{non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} or rather we offer a commemoration of that sacrifice Iâ— S. Chrysâ—stome had beleeved as you now do that the true body of Christ is properly offered and his blood truely shed in the daily sacrifice of the masse he should have corrected his former correction of himself and said what said I we rather offer a memoriall of Christs sacrifice nay rather we offer the very sacrifice it self Christs body and blood and that truely and properly 7. We teach that images may not be set up in churches to worship God by theÌ„ much lesse to worship the images themselvs you on the contrary maintain the erecting censing clothing kissing kneeling before and worshipping of images From which idolatry superstition how fat the church was in Constantines age appears by the canon of the councell of Eliberis the act of Epiphanius the judgement of Eusebius and the joynt testimony of Minutius Felix and Lactantius The 36 canon of the councell of Eliberis is very expresse against images and pictures in churches placuit picturas in ecclesia esse non debere ne quod colitur aut adoratur in parictibus depingatur It seemed good to us or we have determined that no images or pictures be in churches lest that which is worshiped and adored be painted on the walls When S. Epiphanius saw that canon neglected and the law of God violated in that poynt his zeal kindâ—ed within him he tare down a vâ—il rent it in the middle which he found hanging on the church walls at Anablathra because it had on it an image as it had bin of Christ or some saint More over he gave charge to those of that place not to hang up any more such veils against the expresse command of God Eusebius was no better affected to images then Epiphanius for in his epistle to Constantia who desired him to send her an image of Christ he contendeth by many arguments that no true image of Christ may be drawn neither according to his divine nature nor according to his humane not according to his divine because no man hath â—ver seen or can see that not according to his humane because we have learned that his humane nature or form of a servant is â—ingled with or united to the glory of his divine dignity and who will undertake with dead colours to expresse the brightnesse of that glory and dignitie Minutius Felix upon another reason dislikes the dedicating of any image to God put aâ— nos occultare quod credimus si delubra ar as non habemus quod enim simulacrum Deo fingam eum si recte existimes sit dei homo ipse simulacrum Dost thou think that we conceal what we worship because we have no place for images nor altars I pray what images shall I make to God seeing if we judge rightly man himself is Gods image Lactantius is warmer in the cause he concludes peremptorily that religion and images cannot stand together wherefore out of doubt there is no religion where there is an image therefore out of doubt none in your church where there are so many images for if religion be a divine thing and there is nothing divine but in things that are heavenly images therefore are voyd of religion because there can be nothing heaâ—enly in that thing which is of the earth The same Lactantius lib. 2. divinarum institut cap. 2. excludes all images even of the true God as needlesse and superâ—â—uous the image of a man seems then to be needfull when the man himself iâ— away but it is of no use when he is present therefore the image of God is ever superfluous and of no use because his spirit and deity being every where present can never be absent from us You see he layes hard at your images and he endeavours as vehemently to blow out your wax lights They light candles to God as if he were in the dark can he be thought well in his wits who offers candles or wax lights to God for a gift who is the author and giver of all light If this strong breath of Lactantius being but single cannot blow out the lights that burn continually in your churches yet methinks the joynt and conspiring breath of all the fathers assembled in the councell at Eliberis cannot but puff them quite out It is to be forbidden that candles be publikely lighted if any do presume to do otherwise let them keep from the communion In fine to draw the arrow you have put into Constantines bow to the head against the errors and superstitions of your present Romish church prove to me by any good and uncontrolable testimony that publike service in an unknown tongue or masses without communicants or communion of the laity without the cup or making images of the three persons of the Trinity or worshipping images or crosses or selling pardoâ—â— for the release of souls out of purgatory or elevation or circumgestation of the host in pompous procession or praying upon beads or hallowing meddals and Agnus Dei's or blessing salt spittle water c. or christening bells and gallies or going on pilgrimage to the images of Christ our Lady and other saints or whipping themselvs in penance for their own sins or the sins of others or such like customs and fites of your now Romish church were in practice in Constantine his time Prove that the treasury of saints merits and works of supererogation or unwritten traditions in matter of faith or justification before God by inherent righteousnes or any sin in its own natâ—re veniall and not against the law of God but only beside it or esteeming the Apocryphall books of the old testament for canonicall scriptures or equalizing the Latin vulgat translation of the old and new testament to the originalls in Hebrew Greek or seven sacraments properly so called or the Popes infallibitie or his transcendent authority to gratifie or disannull the acts of generall councells to canonize saints to dispence with oaths and vows to depose kings and dispose of their kingdoms or the suspending the effect of the sacrament upon the intention of the priest or accidents without subjects or rats and mice eating Christs body or the putting it in many thousand places at once or any the like assertions of your Romish doctors were any part of Constantines beleef and the day shall be yours In the mean time if as your challenge and the promise of your friends deeply engage you you shall think of a reply to this my answer I require three things of you First that according to our Saviour his rule you mete the same measure to me which I mete to you by setting down my whole answers in my own words that the reader may see what you answer to each particular and what you balk as also how direct and pertinent your replyes shall be Secondly that you be not guilty of that which
of the canon law flat repugnant one to the other but others have done it to my hand and saved me this labour PAR III. Concerning the immutability of divine faith CHALLINGE This one true faith generally preached through the world was not to cease with the Apostles and their immediate hearers but was by Christs promise to continue unchanged to the worlds end For so it is said Mat. 28. 20. I am with you alway unto the end of the world Joh. 14. 26. the comforter whom the father will send in my name he shall teach you all things Answer Neither of these places commeth home to prove that which you intend viz. that the christian faith is to continue unchanged and may not by any addition or detraction be altered Why did you not produce to that purpose Rev. 22. 18 19. I testifie to every man that heareth the words of the prophesic of this book if any man shall add unto these things God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book and Gal. 1. 8 9. but though we or an angel from heaven preach any other gospel unto you then that which you have received let him be accursed Upon which words S. Austin thus paraphraseth whether it be saith he concerning Christor the Church or any thing else which belongeth to faith and our life I will not say if wâ— who are not to be compared to him that said it but if an angel from heaven preach unto you any thing besides that which you have received in the scriptures of the law and the gospel let him be accursed With whom accord St. Hilary St. Cyrill St. Theophilus of Alexandria St. Basil and S. Athanasius St. Hilary I admire thee in this my lord Constantine that thou requirest of us that our faith be restrained to scriptures only S. Cyril of Jerusalem we may not determin or appoint any thing no not the least without the authority of scriptures St. Theophilus of Alexandria it comes from a diâ—ellish instinct to follow the sophisms of meâ—s wits and to conceive any thing to be divine without the authority of scriptures St. Basil the great it is a manifest falling away from faith to bring in to our christian beleef any thing that it not written And S. Athanasius what exceeding folly is it in you to speak things that are not written It is the manner of Marcion and other hereticks not to walk within the bounds of the gospel but to speak out of their private fancies and you Sabellians walking in their steps go about to pervert the unstable by speaking things that are not written But you thought fit to balk those texts of scripture with the fathers glosses upon them and deductions from them though very pertinent to prove the immutability of our christian faith because they have no good meaning to your unwritten traditions As for the two texts you here alledge of Saint Matthew and Saint Iohn they are to singular purpose but not to yours they are two deep wells of salvation out of which we may draw abundance of water of comfort for if Christ be always with us we are always sure of protection if his spirit will reach us all things we shall be sure of instruction But what is this to the imimmutability of our faith or unvariablenesse of the doctrine and sacraments of the church God was always with the chosen of Israel under the law and his spirit taught them all things needfull to salvation yet was the priesthood thereof changed and the law also and a new covenant made upon new conditions and with new promises so it might be also under the gospel if God in his word revealed in scripture had not declared the contrary namely Psal. 1104. the Lord sware and will not repent thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedeck whence the apostle inferreth Heb. 7. 24. this man because he continueth over bath an unchangeable priesthood and 1 Cor. 11. 26. as oft as ye eat this bread and drink this cup ye shall shew the death of the lord till he come that is the second time to wit to judge the quick the dead the lords supper therefore shall continue till we are bid to the marriage supper of the lamb in heaven and Apoc. 14. 6. I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven having the everlasting gospel to preach to them that dwell on the earth and to every nation and kindred and tongue and people if the gospel preached unto us be everlasting no new gospel shall succeed it and if no new gospel no new faith The celestiall lights often turn their shadows and give to the inhabitants of the earth divers denominations of perâ—scii amphiscii and heteroscii but with the father of lightâ— there is no shadow of change Jam. 1. 17. It was true before all time and shall be after all time when heaven and earth shall passe away when the whole world shall be changed into a second chaos and that chaos shall be re-changed into a new world ego Deus non mutor Mal. 3. 6. I am the Lord I change not As God is so it his essence and as his essence is so are his attributes and as his attributes are so is his word and as his word so is our faith grounded upon it immutable Nothing is more unsteady than the needle in a dyall or compasse shaking and quivering continually yet if it be touched with a loadstone and set to the north it resteth unmoveable in like manner though nothing be more variable and unsteady than our assent to mysteries above reason and nature yet if it be touched by the spirit and fixed to the word of God it remaineth unmoveable and the church of Christ ever holding and embracing this faith may truly use the motto of the Phoenix of her age Queen Elizabeth semper eadem always the same PARAG. IV. Concerning the propagation of the christian faith to all ages by pastors and teachers lawfully sent CHALLENGE This divine truth once established to the cud it might continne was to be derived to posteritie not by angels sent to teach particular persons nor by illuminated brethren of Amsterdam still pretending new light but by a continued succession of known visible pastours and bishops lawfully ordained and sent to preach it perpetually in despâ—ght of all new sectaries and novellers whatsoever Answer Of angels sent to particular persons since the time of the apostles and the fathers of the primitive church I read no where but in your golden Legend and for fanatick and phantastick spirits at Amsterdam if any of that mad brood still remain you well know that we build our faith no more upon these illuminated brethren of Amsterdam pretending speciall revelation than upon your inspired fathers of Rome pretending infallible direction and a kind of appropriation of the holy Ghost The differences of the two oâ—â—â—les both bragging of infallible assistance is this they are
Constantinople is equally ranked with him the decree of the councell is that Constantinople should enjoy like priviledges to Rome and the patriarch thereof to be extolled or as the words are magnified etiam in ecclesiasticis even in ecclesiasticall matters Which words are most shamefully corrupted in the canon-canon-law and etiam in ecclesiasticis is turned into non tamen in ecclesiasticis the councell saith even an ecclesiasticall matters your canon alledgeth it yet not in ecclesisticall matters Perhaps the compiler of your canon-canon-law thought it a meritorious work to falsifie a record for the advantage of the see of Rome but to let that passe and nâ—t to cut you out too much work at once I affirm disprove it if you can that never any bishop of Rome obtained the title of universal bishop before Boniface the third his time who got it with much difficultie by the means of Phocas the murtherer of his master and mark it I pray you and glory in it if you please that popery properly so called and Mahumetanism were both bred in one age within a few years one of another PARAG. VIII Touching the second note universalitie CHALLENGE We affirm that the Roman church hath been always catholike viz. universall Answer If you had rub'd up your memory as it seems you have rub'd your forehead you would never let such a catholike falsitie touching the catholike universalitie of your Roman church to have fallen from your pen For it is well known and in part confessed by Alfonsus and others that antiquitie makes little if any mention of sundry particular points which at this day are held amongst you You are not able to produce any kingdom no nor province no nor village no nor hamlet no nor man of note for the space of diverse hundreds of years after Christ which agreed with you in all points of your Tridentine faith or subscribed to the twelve new articles annexed thereunto With what colour or shew of probabilitie can you affirm that the Roman church as you define it to be a company professing the present Roman faith under one visible heâ—d to wit the Pope hath bin always universall or spread over the whole world when it is known to all who know any thing of the church story especially since the division of the christian church into the eastern or Greek the western or Latin church that the eastern or Greek church in circuit as large is not larger than the western never agnized nor doth to this day either your Popes supremacie or your Trent creed and in the western church it self though popery prevail much and spread like a gangren very far especially after the one thousand years when satan was let loose yet was there not any main point of popery established in the western church it self without strong opposition and concestation Even at this day Gods holy name be blessed for it the protestarâ—s in England and Scotland France and Ireland Germany Poland Denmark Swethland the Netherlands and elsewhere if they countervail not in number the popish partie yet they come very neer and now what is become of your brag of universalitie let us now examin your succession PAR. IX Touching the third note succession CHALLENGE The Roman church hath ever had a succession of true bishops and pastours derived from the apostles still teaching c. Answer The third lame leg on which your faith resteth it self is the succession of Roman bishops and pastors which if it were strong and sound yet the patriarchs of Constantinople and Ierusalem and Antiochia and Alexandria do set as good a leg forth for it as your bishop of Rome They produce as uncontroulable a catalogue of bishops and pastours the one succeding the other in their sees as you in the see of Rome and some of them from the apostles themselvs But what if this leg of yours prove a false leg and will double under you to use your owne phrase let the day be yours as now the night of errour and ignorance is if by the same evidence which you bring for your succession we prove not many main defects and maims in it which so deface and confound it that it can be no note or mark of the true church as you make it First notes and marks of any thing ought to be very remarkable and visible and after a sort notorious else they are not notae but ignotae If then the succession of your Romish bishops remain but quessionable such succession questionlesse cannot be a note of the church and is it not questionable and very uncertain when you stick in the very beginning of your catalogue and your skilfullest ushers know not where to rank Clemens in the second or the fourth place When during two and twenty schisms at least in the papacy it was a meeting cast and even lay between the Popes and anti-popes whether were the true successours of Saint Peter When besides many flaws in your catalogue by vacancies for monâ—ths years there was a great chasma or hiatus for almost one hundred years during which time the Popes sate at Avinium left Rome When for one hundred and sixty years together you cannot name me one firm and allowable Pope or such a one as he ought to be your own Genebrard confesteth that fifty of them as I noted before in that time deserved to be termed rather apostaticall and disordered and irregular tâ—aâ— canonicall and apostolicall Baronius gives your succession yet a more terrible blow what was then the face of the Roman church how filthy when as most potent and base queans bare all the sway at Rome changed sees and gave bishopricks at their pleasure and which is most abhominable and not to be named intruded their paramours into Peters chair false bishops whose names are written in the catalogue of Popes only to note and design the times Give me the clew I pray you by which you wind your selâ—s out of this labryinth Eugenius was deposed as schismaticall by the councell of Basit and Amadeus was made Pope in his stead yet afterwards this Eugenius by the favour of princes and a strong hand recovered the Popedom and from him all Popes since reckon Was Eugenius a schismaticall and unlawfull Pope or not If not the generall councell of Basil could not judge of schism and whether shall we believe you or the generall councell of Basil If he were a schismaticall and an unlawfull Pope what shall we judge of all that succeeded him Hic labor ille domus inextricabilis error Besides this Eugenius how many other Popes have thrust into the chair by usurpation and corruption how many have cut it asunder by schism how many have rayed and defiled it with heresie and abhominable filthinesse When you so confidently affirm that the church of Rome hath had always a succession of true bishops and pastors I pray you tell us what you mean by true bishops and pastors If
jurisdiction over all bishops not excluding them from being bishops but making them subject and subordinate to their head or as it may import that this universall bishop should be the only bishop in the world ita ut caeteri non sint episcopi sed vicarii tantum illius that is so that all other who hold the name of bishops should indeed be no bishops but only his vicars This answer no way heals the wounds and gashes made by S. Gregories sharp stile in inveighing against the title of universall bishop for neither did Iohn of Constantinople at whom S. Gregory strikes in these epistles desire to be the only bishop of the world nor doth the word universall import any such thing Neither did Lucifer to whom this Gregory compares this Iohn of Ierusalem affect to be the only angel but as S. Gregory speaketh spretis in sociali gaudio angelorum legionibus ad culmen coâ—… est singularitatis erumpere Despising the rank of his fellow aâ—gells hâ— endeavoured to aspire to the top of singularity and this is that which S. Gregory chargeth this Iohn withall that he affected â—â—ulli Sâ—bâ—sse omnibus praeesse to be under none but above all That he went about cuncta Christi membra sibi universalis appellatione suppâ—â—â—re That is by the title of universall to bring all Christâ— members in subjection unto him From which passages of S. Gregory I frame this argument he who usurps the title of universall bishop in such sort that he labours to be under none but above all is a sore-runrer of anti-christ an imitator of Lucifer in the singularity of his pride but the bishop of Rome affects to be under none but above all ergo by S. Gregories logick he is a fore-runner of anti-christ 2. For justification by inherent righteousnesse and the perfection thereof S. Gregory renounceth it as we do nay he goes farther then we in vilifying humane righteousnesse we say no more but that our best works are not free from some stain of sin he says in expresse terms that if they be examined according to the rigour of justice they are sins Upon the ninth of Iob thus he commenteth ut saepe diximus omnis humana justitia injustitia esse convincitur si districte judicetur that is all righteousnesse of man as we have often said is convinced to be unrighteousnesse if it be strictly judged as in the same book sanctus auteÌ„ vir qui omne virtutis nostrae merituÌ„ esse vitium conspicit si ab interno arbitro districte judicetur recte subjungit si voluerit contendere cum eo non poterit ei respondere unum pro mille that is the holy man because he sees all the merit of our vertue to be vice if it be strictly scanned by the inward searcher of hearts and reins therefore he well adds â—f he will contend with him he cannot answer one for a thousand And the 18 chap. Si enim remota piet atâ— discutimur opus nostruÌ„ poena dignum est quod remunerari praemiis praestolamur If we are examined without mercy our work for which we look for a reward will prove to be worthy of punishment and chap. 19. sed tamen sciendum est quia mundos nos ad perfectum reddere vel vita vel lachrymae non valent quousque nos mortalitas nostrae corruptionis tenet that is we must know that neither our life nor our tears can make us perfectly clean as long as we continue in this frailty of corruption With what face can you affirm that the church of Rome holdeth still the tenets which it did in S. Gregories time Your tenet now is that you câ—… fulfill the law of God in this life that by good works you can merit heaven and more that you may trust to your inherent righteousnesse and that you are justified by it which if you can reconcile with S. Gregories assertions above related I doubt not but you may in good time reconcile all christendom 3. For perseverance of saints in grace S. Gregory is as firm as any of the reformed protestant writers in his 34 book upon Iob he propounds a kind of objection how it should come to passe that Leviathan hath such power to trample gold that is saith he men shining with the brightnesse of sanctifie 〈◊〉 if it were dirt by defiling them with vice sed citius respondemus quia â—urum quod pravis diabâ—li persua fâ—onâ—bus sterni sicut lutum potuerit aurum â—…te oculos Dei â—unquam fuit qui seduci quandoque non reversuri possunt quasi habitum sanctitatis ante oculos hominum videâ—â—tur amittere sed eam ante oculos Dei nunquam habuerunt that is but we speedily ansâ—er that that gold which by the wicked perswasion of the devill may be cast down as dirt was never gold in Gods eye c. 4. For private maâ—â—es without communicants wherein the priest rehearseth the words of Christ take eat and drink yee all of this yet eateth and drinketh all himself and celebrateth a strange kind of supper without any guest at all I say in S. Gregories time this corruption had not crept into the church as appeareth by those words cum que in eadem ecclesia missarum solennia celebrarentur atque ex more diaconâ—s clamaret si quis non communicat deâ— locum and when in the same church the solemnity of the masses were celebrated and the deacon cryed out after the custom 〈◊〉 if any man communicate not let him depart or give place If you here snatch at the word masses I answer that the masses S. Gregory and the fathers before him spake of were nothing but our communion and the service thereunto belonging so called either a â—…ttendis muneribus for the offerings that were then made or a diâ—â—ttendis catechâ—…enis sending away such as were not thought fit to be admitted to the holy sacrament of which we shall have further occasion to speak in answer to your promised reply 5. For the princes authority over ecclesiasticall persons S. Gregory acknowledgeth not only ordinary priests and bishops but even the bish of Rome also himself to be subject to the emperor sacerdotes meos tuae maâ—â—â— comisi I have committed my priests into thy hands And afterwards in his own person ego indignus famulus vester I your unworthy servant Ego quidem inâ—imus subjectus eandem legem per diversas terrarum partes transmitti seci quia lex ipsa omnipotenti Deo minime concorder ecce per suggestionis meâ— pagâ—â—am ferenissimo Dommino â—unciavi utrobique ergo quae debut exolvi qui et imperatori obedientiam praebui pro Deo quod sensi mâ—nâ—â—e â—â—â—ui that is I your lowest subject have published your command And here you tray see in what terms the empire and papacy stood when the Pope held it his duty to publish a decree of