ear_n of_o seduce_a christian_n 4._o in_o all_o humane_a and_o divide_a party_n whatsoever_o num._n 4_o after_o these_o reason_n thus_o give_v by_o he_o a._n c._n tell_v i_o that_o i_o 73._o neither_o do_v nor_o can_v prove_v any_o superstition_n or_o error_n to_o be_v in_o the_o roman_a do_v religion_n what_o none_o at_o all_o now_o true_o i_o will_v to_o god_n from_o my_o heart_n this_o be_v true_a and_o that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n wear_v so_o happy_a and_o the_o whole_a catholic_a church_n thereby_o bless_v with_o truth_n and_o peace_n for_o i_o be_o confident_a such_o truth_n as_o that_o will_v soon_o either_o command_v peace_n or_o 32._o confound_v peace-breaker_n but_o be_v there_o no_o superstition_n in_o adoration_n of_o image_n none_o in_o invocation_n of_o saint_n none_o in_o adoration_n of_o the_o sacrament_n be_v there_o no_o error_n in_o break_v christ_n own_a institution_n of_o the_o sacrament_n by_o give_v it_o but_o in_o one_o kind_n none_o about_o purgatory_n about_o common_a prayer_n in_o a_o unknown_a tongue_n none_o these_o and_o many_o more_o be_v in_o the_o roman_a religion_n if_o you_o will_v needs_o call_v it_o so_o and_o it_o be_v no_o hard_a work_n to_o prove_v every_o of_o these_o to_o be_v error_n or_o superstition_n or_o both_o but_o if_o a._n c._n think_v so_o mean_o of_o i_o that_o though_o this_o be_v no_o hard_a work_n in_o itself_o yet_o that_o i_o such_o be_v my_o weakness_n can_v prove_v it_o i_o shall_v leave_v he_o to_o enjoy_v that_o opinion_n of_o i_o or_o what_o ever_o else_o he_o shall_v be_v please_v to_o entertain_v and_o be_o far_o better_a content_n with_o this_o his_o opinion_n of_o my_o weakness_n than_o with_o that_o which_o follow_v of_o my_o pride_n for_o he_o add_v that_o i_o can_v prove_v any_o error_n or_o superstition_n to_o be_v in_o 73._o the_o roman_a religion_n but_o by_o presume_v with_o intolerable_a pride_n to_o make_v myself_o or_o some_o of_o my_o fellow_n to_o be_v judge_n of_o controversy_n and_o by_o take_v authority_n to_o censure_v all_o to_o be_v superstition_n and_o error_n too_o which_o suit_n not_o with_o my_o fancy_n although_o it_o be_v general_o hold_v or_o practise_v by_o the_o universal_a church_n which_o say_v he_o in_o s._n augustine_n judgement_n be_v most_o insolent_a madness_n what_o not_o prove_v any_o superstition_n any_o error_n at_o rome_n but_o by_o pride_n and_o that_o intolerable_a true_o i_o will_v to_o god_n a._n c._n see_v my_o heart_n and_o all_o the_o pride_n that_o lodge_v therein_o but_o wherein_o do_v this_o pride_n appear_v that_o he_o censure_v i_o so_o deep_o why_o first_o in_o this_o that_o i_o can_v prove_v any_o error_n or_o superstition_n to_o be_v in_o the_o roman_a religion_n unless_o i_o make_v myself_o or_o some_o of_o my_o fellow_n judge_v of_o controversy_n indeed_o if_o i_o take_v this_o upon_o i_o i_o be_v guilty_a of_o great_a pride_n but_o a._n c._n know_v well_o that_o before_o in_o this_o conference_n which_o he_o undertake_v to_o answer_n i_o be_o so_o far_o from_o make_v myself_o or_o any_o of_o my_o fellow_n judge_v of_o controversy_n that_o 11._o i_o absolute_o make_v a_o lawful_a and_o free_a general_n council_n judge_n of_o controversy_n by_o and_o according_a to_o the_o scripture_n and_o this_o i_o learn_v from_o 3._o s._n augustine_n with_o this_o that_o ever_o the_o scripture_n be_v to_o have_v the_o prerogative_n above_o the_o council_n nay_o a._n c._n shall_v remember_v here_o that_o 63._o he_o himself_o tax_v i_o for_o give_v too_o much_o power_n to_o a_o general_n council_n and_o bind_v man_n to_o a_o strict_a obedience_n to_o it_o even_o in_o case_n of_o error_n and_o therefore_o sure_a most_o innocent_a i_o be_o of_o the_o most_o intolerable_a pride_n which_o he_o be_v please_v to_o charge_n upon_o i_o and_o he_o of_o all_o man_n most_o unfit_a to_o charge_v it_o second_o a._n c._n will_v have_v my_o pride_n â—3_n appear_v in_o this_o that_o i_o take_v authority_n to_o censure_v all_o for_o error_n and_o superstition_n which_o suit_n not_o with_o my_o own_o fancy_n but_o how_o can_v this_o possible_a be_v since_o i_o submit_v my_o judgement_n in_o all_o humility_n to_o the_o scripture_n interpret_v by_o the_o primitive_a church_n and_o upon_o new_a and_o necessary_a doubt_n to_o the_o judgement_n of_o a_o lawful_a and_o free_a general_n council_n and_o this_o i_o do_v from_o my_o very_a heart_n and_o do_v abhor_v in_o matter_n of_o religion_n that_o my_o own_o or_o any_o private_a man_n fancy_n shall_v take_v any_o place_n and_o least_o of_o all_o against_o thing_n general_o hold_v or_o practise_v by_o the_o universal_a church_n which_o to_o oppose_v in_o such_o thing_n be_v certain_o as_o 5._o s._n augustine_n call_v it_o insolentissimae_fw-la insaniae_fw-la a_o attempt_n of_o most_o insolent_a madness_n but_o those_o thing_n which_o the_o church_n of_o england_n charge_n upon_o the_o roman_a party_n to_o be_v superstitious_a and_o erroneous_a be_v not_o hold_v or_o practise_v in_o or_o by_o the_o universal_a church_n general_o either_o for_o time_n or_o place_n and_o now_o i_o will_v have_v a._n c._n consider_v how_o just_o all_o this_o may_v be_v turn_v upon_o himself_o for_o he_o have_v nothing_o to_o pretend_v that_o there_o be_v not_o gross_a superstition_n and_o error_n in_o the_o roman_a persuasion_n unless_o by_o intolerable_a pride_n he_o will_v make_v himself_o and_o his_o party_n judge_n of_o controversy_n as_o in_o effect_n he_o do_v for_o he_o will_v be_v judge_v by_o none_o but_o the_o pope_n and_o a_o council_n of_o his_o order_n or_o unless_o he_o will_v take_v authority_n to_o free_a from_o superstition_n and_o error_n whatsoever_o suit_n with_o his_o fancy_n though_o it_o be_v even_a superstition_n itself_o and_o run_v cross_a to_o what_o have_v be_v general_o hold_v in_o the_o catholic_a church_n of_o christ_n yea_o though_o to_o do_v so_o be_v in_o s._n augustine_n judgement_n most_o insolent_a madness_n and_o a._n c._n speak_v in_o this_o most_o proper_o when_o he_o call_v it_o take_v of_o authority_n for_o the_o bishop_n and_o church_n of_o rome_n have_v in_o this_o particular_a of_o judge_a controversy_n indeed_o take_v that_o authority_n to_o themselves_o which_o neither_o christ_n nor_o his_o church_n catholic_a do_v ever_o give_v they_o here_o the_o conference_n end_v with_o this_o conclusion_n num._n 5_o and_o as_o i_o hope_v god_n have_v give_v that_o lady_n mercy_n so_o i_o hearty_o pray_v that_o he_o will_v be_v please_v to_o give_v all_o of_o you_o a_o light_n of_o his_o truth_n and_o a_o love_n to_o it_o that_o you_o may_v no_o long_o be_v make_v instrument_n of_o the_o pope_n boundless_a ambition_n and_o this_o most_o unchristian_a 6._o brainsick_a device_n that_o in_o all_o controversy_n of_o the_o faith_n he_o be_v infallible_a and_o that_o by_o way_n of_o inspiration_n and_o prophecy_n in_o the_o conclusion_n which_o he_o give_v to_o the_o due_a consideration_n of_o which_o and_o god_n mercy_n in_o christ_n i_o leave_v you_o num._n 6_o to_o this_o conclusion_n of_o the_o conference_n between_o i_o and_o the_o jesuit_n a._n c._n say_v not_o much_o but_o that_o which_o he_o do_v say_v be_v either_o the_o self_n same_o which_o he_o have_v say_v already_o or_o else_o be_v quite_o mistake_v in_o the_o business_n that_o which_o he_o have_v say_v already_o be_v this_o that_o in_o matter_n of_o faith_n we_o be_v to_o submit_v our_o judgement_n 73._o to_o such_o doctor_n and_o pastor_n as_o by_o visible_a continual_a succession_n without_o change_n bring_v the_o faith_n down_o from_o christ_n and_o his_o apostle_n to_o these_o our_o day_n and_o shall_v so_o carry_v it_o to_o the_o end_n of_o the_o world_n and_o that_o this_o succession_n be_v not_o find_v in_o any_o other_o church_n differ_v in_o doctrine_n from_o the_o roman_a church_n now_o to_o this_o i_o have_v give_v a_o full_a answer_n 4._o already_o and_o therefore_o will_v not_o trouble_v the_o reader_n with_o needless_a and_o troublesome_a repetition_n then_o he_o bring_v certain_a place_n of_o scripture_n to_o prove_v the_o pope_n infallibility_n but_o to_o all_o these_o place_n i_o have_v likewise_o answer_v â—_o before_o and_o therefore_o a._n c._n need_v not_o to_o repeat_v they_o again_o as_o if_o they_o have_v be_v unanswerable_a num._n 7_o one_o place_n of_o scripture_n only_o a._n c._n have_v not_o urge_v before_o either_o for_o proof_n of_o this_o continue_a visible_a succession_n or_o for_o the_o pope_n infallibility_n nor_o do_v a._n c._n distinct_o set_v down_o by_o which_o 73._o of_o the_o two_o he_o will_v prove_v it_o the_o place_n be_v 〈◊〉_d ephes._n 4._o christ_n ascend_v give_v some_o to_o be_v apostle_n some_o prophet_n some_o evangelist_n some_o pastor_n &_o teacher_n etc._n etc._n for_o the_o
and_o without_o choice_n by_o which_o their_o most_o hate_a adversary_n climb_v up_o and_o can_v not_o cry_v up_o themselves_o and_o their_o cause_n as_o they_o do_v but_o by_o they_o and_o divine_n of_o all_o the_o rest_n may_v learn_v and_o teach_v this_o wisdom_n if_o they_o will_v since_o they_o see_v all_o other_o profession_n which_o help_v to_o bear_v down_o their_o ceremony_n keep_v up_o their_o own_o therewhile_o and_o that_o to_o the_o high_a i_o have_v be_v too_o bold_a to_o detain_v your_o majesty_n so_o long_o but_o my_o grief_n to_o see_v christendom_n bleed_v in_o dissension_n and_o which_o be_v worse_o triumph_v in_o her_o own_o blood_n and_o most_o angry_a with_o they_o that_o will_v study_v her_o peace_n have_v thus_o transport_v i_o for_o true_o it_o can_v but_o grieve_v any_o man_n that_o have_v bowel_n to_o see_v all_o man_n seek_v but_z as_o s._n paul_n foretell_v phil._n 2._o their_o own_o thing_n and_o not_o the_o thing_n which_o 21._o be_v jesus_n christ_n sua_fw-la their_o own_o sure_o for_o the_o gospel_n of_o christ_n have_v nothing_o to_o do_v with_o they_o and_o to_o see_v religion_n so_o much_o so_o zealous_o pretend_v and_o call_v upon_o make_v but_o the_o stalking-horse_n to_o shoot_v at_o other_o fowl_n upon_o which_o their_o aim_n be_v set_v in_o the_o mean_a time_n as_o if_o all_o be_v truth_n and_o holiness_n itself_o no_o salvation_n must_v be_v possible_a do_v it_o lie_v at_o their_o mercy_n but_o in_o the_o communion_n of_o the_o one_o and_o in_o the_o conventicle_n of_o the_o other_o as_o if_o either_o of_o these_o now_o be_v as_o the_o donatist_n of_o old_a repute_v themselves_o the_o only_a man_n in_o who_o christ_n at_o his_o come_n to_o judgement_n shall_v find_v faith_n no_o faith_n 48._o s._n augustine_n and_o so_o say_v i_o with_o he_o dam_fw-la veniam_fw-la non_fw-la credimus_fw-la pardon_v we_o i_o pray_v we_o can_v believe_v it_o the_o catholic_a church_n of_o christ_n be_v neither_o rome_n nor_o a_o conventicle_n out_o of_o that_o there_o be_v no_o salvation_n i_o easy_o confess_v it_o but_o out_o of_o rome_n there_o be_v and_o out_o of_o a_o conventicle_n too_o salvation_n iâ—_n not_o shut_v up_o into_o such_o a_o narrow_a conclave_n in_o this_o ensue_a discourse_n therefore_o i_o have_v endeavour_v to_o lay_v open_a those_o wider-gate_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n confine_v to_o no_o age_n time_n or_o place_n nor_o know_v any_o bound_n but_o that_o faith_n which_o be_v once_o and_o but_o once_o for_o all_o deliver_v to_o the_o saint_n s._n judas_n 3_o and_o in_o my_o pursuit_n of_o this_o way_n i_o have_v 3._o search_v after_o and_o deliver_v with_o a_o single_a heart_n that_o truth_n which_o i_o profess_v in_o the_o publish_n whereof_o i_o have_v obey_v your_o majesty_n discharge_v my_o duty_n to_o my_o power_n to_o the_o church_n of_o england_n 15._o give_v account_n of_o the_o hope_n that_o be_v in_o i_o and_o so_o testify_v to_o the_o world_n that_o faith_n in_o which_o i_o have_v live_v and_o by_o god_n blessing_n and_o favour_n purpose_n to_o die_v but_o till_o death_n shall_v most_o unfeigned_o remain_v your_o majesty_n most_o faithful_a subject_n and_o most_o humble_a and_o oblige_a servant_n w._n cant_n a_o relation_n of_o the_o conference_n between_o william_n lawd_n then_o l._n bishop_n of_o s._n david_n afterward_o lord_n archbishop_n of_o canterbury_z and_o m._n fisher_n the_o jesuit_n f._n the_o occasion_n of_o this_o conference_n be_v b._n §_o 1_o the_o occasion_n of_o this_o three_o conference_n you_o shall_v know_v sufficient_o you_o be_v a_o actor_n in_o it_o as_o well_o as_o in_o two_o other_o whether_o you_o have_v relate_v the_o two_o former_a true_o appear_v by_o d._n white_n the_o late_a reverend_a l._n bishop_n of_o ely_n his_o relation_n or_o exposition_n of_o they_o i_o be_v present_a at_o none_o but_o this_o three_o of_o which_o i_o here_o give_v the_o church_n a_o account_n but_o of_o this_o three_o whether_o that_o be_v the_o cause_n which_o you_o allege_v i_o can_v tell_v you_o say_v f._n it_o be_v observe_v that_o in_o the_o second_o conference_n all_o the_o speech_n be_v about_o particular_a matter_n little_a or_o none_o about_o a_o continual_a infallible_a visible_a church_n which_o be_v the_o chief_a and_o only_o point_v in_o which_o a_o certain_a lady_n require_v satisfaction_n as_o have_v former_o settle_v in_o her_o mind_n that_o it_o be_v not_o for_o she_o or_o any_o other_o unlearned_a person_n to_o take_v upon_o they_o to_o judge_v of_o particular_n without_o depend_v upon_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o true_a church_n b._n §_o 2_o the_o opinion_n of_o that_o honourable_a person_n in_o this_o be_v never_o open_v to_o i_o and_o it_o be_v very_o fit_a the_o people_n shall_v look_v to_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o church_n before_o they_o be_v too_o busy_a with_o particular_n but_o yet_o neither_o 15._o scripture_n nor_o any_o good_a authority_n deny_v they_o some_o moderate_a use_n of_o their_o own_o understanding_n and_o judgement_n especial_o in_o thing_n familiar_a and_o evident_a which_o even_o deny_v ordinary_a capacity_n may_v as_o easy_o understand_v as_o read_v and_o therefore_o some_o particular_n a_o christian_n may_v judge_v without_o depend_v f._n this_o lady_n therefore_o have_v hear_v it_o grant_v in_o the_o first_o conference_n that_o there_o must_v be_v a_o continual_a visible_a company_n ever_o since_o christ_n teach_v unchanged_a doctrine_n in_o all_o fundamental_a point_n that_o be_v point_v necessary_a to_o salvation_n desire_v to_o hear_v this_o confirm_v and_o proof_n bring_v which_o be_v that_o continual_a infallible_a visible_a church_n in_o which_o one_o may_v and_o out_o of_o which_o one_o can_v attain_v salvation_n and_o therefore_o have_v appoint_v a_o time_n of_o meet_v between_o a_o b._n and_o i_o and_o thereupon_o have_v send_v for_o the_o b._n and_o i_o before_o the_o b._n come_v the_o lady_n and_o a_o friend_n of_o she_o come_v first_o to_o the_o room_n where_o i_o be_v and_o debate_v before_o i_o the_o aforesaid_a question_n and_o not_o doubt_v of_o the_o first_o part_n to_o wit_n that_o there_o must_v be_v a_o continual_a visible_a church_n as_o they_o have_v hear_v grant_v by_o d._n white_a and_o l._n k._n etc._n etc._n b._n num._n 1_o §_o 3_o what_o d._n white_a and_o l._n k._n grant_v i_o hear_v not_o but_o i_o think_v both_o grant_v a_o continual_a and_o a_o visible_a church_n neitherof_o they_o a_o infallible_a at_o least_o in_o your_o sense_n and_o yourself_o in_o this_o relation_n speak_v distract_o for_o in_o these_o few_o line_n from_o the_o begin_n hither_o twice_o you_o add_v infallible_a between_o continual_a and_o visible_a and_o twice_o you_o leave_v it_o out_o but_o this_o concern_v d._n w._n and_o he_o have_v answer_v it_o num._n 2_o here_o a._n c._n step_n in_o and_o say_v the_o jesuit_n do_v not_o speak_v distract_o but_o most_o advise_o for_o say_v he_o where_o he_o relate_v 42._o what_o d._n white_a or_o l._n k._n grant_v he_o leave_v out_o the_o word_n infallible_a because_o they_o grant_v it_o not_o but_o where_o he_o speak_v of_o the_o lady_n there_o he_o add_v it_o because_o the_o jesuit_n know_v it_o be_v a_o infallible_a church_n which_o she_o seek_v to_o rely_v upon_o how_o far_o the_o catholic_n militant_a church_n of_o christ_n be_v infallible_a be_v no_o dispute_n for_o this_o place_n though_o you_o shall_v find_v it_o after_o but_o sure_a the_o jesuit_n do_v not_o speak_v most_o advise_o nor_o a._n c._n neither_o nor_o the_o lady_n herself_o if_o she_o say_v she_o desire_v to_o rely_v upon_o a_o infallible_a church_n for_o a_o infallible_a church_n denote_v a_o particular_a church_n in_o that_o it_o be_v set_v in_o opposition_n to_o some_o other_o particular_a church_n that_o be_v not_o infallible_a now_o i_o for_o my_o part_n do_v not_o know_v what_o that_o lady_n desire_v to_o rely_v upon_o this_o i_o know_v if_o she_o desire_v such_o a_o particular_a church_n neither_o this_o jesuit_n nor_o any_o other_o be_v able_a to_o show_v it_o she_o no_o not_o bellarmine_n himself_o though_o of_o very_o great_a ability_n to_o make_v good_a any_o truth_n which_o he_o undertake_v for_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n 61._o but_o no_o strength_n can_v uphold_v a_o error_n against_o truth_n where_o truth_n have_v a_o able_a defendant_n now_o where_o bellarmine_n set_v himself_o purposely_o to_o make_v this_o good_a that_o fide_fw-la the_o particular_a church_n of_o rome_n can_v err_v in_o matter_n of_o faith_n out_o of_o which_o it_o follow_v that_o there_o may_v be_v find_v a_o particular_a infallible_a church_n you_o shall_v see_v what_o he_o be_v able_a to_o perform_v num._n 3_o 1_o first_o then_o after_o he_o have_v distinguish_v to_o express_v his_o meaning_n in_o what_o sense_n the_o
judgement_n infallible_a yea_o and_o he_o set_v this_o mark_n upon_o his_o dissent_n beside_o 189._o that_o he_o reckon_v up_o the_o book_n of_o the_o canon_n just_a so_o and_o no_o otherwise_o then_o as_o he_o receive_v they_o out_o of_o the_o monument_n of_o the_o forefather_n and_o out_o of_o which_o the_o assertion_n of_o our_o faith_n be_v to_o be_v take_v last_o of_o all_o have_v this_o place_n of_o ruffinus_n any_o strength_n for_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n yet_o there_o be_v very_o little_a reason_n that_o the_o pope_n and_o his_o clergy_n shall_v take_v any_o benefit_n by_o it_o for_o k._n s._n hierome_n tell_v we_o that_o when_o ruffinus_n be_v angry_a with_o he_o for_o a_o epistle_n which_o he_o write_v not_o he_o plain_o send_v he_o to_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n and_o bid_v he_o exposiulate_v with_o he_o for_o the_o contumely_n put_v upon_o he_o in_o that_o he_o receive_v not_o his_o exposition_n of_o the_o faith_n which_o say_v he_o all_o italy_n approve_v and_o in_o that_o he_o brand_v he_o also_o dum_fw-la nesciret_fw-la behind_o his_o back_n with_o heresy_n now_o if_o the_o pope_n which_o then_o be_v reject_v this_o exposition_n of_o the_o creed_n make_v by_o ruffinus_n and_o brand_v he_o beside_o with_o heresy_n his_o sentence_n against_o ruffinus_n be_v just_a or_o unjust_a if_o unjust_a than_o the_o pope_n err_v about_o a_o matter_n of_o faith_n and_o so_o neither_o he_o nor_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n infallible_a if_o just_a than_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n labour_v to_o defend_v herself_o by_o his_o pen_n which_o be_v judge_v heretical_a by_o herself_o so_o whether_o it_o be_v just_a or_o unjust_a the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v drive_v to_o a_o hard_a strait_n when_o she_o must_v beg_v help_n of_o he_o who_o she_o brand_v with_o heresy_n and_o out_o of_o that_o tract_n which_o she_o herself_o reject_v and_o so_o uphold_v her_o infall_n ibility_n by_o the_o judgement_n of_o a_o man_n who_o in_o her_o judgement_n have_v err_v so_o foul_o nor_o may_v she_o by_o any_o testibus_fw-la law_n take_v benefit_n of_o a_o testimony_n which_o herself_o have_v defame_v and_o protest_v against_o num._n 13_o with_o these_o bellarmine_n be_v please_v to_o name_n sâ—x_n or_o ergo_fw-la seven_o pope_n which_o he_o say_v be_v all_o of_o this_o opinion_n but_o of_o pope_n opinion_n he_o say_v that_o etiam_fw-la these_o testimony_n will_v be_v contemn_v by_o the_o heretic_n good_a word_n i_o pray_v i_o know_v who_o the_o cardinal_n mean_v by_o heretic_n very_o well_o but_o the_o best_a be_v his_o call_n can_v make_v they_o so_o nor_o shall_v i_o easy_o contemn_v seven_o ancient_a bishop_n of_o rome_n concur_v in_o opinion_n if_o apparent_a verity_n in_o the_o thing_n itself_o do_v not_o force_v i_o to_o dissent_v and_o in_o that_o case_n i_o shall_v do_v it_o without_o contempt_n too_o this_o only_a i_o will_v say_v law_n that_o seven_o pope_n concur_v in_o opinion_n shall_v have_v less_o weight_n with_o i_o in_o their_o own_o cause_n than_o any_o other_o seven_o of_o the_o more_o ancient_a father_n indeed_o can_v i_o swallow_v initio_fw-la bellarmine_n opinion_n that_o the_o pope_n judgement_n be_v infallible_a i_o will_v then_o submit_v without_o any_o more_o aâ—o_o but_o that_o will_v never_o down_o with_o i_o unless_o i_o live_v till_o i_o dote_v which_o i_o hope_v in_o god_n i_o shall_v not_o num._n 14_o other_o proof_n than_o these_o bellarmine_n bring_v not_o to_o prove_v that_o the_o particular_a church_n of_o rome_n can_v err_v in_o or_o from_o the_o faith_n and_o of_o what_o force_n these_o be_v to_o sway_v any_o judgement_n i_o submit_v to_o all_o indifferent_a reader_n and_o have_v thus_o examine_v bellarmine_n proof_n that_o the_o particular_a church_n of_o rome_n can_v err_v in_o faith_n i_o now_o return_v to_o a._n c._n and_o the_o jesuit_n and_o 42._o tell_v they_o that_o no_o jesuit_n or_o any_o other_o be_v ever_o able_a to_o prove_v any_o particular_a church_n infallible_a num._n 15_o but_o for_o the_o particular_a church_n of_o rome_n and_o the_o pope_n with_o it_o err_v it_o have_v and_o therefore_o may_v err_v err_v i_o say_v it_o have_v in_o the_o worship_n of_o image_n and_o in_o alter_v christ_n institution_n in_o the_o bless_a sacrament_n by_o take_v away_o the_o cup_n from_o the_o people_n and_o divers_a other_o particular_n as_o shall_v appear_v at_o 12._o after_o and_o as_o for_o the_o ground_n which_o be_v presume_v to_o secure_v this_o church_n from_o error_n it_o be_v very_o remarkable_a how_o the_o 1._o learned_a cardinal_n speak_v in_o this_o case_n for_o he_o tell_v we_o that_o this_o proposition_n so_o long_o as_o s._n peter_n chair_n be_v at_o rome_n that_o particular_a church_n can_v err_v in_o the_o faith_n be_v verissima_fw-la most_o true_a and_o yet_o in_o the_o very_a next_o word_n it_o be_v fortasse_fw-la tam_fw-la vera_fw-la peradventure_o as_o true_a as_o the_o former_a that_o be_v that_o the_o pope_n when_o he_o teach_v the_o whole_a church_n in_o those_o thing_n which_o belong_v to_o the_o faith_n can_v err_v in_o any_o case_n what_o be_v that_o proposition_n most_o true_a and_o yet_o be_v it_o but_o at_o a_o peradventure_o it_o be_v as_o true_a as_o this_o be_v it_o possible_a any_o thing_n shall_v be_v absolute_o most_o true_a and_o yet_o under_o a_o peradventure_o that_o it_o be_v but_o as_o true_a as_o another_o truth_n but_o here_o without_o all_o peradventure_o neither_o proposition_n be_v true_a and_o then_o indeed_o bellarmine_n may_v say_v without_o a_o fortasse_fw-la that_o this_o proposition_n the_o particular_a church_n of_o rome_n can_v err_v so_o long_o as_o the_o sea_n apostolic_a be_v there_o be_v as_o true_a as_o this_o the_o pope_n can_v err_v while_o he_o teach_v the_o whole_a church_n in_o those_o thing_n which_o belong_v to_o the_o faith_n for_o neither_o of_o they_o be_v true_a but_o he_o can_v say_v that_o either_o of_o they_o be_v verissima_fw-la most_o true_a when_o neither_o of_o they_o have_v truth_n num._n 16_o 2_o second_o if_o the_o particular_a church_n of_o rome_n be_v infallible_a and_o can_v neither_o err_v in_o the_o faith_n nor_o fall_v from_o it_o than_o it_o be_v because_o the_o sea_n apostolic_a can_v be_v transfer_v from_o rome_n but_o must_v ever_o to_o the_o consummation_n of_o the_o world_n remain_v there_o and_o keep_v that_o particular_a church_n from_o err_a now_o to_o this_o what_o say_v bellarmine_n what_o why_o he_o tell_v we_o nihilominus_fw-la that_o it_o be_v a_o pious_a and_o most_o probable_a opinion_n to_o think_v so_o and_o he_o reckon_v four_o probability_n that_o it_o shall_v never_o be_v remove_v from_o rome_n and_o i_o will_v not_o deny_v but_o some_o of_o they_o be_v fair_a probability_n but_o yet_o they_o be_v but_o probability_n and_o so_o unable_a to_o convince_v any_o man_n why_o but_o then_o what_o if_o a_o man_n can_v think_v as_o bellarmine_n do_v but_o that_o enforce_a by_o the_o light_n of_o his_o understanding_n he_o must_v think_v the_o quite_o contrary_a to_o this_o which_o bellarmine_n think_v pious_a and_o so_o probable_a what_o then_o why_o then_o secundum_fw-la bellarmine_n himself_o tell_v you_o that_o the_o quite_o contrary_a proposition_n to_o this_o namely_o that_o s._n peter_n chair_n may_v be_v sever_v from_o rome_n and_o that_o then_o that_o particular_a church_n may_v err_v be_v neither_o heretical_a nor_o manifest_o erroneous_a so_o then_o by_o bellarmine_n own_o confession_n i_o be_o no_o heretic_n nor_o in_o any_o manifest_a error_n if_o i_o say_v as_o indeed_o i_o do_v and_o think_v it_o too_o that_o it_o be_v possible_a for_o s._n peter_n chair_n to_o be_v carry_v from_o rome_n and_o that_o then_o at_o least_o by_o his_o own_o argument_n that_o church_n may_v err_v num._n 17_o now_o then_o upon_o the_o whole_a matter_n and_o to_o return_v to_o a._n c._n 42._o if_o that_o lady_n desire_v to_o rely_v upon_o a_o particular_a infallible_a church_n it_o be_v not_o to_o be_v find_v on_o earth_n rome_n have_v not_o that_o gift_n nor_o her_o bishop_n neither_o and_o bellarmine_n who_o i_o think_v be_v as_o able_a as_o any_o champion_n that_o church_n have_v dare_v not_o say_v it_o be_v either_o heresy_n or_o a_o manifest_a error_n to_o say_v that_o the_o apostolic_a sea_n may_v be_v remove_v thence_o and_o that_o church_n not_o only_o err_v in_o faith_n but_o also_o fall_v quite_o away_o from_o it_o now_o i_o for_o my_o part_n have_v not_o ignorance_n enough_o in_o i_o to_o believe_v that_o that_o church_n which_o may_v apostatise_v at_o some_o one_o time_n may_v not_o err_v at_o another_o especial_o since_o both_o her_o err_a and_o fail_v may_v arise_v from_o other_o cause_n beside_o that_o which_o be_v mention_v by_o the_o cardinal_n and_o if_o it_o may_v err_v it_o
that_o shall_v moliatur_fw-la endeavour_v to_o shake_v the_o foundation_n itself_o upon_o which_o the_o whole_a church_n be_v ground_v num._n 11_o second_o if_o s._n augustine_n do_v mean_a by_o found_v and_o foundation_n the_o definition_n of_o the_o church_n because_o of_o these_o word_n this_o thing_n be_v found_v this_o be_v make_v firm_a by_o full_a authority_n of_o the_o church_n and_o the_o word_n follow_v these_o to_o shake_v the_o foundation_n of_o the_o church_n yet_o it_o can_v never_o follow_v out_o of_o any_o or_o all_o these_o circumstance_n and_o these_o be_v all_o that_o all_o point_n define_v by_o the_o church_n be_v fundamental_a in_o the_o faith_n for_o first_o no_o man_n deny_v but_o the_o church_n be_v a_o 15_o foundation_n that_o thing_n define_v by_o it_o be_v found_v upon_o it_o and_o yet_o hence_o it_o can_v follow_v that_o the_o thing_n that_o be_v so_o found_v be_v fundamental_a in_o the_o faith_n for_o thing_n may_v be_v 28._o found_v upon_o humane_a authority_n and_o be_v very_o certain_a yet_o not_o fundamental_a in_o the_o faith_n nor_o yet_o can_v it_o follow_v this_o thing_n be_v found_v therefore_o every_o thing_n determine_v by_o the_o church_n be_v found_v again_o that_o which_o follow_v that_o those_o thing_n be_v not_o to_o be_v oppose_v which_o be_v make_v firm_a by_o full_a authority_n of_o the_o church_n can_v conclude_v they_o be_v therefore_o fundamental_a in_o the_o faith_n for_o full_a church-authority_n always_o the_o time_n that_o include_v the_o holy_a apostle_n be_v pass_v by_o and_o not_o comprehend_v in_o it_o be_v but_o church-authority_n and_o church-authority_n when_o it_o be_v at_o full_a sea_n be_v not_o simple_o 1._o divine_a therefore_o the_o sentence_n of_o it_o not_o fundamental_a in_o the_o faith_n and_o yet_o no_o err_a disputer_n may_v be_v endure_v to_o shake_v the_o foundation_n which_o the_o church_n in_o council_n lay_v but_o plain_a scripture_n with_o evident_a sense_n or_o a_o full_a demonstrative_a argument_n must_v have_v room_n where_o a_o wrangle_a and_o err_a disputer_n may_v not_o be_v allow_v it_o and_o there_o be_v 4._o neither_o of_o these_o but_o may_v convince_v the_o definition_n of_o the_o council_n if_o it_o be_v ill_o found_v and_o the_o article_n of_o the_o faith_n may_v easy_o prove_v it_o be_v not_o fundamental_a if_o indeed_o and_o very_o it_o be_v not_o so_o num._n 12_o and_o i_o have_v read_v somebody_o that_o say_v be_v it_o not_o you_o that_o thing_n be_v fundamental_a in_o the_o faith_n two_o way_n one_o in_o their_o matter_n such_o as_o be_v all_o thing_n which_o be_v so_o in_o themselves_o the_o other_o in_o the_o manner_n such_o as_o be_v all_o thing_n that_o the_o church_n have_v define_v and_o determine_v to_o be_v of_o faith_n and_o that_o so_o some_o thing_n that_o be_v de_fw-fr modo_fw-la of_o the_o manner_n of_o be_v be_v of_o faith_n but_o in_o plain_a truth_n this_o be_v no_o more_o then_o if_o you_o shall_v say_v some_o thing_n be_v fundamental_a in_o the_o faith_n and_o some_o be_v not_o for_o wrangle_v while_o you_o will_v you_o shall_v never_o be_v able_a to_o prove_v that_o any_o thing_n which_o be_v but_o de_fw-fr modo_fw-la a_o consideration_n of_o the_o manner_n of_o be_v only_o can_v possible_o be_v fundamental_a in_o the_o faith_n num._n 13_o and_o since_o you_o make_v such_o a_o foundation_n of_o this_o place_n i_o will_v a_o little_a view_n the_o mortar_n with_o which_o it_o be_v lay_v by_o you_o it_o be_v a_o venture_n but_o i_o shall_v find_v it_o 11_o untempered_a your_o assertion_n be_v all_o point_v define_v by_o the_o church_n be_v fundamental_a your_o proof_n this_o place_n because_o that_o be_v not_o to_o be_v shake_v which_o be_v settle_v by_o authoritate_fw-la full_a authority_n of_o the_o church_n then_o it_o seem_v your_o meaning_n be_v that_o this_o point_n there_o speak_v of_o the_o remission_n of_o original_a sin_n in_o baptism_n of_o infant_n be_v define_v when_o s._n augustine_n write_v this_o by_o a_o full_a sentence_n of_o a_o general_n council_n first_o if_o you_o say_v it_o be_v particularibus_fw-la bellarmine_n will_v tell_v you_o it_o be_v false_a and_o that_o the_o pelagian_a heresy_n be_v never_o condemn_v in_o a_o ecumenical_a council_n but_o only_o in_o nationals_n but_o bellarmine_n be_v deceive_v for_o while_o the_o pelagian_n stand_v out_o impudent_o against_o national_a counsel_n some_o of_o they_o defend_v nestorius_n which_o give_v occasion_n to_o the_o first_o 4._o ephesine_n council_n to_o excommunicate_v and_o depose_v they_o and_o yet_o this_o will_v not_o serve_v your_o turn_n for_o this_o place_n for_o s._n augustine_n be_v then_o dead_a and_o therefore_o can_v not_o mean_v the_o sentence_n of_o that_o council_n in_o this_o place_n second_o if_o you_o say_v it_o be_v not_o then_o define_v in_o a_o ecumenical_a synod_n plena_fw-la authoritas_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la the_o full_a authority_n of_o the_o church_n there_o mention_v do_v not_o stand_v proper_o for_o the_o decree_n of_o a_o ecumenical_a council_n but_o for_o some_o national_a as_o this_o be_v condemn_v in_o a_o 2._o national_a council_n and_o then_o the_o full_a authority_n of_o the_o church_n here_o be_v no_o more_o than_o the_o full_a authority_n of_o the_o church_n of_o africa_n africa_n and_o i_o hope_v that_o authority_n do_v not_o make_v all_o point_v define_v by_o it_o to_o be_v fundamental_a you_o will_v say_v yes_o if_o that_o council_n be_v confirm_v by_o the_o pope_n and_o then_o i_o must_v ever_o wonder_v why_o s._n augustine_n shall_v say_v the_o full_a authority_n of_o the_o church_n and_o not_o bestow_v one_o word_n upon_o the_o pope_n by_o who_o authority_n only_o that_o council_n as_o all_o other_o have_v their_o fullness_n of_o authority_n in_o your_o judgement_n a_o inexpiable_a omission_n if_o this_o doctrine_n concern_v the_o pope_n be_v true_a num._n 14_o but_o here_o a._n c._n step_n in_o again_o to_o help_v the_o jesuit_n and_o he_o tell_v we_o over_o and_o over_o again_o that_o all_o point_n make_v firm_a by_o full_a authority_n 45._o of_o the_o church_n be_v fundamental_a so_o firm_a he_o will_v have_v they_o and_o therefore_o fundamental_a but_o i_o must_v tell_v he_o that_o first_o it_o be_v one_o thing_n in_o nature_n and_o religion_n too_o to_o be_v firm_a and_o another_o thing_n to_o be_v fundamental_a these_o two_o be_v not_o convertible_a it_o be_v true_a that_o every_o thing_n that_o be_v fundamental_a be_v firm_a but_o it_o do_v not_o follow_v that_o every_o thing_n that_o be_v firm_a be_v fundamental_a for_o many_o a_o superstructure_n be_v exceed_o firm_a be_v fast_o and_o close_o join_v to_o a_o sure_a foundation_n which_o yet_o no_o man_n will_v grant_v be_v fundamental_a beside_o whatsoever_o be_v fundamental_a in_o the_o faith_n be_v fundamental_a to_o the_o church_n which_o be_v one_o by_o the_o unity_n unâ—_n of_o faith_n therefore_o if_o every_o thing_n define_v by_o the_o church_n be_v fundamental_a in_o the_o faith_n then_o the_o church_n desinition_n be_v the_o church_n foundation_n and_o so_o upon_o the_o matter_n the_o church_n can_v lay_v she_o own_o foundation_n and_o then_o the_o church_n must_v be_v in_o absolute_a and_o perfect_a be_v before_o so_o much_o as_o her_o foundation_n be_v lay_v now_o this_o be_v so_o absurd_a for_o any_o man_n of_o learning_n to_o say_v that_o by_o and_o by_o after_o a._n c._n be_v content_a to_o affirm_v not_o only_o that_o the_o prima_fw-la credibilia_fw-la the_o article_n of_o faith_n but_o all_o which_o so_o pertain_v to_o supernatural_a divine_a and_o infallible_a christian_a faith_n as_o that_o thereby_o christ_n do_v dwell_v in_o our_o heart_n etc._n etc._n be_v the_o foundation_n of_o the_o church_n under_o christ_n the_o prime_a foundation_n and_o here_o he_o be_v out_o again_o for_o first_o all_o which_o pertain_v to_o supernatural_a divine_a and_o infallible_a christian_a faith_n be_v not_o by_o and_o by_o 3._o fundamental_a in_o the_o faith_n to_o all_o man_n and_o second_o the_o whole_a discourse_n here_o be_v concern_v faith_n as_o it_o be_v take_v objectiuè_n for_o the_o object_n of_o faith_n and_o thing_n to_o be_v believe_v but_o that_o faith_n by_o which_o christ_n be_v say_v to_o dwell_v in_o our_o heart_n be_v take_v subjective_n for_o the_o habit_n and_o act_n of_o faith_n now_o to_o confound_v both_o these_o in_o one_o period_n of_o speech_n can_v have_v no_o other_o aim_n then_o to_o confound_v the_o reader_n but_o to_o come_v close_o both_o to_o the_o jesuit_n and_o his_o defender_n a._n c._n if_o all_o point_n make_v firm_a by_o full_a authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v fundamental_a than_o they_o must_v grant_v that_o every_o thing_n determine_v by_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n be_v fundamental_a in_o the_o faith_n for_o with_o they_o it_o be_v firm_a and_o catholic_a which_o that_o
but_o as_o it_o be_v appliable_a to_o the_o whole_a church_n militant_a in_o all_o succeed_a time_n so_o the_o promise_n be_v make_v with_o a_o limitation_n 15._o namely_o that_o the_o bless_a spirit_n shall_v abide_v with_o the_o church_n for_o ever_o and_o lead_v it_o into_o all_o truth_n but_o not_o simple_o into_o all_o curious_a truth_n no_o not_o in_o or_o about_o the_o faith_n but_o into_o all_o truth_n necessary_a to_o salvation_n and_o against_o this_o truth_n the_o whole_a catholic_a church_n can_v err_v keep_v herself_o to_o the_o direction_n of_o the_o scripture_n as_o christ_n have_v appoint_v she_o for_o in_o this_o very_a place_n where_o the_o promise_n be_v make_v that_o the_o holy_a ghost_n shall_v teach_v you_o all_o thing_n it_o be_v add_v that_o he_o shall_v bring_v all_o thing_n to_o their_o remembrance_n what_o simple_o all_o thing_n no_o but_o all_o thing_n which_o christ_n have_v tell_v they_o s._n john_n 14._o so_o there_o be_v a_o limitation_n 26._o put_v upon_o the_o word_n by_o christ_n himself_o and_o if_o the_o church_n will_v not_o err_v it_o must_v not_o ravel_v curious_o into_o unnecessary_a truth_n which_o be_v out_o of_o the_o promise_n nor_o follow_v any_o other_o guide_n than_o the_o doctrine_n which_o christ_n have_v lest_o behind_o he_o to_o govern_v it_o for_o if_o it_o will_v come_v to_o the_o end_n it_o must_v keep_v in_o the_o way_n and_o christ_n who_o promise_v the_o spirit_n shall_v lead_v have_v no_o where_o promise_v that_o it_o shall_v follow_v its_o leader_n into_o all_o truth_n and_o at_o least_o not_o infallible_o unless_o you_o will_v limit_v as_o before_o so_o no_o one_o of_o these_o place_n can_v make_v good_a a._n c.'s_n assertion_n that_o the_o whole_a church_n can_v err_v general_o in_o any_o 〈◊〉_d point_v of_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d in_o absolute_a foundation_n 5._o she_o can_v in_o deduction_n and_o superstructure_n she_o may_v num._n 6_o now_o to_o all_o that_o i_o have_v say_v concern_v the_o right_n which_o particular_a church_n have_v to_o reform_v themselves_o when_o the_o general_a church_n can_v for_o impediment_n or_o will_v not_o for_o negligence_n which_o i_o have_v prove_v at_o large_a etc._n before_o all_o the_o answer_n that_o a._n c._n give_v be_v first_o quo_fw-la judice_fw-la who_o shall_v be_v judge_n and_o that_o shall_v be_v the_o scripture_n and_o the_o 4._o primitive_a church_n and_o by_o the_o â—_o rule_n of_o the_o one_o and_o to_o the_o integrity_n of_o the_o other_o both_o in_o faith_n and_o manner_n any_o particular_a church_n may_v safe_o reform_v itself_o num._n 7_o second_o that_o no_o reformation_n in_o faith_n can_v be_v needful_a in_o the_o general_n church_n but_o only_o in_o particular_a church_n in_o which_o case_n also_o he_o say_v particular_a church_n may_v not_o take_v upon_o 58._o they_o to_o judge_n and_o condemn_v other_o of_o error_n in_o faith_n well_o how_o far_o forth_o reformation_n even_o of_o faith_n may_v be_v necessary_a in_o the_o general_n church_n i_o have_v express_v 4._o already_o and_o for_o particular_a church_n i_o do_v not_o say_v that_o they_o must_v take_v upon_o they_o to_o judge_n or_o condemn_v other_o of_o error_n in_o faith_n that_o which_o i_o say_v be_v they_o may_v reform_v themselves_o now_o i_o hope_v to_o reform_v themselves_o and_o to_o condemn_v other_o be_v two_o different_a word_n unless_o it_o fall_v out_o so_o that_o by_o reform_v themselves_o they_o do_v by_o consequence_n condemn_v any_o other_o that_o be_v guilty_a in_o that_o point_n in_o which_o they_o reform_v themselves_o and_o so_o far_o to_o judge_n and_o condemn_v other_o be_v not_o only_o lawful_a but_o necessary_a a_o man_n that_o live_v religious_o do_v not_o by_o and_o by_o sit_v in_o judgement_n and_o condemn_v with_o his_o mouth_n all_o profane_a liver_n but_o yet_o while_o he_o be_v silent_a his_o very_a life_n condemn_v they_o and_o i_o hope_v in_o this_o way_n of_o judicature_n a._n c._n dare_v not_o say_v it_o be_v unlawful_a for_o a_o particular_a church_n or_o man_n to_o condemn_v another_o and_o 〈◊〉_d whatsoever_o a._n c._n can_v say_v to_o the_o contrary_a there_o be_v divers_a case_n where_o heresy_n be_v know_v and_o notorious_a in_o which_o it_o will_v be_v hard_a to_o say_v as_o he_o do_v that_o one_o particular_a church_n must_v 58._o not_o judge_n or_o condemn_v another_o so_o far_o forth_o at_o 〈◊〉_d as_o to_o 〈◊〉_d and_o protest_v against_o the_o heresy_n of_o it_o num._n 8_o three_o if_o one_o particular_a church_n may_v not_o judge_n or_o condemn_v another_o what_o must_v then_o be_v do_v where_o particular_n need_v reformation_n what_o why_o then_o a._n c._n tell_v we_o that_o particular_a 58._o church_n must_v in_o that_o case_n as_o irenaeus_n intimate_v have_v recourse_n to_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n which_o have_v more_o powerful_a sub_fw-la principality_n the_o principality_n of_o a_o apostolic_a chair_n or_o if_o you_o will_v the_o apostolic_a chair_n in_o relation_n to_o the_o west_n and_o south_n part_n of_o the_o church_n all_o the_o other_o four_o apostolic_a chair_n be_v in_o the_o east_n now_o this_o no_o man_n deny_v that_o understand_v the_o state_n and_o story_n of_o the_o church_n and_o 16._o calvin_n confess_v it_o express_o nor_o be_v the_o word_n principatus_fw-la so_o great_a nor_o be_v the_o bishop_n of_o those_o time_n so_o little_a as_o that_o principes_fw-la and_o principatus_fw-la be_v not_o common_o give_v they_o both_o by_o the_o general_n greek_a and_o the_o latin_a father_n of_o this_o great_a and_o learn_a age_n of_o the_o church_n make_v up_o of_o the_o four_o and_o five_o hundred_o year_n always_o understand_v principatus_fw-la of_o their_o spiritual_a power_n and_o within_o the_o limit_n of_o their_o several_a jurisdiction_n which_o perhaps_o now_o and_o then_o they_o do_v occasional_o exceed_v and_o there_o be_v not_o one_o word_n in_o s._n augustine_n that_o this_o principality_n of_o the_o apostolic_a chair_n in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v then_o or_o aught_o to_o be_v now_o exercise_v over_o the_o whole_a church_n of_o christ_n as_o bellarmine_n insinuate_v there_o and_o as_o a._n c._n will_v have_v it_o here_o and_o to_o prove_v that_o s._n augustine_n do_v not_o intend_v by_o principatus_fw-la here_o to_o give_v the_o roman_a bishop_n any_o power_n out_o of_o his_o own_o limit_n which_o god_n know_v be_v far_o short_a of_o the_o whole_a church_n i_o shall_v make_v it_o most_o manifest_a out_o of_o the_o very_a same_o epistle_n for_o afterward_o say_v s._n augustine_n when_o the_o pertinacie_n of_o the_o donatist_n can_v not_o be_v restrain_v by_o the_o african_a bishop_n only_o 16â—_n they_o give_v they_o leave_v to_o be_v beard_n by_o foreign_a bishop_n and_o after_o that_o he_o have_v these_o word_n ibid._n and_o yet_o peradventure_o melciades_n the_o bishop_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n with_o his_o colleague_n the_o transmarine_a bishop_n non_fw-la debuit_fw-la ought_v not_o usurp_v to_o himself_o this_o judgement_n which_o be_v determine_v by_o seventy_o african_a bishop_n tigisitanus_n sit_v primate_n and_o what_o will_v you_o say_v if_o he_o do_v not_o usurp_v this_o power_n for_o the_o emperor_n be_v desire_v send_v bishop_n judge_n which_o shall_v sit_v with_o he_o and_o determine_v what_o be_v just_a upon_o the_o whole_a cause_n in_o which_o passage_n there_o be_v very_o many_o thing_n observable_a as_o first_o that_o the_o roman_a prelate_n come_v not_o in_o till_o there_o be_v leave_v for_o they_o to_o go_v to_o transmarine_a bishop_n second_o that_o if_o the_o pope_n have_v come_v in_o without_o this_o leave_n it_o have_v be_v a_o usurpation_n three_o that_o when_o he_o do_v thus_o come_v in_o not_o by_o his_o own_o proper_a authority_n but_o by_o leave_n there_o be_v other_o bishop_n make_v judge_n with_o he_o four_o that_o these_o other_o bishop_n be_v appoint_v and_o send_v by_o the_o emperor_n and_o his_o power_n that_o which_o the_o pope_n will_v least_o of_o all_o endure_v last_o lest_o the_o pope_n and_o his_o adherent_n shall_v say_v this_o be_v a_o usurpation_n in_o the_o emperor_n 162._o s._n aug._n tell_v we_o a_o little_a before_o in_o the_o same_o epistle_n still_o that_o this_o do_v chief_o belong_v ad_fw-la curam_fw-la ejus_fw-la to_o the_o emperor_n care_n and_o charge_n and_o that_o he_o be_v to_o give_v a_o account_n to_o god_n for_o it_o and_o melciades_n do_v sit_v and_o judge_v the_o business_n with_o all_o christian_a prudence_n and_o moderation_n so_o at_o this_o time_n the_o roman_a prelate_n be_v not_o receive_v as_o pastor_n of_o the_o whole_a church_n say_v a._n c._n what_o he_o please_v nor_o have_v he_o any_o supremacy_n over_o the_o other_o patriarch_n and_o for_o this_o be_v all_o other_o record_n of_o antiquity_n silent_a the_o civil_a law_n be_v proof_n enough_o and_o that_o be_v a_o monument_n
something_o else_o for_o my_o not_o admit_v the_o case_n to_o be_v alike_o f._n pretend_v that_o the_o pope_n make_v bishop_n of_o purpose_n for_o his_o side_n but_o this_o the_o bishop_n prove_v not_o b._n §_o 29_o num._n 11_o no_o nor_o have_v i_o reason_n to_o take_v on_o i_o to_o prove_v what_o i_o say_v not_o i_o know_v it_o will_v be_v expect_v i_o shall_v prove_v what_o i_o say_v and_o it_o be_v hard_o to_o prove_v the_o purpose_n of_o the_o pope_n heart_n for_o if_o it_o be_v prove_v that_o he_o make_v bishop_n at_o that_o time_n that_o some_o of_o they_o be_v titular_a only_o and_o have_v no_o livelihood_n to_o subsist_v but_o out_o of_o his_o purse_n and_o so_o must_v hang_v their_o judgement_n at_o the_o string_n of_o it_o that_o some_o of_o these_o thus_o make_v be_v send_v to_o the_o council_n and_o sure_o not_o without_o their_o errand_n yet_o if_o the_o pope_n will_v say_v he_o neither_o make_v nor_o send_v they_o to_o over-rule_v the_o holy_a ghost_n at_o that_o meeting_n or_o of_o purpose_n for_o his_o side_n as_o no_o question_n but_o it_o will_v be_v say_v who_o can_v prove_v it_o that_o be_v not_o a_o surveyor_n of_o the_o heart_n but_o though_o the_o pope_n heart_n can_v be_v see_v yet_o if_o these_o and_o the_o like_a presumption_n be_v true_a it_o be_v a_o great_a sign_n that_o trent_n be_v too_o corrupt_a and_o factious_a a_o meeting_n for_o the_o holy_a ghost_n to_o be_v at_o and_o sure_o the_o case_n in_o this_o not_o alike_o at_o nice_a num._n 2_o that_o which_o i_o say_v be_v that_o trent_n can_v be_v no_o indifferent_a council_n to_o the_o church_n the_o pope_n have_v make_v himself_o a_o strong_a party_n in_o it_o and_o this_o i_o prove_v though_o you_o be_v here_o not_o only_o content_a to_o omit_v but_o plain_o to_o deny_v the_o proof_n for_o i_o prove_v it_o thus_o and_o you_o a._n answer_v not_o that_o there_o be_v more_o italian_a bishop_n there_o then_o of_o all_o christendom_n beside_o more_o yea_o more_o than_o double_a and_o this_o i_o prove_v out_o of_o the_o council_n itself_o which_o you_o have_v in_o your_o hand_n in_o decimo_fw-la sexto_fw-la but_o have_v no_o great_a heart_n to_o look_v it_o for_o where_o the_o number_n of_o prelate_n be_v express_v that_o have_v suffrage_n and_o vote_n in_o that_o council_n the_o italian_n be_v set_v down_o to_o be_v 187._o and_o all_o the_o rest_n make_v but_o 83._o so_o that_o there_o be_v more_o italian_a bishop_n by_o 104_o than_o of_o all_o the_o rest_n of_o christendom_n sure_o the_o pope_n do_v not_o mean_a to_o be_v overreach_v in_o this_o council_n and_o whatsoever_o become_v of_o his_o infallibility_n otherwise_o he_o may_v this_o way_n be_v sure_a to_o be_v infallible_a in_o whatsoever_o he_o will_v have_v determine_v and_o this_o without_o all_o doubt_n be_v all_o the_o infallibility_n he_o have_v so_o i_o prove_v this_o sufficient_o i_o think_v for_o if_o it_o be_v not_o to_o be_v sure_a of_o a_o side_n give_v any_o satisfy_a reason_n why_o such_o a_o potent_a party_n of_o italian_n more_o than_o double_a to_o the_o whole_a christian_a world_n shall_v be_v there_o show_v i_o the_o like_a for_o nice_a and_o i_o will_v give_v it_o that_o the_o case_n be_v alike_o between_o these_o two_o counsel_n num._n 3_o here_o bellarmine_n come_v in_o to_o help_v but_o sure_o it_o will_v not_o help_v you_o that_o he_o have_v offer_v at_o as_o much_o against_o the_o council_n of_o nice_a as_o i_o have_v urge_v against_o that_o at_o trent_n for_o he_o tell_v we_o antepenult_n that_o in_o the_o council_n at_o nice_a there_o be_v as_o few_o bishop_n of_o the_o west_n present_a as_o be_v of_o the_o east_n at_o trent_n but_o five_o in_o all_o be_v it_o so_o yet_o this_o will_v not_o make_v the_o case_n alike_o between_o the_o two_o counsel_n first_o because_o i_o press_v not_o the_o disparity_n in_o number_n only_o but_o with_o it_o the_o pope_n carriage_n to_o be_v sure_a of_o a_o major_a part_n for_o it_o lay_v upon_o the_o pope_n to_o make_v sure_a work_n at_o trent_n both_o for_o himself_o and_o his_o church_n but_o neither_o the_o greek_a church_n in_o general_n nor_o any_o patriarch_n of_o the_o east_n have_v any_o private_a interest_n to_o look_v to_o in_o the_o council_n at_o nice_a second_o because_o i_o press_v not_o so_o much_o against_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n that_o there_o be_v so_o exceed_v many_o bishop_n of_o the_o west_n compare_v with_o those_o of_o the_o east_n for_o that_o must_v must_v needs_o be_v when_o a_o council_n be_v hold_v in_o the_o west_n but_o that_o there_o be_v so_o many_o more_o italian_n and_o bishop_n obnoxious_a to_o the_o pope_n power_n than_o of_o all_o germany_n france_n spain_n and_o all_o other_o part_n of_o the_o west_n beside_o three_o because_o both_o bellarmine_n and_o a._n c._n seek_v to_o avoid_v the_o dint_n of_o this_o argument_n by_o compare_v the_o western_a with_o the_o eastern_a bishop_n and_o be_v content_a to_o say_v nothing_o about_o the_o excessive_a number_n of_o italian_n to_o other_o of_o the_o west_n that_o will_v receive_v a_o full_a answer_n than_o any_o of_o the_o rest_n for_o though_o very_a few_o western_a bishop_n be_v at_o the_o council_n of_o nice_a be_v so_o remote_a yet_o at_o the_o same_o time_n pope_n sylvester_n hold_v a_o council_n at_o rome_n in_o which_o he_o with_o 275_o bishop_n of_o the_o west_n confirm_v the_o nicene_n creed_n 449._o and_o anathematise_v all_o those_o which_o shall_v dare_v to_o dissolve_v the_o definition_n of_o that_o holy_a and_o great_a council_n now_o let_v bellarmine_n or_o a._n c._n or_o any_o else_o show_v that_o when_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n sit_v there_o be_v another_o council_n though_o never_o so_o private_o in_o regard_n of_o their_o miserable_a oppression_n which_o sit_v in_o greece_n or_o any_o where_o in_o the_o east_n under_o any_o patriarch_n or_o christian_a bishop_n which_o do_v confirm_v the_o canon_n of_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n and_o anathematise_v they_o which_o admit_v they_o not_o and_o i_o will_v confess_v they_o speak_v home_o to_o the_o comparison_n between_o the_o counsel_n else_o a_o blind_a man_n may_v see_v the_o difference_n and_o it_o be_v a_o vast_a one_o num._n 4_o but_o here_o a._n c._n make_v account_n he_o have_v find_v a_o better_a reply_n to_o this_o and_o now_o tell_v we_o that_o neither_o french_a nor_o spanish_a nor_o schismatical_a 62._o greek_n do_v agree_v with_o protestant_n in_o those_o point_n which_o be_v define_v in_o that_o council_n especial_o after_o it_o be_v confirm_v by_o the_o pope_n as_o appear_v by_o the_o censure_n of_o jeremias_n the_o greek_a patriarch_n who_o agree_v with_o the_o protestant_n in_o the_o point_v define_v by_o that_o council_n as_o he_o speak_v or_o rather_o to_o speak_v proper_o against_o the_o point_n there_o define_v i_o know_v not_o and_o for_o aught_o a._n c._n know_v many_o may_v agree_v with_o they_o in_o heart_n that_o in_o such_o a_o council_n dare_v not_o open_v themselves_o 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this_o the_o protestant_n all_o agree_v and_o for_o the_o second_o the_o immediate_a deduction_n they_o be_v not_o formal_o fundamental_a for_o all_o man_n but_o for_o such_o quartum_fw-la as_o be_v able_a to_o make_v or_o understand_v they_o and_o for_o other_o it_o be_v enough_o if_o they_o do_v not_o obstinate_o or_o schismatical_o refuse_v they_o after_o they_o be_v once_o reveal_v indeed_o you_o account_v many_o thing_n fundamental_a which_o be_v never_o so_o account_v in_o any_o sense_n by_o the_o primitive_a church_n such_o as_o be_v all_o the_o decree_n of_o general_a counsel_n which_o may_v be_v all_o true_a but_o can_v never_o be_v all_o fundamental_a in_o the_o faith_n for_o it_o be_v not_o in_o the_o power_n of_o 3._o the_o whole_a church_n much_o less_o of_o a_o general_n council_n to_o make_v any_o thing_n fundamental_a in_o the_o faith_n that_o be_v not_o contain_v in_o the_o letter_n or_o sense_n of_o that_o common_a faith_n which_o be_v once_o give_v and_o but_o once_o 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thomas_n hold_v the_o first_o and_o 3._o durand_n the_o late_a then_o you_o agree_v not_o whether_o the_o soul_n of_o christ_n do_v descend_v real_o and_o in_o essence_n into_o the_o low_a pit_n of_o hell_n and_o place_n of_o the_o damn_a as_o 16_o bellarmine_n once_o hold_v probable_a and_o prove_v it_o or_o real_o only_a into_o that_o place_n or_o region_n of_o hell_n which_o you_o call_v limbum_fw-la patrum_fw-la and_o then_o but_o virtual_o from_o thence_o into_o the_o low_a hell_n to_o which_o 11._o bellarmine_n reduce_v himself_o and_o give_v his_o reason_n because_o it_o be_v the_o 2._o common_a opinion_n of_o the_o school_n now_o the_o church_n of_o england_n take_v the_o word_n as_o they_o be_v in_o the_o creed_n and_o believe_v they_o without_o far_a dispute_n and_o in_o that_o sense_n which_o the_o ancient_a primitive_a father_n of_o the_o church_n agree_v in_o and_o yet_o if_o any_o in_o the_o church_n of_o england_n shall_v not_o be_v thorough_o resolve_v in_o the_o 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particular_a man_n assertion_n upon_o the_o church_n yet_o i_o see_v you_o mean_v not_o to_o leave_v it_o and_o sure_o as_o controversy_n be_v now_o handle_v by_o some_o of_o your_o party_n at_o this_o day_n i_o may_v not_o say_v it_o be_v the_o sense_n of_o the_o article_n in_o hand_n but_o i_o have_v long_o think_v it_o a_o kind_n of_o descent_n into_o hell_n to_o be_v conversant_a in_o they_o i_o will_v the_o author_n will_v take_v heed_n in_o time_n and_o not_o seek_v to_o blind_v the_o people_n or_o cast_v a_o mist_n before_o evident_a truth_n lest_o it_o cause_v a_o final_a descent_n to_o that_o place_n of_o torment_n but_o since_o you_o will_v hold_v this_o course_n stapleton_n be_v of_o great_a note_n with_o you_o than_o m._n rogers_n his_o exposition_n or_o note_n upon_o the_o article_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n be_v with_o we_o and_o as_o he_o so_o his_o relection_n and_o be_v it_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n which_o stapleton_n affirm_v 1._o the_o scripture_n be_v silent_a that_o christ_n descend_v into_o hell_n and_o that_o there_o be_v a_o catholic_a and_o a_o apostolic_a church_n if_o it_o be_v then_o what_o will_v become_v of_o the_o pope_n supremacy_n over_o the_o whole_a church_n shall_v he_o have_v his_o power_n over_o the_o catholic_a church_n give_v he_o express_o in_o scripture_n in_o the_o 9_o key_n to_o enter_v and_o in_o 16._o pasce_fw-la to_o feed_v when_o he_o be_v in_o and_o when_o he_o have_v feed_v to_o 32._o confirm_v and_o in_o all_o these_o not_o to_o err_v and_o fail_v in_o his_o ministration_n and_o be_v the_o catholic_a church_n in_o and_o over_o which_o he_o be_v to_o do_v all_o these_o great_a thing_n quite_o leave_v out_o of_o the_o scripture_n belike_o the_o holy_a ghost_n be_v careful_a to_o give_v he_o his_o power_n yes_o in_o any_o case_n but_o leave_v the_o assign_v of_o his_o great_a cure_n the_o catholic_a church_n to_o tradition_n and_o it_o be_v well_o for_o he_o if_o he_o can_v so_o 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matter_n subject_n to_o question_n to_o great_a question_n in_o these_o day_n whether_o a_o man_n may_v be_v certain_a of_o his_o be_v in_o the_o state_n of_o salvation_n certitudine_fw-la fidei_fw-la by_o the_o certainty_n of_o faith_n do_v not_o 14._o bellarmine_n make_v it_o a_o controversy_n and_o be_v it_o not_o a_o part_n of_o your_o catholic_a faith_n if_o it_o be_v determine_v in_o the_o tridentini_n council_n of_o trent_n and_o yet_o these_o two_o great_a friar_n of_o their_o time_n dominicus_n soto_n and_o andreas_n vega_n 1622._o be_v of_o contrary_a opinion_n and_o both_o of_o they_o challenge_v the_o decree_n of_o the_o council_n and_o so_o consequent_o your_o catholic_a faith_n to_o be_v as_o each_o of_o
any_o christian_a be_v offend_v that_o there_o shall_v be_v a_o good_a end_n of_o controversy_n can_v you_o think_v of_o a_o better_a end_n than_o by_o a_o general_n council_n and_o if_o you_o have_v a_o most_o gracious_a king_n incline_v unto_o it_o as_o you_o say_v it_o be_v offer_v how_o can_v you_o acquit_v yourselves_o if_o you_o do_v not_o consent_v now_o here_o a._n c._n marvel_n what_o 62â—_n kind_n of_o general_n council_n i_o will_v have_v and_o what_o rule_v i_o will_v have_v observe_v in_o it_o which_o be_v moral_o like_a to_o be_v observe_v and_o make_v a_o end_n of_o controversy_n better_o than_o their_o catholic_a general_n counsel_n true_o i_o be_o not_o willing_a to_o leave_v a._n c._n unsatisfy_a in_o any_o thing_n nor_o have_v i_o any_o meaning_n to_o trouble_v the_o church_n with_o any_o new_a devising_n of_o my_o any_o general_a council_n shall_v satisfy_v i_o and_o i_o presume_v all_o good_a christian_n that_o be_v lawful_o call_v continue_a and_o end_v according_a to_o the_o same_o course_n and_o under_o the_o same_o 2._o condition_n which_o general_a counsel_n observe_v in_o the_o primitive_a church_n which_o i_o be_o sure_o be_v counsel_n general_n and_o catholic_a what_o ever_o you_o be_v but_o i_o doubt_v that_o after_o all_o noise_n make_v about_o these_o requisite_a condition_n a._n c._n and_o his_o fellow_n will_v be_v find_v as_o much_o if_o not_o more_o defective_a in_o performance_n of_o the_o condition_n than_o in_o the_o condition_n themselves_o well_o the_o jesuit_n go_v on_o for_o all_o this_o f._n i_o ask_v the_o b._n whether_o he_o think_v a_o general_n council_n may_v err_v he_o say_v it_o may_v b._n §_o 31_o i_o presume_v you_o do_v not_o expect_v i_o shall_v enter_v into_o the_o proof_n of_o this_o controversy_n whether_o a_o general_a council_n may_v err_v in_o determination_n or_o not_o yourself_o bring_v no_o proof_n that_o it_o can_v and_o till_o that_o be_v bring_v my_o speech_n be_v good_a that_o it_o can_v and_o yet_o i_o hope_v to_o be_v find_v no_o infringer_n of_o any_o power_n give_v by_o christ_n to_o his_o church_n but_o it_o seem_v by_o that_o which_o follow_v you_o do_v by_o this_o question_n can_n a_o general_n council_n err_v but_o seek_v to_o win_v ground_n for_o your_o other_o which_o follow_v f._n if_o a_o general_n council_n may_v err_v what_o near_o be_v we_o then_o say_v i_o to_o unity_n after_o a_o council_n have_v determine_v yes_o say_v he_o although_o it_o may_v err_v yet_o we_o shall_v be_v bind_v to_o hold_v with_o it_o till_o another_o come_v to_o reverse_v it_o b._n §_o 32_o num._n 1_o whether_o a_o general_a council_n may_v err_v or_o not_o be_v a_o question_n of_o great_a consequence_n in_o the_o church_n of_o christ._n to_o say_v it_o can_v err_v leave_v the_o church_n not_o only_o without_o remedy_n against_o a_o error_n once_o determine_v but_o also_o without_o sense_n that_o it_o may_v need_v a_o remedy_n and_o so_o without_o care_n to_o seek_v it_o which_o be_v the_o misery_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n at_o this_o day_n to_o say_v it_o can_v err_v seem_v to_o expose_v the_o member_n of_o the_o church_n to_o a_o uncertainty_n and_o waver_v in_o the_o faith_n to_o make_v unquiet_a spirit_n not_o only_o to_o disrespect_n former_a counsel_n of_o the_o church_n but_o also_o to_o slight_v and_o contemn_v whatsoever_o it_o may_v now_o determine_v into_o which_o error_n some_o opposer_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n have_v fall_v and_o upon_o this_o be_v ground_v your_o question_n wherein_o be_v we_o near_o to_o unity_n if_o a_o council_n may_v err_v but_o in_o relate_v my_o answer_n to_o this_o you_o be_v not_o so_o candid_a for_o my_o word_n do_v not_o sound_a as_o you_o seem_v to_o do_v that_o we_o shall_v hold_v with_o the_o council_n err_v or_o not_o err_v till_o another_o come_v to_o reverse_v it_o as_o if_o ground_n of_o faith_n may_v vary_v at_o the_o racket_n and_o be_v cast_v of_o each_o side_n as_o a_o cunning_a hand_n may_v lay_v they_o num._n 5_o you_o forget_v again_o omit_v at_o least_o and_o with_o what_o mind_n you_o best_o know_v the_o caution_n which_o i_o add_v for_o i_o say_v the_o determination_n of_o a_o general_n council_n err_v be_v to_o stand_v in_o force_n and_o to_o have_v external_n obedience_n at_o the_o least_o yield_v to_o it_o till_o 7._o evidence_n of_o scripture_n or_o a_o demonstration_n to_o the_o contrary_a make_v the_o error_n appear_v and_o until_o thereupon_o 2._o another_o council_n of_o equal_a authority_n do_v reverse_v it_o and_o indeed_o i_o may_v have_v return_v upon_o you_o again_o if_o a_o general_n council_n not_o confirm_v by_o the_o pope_n may_v err_v which_o you_o affirm_v to_o what_o end_n then_o a_o general_n council_n and_o you_o may_v answer_v yes_o for_o although_o a_o general_n council_n may_v err_v yet_o the_o pope_n as_o head_n of_o the_o church_n can_v a_o excellent_a mean_n of_o unity_n to_o have_v all_o in_o the_o church_n as_o the_o pope_n will_v have_v it_o what_o ever_o scripture_n say_v or_o the_o church_n think_v and_o then_o i_o pray_v to_o what_o end_n a_o general_n council_n will_v his_o holiness_n be_v so_o holy_a as_o to_o confirm_v a_o general_n council_n if_o it_o determine_v against_o he_o and_o as_o for_o etc._n bellarmine_n reason_n why_o a_o general_a council_n shall_v be_v useful_a if_o not_o necessary_a though_o the_o pope_n be_v infallible_a they_o be_v so_o weak_a in_o part_n and_o in_o part_n so_o unworthy_a that_o i_o be_o sorry_a any_o necessity_n of_o a_o bad_a cause_n shall_v force_v so_o learned_a a_o man_n to_o make_v use_n of_o they_o num._n 3_o here_o a._n c._n tell_v i_o the_o caution_n mention_v as_o omit_v make_v my_o answer_n worse_o than_o the_o jesuit_n relate_v it_o and_o that_o in_o two_o 64._o thing_n first_o in_o that_o the_o jesuit_n relate_v it_o thus_o although_o it_o may_v err_v but_o the_o caution_n make_v it_o as_o if_o it_o do_v actual_o err_v second_o in_o that_o the_o jesuit_n relate_v that_o we_o be_v bind_v to_o hold_v it_o till_o another_o come_v to_o reverse_v it_o that_o be_v we_o not_o know_v whether_o it_o do_v err_v or_o not_o but_o only_o that_o it_o may_v err_v but_o the_o caution_n put_v the_o case_n so_o as_o if_o the_o determination_n of_o a_o general_n council_n actual_o err_v be_v not_o ipso_fw-la jure_fw-la invalid_a but_o must_v stand_v in_o force_n and_o have_v external_a obedience_n yield_v to_o it_o till_o not_o only_o moral_a certainty_n but_o evidence_n of_o scripture_n or_o a_o demonstration_n to_o the_o contrary_a make_v the_o error_n appear_v and_o when_o it_o appear_v we_o must_v yield_v our_o obedience_n till_o a_o council_n of_o equal_a authority_n reverse_v it_o which_o perhaps_o will_v not_o be_v find_v in_o a_o whole_a age._n so_o either_o the_o jesuit_n relate_v this_o speech_n true_o or_o less_o disgraceful_o and_o a._n c._n think_v that_o upon_o better_a judgement_n i_o will_v not_o allow_v this_o caution_n true_o i_o shall_v not_o thank_v the_o jesuit_n for_o any_o his_o kindness_n here_o and_o for_o the_o caution_n i_o must_v and_o do_v acknowledge_v it_o i_o even_o upon_o advisement_n and_o that_o whether_o it_o make_v my_o answer_n worse_o or_o better_o and_o i_o think_v far_o that_o the_o jesuit_n have_v no_o great_a cause_n to_o thank_v a._n c._n for_o this_o defence_n of_o his_o relation_n num._n 4_o first_n then_o the_o jesuit_n so_o say_v a._n c._n do_v in_o his_o relation_n make_v it_o but_o a_o supposition_n that_o a_o general_n council_n may_v err_v but_o 63._o the_o caution_n express_v it_o as_o actual_o err_v true_o but_o yet_o i_o hope_v this_o expression_n make_v no_o general_n council_n actual_o err_v and_o then_o it_o come_v all_o to_o one_o whether_o i_o suppose_v that_o such_o a_o council_n may_v err_v or_o that_o it_o do_v err_v and_o it_o be_v fit_a for_o clear_v the_o difficulty_n into_o which_o the_o church_n fall_v in_o such_o a_o case_n to_o suppose_v and_o more_o than_o a_o supposition_n it_o be_v not_o a_o general_a council_n 1._o actual_o err_v then_o as_o only_o under_o a_o possibility_n of_o err_v for_o the_o church_n have_v much_o more_o to_o do_v to_o vindicate_v itself_o from_o such_o a_o error_n actual_o be_v than_o from_o any_o the_o like_a error_n that_o may_v be_v num._n 5_o second_o a._n c._n think_v he_o have_v get_v great_a advantage_n by_o the_o word_n of_o the_o caution_n in_o that_o i_o say_v a_o general_n council_n err_v be_v 63._o to_o stand_v in_o force_n and_o have_v external_a obedience_n at_o least_o so_o far_o as_o it_o consist_v in_o silence_n patience_n and_o forbearance_n yield_v to_o it_o till_o evidence_n of_o scripture_n or_o a_o demonstration_n
be_v or_o can_v make_v i_o but_o if_o he_o ask_v how_o i_o know_v infallible_o i_o believe_v they_o in_o their_o true_a and_o uncorrupted_a sense_n then_o i_o answer_v there_o be_v no_o man_n of_o knowledge_n but_o he_o can_v understand_v the_o plain_a and_o simple_a decision_n express_v in_o the_o canon_n of_o the_o council_n where_o it_o be_v necessary_a to_o salvation_n and_o for_o all_o other_o debate_n in_o the_o counsel_n or_o decision_n of_o it_o in_o thing_n of_o less_o moment_n it_o be_v not_o necessary_a that_o i_o or_o any_o man_n else_o have_v infallible_a assurance_n of_o they_o though_o i_o think_v it_o be_v possible_a to_o attain_v even_o in_o these_o thing_n as_o much_o infallible_a assurance_n of_o the_o uncorrupted_a sense_n of_o they_o as_o a._n c._n or_o any_o other_o jesuit_n have_v num._n 6_o a._n c._n ask_v again_o what_o text_n of_o scripture_n tell_v that_o protestant_n now_o living_n do_v believe_v all_o this_o or_o that_o all_o this_o be_v express_v 69._o in_o those_o particular_a bibles_n or_o in_o the_o write_n of_o the_o father_n and_o counsel_n which_o now_o be_v in_o the_o protestant_n hand_n good_a god_n whither_o will_v not_o a_o strong_a bias_n carry_v even_o a_o learned_a judgement_n why_o what_o consequence_n be_v there_o in_o this_o the_o scripture_n now_o be_v the_o only_a ordinary_a infallible_a rule_n of_o divine_a faith_n therefore_o the_o protestant_n can_v believe_v all_o this_o before_o mention_v unless_o a_o particular_a text_n of_o scripture_n can_v be_v show_v for_o it_o be_v it_o not_o make_v plain_o before_o how_o we_o believe_v scripture_n to_o be_v scripture_n and_o by_o divine_a and_o infallible_a faith_n too_o and_o yet_o we_o can_v show_v no_o particular_a text_n for_o it_o beside_o be_v a_o text_n of_o scripture_n necessary_a yet_o that_o be_v for_o the_o object_n and_o the_o thing_n which_o we_o be_v to_o believe_v not_o for_o the_o act_n of_o our_o believe_v which_o be_v mere_o from_o god_n and_o in_o ourselves_o and_o for_o which_o we_o can_v have_v any_o warrant_n from_o or_o by_o scripture_n more_o than_o that_o we_o ought_v to_o believe_v but_o not_o that_o we_o in_o our_o particular_a do_v believe_v the_o rest_n of_o the_o question_n be_v far_o more_o inconsequent_a whether_o all_o this_o be_v express_v in_o the_o bibles_n which_o be_v in_o protestant_n hand_n for_o first_o we_o have_v the_o same_o bibles_n in_o our_o hand_n which_o the_o romanist_n have_v in_o they_o therefore_o either_o we_o be_v infallible_o sure_a of_o we_o or_o they_o be_v not_o infallible_o sure_a of_o they_o for_o we_o have_v the_o same_o book_n and_o deliver_v unto_o we_o by_o the_o same_o hand_n and_o all_o be_v express_v in_o we_o that_o be_v in_o they_o nor_o be_v it_o of_o moment_n in_o this_o argument_n that_o we_o account_v more_o apocryphal_a than_o they_o do_v for_o i_o will_v acknowledge_v every_o fundamental_a point_n of_o faith_n as_o provable_a out_o of_o the_o canon_n as_o we_o account_v it_o as_o if_o the_o apocryphal_a be_v add_v unto_o it_o second_o a._n c._n be_v here_o extreme_o out_o of_o himself_o and_o his_o way_n for_o his_o question_n be_v whether_o all_o this_o be_v express_v in_o the_o bibles_n which_o we_o have_v all_o this_o all_o what_o why_o before_o there_o be_v mention_n of_o the_o four_o general_a counsel_n and_o in_o this_o question_n here_o be_v mention_n of_o the_o write_n of_o the_o father_n and_o the_o counsel_n and_o what_o will_n a._n c._n look_v that_o we_o must_v show_v a_o text_n of_o scripture_n for_o all_o this_o and_o a_o express_a one_o too_o i_o think_v and_o do_v so_o still_o it_o be_v enough_o to_o ground_n belief_n upon_o 2._o necessary_a consequence_n out_o of_o scripture_n as_o well_o as_o upon_o express_a text._n and_o this_o i_o be_o sure_a of_o that_o neither_o i_o nor_o any_o man_n else_o be_v bind_v to_o believe_v any_o thing_n as_o necessary_a to_o salvation_n be_v it_o find_v in_o counsel_n or_o father_n or_o where_o you_o will_v 19_o if_o it_o be_v contrary_a to_o express_v scripture_n or_o necessary_a consequence_n from_o it_o and_o for_o the_o copy_n of_o the_o counsel_n and_o father_n which_o be_v in_o our_o hand_n they_o be_v the_o same_o that_o be_v in_o the_o hand_n of_o the_o romanist_n and_o deliver_v to_o posterity_n by_o tradition_n of_o the_o church_n which_o be_v abundant_o sufficient_a to_o warrant_v that_o so_o we_o be_v as_o infallible_o sure_a of_o this_o as_o it_o be_v possible_a for_o any_o of_o you_o to_o be_v nay_o be_v we_o not_o more_o sure_a for_o we_o have_v use_v no_o index_n expurgatorius_fw-la upon_o the_o write_n of_o the_o father_n quintum_fw-la as_o you_o have_v do_v so_o that_o posterity_n hereafter_o must_v thank_v we_o for_o true_a copy_n both_o of_o counsel_n and_o father_n and_o not_o you_o num._n 7_o but_o a._n c._n go_v on_o and_o ask_v still_o whether_o protestant_n be_v infallible_o 69._o sure_a that_o they_o right_o understand_v the_o sense_n of_o all_o which_o 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