his Beads and Reliques and prescribes certain numbers of Pater nosters and Ave Mary's of Stations of Visits of Churches of Pilgrimages Fasts Pennances of macerations and mortifications with which and with the help of Pardons Dispensations and Indulgences which were purchased at a dear rate those who had them were not onely justified themselves but helped to justifie others delivering souls out of Purgatory and acquiring for them a greater degree of blessednesse or an augmentation of glory as the Councill speaks Our Fathers did believe that there was an abuse in all these things and that this Doctrine which possessed the minds of the people and that made up the greatest part of their piety did overthrow the Foundation of Religion which doth essentially consist in placing our chiefest confidence in the Death of our Lord Jesus Christ and farther in serving God according to his will and not according to the commandments of men It is also true that since the Reformation the Church of Rome it self doth seem to be a little more reserved than she was before as well as to expressions in regard of her Doctrines as in regard of the practice and the very use of Indulgences and they are beholding to us for it which doth very much serve for the justification of our first Reformers but the abuses are yet too great in one and the other for the corrupting of piety and scandalizing of true Christians Those who onely consider the controversie of Justification at a distance or transiently without searching into the grounds and consequences will not it may be at first think it so important as it is but it is of so great moment what herein is the judgment of those who are well informed amongst us that as to the contrary we should not stick here to maintain that the difference of Belief which doth separate us from the Church of Rome as to this point is of so great consequence unto Religion that there is scarce any greater Let us therefore be permitted according to the liberty that Dispute doth require to deny here formally what the Bishop of Condom doth aver in something an uncertain manner That there are but few learned men of our side as he speaks but do confess that we ought not to separate from the Church of Rome about this point and that this difficulty is not any longer considered as much material by the most intelligent persons amongst us The Bishop of Condom doth not cite one of those learned men nor one of those intelligent persons unto whom he imputes these sorts of Sentiments as the importance of the business doth require The Confession of Faith of our Churches which contains the General Belief of those of our Communion explains it self to the contrary upon this point as throughly as may be it confirms the very Doctrine which the first Reformers taught declaring in express terms That how little soever we swerve from this Foundation we can never finde any ease but that we shall be continually tossed with inquietude The Council of Trent it self acknowledged the importance of this Controversie First in that it takes notice of it from the first as one of the principal causes of the Schism and which did most deserve the care of the said Council And in the second place by the prodigious length of its Decree and by the vast number of its Canons and Anathema's much greater upon this point than upon any other In summe it may be said that it is not onely a principal point but it is one of them which are most such The others for the most part do onely regard some part of Religion Errour doth corrupt but that part and doth not influence the others if we may so speak The worshipping the Host for example is without doubt one of the most essential points in which it is impossible to finde any mean because the question is whether it ought to be worshiped or not worshipped which is the first and greatest Act of Religion Nevertheless this is but a particular point a capital errour indeed for them who are deceived in it but which doth nothing or changeth nothing in all the other Fundamental Points But who speaks of Justification speaks of the means of our Salvation that is to say the Mystery of our Redemption there is nothing more important than not to be deceived in the choice of such a matter because if a man fails to take the right way he falls from errour to errour and the very true essence of Religion is changed and altered This truth will plainly appear by the bare comparing of our Doctrine with that of the Church of Rome We do believe that our Justification doth alone consist herein that having deserved death Jesus Christ dyed for us and satisfied the Justice of God the Father for us who for the love of his Son pardoneth all our sins in general uniting us unto him by a true and lively faith and imputing his righteousness and obedience unto us that is to say the merit of his Death it self as though we had suffered it in our own persons We believe that it is God himself that doth beget and strengthen this Faith in our hearts by the inward operation of his Holy Spirit and by the outward Ministry of his Word and Sacraments as shall be explained in what follows upon the subject of the Sacraments that this Faith is not a dead or idle Faith but a living Faith and working by love and by all sorts of good works and that these works are very acceptable to God and necessary to Salvation as an inseparable consequent of that Faith which justifies us but that it is onely of pure Grace and by the alone merit of the death of J●sus Christ that