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Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
law_n	faith_n	justification_n	work_n	32,098	5	6.7418	4	true

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A84760	A sober answer to an angry epistle, directed to all the publick teachers in this nation, and prefixed to a book, called (by an antiphrasis) Christs innocency pleaded against the cry of the chief priests. Written in hast by Thomas Speed, once a publick teacher himself, and since revolted from that calling to merchandize, and of late grown a merchant of soules, trading subtilly for the Quakers in Bristoll. Wherein the jesuiticall equivocations and subtle insinuations, whereby he endeavours secretly to infuse the whole venome of Quaking doctrines, into undiscerning readers, are discovered; a catlogue of the true and genuine doctrines of the Quakers is presented, and certaine questions depending between us and them, candidly disputed, / by [brace] Christopher Fowler & Simon Ford, [brace] ministers of the Gospel in Reding,	Fowler, Christopher, 1610?-1678.; Ford, Simon, 1619?-1699.	1656 (1656)	Wing F1694; Thomason E883_1; ESTC R207293	63,879	81

Apostle meanes not such an one as expounds and applies the written Word but either one that preached up the Jewish ceremonies according to the Letter which were the vaile that hid the Gospell instead of Christ the substance of them or else that preached the duties of the Law for justification and so your generation are the Ministers of the Letter who preach up a righteousnesse of workes under the notion of Christ in us to the decrying and blaspheming of the righteousnesse of Faith in Christs person without us And you your selfe speake scornefully enough of it though covertly p. 55. of your Book as of a righteousnesse beyond the Stars and a far off from us so that we feare your heart is the same with them though you be more wary in your expressions In a word if we mistake you you must impute it to your darknesse and ambiguity of expression which you affect in this Epistle that you may like a Carp by running your head in the mud of uncouth and ambiguous language avoid the Net of a just discovery and confutation and to your undertaking which being the justification of the people called Quakers we are necessitated to interpret you by what we know of them To your thirteenth Article concerning the unprofitablenesse Sect. 44 of talking and professing Christ in Orthodox notions except we witnesse we will suppose you understand find and feele by experience the life of Christ in us We would hope you mean as you say and no more and if so we mean and say as you do that it will not availe us or our hearers to talk of Christs dying for us and our being justified by his righteousnesse except we receive a spirit of holinesse from him and be taught by the grace that appeareth to us to deny all ungodlinesse and worldly lusts and to live soberly righteously and godly in this present world But we Tim. 2. 12. must tell you that we do not make our mortification of sin or resurrection to newnesse of life or any of the fruits growing upon those roots though we could be as holy as ever any Saint was upon earth any part of our righteousnesse in the presence of God but in matter of justification we renounce them all as abominable and filthy rags drosse and dung to the righteousnesse which is of God by faith and desire to be found in him alone who Isa 64. 6. Phil. 3. 8 9. Jer. 23. 5. Gal. 2. 16. is the Lord our righteousnesse We say with the Apostle Knowing that a man is not justified by the workes of the Law but by the faith of Jesus Christ even we have beleived in Christ that we might be justified by the faith of Christ and not by the workes of the Law Whether you be of this judgment or no we desire to know more fully in your next Those of your generation are not as we shall shew anon from their own papers which speak out what we see you have a mind to conceale In your fourteenth Article you confesse that you both publish Sect. 45 and practise an unmannerly disrespect of all persons in which because you scruple swearing we would as well as we may credit you without an Oath And that you publish and practise it as truth we will beleive But Omne simile non est idem as you may very well know Many of your quaking doctrines as you colour them are very like truth But we have in part shewn they are not what they shew for and shall do more ere vve have done vvith you Mean while vve will a little dispute it vvith you Whether Religion destroy civility and good manners For our parts vve humbly conceive that the fifth Commandement is not yet repealed that commands us to honour our Fathers and Mothers And Solomon vve suppose walked by that Law vvhen he bowed to his Mother 1 King 2. 29. Nor do vve dare condemne the bowing of Abraham before the Sons of Heth Gen. 23. 7. 12. Nor do vve think that cursed Canaanites are more capable of civill honour and respect then civill Magistrates And how far the examples of Luke dedicating his Book to the most excellent Theophilus Lu. 1. 3. Pauls Titles of King Agrippa and most Noble Festus and Act. 26. 7. 25. 1 Pet. 3. 6. Sarahs calling Abraham Lord practised in the old and commended in the new Testament vvill justifie the practise of those vvho bestow Titles upon men according to their quality from that respecting of persons vvhich the Apostle James condemnes it Jam. 5. 1. may be your own second thoughts will better inform you Surely the Apostle James doth not deny the distinction of Magistrates and others in their Seates and Benches We do not find the Apostles when they were called before Magistrates justle with them for their Chaires and Cushions or set themselves down cheek by joule with them upon the Bench. Nor was 1 King 2. 19. Solomon to be charged with respecting persons for calling for a Chair for his Mother Bathsheba and not for all others as well that came to present Petitions to him For a close we are perswaded that this levelling humour never lasted longer in any person then till he himself got into the Chair of Magistracy We know no Prince in Europe that ever King'd it with that state as John of Leyden did when he acted his part at Munster and yet he and his Generation were as much against respecting of persons a while before as any of our Quakers at this day In a word we are no friends to that great distance which meer wealth makes in the esteem of the world between man and man especially between godly poore and ungodly rich men And we hope we can say in the sincerity of our hearts that we know no godly poor man whom we would not and do not prefer in our esteems and respects as we have opportunity to shew it before any wealthy men that are not so But where the goodness is equall in both we suppose the modesty of the inferiour will not suffer him to be agrieved if his Superiour in any sort sit above him or go before him nor do we think it any token of humility which is one of the most eminent graces in true Saints for such an one to justle for the wall with another to whom in common courtesie and civility founded upon the Law of God Nature and Nations it is more due We shall not dispute against you the consequences of this Sect. 46 your Doctrine if it should take place as they touch our selves Let it follow as you say that we shall hereby be stripped of the Titles of Doctors or Divines we perswade our selves as well-pleasing as you think they are to us we have learned of our Master to be contented to be made of no reputation if God think fit to abase us among those with whom we have to do that vve should receive as little respect from others as vve do from

seeing we are told Heb. 6. 17. that God himself allowes himself to sweare for those ends for which an Oath is legally used by men viz. for confirmation of his word Q. 5. Whether without swearing upon the call of a Magistrate all mens estates be not as liable to prejudice as the maintenance of the Ministry And whether cheating companions will not be as prone to take the same advantage against other men in case there was no judiciall Oathes required as it seems by the Authors confession Hereticks would against poor Ministers except we must take it for granted that every mans yea yea and nay nay is as a sufficient security in this case of testifying the Truth judicially as a solemn Oath Q. 6. Whether Abraham did well or ill to require an Oath of his Servant Gen. 24. 3. Jacob of Joseph 50. 5. Nehemiah of the Jewes Neh. 13 25. Or if you evade these examples as being before Christ whether the Apostle Paul did well or ill to sweare Gal. 1. 20. c. In a word this Doctrine of the unlawfulnesse of swearing in Sect. 14 any case is a fragment of the old Germane Anabaptists a Generation of men against whom the Magistrates saw sufficient cause to dispute with the Sword of Justice for being publick enemies to humane Society and it concernes you to take heed that the Magistracy of England may never have the like provocation to follow their example against their genuine issue the Quakers and other Sectaries among us But least you should seem justly to charge us with swearing our selves and teaching others to do so contrary to the command of Christ we must in the close let you know how we sweare and allow others to do so and what swearing we forbeare our selves and preach downe among them in obedience to Christs command We must tell you that being lawfully called to witnesse to truth upon Oath before a Magistrate we shall not our selves refuse to sweare that is according to the forme required in Law to call God to witnesse that we lye not But in our communication or ordinary discourse we desire both we and our hearers may keep to our yea yea and nay nay as Christ commands and not to sweare at all because we dare not take or allow others to take the name of God in vaine And this we suppose to be all that our Saviour intends in that Prohibition that in our communication we should not sweare at all If any one be not convinced hereof by what we have said let him reconcile our Saviours Prohibition to the precepts and examples before pleaded some other way and Phyllida solus habeto He shall gaine the cause in this point Your following three Articles viz. 6. 7 8. are all concerning Sect. 18 Tythes and forced maintenance wherein the summe and upshot of all shewes your charity to the poore Ministery that you would faine have them reduced to the condition of the unjust Steward that is either to work or beg For working we suppose in such a Generation as God hath now east us into we shall not want whilest besides the ordinary attendance upon our charges which the Apostle Paul accounted a work and a great one too 1 Thes 5. 13. Eph. 4. 12. and such as none will be too forward to intrude into that sufficiently understands the weight of it 2 Cor. 2. 16. The work of a Builder a Sower 1 Cor. 3. 10. Mar. 4. 13 1 Cor. 3. 6. 2 Tim. 2. 6. Jo. 21. 26. Heb. 13. 15. 2 Tim. 2. 3 P. 40. a Planter an Husbandman a Shepheard a Watohman a Souldier We are called upon to answer every idle rayling Paper that you and your companions send us But seeing you account this no work it seemes you would have us worke with our hands or beg An hard Law for men that have been bred in a way of humane Learning which elsewhere you seem to allow some use in the World it may serve to tile the house you confesse and in that place you are content it shall stand But surely should this Law of yours take place that those that have been bred to study must have no subsistence but by handy work or begging I feare the next Generation would yeild few Tiles to keep the house in repaire so that it would quickly drop through and you as well as others would not be able to lye dry in it For who will give his Children ingenuous Education at the Schooles of Learning and set them there to spend the flower of their youth in acquiring humane literature when the highest preferment they could expect after ten or twenty yeares Study would be either to work or beg would not every one conclude it better to set their Sons to some Trade or other in their youth that so at the end of seven yeares they might be able to get a livelyhood at their fingers ends or turne them a begging in their Childhood rather then maintain them twice seven yeares at Schoole and University to come thence to be preferred to a certain beggary as being the only lot of the two like to befall them who are utterly to learne to work having never been bred thereunto But the measure you mete unto us is harder yet You that will have us work or beg will not allow us to carry so much as a Purse to put our Wages in when we have earned it nor a Scrip to put our Almes in when we have begged it but to live as the Sparrowes do that digest one meales meat in seeking where to get another I suppose should God call us to that condition either by an extraordinary command as Christ did his Lu. 10. 7. Apostles in the place you quote or by an extraordinary providence as we suspect in case you can compasse your fifth Monarchy it would befall us we should not want faith to trust him who feeds the Sparrowes and clothes the Lillies whether in a way of working as we are able or asking the charity of others when disabled We have learned a distich of learned and honest Musculus which he made when the fury of the Germane Anabaptists your Predecessors turned him out of his Pulpit and maintenance and enforced him to weave and dig for a subsistence for himself and his Family Est Deus in Coelis qui providus omnia curat Credentes nunquam deseruisse potest Which for the sake of your Brethren who whatsoever you are are no great friends to Latine we shall english A God in Heaven lives whose care extends To all and therefore will not faile his friends But we question yet further whether you that would require Sect. 19 us to follow precisely the Apostolicall example in that Chapter will not yet go further then this in your rigorous exactions Suppose we should work without a Purse and beg without a Scrip at your command what security will you give us that you will not make us work and beg barefoot too For if your Text

whether you vvill submit your Revelations to this Touchstone or no If so you yeild the question If not then whatever Commands or Prohibitions you receive in the way of revelation you must obey vvhether agreeing or disagreeing to the written Law of God And then how far the examples of Abraham offering up his Son and Phinehas executing vengeance yea and vvhen time serves Ehuds message from God to Eglon may be witnessed in you as you speak we know Judg. 3. 19 not and shall pray vve never may by experience Q. 9. Whether the Scriptures do not establish it selfe as the rule of Faith in referring all pretenders to new light to the Law and the Testimony and telling us expresly That if they speak not according to this word it is because there is no light in Isa 20. 8. them And whether the light in you and in your companions be not darknesse that will not undergo this tryall Q. 10. Whether the phrases of walking in the Law of the Lord keeping Gods Testimonies taking heed to a mans way according to Gods word not wandering from Gods Commandements Ps 119 1 2. 9 10. 21. 30. 35. 51. 102. 110. 133. 157. laying Gods Jugdments before him going in the path of Gods Commandements not declining from Gods Law not departing from Gods Judgments not erring from his Precepts ordering his steps in Gods word not declining from his testimonies Are not cleare evidences that David made the written word that then was his Rule And you owne Davids Rule for yours p. 8. Q. 11. Whether you think in your conscience that Deut. 5. 32 33. doth not convincingly prove the Scripture to be the Saints rule The words are Yee shall observe to do therfore as the Lord your God hath commanded you and before vve have the repitition of the written Law You shall not turn aside to the right hand or to the left c. Your answer in your book is in summe P. 7. that all the Scripture was not then written But did not Moses therein establish as much as was then written for the rule the Saints of those times were to walk by Besides these words immediatly refer to the Morall Law before repeated in the same Chapter And will you exclude that from being the Saints rule as well as other Scriptures Then indeed there vvill be no duty or sin but as a man thinks Q. 12. Whether you deale honestly with Calvin in that P. 20. Scripture Eph. 2. 20. whilest you tell your Readers that he saith in Terminis That the Apostle doth in that Scripture intend Jesus Christ to whom the Prophets and Apostles did beare witnesse Whereas Calvin saith expresly It is without doubt that the foundation in this place is taken for the Doctrine of the Prophets and Apostles And therefore Paul teacheth that the Quin fundamentum hic pro doctrina sumatur minime dubium est Et itaque docet Paulus fidem ecclesiae in hac doctrina debere esse fundatam Calv. in l. Churches faith ought to be founded on this Doctrine And there is not any mention at all of those vvords in Calvin vvhich you quote from him To say the truth vve much vvonder how you could have the brazen face to father a saying upon Calvin vvhich he never said till vve looked upon Marlorate whose mis-quotation or rather the fault of his Printer it seemes deceived you for there vve find among other things there ascribed to Calvin this passage you mention But it concerned a man of your acutenesse not to have taken up a report from another vvhen Calvins vvorks are so common in every Shop and Study that vvith a little paines more you might have conversed vvith the Originall Author whence Marlorate makes his collections But it seemes you vvere vvilling to snatch at any thing that seemed to support your cause vvhere ever you found it And yet you shewed no part of ingenuity in your usage of Marlorate himself vvho together vvith that passage vvhich you quote and under the same note by which he distinguisheth Calvins vvords cites Calvin point blank against you saying that the Apostle shewes in that place how the Ephesians vvere made fellow Citizens vvith the Saints Nempe si fundati sint in Prophetarum Apostolorum Doctrinâ to wit If they be founded on the Doctrine of the Prophets and Apostles These words and others to the same purpose immediatly precede your owne quotation vvhich renders your dis-ingenuity the more culpable as shewing a vvilfull designe of abusing so reverend a name to delude your Readers Q. 13. In a vvord tell us ingenuously Whether we must or must not beleive the Doctrines which the Scriptures lay downe upon their owne authority If vve must vvhy do you quarrell at those that call them the rule ground foundation of faith seeing every intelligent man will tell you that it is the same thing to beleive the Doctrines of the Scripture upon the Scriptures authority and to make the Scriptures the ground rule foundation of faith If vve must not then tell us what superadded to the Scriptures owne Authority renders their Doctrines more credible We observe the Papists state this question as you do But they vvill answer us ingenuously That they beleive the Scriptures because the Church hath confirmed them And the Socinians are of your mind also but they deale fairely too and speak out That they will beleive the Scriptures as far as reason votes with them Would you speak out vve doubt you must confesse you are very neer these last in your judgment Why do you not tell us plainly that you beleive the Doctrines laid down in the Scripture as far as the light within you concurs with them And then vve shall know vvhat you mean in denying the Scriptures to be the rule and ground of faith Viz. That as much as pleaseth you you vvill beleive and vvhat dislikes you shall be cashiered as an old Declarative or an Almanack out of date as some of your Cater-cosins the Familists have blasphemously called the Bible Q. 14. Lastly Whether God vvill not judge every man vvho lives within the sound of the Gospell by the written word If not what meanes the Apostle Paul when he saith that as many as have sinned in the Law shall be judged by the Law in the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my Gospel Rom. 2. 12. 16. And seeing we are upon this subject give us leave to enquire yet a little further what are those Books out of which the dead shall be judged and whence one day God will draw the rule of his proceedings in the day of Judgment as you may find Apoc. 2. 12. If God vvill judge us out of the written word after death surely we are not to be blamed if we study that Statute-Law and labour to conforme our beleif and practise thereunto whilest we live which must judge us when we dye Or else we pray you

to conceit the case altered in their own concernments from what they rigorously pronounce concerning others We have not yet quite done with you and therefore we must Sect. 84 crave your patience a little longer whilest we ask you a few plaine Questions upon this subject now at hand Q. 1. Sir you will admit of no interpretations of Scripture we entreat you therefore to tell us Christ saith he is the true Vine and his Father an Husbandman Jo. 15. 1. Are they properly so or Metaphorically If you say metaphorically or improperly you interpret for the Texts expresse words are not I am a metaphoricall Vine and my Father a metaphoricall Husbandman If you say properly you blaspheme Q. 2. Christ saith I am the door Jo. 10. 9. You beleive you Epistle p. 7. say that Christ meanes as he speakes and therefore you deny our meanings and interpretations as needlesse Is Christ then that which we in propriety of speech call a door If you say he is in a spirituall sence a door who interprets now Do we offend if we interpret this Text of a spirituall door to a mysticall building and you though you give the same sense not so Q. 3. Nay what say you further to those two places of Paul and James which in words flatly contradict one another Yee see saith James that by workes a man is justified and not by faith onely Ja. 2. 24. But we know saith Paul That a man is not justified by the workes of the Law but by the faith of Jesus Christ Gal. 2. 16. You will allow vve hope that the Scriptures are truth though they be not the word of God Now truth and truth contradict not each other so that vve must find a different sense from the contexts of both places wherein the one affirmes that works justifie not and the other that they do This reconciliation is usually made by our Divines thus St. Paul denies works to constitute any person just before God and James affirmes that workes declare a person just How you without interpretation vvill reconcile them we know not especially when vve consider that you are a greater friend to constitutive justification by workes if you be of the mind of your fellow Quakers then vve believe James was and so are more concerned to study how to come off fairely with Paul then vve Q. 4. And now vve are upon the point of reconciling Scriptures vve shall make you a little more work in this kind Christ saith The Father is greater then I and yet he saith againe I and the Father are one And Paul saith of him That he accounted it no Robbery to be equall with God Phil. 2. 9. The Apostle John saith There are three that heare record in Heaven the Father the Word and the H. Ghost and these three are one Shew us without interpretation how Christ can be equall with the Father without robbery and one with him and yet the Father greater then he how the Father the word and the H. Ghost can be three and yet one And we might here also put you the question that our Saviour put to the Pharisees Mat. 22. 41. How Christ is Davids Son and yet Davids Lord and we suppose with the same successe that you will never be able to Answer us a word if you hold your Principle of denying all interpretations but that your forehead possibly may be harder then the Pharisees Q. 5. What will you say to a Papist but that you owne not the Scripture as a rule of Doctrine which indeed is a quick way of Answering all difficult Texts when he tells you that he finds Transubstantiation in this is my body Is the expression proper or figurative was the bread his body indeed or a Signe of it if you say his body indeed you are a Papist if not you interprete Sir to be short we shall take leave to mind you of these particulars and we have done 1. As to that un-christian passage of yours viz. a righteousnesse beyond the Stars a Righteousnesse far above us as you call the Righteousnesse of Christ in a slighting manner and we have just ground to feare some of those you plead for speake to that purpose in a spighting way we heartily advise you to take heed what you doe that you may not be found in the number of those who by wicked hands labour to pull the Crowne from the Head of Jesus and destroy the very being of Holynesse amongst men for all the workes of such Persons at the best are but beautifull deformities and although they may be highly esteemed amongst men yet they are abomination before the Holy God for our parts we are not ashamed of the Gospell of Christ and have through mercy determined not to know any thing amongst our People but Jesus Christ and him crucified and we judge it a speciall duty in this season the Lord helpe us in it that the more you and your complices doe either wretchedly reflect upon or downe right Blaspheme and speake against that Glorious Righteousnesse the more to exalt and make mention of that Righteousnesse even that only 2. Whereas you say could the Scripture be a rule before it was Scripture We answer the word now written even the selfe same word was the very same and had the same Office viz. to be a Divine ground of faith and rule of life before it was written as for instance Enochs Prophecie quoted by Jude 14. 15 concerning the judge the attendants the Persons to be judged the judgement it selfe the deeds and words for which they are judged is the very same with the written word and Gods word to Abraham Gen 17. 1. I am God al-sufficient waelke before me and be upright is the same with nay is the summe of the written word yet this was spoken foure hundred yeares before a word was committed to writing it being generally agreed upon that Moses was the first holy man that did write by the inspiration of the Holy Ghost Pray Sir tell us what difference was there between the Law as spoken by the mouth of God and afterwards written by the finger of God When Moses being provoked in the businesse of the Golden Calfe had broken the two Tables God commanded him to make two Tables of Stone more and the Text tells us that God did write the very selfe same words that he had written before in the first Tables Exod. 34. 1. the Truth is you doe but trifle in your Quaerie yet we feare you border not far from Blasphemy you nusle up your quaking freinds in their horrid rejecting of the Scriptures to be the rule and so make them listen after inspirations you would make void the word of God through your pretended Revelations and pull that pure and perfect clear Light out of the Firmament of Assembleis that men might follow the ignis fatuus of their darkned minds and deceitfull hearts 3. You quaere Whether our Sermons are infallible and if so why they