Selected quad for the lemma: law_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
law_n	according_a	great_a	king_n	5,046	5	3.6170	3	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A10973	Two dialogues, or conferences (about an old question lately renued, and by the schismaticall company, both by printed pamphlets, and otherwise to the disturbance of the Churches quiet, and of peaceable minds, very hotly pursued.) Concerning kneeling in the very act of receiuing the sacramental bread and wine, in the Supper of the Lord The former betweene two ministers of the word, the one refractarie, and depriued; the other not so. The latter betweene an humorous schismatike and a setled professor.	Rogers, Thomas, d. 1616.	1608 (1608)	STC 21241; ESTC S116109	75,976	132

the example of Christ by our Kneeling and therefore in Kneeling do not sinne S. Setting vp of Images in Churches onely to be Laie mens bookes is by authority condemned because they are as stumbling blockes in the way of the blind So that they haue beene are still and will bee here-after worshipped by ignorant persons Is not Kneeling as scandalous How can it then be iustified P. Iustly haue Images those Lay-mens bookes by authority beene condemned I thinke you will affirme as much Gods word is directly against such Images Now could you make good your words that Kneeling is as scandalous now as Images sometime were in our Churches I would be of your minde that it is to bee condemned as Images were That Images the Images I meane that you speake of are such stumbling blocks I doe read both in the bookes of God and otherwise in most godly and approoued writers old and new but that kneeling at the Communion is as scandalous as Images and therefore to be condemned is doctrine proceeding newly from the braine of of you Schismaticks neuer afore heard of among the people of God SECTION 13. Whether the Kings commandement to Kneele maketh Kneeling to be no sinne S. IT is said that the Kings commandement taketh away scandall in things indifferent P. What say you herevnto S. It may be auerred that this is a begging of a questiō except it be proued by the word that Kneeling may bee without sinne that though it be an institution of man contrary to the example of Christ a signe of cōmunion rather with Antichrist his synagogue of Rome thē with Christ and his church it haue no proportion with Sacramentall eating and haue beene is and will be bread-worship P. That wee may kneele at the Communion with-out sinne and that the said Kneeling is neither a meere institution of man nor contrary to the example of Christ nor a signe of any Communion at all with Antichrist his synagogue nor hinders a whit the Sacramentall eating of Christ nor finally with vs euer hath beene is or I hope shall bee any Bread-worship hath sufficiently beene prooued by vndeniable and strong arguments And therefore go on prooue that it may not by the authority of the King be enioyned S. Suppose that in it self it were as indifferent as was eating of flesh sacrificed to an Idol not in the Idols temple but at a priuat table where no weake ones were in the Apostles time yet how doth the Kings cōmandement take away scandall from Kneeling in publicke places doth it make all so sure that none can be scandalized or if that cannot be doth it take away guiltinesse from the scandalizer as if all the blame of scandalizing were in the Kings commandement Surely it must be in the former or else in the latter it cannot be P. Our Kneeling euen in the publicke churches is no scandalizing but accidentally as any good euen the best thing may bee And therefore neither doth the King offend in commanding nor wee offend in obeying and so is there neither scandall nor scandalizer nor any iustly scandalized by kneeling for neither doth Kneeling nor the Kneeler nor the King commanding to kneele deserue any blame You take things for granted which will not be confessed Here is no offence giuē in any respect at all S. By scandalizing a weake brother perrisheth Of whose blood the scandalizer is guiltie as Ioab was of Vriabs blood notwith-standing the Kings commandement P. What of this Insinuate you all Kneelers to be like bloody Ioabs our King commanding vs to Kneele to like Dauid when hee commanded that Vriah should bee murdered O vndutifull vngodly and inconsiderate imputations S. Here his Maiestie knowne to be of a gentle disposition and to haue learned yea professed better things in Scotland is most-humbly prayed to take the word King as spoken in imitation and vnder-stood of Cantor who knowne to be of a violent disposition did carry matters in the conuocation and published Canons not orderly and fully concluded as some of his Suffragane Prelates reported P. His Maiestie liued in Scotland a long-while and many years among Puritanes yet was neuer any Puritane him-selfe The most-reuerend Father whome you tearme in derision Cantor did neuer any thing about the publike affaires of the Church but vpon good aduise and lawfull consent nor published any Canons for the ordering of the Church but the soueraigne person of the kingdome euen his Maiestie him-selfe and that according to the Lawes and Statutes of the Realme and vnder his great Seale ratified them all These reproachfull words do but wound his Maiestie in the sides of his officers Go to your matter leaue thē if you haue any more to say S. It is impossible that the Kings commandement should make all so sure that none can bee scandalized the general ignorance of the people the dispotitiō of the ignorant vnto superstition the old leauen of Poperie not purged the multiplying of Papists all well considered P. All these thinges considered Kneeling at the communion vses according to th'ordinance of the Church of England and none otherwise is no Scandall giuen S. Nay rather it is likely that by the commandement the Scandall should bee the greater especially in regard of the 27. Canon where ministers are commanded vnder paine of suspension not wittingly to administer the Sacraments to any but to such as Kneele P. The Canon is necessary and to the preseruation of vnitie and the preuenting of hatefull confusions which otherwise too-offensiuely would spring spread ouer the kingdome Dangerous maladies must haue eating and biting medicines Gods ministers may thanke you Schismatikes for this seuere discipline They that wil not receiue Gods sacraments but as they list must by seuerity be driuen to take thē as they should It is a good rule in Phisicke stay the beginnings The Philosophers do say how Mod●eus error in principio fit maximus in fine That error which at the last was greatest at the first was but a little one in Diuinitie we finde the same to bee most true For the foulest and most horrible heresies sprang but of petty Schismatikes at the first They must in time meete with cut of those Shismes that would not haue the Church pestered and molested with heretikes This very discourse of ours may put the world in minde what hideous horrible fancies this Recusancie of yours to Kneele leauing the vnion of the Church and Communion with vs in the sacraments because yee will not kneele hath already ingendred Your errors here-about are foule and monstrous and yet worser are behinde for the preuenting whereof we are on all sides from the King to the lowest and meanest subiect to set to our helping hands Neither be you nor any other men to thinke that punishment seuere which is rather necessarily for a publike good then willingly inflicted S. May not simple and superstitious persons take occasion thus to argue Why should Kneeling be

Kneeling there may rightly be iudged both a grosse mocking of Christ as was the souldiers their bowing of Knees before him and is the taking of the name God in vaine But what is this to our Kneeling here in England at the participation of the blessed Sacrament where all things are by authoritie enioined to be done both respectiuely reuerently and with due deuotion voide of superstition Schis Did Naaman newly brought to the knowledge of God attribute so much to the bowing in the house of Rimmon when his master leaned on him so that it was not his voluntarie action and shall we who haue had the Gospel long Kneeling by institution and determination in a principal part of Gods seruice make no account whether we honor God or no by Kneeling Pro. Naaman the Assyrian neither voluntarily would nor forcible could be drawne to commit Idolatrie whose example may teach vs all whether old Professors or new Conuerts to keepe our selues free from all Idolatrous pollutions Naaman after his conuersion came if he did come into the house of Rimmon and bowed as wee come into our Churches and Kneele but yet neither be our Churches as the house of Rimmon neither bow wee so much as before Idols much lesse idolatrously when we participate of the sacred mysteries And though by institution and determination of the Church when we take eate and drinke we Kneele yet by our said kneeling we doe honor God in this principall part of his seruice your selfe hath acknowledged the gesture of Kneeling to be the most solemne signe of reuerence we do say the same SECT 3. Whether Kneeling at the Communion be a wil-worship Schis IF Kneeling be instituted for a more reuerent receiuing then it must be either in regard of God or of bread and wine Pro. Not of bread and wine Sch. If in regard of God then must we be wel perswaded that such kneeling is an acceptable seruice vnto his maiestie Pro. We are so perswaded or ought so to be els in Kneelieg we sinne yea as you say it cannot be without sinne For whatsoeuer is not of faith is sinne Schis That this may be we must consider whether such Kneeling be a wil worship or a seruice reasonable and according to Gods will lest otherwise we find ourselues so farre from honoring God as that we prouoke him as did Nadab Abihu who offered incense but not the verie fire which God appointed were therfore deuoured with fire And as did king Dauid and the Priests who caried the Arke otherwise then it ought to haue beene and therefore Vzza died for it with a sodaine death For God will be sanctified if not by yet in all them that come neere him Pro. Our kneeling is no will worship but a seruice reasonble according to Gods will as be all the ecclesiasticall ordinances whatsoeuer not besides or contrarie to the reuealed will of God Such constitutions I call not humane tradition saith Bullinger because they are deriued from the diuine Scripture not deuised in the braine of man and vsed of her viz. the Church which hearkneth vnto the voice of her only shepheard acknowledging not the voice of others For example the Church commeth together to heare Gods word vnto publique praiers both in the morning euening at appointed houres as is commodious for euery place people and that is in stead of a law Againe the Church hath supplications holy-dayes and publque fasts vnder certaine lawes The Church moreouer at certaine times in a certain place and prescribed maner celebrateth the sacraments that according to the lawes and receiued custome of the Church The Chuch likewise baptizeth infants remoueth not women from the Lords Supper and this she hath for a law By her deputed Iudges the Church determineth in causes matrimoniall and in these things hath certaine lawes But all these other like these she draweth from the general scriptures and for edification sake applieth them to places times and persons whereby wee may indeed behold in sundrie Churches a diuersitie of formes but no discord at all So that worthy man And agreeably hereunto the Church of Sweathland Quae cum Scriptura cōsonant those constitutions which agree with the Scripture be ordained for the bettering of maners benefite of mankind albeit according to the verie word they be not expressed in the Scriptures yet in as much as they proceede from the generall precept of Loue which hath ordained all things in most comely order they deserue to be esteemed diuine rather then humane constitutions c. Many such truly the Church doth lawfully obserue at this day and as occasion also is ministred appointeth new which whoso shall reiect the words are memorable he doth despise the authority not of men but of God whose tradition it is whatsoeuer is commodious And so they whose words haue passed vncensured by the publishers of the Harmonie of the Churches confessions If you then can shew no word of God to the contrarie we cannot but hold the order for Kneeling to bee the ordinance of God And therefore the example by you cited of Nadab Abihu and Vzza trouble not vs who conscionably do Kneele and keepe the orders of a most reformed Church but may pierce your heart and the rest of our new Recusants the separated brotherhood who obstinately despise and violate the ordinances of our Church allowed because no where disallowed in the booke of God SECT 4. Whether Christ his example in euerie thing at the ministration of the Communion is necessarily to be followed Schis BVt Kneeling is contrarie to the example of Christ and his Apostles Pro. Well may kneeling differ but surely it is contrarie to none example of theirs Schis They ministred and receiued Sitting or in such a gesture as in those Countries was most vsed at eating Pro. The truth is you cannot directly say how the Lords supper was ministred or receiued in Christ and his Apostles daies and therefore you say how by them it was ministred and receiued Sitting Schis From his example to differ without warrant from Gods word cannot be without fault Pro. Nay rather to bind vs necessarily to the example of Christ in all ceremoniall matters without warrant from Gods word cannot be without great offence Schis Examples of holy men much more of Christ are to be followed except there be some reasonable cause to the contrarie Pro. True Schis The Apostle to reforme an abuse which crept euen in their times into Loue feasts which were immediatly before or after the Lords Supper did banish them thence and reduced the maner of administring the Lords Supper to the first institution saying Shall I praise you in this I praise you not For I haue receiued of the Lord which I haue also deliuered vnto you Pro. The Loue-feasts abused by the Corinthians were spoken against by the Apostle not because they were feasts or feasts of Loue made after or before the receiuing the