come to the .78 Vntruth to geue any one instaunce or exceptyon in any one Countre of the greke Churche And so D. Harding though he haue not proued it him selfe yet M. Iewell hath proued it for him For an Vniuersal proposition is well proued by Order of Schooles and Reason when no Instance or Exception can be brought to the Contrary Harding Bicause the first preachers of the faith came to these west partes from Rome c. Iewell The .73 Vntruthe The first preachinge of the Faith in these Weste Countries came not first from Rome This Vntruthe was noted before by M. Iewell in the firste Article and here it is repeted to make a number It was the .32 Vntruthe In that place we haue satisfied it and shewed that Fraunce Germanye and the Englishe Nation our Forefathers had all their firste faithe from Rome Maye it please thee gentle Reader to haue a recourse to that place and then iudge what the impudency of M. Iewell deserueth not only in repeting it now againe for an Vntruthe but also auoutchinge it in the texte and noting also in the Margin that M. Hardinge wittingly and willingly auoucheth Vntruthe He bringeth in surmises without Authoritye that Nathanael Saturninus and Lazarus preached first the Faithe of Fraunce For this surmise and Gheasse of his you had before alleaged a testimonye of the Frenche bishoppes them selues aboue a thousand yeares paste confessing they had their Faithe firste from Rome If that suffise not beholde the particular testimony of diuerse the principall Churches in Fraunce to recorde the same Demochares a Frenche Writer of late dayes reakoning vp the Bishops of euery bishoprike and Archebishoprike in Fraunce by the recordes of the Chapters of eche Churche nameth vs their firste bishops to be these Of Senes the first Bishop was S. Sauinianus sent from S. Peter as also Antoninus witnesseth Of Paris the first bishop was S. Denys sent by Clement as the Monuments and Antiquites of Paris do yet testifie Of Chartres Auentinus sent from S. Peter was the first bishop Of Orleans Altinus sent likewise with the other two by S. Peter By S. Clement Pope of Rome soone after S. Peter were sent also diuers Nicasius the firste bishoppe of Rhone Exuperius of Ba ieux and Taurinus of Brye The firste Bishop of Antissiodorum was S. Peregrinus sent from Sixtus the Pope of Rome in the yeare of our Lorde 30. Whereas M. Iewel writeth that Nathanael Lazarus and Saturninus preached the Faith first in Fraunce he hath taken that by lyke out of some LegeÌ„da aurea and yet hath not al together truly reported it For as touching Saturninus he was bishop of Tolose in Fraunce in the persecutioÌ„ of Decius more then 200. yeares after Christ and therfore could be none of the first that preached there the faithe For Nathanael Vrsinus is named to be the firste bishoppe of Burges Of Lazarus arriuing to Massilia with Marye Magdalene and Martha it is written but that they planted the faithe in Fraunce it is very vncertaine As for the coniectures of M. Iewell from whence our countre receiued the faithe I haue before in the 32. Vntruthe declared the contrarye oute of the approued Historye of Venerable Bede Iewell Tertullian calleth Hierusalem the Mother and the spring of ReligioÌ„ So doth the Prophet Esaie longe before Prophecye De Syon exibit lex verbum Domini de Hierusalem The lawe shall come forthe of Syon and the worde of the Lorde oute of Hierusalem Our Sauioure also sending forthe his Apostles biddeth them to beginne at Hierusalem to preache to Samaria and so vsque ad extremum terrae euen to the vttermost of the earthe In that sence all the worlde had the faith from Hierusalem And so S. Augustine in the place by M. Iewell alleaged when he saieth The faithe sprange first from the Grekes by the grekes meaneth not the countre of grece but the countre of Iury who at that tyme was a part of the greke Churche as by the greke Liturgie of S. Iames bishop of Hierusalem by the greke Homilies of Cyrillus bishop there also before S. Augustines time lâ—st of all by the wordes of S. Augustine him selfe in that selfe same epistle alleaged by M. Iewell it is euident For in that same Epistle shewing that we ought not to reiect the greke worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 expressing the consubstantialite of Christ with God the father bicause it was not written in holy Scripture but made by the greke Fathers saieth thus Non enim in Africa aut in cuncta Barbariae sed in Syria vel Graecia vbi ipsa caro voluit de virgine nasci dominica decuit vel oportuit verba fidei compendiose firmare For not in Afrike nor in all the rest of barbarous and forrain countres but in Syria or Grece where it liked our Sauiour to take Flesh of the Virgin the wordes of our faithe ought or might wel be established In whiche wordes he calleth Iury where Christ was borne by the name of Grece The which also he doth in an other Epistle calling that countre Radicem Orientalium Ecclesiaruâ— vnde Euangelium in Africam venit vnde terra si eis afferatur adorant The Roote of of the East Churches from whence the Ghospell came vnto Afrike and from whence the earthe if it be brought to them is worshipped which can be meaned of no Lande but of the Holy Lande Yet notwithstanding all this that principally all Christendom hath their faithe from Hierusalem thoughe she be the true Mother to vs all though S. Augustine do confesse that from thence the faith came to Afrike yet I saye notwithstandinge all this Saint Augustine in this very epistle 70. in number confesseth also that the Faythe came to Afrike from Rome For speaking off the Donatistes condemned apud Ecclesiam transmarinam whiche was at Rome by Melchiades the Pope he addeth vnde ad istas partes Christianae fidei manauit authoritas from the which Church of Rome the authorite of Christen faith hath ben deriued in to these partes And so S. Gregory saieth that from Rome in Africanis partibus sumpsit ordinaâ—io saecerdotalis â—xordium In the Coastes of Afrike the beginning of priestly Order did springe Thus notwitstanding that Hierusalem is the Mother of all Chrystendom yet the Weste Churche as we haue particularly declared in Fraunce in Germany in our countre and last of all now in Afrike hath taken their first faith properly and immediatly from Rome And so hath there ben no Vntruthe auouched by D. Harding but a manifest and willfull falshood defended by M. Iewell Harding They planted and sett vp in the Countres by them conuerted the Seruice of the Church of Rome or some other very like and that 74 in the latin tounge onely for ought that can be shewed to the contrary Iewell The .74 Vntruthe For the first preachers them selues spake no latine If this be all that you
and fiue and twenti Singers Stapleton All this proueth that your clergy of Laie Craftesmen and Younge Scholers hauing only Ministres and deacons is farre vnlike to the clergy of the primitiue Church who had so many degrees beside of holy Orders It proueth not that All these did at All Times Receiue with the Bishop And for proufe hereof you bringe not one worde but thus you Conclude M. Iewell Iewell Hereby we maye see that Chrysostome being at Antioche in so populous a Citie although he had none of the laye people with him yet coulde not be vtterly lefte alone Stapleton This is loe M. Iewelles Conclusion and this is his argument Ignatius a bishop of Antioche had a number of Priestes to waite vpon him Chrysostom when he was bishop in Constantinople had the like Cornelius bishop of Rome had so also Nazianzen complaineth of the great number of the clergy and Iustinian longe after Chrysostoms time restrained the nuÌ„ber of the clergy in Constantinople Ergo Chrysostome being no bishop but a Priest only at Antioche had in Antioche Alwaies a Number to Serue and Waite vpon him For thou must vnderstande gentle Reader when Chrysostom spake these wordes which we are nowe aboute The daily Sacrifice is offred in vaine we stande at the Aultar for nought There is not one that will receiue he spake those wordes in an homilie made to the people of Antioche where he toke the inferiour orders as Socrates and Nicephorus do write where he was made Reader deacon and priest He was then no bishop at all but only a Priest at Antioche Therefore all this number that M. Iewell hath hetherto proued is vtterly beside the purpose And that for ij causes First bicause all his allegations being of bishops of Rome and of Constantinople they make nothinge to the wordes of Chrysostom who was then but a Priest and that at Antioche Secondarely bicause al these allegations proueth a number to Waite and Attende vpon the bishop but they proue not a whit that such a number ought allwaies to Receiue with the bishop Nowe let vs see howe M. Iewell procedeth Iewell Nowe if we saie that some of these priestes deacons or other Communicated with the Bishop I tell them saieth M. Harding boldely and with a solemne countenaunce which must nedes make good proofe This is but a poore shifte and will not serue their turne Stapleton D. Harding did not only tell you so M. Iewell but he added also a reason wherefore To the which reason you haue not answered one worde but like a Hicke Scorner you thought to face out the mattter making your Reader beleue that it was only tolde with a bolde and solemne Countenaunce Nowe this Shifte M. Iewell is not only Poore but very Beggarly and starke False and such as you are neuer able to Proue To witte that Euery Simple Priest at Euery time that he saied Masse had a Number of other Priestes and deacons to communicat with him For vnlesse you proue this M. Iewell it will allwaies be but a Gheasse to saie Chrysostom had certaine priestes and deacons to communicat Yet you saie Iewell But if it be true it is riche enough if it agree with Chrysostomes owne meaning it is no shifte and therefore sufficiently serueth our purpose Stapleton Proue it to be true then it shall be ritche enough Proue it to agree with Chrysostoms meaning then it shall be no Shifte You procede and saie Iewell And bicause he sitteth so fast vpon the bare wordes and reposeth all his hope vpon Nemo if we list to cauil in like sorte StapletoÌ„ It is no cauilling to presse the Authors wordes and meaning as hath bene proued But to wrâ—st the Author to that which he neuer meant as M. Iewell hath done that is in dede to cauille Iewell VVe might soone finde warrant sufficient to answer this matter euen in the very plain wordes of Chrisostome For thus they lie Frustra assistimus Altari In vaine we stande at the Aultar VVe stande saieth he and not I stande and therfore includeth a number and not one alone He includeth in dede a number to stande at the Aultar but he includeth no number to receiue at the Aultar vnlesse M Iewell be of the opinion that they receiued standing Againe Chrysostom complaineth not only of him selfe and his owne flocke but of other priestes also and their flockes We stande we priestes do stande at the Aultar we offer the daily Sacrifice and yet Nullus qui communicetur There is not one that dothe communicat Iewell How be it our shiftes are not so poore We nede not to take holde of so small aduantages Stapleton It is a pointe of Rhetorike to make great Bragges when Matter fainteth But when M. Iewell hath all saied it will appeare that this Small Aduantage is the best holde he hath It foloweth Iewell It is prouided by the Canons of the Apostles that if any bishop or priest or Deacon or any other of the Quiere after Oblation is made doe not receiue onlesse he shewe some reasonable cause of his doing that he stande excommunicat The like lawe in the Churche of Rome was after renewed by Pope Anacletus StapletoÌ„ M. Iewell did well to expounde the Canon of the Apostles by the lawe of Anacletus For as the lawe of Anacletus speaketh expressely of bishops only and of their Masses so dothe Canon of the Apostles also if at lest they be like as M. Iewell saieth And then they make nothinge to the Present Purpose For as it hath bene shewed before Chrysostom was then no Bishop when he spake the wordes which we nowe treate of but a Priest in Antioche Againe M. Iewell to stretche the Canon of the Apostles farder then it was intended hath falsified a parte therof For where he saith or any other of the Quire it is in the greke 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in Latin aut alius ordinis ecclâ—siastici in true english or any other of the Clergy For of the Clergy only this CanoÌ„ was made who in the Apostles time and many yeres after wheÌ„ the bishop celebrated vsed customably to receiue For in that time many right holy and lerned men continewed in the inferiour orders of the clergy all the daies of their life And were not admitted to priesthood but being called and in a maner forced thereunto Such at that time in the beginning of the faithe communicated with the bishop bicause otherwise as the Canon saieth he shoulde seme to be author offensionis populo suspicionem praebens in offerentem A cause of offence to the people and to bringe the party that offred into suspicion As being such a one with whom his Clergy woulde not communicat For this re pect at that time such communicating with the bishop was thought necessary The state of Chrisostoms time foure hundred yeres after was otherwise Iewell The Councell of Nice decreeth thus Let the Deaâ—ons in order after the Priestes
loquor I speake in tounges more then all yowe Yet I do not affect this speaking with tounges I had rather speake fiue wordes to edifie other then tenne thousand of wordes not with my tounge as M. Iewell hathe falsely translated it but in lingua in the tounge that is by the miraculous gifte of tounges alone where the gifte of Interpretation is not also vsed whereby the Congregation might be edified Nowe who seeth not that all this discourse of the Apostle is farre wide from vttering the Ordinary Seruice of Gods Churche in any tounge knowen or vnknowen Yet that the matter maye be more clere and euident euen to all men let vs produce and prosecut yett farder the wordes of S. Paule which doe folowe though not alleaged by M. Iewell at all vntell we come to his laste wordes Let all thinges be done to edifie It foloweth in S. Paule Brethern be not like Children in vnderstanding But in euill doinge be childern in vnderstandinge be ye perfâ—ct For as Chrysostome vpon this place saieth Childern vse to gape and wonder at small matters but at weighty thinges in dede they wonder nothinge at all Therefore seing thâ—se Corinthians hauing the gifâ—e of tounges thought thâ—y had thereby all thinges allthough that were the vâ—ry lest of all the other giftâ—s the Apostle saiâ—th vnto them Be not like children c. You see the Apostle prosecuteth the matter of the miraculous gifte of tounges and speaketh yet nothinge of the Common Sett Seruice Let vs goe forthe withe the texte For it is writen in the lawe For I will speake to this people in other tounges and in other lippes and yet they shall not so heare me neither saieth the Lorde All this is to debace the gifte of tonges when it is vsed by it selfe alone The Apostle goeth forthe Therefore tounges serue for a token not for the faithâ—full but for the vnfaithefull But prophecies or interpretation are not for the vnfaithefull but for the faithefull Such a token or prouocation to admiration the gifte of tounges was to the gentiles of Parthia Media Mesopotamia and diuers other nations when they hearde the Apostles to preache in all tounges vpon Whitsondaye But prophecies whiche consiste in interpretation or reuelation do serue for the faithefull do moue and strik them So by the gifte of prophecy Ananias and Saphira saieth Chrysostom were striken to deathe of S. Peter Nowe to put an example of all this the Apostle saieth If therefore the whole Congregation come together and all speake in tounges and some infidels or ignorant men do enter will they not saie you are madde For so many of the infidels vpon Whitsondaye hearing the Apostles to speake in tonges mocked theÌ„ therewith and saied they were droncke But many other also wondered thereat Therefore as Chrisostom here saieth Non signum sed ruditas accusatur increduli Not the signe of speaking withe tounges but the rudenesse of the vnbeleuer is here blamed of the Apostle Thus the speaking of tounges is allwaies debaced but yet not vtterlye reproued But if all do prophecy that is doe interpret or reuele that which is spoken in tonges and then anye infidele or ignorant doe enter he is conuinced of all men he is iudgâ—d of all men for the secrets of his harte are made open and so falling on his face he will adore God and pronounce that verâ—ly God is in yowe All this is spoken saieth Chrisostom vt interpretem adiungere cogat to force the Corinthians to adde to the speaker in tonges an Interpreter Nowe therefore the Apostle concludeth and saieth What is it then brethern VVhen you come together euerye on of you hath a psalme hath doctrine hathe reuelation hathe the tonge hathe Interpretation Let all thinges be done to edifie Thus farre the whole text of S. Paule from the beginning of M. Iewelles allegation to the ende thereof The drifte of S. Paule is this You come together one of you hath the gifte of singing For as Chrisostom saieth psallere sic quondam doni diuini fuit sicut docere In olde time singing was of the gifte of God euen as teaching was An other hath the gifte of Reuelation an other of speaking with tonges an other of prophecy or Interpretation But to be shorte Non est longo donorum disâ—rimine opus Vna res est quam volo quam quaero vt proximus edificetur There nedeth not such a longe distinctioÌ„ of giftes It is but one thing that I desir that I seke for That your neighbour may be edified Loe here is according to the doctores Iudgementes the whole issue processe and discourse of the blessed Apostle in that Chapter whiche also in that which foloweth he prosecuteth yet more geuing a particular order howe they shall speake with tounges and howe they shall interpret one after an other not talke confuselye without an interpretour We see the whole drifte of the Apostle is that the Corinthians in vsing the gifte off tounges shoulde adde also the Interpretation thereof vnto it that the Audience might be edified Here it may be obiected If the Apostle require the Corinthians to haue an interpretation and exposition of that whiche was spoken in straunge tounges at the time of Common Praier doth not the same reason binde vs also to haue our Common praier either in no straunge tounge at all or els to haue with all an Interpretation thereof to the entent that the people nowe also maye be edified To this I answer diuers waies And Marke well gentle Reader our answer herein First I saie the Apostle speaketh not of the straunge tounges vsed at seruice time at the Oblation time at the time of celebrating and Ministring the holy mysteries but at the time of preaching Proue this you saie Thus I proue it First the Apostle persuadeth in all this Chapter the Corinthians not to affecte so much the gifte of tounges as the gifte of Interpretation And the reason he addeth saying He that speaketh in the tounge speakâ—th not to men but to God For no Man heareth that is vnderstandeth him But in the sprit he speaketh mysteries Nowe he that prophecyeth that is which interpreteth and expoundeth he speaketh to men he speaketh to edifie to exhort and to conforte Nowe who doubteth but this edifying which consisteth in Exhortations and in Counforte geuing apperteineth properly to homilies sermons and preaching In this case therefore it is necessary that the people vnderstande that which is saied Nowe in the Oblation and holy ministration it is a time of praier not of exhortation and preaching This to be the ende intent ad drifte of the Apostle it appeareth by this entry and beginning which he maketh To this purpose hath he alleaged all that before hath bene saied as the comparisons of the musicall instrument of the Trumpet and so forthe At the ende also of his disputation it appereth yet more euident For thus he saieth Si ergo conuenit vniuersa
vniuersall Churche Well pleaded and lyke a lawyer But Lyke diuinite lyke lawe For shame vnderstande your lawes better before you alleage them Or els folowe the Paynters Councell Ne sutor vltra crepidam The wordes of the lawe vpon which Ostiensis groundeth are these Si quis ergo vel pareÌ„ vel maiorem Iudicem apellauerit alium tamen pro alio in ea causa est vt error ei non noceat sed si minorem nocebit If any man therefore do Appeale to an equall Iudge or to a higher then he shoulde as yet mistaking one for the other the errour shall not hurte but if he Appeale to an inferiour Iudge it shall hurte As in a Case Iohn being cast by the Archedeacon Appealed to the Archebishop where as he should first haue appealed to the bishopp as to a nerer Superiour But this errour doth not hurte bicause he appealed to a higher Iudge The same Iohn from the ArchedeacoÌ„ appealed to the Officiall of CauÌ„terbury where as he shoulde haue Appealed to the Iudge of the Prerogatiue Courte This errour hurteth not neither bicause he Appealed to a Iudge equall and off like Authorite to that Iudge to whom he ought to haue Appealed Therefore his Appeale shal procede before the Iudge to whom he should haue Appealed notwithstanding the errour committed in meaning an other Iudge being his equall In the thierde Case Iohn Appealed from his bishop to an other bishop where as he should haue Appealed to the Archebishopp In this case he looseth the benefyt of Appeale Bicause he hath appealed to a Iudge neither higher neither equall to that Iudge to whom he ought to haue Appealed that is to the Archebishop butt to an inferiour Iudge For the bishop to whom he Appealed though he be equall to the Iudge who before had geuen the Sentence yet he is inferiour to the Iudge to whom the Appeale ought to be made In this case therefore the Appeale is voide The wordes therefore of Ostiensis and of the glose saying that the errour hurteth not when the Appeale is made to an equal Iudge doe not meane a Iudge equall to the party Appealing or equall to the Iudge from whom the Appeale is made but they meane a Iudge equall to him to whom of right the Appeale shoulde haue bene made It is therefore a manifest Vntruthe contrary to al lawe and reason that M. Iewell saieth Appeales maye be made not only from the lower Iudge to the higher but from equal to equal And to saie that Ostiensis or the lawe so saieth it is a double Vntruthe The lawe is plaine to the Contrary both Ciuil and Canon which is easy to be proued Appeales were admitted saieth the lawe to correct and amende the iniquite rigour or errour of a former Iudgement But no Inferiour or equal can correct the Iudgement of his superiour or equall bicause he hath no rule ouer such Therefore no Inferiour or equall can take an Appeale from his Superiour or equall Againe the lerned lawyers define an Appeale thus Appellatio est ius quo interim primasententia extinguitur iterum causae cognitio ad Iudicem superiorem deuoluitur Appeale is a lawe by the which the former Sentence is for the time made voide and the triall off the matter is remoued to a Superiour Iudge So that the Superiorite of Iudgement is off the very nature of an Appeale And therefore that euery Appeale ought to be to a Superieur it is proued saieth Bartolus by infinit lawes And one lawe expressely saieth Minor magistratus contra sententiam maioris non restituet The inferiour Iudge or Magistrat shall not acquitte against the Sentence of an higher Iudge Nor shall not sit vpon any Appeale so made And against al Appeales to equall Iudges the Authentikes speake expressely The wordes are these Cum non oportet ad compares Iudices appellationes referri sed a minore iudicio in maius tribunal ascendere Whereas Appeales maye not be remoued to equall Iudges but they ought allwaies from an inferiour Iudgement remoue to a higher benche Finally as certaine a principle it is in the lawe that euery Appeale is to a Superiour as it is in diuinite that al that do swere do sweare by their letter as the Apostle saieth Therefore the Canon lawe admitteth Appeales but only to a Superiour where it saieth Placuit vt si a quibuscunque ecclesiasticis iudicibus ad alios Iudices ecclesiasticos vbi est maior Authoritas prouocatum fuerit audientia non negetur It hath semed good that if Appeale be made from any ecclesiasticall Iudge to other ecclesiastical Iudges which be of a higher Authorite that Audience be geuen This shifte therefore neither of Ostiensis and the glose Neither of any other lawe Ciuil or Canon helping any whit against the Authorite of Appeales what other conuayaunce hith M. Iewell to dasel the Readers eyes withall or to blancke his euident and most assured Argument of the bishop of Romes Supremacy ouer all bishops as being one to whom all other the chiefest Patriarches them selues haue appealed You see howe many waies he had laboured against it and what paines and trauail he hath bestowed thereon and yet hath brought no Argument but such as if it were true it was of no force if it was of force it was not true Lest al his labour therefore shoulde be lost he dilateth yet the matter one waye more and beginneth as if it were a freshe thus Iewell But M. Harding might soo haue foreseene that this his first principle of Appeale would easely be turned against him â—â—â—fe First for that it is well knowen that Appeales then euen in the Ecclesiasticall causeâ— were made vnto the Emperours and ciuile Princes Secondely for that the bishop of Rome determined such cases of Appeale by warrant and Commission from the Emperour Thirdly for that matters being once hearde and determined by the bishop of Rome haue bene by Appeale from him remoued furder vnto others StapletoÌ„ Here be three but if M. Iewell thryue with any one let him take all Iewell As touching the first that Appeales in Ecclesiasticall causes were lawefully made to the Prince it is clere by Eusebius by Socrates by Nicephorus and by S. Augustine in sundrie places Al these foure Authours are brought aboute one selfe matter And that is this Donatus being condemned by three score and tenne bishops in Africa appealed vnto the Emperour Constantinus and was receiued StapletoÌ„ That heretike Donatus appealed in dede and was receiued but knowe you howe he was receiued M. Iewell Optatus an Africane bishop and liuing in the heate off that tragedy him selfe writeth thus Lectis literis Constantinus pleno liuore respondit In qua responsione et eorum preces prodidit dum ait Petitis a me in sâ—culo iudicium cum ego ipse Christi Iudicium expectem Et tamen dati sunt Iudices c. The Supplications of the Donatistes appealing from their owne bishopps to the Emperour
vnto others and thus did others vnto him This is an 451. Vnfallible token that their authoriâ—e was equall and none of them had power and gouernement ouer his folowes If this be an infallible token it is bicause M. Iewell saieth so For truly if any other man had made such reasons all had ben but a Gheasse a Surmise a likelyhood a Coniecture Such are all D. Hardinges proofes to M. Iewell be they neuer so clere and manifest But nowe euery gheasse that he bringeth must be an vnfallible token For how saie you M. Iewell Be these letters of Conference an vnfallyble token of equalite And where finde you that letters of Conference and betwene whom You finde them in S. Gregory For him only you note in the Margin And you finde suche letters of him to the bishops of Constantinople Alexandria and Antiochia How then if S. Gregory him selfe which wrote such letters of Conference to the bishop of Constantinople dothe yet expressely saie the Churche of Constantinople to be subiect to the churche of Rome Shal not then M. Iewelles vnfallible tokeÌ„ proue an vnfallible Vntruthe Vnlesse to iustifie M. Iewelles wordes we must make S. Gregory coÌ„trary to him selfe and to saue his Vntruthe make S. Gregory a lyar Let vs then heare what S. Gregory saieth These are his wordes Nam de Constantinopolitana Ecclesia quod dicunt quis eam dubitet sedi Apostolicae esse subiectam For as touching thaâ— they tel vs of the Churche of Constantinople who doubteh but that she is subiect to the See Apostolike Which also our most godly Emperour and our Brother Eusebius bishop of that Cite do continually professe Yet if she or any other Churche haue any good thinge to be folowed I am ready to folowe my inferiours in good thinges whom I forbidde from vnlawfull thinges For he is vnwise which thinketh him selfe therefore to be chiefe that he may neglect to lerne the good that he seeth Thus farre holy S. Gregory In whom we see notwithstanding he wrote letters of conference to the bishop of Constantinople and calleth him here his brother yet he calleth him his inferiour and dissembleth not that his Churche is subiect vnto him And in the next epistle he writeth of the bishopp of Constantinople that being accused of a certaine crime the Iudgement was referred vnto him of the Emperour iuxta statutae Canonica According to the statutes of the Canons not by the mere will or commission of the Emperour Now if M. Iewell do maruaill how such letters of conference such titles of brethern should passe betwene S. Gregory and the other Patriaches and yet they notwithstanding be subiect vnto him S. Gregory wil tel him soone the cause hereof in these wordes Cum culpa non exit omnes secunduÌ„ rationeÌ„ humilitattis aequales sunt Where no faulte is committed all by the reason of humilite are aequall And in that sence S. Paule saieth VVilt thou not feare the higher power Do well And he will praise thee For he is the minister of God to doe the good But if thou do euil then feare him Thus S. Gregory was brother to al other bishops wrote familiarly and frendly vnto them vntell they offended Then he woulde vse and shewe his power ouer them euen ouer the bishop of Constantinople him sefe the chiefest of all the Patriarches after the Pope So he excommunicated Iohn of Constantinople so he iudge ouer Eusebius bishop of the same See and so he expressely professeth and putteth it out of doubte that the Church of Constantinople is subiect to the bishop of Rome And thus M. Iewelles vnfallible token is not founde to be so much as a bare gheasse But voide of al truthe and weight By such false sleightes and seely surmises M. Iewell maintaineth his schismaticall disobedience against Christes Vicaire and draweth other to the snare of his schisme Iewell And .452 therefore when Eulogius bishop off Alexandria had written thus vnto Gregory being then bishop of Rome Sâ—utiusfistis as ye commaunded Gregorie vtterly shunned and refused that kinde of writing for thus he answereth him I pray you haue awâ—y this worde of Commaunding from my hearing For I knowe bothe what I am and also what you are Touching your place you are my brethern touâ—hing maneâ—s are my Fathers Therefore I commaunded you not but only shewed I what â—hought good Stapleton Tis declareth the great humilite of holy S. Gregory This proueth true that which he saied before Cum culpa noâ—â—xâ—git omnes secundum rationeÌ„ humilitatis aequales sunt Where â—o faulte is committed all by the reason of humilite be equal And thus the saying of the Apostle is verefied Iusto â—on est lex posita The lawe is not made for the righteous All this is true that all bishops and Priestes are brethern the one commaundeth not the other when nothinge is amisse If I offende not the lawe the magistrat hath nought to doe with me He can not commaunde me But the Master may commaunde his seruaunt do he well or euill The Pope is not so primat ouer other bishops that he hath them at commaundement as seruauntes But if they breake the Canons he commaundeth them and forceth theÌ„ to their duity or els remoueth theÌ„ from their Authoryte So S. Gregory him selfe which shunned the worde of commaunding yet he putteh it out of doubte that the See of Constantinople who was not inferiour to the See of Alexandria was subiect to the See of Rome So Athanasius bishop of Alexandria being cited to the Churche of Rome appeared there as to his superiour So Cyrillus bishop also of Alexandria was legat to Pope Celestinus in the thirde Generall Councell of Ephesus Yet as S. Gregory would not commaunde Eulogius so neither Iulius commaundeth Athanasius nor Celestinus in the thirde General Councell of Ephesâ—s commaundeth Cyrillus Thus M. Iewell for lacke of matter and weight hunteth after termes and phrases to builde vp his schismaticall disobedience to our mother Churche the holy See of Rome Iewell Fiâ—ally 453. for that Michael Palaeologus The Emperour of the East partes in the Councell holden at Lyons aboute the yere of our Lordâ— .1442 after great intreatie made vnto him by the bishop of Rome hid acknowleadged the bishops of the East to be subiect vnto him after he returned home againe in to his Empire and was dead his Cleâ—gie vvoulde not suffer him to be buried Yet saieth M. Harding Al the bishops of Grecia Asia Syria Aegypte and to be short all the Orient read and exhibited their humble obedience to the See off Româ— M. Iewell is miserably forced for the maitenaunce off his schisne not only to falsefie couÌ„cels to take parte with the Arrians and withe Donatistes olde condemned heretikes of the primitiue Churche to gather gheasses and coniectures vpon titles and phrases to falsifye S. Basill to misalleage the decrees but nowe at the laste to suche miserable shiftes he is driuen the poore creature is forced to claime
know bothe 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in greke and Praesideo in Latin dothe sometime signifie to sitt in the first place But doe not yow knowe also that it signifieth to Beare rule and to gouerne Is not our englishe worde President taken out of the Latin Praesidere a worde of Authorite and gouernement more then of sitting in the first place Wil you measure and limit the Office of the Lord President in Wales with the prerogatiue of only sitting before other and hauing the first place But that Theodoret calling the Churche of Rome 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Orbi terrâ—rum praesidentem the Churche that is president and beareth rule ouer the worlde meaneth a farre greater prerogatiue then of sitting in the first place and that therefore this traÌ„slation is true and yow but a fonde wrangler to finde faulte therewith the whole place of Theodoret him selfe shal testifie and beare witnesse Theodoret that lerned father and bishopp of Cyrus beginneth his Epistle vnto Pope Leo in this sorte Si Paulus praeco veritatis c. If Paule the Preacher of Truthe the truÌ„pet of the Holy Ghoste ranne vp to the great Apostle Peter to bring from him a determination touching the question which those of Antioche moued about the obseruations of the lawe of Moyses much more we whiche are abiecte and off small regarde doe runne to youre Apostolike See that we maye receaue from you some holesome medicine to cure the woundes and sores of the Churches For to you it belongeth to beare the chiefty in all thinges For your See is decked with many praerogatiues whereby you are Superiour to other For other cities are commended for greatnesse for beauty and for multitude of inhabitants And many are noble for certain spirituall giftes peculiar to them But God the geuer of all good thinges hathe geuen to your Citie a plentifull and abundant copie of al goodnesse For that Citie is the greatest and noblest of al Cities and it is shee that gouâ—rneth the whole worlde and is full of inhabitants Furthermore this Citie gotte that Empire whiche nowe gouerneth the worlde and of her owne name hathe called her subiects But chiefely and principally the Faithe commendeth her and the worthy witnesse S. Paule who crieth out and saieth Your faithe is preached through oute the whole worlde Thus farre Theodoret in commendation of the Citie of Rome and not so muche of the Citie it selfe as of the Churche and See of that Citie For these wordes to haue bene spoken of the Churche not of the Citie M. Ieweâ—l him selfe confesseth chaunging the wordes Quae praeest orbi terrarum into Ecclesiam orbis terrarum primariam The most Notable and chiefe Churche of the worlde For the chiefe Citie of the worlde at that time Rome was not but rather Constantinople whiche also was therefore called Noua Roma Newe Rome Againe it sâ—all the better appeare by the suite and request of Theodoretus in this epistle to Pope Leo whether he called the Churche of Rome the president of the worlde for preeminence of place only or no. Theodoret in that epistle to Pope Leo being wrongefully depriued and deposed from his bishopricque by Dioscorus the Patriarche of Alexandria in the Conuenticle of Ephesus of which we haue often mentioned before declaring firste the iniurious iudgement of Dioscorus the longe continuaunce in his bishopricke hauing serued therein xxvj yeares the largenesse of his charge hauing in his prouince for he was a Metropolitane Archebishop eight hundred Churches his great paynes and trauail in preseruing all that people from heresy namely from the heresy of Marcion from the which as he writeth he had deliuered aboue a thousand soules conuerting them to the Catholike faithe declaring I saye all these thinges to the Pope particularly he cometh to his suite and saieth Et post tot sudores labores c. And beholde after all this sweate and trauail I am condemned being not so muche at accused But I looke for the Sentence of your Apostolike See And I beseche and require your holynes to aide me in this case Appealing to your right and iuste iudgement and to commaunde me to come before you and to shewe that my doctrine and belefe foloweth your Apostolike steppes And a litle after hauing reakoned vpp what workes he had writen partly against heretikes partly vpon holy Scripture of the whiche to this daye a great parte is extant he repeteth his suite and saieth But I beseche yowe caste not of my humble request nor despise not my hore head which after suche paynefull trauailes is thus iniured Before all thinges I beseche yow I maye knowe from you whether I ought to stande to this wrongefull iudgement or no. For I looke for your sentence and if you shall commaunde me to abide the iudgement I will abide it and neuer trouble man here aboute any more but abide the iust iudgement of my God and Saviour Christ Iesus God is my witnesse I haue no regarde of my honour and promotion but of the great offence that maye rise hereof in the mindes of many simple folke and specially of suche whom we haue before conuerted from heresy VVho hauing an eye to the See of Alexandria and other bishops whiche haue condemned vs will perhappes iudge that we are not able to discerne the true and right doctrine Thus Farre Theodoret in his supplication and Appeale to Leo the Bishopp of Rome he hymselfe beinge a bishop of Cyrus in the East and subiecte properly to the prouince and Patriarkeship of Antioche not of Rome By this his Appeale and by the Restitution also to his bishopricke whiche ensued hereupon by Leo the Pope as I haue before declared out of the Chalcedon Councell and by the whole wordes of Theodoret it is euident that calling the Churche of Rome Orbi terrarum praesidentem or quae preest orbi terrarum the President and gouuerner of the worlde he meaned not a preferment only of sitting in place before other bishoppes but a Superiour Authorite and Primacy ouer other bishoppes and such as to whome from a Patriarche and Councell of Bishops he might yet Appeale Yet saieth M. Iewell Iewell He might 548. better haue turned it Ecclesiam orbis primariam The most notable or châ—â—sâ— Churche of the woâ—lde And so woulde his translation haue well agreed with the Constitutions of the Emperour Iustinian wherein the preeminence of sitting in the first place in all Councelles and assemblies is by special Priuilege graunted to the bisshop of Rome To the Constitutions of Iustinian touching the bishopp of Romes prerogatiue I haue answered before in the 99. Vntruthe And declared there the greate vntruthe of M. Iewelâ— falsifying and corrupting the Constitutions of Iustinian And nowe touching the translation of this place I leaue it to euery indifferent Reader perusinge the whole wordes of Theodorets epistle considering the cause and ende of his writing to iudge whether the translation