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A74651
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The clergie in their colors or, the pride and avarice of the Presbyterian clergie hindering reformation: shewing, how from time to time they have not onely been the fomenters of this first and second war, but also by their horrid fallacies have to this present time deluded the common-vvealth. Discovered in a plain and familiar dialogue betvveen Philalethes and Presbyter.; Pride and avarice of the clergie.
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Boun, Abraham.
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1651
(1651)
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Wing B3835; Thomason E1416_1; ESTC R209447
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53,245
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199
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and put out at their pleasures and this must be allowed for the people surrendred or rather yeilded up by compulsion into the hands of these wolves pretending to be Shepherds all their right and power But alas this grew through corruption of time when Antichrist was come to his height then he and his Prelates inthralled the Churches and wrested from the poor people that right which the Gospel gave unto them and which continued for the first three hundred years after Christ as is confessed by the Papists and Protestants Fullers holy state li. 2. ca. 12. pa. 87. Acts 1.23 6.5 Calvin Instit l. 4. ca. 19. Sect. 31. 14. Se. 31. Cath Divine An. Caudrey Case Prefa sect 8. Magd Cent. 2. ca. 7. cent 3. c. 7 Cipr. epist l. 1. epist 4. epist 3. l. 1.3 epist 11. But these Wolves made void the Law of God by their Traditions and the slavish Ministerie of England are unwilling to come out of this Babylonish servitude but with Issachar because he sees rest is good or rather his Benefice fat he croucheth down under the burthen But see the use and equitie of it in our dayes it may be at the first this power of presentation was given to a good man or rather he took it because he founded or endowed the Church but by revolution of times it comes by descent or purchase to an Atheist a Papist a Symonist or some wretch not fit to be trusted with the life and death of a dog much less with the soules of men And by this means the souls of men according to that Prophecie become the merchandize of Rome for who seeth them not set to sale almost by every Patron yea and their bodies too Rev. 18.13 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for according to the number of the people and the profit of their bodily labours is the Advowson sold for more or less And I know no other way in all the world how the bodies and souls of men can be made the merchandize of Rome but by this means nor is the Prophecie any other way fulfilled for if it should be meant of selling slaves that properly belongs to the Turks Pr. But I told you although some Patrons prove Latrons and sell the Presentations the people may except against the partie presented if he be not a worthie man and if they do not it s their own fault Ph. You had need to have more skill in Divinitie then you have in the Law Alas this Libertie is but a meer gullerie and cousenage of the people If any one refuse to admit or do keep out the partie presented And a quare impedit or such Writ be brought to trie the right Gods Law never comes into question but only who hath the best title to present by the Law of the Land which is Popish in that point as in manie others the Lord of heaven amend it and lookes only upon the presentation as a temporal right without judging the matter as appertaining to Religion therefore I pray you speak no more of this matter for the more you stir in in it the more it stinks But shew me some better evidence of your calling Pr. I will shew you sufficient Wee have abilities and gifts fit for the Ministerie being apt to teach and able to divide the word of truth aright And our Ministerie is sealed by the conversion of soules and however our outward calling in a nicetie may be defective yet we have the inward which is most effectuall and therefore there is no cause of separation Ph. For your calling I account it not right for what you formerly alledged And for that you last said its no proofe that your calling to the Ministerie is lawful for a private man may be abundantly gifted yea and convert souls as common experience sheweth and yet have no calling to the Ministerie And this I dare farther add and know by mine own observation that God doth not bless the Ministers labours who have received the mark of the Beast by their conformities and subscriptions as he doth the labours of other faithful men And the reason is because they stood not in Gods wayes for if they had they should have turned the people from their iniquities But for want of a faithful Ministerie it hath pleased God to blesse the endeavours of godly Parents and religious governours of families and private Christians who with Joshua serve the Lord to the conversion of many more souls then are turned unto God by these mens Ministery how learned and Orthodox soever So that where a man can hardly finde any converted by the Ministery of these men he may finde the footsteps of Religion and godlinesse derived from religious Parents and Families for the continuance of the Church from generation to generation even to admiration And your old conformitie and Subscription which you are constrained to defend by Popish arguments when you have to deal against the Brownists and Independents are a great blemish to the Ministery Pr. We subscribed to nothing which was unlawfull although many things were inconvenient Ph. Thanks bee to God that we be rid of the Hierarchy of Arch-bishops Diocesan Bishops Arch-Deacons Deans and the rest of that rabble the Books of Common-prayer Homilies consecration of Priests and Deacons with the spiritual Courts Licenses Dispensations Commutations of Pennance Consecration of daies to Saints and some to wicked men and Idols as the Crosse and the Rhoode daies observed by some forbidding of meats and marriage at some times with their Canons and Ceremonies Crosses Surplices worship of the breaden God and many other popish trinkets All which the most ingenious amongst your selves have condemned as not capable of purgation but fit to be abolished else I could easily prove the whole body of them which are contained in your Subscription most of them being injoyned and set forth in the Rubrick and the rest comprehended in your Oath and Canonicall obedience to be reliques of Antichrist invented by that man of sin and his vassals and are at the best humane presumptions brought into the Church without warrant of the Word Vid. Preface to the Common-prayer Book or teaching Ceremonies which Christ onely ought to appoint who is the Teacher of his Church and serve for nothing else but to mis-leade the simple and to offend the weak and tend onely to conformity with Rome And therefore altogether unlawfull But cheifly the Cross which in Baptism is made the sign and Seal of the whole work of Sanctification is the worst of all Popish Ceremonies and the greatest Idol in the Romish Church except the Virgin Marie for that blesseth all the rest and therefore is the greater as Bellarmine teacheth Bellar. Contr. de sacra Confer l. 2. c. 13. pa. 371. These things you know better then I do yet I name them thus briefly that you may consider of them and not wilfully hudwink your conscience and imprison or withhold the truth in unrighteousness but that you may come
either a lawfull Minister or one who stands in place of such who in some degree preacheth or at least publisheth by reading the word of God and administreth the Sacraments to the people therefore in charitie they ought to be accounted the Church of God Ph. The division of Parishes and such a Ministerie and Ordinances as you speak of are not sufficient to give the Parish Congregation the denomination of a visible Church of Christ For then must almost all the Congregations under the Papacie be visible Churches for amongst them the Parishes are divided and so they were in England almost 340. before any Reformation And those Popish Congregations had the word of God dailie read nay and preached constantly and expounded in manie places by their Friers and Postillers as may be seen by their works in Print Nay and their verie Mass-Books have much of the word of God in them although most miserably corrupted and mingled with their own inventions They have also had both Sacraments amongst the Papists for a long time and have yet at least Calvin Instit l. 4. ca. 3. Sect. 11. Baptisme mingled with Popish Ceremonies of which the Cross is the worst and some other footsteps of a true Church And if these had made a Congregation a true Church poore Penry was unwise to publish that a great part of Wales never had the face of a Church of Christ the Parishes being divided and the Churches furnished with such a Ministerie and Ordinances as you speak of Yet he and others have formerly charged the State with refusing the Gospel and rejecting Christ and his pure worship in as much as there was no Reformation although it cost him and others their lives for their boldnes Entri Cook Judit pa. 352. Pr. You speak of dark Corners of the Land as if none were in better condition you may finde amongst the manie thousand Parishes of this Nation manie visible Churches of Christ and mine in particular Ph. I doubt not but there are manie visible Churches of Christ in this Common-wealth and true Ministers of Christ lawfully called But when I pray you became your Parish to be a true visible Church of Christ Pr. My Parish hath been a visible Church ever since it was instituted and the Church founded you know not the contrarie and therefore ought to admit it having so continued beyond the memorie of man until this day Ph. When was your Church founded Pr. You your self have confessed that the Gospel was planted in England before Poperie came to its height and the Ministerie and Churches were then setled and had succession from the Apostles daies shew me when the Succession failed Ph. If I should admit the place that you call Church viz. the meeting Place to have been built before Poperie yet this proves not that the Congregation is a visible Church your succession hath had several interruptions and discontinuance First it is to be considered that the whole Current of Historie agree that the Romans commanded the better part of Brittaine from the time of Julius Caesar until Theodosius the younger which was almost five hundred years and the tenth Persecution about 337. years after Christ during which time there were not above five of the Emperours who were either Christians or shewed favour to Christians but generally all the rest first or last in their times were wicked Persecutors Heathens and worshippers of Idols some of which by exquisite Torments wasted the Churches of Christ and drove the Professors into corners they not daring to meet in publick When the Roman Empire was broken or at least was grown to an ebb the Saxons invaded this Island and about the year foure hundred and fiftie the Brittains were beaten into Wales by Gormundus and thence grew the great Colledge of Moncks at Bangor with whom Austin contended And the Saxons as well as the Romans were Heathens and had their Idol Priests Flammins and Arch Flammins like the late Bishops and Arch-Bishops for dignitie and Power and these continued until about six hundred years after Christ where is now your Succession Pr. But yet there were manie faithful Christians both Pastors and others in the worst times and I could tell you of manie who suffered Martyrdome for Christ's cause in this Nation and if we cannot prove Succession it is rather for want of the light of Historie then for that there were no such Churches or Pastors Nevertheless from the time of the abolishing of the Heathens Hierarchie and Idolatrie which was done by King Ethelbert above a thousand years since we have a verie fair Succession Ph. This indeed manie of you boast of but it makes little for your purpose To omit to speak of the miserie brought upon this Land and the decay of the true Religion by meanes of the incursions or rather Conquests of the Saxons and Danes after Ethelberts time It is certain and you cannot denie it that all your successions both of Ministerie and Parish-Churches came from your Mother the Church or rather the Whore of Rome who had all at her devotion until King Henrie the eight drove out the Pope and kept Poperie Cath. Divine An. Caudreys Case P. 108.109 Bed l. 1. Hist Angl. ca. 22. 27. Pr. Well it s true that for about five hundred years untill the Reformation began the Bishop of Rome usurped authoritie over the Church of England but yet all did not submit alike some faithfull men escaped both Ministers and people as John Wickliff and his followers persecuted by the name of Lollards who grew in great number even in our Countrie about two hundred years before the Reformation From which time of Reformation you cannot denie but that my Parish in particular hath been a true visible Church where there hath been a competent number of faithful people and a Minister who claimed nothing from Rome for the Popes Supremacie was abolished by King Henrie the eight as you now said Ph. If the rejecting of the Popes Supremacie make your Parish a true Church then likewise are the most of the Popish Congregations of France true Churches for they likewise have rejected or refused to receive the Popes Supremacie and have not received the Councel of Trent but have had a Pope a Cardinal of their own for manie years past And Cardinal Richelieu called a Prince of the Church was as great a Pope as William Laud late Prelate of Canterburie Marc. de vulson des Libert de'l Eglise Gallicane lib. 3. pa. 233.234.235 Pr. You cannot denie the Succession of faithful Ministers which if you admit you must also admit the Succession of Churches since the time of Reformation Ph. For your Succession it s a mear dream If at any time there was no visible Parish-Churches then was there no Pastors of those Churches for although there may be a visible Church without a Pastor as when the Pastor dieth the Church is not unchurched yet can there be no Pastor of a Church unless there be such a Church in