yet but the meere-shadow of Presbiterian Government and so are fit for nothing more let them be first instructed and then commanded The Parliament are English men themselves who know the disposition of their own Country-men to be such that they will freely run when they are drawne with the cords of men viz. reason and love but are extreame head-strong in case of compulsion they could never endure the bramble should raigne over them when the Kingdome is taught in the substance of Presbytery its likely the meere shadow Will flie away Thirdly It may be the Parliaments designe may be first to feed the Kingdome with substantials of Religion the finest of the flower the milke and honey of the Land of Canaan viz the great Doctrines of faith towards God and repentance from dead works and untill the time of some proficiency therein the shadow of Discipline may be sufficient the substance whereof is but a meere shadow in comparison of these our late Prelates whilst they so hotly contended for Discipline and government in pretence of suppressing a deformity and multiformity of Heresies and Sects Errour Scandall c. Did destroy and crucifie RELIGION and her children when they bowed the knee to DISCIPLINE crying haile Master and kissed it we hope the Parliament will not permit such a Faction againe Whereas you say The Parliament hath granted in their Propositions a liberty to all sorts of Service and Worship of God an opening a doore to Atheisme to all Religions to Error Scandall Schisme Heresie c. we reply Brethren your language reflects upon your descent and your expressions do disparage your honourable employment as Commissioners of State your pens seeme to be rather steered by the hands of some of the late scandalous Pamphlet writers then of the Scotch Commissioners You callumniate boldly but will any thing stick let 's observe your charge The Parliament you say desires the settlement of a vast deformity or multiformitie of Heresies and Sects and grants a liberty for all sorts of Service and Worship of God yea and the opening a doore to liberty of Errour Scandall Schisme dishonouring God opposing the Truth bindering Reformation and seducing others and all this is aggravated in so much as it is done after a most sacred and solemne League and Covenant to suppresse all these according to the Word of God and the example of the best reformed Churches Brethren two things you should have done before you can make this good you know that Religion and the Covenant requires the suppression of these things according to the Word of â—od and the example of the best reformed Churches First then you should have shewed by the Word of God what are these Errors Heresies Scandals c. which you say the Parliament desires a settlement of Secondly You should have proved the methods and waies the rules and directions of the Word of God for the suppression of these and the Parliaments practice in opposition to that and then put it unto the judgement of ingenious men to determine the case have you done this in the eye of the Kingdome before whom you have slandered the Houses of Parliament if not were you not Commissioners of State we would tell you more plainly your deserts but for the present we say no more but this If any man among you seeme to be Religious and bridleth not his tongue much more his pen but deceiveth his owne soule this mans Religion is in vaine Be it known unto you that we verily beleeve that the things you speake of much more the toleration of them and most of all the setling the same are the first-borne of abominations unto our present Parliament and in the meane while we clearely discerne that while you pretend to plead with such imparalleld zeale against Errours Heresie c. you sticke not to abuse the repute and blemish the good name of a whole representative Kingdome at once violating the most plaine evident and obvious rules shall we say of Christianity yea of common justice and honesty and therefore we tell you as you tell the Parliament and take notice of it Certainly 〈…〉 mocked You tell us page 7th that it is far fr 〈…〉 ions that pious and peaceable men should be troubled because in every thing 〈◊〉 cannot conforme themselves to Presbyterian Government for you say you did never oppose such an indulgenâ—e to their Persons as is agreeable to the Word of God may stand with the publique peace and is not destructive to the Order and Government of the Church yet you do from your soules aâ—hor such a generall and vast toleration as is exprest in the Proposition c. Who shall judge of pious and peaceable men in England the Parliament of England or the Scotch Commissioners Againe who shall determine what kind of iudulgence is agreeable to the Word of God may stand with the publique peace and is not destructive to the Order and Government of the Church established in England the Parliament of England or the Scotch Commissioners what meane you by indulgence to their Persons such a kind of indulgence of their persons as pious and peaceable men may have in Spaine Rome Turkie among even Infidels themselves or of a better consideration If we may plough with your owne heifer we may quickly expound your riddle you would not have a toleration of any Sectaries and we see who they are by your large Schedule page 12 Anabaptists Antinomians Arminians Familists Erastians Brownists Separatists Libertines Independents Nullifidians Seekers and the new Sect of Shakers can any man in the least degree withstand your Presbytery and not be rankt among these Sectaries except the Episcopalians for which it seemes we shall have a toleration Cum privilegio Scotico Brethren we are not yet baptized into the spirit of Scotch Presbytery there we are Anabaptists we cannot submit unto the Lawes thereof there we are Antinomians holding that we have power and liberty of will therein here wee are Arminians neither doe wee judge it sinfull though we should act contrary to your Presbytery there we are Familists perhaps we judge that there is not so plaine and cleare a Forme of Church-government and Rule of Discipline to be found out in the word of God as some do suppose and therefore do hold that Christian Magistrates may establish such a discipline it being not contrary to the word of God as they shall judge meet and that we ought to submit unto it here we are Erastians and yet wee judge that we ought to come out of Babylon and decline corrupt and superstitious worshipping of God there we are Brownists and Separatists judging our selves free from receiving the law of Church government from the Scotch Oracle here we are Libertines neither will we depend upon your judgements as infallible here we are Independents extreamly doubting your judgements therein not questioning our salvation though we have no faith therein here we are Nullifidians being extreamly in the dark
not understanding your wayes here we are Seekers And if the Lord in mercy doe not afford us more liberty and indulgence in the quiet enjoyments of our priviledges and interests in things Civill and Religious then for ought we see you would afford us we may be quickly reckoned amongst the new Sect of Shakers you would make us tremble under your hands from which condition Libera nos Domine Brethren such Sectaries in the sense delivered the Parliament may well desire to tollerate but your assertion of the Parliaments sinfull tolleration of the Sectaries of your Catalogue is a scandalous false an unbrotherly aspersion For have they not in terminis declared against the tollerating of Popery Masse Service book it is not the property of a brother to be the accuser of brethren That next Religion wherein you differ in judgment from the Propositions is concerning the interest and power of the Crowne being obliged by our solemne League and Covenant Allegeance and duty of Subjects not to diminish but to support the Kings just power and greatnesse You should have added In our severall places and callings a passage in the Covenant which ever and anone doth flye in your faces Next you come to the question Wherein the Kings Regall authority and just power doth consist and you answer it in the first place that it is chiefly in making enacting laws and upon this principle you document the Parliament of England about the Kings power in making laws c. What have you to do to busie your selves in such things which meerly concerns another Kingdome but since you thus take upon you confident we are beyond your commission we desire you in your next to declare faithfully the power of the King in making laws in the kingdome of Scotland how valid his negative voice is there But in the mean while why doe you professe Ignorantium facti juris alieni and yet interpose in the power of making laws in the Kingdome of England Brethren remember that golden passage in the covenant Our places and callings and doe not stretch your selves beyond your line It is not the property of wise men to bee medling Againe if the King hath a negative voice in making lawes hath he not the same in repealing lawes And if so farewell Presbytery and Directory In the next place you intermeddle with the Militia of the kingdome to that wee pray you hands of would we suffer you to feize upon that for ought we know the honour of Englishmen would bee quickly contained in the Court complement Your humble servants and the Catholick titles and tearms of Dominus dominantium and servus servorum would soon be divided between the Scot and the Englishman Englishmen are better soldiers than to part with their weapons and Militia of their kingdom and suffer another nation to intermeddle with that We have not the patience to admit of a word of discourse of your medling with the Militia of England The next thing you complain of under the head of Commission and excesse is the standing of our Armies to that you tell us You thinke fit that neither King nor Parliament ought to keep up an Army in the field when the war is ended You give your judgement before it is demanded we think fit you should forbeare intermedling untill it appears within your vocation and calling according to the solemne League Covenant Brethren we do not interpose nor busie our selves about Your Army in Scotland or affairs particularly belonging unto that kingdome neither do we envie your mountains but are contented with our own vallies As for Our Army they are only Englands charge why should they bee the Commissioners of Scotlands trouble It is very true the charge of the Army is great but whether Needlesse as you tell us the judgement of our Pâ—rliament and not the Scotch Commissioners must determine for us a hand of mercy to our distressed kingdome did at first gather them a hand of power hath hitherto been with them and a hand of providence hath kept them together to preserve the interest of their native country intire whole from the violence of those that would be fingring therewith And though it be true that the sea is our Bulwark by Gods mercy from forrain enemies which are beyond it yet you know very well that our late wars have been fomented by our own natives for sometimes brethren prove unnaturall and Paul joynes his perills among false brethren with his perils at sea If you doe indeed condole the griefs of the people from the charges of our Army you will take heed that wee be not troubled with any from forrain parts for confident we are the whole kingdome will never abide it no though they should enter into a soleme League and Covenant that they would only help us to disband our Armies and ease the people of the oppressions therof You tel us If the Houses had according to your earnest desires of the 3 of March 1644. when they model'd their Army made choice of such officers as were known to be zealous of the reformation of Religion and of that uniformity with both kingdomes are obliged to promote and maintain c. and put in execution their severall declarations as that of the 20. of Sept. 1643. as also the 15. of Feb. 1644 ordering all Officers under Sir Thomas Fairfax to take the Covenant c. it would have prevented a world of inconveniencies and evils which have ensued upon the neglect thereof We judge ourselves to have cause to bind the sacrifice with cords to the hornes of the Altar and praise the name of the Lord for his wisdome and goodnes in modelling the Army even as he did though contrary to the advice of the Scotch Commissioners yet we plead not at all for any errour or evill of judgement or practice either of the Army or any therein 'T is true we heare of all religions in this Army and of no religion in another of error of judgement here of error of practice elsewhere of quartering upon the countrey by this Army of quartering the countrey by another of officers and soldiers that through scruple of conscience cannot tâ—ke the Covenant in this Army and of officers and soldiers that can both take the Covenant with hands lifted up to the most high God and yet strike hands with death and hell by cursing and swearing plundring and stealing in another Army It is no pleasure to us to dabble in the mire of another Army neither can we endure that the Scotch Commissioners should bespatter our Army If the Houses had according to your earnest desire the 3. of March 1644 when they model'd their Army made choice of such officers as were known to be zeâ—lous of the reformation of religion and of that uniformity which both kingdoms are obliged to promote and maintain that is if they had made choice of such Officers
as you would have preferred viz. zealous hardy men out of the north whose judgement about the Covenant and Treaty had concurred so as to introduce your nation to be one of the Estates of this kingdome to have a negative voyce in all things concerning our welfare who would have pleaded your co-intrest with the Parliament of England in the Militia of the kingdome disposall of places and offices of tâ—ust in all our particular and proper goods we are confident with you that it would have prevented a world of inconveniences upon the King and his party his Armies in the fields strong Holds and Garrisons which have ensued upon the neglect thereof The last thing you speak unto under this head is viz the interest of the Crowne that is touching the conferring titles of honour which you call the Flower of the Crown and wherewith Kings doe use to recompence the vertue and merits of their good subjects c. Did you not formerly consent to the making voyd of the Titles of honour confer'd by the great Seale after it was carried away from the Parliament have you better considered of the matter and changed your thoughts touching the vertues and merits of those who have assisted the King against the Parliament Is this your zeale against the common enemy of both Kingdoms according to the solemn league and Covenant Is this that just and condign pnnishment wherunto you engaged your selves to bring them what that might be rewarded for their helping the King against the Parliament as we heare your Secretary was as is supposed for his care and pains in this your writings against the Houses with titles of honour Having finished the particulars of the second head viz the interest of the Crown you fall upon the third the union and joynt interest of the kingdoms where you complain First That the Houses have omitted the Covenant in these Propositions We have given you an answer to that once and again you do so tosse the covenant that it 's thought you will quickly bring it out of date the word Covenant is your Shiboleth but we can both pronounce and nnderstand it as well as your selves Secondly you adde that the Houses have rejected all that concerns-unity and uniformity in matters of Religion It is but a temporary Suspension because of their former successesnes your own answer for your rejecting propositions pressing for a treaty contrary to your promise and not a rejection of those things Did they presume the religion of Scotland in the principles thereof to justifie your practices in abusing our Parliament as your Papers have done they would have reason enough to reject all that concerns unity and uniformity with you in matters of religion But confident we are as they have no reason so the least jealousie thereof is not within the confines of their thoughts Next you complaine of the omission of severall things even in heapes all which you summon up in this That generally throughout the Propositions all expressions of joynt interest are left out If by joynt interest you meane such a joynt interest as is according to the expresse letter of the solemn League and Covenant and treaties between the Kingdoms we cannot presume such an omission though there may be a prudentiall suspension at present of some particulars thereof though we know no such thing Secondly if by Joynt Interest you mean such a Joynt Interest as you would extort from the solemn League and Covenant and treaties between the Kingdomes as the sence thereof which was never intended nay abhor'd As that the Militia by sea and land in the Kingdoms of England Ireland the power of making peace and war with forraine States the Kings consent in the enacting of any law the conferring of great places of honour and trust making of Peers of Parliament conferring of titles of honour what revenue the King is to have in England Ireland and how to be disposed c. cannot be transacted and concluded upon without the joynt advice and confent of the kingdome of Scotland If such a kinde of sense meaning only of the solemn League Covenant and treaties between the kingdoms will serve your turn and the expres letter of these is too short for your satisfaction the Parliament of England have reason upon reason that generally throughout the propositions all expressions of joynt interest should be left out Yea if we may be understood in the observation of our due distance from and obliged duty to them we obtest them by all their vowes covenants promises by all their votes orders ordinances by all their declarations proclamations protestations by all our bloud blowes battles by all our vexations contributions and taxations by all our monies horse and plate by all our servants apprentizes and journey-men by all our wounds sores and scares by all the rents rapes and ruines by all the plunderings burnings and sackings by all our widdows fatherles and friendles by all our sayings doings and sufferings for our kingdomes interests by the sad effects of tyranny and slavery by the great trust committed to their charge by our confidence of their faithfulnes therein by the honour of English men by the stain of their posterity kindred and progeny by their principles of humanity justice and integrity by their great account at the last day that they doe preserve our rights lawes interest our priviledges liberties and immunities intire distinct and whole and that they neither sell them give them nor grant them nor yet suffer them to be sold given or granted by any compact Covenant or Treaty as we are most assured hitherto they have not to any Nation Kingdome or people and more particularly that in all their transactions between themselves and our Scotch brethreÌ„ they maintain the distinct interest of England without confounding it with the interest of Scotland and that in all their neighbourly friendly and brotherly Associations for the jojnt benefit of both Kingdomes they never associate in that which is their several distinct and particular rights Whereas you complain that formerly Propositions of both kingdoms were drawn up together in one body now for separating the interests of the kingdoms the Propositions for England are drawne up apart upon the observation whereof with other things you desired a conference and it would not be granted We reply First what mean you by one body mean you the Commissioners of both Kingdoms making that up one body or secondly the Parliament of England in conjunction with the Scotch Commissioners doubtles we cannot thinke that the Parliament of England and Scotch Commissioners were ever known yet to be one body we hope that never such a monster shall be seene in England neither can we imagine that the Commissioners of both kingdomes in one body were to draw up propositions for peace therefore mean you thirdly that this one body was not made up of men but of propositions
2. Were they not impositions as well when you did concurre to send propositions as when you did dissent The King may have some just desires to move for the Crowne and for himself as that be may have his Revenues c. 1. It is true the Crowne aod Revenues goe together in England however it is in Scotland neither doe we presume any propositions shall be sent by the Parliament in prejudice to the Crown or Crown-Revenues both being for the Kingdoms honour and safety 2. Was not this likewise as good a reason when you did concurre Your next reason A personall Treaty with the King is the best way to beget a mutuall confidence c. 1. That is as the Treaty may be managed and so may propositions as instructions be given 2. And was not this likewise as good a reason when you did concurre Your last reason is this we cannot expect his Majesty will grant in terminis whatsoever propositions shall be sent unto c. neither will the Houses of Parliament give full power to commissioners to make altrrations as they shall see cause He is to passe Bills in terminis why not propositions being matter for Bils Confident we are had he wrested the sword out of the Parliaments hands as it is wrested out of his hands they should have had such propositions as he would have judged fit for traitors it may be the axe in stead of the halter heading in stead of hanging for traitors hath he proclaimed them without recalling it to this day 2. Was not this also as valid when you did concurre as now it is Thus your weighty reasons for the thing A personall Treaty vanish into the aire Let us now examine your reasons for the place at London for there lies the emphasis of your motion and perhaps designe 1. Propositions have been often essayed without successe and therefore the personall Treaty must be at London 2. The Kings removall from London was the cause of the warre and his returne or presence may be a remedy Ergo the Treaty must be at London Thirdly in a personall Treaty things may be mutually debated for that is the summe of your reason Ergo the Treaty must be at London Fourthly the King may have some desires to move for the Crowne Ergo the Treaty must be at London Fifthly a personall Treaty is the best way for giving and receiving satisfaction Ergo the Treaty must be at London Sixthly it cannot be expected his Majesty will grant all the propositions neither will the Houses give full power to their Commissioners to make alterations as they see cause upon debate Ergo the Treaty must be at London Brethren we shall not so much prejudge the weaknesse of our countreymen as to shew them the difficiencie of these starved suggestions Englishmens eyes are in their heads and they need no spectacles to see mountaines only we would gladly know your meaning by the advantage of the Crown and motions of the Crown which ever and anon you hint out to us if our judgements faile us not as possibly they may for we are no Statesmen but as the late times have made us all enquire into State-cases we say if our judgements be right both the King and the Crown and all things belonging unto them as such are for the Kingdomes advantage and for no personall interest whatsoever in prejudice of that we have had many things which they call Aphorismes divulged amongst us as that THE SAFETY OF THE PEOPLE IS THE CHIEFEST LAW THE KING IS ABOVE EVERY PARTICULAR MAM BUT LESSE THAN THE WHOLE KINGDOME that THE KING IS THE KINGDOMES BUT THE KINGDOME IS NONE OF THE KINGS except with a distinction and twenty more such sayings which are our ordinary discourse and we thinke there is a great deale of equity justice and reason in them and a light to instruct us to give unto the Magistrates their due and to preserve our selves from tyranny and by these things were we rallied by the Parliament together to maintain the truth of these sayings and we have paid for our learning it hath cost us deare and we would not quickly forget all like dunces untill we are knockt into our former lessons your talking so much of the advantage of the Crown and motions for the Crown seems to us to interfier with these sayings Having exhibited your reasons such as they are for a personal Treaty you fall into invectives with the Parliament of England thus If they were esteemed enemies to the Parliament and peace of the kingdome who advised the King to withdraw from his Parliament what estimation will the world have of them who will not suffer him to returne to his Parliament when he offers to cast himselfe into their arms The plaine English whereof is this to insinuate into the people that the Parliament of England being against the Kings treating at London are the Kingdomes enemies and so to stirre up the people against their Parliament Is this like Commissioners of State Would you suffer such things in your owne Kingdome Is this according to your solemne League and Covenant Is this your brotherly love your zeale for the parliament of England and the interest thereof We say no more but better is a neighbour that is near than a brother that is farre off But secondly if the Parliament be the Kings enemy because they will not admit of a personal Treaty at London what were you when you refused the same things Doe not you give a just occasion for the Cavaliers to call you Enemies all-a-row Having dispatcht the first particular in your method viz. The readiest meanes for a lasting peace which you say is a personal Treaty with the King at London you fall to the second viz. The consideration of the propositions which are to be the foundation of peace and therein First to consider and remove the differences which you divide into three heads which are 1. Matters of Religion 2. The interest of the Crown 3. The union and joynt concernment of the Kingdomes First you begin with that of Religion and hint it in one of your biting parenthesis as a most flagitious neglect that it is put by the Parliament amongst the last of these new propositions 1. You know Brethren that that may be primum in extentione which is ultimum in executione we use to make our hedge before we plant our garden 2. Religion was not the first of those propositions which were sent to New-Castle with your consent as appeares in print but now you are more zealous than before 3. The best sort of English-men loves Religion in the bottome to have it in designe as well as pretence to make Religion the end and not the means unto their intentions 4. We have generally observed that the emptiest zelots are the greatest advocates for the circumstances of Religion time and order mighty matters in some mens eyes You commend the King