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B12204 An ansvvere to a letter of a Iesuited gentleman, by his cosin, Maister A.C. Concerning the appeale; state, Iesuits Copley, Anthony, 1567-1607?; Champney, Anthony, 1569?-1643?, attributed name. 1601 (1601) STC 5735; ESTC S108680 66,056 126

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all at one time Nay more to note the will of God in this behalfe he also tooke away the issue he had as I haue crediblie heard by our Queene as it were to shew that hee would not haue England anie way Spanish though England it selfe neuer so faine would Great and ample dowre he likewise laid vnto Englands crowne by the match and yet it was not Gods will that all that should winne England Spanish How much more may we then hope in God neuer to see it such by being laid to Spaine especiallie so baselie and abiectlie as these hot-spurre Fathers would haue it seeing that Spaine laid to it in so wooing wise could not make it Spanish Moreouer what reason were it that Spaine should be so great aboue all her neighbours as by the possessing of England nay what preiudice were it not to all christendome considering the proude and tyrannous humour of that nation Say that we for our parts should haue Catholicke religion by the meanes with it peace and trafficke with all christendome and all christendome the same with vs and perhaps all christian Princes peace with one another too which by our practises say the Iesuits hath bin and daylie is infringed Graunt we all this doth it therefore follow that Spaine is sure to haue euer a good king ouer her to administer such her greatnesse in good manner yea is Spaine euer sure of a Catholicke king vnder whom to continue Catholicke it self and all her estates vnder her In the fiue twentieth yeere of the raigne of our Soueraigne Lord and King Henrie the eight Catholicke religion was as vnlikely to haue bin supprest in England as it is at this day in Spaine vnder Philip the third and yet we see how soone after it followed and what it is now come to The like may chaunce to Spaine vnder a king according and by the same reason why may not wee also hope for Catholicke religion yet once againe here in England as they not expect the Protestant it being no more impossible nay more probable for a Protestant-Prince to returne Catholicke seeing that magna est veritas praualet then for a Catholicke one to turne Protestant it being too true that ruimus in vetitum semper cupimusque negata But say that Spaine should be so fortunate in her Soueraignes as to haue them euer Catholicke whereby Catholicke religion still to flourish in their dominions yet neither doth that take away all other mischiefes which may follow of their greatnes as breach with their neighbour-Princes and so warres abroad and be but for imployment of such spirits as happilie would else through peace be tumultuous at home consequently oppression of their subiects for the maintaining of those warres especiallie their subiects lying so farre off as England gouerned by their deputies together with a thousand such like mischiefes which are incident to great Monarches as from their greatnes and hauing more then they can well weld though nere so Catholicke and good otherwise And if it be so as the Iesuits calumniate that England alone troubles all the world how much more trow yee would all the world be troubled were Spaine and England one vnder a quarrellous Prince or rather how would not England then haue her part of troubles with all the world which now is quiet Great are the hazards that are from greatest Monarches both to the Church and the ciuill state of the world for that their taking to be bad as most men are naturallie so inclinde especiallie when aboue controule carries all in like manner with them making their greatnesse the counterpoise or ouer-biasse to goodnesse as wee read in the Greeke Emperours whose aptnesse to heresie wrought continuall schismes in the church till in the end God gaue that Empire with her Emperour ouer for the same to the Turke as aforesaid So likewise afore them the Romaine Emperours who being manie bad to one good what disorder wrought not their example and authoritie throughout all their Empire for which it pleased God at last to dissolue it and conuert it into manie kingdomes and Prouinces as now we see it whereby though one state or kingdome should miscarie vnder an vnhappie Prince yet the rest may tarrie good and prosperous If then such hath bin the prouidence of God to depose the Romaine Empire from her greatnes for her sinnes as from her greatnes and hath disposd it into distinct states and Prouinces as in reformation why then doe the Iesuits so labour to erect a Spanish Empire against such the prouidence of God for the euils hee saw in the Romaine or rather why not let England continue English and worke it selfe Catholicke againe if it please God in English manner Are they so much of God almighties counsaile as to know whether is more to his honour the proceeding practise of the Seminaries as hitherto for the good of his church and our countrie or the Spanish sword Or rather what christian spirit is not able to distinguish whether of the two is more perfect and how little behoofefull nay how vnlawfull is the drumme and ensigne where the word is likelie to speed as here amongst vs it daylie makes faire shew to doe Briefe a Heathen man could see it to be better and say thereupon Cedant arma togae concedant laurea linguae Which such their Spanish raigne if it should once come to passe in our countrie as I beseech God I may neuer see it either with or against our wils how hard yea impossible a matter it were to euict that nation out againe Sicilie Naples Lumbardie and the greater part of the Low-countries doth at this day teach vs by their lamentable extreame bondage not that Spaines valour maintaines such her dominion ouer them but her Indies Most of all absurd therefore it is to thinke it likelie that which Father Cowbucke by his papers agents so labours to perswade viz. that of their owne good nature they wil selfelie auoide the realme after hauing once establisht the Catholicke religion in it which saith hee is all that the Catholicke king desires Oh vnsauorie assertion arguing rather that simplicitie which ought to be in a religious person then the subtilty that is in him As though if a reconciled foe be neuer to be throughlie affied a present enimie for pretended wrongs and who daylie seekes and assayes to be reuenged may hauing once the law in his own hand be so farre forth trusted as with a kingdome seeing that for it what faith what iustice euer tooke place in this world Or as though the pretence to continue our said holie religion amongst vs may not as stronglie perswade him were religion his meere motiue to settle in this land as to come to inuest the same Oh cosin shew yee me where euer religion and armes marcht so together shew ye me where euer ye read of a Prince that vanquishing a countrie by the sword euer left it but so which properly is
no leauings but losse Especially a crowne so sweet and so hard to winne as Englands is it likelie the Spaniard would not esteeme it worth the holding or leaue such a realme as this to it selfe contenting him onelie to haue it to friend when he may enioy it subiect Belieue me cosin they are no such Aesops coxcombs as finding so rich a iewell as England to leaue it as a thing of nought they hauing vsde the Indies long and being better iewellers then so nor are they so tēperate a people neither yet is Spaine so much the Paradice of the world it being for the most part a verie barren and desert soyle that they should hold England so little worth as not worth the holding If Englands amitie heretofore with Spaine haue not deserued a worthier opinion at her hands then so at least her late enmitie hath during which what boote we haue made of it both by land and by sea all the world knowes what it of vs it may put it in her eye Besides the deere proffer the Spaniard made for England as England as well as for reuenge in 88. with the losse both of their honours and liues and the infinite charges of their Armado shewes plainelie at what price they were willing to haue purchaste it at a lesse then which it is not likelie that they would euer haue left it Tush tush it is verie well knowne that the Spaniard so esteemes of England that not being able to make it Spanish hee could be content that euen Spaine were English for some yea sundrie honours which it hath and Spaine wants At least their wise and valorous king the Emperour Charles so esteemed of England that in his precepts to his sonne the last Phillip on his death-bed hee stucke not to make this one and that the greatest earthlie one vnto him in these words And sonne in briefe Paz con Yngalatierra y guerra con todo el mondo as much to say as Sonne be at peace with England and warre with all the world How base were it then in vs to disesteeme our nation so as to wish it vnder another which so highlie so noble an Emperour commended and which the Iesuits themselues finde to flow with milke and honie vnto them euen vnder persecution There is no question but greatlie may religion sway a Prince but yet not so as to leaue a Crowne We reade of manie that haue transgrest yea left all religion for a Crowne but of verie few that euer left a Crowne for religion Yea most Princes hold it a point of religion neuer to leaue a Crowne till a Crowne leaue them See then I pray how sillie an Oratour father Cowbucke is in this his gentle perswasion of the Spaniard and how vngentle a minde he beares to his countrie being indeed no gentleman and lastlie somewhat to excuse the man how well it steeds him to seeme the religious in this Paradox for his credits sake though thereby hee discredit his religion in but seeming so Neither for your credit-sake cosin will I anie further perswade you herein least in so seeming to vnder-value your iudgement in a cleare case I should seeme not onlie the discurteous vnto you but also vnciuill For what generous nature in the world would endure his countrie to be conquered by straungers or what sot imagine in a conquerour a voluntarie abandon of a Crowne seeing that in such a case aboue all other worldly cases whatsoeuer Non minor est virtus quàm quaerere parta tenere Passing politickelie notwithstanding deales the king of Spaine seeing his right to this realme and his successes of warre for the same haue hitherto bin no better to entertaine religious men in the pursuite thereof for that it is much what a religious person once turnd politicke may perswade with the vulgar making pure religion and deuotion his colours then which no Oratorie can so enueigle affections not onely to couet but also to vndertake matter euen against nature And on the other side too cheape were England wonne to Spaine with so piping neither need the king of Spaine greatlie repine at the few Caricks and townes wee haue taken and spoiled of his neither yet at his Catholicke charges in maintaining two Englishe Seminaries at this day to our Church in his countrie if he can carue himselfe so easie and so ample amends Which as touching the Seminaries quatinùs vnder Iesuits discipline and also his foresaid Armado of 88. if his charitie be so great toward vs or rather not his ambition for before the miscarriage of that Armado on our cost those Seminaries were not erected in Spaine but since are there not I pray other kingdomes aswell as England vpon which he may likewise practise such his Armadoes first and then after also erect them the like Seminaries namelie with Iesuit-superiours ouer them which if the one were without the other or that the Seminaries had beene erected before the Armado were no such suspitious dealing but truely very faire and friendly play like to the last French kings in that of Rhemes but as thus England may well say Timeo Danaos dona ferentes and the rather for that father Cowbucke hath of late gotten diuers of the youths hands of those Seminaries to the Ladie Infantaes title as wee heare which alasse poore man wil neuer earne him the price of a Cardinals hat much lesse the honor to weare it But as I say if the king of Spaines zeale be such as needs he will be doing why there is Denmarke and Scotland two ample kingdomes both hereticall why hath he no Iesuits there or why sends he no Armadoes thether Oh belike he sees that they haue kings to defend them and England but a Queene but a woman whom happily being such he would haue the world thinke he came a wooing vnto that yeere which truelie besides the manner being so martiall was also vnlawfull in the maine seeing it is not allowable for any Catholike much lesse the Catholicke king the king of Catholickes to marrie two sisters though the one were Catholicke without dispensation much lesse perforce Or if hee will say that not those kingdomes but England hath wronged him what is that I pray for English-men to betray therefore their countrie vnto him or why should not wee the rather for that reason suspect his pretence of religion in his comming Shall the sonne because the father hath done his neighbour wrong ioyne with that neighbour to cut his fathers throat God defend or were it religion or moralitie in that neighbour to make such vse of the sonne truelie no. And yet such is Spaines dealing with our countrie and vs at this day and so good Casuists are Iesuits Graunt wee as the Iesuits suggest that our countrie hath and doth maintaine Spaines rebels against her sackt her townes inuaded her tresures both by sea and land yet were it so and that it became subiects to define their Soueraignes affaires of state all that an English-Catholicke
being vnder so sharpe affliction you partly see alreadie and may imagine more whether partie so euer preuaile For what knowe we what vse the State wil make therof whether rather not to extinguish both by the meanes then to tolerate any All our comfort is to thinke that the hand of God whereunto no good thing is impossible can and will in honour of the much blood of his Seminary-Saints that hath ascended vp to him now these fortie yeeres out of our Church stint extreames and turne all to the best who perhaps permits the Societie and Arch-priest to be thus obdurate in their Schisme both to their finall shame to the greater good of our Church and countrey then yet we are worthy to apprehend For I assure yee Cosin as touching the latter latet anguis in herba which but by this meanes could not well be descried And though it seeme to vs but a matter vpon the By to the Appeale yet I doubt not but it is a principall in the eye of God and needing his especiall interuention It is Cosin at a word the whole state of our Countrey which the Iesuits labour whether in zeale to their Founder who was a Spaniard or in gratitude to Spaines benefits and generally of the house of Austrich to their societie to subiect to Spaine and in such faction and in such hope haue vnder pretence of Catholicke-Religion alreadie wonne vnto the Spaniard much ground in our Countrey which now that the plot is growne to a head in the Arch-priest they stronglie maintaine and daily gaine more and more in the hearts of Englishmen A shame that either Religion should be so profaned or English nature so stained grace neuer vsing to preuaricate nature but to accomplish it First therefore as touching the Bull of Pius 5. and the same since confirmed by Gregorie the thirteenth against her Maiestie as neither the Spaniard nor any other forraine power is either by expresse or implyed tearmes thereof incited to dominion ouer this land as little are English hearts thereby disallegeanced so from her Maiestie as to concur with any forraine Inuadour For though the said Buls vpon her Maiesties Excommunication therein promulged doe de facto assoyle the subiects of this Realme from their homage vnto her it therefore followes not that they must and ought to be parties against her Maiestie and their Countrie to a forraine power howsoeuer pretending euen Religion or other ciuill good thereunto for that were to conster the Popes act so ouer-much in religion and grace as to the destruction of nature which were against the Maxime aforesaid For a man to goe against his owne Countrey is and euer was holden in the ciuill part of the world an act Contra ius gentium and also vnnaturall yea and against all grace Besides that Christ neuer did delegate any such power to Saint Peter as Tradere gentem in gentem that being a meere temporall reuenge and he but his Viccar spitituall Yea he expressely rebuked him for drawing his sword and cutting off Malchas his eare Christ saying vnto him Tibi dabo claues regni caelorum and Pasce agnos meos pasce ones meas sounds cleane in another sence Moreouer Mihi vindictam ego retribuam saith our Sauiour to all à fortiore to the Cleargie and by his Prophet else where Iustitia iudicium correctio sedis eius Ignis ante ipsum praecedet inflammabit in circuitu inimicos eius c. So as Saint Peters Commission against transgressing Kings and kingdomes is no more then only to denounce by Excommunication and other the like Ecclesiasticall censures Gods displeasure against them for their transgression and not to exercise the secular sword at all namely in such a manner of reuenge as is said but leaue that to him who only hath power ouer Princes and Principalities to conuert and subuert at his pleasure And euen the Sea Apostolike it selfe hath been subiect to transmigration sundry times vnder the hand of God and as it hath seemed his angrie hand too as well as prophane states the supreme Pastors hauing themselues been often forced to forsake Rome whilest it was a sacking and euen at one clap were away at Auignion almost 80. yeares which if translation of States were so absolutely in the Popes holines power it is not likely he would neither yet God haue permitted his owne Sea to bee so disparaged ne would the demesnes thereof be so small as they are at this day And whereas it may be obiected that the Prophet Samuel elected erected and consecrated Dauid King of Israel in priuation of Saule for his preuarication ergo the Popes holines may tradere gentem in gentem that followes not for that neither this act of Samuel was such a tradition Dauid being a Patriot of Israel and no forrainer as also forasmuch as Dauid did not execute that his Royaltie in any such manner as might argue blood and conquest he hauing him sundrie times in his power might easilie haue slaine him if he had would but as wee read expresselie in the storie did bemone yea and reuenge the death of Saul and all because he was Gods annointed such as her Maiestie is ouer vs at this day by the hand euen of a Catholicke Bishop So likewise the translation of the Romaine Empire by Leo the fourth to Charlemaine and his successors which was the greatest translation of temporall state that euer was done by the Papall hand for that of Constantines was of himselfe in bountie to the Church that I say of Leo was no such tradition as gentis in gentem it being but titular onlie and not in defeazance of the Grecian Empire either in her Emperiall title or demesnes the said Empire continuing certaine hundred yeeres after in ech till in the end vindicta diuina dissolued it giuing it ouer for heresie in verè alienam gentem both for rites and language viz. the Turke who to this day is Lord of it all I inforce not thus much vnto you cosin touching the Popes holinesse ciuill sword as to derogate any whit from it or presumptuouslie to take vpon me to dispute his Commission otherwise then vnder correction and in all submission to holie Church if I mistake but onlie in aduancement of S. Peters chaire and his keyes vnto which I professe a full and firme beleeuing soule in reuerence and reference whereunto as also in loyall loue to my Prince and countrie and zeale to the Seminaries fructification hitherto by the word being likelie to performe it in time to a wished end continuing as they haue begun and with what els may happen Englishlie to the same end vpon the bie I say againe I doe not see how that that chaire those keyes to be imbrude in blood and to atchiue Conquests especially such a tradition as of England to Spaine by the sword can any waies stand eyther with Christs or his said vicars honour Againe neither hath the practise of the supreame Pastours
from S. Peter to this day beene such that euer I reade Ignem veni mittere in terram quid volo nisi vt ardeat being a fire that Christ neuer meant as out of two flints by repercussion or out of steele by hard-edge but such a fire as hee sent downe in forme of disparted tongues ouer his sacred mother and the Apostolike assemblie at Pentecost and that which Saint Augustine our countries Apostle brought ouer to Eleutherius our king from Saint Peters sea Such is the fire that burnes in Iesus name and such the fire that flames from forth the Seminaries amōgst vs at this day Volentes trahit saith S. Paul of the holie ghost hauing his spirit nolentes non cogit The Iesuits mistake groslie if they thinke that God is to come to his spouse in turbine tonitru for such shall be the comming of Antichrist another day but in leui aura quasi susurrans Saxonie that was subdued to the Catholicke faith by armes how short time continued it therin being the last of all the Germaine-Prouinces that receiued it and the first that forsooke it In like manner at this instant hath not the Poland king receiued notable domage and daylie doth both in his owne and the Churches estate at the hands of his natural subiects the Sweathlands vnder the conduct of his vncle Fredericke whom they haue chosen their Protector and as now the newes is their king against him comming at the Iesuits instigation to conquer them to the Catholike faith Hath hee not lost not onelie all that his naturall heritage this of Poland being his kingdome but by election from euer being by all likelihood Catholicke againe it being now by meanes of such his prouocation the rather rooted in heresie but also part of Liefeland too which before was Catholicke besides his honour and all his charges of warre Such forsooth was the Iesuits religion in this case and so set they on the king to reuenge their wrongs rather then his or Gods and the irreuerence those people did them as they informd comming to take place and to preach amongst them by vertue of the kings letters-patents And thus if the Popes holinesse had anie such commission as is said the Iesuits doe vsurpe it they hauing I am sure no Breue of his to shew whereby thus to set kingdome against kingdome for religion as Poland against Sweathland and Spaine against vs. The knights of the Temple of Rhodes those of Malta at this day though they be the vowed souldiers of Christ his church neuer bore so quarrellous and irreligious spirits neither yet the Iesuits founder though hee were sometimes a souldiour left them any such rule But least of all is the Spaniard so peaceable a man amongst his neighbours as that hee neede to be nowd on to quarrels by the religious Howsoeuer that is not the way cosin the spirit of Christ being meeke and humble and what manner of Ghospelling he propounded to his Apostles and what armes viz. a scrip and a staffe you may read in the Acts. Moreouer if propter iniustitias c. as in 2. Reg. God to deliuer a nation ouer to the hands of another nation be his curse to that nation so giuen ouer and not his blessing is it meete that the Patriotts of the same should exhibit themselues instruments thereunto all people being bound to complie with their countrie as with their mother in all Gods blessings and not his maledictions Now then seeing it doth or may appeare vnto you that the king of Spaine neither de facto hath nor de iure can haue anie autenticke title or colour of title from the sea-Apostolicke to the royall Crowne of this land as for religion which of all pretences is most forceable much more easilie and iustlie may you condemne the Iesuits for perswading amongst vs a Spanish title thereunto in blood which the Spaniard himselfe neuer to this day yet pretended either in himselfe or his predecessors and lastlie if such their supposed title together with the aforesaid from the church faile then forsooth the benefit of Spaines conquering vs which of all other positions is most absurde Touching their title in blood then were it neuer so new and so true it is sufficient answer therunto to say that in respect they are meere straungers and of another nation I meane the king and his sister both such their title is voide and of no effect as well as for Fraunce to impleade their Sallicke-law in barre against Englands title vnto it Againe prescription were also a competēt estopple vnto them they pretending from king Iohn and Edward the third and yet neither their ancestors nor they themselues hauing layed in their claime to this day which during the deuision of the houses of Lancaster and Yorke at what time it continuing long and the whole land likewise therevpon deuided in ciuil warres it was a fit season for the Spaniard to haue done set in foote considering that vis diuisa debilis and also being then neerer the stemme of this pretended title which would haue made the better show Briefe if titles so farre fetcht might take place for a Crowne I wisse there are in this land a manie poore persons at this houre that might be serud before Spaine And as for king Iohn though hee were not the best Prince either to the Church or our Countrie but vnfortunate to ech and to him selfe most yet will we not hold him so vnblest of God and vnhappie as that from his loyne should be intituled a forraine-pretender to this realme ne euer built hee London bridge for a Spanish Conqueror to trample on as I haue often heard that nation bost of such a day Much lesse king Edward that our victorious king may his ghost abide to see England vnder a forraine rule who subdued forraine powers and Crownes to it Be this enough said and more then needs touching Spaines title in blood to England seeing that euen a meere English pretendant to deduce a title so farre off and after so manie changes amongst vs without making claime any time betweene were absurd much more so meere strangers present enimies as both they are to our state for which as little reason wee haue as for their religious pretence aforesaid to be any way parties to their raignes ouer vs. Touching their conquest then and the vtilitie therof to our countrie which is the last point the Iesuits perswade the other two fayling they doe well verilie to suggest it vtill at least if so seeing that vulgus amicitias vtilitate probat rather then honest and honourable which at all it would not be but contrariwise a meere wrong in them to attempt and slauerie in vs to endure So noble an Iland as this which to vse the Spanish Chronographers owne words was one of the 3. prime plumes in the helme of the Romaine Empire at her greatest the other two quoth he being Spaine and Fraunce an Iland which