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A14614 The copies of certaine letters vvhich haue passed betweene Spaine and England in matter of religion Concerning the generall motiues to the Romane obedience. Betweene Master Iames Wadesworth, a late pensioner of the holy Inquisition in Siuill, and W. Bedell a minister of the Gospell of Iesus Christ in Suffolke. Wadsworth, James, 1572?-1623.; Bedell, William, 1571-1642. aut; Hall, Joseph, 1574-1656. 1624 (1624) STC 24925; ESTC S119341 112,807 174

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Letters to you did make mee procrastinate my payment till now to my shame you should neede to demand it And that I may by the more shaming my selfe obtaine a more easie penance from you I confesse to you I was sometime halfe in the minde hauing especially differred it so long to suppresse it altogether First out of mine owne naturall disposition who haue euer abhorred contention and whereas in matters of Religion there ought to be the fairest wars I could neuer yet meete with any of that side of so patient a minde but by opposition he would be vnsetled For your selfe though I knew your former moderate temper and as I remember I wrote to Doctor Hall beleeued you in that which you protest that out of conscience you were such as you professe yet me thought I perceiued by your quick manner to him and some passages in the conclusion of your Letter you were rather desirous to enioy the quiet possession of your owne opinion then come to any fur●her disputation whose is the right And in truth the time of that triall had beene proper before your departure nor you had to● farre engaged your selfe and were to iustifie by your constancie the wisedome of your change Besides since the sum of the errour of that side as I haue euer conceiued it is beleeuing rather too much then failing in any point necessary to saluation that notable place of the Apostle Rom. 14. 1. came to my minde especially after that I had once occasion to preach of it where he forbids controuersies of disputations with those that are infirme in faith Who art thou saith he that iudgest another mans seruant he standeth or falleth to his owne Master Why should I grieue you and perhaps make my friend mine enemy as Saint Paul the Galathians by saying the truth The world is full enough of contentious writings which as by your letter appeares you had seen ere ye resolued If those had not satisfied you what could I hope to adde to them These things moued me but as you say they did not yet satisfie me For all men are interessed in the defence of truth how much more he that is called to be a Preacher of it All Christians are admonished by Saint Iude to fight for the faith once giuen to the Saints how much more those that are leaders in this warfare How could I say I loued our Lord Iesus Christ if his honour being questioned I should be silent How could I approue to mine owne soule that I loued you if I sufered you to enioy your owne error suppose not damnable Besides that you and perhaps others also might be confirmed in it perhaps interpreting my silence for a confession that your Motiues were vnanswerable But therein I was not onely resolued selfe to the contrary but thought it so easie to resolue any indifferent minde as me thought it was more shame not to haue done it at the first then praise to doe it at the last As for the successe of my endeauour I was to leaue it to God Many and secret are the wayes of his Prouidence which serueth it selfe sometimes euen of our errours to the safer conduct of vs to our finall happinesse Some I had known and heard of more who being at first carried away with the shewes of Vnity Order Succession Infallability when they found them emptie of Truth and the cloakes of Pride ambition coue●ousnesse ioyned with an obstinacie to defend all corruptions how palpable so euer by finding the difference of these Hulles from their Fathers Table had with the prodigall Son returned home againe To conclude I accounted my selfe still in debt and was I confesse to you unwilling to die in it and somtimes vowed to God in the middest of my troubles if I might once see an end of them to endeuour to discharge it And now hauing by his mercy not onely attained that but a new occasion presented me presently thereupon by your calling for satisfaction to pay it and meanes offered me to send it safely I take this motion to proceede from God and doe humbly desire his Maiesty to turne it to good It remaines therefore good Master Wadesworth that I doe intreat your pardo● of that slacknesse that is past and gentlenesse to take it as I shall be able to pay it My employments both ordinary and extraordinary are many the bulke of it is to great to conuey in one Letter consisting of sundry sheetes of paper and at this present there lies an extraordinary taske vpon me so as I cannot presently writ it out I doe therefore no more now but acknowledge the debt and promise speedy paiment Vnlesse I shall adde this also that I doe vndertake to pay interest for the forbearance and according as I shall vnderstand by Master Austen shall be fittest and safest to send it in parts or all at once To the conclusion of your last Letter wherein you professe your desire to spend the rest of your life rather in the heate of deuotion then of disputation desiring pardon of coldenesse that way and of all other your sinnes and that it would please God to guide and keepe me in all happinesse as your selfe through the redemption of our sweete Sauiour and by the intercession of his holy mother and all Saints I doe most thankefully and willingly subscribe Amen returning vnto you from my heart your owne best wishes Neither is it my purpose to call into question the soliditie of truth or firmenesse of the hope of saluation which you finde in your present way This onely I say Et pro nobis Christus mortuus est pro nostra Redemptione sanguinem suum fudit Peccatores quidem sed de ipsius grege sumus inter eius ouiculas numeramur This is my tenet And if the doctrine of the holy Bible doe containe solid truth and beleeuing in the name of the Son of God doe giue firme hope of saluation according to Gods own record 1 Iohn 5. 10. 11. 12. we are perswaded we haue both I will adde this more We know that wee are translated from death to life because wee loue our brethren With this Oyle in our Lampes which we desire may be alwayes in store in our Vessels also our hearts we attend the comming of the Bridegroome and say cheerefully Etiam veni Domine Iesu. To whose gracious protection I doe most hartily commit you and doe rest Your assured friend and louing Brother W. BEDELL Horningesherth this fifth of August 1619. To the Worshipfull Master WILLIAM BEDELL at Horningesherth neere Saint Edmundsbury in Suffolke these Salutem in Crucifix● WORTHY SIR I Was exceeding glad to perceiue by your kinde modest and discreete Letters of 5. of August last that you are still permanent in your own good nature and constant in your loue to me not like Master Ioseph Hall neither bitterly reuiling nor flourishing impertinently Vnto whom I pray you returne his scoffing railing Letter with these few marginall noates I
vniforme concord with the Protestants at this day in such matters as appeareth by the common rule of Faith the Creede and so hath also the Church vnder the Popes tyrannie As to the Trent-additions they are forraine to the Faith as neither principles nor conclusions thereof neither can your selues shew vniforme consent and concord in them and namely in the 11. of them in any one age especially as matters of saluation as now they are canonized How much lesse can yee shew it in all other conclusions of Faith whereabout there haue beene among you as are now among vs and euer will bee differences of opinions without any prejudice for all that vnto the vnitie of the Faith of the Church and title to the name of it As for Wicliffe Hus and the rest if they haue any of them borne record to the Truth and resisted any innouation of corrupt Teachers in their times euen to bloud they are iustly to be termed Martyrs yea albeit they saw not all corruptions but in some were themselues carried away with the streame of error Else if because they erred in some things they bee no Martyrs or because wee dissent from them in some things we are not of the same Church both you and we must quit all claime to Saint Cyprian Iustine Martyr and many more whom wee count our Ancients and Predecessors and bereaue them also of the honour of Martyrdome which so long they haue enjoyed You see I hope by this time the weaknesse of your Argument CHAP. X. Of the originall of reformation in Luther Caluin Scotland England c. IN your next Motiue taken from the originall of Reformation before I come to answere your Argument shortly coucht in forme I must endeuour to reforme your iudgement in sundrie points of storie wherein partly you are misse-led and abused by Parsons and others of that spirit partly you haue mistaken some particulars and out of a false imagination framed a like discourse First for Luther it was not his ran●our against the Dominicans that stirred him vp against the Pope but the shamefull merchandize of Indulgences set to sale in Germanie to the aduantage of Magdalen sister to Pope Leo X. Beleeue herein if not Sleidan yet G●●cciardine l. 13. And of all that mention those affaires it is acknowledged that at the first and for a good time he shewed all obedience and reuerence to the Pope The new Historie of the Councell of Trent written by an Italian a subiect and part of the Church of Rome as should appeare by the Epistle Dedicatorie of the Reuerend and learned Archbishop of Spalato prefixed to his Maiestie speaketh thus of the matter Questo diede occasione c. This gaue occasion to Martin to passe from Indulgences to the authoritie of the Pope which being by others proclaymed for the highest in the Church by him was made subiect to a Generall Councell lawfully celebrated Whereof hee said that there was neede in that instant and vrgent necessitie And as the heat of disputation continued by how much the more the Popes power was by others exalted so much the more was it by him abased yet so as Martin contayned himselfe within the termes of speaking modestly of the person of Leo and sauing sometimes his iudgement Againe After his departure from the presence of Cardinall Cajetan at Augusta hee saith hee wrote a letter to the Cardinall confessing that hee had beene too vehement and excusing himselfe by the importunitie of the Pardoners and of those that had written against him promising to vse more modestie in time to come to satisfie the Pope and not to speake any more of Indulgences prouided that his aduersaries would doe the like This was Luthers manner at the first till the Bull of Pope Leo came out dated the ninth of Nouember 1518. Wherein he declared the validitie of Indulgences and that hee as Peters Successor and Christs Vicar had power to grant them for the quicke and dead that this is the doctrine of the Church of Rome the Mother and Mistris of all Christians and ought to bee receiued of all that would bee in the Communion of the Church From this time forward Luther began to change his stile And saith he as before hee had for the most part reserued the person and iudgement of the Pope so after this Bull he resolued to refuse it and thereupon put forth an Appeale to the Councell c. You see then how submissiuely Luther at first carried himself But extreme tyrannie ouer-comes often a well prepared patience Touching his causing rebellion also against the Emperour yee are misse-informed his aduice was asked about the association of the Protestants at Smalcald hee said plainly hee could not see how it could bee lawfull further then for their owne defence Ioh. Bodin in his second Booke de Repub cap. 5. hath these wordes We reade also that the Protestant Princes of Almaine before they tooke armes against the Emperour demanded of Martin Luther if it were lawfull He answered freely that it was not lawfull whatsoeuer tyrannie or impietie were pretended He was not beleeued so the end thereof was miserable and drew after it the ruine of great and illustrious houses of Germanie As for the warre in Germanie it began not till after Luthers death neither was it a rebellion of the Protestants the truth is they stood for their liues The Emperour with the helpe of the Popes both mony and armes intended to roote them out and although at the first the Emperour did not auow his raysing armes against them to be for Religion yet the Pope in his Iubilee published vpon this occasion did not let to declare to the world that himselfe and Caesar had concluded a league to reduce the H●retikes by force of armes to the obedience of the Church and therefore all should pray for the good successe of the warre That Luther euer reuiled the Emperour I did neuer till now heare or reade and therefore would desire to know what authors you haue for it Touching other Princes namely King Henrie the eighth I will not defend him who condemned himselfe thereof It is true that he was a man of a bold and high stomacke and specially fitted thereby through the prouidence of God to worke vpon the heauie and dull disposition of the Almaines and in so generall a Lethargie as the world then was in hee carried himself as fell out somtimes very ●oisterously But arrogancie sch●sme rebellion were as farre from him as the intention itself to plant a Church As to his Vow-breaking lastly if that Vow were foolishly made and sinfully kept it was iustly broken perhaps also charitably if hee would by his owne example reforme such as liued in whoredome and other vncleannes and induce them to vse the remedie that God hath appointed for the auoiding of them to wit honorable marriage All this matter touching Luther vnlesse I be ●eceiued you haue taken from 〈◊〉 Harding that at least touching his
whole one Citie the world Hath it onely succession where to set aside the inquirie of Doctrine so manie Simoniacks and intruders haue ruled as about fiftie of your Popes together were by your owne mens confession Apostaticall rather then Apostolicall Or Vnitie where there haue beene thirtie Schismes and one of them which endured fiftie yeares long and at last grew into three heads as if they would share among them the triple Crowne And as for diffentions in Doctrine I remit you to Master Doctor Halls peace of Rome wherein hee scores aboue three hundred mentioned in Bellarmine alone aboue threescore in one onely head of Penance out of Nauarrus As to that addition in all ages and places I know not what to make of it nor wher●o to refer it Consider I beseech you with your wonted moderation what you say for sure vnlesse you were begu●led I had almost said bewitched you could neuer haue resolued to beleeue and professe that which all the world knowes to be as false I had welnigh said as God is true touching the extent of the Romish Church to all ages and places Concerning the agonies you passed I will say onely thus much if being resolued though erroniously that was truth you were withholden from professing it with worldly respects you did well to breake through them all But if besides these there were doubt of the contrarie as me thinks needes must be vnlesse you could satisfie your selfe touching those many and knowne exceptions against the Court of Rome which you could not be ignorant of take heede lest the rest insuing these agonies were not like Sampsons sleeping on Dal●lahs knees while the locks of his strength were shauen whereupon the Lord departing from him he was taken by the Philistims had his eyes put out and was made to grinde in the prison But I doe not despaire but your former resolutions shall grow againe And as I doe beleeue your religious asseueration that for very feare of damnation you forsooke vs which makes mee to haue the better hope and opinion of you for that I see you doe so seriously minde that which is the end of our whole life so I desire from my heart the good hope of saluation you haue in your present way may be as happie as your feare I am perswaded was causelesse For my part I call God to record against mine owne soule that both before my going into Italie and since I haue still endeauoured to finde and follow the truth in the points controuerted betweene vs without any earthly respect in the world Neither wanted I faire opportunitie had I seene it on that side easily and with hope of good entertainment to haue adioyned my selfe to the Church of Rome after your example But to vse your words as I shall answere at the dreadfull day of iudgement I neuer saw heard or read any thing which did conuince me nay which did not finally confirme me daily more and more in the perswasion that in these differences it rests on our part Wherein I haue not followed humane coniectures from forraine and outward things as by your leaue mee thinkes you doe in these your motiues whereby I protest to you in the sight of God I am also much comforted and assured in the possession of the truth but the vndoubted voice of God in his word which is more to my conscience then a thousand Topicall Arguments In regard whereof I am no lesse assured that if I should forsake it I should be renounced by our Sauiour before God and his Angels then in the holding it be acknowledged and saued which makes me resolue not onely for no hope if it were of 10000. worlds but by the gracious assistance of God without whom I know I am able to doe nothing for no terrour or torment euer to become a Papist You see what a large distance there is betweene vs in opinion Yet for my part I doe not take vpon me to foreiudge you or anie other that doth not with an euill minde and selfe condemning conscience onely to maintaine a faction differ from that which I am perswaded is the right I account we hold one and the same faith in our Lord and Sauiour Iesus Christ and by him in the blessed Trinitie To his iudgement we stand or fall Incomparably more and of more importance are those things wherein wee agree then those wherin we dissent Let vs follow therefore the things of peace and of mutuall edification If any be otherwise minded then he ought God shall reueale that also to him If any be weake or fallen God is able to rai●e him vp And of you good M. Waddesworth and the rest of my Masters and Brethren of that side one thing I would againe desire that according to the Aposiles profession of himselfe you would forbeare to be Lords ouer our Faith nor straightway condemne of heresie our ignorance or lacke of perswasion concerning such things as wee cannot perceiue to be founded in holy Scripture Enioy your owne opinions but make them not Articles of our Faith the analogie whereof is broken as well by addition as subtraction And this selfe same equitie we desire to find in positiue Lawes Orders and Ceremonies Wherein as euerie Church hath full right to prescribe that which is decent and to edification and to reforme abuse so those that are members of each are to follow what is enioyned till by the same authoritie it be reuersed And now to close vp this Account of yours whereof you would haue Doctor Hall and me to be as it were examiners and Auditors Whether it be perfect and allowable or no looke you to it I haue here told you mine opinion of it as directly plainely and freely as I can and as you required fully if not tediously I list not to contend with you about it Satisfie your owne conscience and our common Lord and Master and you shall easily satisfie me Once yet by my aduice review it and cast it ouer againe And if in the particulars you finde you haue taken manie nullities for signifying numbers manie smaller signifiers for greater correct the totall If you finde namely that out of desire of Vnitie and dislike of contention you haue apprehended our diuersities to be more then they are conceiued a necessitie of an externall infallible Iudge where there was none attributed the priuiledge of the Church properly called to that which is visible and mixt If you finde the reformed Churches more charitable the proper note of Chists sheepe The Roman faction more fraudulent and that by publike counsell and of politicke purpose in framing not onely all later writers but some ancient yea the holy Scriptures for their aduantage If you finde you haue mistaken the Protestants doctrine touching inuisibilitie your own also touching vniformitie in matters of Faith If you haue beene misinformed and too ha●●ie of credit touching the imputations laid to the beginners of reformation For as touching the want of Succession and the