the publique Prayers also the forme and manner of things with what authority then do our brethren take vpon them to traÌ„spose in the Church of England that which the Church of England hath disposed with what authority can they abrogate or alter the dayes and times of preaching administring the sacraments that the Church of Engl. in like maner by her authority hath disposed with what authority can they dispose assemblies commâ—â—gs together of the people to bee made in other places than to that purpose are disposed with what authority can they controul or disobey the form manner of the publike praiers vsing those thingâ— in the ordinary seruice that the church of Eng. hath disposed to be vsed yet they wil not only refuse to vse thosethings the form manner of publike prayers nor only deface reuile them as naught but set forth oppose against that which by the churches autority is disposed another forme maner of publike prayers of their own disposing Yea if wee were disposed to examine better their owne positions how standeth this with their prayer on the other side of the leafe pag. 69. saying God graunt therfore that in steed of ordinary formes of praier we may haue preaching in all places If the church haue authority to dispose for publike prayer the form manner so that al things be done comely agreeable to order but especially that in all thinges principal regard be had to edification then not only a forme of publike praiers hindreth no whit but furthereth comlines order edificatioÌ„ but also the church vsing her authority in disposing of an ordinary form of publike praiers so well as in disposing the daies times places for preaching it cannot be that preaching in all places shoulde bee had in steed of publike praiers but that both of them should stil continue in their dayes and times places forme and manner by the Churches authority disposed And what followeth hereupon but that either our brethren must denie the Church of England to be the Church and so not to haue authority of their disposing of these things or els granting it to be the Church that is to say a particuler Church for I think they wil not say that they mean this only of the vniuersal church nor yet of euerie seueral congregation for so our Bre. assertion were not true but speaking heere indefinitely that the church hath authority to dispose these thinges they mean euery whole state of any true particular Church in Christendome As the Church of England in Engl. the Scottish Church in Scotl. the Heluetian the Geneuian the French and the Dutch Church in their owne states Which being confessed our Brethren beeing neither the Church vniuersall nor the whole state of the particular Church of England but priuate members in the Church of England and though some numbers of them heere and there collected may make some seuerall congregations yet are they not of sufficient authority no not so to collect themselues or haue any autority of making any assemblings or commings together at all in any place being but priuate persons without the disposing of them that haue autoritie in the Church or of the whole estate of the church of England therunto then must they néedes confesse withall that they doe greatly offende in going about to gaine-say and ouerthrowe this authority of the whole Church of England which hath by her authority so much as in her lies disposed ordeined and established these thinges as touching the circumstaunces for order and comelinesse sake but cheefely for edification as the dayes and times of preaching and administring the sacramentes the places meete for the same and for publike prayers also for the form and manner of vsing those things that all thinges be done comely and agreeable to order but especially that in all things principal regard bee had to aedification Nowe when the Church of Englande hath by her authority and by the authority of the supreme gouernor of her vnder Christe and of all the gouernors ecclesiasticall or politicall of her whole estate thus disposed these thinges Is it lawfull for any priuate persons bee they learned or vnleâ—rned be they few or many in the same Church to resist this autority whether this be to resist euen God or no and whether that which Saint Paule wrot to the Romaines Chapter 13. charging them beeing Christians to obey their Ciuill Magistrates though euil and Heathen in ciuill and indifferent matters do not much more binde euery particular priuate Christian all Christian subiects to obey their Christian Magistrates and all good Christian both Ecclâ—siastical and politike gouernors the whol particular estate autority of their own church wherof they are but priuate members I refer it to euery indifferent readers iudgement to our Bre. own answere on better aduisement of these thinges If our Bre. deny that they haue euer done or yet doe resist the Church of Englands authoritie in disposing these things what was all this that was last spoken of against the ordinary form of publike praier diuine seruice besides the authority it selfe of the ecclesiasticall gouernors and many other things of circumstances for dayes times places and administrations of Sacraments that they so vehemently impugne If they say that herein yet they doe not resist nor speake against the Church of Engl. for her authority to dispose these things but resist and speak against her onely for this that the she hath abused her authority and that she hath encroched further than shee hath lawfull authority to warrant her doing for that her authority as touching these circumstaunces is but for order and comelinesse sake and cheefely for edification and that it is to bée restrained with this limittation So that all thinges bee done comely and agreeable to order but especially that in all thinges principall regarde bee had to edification which S. Paule so often and so precisely vrgeth in the 14. Chapter of the Cor. Neither do we desire to haue the Churches authoritie in these circumstances to bee enlarged one inche further And euen so God bee praysed hath the Church of Englande had and especiall consideration of al these 3. points of comlinesse of order and of edification If they thinke not so acknowledging her to bee a true Church except they can proue it better than hitherto they haue done and yet should they prooue the same also if they coulde with more modesty and humility than they attempt to doe they both offer too great an iniury to their true and louing Mother the Church of England whose Children if any children of the Church they be and bewray too great a partiality to their owne opion And more séemely of the twain it might be thought to all good men that as they confesse their Mother hath authoritie giuen vnto her by their Faâ—her of disposing these circumstances to these ends and
Elders How the auncient Fathers that haue expounded this Epistle Chrysost Oecumenius Theodoret Theophilact and Ambrose haue interpreted this place especially because Caluin Beza Danaeus alleage Ambrose for these Elders How Beza further alleageth Cyprian with a full examination of Cyprian for them How Snecanus likewise alleageth Cyprian Tertullian with parsel of Tertullian for them besides the examining of Clemens Alex Irenaeus Iustinus Martyr Ignatius Policarpus How Danaeus alleageth the Ecclesiasticall histories cheefely Socrates with his allegations out of Augustine Basil Dionisius Ierome and the canon Lawe with the examination of the ecclesiasticall histories the Fathers and the canons for these Elders and of the cause of these so learned mens mistaking in all these searchings for them making all not only nothing for them but cleane against them nor being euer able to prooue not one such consistory no not one such Elder Howe Danaeus with Beza and Caluine return back again to search the Scriptures better for them Rom. 12.1 Corinthians 12. Ephes 4. Act. 20.1 Peter 5. And of Caluines and Danaeus contradictions Of Danaeus return again to the Ecclesiasticall history in Sozomen in which speeding as il as before if not worse for any practise that he would find he comes again to the scripture searching for these Elders Acts. 15. Acts. 21. Philip. 4 1. Tim. 3.1 Pet. 3.1 Corinth 14. Iac. 5. And so home again to that wherwith our bret began the inquiry for them at Act. 14. Lastly of the second point of moderating these Elders authority by propounding all their actions to the people to confirm them And of the popular state our Bret. fear But not auoiding of horrible confusion And of the example they seek to auoid it by in the manner of Saint Pauls excommunication of theincestuous Corinthian AND first say our Brethren let vs examine whether this authoritie be so diffused ouer the whole Churche that the hearing trying and determining of all matters pertayneth to the whole multitude or to some speciall choosen persons amonge them meete for that purpose COme they now in almost at the last casts saying and first let vs examine whether this authoritie be so diffused ouer the whole Church c. What meane our Brethren hereby That the first shall be last and the last shall be first Should they not haue examined this before They sayde in the former page 82. that the authoritie of Christ is left vnto his whole Church And also before that page 81. That regiment which he hath left vnto his Church is a consent of his householde seruants And that our sauiour Christ hath neither authorized nor promised to blesse anie other forme of regiment than that which consisteth of the consent and gathering together of his seruantes in his name What else can any of the seruantes of the housholde of Christ suppose when they heare of this but that where-so-euer they be diffused they must gather themselues together either the whole church vniuersally or euery whole Church particularly and giue their consent thereunto or else the matter whatsoeuer is not authorized by the authoritie that Christ hath left vnto his Church And that he hath blessed none other forme of regiment And must it nowe be called in question and examined whether this authoritie be so diffused ouer the whole Church that the hearing trying and determining of all matters perteyneth to the whole multitude And why not if the former sayinges bée true Do our Brethren begin now to call this a diffused authoritie Diffused commeth néere confused And I Thinke shortly they will finde it confused too And as they nowe beginne to encline to some speciall chosen persons amongst them meete for that purpose so by little and little they will peraduenture come downe at length to some authoritie of gouernement euen of one Pastor afore other in one congregation and perhaps in one Diocesse also which is the thing that they nowe so peremptorilie denie Let our Brethren nowe therefore in their good moode procéede The authoritie â—s the power of our Lorde Iesus Christ graunted vnto the Church Our Brethren sayde in the page before that the authoritie of Christe is left vnto his whole Church here yet they say more circumspectly the authoritie is the power of our Lorde Iesus Christ. Not that Christe hath left his authoritie vnto the Churche but that the authoritie which hee hath left vnto his Church is not so the Churches but that it still remaineth his authoritie Nor that he hath left that his autoritie to his whole Church as they sayde before but as they say here it is graunted vnto the Church Which may well stande if any parte or persons of the Church haue it although the whole Church haue it not But say they because the iudgement of the multitude is confuse whereas God is not the author of confusion but of order and that we finde in the worde of God certaine officers appointed for gouernment we are bold to affirme that that charge belongeth vnto those that are such Here our Brethren in this Learned discoursing of the matter hauâ— now at length found out not diffusion but plaine confusion in the iudgement of the multitude So that we may now I hope with our Bretherens good leaue dismisse in peace the gathering together of the housholde seruantes nor enquire after their consentes but for the consent only of certaine officers appointed for gouernment And here our Brethr. say they are bold to affirme that that charge belongeth vnto those that are such This boldnes of our Breth is here yet the more coÌ„mendable that they feare not to repell the peoples consent and iudgement for feare of confusion Whereas God is not the author of confusion but of order But it had béene better in my simple iudgement not at all to haue sette the multitude a-gogge as hauing an interest of consent and authoritie to heare trie and determine all matters onely to bridle the Pastors and the Bishops authoritie than nowe hauing brought them in to thrust theÌ„ out Turpius eijcitur quaÌ„ non admittitur hospes Will the multitude hearing that Christ hath giuen his authoritie to his whole Church and so to euerie Church indifferently that that regiment which he hath left vnto his Church is a consent of his housholde seruauntes and that he hath neither authorized nor promised to blesse any other forme of regiment than that which consisteth of the consent and gathering together of his seruantes if they thinke themselues to be any part of his whole church or of anie particular Churches and seruauntes of his housholde suffer themselues after they are gathered together to vse their authoritie and to giue their coÌ„sent to be this mocked in the end be told it pertayneth not to the whole multitude but to some special chosen persons amoÌ„gst theÌ„ because the iudgement of the multitude is confuse and God is not the author of
perceaue that their good meaning in them doth nothing aunswere to the perilous daunger of them Last of all for as muche as the Election of Pastors is a great and waightye matter whiche ought not to bee permitted to the iudgement of anye one man but perteyneth to the Churche whereunto they should bee chosen both for better aduise in choosing of a meete man and for aucthoritye in causing him to accept their Election it is conuenient that it bee done by the iudgemente of the particular Synode Our brethren heere from the correction returne to the Election of Pastors bicause say they it is a greate and waightye matter They vrge a fresh that it ought not to be permitted to the iudgement of anye one manne but pertayneth to the Churche wherunto they shoulde bee chosen I replye that although in some Churches it may well so bee and hath beene and is that the Church had or hath some voyce inter-est or consent in choosing of their Pastors namelye in choosing of the Byshops as the Pastors of all Cathedrall Churches haue yet some interest in the electing of the Bishops to their Churches whome the Christian Princes by the prerogatiue of their chiefest estate and as Patrons for the temporalties that they haue endowed the Bishoprickes withall and for their chiefe charge that they haue in generall and specially of all the Churches in their Dominions doe commend vnto their elections yet on the other side manye Churches haue beene and are furnished with good Bishops and especially inferiour particular Churches with excellent Pastors by the iudgemente and appointing of one man And we haue good warrant also for the same For not onely Christ himselfe by his owne onelye Iudgemente did first elect and ordaine the Apostles and all the other 72. Disciples but also Sainct Paule elected and ordeyned Timothy and Titus to bee Bishops or rather Archbishops of Ephesus Creta that they mentioning no other ioyned with them in the Authoritye of that action should also ordaine others to be Bishops and Elders in euery Citie of those Prouinces And although they except that Christes doing heerein is aboue all other yet me thinketh that it is the better Example For had it beene absolutely euill to appoint any to be a teacher of the people and to minister the Sacrament vnto them whom the people their selues had not chosen then would Christ being but one man neuer haue so chosen any at all to that office Neyther helpeth it their tourne that they say the Apostles had not certaine places or boundes assigned vnto them wherein to preache and Minister the Sacramentes as Bishops and Pastors haue for neyther the limitation of the places as any preiudice to the matter nor yet the very Apostles and the 72 Disciples were so left at large by these wordes of Christe Marke 16. 15. Goe into all the worlde and preache the Gospell to all Nations c. But that both for a while the places of their Preaching were limited vnto them before this commission 〈◊〉 also that afterwarde they did portion out among them selues certaine partes and limites of the worlde wherein they woulde preache and some continued still or moste commonlye at or neere about Ierusalem and Iames had such especiall Resyance and charge in that Church that he is called both of the auncient and late wryters as we haue seene the Bishop thereof But what shall we saye to those Pastors that in euery particular Church of their prouinces were made by the onely Iudgement of Timothie and Titus For the text inferreth no necessity whereon we should gather that they were chosen and ordeyned by the Iudgement and aucthoritye of any other Yea the very wordes of the Apostles charge to ordaine them city by citie or in euerie towne except we shal say he called the Synodes to euery towne plainely argue that the making of thē was without Synods But let vs now see how these sayings hang together that the election of Pastors pertaineth to the Church wherunto they should be chosen and yet it is conuenient that it be done by the iudgement of the particular Synode which they called before the Synode of euery prouince or shire For whatsoeuer their reasons are that here they alleage both for better aduice in chosing a meete man and for aucthority in causing him to accept their election yet if the Election pertaine to the church wherunto the parties elected should be chosen then eyther it pertayneth to both or not to the iudgement of the Synod be it either particular or generall For the Synode is not the church whereunto they are chosen except they will call a particular church a particular Synode And though they say they giue not the synod the aucthority in choosing a meete man but onely for better aduice in chosing a meete man aucthority only in causing him to accept their election yet doth not this follow hereupon that it is cōuenient that the electiō it self be done by the Synods iudgement For then hath the iudgement of the Synode authority in the election it selfe and such authority too that if any election of a Pastor in any congregation be made without the iudgement at the least of a particular or shire Synode it is an inconuenient election To auoyde with inconueniencie it must néedes fall out that so often as any Pastorship is vacant in all England by and by there must not onely bee an assemblie made by that particular church but also a Synod be called and assembled of the whole prouince or at least of the whole shire for their iudgemēt in the election of euery particular Pastor to be chosen Wherby we should haue if not in euery shire yet in most shires continuall Synodes But in euery assembly or company some one of necessity he a Pastor or Elder must haue this prerogatiue to order and dispose the same with reason or else great confusion is like to followe pag. 114. and how then must it not also followe of necessity that there must bee a continuall prerogatiue of one among and ouer the Pastors But what grosse contradictions these sayings implye and that is more what daylye molestations contentions daungers and inconueniences these their so often continuall assemblies Synods of euery shire eyther with the Princes warrant as Dancus would haue it or without it would breede throughout the whole realme although there were no other daunger by their former too too great authority but only this their aduice iudgement aucthority in the elections of euery newe Pastor that is to be chosen ouer all England I referre it to the further consideration of the indifferent readers iudgement That no one man hath aucthority to ordaine Pastors and to impose them ouer Churches hath bene before declared by the example of the Apostles Paule Barnabas who although they were Apostles yet wold they not chalenge that prerogatiue vnto themselues but by
likewise they haue before declared and thereto cited euen one of their last testimonies pag. 21. by the name of Elders the Pastors are called Act. 14.23 where Paule and Barnabas ordeyned Elders by election in euery congregation But if now that they may be able to knowe these matters of which the hauing a Pastor is an order both of comelines and aedification according to Gods word these Elders themselues must be Pastors How shal these Elders enquire when the Pastors place is void where they may finde a man meet to supply his roome when the roome is neuer voyd of Pastors so long as the assemblie of Elders doth continue If they continue not much lesse can they enquire for one nor choose him nor deserue therein the ayde of the Synod for him But be the assemblie of the Elders Pastors themselues or not can they not choose another Pastor to supplye his roome when any Pastors place is voyde among them but that they ought therein to desire the ayde of the Synode For wherein do they meane this therein but of that they declared before to enquire when the Pastors place is voyde where they may finde a man meete to supplye his roome and therein to desire the ayde of the Synode They declared before concerning the Pastors election that it was conuenient to bee done by the iudgement of the particular Synode both for better aduice in choosing a meete man and for authoritie in causing him to accept their election And ought they now to haue the Synods ayde also to helpe them to enquire when the Pastors place is voyde where they may finde a meet man to supply his roome So that when and wheresoeuer in all England a Pastors place is voyde we ought not onely forthwith to haue a Synode vppon that onely occasion except the roome shall stande voyde till some greater occasion of a Synode happen but the Synodesayde must bee craued before the newe election where they may finde a meete man and in the election it selfe their aduise also must be had in choosing a meete man and besides this their authoritie must be had in causing him that is the elected partie to accept their election and finally it is conuenient that it bee done also euen by the iudgement of the particular Synode And then this meete man after all this inquirie both of the assemblie of Elders of that particular Church and of the Synodes ayde in this enquirie being at last found out and the man by such godly aduice so chosen and by this authoritie so caused to accept their election and all this being thus authentically done and ratified by the iudgement of the particular Synode the man ought to be presented to the congregation and by them to be allowed and receiued What and must a new allowance of the congregation be had after all this assembling inquiring aduising and choosing of the gouerning Elders of that congregation Yea and aboue them after all the assembling inquiring and better aduising and choosing and authorizing and euen causing the man to accept their election and after iudgement and all of the particular Synode What shall we thinke hereon Hath the particular congregation an higher authoritie of allowing the Pastor then haue not onely the gouerning Elders whom the congregation their selues haue of confidence chosen and committed vnto them their authoritie pag. 84. but also then the whole particular Synode whose ayde therein was desired and must it now be ouerruled by the allowing or disallowing of euery particular congregation If they say they meane not that the man ought so to bee allowed and receiued of the congregation that he may also of them bee dissallowed or not receiued but that the congregation must allowe him and receiue him after all these allowances of him and authorities What and will they impose him vpon them and inforce the congregation to allowe him and receiue him Well may they be compelled to receiue him but they cannot compell them to allowe him except from teeth outward If they say they meane not to cause them to allowe him or receiue him but that they ought onely of their duetie so to doe doe they not say in plaine words of the Synodes authoritie ouer the elected partie and for authoritie in causing him to accept their electioÌ„ What imply these words but that he must accept their election be he willing or vnwilling to accept it And haue they more authoritie to cause him to accept their election than they haue to cause that particular congregation which haue committed their authoritie to the assemblie of Elders which assemblie haue desired the ayde of the Synod to accept the man whom they haue thus elected for them But they say that they ought so to doe not simply but if no man can shewe any reasonable cause to the contrary And what if no man can doe this must they thus therefore impose Pastors on them And is not this imposing one of their quarelles against the Bishops are they now themselues faine to come to imposing of Pastors on the congregations But what now if any man can alleadge any reasonable cause to the contrarie must euery reason of any one man ouer-rule al the reasons and authorities both of all the residue of the congregation and of all the gouerning Elders and of all the Synode See what a great sturre wee haue here had still must haue about the choosing of euery Pastor in that Realme all the seuerall congregation all the assemblie of Elders all the Synode of the Prouince or Shire must meete together with all this adoe and when all is done in comes any one man he alone vpon any reasonable though not necessarie cause may turne topside turuie all their doings And is this the right election and ordeyning of Pastors Yea say they this is the right election and ordeining of Pastors Yea and grounded vppon the word of God and practised by the Primitiue Church 200. yeres after Christ. This is stoutly auouched if now they can proue it But can they shew this election and ordâ—yning of Pastors in any places yea in any one place in al Gods word Well what of that It is grounded say they vpon the word of God What Are they soone grounded What meane they by grounded CaÌ„ they shewe vs any one rule or but any one example hereof in the worde of God No place that they haue yet alleadged sheweth any such election and ordeyning of Pastors What Synodes assembling inquiring aduising choosing iudging and causing of the partie elected to accept their election was there had in the electing and ordeyning Pastors by Paule and Barnabas Act. 14 Or what electing and ordeyning of Pastors was there in the Synode if we shall properly call that assemblie a Synode which was of the Apostles and Elders of Ierusalem Acts. 15 Or doth S. Paule in any of his precepts to Timothie or to Titus commaund not only an
assembly of the same congregatiō whereunto the Pastor should be chosen but also a Synod either general or nationall or Prouincial or particular yea be it but of one shire to be called and holden at the electing and ordeyning of all and euery or of any Pastors for their particular congregation And how then dare our Brethren for very shame so confidently affirme as though it were most cléere and out of all crime This is the right election and ordeyning of Pastors grounded vppon the worde of God What a grounding is this of the which no one place nor foote of grounde can bee found or seene or heard of And yet if this were the right election and ordeyning of Pastors then all the electiōs and ordeynings of Pastors expressed in the word of God must either be according vnto this or els they were not elected and ordeyned aright or els this is not so the right election and ordeyning of thē but that other elections ordeynings of Pastors mencioned in the word of God without these assemblies and Synods for the doing of them are as right as they And then this maner of electing if euer there were any such is no necessarie prescription vnto other But our bretheren not content thus amisse to father this their electing and ordeyning of Pastors as grounded vpon the word of God they proceede further to this practise of 200. yeares after christ But this pretended practise also we haue already sufficiently improued And albeit during the sayd tyme and as long againe in many places the people had voyces of cōsent in the elections of their Bishops Yet had they not also the like dealing in electing all the Pastors vnder the Bishops vnt as for ordeining they had neuer any part at all theirin neither for Bishops nor for any other Pastors neither during the practise of those 200. yeares nor far before nor after except they shall find some odd extraordinarie example which I remember not but that were not able to cary away al the practise of the primatiue church for 200. yeares after Christ. But to call them to the iustifying of that they haue auouched here can our Bretheren bee able to prooue that all the elections and ordeynings of Bishops and Pastors were made by the Inquirie aduice choise iudgment and authoritie of Synodes causing the party elected to accept their election or that Synodes were alwaies called whensoeuer any Pastor of any particular church was to be elected and ordained By this wee maye plainely see that our presentation of patrones is both prophane and preiudiciall our giuing of orders by Bishops is presumptuous and full of absurdities First because they take vppon them to doe that which none of the Apostles durst doe that is without Election of the churches to ordaine Elders Secondlye that they giue an office without a charge to make a Pastor and send him to seeke a flocke where hee can finde it which is as vnreasonable a thing as if one were chosen to be a church warden had neuer a church to kepe or made a constable that had neuer a towne or place appointed wherof he should be constable For the name of Pastor Elder or ouerseer is the name of an office in act and essc because it is a proper relatiue and not potentiall abilitie in the cloudes If Bishops as they be nowe were consecrated after the same maner to seeke their bishopriks where they could find them it were no greater absurditie then it is to ordaine Pastors and let them proll where they can for their benefices Thirdly by this wādring we may also say vagabound ministrie shifting from place to place and in all places to bee counted a minister where he hath noe charge it would griue a man to thinke what inconuenience doth followe but principally howe filthilye it stinketh of the olde popishe indelible charecter from whence it hath his grounde and neither of any reason or of the worde of God And yet forsooth it is so perfect that it may abide no reformation Fourthly if you will see howe well the authority which they claime and practise is vsed of them that onely haue the choyse and admission of Ministers Looke ouer the whole Realme of England what a multitude of vnfit Pastors shall you finde in euery place so that Ieroboam neuer made worse priestes of the refuse of the people to serue his goldē calues then they haue ordeyned Ministers to feede the flock of Christ which he hath purchased with his own blod By this that wee haue before perused wee can neyther plainlye nor any way see that our presentation of patrones being vsed as in right lawe established it ought to be is eyther prophane or preiudiciall which wordes are very rough and hard being spoken not so much against such patrones as doe prophanely with the Churches spoyle abuse their interest as simply against all our presentations of patrones Prince or whosoeuer and against the right and tytle of them although they chuse neuer so meete a man or present him neuer so freely For since that to whomsoeuer the right of Electing hath perteyned the principall end thereof was to prouide the Churches of meete Pastors so that this may be prouided for and vpholden The right of electing is not in it selfe prophane And to whom is this our presentation of patrones preiudiciall Is it preiudiciall to the people Yea rather if it be well vsed is it not more beneficiall to them there is no simple necessitie of the peoples presenting nor example in the Scripture as yet alleadged But if the people had got a right afterward might they not againe haue lost their right or interest whatsoeuer they had which was rather in Cities about the choosing of their Bishops than of all Pastors in euery particular congregation by abusing the same through their factions immoderate and tumultuous contentions oftentimes ended with bloodshed whereof the Ecclesiasticall histories haue many examples and some within the space of the foresayd 200. yeres And why might not their interest in electing Bishops haue ceased as did their authoritie in many other things besides that they had among themselues before while the Princes that were in chiefe authoritie ouer them were as yet out of the household of the faith and enemies thereto Which Princes afterwardes becomming faithfull this care especially belonged to them both to prouide for godly Bishops and to restrayne their people from factions and from sedicious growing by their disordred elections And so the people left off by little and little to deale in those matters when the Christian Princes the Clergie in the Cathedrall Churches dealt therein And doe not our Bretheren in effect confesse that the people haue resigned vp what interest they had vnto an assemblie of Elders consisting of graue wise and godly men to elect for them and pag. 84.85 in whome they repose such confidence that they commit vnto them their authoritie in
entirely retaine their supreame authority in Ecclesiasticall causes Neuerthelesse there is no reason to the contrary but it may be thought of some or of moste if not of these Learned discoursers that they shoulâ— haue treated first on the Supreame authoritie of Christian Princes that the reader might first haue knowen what Gouernement perteyneth to them and howe farre it extendeth by the worde of God that haue the Supreame authoritie of Eccl. causes and then to haue treated on those in their orders dignities and places that are vnder them and séene likewise the differences of their inferiour Gouernements And so should the reader of these controuersies haue eastly plainely perceaued whether any of their inferior Gouernments authorities had incroached on the Christian Princes Supreame gouernment authoritie yea or no. This mee thinketh had béene the better the simpler and more direct Methode then first to bring in all the other inferiour persons and to assigne this and that Gouernement vnto euerie of them and when all haue had their places offices and gouernementes assigned to them then to come to the Christian Princes and tell them this is the place and office of Supreame Gouernement left for you Your Maiesties come late these 4. are your Seniours ye are but their punies and therefore be content there is no remedie you must take that which by them is not forestalled howe farre your Supreame authoritie extendeth we shall haue better occasion to entreate hereafter when we haue described the Eccl. state Me thinketh that Christian Princes may take griefe hereat yea euerie indifferent Reader may suspect that Christian Princes might haue great wrong offered them by this dealing But whether our brethren Discoursers meane thus or no by bringing in first all the inferiour persons and taking vp before hande ere the Princes be so much as mentioned the direction of all Eccles. matters to bee directed onely by them and bid the Princes be content they shall haue the Supreame place of authoritie that is the last place as they perhaps meane it and the Princes vnderstande it for the chiefest place let them now go on and tell their owne tale and shewe their reasons for thus placing of the Christian Princes Where-uppon it seemeth that all the regiment of the Churche dependeth Where-upon And where-upon I pray you brethren speake you this eyther vpon the giuing to Christian Princes the first treatise or vpon the Supreame authoritie of Christian Princes The supreame authoritie you haue graunted But the first place of the treatie yee will not graunt Where-upon it may be taken that this your where-upon seemeth as if ye sayde If we should first intreate of the Supreame authoritie of Christian Princes then it might seeme that all the regiment of the Church dependeth on them But construe your owne words wherevpon ye please eyther vpon the one sense or the other Here is nothing yet alleaged but that onely it seemeth that all the regiment of the Church dependeth on it But if it be vnderstoode for the onely first place of the treatie it can not so much as seeme to depende all vppon the first treating of the same If it be vnderstoode of the Christian Princes supreame gouernement in Ecclesiasticall causes which you haue graunted and we take holde thereon and that some what yet in time least all be cleane giuen from them if all be not giuen away alreadie but yet will wee take as good holdfast as we can for the Princes right that Christian Princes haue supreame authoritie in Ecclesiasticall causes which once beeing graunted then whether yee treate there-upon first or last whatsoeuer would seeme to fall out will seeme so still But what is this that would seeme to fall out hereupon That all the regiment of the Church dependeth on the Christian Princes supreame authoritie in ecclesiasticall causes Would this seeme if the Prince had the first place Doeth it seeme that all the regiment of the Church dependeth on the Pastor And yet here you assigne the Pastour the first place Though afterwarde vppon further aduisement you put him backe and make him come downe with shame and take the lower roome giuing the first place to the Doctor notwithstanding your selues doe thus heere for a while exalt the Pastour But it seemeth ye haue a greater Iealousie of the Christian Prince then of anie of all these foure Tetrarkes For howsoeuer yâ—â— set them one before or after another the Christian Prince must come behind them all for feare it might seeme that the regiment of the Church dependeth thereon But shall the Christian Princes be debarred of the right of their place in the treatie of their authoritie because it seemeth that there-upon the Regiment of the Church dependeth It seemeth that these wordes are suspitiouslie cast foorth as though her Maiestie would haue all the Ecclesiasticall functions and all their ministerie of the worde and sacraments and all the mysticall state of Christes militant Church in her Maiesties Dominions to depende on her Maiesties supreame authoritie in Ecclesiasticall matters It seemetht his is not verie good dealing to burthen her Maiestie with suspition of such thinges But we will suspende our iudgâ—ment for all this that seemeth to depende for if wee shoulde not but streight condemne a thing because it seemeth this or that what if this dealing of our brethren seemed harde to the Christian Prince What if it seemed to her Maiestie that the bringing in of all these foure Estates before her Maiestie and the giuing vnto them onely the direction of all Ecclesiasticall matters might be greatly preiudiciall to the state of gouernement established to make a mutenie in the common-weale to sâ—â— vs all together by the eares to make an infinite number of factions and alterations yea to take from her Maiestie the best part of her supreame authoritie and to bréed many mo mischiefes and inconueniences then she or you or we or any yet sawe If I say it should seeme so vnto her Maiestie and to a great number besides which thinke themselues as sounde Protestantes and as good subiects as you either would seeme to be or are would ye not straight wayes aunswere What though it seemeth so yet it is not so it is but onely your surmise and though it seemeth so to you yet it seemeth not so to vs ye will say nor to many other But sure it is not so whatsoeuer it seemeth vnto anie If nowe we replie well yet it seemeth not so of nothing There can be no smoake where there is no fire and if it be not smoake indéede yet since it seemeth to be smoak it is not amisse to feare fire We must abstaine from all appearaunce of evill 1. Thes. 5. Would ye be content to haue the matter ouerruled thus against your Learned discourse for this Tetrarchie because these daungers might so seeme to insue yea to depende there-upon And I pray you brethren what stronger reason call ye this It may
commaunded Bee yee subiect one to another in the feare of God Ephes 5. The holy Fathers therefore in the old time considering these things haue described the same in the order of the Cleargy that all the other Clearks should with a singular care bee kept and gouerned of the Presbyter or Eldershippe but among the Preestes or Elders the bishop as a Consull among the secretaries of the common-weale according to the often alleaged example of Caluine So hee shoulde beare the cheeefest care and custody both of the whole Church and also singulerly of the vniuersall order of the Cleargye But vnto euery more frequented Church they ordeyned bishops and to euery one of such Churches they commended the Churches neerer adioyning that were in the lesser Townes or Villages and to this purpose they willed the Preestes and Curates of the same Churches whome they called Chorepiscopâ—s Bishops Chorall eche one of them to hearken to the bishop that was neerer to them and to the Presbytery or Eldership Which Preestes or Elders those B being the more cheefe called oftentimes together with al their Cleargy and furnished them in knowledge and diligence of their functions But whereas the Lorde woulde that they which are men appertayning to him shoulde mutually embrace one another and sustayn care one of another as farre and as largely as they are able for all Christians are one body the holy fathers haue ordeyned that the bishops of euery prouince for now all the territories subiect to the Romanes were distributed into Prouinces should assemble them-selues together with the preestes or Elders so often as the neede of the churches required the same but for certaynty twise in the yeare and shoulde enquire of the doctrine and discipline of Christ how the same in all the particular Churches was administred and did flourish And where they had found that sinne was they shoulde correct it and such thinges as they had knowne to bee wel they should confirm them and aduance them But that these Synodes should rightly orderly be administred they willed that both for the calling and moderating of them the Metropolitans should bee the rulers of them that is the bishops of euery Metropolitane City for so the cheefest city in euery prouince was called where the Pretory or pallace of the cheefest president was And therupon vnto these Metropolitane byshops they enioyned a certayne care and heedefulnesse of all the Churches throughout their prouince that if so be they vnderstoode of anie thing that were not so wel ordeyned or doone either of the ministers of the Churches or of the common people they should in time admonish them thereof and if they could not amend the same by their admonitions that to correct it they should call together a synode of the B. for no iudgement was graunted vnto them which by their owne proper authority they might exercise in the Churches that had bishops themselues of their owne for all the iudgement both ouer the people and ouer the Cleargy appertayned to their owne bishop and to the preest or Elder of euery church and as for the B. the synodes iudged them And thereupon when as the B. were to be ordeined vnto the churches it was appointed that they should come together to the same church with all the B. of their Prouince if that with the profit of the churches it might bee doone if not with some of them Howbeit not with fewer then two or three of them Which bishops should gouerne the election of the bishop if it were yet to be made and being made they should examine it and most seuerely make inquiry of him that is elected and search out all his life and his ability for the Episcopall office and then at length initiate him into the episcopall function All which thinges were instituted and were in force vnto this ende that there might bee among the churches and in the Ministers therof so great a knowledge as by any means was possible and a mutuall care and to debarre and expell all offences of Doctrine and of manners and to susteine aduaunce and make more effectuall the edification of faith life worthy of Christ the Lord insomuch that if so be any had ceased from their duetye or office the other bishops shold giue assistance yea to the excoÌ„municating casting him out of the Episcopall office Let those thinges be considered that Saint Cyprian wrote to Stephanus bishop of Rome concerning Martian bish of Arles who fell into the Nouatians sect The first booke Epist. 13. and also those thinges that he wrote in the third Epistle the first booke concerning a certayn portion of the Flocke distributed to euery one of the B. and the thinges that he hath in his Preface and in the counsayle of Carthage as he writeth to Quirinus Furthermore when as all the world was replenished with Churches and that the Metropolitanes also had neede of their owne particuler cure for neither as there began to be very many were all of them wise or watchfull inough for alwayes in all orders of men fewe are excellent the care of some of the prouinces was committed to certayn Byshops of the cheefe Churches as to the Romaine to the Constantinopolitane to the Antiochian and to the Alexandrine and afterwarde to the Caesarien of Cappadocia and to certain other euen as the Churches of Christes faythfull people being multiplied the necessity seemed to requre Notwithstanding vnto these Primate bishops whom afterward they called Patriarckes there was no right at all ouer these other bishops or Churches then that I haue sayde was vnto euery Metropolitane ouer the Churches and bishops of his prouince Euery one vnto his owne portion of Churches ought a singuler care and heedefulnesse and also to admonish the bishops in time if any had aught offended or slacked in his office And if by admonishing he had profited nothing to adhibite the authority of a Councell Among these the first place was yeelded to the Romayne both for the reuerence of S. Peter and also for the maiesty of the City By which reason the fathers afterward ensuing gaue the second place to the Constantinopolitane as to the other Rome and to the bishop of the seate of the Empire whereas the Antiochian had before that obtained the seconde place among these Patriarckes But as the nature of man defiled with ambition laboureth alwayes more that he might rule far wide then that hee might rule well these Patriarckes on the occasion of this generall care of the Churches to theÌ„ committed drew vnto them first the ordeyning of the bishops that were neerer to them And by that ordeining snatched by litle and little and confirmed some iurisdiction ouer such byshops and their churches Which euill when now it glimpsed foorth began to become a greeuous contention concerning a generall empire ouer all the Churches Which indeede first of all Iohn a certaine bishop of Constantinople vnder the Emperour Mauritius
attempted to take vpon him Of which contention very many Epistles among the Epistles of S. Gregory lib. 5.6.7 are extant At the length vnder Phocas the Romayne obteyned this Title of the vniuersall Bishop Which title by little and little the bishops of this sea began more to abuse vntil vpon occasion first by the diuision of the Empire vnder Charles the greate afterwards by the discordes of Princes and nations whereby they brake the power of the Emperor of the West and of other kings They haue lift vp themselues into that Anti-Christian power whereof now they vaunt hauing firste oppressed the power of the Bishops and then also of the kings and Emperoures Thus therefore hath Sathan ouerthrowne all the healthfull obedience gouernment of the clerical order For the Romaine Antichriste hath taken an immediate Empire vnto himselfe ouer all the Cleargy and also ouer the Laity hath dissolued the custody of the Bishops when they were good and their care towards those that were commended to their truste But because it is altogether necessary that euery of the Clerkes should haue their proper keepers and carers for them the power and authority as of Bishops so also of Archdeacons and of all other by what meanes soeuer they be esteemed vnto whome any portion of keeping and gouerning the Cleargie is committed is to be restoared and also their vigilancy and heedfull regarde or correction leaste any should bee at all in this order 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 vnkept Thus farre Bucer not onelye faithfully reciting but also praysing the custome of the auncient church in diuers orders of Ecclesiastical functions to be ordeined of the which we haue before spoken Moreouer I ought also to haue had consideration of those churches which although they haue embraced the Gospel notwithwanding both in matter and in name they haue retayned their Bishops and Archbish. Besides that in the Churches also of the Protestants there want not in very deede Bishops and Archbishops whome hauing chaunged their good Greeke names into euill Latine names they call Superindentes and generall Superindentes but where also they neither obteine these old good Greeke names neither these newe euill Latine names euen there notwithstanding some principals or chiefe are wont to bee vnto whome almost al the authority doth belong Poynting out as it should séeme to Geneua c. The controuersie therefore should haue beene of names but whenas we agree cōcerning the matters what do we brawle concerning the names In the meane season euen as I haue not dissallowed the Fathers in that matter whereuppon the quaestion is so can I not but loue our mens zeale Who haue therefore hated the names bicause they feare least with the names the olde ambition also and the tyrannye with the ruine and desolation of the Churches might be called againe Thus reuerently writeth Zanchius of these Ecclesiasticall orders of this superiority of Bishops and Arch-bishops yea and of the Patriarkes also before the pride and tiranny of Antichriste came and that it came not by these orders and dignities but by the ambitious breaking and violating of them and he neither disalloweth but highly commendeth these Fathers and these orders and dignities as good and necessary and nothing preiudiciall to the word of God nor condemneth the zeale of these our brethren though he shewe withall that albeit they shunne and hate the name of Bishop and Archbishop yet they haue the matter and retain still such principall or chiefe ministers among them to whom almost all the authority doth belong Now as hee hath thus at large defended and confirmed his 10. 11. Aphorismes so comming to the 12. he proceedeth against the ambition tyrannie of the Pope to shew that none of al these orders and dignities no not of the Patriarkes were any occasion therunto saying For neither Christe ordeyned such an head neither the auncient Fathers would admit it bicause it was not expedient for the Churche But they were contented with 4. Patriarks the Romain the Cōstantinopolitane the Alexandrine and the Antiochien who all of them should be of equall authority and power and ech one should bee content with his owne bowndes euen as it was defyned in the Nicene Councell confirmed in others and that not without great waighty causes Of the which this in my iudgement is not the laste to wit leaste the dores should be opened vnto tyrannie in the Church but rather that if one should dare to attempt any thing contrarye to the sownde doctrine of Christ and contrary to the liberty of the Church The other Arch-bish being of no lesse authority with their bishops might oppose themselues and dawnt his boldnes breake his tyrannie The Church in respecte of Christe is a kingdome In respect of men that are in the same eyther do rule or be ruled it is a gouernment of the best persons This is Zanchius graue iudgement euen of these Patriarkes that if they had beene kept as they ought to haue béene and according to the good purpose of their institution they were so litle occasiōs to any popish pride or tyranny that they were the most especiall suppression of it and of al errors and factions in the Church and that it impeacheth nothing Christes kingdome And what hath Zanchius said héerein saue for the bare title of Hierarchie that Caluine himselfe doth not anow who saith Institut Chr. cap. 8. de Fide Sect. 54. But that al the particular Prouinces had one Arch-bishop among the Bishops and that in the Nicene Councell Patriarks were ordeyned that in order and dignity should be superiour to the Arch-bishop that thing appertayned to the conseruation of discipline Albeit in this disputation it can not be ouerpassed that these degrees therefore were chieflye instituted for this cause that if any thing should happen in any Church which coulde not be well dispatched of a few it should bee referred to a prouinciall Synode If the greatnesse and difficulty of the cause required also a greater discussing that Patriarkes were adhibited together with the Sinodes from the which there should be no appeale but a generall Councell The gouernment being thus constituted some called it an Hierarchie an holy gouernment or sacred principalitye by a name as seemeth to mee vnproper verily vnused in the Scriptures For the holy Ghost would take heede least any should dreame of principaiity or Domination when as the gouernment of the Church is treated vpon Howbeit if omitting the name we shall looke into the matter we shall find that the old Bishops would not faigneanother forme of gouerning the Church different from that which the Lord by his word prescribed Thus also doth Caluine his selfe confesse besides that which he before cōfessed And what shoulde wee then as Zanchius saide brawle about the name the matter whereof is thus of al these so excellent learneed men both the auncient Fathers and also the late or yet lyving moste
the gouernement of a kingdome is not so necessarie but that they might do it did it by their deputies or else these queenes did sit their selues in publike indgement yet no reproch or vncomlines vnto their shamfastnes But whatsoeuer they did then Danaeus will proue that this should not now be done And why not now From hence to wit that it is vtterly vnseemely for the shamefastnes of a woman sayth he by the ciuill lawe of the Romanes L. mulieres D. de regul iuris women are rightly repelled from administring the functions and offices belonging to meÌ„ such as also are those that ought to be exercised in publike And the same is the saying of Augustine Lt. de nuptâ—s cap. 9. Neither can it be doubted that men ought rather to be principall vnto women than women to men Here is both the autority of the ciuil law of this most famous Doctor of the Church S. Aug. alleaged against womens sitting in publike iudgment their supreme gouernment ouer meÌ„ To S. Aug. afterwarde in his order Let vs first consider the ciuill law hereon Not that I wil take vpon me lawyerlike to answere this rule of the law of maÌ„ in such learned full maner as the professors thereof would do it sufficeth me that I find sufficient warrant for womens supreme gouernment out of Gods lawe NotwithstaÌ„ding I deny not this law ciuill so far as it contrarieth not the law diuine which we all Christendom are more bound vnto thaÌ„ to any ciuil law of the Romanes Io. Ramus in his Inchiridion or manuel de reg iuris li. 2. axiom 50. de Faeus mentions this rule froÌ„ whoÌ„ Danaeus taketh it Vlpian sayth he doth say that women are remoued froÌ„ al ciuill or publike offices both because it is not commendable for the shamefastnes of the feminine sexe to be prouoked to do those things which appertain to men also because the counsell of women is feeble fraile and without the experience of matters Vlpian alleageth examples therfore womeÌ„ can be no iudges nor demaunde right nor appeare for other nor bee procurators Of the motiues that induced hereunto this famous lawyer Vlpian and yet but an heathen Idolater not knowing Gods law nor séeing such measure of his giftes among the heathen Romanes in those daies we shal after God willing sée further Danaeus leading vs to the enquirie what women haue also gouerned the Romaine Empire As for this law both properly is vnderstood of the personall actions of such offices or functions as appertaine onely to pleas for hereunto hee driueth all his examples and so no more restrayneth the principalitie of a womans supreme gouernement ouer a kingdome than it doth of a childes neither is it further to be stretched than serueth to the reasons here alleaged which only take place in the ordinarie sort of women But when as we haue shewed so many laudable examples to the contrarie and shall sée further in the practise of the greatest states in Christendome yea Danaeus also himselfe hath specified some such examples as in all points are aunswerable to all the vertues here required and to many farre more excellent besides as firme as constant and as expert counsell of most waighty matters as in the most best Counsellers among men not only such as Holda to whoÌ„ Iosias the high Priest and the grauest Counsellers resorted for counsell nor as Iudith that gaue most godly stoute and prudent counsell to the Priestes the Elders and all the people but God be praysed by Danaeus owne confession we are not vnfurnished in this behalfe And therfore such excellent women are to be excluded from this rule of the ciuill lawe but not from the rule of the ciuill gouernment But for our better proofe hereof to shew how this rule of the ciuill law debarreth not simply all women especially not Princes no not from publike sitting and pronouncing law in iudgement the promptuarie of the three lawes to wit the diuine lawe of God the Cannon lawe of the Bishops and the Ciuill lawe of the Emperours collected by Montholonius as comming next to hande may suffice mee thinkes both for the matter it self and for the lawes reaching to or restrayning of this rule Upon this sentence Iudg. 4. Debora the wife of Lapidoth was the Prophetesse which iudged the people at that time of Iabin king of Chanaan and shee fate vnder a date tree that was called by her name betweene Rama and Bethell in mount Ephraim and the children of Israell came vp to her for all iudgement c. Upon the woorde shee iudged sayth Montholonius By the lawe of man it is not permitted for women to iudge or to exercise the office of a partie that iudgeth The text is open in L. faeminae in princ ff de reg iuris in c. cum Praetor § 1. ff de iudi in C. 1. § tria sunt 3. quaest 7. in c. mulierem militem in fi 33. quaest 5. which notwithstanding proceedeth not in the case that is put in c. dilecti de arbi where it is sayde Dilecti fil Abbas c. Our beloued sonnes the Abbot and Couent of Sardinia of the Cistercien order haue by complaint declared vnto vs that whereas among them of the one partie and the hospitalers he meaneth those of the order of S. Iohn whome wee called the Knightes of the Rhodes or nowe of Malta of the other partie a question was mooued in sute of lawe about the vsage of a certaine woode it was by both parties compromitted to the Frenche Queene who vnderstanding the merites or rightes of the cause thought good the definitiue sentence to bee promulgated or published by arbitriment But although according to the rule of the Ciuil lawe women are remooued from publike offices and in an otherl place it bee sayde that albeit they be of most highe estimation if they take vppon them an arbitriment or else beeing Patronesses they interpose themselues in the hearing of matters among their Tenauntes manumised or made frée they are to bee separated from all iudiciall examining so that no penaltie nor any exception of couenaunt may bee taken against the contemners of them by reason of their prolation or sentence that they haue giuen foorth neuerthelesse because of the custome approoued which in the partes of France is holden for lawe women preexcelling are knowen to haue an ordinarie iurisdiction ouer their subiectes we therefore commande that by the penaltie decreed in the compromise the hospitalers obserue the same arbitriment euen as it is prouidently set foorth and receaued of either partie especially sithe it hath beene ratified with the presence and counsell of the Bishops These wordes hath the text Which well proueth that those which are preexcellent women or of great nobilitie may giue iudgement Hereupon sayth Angelus in his Counselles Consil. 270. that he sawe Queene Ioane sitting in the throne made for
And yet must these be added to the residue that the Churching or thankesgiuing of women after their child-birth might altogether be omitted and that among the superstitions vsed in buriall no kinde of praying nor preaching should be vsed If preaching be the soules foode who did last forbidde it And besides these thinges what sturre and hote contentions haue béene raysed vp for a number of other thinges which in regarde of preaching though otherwise in their kindes and degrées they be comely and decent yet in that respect may be accounted for small trifles And therfore I would wish our Brethren to take good héede what here they say that they are not to be excused if any for small trifles only rayse vp hote contentions sith this toucheth themselues néerer than they wéene What maketh them to cast foorth these spéeches But that they thinke eyther these matters for which they thus contende are matters of great importaunce or else that not they but we rayse vp suche hote contentions for them And indéede though in their owne nature many of them be indifferent yet being by lawefull authoritie ordeyned to be vsed for publike order and for comelinesse they are become hereby more important than that it may be lawefull to any priuate man at his owne voluntarie to shake them off except by the like lawefull authoritie whereby they were brought in they shall be remooued Yea in this case we are bounde to be hoate for defence of them also so wée excéede not the boundes of Christian charitie both for obedience to the lawefull authoritie that made them and also for the order and comelinesse sake for which they were authorized not to sée them impugned sithe that in the impugning of them not onely the obeyer yéelding to them is defaced but the lawes and Magistrates authoritie in making them is violated and indaungered Wherein although the defenders be hoate yet properly not the defenders but the impugners are indéede the verie raysers of these hoate contentions And therefore by this their owne saying our Brethren are not in this behalfe to be excused but rather with griefe and in charitie be it spoken to be accused yea they accuse in these wordes their owne selues as disturbers of the Churches quiet Neither can they shelter themselues vnder this worde onely saying they raise not vp this hote contentions for small trifles onely but that among their quarells there are some of great importance For let anie of thē be of what importance soeuer they shal be found to be ought they only or not only to raise such hote contentions for any suche small trifles Now as in this point they plainly make themselues not excusable so much more in adding these wordes So haue they much to answere before God that suffer the people of God to lacke the only food of their soules for such humane cōstitutiōs Verily this goeth néerer to the quicke For howsoeuer we may shufle out aunsweres one to another when we shall come to aunswere before God we can not so answere before him For if none should suffer the people of God to lacke the only foode of their soules for such humane constitutions shall our Brethren be excusable that being lawfully called to the office of distributing this only foode of our soules do altogether with drawe themsemselues and that onely if they will afforde them no better title for such humane constitutions But they say the fault is not in them for they would gladly continue in feeding the people of God if they might be suffred Yet doth this their owne saying still make them vnexcusable For séeing they be but such humane constitutions as should be rather suffered than that they should suffer the people of God to lacke the only foode of their soules they suffring this for not suffring the other do invincibly recharge themselues that herein they haue much to aunswere before God If our Brethr. reply that these humane constitutions for which they suffer the people of God as farre as in them lyeth vtterly to lacke the onely foode of their soules be such as by no meanes are sufferable and can not be ioyned with the deliuery of the worde of God this requireth to be better proued than yet it is Which if they can proue then wee must néedes yéeld the fault to be in vs and that we haue much therein to aunswere before God and to crie God heartily mercy and ioyne them And also I hope vpon such proofe euery good man will do But for my part I could neuer yet sée this proued As for any humane constitution that our cōmunion booke and the Eccl. gouernment of our Church of England doth require of them hath bin further by others I also I trust haue euidently sufficiently proued for those that as yet we haue séene that they are none other humane constitutions but such as may well stande with the Pastors feeding the people of God with the onely foode of their foules to wit the word of God And therefore they haue much to aunswere who by their not yéelding to them but rather cleane forsaking the Pastorship cōmitted to them and ministerie of the word and sacraments are the cause their selues that they be not suffred to preach and so suffer the people to lacke the only foode of their soules for thinges which are in comparison farre inferiour matters But to conclude say our Brethren it is the dutie of euerie true Pastor to obserue those things that are concluded by the lawfull authoritie of the Church concerning ceremonial matters for order and comelines sake and for aedification and not to controll publike order by his priuate iudgement but vpon great and waightie causes This is a good conclusion that our Brethren do here make of all these matters But do they not yet sée how flatly withall they conclude against themselues For we are now in hand with ceremoniall matters And the whole Church o◠England hath fully concluded long since that by lawfull authority that these things are to be obserued cōcerning ceremoniall matters for order and comelines sake for aedification What foloweth then But as our Brethr. here do say it is the dutie of euery true Pastor to obserue those thinges and not to controll publike order by his priuate iudgement How then doe our Brethren in controlling and not obseruing those things obserue the dutie of true Pastors Do they think that their iudgement is not priuate iudgement But what is it else For although they were some greater number of Pastors thā they be yet being compared to the lawfull authority of the whole Church of Englande they are but priuate Pastors and their iudgement priuate especially beeing depriued by lawfull authoritie of their Pastorship or rather exauthorating themselues of the ministery Do they think this exception which they reserue for the last cast and place it as a rereward in the end of this conclusion but vpon
great and waightie causes will be a sufficient starting hole to saue all vpright themselues froÌ„ pronouncing the definitiue sentence against themselues that their doing is not the dutie of true Pastors No that will not helpe them For these matters beeing but ceremoniall matters as they call them and so not great and waightie what great waightie causes should moue a true Pastor by his priuate iudgement to controll publike order in those thinges that are concluded by lawefull authoritie of the Church concerning ceremonial matters for order and comlines sake for aedification Shal any priuate man thinke if he think them to be indéede the Church of God that the Churches concluding of those thinges by lawefull authoritie proceeded not of greater and waightier causes than his controllment And therefore except men shall make so litle light account of the true Church of God and of her conclusions and orders by lawefull authoritie as to preferre euerie priuate mans or Pastors priuate iudgement before hers our Brethren by this their owne conclusion must either néedes yéeld to the Church of Englandes publike conclusion and lawfull authoritie concerning these ceremoniall matters that they are to be obserued for order and comelines sake and for aedification as the Church of England hath decréed them and not to controll publike order by priuate iudgement or else let our Brethr. herken to their owne conclusiue sentence and determination that they do not the dutie of true Pastors And thus much also for these ceremonies We haue hetherto intreated of the proper dutie of a Pastor himselfe now it followeth that we likewise set foorth his authoritie in common gouernement with the Elders But least any man should mistake that which we purpose to say of his authoritie we haue need to expresse what we meane by this worde authoritie For euen those things that we haue shewed before to be the dutie of a Pastor may also be called his authoritie as to preach and teach wherein is included his authoritie to forgiue and reteine sinnes Also his authoritie to minister the sacraments and to doe other thinges in the Church which none may doe but he But in this place we vnderstande authoritie for power of gouernement in the Church Whereof the Apostle speaketh that it is one of the graces and giftes of God necessarie for the building of his Church This authority of regiment we haue declared that it ought not to be a Lordly ruling neither ouer their flocke nor yet ouer their fellow seruants and brethren and least of all that they ought to haue dominion or Lordship ouer the faith of the Church Our Brethren here promise to sette foorth that part of the Pastors authoritie which they say he hath not of the proper dutie of a Pastor himselfe but in common gouernement with the Elders But because these wordes as they are grounded on the presupposall of that Eldershippe which they make one part of their Ecclesiasticall Tetrarchie not dealing with the woorde so promising â—o treate of the authoritie of the Pastor in common gouernement they séeme their selues to doubt that except they should expounde what they meane thereby it might easily bee mistaken what they meant Neither doubt they this mistaking without a cause which of purpose shunne the plaine and vsuall approoued distinction of the authoritie or power of the order and of the iurisdiction But what-so-euer authoritie of the Pastor they will nowe sette foorth and make playne what they meane thereby when as they faye For euen those thinges which wee haue shewed before to be the dutie of a Pastor may also bee called his authoritie as to preache and teach wherein is included his authoritie to forgiue and retaine sinnes if this authoritie of the Pastor to forgiue and retayne sinnes bee included in his authoritie of preachinge and teaching and withall this bee a thing appertaining to the proper dutie of a Pastor himselfe as also is his authoritie to minister the Sacramentes and to doe other thinges in the Churche which none may doe but hee then haue not the Elders to deale in the authoritie of forgiuing and retayning sinnes For if they shoulde they shoulde intermeddle with the worde For this is included in preaching and teaching But our Brethren exclude the gouerning Elders from preaching and teaching therefore withall they exclude them from the authoritie of forgiuing and retayning sinnes And this by the way is not vnnecessarie to bee héere obserued because afterwarde they giue authoritie of forgiuing and retayning sinnes vnto the gouerning Elders which they confesse are not Teachers nor Preachers nor dealers at all with the worde But doeth not this authoritie of the Pastor belong to iurisdiction And therefore not onely the authoritie of his order to which properly preaching and teaching and ministring the Sacramentes doe appertayne but the authoritie also of iurisdiction to which the power of forgiuing and retayning sinnes appertayneth is the proper dutie of the Pastor himselfe which none may doe but he and is an authoritie separate from that his authoritie which is in common gouernment with the Elders or with any other which are not Pastors in the Church And as for that power of gouernment in the Church whereof the Apostle speaketh 1. Cor. 12.28 That it is one of the graces and gifte of God necessarie for the building of his Church S. Paule maketh not all the graces and giftes of God which there he speaketh of necessarie for the building of his Church if we speake of such perpetuall necessitie as that the Church can neuer be without them For S. Paul reckoneth vp there great offices graces and giftes of God that are not necessarie in that sense As euen the first office that he beginneth there withall of Apostles besides the giftes of healinges the giftes of powers or of working mightie myracles and the gifts of diuerse kinds of languages All which are not now so necessary in our dayes nor many hundreth yeres sithence to the building of Gods Church Neither is it agréeed vppon by the best interpreters what manner of grace and gift of God this power of gouernment in the Church was which S. Paule in that place speaketh of For albeit Beza say he declareth the order of Elders that were keepers of the Discipline and policie Ecclesiasticall yet sayth Aretius it is a politicall facultie of administring the common weale and of ruling others commodiouslie and of conseruing them in order which gift is necessarie in Magistrates And while the Churche wanted a politique Magistracie certaine choosen Elders gouerned the assemblyes of the faithfull as it were an ordinarie Magistracie Héere in déede hée sayeth this gifte is necessarie but he addeth in whome to witte in Magistrates and yet he specifieth in what kinde of Magistrates to witte politicall and in the administring of the common wealth not the Ecclesiastical discipline And withall he limiteth a time how long this gift of
inquirie must bee made by witnesses Signifieng that the complainers must not easilie bee beleeued Moreouer that the fame and name of those that are good must bee fauoured that they bee not openlie defaced with euerie small rumour First heere I take Priest or Elder by office and age that is the Ministers must not bee condemned except diligent inquisition be had Neiâ—her onely the Ministers but all persons of graue yeeres For vnto whome God hath giuen a good name and grauitie of age it behoueth to worshippe them in the place of parents Therefore diligent heede is to be had that the defamers bee not rashlye beleeued against such persons Moreouer because such Priests or Elders were Iudges and Senatours Ecclesiasticall that corrected other for their sinne according to the reason of their fault it is credible that they incurred the offence of many insomuch that they shoulde not want backbiters It was therefore a matter worthy of admonition that nothing shoulde rashly bee credited against them Neither followeth it therevpon that witnesses shoulde bee had onely in these and in other they must proceede without witnesses yea rather because in these grauitie is required he teacheth that the same must be had in euery Ecclesiasticall iudgement In the meane time there are many light and childish matters in which neither the integritie of the fame nor name is touched wherein there is no neede of like rigour Let vs therefore establish this for a common rule that in all Ecclesiastical iudgement the president or gouernour must haue care that in a godly and holy sorte inquisition may be made of mens sinnes Thus doth likewise Aretius drawe this precept of Paule to Timothie to a generall rule that in the consistorie in criminall causes euen agaynst a Minister whome he calleth also a Praesident ouer the people the hearing that the Bishop is a higher Praesident aboue him and hath the admittance and his iudging of the matter And what differeth Beza herein from these Against an Elder sayth he 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 The Greekes referre this to men of more auncient yeeres which to mee seemeth verie absurde For although somewhat ought to be giuen to the hoare head yet I see no cause why in this point the condition ought not to be alike But in a Priest there is a farre other reason because it is certaine that Sathan layeth his snare chieflie against this sort of men And for that cause none are so much thrall to slaunders and backbitings In hearing therefore the accusations of them there is most neede of great heedfulnesse But thou wilt saie what is that Heere mee thinkes some haue stumbled while they thinke that nothing is heere praescribed of Paule which in all iudgements is to bee obserued And therefore they sweate much in vntying this knotte and doo manifestlie wreast the wordes of the Apostle insomuch verily that some which thing Erasmus out of a certayne Epistle written by Saint Ierome to Marcella rehearseth doo cleane blotte out all that member following and then expounde it receiue not that is receiue not easilie Howbeit I doo not suppose anie difficultie to bee heere for it is one thing to admit the accusation and anotherthing to absolue or condemne the accused But this is the office of a iudge to heare anie that will accuse whom afterward if they shall not throughly proue him guiltie he may chastise according to their deserts But for all this when as a Priest is accused the Apostle would haue a certaine peculiar thing to be obserued that no man shoulde bee admitted no not so much as to accuse him except before hand afore two or three witnesses he shall cause his accusation that is to come to bee beleeued So that the Priest be not straight waie condemned or the cause heard in his absence But that after it shal appare that it wil not be a friuolous accusatioÌ„ That then at the length the guiltie partie shall be called and that it shall bee lawfullie determined on the whole matter But I finde the cause of this Apostolicall constitution to be two folde to wit because as I said right now none are alike thrall vnto slaunder as are godly Doctors And then because in a manner no priuate iudgement can bee ordained against a Priest sith that it must needes bee ioyned with the publike offence of the whole Church Insomuch that although hee bee absolued notwithstanding some imfamie therevpon shall redound to the whole Church and that there should bee neede of great caution not onelie in iudging him but also in admitting his accuser Moreouer we must note out of this place that Timothie in the Ephesine Presbiterie was then 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that is Antistes the Bishop as Iustine calleth him not that he should doe all things as he listed but that for his godlinesse and wisedome hee shoulde moderate all things that all things in the assemblie should bee well done and in order Thus doth euen Beza also not onelie acknowledge Tymothie to haue bene the Bishop of the Church of Ephesus but also that both he had and euerie Bishop by this rule ought to haue this authoritie of moderation whether anie accusation and how farre forth shoulde be admitted against a Pastoral Elder and in hearing and determining the cause to be his iudge Which authoritie in so great a Consistorie as then and there was beeing singled and separated out from other vnto him how had other anie parte with him of the same And as it was thus in triall of matters pleaded before him so if anie Pastors were found to haue openly offended Timothie againe in the next verse and in Timothie euerie Bishop hath authoritie giuen him ouer anie such pastors openly to reproue them And the reason is aâ—ded by the Apostle That the other also speaking especiallie of the otheâ— Pastors may haue feare From hence saith Aretius is this noble argument drawen Feare in the church is to be confirmed therfore Ecclesiastical iudgemeÌ„ts are grauely to be administred so that sith the Bishops authoritie should be such as shoulde strike feare in the other pastors it is apparant they had not the same nor equall authoritie with him And so Hyperius referreth all this in generall to the authoritie of Bishops though the matter be brought before the Church and that the Bishops should seeme to fauour their sinnes if he dealt not thus And hée concludes in these wordes But of what matter the Priests or Elders may be accused and reproued before the Bishop it were long to dispute And the next verse declares yet further his separate authoritie I charge thee before God and the Lord Iesus Christ and the elect Angels that thou obserue these things without preferring one before another and do nothing partially This contestation saith Hemingius wherwith as it were with an oathe Paul bindeth Timothie declareth howe harde the office of a Bishop is And it containeth a verie serious admonition least that in
Ambrose and the other allegations of Beza out of Cyprian and a number of other Fathers and histories for the search of these Elders Which not yet finding I haue returned to the Scripture to search what places anie other of our Bre namelie Beza Caluine and Danaeus which chieflie write vpon this matter haue alleaged And not yet finding anie sufficient proofe of theÌ„ till some other of our Brethren shall bring better proofe or proue these places better I am now come againe where we began to the 14. of the Acts verse 23. because our Bre. here will further yet againe reuiew the same And especiallie in the place before alleaged for election there is great reason to leade vs to thinke that the Elders for gouernment are as well vnderstood as the other for doctrine because it is written in the same place That after they had ordained them Elders in euerie congregation by election as hauing set the Churches in perfect order which coulde not bee except they had established discipline so well as doctrine they committed them to the Lord in whom they beleeued This great reason is nothing but our Brethrens ouer great presupposall that except there were such Elders ordained there were no perfecte order set nor discipline established in the churches Which great reason lieth all on the great and common fallation Peâ—itio principij reasoning on that as on a great and graunted principle which is a greate and principall question They might wel haue set the churches in perfect order haue established discipline in them without ordaining anie Consistorie or Segnorie of such Elders or gouernours as meddle not with teaching For what would it haue hurt the perfection of order establishment of discipline in the churches if all the Elders that they ordained had bene teachers to as Caluine sayth they were Albeit Saint Luke in that place mencioneth not of anie perfection of orders or of discipline established at all But onelie sayth the text in this 23. verse here mencioned And ordaining with the handes Elders vnto them Church by Church making praiers with fastings they commended them vnto the Lord on whome they beleeued Did Saint Paule in all the Churches where hee went preaching yea though some of them were famous Churches and in some of them he laie long as at Corinth set the churches in perfect order and established discipline in them as well as doctrine How then doth he write unto the Corinthians of so many things that as it plainlie appeareth by his reprouing teaching and ordering of them wer not before set in such order nor established No nor yet all things as concerning the perfection of order and establishment of discipline were contained in his Epistles afterwards written vnto them but that he saith he would â—et an order of other things at his comming to them 1. Cor. 11.34 which we expound not with the aduersaries of the Gospel for matter of doctrine but for order and discipline And therefore it is not so great a reason as shoulde leade our Brethren to thinke that Paule and Barnabas tarrying so small a while in euerie place that then they went vnto did set such perfect orders and establish discipline in those meaner churches But since our Br. here doe vrge this place no further than that there is great reason to leade vs so to thinke and we sée also some reason to leade vs to thinke the contrarie whether theers or ours bee greater yea whether theirs bee anie great or small and whether Caluine himselfe be not of force to ouer-rule this so slender a reason of theirs saying Not of some among them but of all of them I interprete Elders in this place to bee those to whome the office of teaching was inioyned Which interpretation if it be true then whether by anie reason they could be such Elders as were gouernours onelie and not teachers I referre to the readers yea to our Brethrens owne indifferent iudgement and proceede to their second point of moderating these Elders The second point for moderation of the Elders authoritie in such sort that their sentence may be the sentence of the Church is this that wheÌ„ the Consistorie hath trauailed in examining of causes pertayning to Ecclesiasticall discipline and agreed what iudgement ought to passe vppon the matters they propounde it to the whole multitude that it maye bee confirmed by their consent This second point draweth somewhat neerer to a moderation of the Elders authoritie than the former did But how agreeth this with the former moderation of them For before although they should be elected and chosen by the consent of the whole congregation yet the whole church was to repose such confidence in them that they coÌ„mit vnto them their authoritie not onely in hearing and examining but also in determining of all matters pertaining to discipline and gouernment in that congregation If therefore these Elders shall haue authoritie to doe all this how is it here sayd that when the consistorie hath trauailed in examining of causes pertaining to Ecclesiasticall discipline and agreed what iudgement ought to passe vpon the matters they propounde it to the whole multitude that it may be confirmed by their coÌ„sent If the whole multitude haue before hand committed vnto them their authoritie to determine all matters why shoulde they bee brought to the whole multitude backe againe to haue that confirmed that before was determined and that by their owne authoritie was committed vnto these Elders to determine And what authoritie haue they reserued and lefte vnto themselues herein to confirme by their consent after these committies haue determined the matter For what if the whole multitude shall dissent Haue they all or some or the greater part of them a negatiue voice to dash all that these Elders haue before determined And how is not this then a plaine Popular state when in all matters none excepted not onely pertaining to discipline but also to gouernment the chiefe last authoritie consisteth in the coÌ„firmatioÌ„ no not yet of the prince but of the whole multitude We feared before 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the dominion of a few persons in this Seniorie And therefore our Brethren to moderate reduce them ad 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to the gouernment of the best men which our brethren call men of godlinesse and wisedome they haue now so moderated the matter that they haue brought all ad 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to the popular regiment not onelie of the common people but of the whole multitude And all vnder pretence that the Bishops before did some things more than they should separated from other by themselues in the Ecclesiastical discipline And now they haue so excluded this separate gouernment of the Bishops that withall they haue cleane cut off the Monarchie and supreme gouernment of the Prince and all yea of these Seniors determination and all and giuen all matters pertaining to the discipline and gouernment of
This also haue we shewed euen by Caluine that it necessarilie inferreth no such Colledge but may be well vnderstood for the office or function of the Presbyterie Priesthood or Eldership But Danaeus so calleth it Because saith he it coÌ„sisteth chieflie of those persons to wit Presbyters Priests or Elders that is they that are in the Church called Presbyters Priestes or Elders For it may also consist of Deacons if the Church so think it good or if the number of Presbyters in that place be small Héere againe Danaeus casâ—eth to our Brethren a fresh bone to gnawe vpon For if none of these offices in this Tetrarchie that our Br. would erect may be ioyned together in one person how shall it be lawfull for a Church to haue the Deacons to be the gouerning Elders yea the whole Consistorie of these gouerning Elders if they so thinke good to consist of Deacons And why not then the same to be Teachers and Pastors And so all to be resolued into one if they shall thinke it good at least if the Church shall think it good as our Church dooth there is no necessitie of these gouerning and not teaching Elders We say therefore saith Danaeus that vnto this Senate Ecclesiasticall or Colledge of the Presbyterie the moderation the administration the adiudging and the exercise of this power of the keyes doth apperteine and of consequence this power ought to be exercised by the Pastors Presbyters Priests or Elders of the Church as by men aduanced therevnto of God by the consent and suffrage of the people that is of his Church c. The administration and dispensation therefore of this power of it selfe in coÌ„sideratioÌ„ of the exercise therof perteineth not to euerie one of the people but to the Presbyterie that is to the Pastors and Priestes or Elders of the Church howbeit the right authoritie thereof perteineth to the whole Church because that that is done by them is done by the whole Church This is Danaeus iudgemeÌ„t for this power Which being thus set down in coÌ„ming to the proues héerof that better to sée what kinde of Presbyters or Priests all this while he meaneth he procéedeth saying But by these reasons is our sentence prooued First vnto them that is to the Pastors and Presbyters Priests or Elders perteineth the Churches regiment as to the publike Aduocates and Proctors of the Church Therefore they are euerie where called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Gouernours or Guides in the Epistle to the Hebrues chap. 13. chap. 1 vers 24. They are first saluted of Paule to the Philippians Paule directeth to them the Epistle that hee writeth to the whole Church And Paule layeth downe the almes among them 1. Tit. 1. Therefore to them the care the medling and the administration of the right and matters of the Church dooth apperteine But this power and the medling and exercise thereof is a part of the Eccl. regiment therefore the same also perteineth to them This Argument grounded on these 4. testimonies dooth not onely admit well inough that these Presbyters Priestes or Elders may be also Ministers of the word but each one of theÌ„ expreslie prooueth that such they were As first that which is héere cited Hebr. 13. Remember saith the Apostle your Gouernors or Guides which haue declared vnto you the worde of God Héere are no other Gouernors or Guides named than such as are the Teachers of the word And what letteth but that after also vsing the same terme in his salutations Salute all your Guides and Gouernors he meaneth still such Guides and Gouernours as in the 7. verse before hée bad them obey that is the Teachers of the word As for those that S. Paule saluteth first in his Epistle to the Philippians he plainlie calleth them Bishops And what Caluine vnderstandeth by the name of Bishops to wit the Ministers of the word we haue heard sufficientlie alreadie And to take our Brethrens owne confession in this their learned discourse pag. 23. 24. where treating of Pastors to be al one with Bishops they say The same thing is to be obserued in the name of Bishops vsed by S. Paule Philip. 1.1 where he and Timothie send salutations vnto the Bishops and Deacons of the Churche which was in the Citie of Philippi which Bishops were the Elders or Pastors So that by our Brethrens owne testimonie this prooueth nothing for anie not Pastorall Elders As for the next testimonie 1. Tim. 1. mencioneth no Elders or any Eccl. Gouernors that were not Teachers Timothie himself to whome he wrote the Ep. was a teaching Gouernor And all the other were Teachers good or bad that there he speaketh of As I besought thee saith S. Paule to abide stil in Ephesus when I departed into Macedonia so doo that thou maist command some that they teach none other doctrine And ver 7. They would be Doctors of the Law yet vnderstand not what they speake So that whatsoeuer these were yet they took not vpoÌ„ theÌ„ anie eccl gouernment without teaching nor anie other there mencioned except peraduenture Hymenaeus and Alexander whom S. Paul excommunicated did take vpon them to be eccl Gouernors and not Teachers But were they Teachers or no it appeareth they were blasphemers The Elders that S. Paule mencioneth Tit. 1. what they were our Br. also in this their learned disc pag. 24 doo say Likewise vnto Titus 1.5 he calleth them Elders and immediatelie after describing the qualities of such as were meete to be ordeined Elders he calleth them Bishops c. And againe pag. 35 Hee requireth that he be such a one as holdeth fast the faithful word according to doctrine and that he also may be able to exhort with wholsome doctrine improoue them that gain say it Here our Br. applie these testimonies to Bishops Pastors And Daneus bringeth them in to prooue the Elders of the Consistorie How can we reconcile our Br. and Daneus but that the Elders of the Consistorie muâ—t be al pastorall Elders at the least and Teachers of the word But our Br. require a Consistorie of eccl Gouernors that are not Teachers and therfore all these testimonies doo cleane confute theÌ„ But let Danaeus procéed For why are they called the Bishops of the Church why the Prelates or those that are preferred but that we should vnderstande that the gouernment of the Church perteineth to them and is of them to be administred Act. 20. ver 18. And therefore they â—heir selues not euerie one of the people are called together if the Church bee to bee warned of anie matter or if anie thing be to be deliberated vpon in the Church they by reason of their office come together and deliberate as it appeareth Act. 20. ver 17. and 21. ver 18 15. ver 22. to them also it is to be deferred if anie thing be to be done or to be treated vpon in the
alreadie méetlie well to examine what the presbyters were which Cypian mencioneth and we haue still found them Ministers of the worde and Sacraments In none of his bookes of Epistles anie 12. Epistle toucheth this matter I graunt that in reconciling of Heretikes and those that were falne to Idolatrie he vsed to take the aduise of his priests of his Deacons of his Clergie and of all the people But this prooueth not that he neuer restored anie otherwise When he confesseth that not onelie a priest but a Deacon also may in necessitie restore the baptised peniteÌ„t to the churches peace But whomsoeuer Cyprian adioyned to him in anie solemne reconciliation he reserueth the power and authoritie of loosing to himselfe As for the first Councill of Antioch which was elder than those of Carthage before cited in the 23. chapter it is thus decréed It is not lawful for a Bishop to make vnto himself another successor although death approch vpon him But if anie such thing should be done the same constitution to be voyde But let the Ecclesiasticall lawe bee kept which is on this wise that a Bishop ought not to be made otherwise than with a Synode and Iudgement of Bishops who after the death of him that is departed haue power to promote him that shall be worthie What is here to abbridge the authoritie of a Bishop that he cannot excommunicate any offender without the consent and ioynt action with him of a Segniorie Where if Danaeus had but looked to the verâ—â— next chapter he should haue found another manner of matter where the Councill saith in the wordes following concerning the authoritie of him that is maâ—e Bishop Those things that perteine vnto the Church must be kept with all carefulnes and with a good conscience and faith that is in God who considereth and iudgeth all thinges Which are also to bee dispensed by the iudgement and power of the Bishop to whom the people is committed and the soules that are gethered together in the Church But to come néerer to the present purpose for excommunication The 4. chapter saith If anie Bishop being condemned of a Synode or a Priest or Deacon of his owne B. shall presume to meddle in anie thing concerning Priesthood or the holie Ministerie it shall not be lawfull for him anie more to haue hope of restitution neither anie place of satisfaction but al that communicate with him to be thrust out of the Church especiallie if they obstinatelie communicate with him after they haue knowen the sentence pronounced against him What can bee plainer spoken than this that the Bishop himselfe may excommunicate And in the 5. chapter If anie Priest or Deacon contemning his B. shal separate himselfe from the Church and priuatelie by himself gathering the people together shall dare to erect an Altare or Communion Table And albeit his B. exhorting him and once and twice reuoking him he shall remaine disobedient let this man by all meanes bee condemned nor let him hope at anie time to obteine helpe or to receaue his owne honour And if so bee hee shall persist to disturbe and sollicite the Church let him bee repressed by the outwarde powers as a seditious person And in the 6. chap. If anie man be excommunicated of his owne Bishop he ought not to be receaued of others before he be first reconciled to his Bishop c. And in the 12. chapter If anie Elder or Deacon of his owne Bishop or if anie Bishop of a Synode shall perhaps be condemned c Thus dooth this Councill also which Danaeus citeth prooue that vpon iust occassions a Bishop himselfe may excommunicate not onelie such among the people but also among the Pastorall Elders as bee notorious offenders Nowe when Danaeus hath thus farre procéeded on the parties that should exercise this power of the keyes giuen to the Church he coÌ„meth at length chap. 55. to this sentence of Christ Mat. 18. v. 17. Tel the Church Where traueling to comfort them that hold this word Church to be simplie meant for the People he pleadeth that it is meant for the Prelates of the Church And at length he coÌ„meth to this conclusion with this saying of Ambrose in librâ— dâ— dignitate Sacerdotali cap. 3. That which perteineth vnto all ought to bee done of all True it is howbeit according to the diuerse vocation of euery one in â—he Church of God By reason whereof the people are not equall to the ecclesiasticall Prelates So also Chrysostome lib. 3. de Sacerdot beyonde the middest of the booke Baptisme is giuen vnto the Church I aske therefore to whom perteineth the administration thereof and to haue the power of baptising Dooth it pertaine to euerie one of the people No but to the Pastors alone And yet this gift is giuen to the whole Church as also iâ— the power of the keyes But euen as when Baptisme and the holie Supper of the Lord is administred in the Church the force of Baptisme of the Supper is expounded to the people who all of them seeing it the seale is added to the healthfull promises of God and so the people is confirmed in their faith and each one of the people is taught and aedified To conclude when these thinges are done the Church out of the holie Supper and out of Baptisme feeleth receaueth the fruite which it ought to receaue euen so when hypocrites and wicked ones are cast out of the Church or when that the poenitent are receaued the same is done the whole people and each one of them withall perceiuing it consenting to it the authoritie of Gods word is ratified the reformation of manners in the Church established and the puritie of doctrine is conserued Which when it is done the Church and euerie one of the Church receaueth the fruite that they ought to receaue out of that power of the keyes that is graunted to the Church By this reason therefore these things the Supper of the Lord and Baptisme and the power of the keyes are of God giuen to the whole Church the administration whereof notwithstanding apperteineth not vnto euerie one but vnto them onelie that are lawfullie called in the Churche to doo these thinges Thus haue we séene at large the iudgements and reasons pro contrà of all these excellent men for these Elders and for their authoritie in this ecclesiasticall Censure Let vs now returne vnto the learned Discourse of our Brethren Therefore in euerie Church there ought to bee a Consistorie of Elders or Gouernors which with the Pastor may take charge of ecclesiasticall discipline and good order to be obserued in the Church to the punishment of vice and the aduauncement of true vertue These if they gouerne wel as Saint Paule doth testifie are worthie of double honor both that honour that is due to godlie men and that which is due to good Gouernors The premisses that our Brethren haue
with the weake And this likewise I graunt that no small consideration is to be had in the Synodes determination of bearing with the weake Howbeit we must vnderstande wherein and in what manner they be weake and how farre foorth they are to be borne withall For otherwise they may still pretende weakenesse to couer wilfulnesse May not the Synode determine that it is lawefull to eate so much as an egge on Fryday because some will take offencâ— and pretende weakenesse But it is a good hearing that our Brethren are become so carefull to haue offences auoyded and the weake borne withall Would God they would not giue so great offence as herein they doe both to â—he weake and strong with their vnnecessarie striuing for ceremoniall matters against those thinges which our lawfull synodes with the corroboration of the Prince and of the whole Realme haue alreadie determined and concluded Wherein our Brethren do not only offend the synode the realme the Prince in reiecting their lawfull authorities herein but euen for the weake the speciall consideration of whom they here pretende they haue beene through these contentions the greatest occasion that many which were before but weake amongest vs haue now not doubted any more of our ceremonies but of our faith and doctrine Yea where many were more than halfe wonne and metely well come on they are nowe cleane lost and vtterly reuolted from vs when they sée that we will not stande to the determination no not of our owne Churches synodes nor to the authoritie and decrées of our owne Prince Is this our Brethrens consideration of auoyding offences and of bearing with the infirmitie of the weake As for consideration of order and comelinesse and aedification it is neither orderly nor comely in my opinion for any priuate particular Ministers to controll and preindicate the determination of a whole godlie Synode such as I hope ours are that hath alreadie determined and concluded what is order comelines aedification in these things Paphnutius in-deede did gainsay in Priestes mariages and preuayled against all or the moste part of the famous Nicene Councell But that was done in the Councell and in the debating of the matter before any decrée determined and concluded And also though they had neuer so fully determined and concluded it with all the authoritie that they had since it was flat against the worde of God and an error in Doctrine he might and ought to haue spoken against it In which case not onely we but the Papistes them-selues as Gerson Panormitane and others do graunt that we must more beleeue one man neuer so simple yea a lay man more than the Pope or than a generall councell where hee brings the manifest Scripture against them If our Br. can do so against vs and not wrest the Scripture wee yeelde presently But in those ceremoniall matters that are neither of fayth and Doctrine nor are this way or that way commaunded in the Scripture but left to the Churche of Christe to vse with these three cautions of order and comelinesse and aedification when a godly Synode hath alreadie debated determined and concluded what vse of them tendeth best to these three ends and wherein the state of that Church may be best ordered adorned and edified it is not then and in â—hose matters sitting with the duetie of anie such lay or ecclesiasticall persons to controll that conclusion of the Synode If our Brethren sayde so late before on the other side of the lease that it were an absurd thing for our prolocutor in our conuocation to take vpon him to be a controller of the whol Synode How much more is it an absurde thing out of the Synode and after the Synode for a meaner person than our Prolocâ—tor to take vpon him not only to be a controller but a defacer and oppugner of the whole Synode and a canceller of all their authoritie and determination How much better shall it be for our Br. to call to their remembrance their own conclusion where before they speake also of ceremonies page 76. saying there But to conclude it is the duety of euerie true pastor to obserue those thinges that are concluded by the lawfull authority of the Church concerning ceremoniall matters for order and comelinesse sake and for aedification and not to controll publike order by his priuate iudgement except vpon great and waighty causes Although in deede while they be but such ceremoniall matters and they are concluded as they say by the lawfull authority of the Church and if lawfull then haue they not gone beyond their bounds there can no causes bee so great and waighty that shoulde make any true pastor to set vp him-self against this lawfull authoritie of the Churcâ— For if hee doe hee doth it vnlawfully and not like a true Pastor When the assembly or Synode of the Apostles and Elders at Ierusalem which our Brethren héere alleage for an example did commaunde for a time abstinencie from meate offered to Idols otherwise lawful in it selfe for offences sake and for auoyding of all pollution and Idolatrie which the Euangelist noteth Actes 6. Luke 15. ver 20.29 Had it then beene lawfull for any particular Minister or Ministers to haue reiected the authoritie of this decree or to haue kept it and broken it at his or their pleasure and if this bee an example to followe though not to compare in like authoritie with this moste holy assembly and decree of the holy ghoste but as all good Synodes may take example from hence Now then is it now lawfull for any priuate ministers to reiect the authoritie of a lawfull Synode and the caeremonies rytes and orders therein decreed by the Princes and the realms authoritie alreadie established They say the Apostles and Elders commaundement was but for a time But coulde their authoritie haue reached to the forbidding that meate for any time which was otherwise lawfull in it selfe during all the time of the Christian libertie and can the authoritie of no Synode nowe restrayne our Br. for any time to forbeare that which otherwise is lawfull in it selfe but that they will needes vse still their libertie in caeremoniall matters or will they be the prescribers of the time for their continuaunce But they say that decree was made for offences sake and for auoyding of all pollution of Idolatrie So it was I graunt But that pollution of Idolatrie was not in the meate it selfe nor the offence so much in the strong as in the weake And yet the strong obeyed this decree onely to auoyde the weakes offence And to this end that the strong in fayth should not abuse their libertie by offending the consciences of the weake Saint Paule hath a notable treatise at large thereof 1. Cor. 10. Admitte therefore that any of those caeremonies being in them-selues otherwise lawfull because they haue beene offensiuelie abused and Idolatrouslie polluted yet the
are the cheefest matters of their displacing which are in-deede farre more waightie matters than is the making a signe of the Crosse than is the baptizing in a Font or than is the wearing of a Surplesse If the ignoraunt thinke that they are displaced from all Ministerie onely for a Crosse or a Font or a Surplesse or some such other caeremonie as they call trifles surely then are they verie ignoraunt and our Brethren delude the people in this ignoraunce that tell them they are displaced from all ministery but for these causes Although indeede were they displaced from all Ministery for none other causes then such as these admitting also that these were but trifles too as here they call them albeit some of them haue voluntarily displaced themselues from all Ministerie forsaking their calling without being by any others displaced but admit also they are displaced and that from all Ministerie which notwithstanding the moste part of them or the most learned of them are not and whether they are so that compiled this Learned Discourse God and themselues do knows yet am I sure that they neede not nor if their selues were not in greater fault of more contempt obstinacie against these thinges than the waight of these thinges by their owne account amounteth vnto they neither neede nor shoulde be displaced of all Ministerie for them For if these thinges be as they say but trifles when as the yeelding to them might keepe themselues from beeing displaced ought they for trifles to be the occasion of their owne displacing from such weightie matters as is all the Ministerie So that euen that which they pretende to the ignoraunt yea to the learned and all in this their Learned Discourse to breede more odiousnesse to the displacers of them as that they are displaced for trifles doth shewe that this excuse is but a trifle or rather an vntrueth when as the matter the more trifling it is bewrayeth the greater obstinacie in him that will rather suffer him to be displaced of all the Ministerie and therby all the people to bee vtterly giuen ouer to the wide worlde for any benefite at all of the Ministery they shall haue by him or by any other of his procuring rather then he will relent to the Synode to the Church to the Realme to the Prince but in any one thing and that but such as hee his selfe confesseth to be but a trifle Howe doth not this the more that they extenuate the matter aggrauate the crime and make it as our Brethren sayde Pag. 93. that a lesse crime increased with contumacie and contempt of the Churches admonition may become worthie of the fame castigation But here our Brethren are so farre from the acknowlegement of this great fault that to mooue the reader more with the indignitie of their displacing they fall a praysing them selues that they preach most diligently pray moste feruently and minister the Sacraments moste reuerently according to Christes institution All which three pointes in whom they doe in-déede concurre we must néedes confesse deserue high praise And woulde God both they and we and all the Ministerie may doe our indeuours to the vttermoste of our gifts in these three duties But if our Br. preach neuer so diligently and yet cut not the worde of God a right and with discretion an ownce whereof is worth a pounde of Learning if they speake not the words of trueth and sobernesse as Saint Paule saith to Festus Actes 26. ver 25. But spende all or the moste of their preaching in contention about these vnnecessary controuersies in Discoursing of Regiment and matters of state in inuectiues against their Brethren against the Prelates yea against the Ciuill Christian Magistrate and all for the vrging of these platformes it were a greate deal more commendation in other mens opinion than it is in their own to be lesse diligent in preaching than some of them be Notwithstanding diligence in a good preacher in-déede is worthie both great commendation and as Saint Paule sayth double honor And whereas they recommend themselues also that they pray moste seruentlie I am glad to heare of it and God graunt they do so But why do they blabbe it thus to all the world with publishing it in print do they seeke the peoples prayse herein also must the feruencie and most feruencie of their prayer bee blasoned thus abroad with this trumpe of their owne Learned Discoursings thereon O that our Brethren woulde rather haue remembred what Christe sayde Math. 6. ver 5. of these that seeke prayses for their prayings Aâ—en dicâ— vobis mercedem habent Howbeit feruencie in all goodnesse deserueth prayse and in prayer is euen the marowe of it But suche feruencie as condemneth bee it neuer so sounde and godly all prescribed forme of publike prayer set foorth for the peoples vse and edifying by the authoritie of the true Church of Christe and of the Christian Magistrate is too fierie a feruencie in my iudgement And as for their thirde commendation that they Minister the Sacraments moste reuerently according to Christes institution What meaâ— they hereby can they prooue that our Communion Booke the prescribeâ— order whereof they refuse both in publike baptisme and in the Lordes Sapper for any materiall necessarie partes of the Sacraments are not ministred according to Christes Institution If they mislike them for any formall or accidentall part which is rather no part at all as not of the substaunce of them but accedents and ornaments of comelinesse and order doe they also minister the Sacraments according to Christes institution for place for time and for all the manner of them if the name of Christes Institution may be applied to these appendances as for baptizing them in riuers for ministring the Communion after Supper for sitting at a Table or rather on the grounde and such like if it be lawfull for them to leaue all these circumstances and yet they may bee sayde to minister the Sacramentes moste reuerently according to Christes Institution why shoulde they refuse to Minister them according to the order prescribed by our Booke except they can prooue that wee minister them not in anie godly manner but against Christes Institution wickedlie and vnreuerently which they shall neuer be able to prooue Yea we minister them with all due reuerence and in many pointes a greate deale more reuerently then they doe And therfore for these their vnreuerent demeanours and obstinacie therein against our good and reuerent orders by order and authoritie of the Church and Magistrate established they are worthily displaced though with greefe thereat no lesse to vs that they shoulde deserue it than vnto them that they shoulde féele it But heereby the ignorant and all other may wel perceiue that it is not as they would beare the worlde in hand they are displaced from all ministerie for a Crosse or a Font or a surplesse or some such other trifle
dominion And do they héere acknowledge then in this vnderstanding the title of the Princes supremacie nothing else but that it doth properly appertaine to the ciuil Magistrate meaning the soueraigne Christian Prince to bee the highest gouernour of all persons within his dominion Well this is yet farre more than the blind and rebellious Papists will graunt Howbeit in some respect they will graunt thus much also But shal the Prince be gouernor likewise of them that properly must be called Gouernors And why not if he must be aboue the Pastor also which is aboue them Howbeit all this is granted here as yet no further than for the persons No is This is but halfe of the title of the Princes supremacie Where is the matter wherin this supremacy doth consist that is to say in al matters or causes so well eccl as tēporall This is the materiall part of this title no lesse necessary than other of the persons is the chiefest point of this controuersie betwixt the Papists vs. And do our Br. now begin to stay here another while at this Thē we may make a faire piece of work What is this part forestalled vp already by any of the former tetrarkes Indéede they saide very suspitiously to the matter pag. 84. Therefore there ought to be in euery Church a Consistory or Seignory of Elders or Gouernors which ought to haue the hearing examination and determining of all matters pertaining to discipline and gouernment of that congregation Yea but say they that sentence goeth further which authoritie of theirs neuerthelesse ought to be moderated Or else say I farwell cleane the Princes supremacy in al eccl matters if these Gouernors authoritie in all matters pertayning to discipline gouernmēt of that cōgregatiō be not moderated and y◠wel moderated Yes say they it ought to be moderated that their iudgement may be rightly accounted the iudgement of the holy Church Yea but say I how is it moderated that it do not debarre the supremacie of the Prince in all these matters Which thing say they cōsisteth in these 2 points first that the Elders be elected chosen by consent of all the cōgregation mē of godlines wisdom in whō the whole church reposeth such cōfidence that they cōmit vnto thē their authoritie in hearing determining such matters as without horrible confusion they can not performe themselues Why but al this while what is this to any point of the Princes autoritie in all this matter Is there no better prouiso for the Prince in the 2. point of moderating the authority of these gouernors in Eccl. matters The 2. point say they for moderation of the Elders authoritie in such sort that their sentence may be the sentence of the Church is this that whē the Consistory haue trauelled in examining of causes pertaining to Eccl discipline agreed what iudgmēt ought to passe vpō the matters they propound it to the whole multitude that it may be confirmed Yea is all the wind in that dore Still the whole multitude The whole Church The whole congregation As though all the authoritie in Eccl. matters commeth from them as from the spring and floweth to thē as to the Sea They make the gouernors which gouernors must with the Pastors make all the lawes must heare determine of all matters pertayning to discipline to gouernment of that congregatiō and whē they haue so don al must be again referred to that cōgregation to the whole multitude of them that it may be confirmed by their consent What and must it not come a litle higher after them to be at least propounded also to the Prince that it may be also confirmed by his consent No no no beware that of all things if it be once confirmed by the multitude of that congregation it hath passed all his confirmations and can haue no more godfathers except it come to a Synode But there we haue already heard how the Prince hath sped except that now we shall heare of any more For there are some matters yet left to the Prince for his supremacie to consist in or else besides a bare title it is meere nothing no not of the persons neither vnlesse withall it be in some matters Well but they will not yet tell vs of these matters til afterwards But thus farre they haue acknowledged for the persons that the Prince is the highest gouernour of all persons within his dominion Would not this haue bin very well necessarily ioyned together vnto it to know in what matters he is the highest of all the persons Or else they may moue what controuersie on the supremacie they shall please or cleane deny it But since they will stay a while vpon the supremacie ouer all persons in the Princes dominions that with this prouiso if it be rightly vnderstood so that the soueraigne Empire of God be kept whole let vs stay also to go together with them and consider what stop or limax this is that stayes them here in their procéeding from the persons to the matters But herein resteth all the doubt how this is truly to be vnderstood that shall wee best vnderstand by the contrarie namely by the vsurped tyrannie of Antichrist For Antichrist did chalenge vnto himselfe all authoritie both that which is proper to God and that which is common to men Therefore that the Pope claymed to be the onely head of the Church from which the whole bodie receiued direction and was kept in vnitie of faith this was blasphemous against Christ therfore may not be vsurped of any ciuil Magistrate no more than by the pope Likewise where he chalengeth authoritie to alter change dispence with the commandement of God to make new articles of fayth to ordaine new Sacraments c. This is also blasphemous ought not to be vsurped of any ciuill prince on the other side where he chalengeth authoritie ouer all princes and so ouer all the Clergie that hee did exempt them from the ciuill iurisdiction this is contumelious and iniurious against all Christian kinges And therefore euerie prince in his owne dominion ought to cast off the yoake of his subiection and to bring all Eccl. persons vnto his obedience and iurisdiction Here haue we the first part of the title of supreme gouernment ouer all persons If all the doubt resteth herein how this is truly to be vnderstoode that the soueraigne Empire of God may be kept whole then is the supremacie that her Ma. holdeth and that we acknowledge due properly appertayneth to the Prince without all doubting of the matter And if our Brethren wil acknowledge all that supremacie vnto the Prince saue that supremacie which is proper to God and saue that supremacie or rather tyrannie which the Pope chalenged and vsurped or which is agréeable thereunto we should soone agrée herein without moouing any controuersie or doubt of this matter Yea this should soone
alreadie written and by treatises lately and nowe published it may appeare we seeke that which at the least in the iudgement of all true Christians hath no small probabilitie as wee iudge necessitie of trueth out of the Scriptures it may please her most excellent Maiestie and their honors to appoint on both sides the best learned most godly and moderate men to debate al differences of waight betweene them and vs. So that first vppon sufficient consideration the Questions to be debated be without all ambiguitiâ— set downe the reasons of both sides without all outgoings shortly and plainely deliuered in writing ech to other that after vpon sufficient examination the reasons of both be continually confirmed and resolued till either by the euidence of trueth one partie yeelde vnto the other or the follie and madnesse of those which gaine-say it doe in equal iudgement become manifest in regarde of the contradictions and absurdities where-to they shall be driuen by the force of Gods worde It may appeare we graunt that our brethren haue both alreadie writâ—en bookes now lately published treatises but with what authoritie they could so doe that is another question if it be lawfull authoritie to do it both against lawe and authoritie we may shortly haue other vpon like ensample set out worse matters yea neuer so ill doctrine or matters neuer so much against the state For although they pretende their bookes and treatises to be neuer so good yet ought they not to be published but by good meanes also least if the good meanes be neglected ill thinges in like manner may be published But by what ill meanes soeuer they set out their bookes and treatises yet for the matter of them it may say they appeare we seeke that which at the least in the iudgement of all true Christians hath no small probabilitie as we iudge necessitie of trueth out of the Scriptures Fancie might make a man bowlt branne and thinke it is flower And euen so doe our brethren imagine in this necessitie But when we shall come to the examining of these bookes and treatises yea euen of this their learned discourse compiled in the name of all the faithfull ministers and of all their desires and of all that they say they seeke for we shall finde necessitie of trueth out of the Scriptures in no one thing of all their posâ—tions in controuersie except they vnderstande it so out of the Scriptures that is to say cleane without al scriptures or any necessarie consequence of scriptures And although probability ought not to carrie away the matter yet vpon better suruey thereof we shall finde not so much as any good probability that is grounded on the Scriptures but onely on the méere interpretations and sayings of some the chiefest persons in estimation on their side if at the least they agrée with them and are not caried away by their owne fancies as in the perusing of this learned discourse shall God willing appeare In the meane season sée héere how peremptorie our brethren are in their owne iudgement That which they seeke for is of no probability but as we iudge necessity say they yet they confesse that in the iudgement of all true Christians it is but of probability though saye they it hath no small probability So that they graunt at the least héereby that many if not al true Christians iudge that that which they seeke for hath no necessity of truth out of the Scriptures but hold themselues contented onely with probability For be it small or not small it is but probability of truth out of the Scriptures that they grounde themselues vpon yet think this hindereth not but that they still be al true Christians So that â—hey count them no true Christians in whose iudgement the thinges that our brethren seeke for haue not at the least great probability of trueth out of the Scriptures But if they can allow them to be al true Christians in whose iudgement these things stand but on the vncertainty of probability I trust we shal not léese our Christendome euer a whit the more â—or this but be true Christians yea their selues haue graunted vs euen in â—his Preface that we are their brethren and that we agrée in the substaÌ„ce of religion with them and therfore of necessity if they be true Christians we be true Christians also and yet we openly and constantly anow that the most and greatest of the things that they seeke for haue not at the least any probability of truth out of the Scriptures in our iudgements yea in my iudgement not one of them al any good probability but we al confesse they haue no necessity This therefore was too vnaduisedly and too peremptorily spoken and vpon too great a confidence in their cause as to hazard the truth of our Christianity for not iudging these things to bee at least probable But let the necessity or probability be tried in the debating and weighing of them let vs now sée how they woulde haue them debated and weighed It may please say they her most excellent Maiestie and their honors to appoint on both sides the best learned most godlie and moderate men to debate all differences of weight betweene them and vs. This is a good beginning that they will yéelde to her most excellent Maiestie and their honours yet at the least thus much if they woulde stande to this but when it shall come to the debating wayghing or determining they giue her Maiestie and their honours no authoritie at al. Yea they haue their selues alreadie debated weighed iudged determined and prescribed these thinges and that for necessitie in their iudgements before they come to this conference as shal also appeare by these their learned discourses and is it likely they will yéelde and reuoke this their principles set foorth in print and diuulged to all the worlde by our reasoning afterwarde with them howesoeuer by reasoning we should euict them Had it not béene better not to haue vaunted thus before hande on such necessitie and prescription But they say The best learned most godlie and moderate men on both sides should be appointed to debate al differences of weight betweene them and vs. For their partes they so glorie both of their learning and godlines that they giue this booke two titles in the one for godlinesse and moderatenesse A declaration of the desires of the faithfull ministers not prescribing but moderatly desiring in the other for their learning A learned discourse of Ecclesiasticall gouernment Thus haue they set foorth themselues for these vertues But thankes be to God that they graunt yet some of our side to be also both learned godly and moderate men What the learning is of many God be praysed on our side let the learned iudge Moderation is more easily discerned as the Apostle saieth Phil. 4.5 Let your moderate or patient minde be knowen to all men But since our brethren
I may rather to excuse you Wishing you where your accusation of her Maiestie is too apparant that you should with submission and amendment acknowledge the ouershooting of your duties For what dooth this reléeue your accusation if not onelie the Prince but others also be accused of these things If there be others besides the Prince well may it lessen the Princes faulte but it dooth not cleare it if in giuing the disposition of the matters to the Prince and placeing héerein the Prince before them yee make not the Prince rather principall in the faulte then accessarie But bicause héere are others with the Prince accused maye we be so bold to inquire further of these others What haue others to doo in these matters What Whatsoeuer it shall please them-selues also to call or count indifferent it must be so holden of all men without any further inquirie Doo they so Then are they as déepe in as the Prince And doo they all this without the Prince or with the Prince We say whatsoeuer it please the Ciuill Magistrate or them-selues Then if ye meane it disiunctiuelie without the Prince the Princes faulte was by it selfe as theirs also by themselues and the one neither burtheneth nor easeth the other Naye will they saye we meane not so but by the one or the other we conclude them bothe But the question was of the Princes authoritie and disposing Belike then the Prince dooth not dispose these indifferent matters all alone nor whatsoeuer pleaseth him or her selfe but whatsoeuer pleaseth them-selues so that the Prince hath some others assistant at least for enformation what these things are yea to be determiners and iudges to haue the same so called and accounted Héere then the Prince plaieth not the Tyrants part this is not Sic volo sic iubeâ— stet pro ratione voluntas thus will I haue it thus I command it be let that stand for reason whatsoeuer pleaseth me but contrariwise héere is the token of a good Prince that will not dispose of these matters alone but call others vnto this deliberation Well then the Prince is cléered of that point And now if there be no greater or not more faultes in these others to abuse the Princ for ought that I sée the Prince will soone be quitte But now though the Prince be of a good nature and meaneth well yet great fault may be in these others who to flatter the Prince will referre all matters to the princes disposition Such I graunt there may be yea there is no prince so good whom flatterers tempt not now and then But brethren take héede héere that you doo not eftsoones abuse the prince vnder pretence of speaking against such flatterers and that yé◠also abuse none others in authoritie about the prince by such odious and suspitious spéeches It is ye know the common practise of the arrantest rebels not to pretend so much their quarrell directlie against the prince as to saye the prince whom still they praise to be naturallie of a good disposition hath others of counsell and authoritie by whom the Prince is lead and abused And these others they would haue onelie remooued I doo not brethren bring this as an instance to resemble your dooings but that ye should beware least yée should resemble them And yet as it is good for princes to take héede what counsell of others they doo follow so if this Prince héere whome ye call the Ciuill Magistrate examine these others of whom yee haue mooued this suspition whether they be such â—â—atterers yea or no néede they desire anye better witnesses for them than your selues For who-so-euer they be bicause it might be odious to inquire their names they séeme to be no flatterers of the Prince For your selues saye of them others there be that referre onelie indifferent matters to the disposition of princes In which wordes although they giue to princes an authoritie of disposing yet they restraine it onelie to indifferent matters So that they giue not princes that onelie high authoritie and absolute power that all things in the Ecclesiasticall state are to be disposed by the Ciuill Magistrate or that all the regiment of the churche dependeth on the supreame authoritie of the Christian princes but the disposition of princes by these men whom ye terâ—e others is restrained onelie to indifferent matters Whereby it séemeth that these others are men of conscience and knowledge hauing the feare of God before their eyes nor giue the prince the disposition of any one thing which God alreadie hath disposed So that hetherto and that by your selues these others also are acquitted except there be further matter against them But say our brethren in determining indifferent matters they shew themselues not to be indifferent Iudges What are these others then Iudges also and determiners of these matters These are great offices who called them héere-vnto The prince called them to be examiners and the iudgement and determination of these matters apperteyneth to their office And did they not then intrude themselues No. But they shew themselues not to be indifferent Iudges Why so Are they partiall to themselues And Iudge or determine that indifferent matters belong to their owne disposition No they referre that from themselues to the disposition of princes How are they partiall then Belike they referre it to the Prince bicause they are matters that onelie concerne the Prince and not themselues Naye they concerne them-selues as much or more then any other and the iudgements and determinations what is the nature of those matters doo especiallie apperteine vnto them Doo they so sée how these things fall out both for the Prince and for these others The Prince hath héere authoritie to dispose of indifferent matters How-be-it the prince will not dispose of them alone but chooseth and calleth others which by their office and function are most skilfull to discerne indifferent matters from matters not indifferent which intrude not them-selues into the iudgement and determining of these matters which are so farre off to encroche anye aduantage or authoritie to them-selues héereby that they referre these matters to the princes disposition Neuerthelesse the prince will dispose nothing but that which these men shall be Iudges and determiners of it to be suche an indifferent matter as whereof the Prince maye dispose neither dooth the Prince impose anie thing vpon them against their willes nor craueth any thing of them to Iudge or determine this waie or that waie what is or what is not an indifferent matter but leaueth that frée to these others iudgement and determination Héere the subiects giue the Princes their due and goe no further héere the Princes take no more then is their due nor all that neither and but by the subiects owne consent and by their aduise iudgement and determination of the matters indifferencie to whose skill and function it chéefelie apperteineth Héere neither the Princes can complaine of the subiects
then possesse the Churches as the lawe commandeth With which confutation when he had stopped his mouth hee sayde that hee maruelled at Apollinaris that so impudently resisted the trueth when as he knewe well enough that the famous Damasus auouched that God the word did take vpon him our whole nature to whome he alwayes taught the contrary For sayth he thou depriuest our mindes of saluation which accusation if it be false then deny thou now this impe of thy newfanglenesse and receiue the doctrine of Damasus and obteine the diuine Churches Thus did the most wise Flauian allay their boldnes by the trueth of his speech But Meletius of all men the mildest sweetely and gentlie calling Paulinus sayde because the Lorde of this flocke hath set me also ouer the custodie of the sheepe and other are committed vnto thee sith there is a community of godlines among the sheepe let vs freendly ioyne our foldes and let go the contention of Mastership and attend in common to the sheepe that go in common in the pastures But if the seate itself doe stoppe the concord I also will endeuour to remooue this contention Let vs set I pray you in the seate the booke of the diuine gospell and let vs either of vs sitte together on eyther side it And if so be that I shall dye before thee be thou O freend alone the Sheepes master But if this shall happen to thee before me then will I to my ability take vpon me the care of the flock When as Paulinus allowed not these his sweete and gentle speeches the Duke deciding the cause commended the Churches to Meletius the great But Paulinus reteyned the mastership or remained bishop of these Sheepe that had long before deuided themselues Here agayne is another notable story of another Meletius where moe in one city tooke vpon them according to their factions to be bishops and what offer was made to appease the strife of two at one time to haue ruled together vntill the decease of the one or the other and how in the end it was determined vnto one Thus much to this most reuerend and learned mans aunsweres to Epiphanius for the superioritie of one bishop in one citie The residue of his argumentes because they are chéefely on the sentences taken from Ierome Chrisostome Theophilact and Theodorete whose sentences we haue before at large perused I will héere for this time passe them ouer saue that which he sayth of Cyprian as yet vntouched And whereas Cyprian sayth he not in one place calleth the bishops successors of the Apostles whose authority is from God and if we take it so as though by the very commaundement of God these Bishops are the same that in time past were the Apostles the thing it self doth confute that seeing there was alwaies a certaine portion assigned to euerye Bishop But the Apostles by the direction of the spirite of God though not confusedlie didde exercise their Ministery throughout the whole world The meaning of Cyprian is plaine without cauiling as the like saying of many other the auncient fathers that bishops are the successors of the Apostles bicause they succéeded both in the places Churches by the Apostles fownded and in the chiefest dignity of the Churches orders as in their times the function of the Apostles was As the Magdeburgēses note Cent. 3. cap. 6. tit de ratione gubernandi pag. 150. The firste and cheefest authority belonged to the Bishops whome also Cyprian lib. 3. Epistola 14. calleth Praepositors placed ouer the residue who in gouernment sustayned the chiefest parte of the Ecclesiasticall administration After them the next in dignity belonged to the Priestes or Elders and the third to the Deacons And that Bishoppes were then aboue the Priestes or Pastorall Elders is apparant by Cyprians owne wordes I haue long helde my patience moste deare bretheren as though our bashfull silence should help to quietnesse But when immoderate and abrupt presumption by the rashnes thereof shall attempt to disturbe the honor of the Martyrs and shamefastnesse of the Confessors and tranquillity of the whole people I must no longer hold my peace For what daunger of the offense of the Lord ought we not to feare when as some of the Priestes or Elders neyther mindefull of the Gospell nor of their place no nor thinking of the Lords iudgements to come neither that now the Bishop is placed ouer them do with contumely and contempt of him that is placed ouer them claime the whole to themselues which thing was neuer done at all vnder the auncestors Yea and would to God that casting flatte downe the saluation of our brethren they woulde not challenge all thinges to them selues I can dissemble and beare the reproches of our Bishoprike as I haue still dissembled and borne them But now there is no place of dissembling whē as our brotherhoode is deceaued by some of you who while without meanes of restoring the saluation they desire to be plausible they rather hinder such as are fallen c. Whereby as it plainely appeareth that the Pastorall Elders were inferiour to bishops so euen then there were of the Cleargie some Priests or Elders that enuied and slaundered this their B. Superiority and woulde haue had the dealing as far forth as they in restoring the poenitents and in all thinges equall authority to the bishoppes Which thing by Cyprians iudgement how plausible a shew of reformation soeuer it had was very offensiue vnto God and neuer before attempted of the Ministers And so consequentlie this superioritye of Bish. placed ouer the Priestes or Pastorall Elders had continued euen from the Apostles times And thus might they well of him bee called the successors of the apostles Not that Cyprian ment that there was no difference betwéene the Bishops and the Apostles And therefore this is a manifest mistaking to say If wee take it so as though by the very commaundement of God these Bishops are the same that in times past the Apostles the thing it selfe dooth refute that seeing there was alwaies a certaine portion assigned to euery Bishoppe But the Apostles by the direction of the spirite of God thoughe not confusedlye didde exercise their Ministerye throughout the whole world Although héerein and in other poyntes moe the Apostles were distinguished from and aboue Bishops yet might they also be Bishoppes well inough For as this Learned man saith they did it not confusedlye so their charge to goe into all the world and preache the Gospell vnto all nations was not so that euery one of them shoulde trauell ouer all the world and preach vnto al nations But that by the world being name◠per fynecdochen the whole for the parts and that among them all some héere and some there by the direction indéed of the spirit of GOD they dispersed themselues at length in diuerse parts of the world And there also diuerse of them did settle themselues so long as they liued
in Ignatius or other auucient writers whosoeuer they be whatsoeuer they speake or write neuer so-good neuer so holie neuer so true what though it were when the bishop of Sathan was not yet founde out if it once be towching the authority of bishops Ouer-seers it is all to be reiected with this contumelie It is to be vnderstode of this kinde of bishoppe whiche is called The bishoppe of Man that is to say brought into the Church by the alone wisedome of man besides the expresse word of God Thus doth this moste Reuerend and Learned man froÌ„ beyond the Seas in a round conclusion giue his iudgement of them and so he leaueth them Let vs now therefore leaue him also to returne a Gods blessing beyond the Seas from whence he came and with all due reuerence taking our leaue of him in expectation of other reuerend and learned Fathers Iudgements from beyonde the Seas also Let vs now for the present returne home to our Brethren where we left them in their Learned Discourse of Ecclesiasticall gouernment THE ARGVMENT OF THE FIFT BOOKE PROCEEding still further on the Pastors THis booke treateth specially on the Iudgements of other reuerend and godly learned men from beyonde the seas also in the late reformed Churches concerning this superiour authority dignity of one pastor in a citie or Diocesse or Prouince ouer his brethren and fellow pastors Which one was called in a citie or diocesse bishop in a prouince Archb. To the proofe whereof are alleaged vpon our brethrens allegation of Titus What superiour authoritie he had ouer all the pastors of Creta with the iudgements of Bullinger Caluine Aretius Hemingius Herebrande with the orders of other reformed Churches for their Superintendents speciall and generall The B. and Archb. of the fathers and other canons of the auncient churches regiment approoued by Caluine in Geneua with the approbation of Ieromes sentence and that this order was in the Apost times and not contrary to the Apostolicall Doctrine with Caluines epistles to diuerse B. and Archb. to the King of Polonia approouing this superior authority and his generall rules for all popish B. conuerted to the gospell The iudgement of Zanchius and Bucer for those olde orders specially of bishops Archb. for the old clericall discipline and regimente due vnto them of the obiections to the contrary out of Peter and of the Titles proper to Christe and whether the name Archb. be coÌ„petent to any Minist of Peters Title of fellow Elder and of Christs prohibitions of Titles rule of his example of washing his Disc. feet c. and of humility Lordship of bishops holding temporalities royalties of obedieÌ„ce vnto them in the same of Diotrephes with caueats for the Ministers lawful authority and against vnlawfull liberty by aequality lastly of Bezaes iudgement on these matters for the Apostles and the auncient orders of the renuing those orders in the state of Geneua The Learned Discourse IN the same manner of speaking he describeth the qualities of those which were to be chosen Bishops and Deacons Likewise vnto Titus 1.5 Hee calleth them elders and immediately after describing the qualities of such as were meet to be ordeyned elders hee calleth them bishops saying For this cause did I leaue thee in Creta that thou shouldest continue to redresse the thinges that remayne and that thou shouldest ordeyne elders in euery City if any bee vnreprouable the husband of one wife hauing faithfull children which are not accused of riot nor are disobedient For a bishop or ouerseer must be vnreprouable as the steward of God not froward c. COncerning the communicating of these names Pastors Priestes or elders and byshops indifferently or the being of the office all one and the same vntill furder order in the Apostles times were taken we haue at large before declared But as for the matter that among these Pastors Elders or bishops some one Pastor elder or bishop had a superior gouernment ouer many of the residue in the same order as wee haue plainly prooued it by Saint Paule through-out all the same his Epistle to Timothy héere alleaged and also out of the other Epistle vnto him so for this Epistle likewise vnto Titus 1.5 Which Epistle appeareth to be so late written by Saint Paule that there is no such iourney or aboade in any such place mentioned in all those iourneyes which Saint Luke so diligently in the Actes recordeth therfore it should rather séeme to be written after that time Bullinger in his Preface on this Epistle to Titus sayth when it was written eyther before or after the Apostle was taken it is not euident ynough Theophilacte thinketh it written before his bondes and before the later to Timothie were published Certainely hee that wil search it more diligently shall not want coniectures whereby it may be gathered that it was written after that by the sentence of Caesar hee was at Rome acquitted But were it written then or after or before or as Chytreus also in his Onomastichon gathereth yet maketh it no lesse if not much more vnto this purpose that euen at that time while the name of Preest or Elder and Bishop was yet vsed in common notwithstanding there was yea and that no small difference among these Preestes or elders and Bishops in the degree of superiour gouernment which is apparant by the text it selfe wherein Saint Paule giueth Titus beeing a priest or elder or pastor or Bishop a greate deale more authority and superior dignitie then ordinarilye appertayned to euery Preest or elder or Pastor or Bishoppe or by what name soeuer they were tearmed Which Caluine himselfe vpon these wordes For this cause haue I lâ—ft thee in Creta c. doth note saying This beginning doth clearely shewe that Titus is not so muche admonished for his owne sake as commended vnto others leaste any shoulde hinder him the Apostle committeth vnto him his owne turnes Wherefore it behooueth that hee bee acknowledged of all men for the Apostles Vicar and bee reuerentlye receyued For sithe that no certayne station was assigned to the Apostles but an office enioyned to them of spreading the Gospell through-out all the worlde whereas therefore they trauayled out of one city into another they vsed to substitute fitte men in their place by whose labour that which they beganne shoulde be finished So Paule boasteth that he founded the Church of Corinth but other were the master workman which ought to builde therupon that is to further the building This indeede belongeth to all Pastors â—or the Churches shall alwayes haue neede of encreasinges and of furderaunce so long as the worlde endureth But beyonde the ordinary office of pastors a care of ordeyning the Churche was committed to Titus for pastors are wont to bee placed ouer Churches that bee already ordeyned and formed in a certayne manner But Titus susteyned a certayne burden more that it is witte
Prince What alleageth Danaeus against them That though some men Princes do not these thinges yet for women Princes though they would they can not Nay Danaeus is not yet so peremptorie that by any meanes they can not do it but saith he these thinges become not at all womens shamefastnes Indéede shamefastnesse is one of the chiefest ornamentes of women and great reason it is they should haue a speciall regard to the comlinesse and shamefastnesse of their nature Neither is fighting and martiall affayres so fitte for their imbecillitie and the profounde discussing in pleas of right and lawe doth commonly surmount the capacitie of women which as by custome they are not so enured and acquainted withall so are they by nature for the most part more wittie than wise and more pregnant in inuention of delightfull matters than deliberate in iudgemēt of graue and doubtfull controuersies Howbeit wee speake not nowe of the ordinarie sorte of women but onely of those that are supreme gouernours of a kingdome which also falleth out verie séeledome nor yet ascribe we the habilitie of these functions to all those that are such women Princes No more than it can be sayde also of all those Princes that are men though it be no sufficient debarre to the right of either of their estats which is a farre higher point in lawe than is the personall administration of their functions And yet well may we iustifie this that as God hath so giuen the administration euen of both these functions to some singular women princes without any staine at all vnto their shamefastnes so vpon especiall occasion or necessitie thereunto why may we not conclude when God calleth a woman prince to the supreme gouernment of a kingdom that she may in good order do these things without any touch of blemish to the decencie honor of her shamefastnes I speak not of personal fighting in the wars like the Amazones the french pucell and yet in some necessitie women haue put to their handes somtimes extraordinarily to the defence of themselues striking of their enemies that without reproch As Iael that killed Sisera got thereby great honor Iud. 4. and the woman that cast a piece of a milstone on Abimeleches head brake his braine pan Iud. 9. And Iudith that cut off Holofernes head by her prudence and valour ouerthrew all his mightie armie and directed her people how to set foorth their armies But these were yet no gouernors of armies And indéede it is one thing to strike the enemy or to defende thēselues and another thing to gouerne an armie But haue not we recited a number of those women that haue gouerned armies some of thē without any discommendation but rather to their high prayse besides the great benefite of their subiects But to conteyne vs in the bounds of the Canonicall scripture did not Debora as well as Barak goe foorth with the armie yea chiefely gouerne it both what number they should be who should be their Captaine and when they should giue the onsette of al this she tooke no shame but glory And when the Queene of Sabaea came to Salomon with so great a traine that Peter Martyr sayth thereon habuit multitudinem secū instar exercitus she had a multitude with her as it were an armie did not she chiefely gouerne then And why did not Salomon lay that in her dish tell her that she could not be a Queene because she could not with that shamefastnesse which becommeth women kinde gouerne an armie No nor Christ debarreth her of the title of a Queene or of her due cōmendation for all that matter Neither Philip founde this fault in the Eunuches Ladie and Mistresse Candace the Queene of Aethiopia that gouerned such an armie as we heard already out of Plinie Strabo Neither besides the scripture Iosephus findes this fault in Alexandra And yet al these had must néeds haue had armies and defences against their enemies yea though they had peace with them Therefore notwithstanding this exception of Danaeus for the gouerning or being ouer an armie whether by their deputies as Peter Martyr sayth the Queene of Sabaea might appoint her sonne or some other in her absence or in case by themselues as her selfe conducted the troupe that came with her to Salomon Queenes are not to be sequestred from all supreme gouernement of a kingdome Yea they may so orderly gouern ouer all their armies also that they may still with honour and without shame reteyne the decencie and shamefastnes of their calling The other function though it pertaine more to peace and quietnesse yet because it hath the hearing and debating of quarels and brawles the contentious pleading of titles doubtes the finding out and determining of right and law séemeth to be as farre from womens modest shamefastnesse and milder capacitie as the other in the broyles of warres And yet if wee shall throughly consider this function hauing graunted the one which is the harder for the gouernement ouer an armie in the warre women will hope the better and plead in peace the harder not to be clean◠debarred from the barre nor yet from sitting in the iudgement seat if the importance of necessitie or speciall occasion and much more title of right do call them to it and they haue able giftes to aunswere it What authority in her Citie the wise woman of Abele had 2. Sam. 20 though she pleaded so wisely euen in the warres with Ioab and in giuing counsell to her people for their peace I will not examine because she was vnder God no supreme gouernour nor sate in any publike iudgement that we reade of But for Deborah it is expressely set downe in the scripture that she iudged Israel Iudg. 4. ver 4. and that the children of Israel came vp to her for iudgement ver 5. If it be replied this was a specialtie and therefore can not be drawen into anie ordinarie rule or example although it may be well aunswered that God did not drawe such specialties from such persons as otherwise in them the function had béene monstrous and méere against nature so that anie person whome God calleth to authoritie and furnisheth with his spirite of iudgement enhabling their inhabilitie may take it on them and looke on Debora for a president yea were the Prince a child and had the gift of iudgement beyonde his age as had Daniel or Salomon for all their rare and singular giftes yet might he well set them before him for a patterne But howsoeuer we exempt the example of Deborah what shall we say to these two foresayde Queenes of Sabaea and Aethiopia mentioned without touch of ignominie if not rather of prayse both in the olde and in the newe Testament at leastwise approued to be lawefull Queenes For either the Princes personall execution in the administration of this function pertaynining to
them But the authoritie was his not theirs by himselfe separated from other he exercised the same I not wee saith he will dispâ—se them If our Brethren saie that Paule was an Apostle and they alleage this rule not for Apostles but that in the regiment and gouernance of the Church the Pastor Bishop or Elder hath none authoritie by himself separated from other although we haue shewed alreadie that Saint Paule exercised sometimes the office of a pastorall Elder which hee did also in Corinthus yet sith our Brethren annexe this reason For in the Church there ought to bee no Monarchie or sole absolute gouernment but that is referred peculiarly to our Sauiour Christ onelie Howe doth not this reason cut off Saint Paule euen as an Apostle and all the Apostle and all other besides our Sauiour Christ onely Did they take vpon them the Monarchy or sole absolute gouernement that is referred peculiarly to our Sauiour Christ onely And what though no ordinarie Bishoppes Pastors nor Elders haue in all things like authoritie as the Apostles had Yet to take vppon them this monarchy and sole absolute gouernement peculiar to Christe onely they and all the Angelles in heauen were as much debarred as anie other So then by this our Brethrens reason the Apostles might haue none authoritie by themselues separated from other in the regiment gouernment of the Church But we sée how they had such separate authoritie neither may we thinke they inuaded Christs monarchie or sole absolute gouernment and therefore Christs monarchie or sole absolute gouernment may stand intier yet may some other Ecclesiasticall person haue from Christ some authority by himselfe separated from other in the regiment and gouernance of the Church For he that hath some parte of the Monarkes authoritie and that not of himselfe but representing the Monarke committed to him and that to him by himselfe separated from other doth not forth with take the Monarchie on him or that sole absolute gouernment that is referred peculiarly to our Sauior Christ only but the Apostles had and exercised so farre forth some authoritie in the regiment of the Church by themselues separated from other that they appointed other also to take such authoritie vpon them and giue them rules of the same And as we haue shewed out of our Brethren themselues that Timothy whose example they would elude vnder pretence that hee was an Euangelist was the Pastor of Ephesus and the chiefe Pastor there 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Antistes Bishop and that their first or Archbishop so Saint Paule that had it and vsed it by himselfe giueth Timothie likewise authoritie by himselfe separated in respect of the authoritie from other and that not onelie in the function of teaching but also in the Ecclesiasticall and publike gouernment of the Church For teaching he saith 1. Tim. 1.3 As I besought thee to abide still in Ephesus when I departed into Macedonia that thou shouldest command some not to teach other doctrine And in the 4. Chap. verse 11. c. These things command and teach Let no man despise thy youth but bee vnto them that beleeue an example in word in conuersation in loue in spirit in faith in purenesse till I come giue attendance to reading to exhortation and to doctrine Despise not the gift that is in thee which was giuen thee by prophesie with the laying on of handes of the Presbiterie or Eldership These things exercise thou in these things be thou that they profiting may be manifest among all Take heedâ— to thy self to thy doctrine coÌ„tinue these things For doing the same thou shalt saue thy self and the hearers of thee Al which authoritie as it is peculiar to the proper dutie of thepastorall office and in coÌ„mon to Saint Paule to the Apostles Euangelists Bishops Pastors to all Elders Ministers of the word by theÌ„selues separate from other in which part neither anie of them nor all they nor al the Angels in heauen can make nor teach anie other Gospel so for that which followeth in the next Chapter consisting all or most of that authoritie which our Brethren saie they now vnderstand for power of gouernment in the Church the Apostle ascribeth also many parts and those the chiefe and principall partes of that authoritie to the rule and gouernance of Timothie by himselfe separated from others in that authoritie euen as he did before in the doctrine And in this respect with much better reason that in these things both Paule and Timothie had and the Bishoppes pastors haue more authoritie as in matters that men might make and some of them also alterable As for example Rebuke not an Elder sayth Saint Paule to Timothie 1. Tim. 5.1 but exhorte him as a Father The rebuking therefore of an Elder appertained to his authoritie in the gouernment of the Church But hee might rebuke him by himselfe and separated from other that is as well by his owne pastorall authoritie separated from others authoritie as priuatlie by himselfe or separating the Elders from other Moreouer saith Paule to Timothie verse 11. reiect the younger widowes The reiecting therefore of the widowes to whome Beza ascribes an Ecclesiasticall office appertained also vnto Timothie And verse 19. Against an Elder admit no accusation except vnder 2. or 3. witnesses Not onelie therefore the hearing and all the chiefe processe in iudgement but the verie admitting oâ— the accusation appertained particularly to his authoritie by himselfe separated from other though not so separated that they might not sit with him but that in the admitting and determining such accusations euen in the Consistorie against an Elder and the Elder a Pastor also the authoritie of the negatiue voice is ascribed here to him and in his person to a Bishop This may also be referred saith Hemingius vnto the honour of Priests or Elders that the Bishop should not giue care to the slanderers of the life and fame of them except they were conuicted before by lawful witnesses For if he would hearken to tale tellers without euident knowledge of the cause it cannot bee but that oftentimes hee shoulde giue ouer hastie iudgement and shoulde bee carried rashly against the innocent Wherein he plainlie ascribeth the authoritie of iudgement ouer a Pastor accused to the Bishop The proposition of this place is saith Aretius that a Bishop must endeuour himselfe that the Ecclesiasticall iudgements may most hoâ—â—lie be administred He appointeth the partes from the diuision For sinne either is hidden and therefore by witnesses to bee conuinced or is notorious neither hath the sinner neede of witnesse because the sinne is euident or else also hee doth confesse it Of either of this kinde hee brieflie treateth but he beginneth with that that is hidden As it is wont in great men such as are the Praesidents of the Common weale and of the Church whose sinne is not euident for because of their authoritie These if they bee complained vppon
the sight of so great witnesses God the Father Christ and the elect Angels he calleth these elect for the difference of the reprobate he should doo anie of those things that pertaine to the office of a Bishoppe of priuate affections But that he should doo all things lawfully and orderlie to the glorie of God and to the edification of the Church according to the praescribed Canons preferring none to any thing for priuate causes And speaking of the diuerse readings of this sentence he saith al these readings although they differ in wordes yet they offer the same sentence that is to wit a Bishop according to the Canons praescribed of Paule shoulde doo and iudge al things esteeming more the verity of the cause than the condition of the person Which thing verilie is in common commended to all Iudges Exod. 18. Wherein saith Beza he is sayd of the Grecians 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to giue preiudicate iudgement that accounteth anie man as excel-cellent and choise But a Iudge ought in iudging to laie downe all these opinions as he that sitteth not to iudge of the persons but of the cause c. For a Iudge ought to weigh the rights of the pleaders as it were in a ballance so that he should incline to neither parte Otherwise it will not be a right iudgement But a Iudges authoritie in all such iudgements iâ— the chiefest on the bench whosoeuer sit with him as assistant neither doth he howsoeuer he communicate with other in councell deliberation ioyne anie with him in the authoritie of iudgement the Bishop therefore béeing such a Iudge in these matters pertaining to the Ecclesiastical regimeÌ„t and gouernance of the Church we finde by searching of the Scripture that a Bishop hath authoritie by himselfe separate from other cleane contrarie to our Brethrens saying Neither hath the Bishoppe this authoritie onely concerning their liues and conuersation But for their verie entrie and admittance also into the ministerie al the authoritie of being ordained was to passe by whom so euer they were elected by his onelie ordeining of them as appeareth further verse 23. Laie handes lightlie on no man And although Beza heere doe abridge this his authoritie in ordaining Ministers and saie Laie handes c. that is admit not euerie one lightlie to haue anie Ecclesiasticall function to wit so much as in thee is For neither all the authoritie laie in Timothie alone but by election made of the suffâ—agies or voices or the whole Church as we haue sayd Act. 14. d. 23. and appeareth by the elelection of Matthias and of the Deacons And then afterward the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or Bishoppe in the name of the Presbiterie did by the imposition of handes consecrate vnto the Lorde the elected partie as is abouesayde 4. d 14. But al this ouer nice mincing serueth not the turne for in the elections which Beza héere citeth for example of like manner there is great difference In the example of Matthias Act. 1. his election was by lot and not by voices nor anie laying on of hands is there mencioned In the Deacons Act. 6. the multitude chose them and the Apostles not anie of the other Elders laide their handes on them And as for the example Act. 14. whereof although we haue seene som what alreadie yet so often as our brethren leade vs to this place which is one of their principall sanctuaries to which they runne it shall not be amisse so often to shew that they claime a wrong priuiledge And first that it was done by the peoples voices holding vp their handes as a testification of their consentes vnto them which the wordes of the text doe not inforce 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but ordeining by the hande vnto them Priests or Elders by euerie Church although Erasmus interpret 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 quum creassent per suffragia and when they had created by voices Elders vnto them whom Caluine followeth saying The word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifieth to discerne by holding vp the handes as is wont to be done in solemnities or assemblies of the people And Beza followeth him saying This word sprang of the custome of the Grecians which gaue their voices with their hands held out Wherevpon sprang that decree noted of Cicero for Lucius Flaccus they stretched out their hands And diuerse others most excellent learned among our Brethren and vs followe that translation and albeit our Geneua translation saith And when they had ordeined them Elders by election but adding this note in the margine The word signifieth to elect by putting vp of hands which declareth that Ministers were not made without the consent of the people yet with the good leaue and reuerence of all these singular learned men bee it spoken not onelie no necessitie driueth them to this interpretation but I sée not though I woulde bée right gladde to learne howe it can stande with the sense and reason of the Lert For first the text maketh there no mencion at all of their election wherof we doubt not but that they were not made without the consent of the people But the question is who did make create or ordaine them Whether the people together with Paul and Barnabas or Paul and Barnabas onelie But it is most euident that the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is referred onely to Paule and Barnabas and therefore whatsoeuer the people did in voicâ— or hands in the election the handes onely of Paule and Barnabas were in the creating and ordaining of them And although that the Heathen Grecians had such an vse that when a lawe or decree was to bee approued of the people they gaue their consent therunto in their great assemblies by holding vp their hands yet to take the word here in such a prophane sense me thinkes Caluine aunsweres himselfe sufficientlie Notwithstanding the Ecclesiasticall writers vse the name 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in another sense that is to wit in a solemne custome of ordaining which in the Scriptures is called the laying on of hands Moreouer by this forme of speaking is excellentlie expressed the lawfull manner in creating Pastors Paule and Barnabas are sayd to choose the Elders Doe they this alone by their priuate office Yea tather they permit the matter to the voices of them all Therefore in the Pastors that were to bee created there was a free election of the people But that nothing should be done tumultuouslie Paule and Barnabas as it were moderators had the gouernment Thus ought the decree of the Councell of Laodecia to bee vnderstoode which forbiddeth the election to be permitted to the people Thus writeth Caluine Wherein he driueth all to the election But the worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 importeth by his owne interpretation and by the Ecclesicall custome in the Scripture the ordination by laying on of handes Aâ— for the election was another matter which then in parte pertayned to the people
And yet therein Paule and Barnabas had a seuerall higher authoritie by themselues than anie other had ioyntly with them As for the decree in the Councell of Laodicia which was holden about the yéere of our Lord 360. the words and meaning are plaine Chap. 13. That it must not be permitted vnto the people to make election of them that were to be promoted vnto Priesthood What tumultes they had found therein I remit to the Ecclesiasticall histories So that we cannot as Caluine doth vnderstand the words of the Councell so as that they onelie take awaie the moderation of the voices from the people for that they neuer had so much as to bee moderators of their owne voices But the Councels meaning is most apparant that the people should no longer haue anie voices at all to elect the pastor And therefore that auncient Councell in making this decree declareth that they tooke not the peoples election to be anie necessarie and materiall part of creating ordaining or consecrating of a Pastor But whatsoeuer authoritie our Brethren would renue vnto the people concerning election What is that to the ordaining of him The election maketh him but ordinable or capable to be ordained As for that example which Beza addeth Act. 4. mencioneth indéede Imposition of hands of the presbiterie or eldership Which word if we shoulde heere vnderstand for a number of Elders that laide their hands on him which Caluine saith we néede not do and we haue shewed the contrarie yet neither followeth it of necessitie that they were anie Elders that dealt in the gouernment of the Church and not in the word as Beza himself confesseth neither that this imposition of hands on him was at his first creating minister of the word or pastor but on some other occasion and therefore saith Beza 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 id est 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of Prophesie that is to prophesie or in prophesie as Rom. 4. b. 11. or by prophesie that is the holie Ghost by the mouth of the Prophets so commending as is aboue sayde Chap. 1. d. 18. howbeit because mencion is made of the gifte bestowed vpon him I prefer the former interpretation For it is more probable when as he had alreadie an excellent gift of prophesie that hee was chosen for a while to wit vntill he were of the Lorde called to some other place for he was an Euangelist Which laying on of hands out of doubt did confirme the grace of God in him as 2. Tim. 1. b. 6. But of Prophets what was their function hath often bene declared of vs. Of the presbiterie 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that is of the order of the Priestes or Elders In the which name it is probable that the companie is signified of all them which laboured in the word in the Church of Ephesus as Act. 20. d. 27. and f. 28. For sometimes these names of Bishops and Priests yea and of Deacons also are generall See Phil. 1. a. 1. a certaine fellowe translateth it the Senate as in another place for the Church hee sayde the common weale Thus writeth Beza of the imposition of hands and of the presbiterie both counting the name Senate too prophane a name of the presbiterie and ascribing the imposition of handes to those onelie that were labourers in the word and that Timothie was a minister of the word before this imposition of their hands But if now we shall vnderstand that in this place 1. Tim. 4.14 by laying on of hands vpon Timothie was also meant the ordaining or creating of him a minister of the word as Saint Paule meaneth it in his precept to Timothie 1 Tim. 5.22 and as Caluine taketh it let vs sée againe what Caluine saith thereon He saith that grace was giuen vnto him by prophesie How To wit because as we sayde before the holy Ghost by Oracle appointed Timothie that hee shoulde bee chosen into the order of pastours For he was not chosen onelie by the iudgement of man as is wont to be done but the calling of the spirite went before He saith it was giuen him with the imposition of handes Wherein hee signifieth that together with the ministery he was also indued with necessary gifts It was vsuall and solemne to the Apostles to ordaine Ministers by the imposition of handes And veriâ—y of this custome and of the originall and signification thereof I haue touched somewhat before and the residue may be gathered out of my Institution The Presbiterie they which thinke this worde is collectiue put for the Colledge of the Priests or Elders doe in my iudgement thinke well Notwithstanding all thinges weighed I graunt that the other sense dooth not ill agree â—hereto that it should be the name of the office c. And because Beza referreth the expounding of this place to the 2. Tim. 1.6 on these wordes VVherefore I warne thee that thou stirre vp the gifte of God which is in thee by the imposition of my handes Let vs sée againe withall what Caluine saith thereon There is no doubt but that Timothie was wished for with the common desire of the Church and not elected by the priuate will of Paule alone But it is not absurde that Paule shoulde ascribe the election priuatlie to himselfe whereof hee was the chiefest author Although here he rather treateth of the ordeining of him than of the electing that is of the solemne custome of his being instituted Moreouer it dooth not cleerelie appeare whether that when any was to be consecrated all were wont to lay their hande vpon his head or one onelie in the place and name of all My coniecture rather inclineth vnto this that there was one onelie which layde his handes vpon him Howbeit it may bee doubted whether this present imposition of handes bee referred to his ordaining because at that time the graces of the spirite whereof Saint Paule treateth to the Romanes Chap. 12. and 1. Corin. 13 were conferred by imposition of handes vnto many also which were not instituted Pastors But I easilie gather of the former Epistle that Paule treateth heere of the Pastors office For this place agreeth with that Neglect not the grace which is giuen to thee with the imposition of the handes of the Presbiterie Whereby it appeareth that the handes of the Presbiterie in the ordaining and consecrating a pastor might bee well inough not the handes of many but of one alone that had principall authoritie aboue the other in that action And as Paule testifâ—eth thus of his owne manner of ordaining Timothie so hee procéedeth in his precept to Timothie 1. Tim. 5.23 Laie handes lightlie on no man Whereon sayth Caluine There is no doubt but that hee woulde put awaie enuie from Timothie and meete with many complaintes that oftentimes arise against the godly seruauntes of Christe which refuse to obey the ambitious praiers of anie whosoeuer For some accuse them of roughnesse some of enuie some crie out that they bee cruell
examination and determining of al matters pertayning to discipline and gouernement of that congregation The premisses inferred not this conclusion S. Paule speaketh not at all in those places of euerie Church and congregation nor howe many offices ought to be in euerie of them nor of any consistorie or Seniorie at all of Elders or Gouernors in them nor of the hearing examination determining of all matters pertayning to discipline and gouernement of that congregation nor who or how many of them ought to do these things nor of any certaine perpetuall and ordinarie platforme of officers or offices to the whole Churche or to euerie particular Churche and congregation None of all these pointes are here either plainely declared or inclusiuely insinuated by S. Paule and yet sée how our Brethren when they are once growne to be bolde to affimre one point out of Gods word for these officers more than the worde of God leadeth them vnto dare from one point procéeding to another waxe bolder and bolder in the ende so bolde not nowe only to affirme plainely all these things But to make a flat and plaine conclusion on them and that a necessarie that therefore there ought to be in euery Church a Consistorie or Signorie of Elders or Gouernors which ought to haue the hearing examination and determining of all matters pertaining to discipline and gouernment of that congregation and then indéede farewell not only our former questions of womens gouernement but of all Princes gouernement women or men in any of their dominions For here is not onely mentioned discipline but also gouernement and not in Ecclesiasticall matters only but in all matters pertayning to the gouernement of that congregation and not onely the hearing and examination of all matters but also the determining of them all And all this not to be done in some but in euerie Church and in euerie congregation in the Realme yea in the whole worlde And all this to be done not by any officers of the Prince but by a Consistorie or Segnorie of Elders or Gouernours chosen among themselues not any officers of the Prince being so muche as mentioned among them no nor now when it commeth to the conclusion eyther Pastor or Bishop is ioyned with them So that both the Pastor and the Bishop is now so farre remooued from hauing any authoritie of gouernemnt in the Church separated from others by him selfe that he may kéepe it by him selfe haue he any for with them in conclusion hee getteh none they will haue all separately by themselues Are not these matters trowe wée in this Learned Discourse of our Brethren properly concluded and to the great beautifying of Gods Church and to the quiet establishment of this Realme O Brethren Brethren it is more than high time to looke to such a Segnorie the verye péeping out of whose heades and the first appearing in the Discoursing of them shall beginne his course on this course fashion and vnder pretence of putting by the Bishoppe and of ioyning with the Pastor shall so exclude the Princes established authoritie and sette vp such a straunge newe gouernement among them-selues and that in euerie particular Congregation that is in euerie parish Church both with vs in Englande and throughout all Christendome But nowe to mittigate all this least it might growe into shrewde suspition of most daungerous troubles innouations and confusions of all Realmes and states by giuing too great authoritie to the Segnories of these Congregationall Elders and Gouernours Our Brethren adioyne heereunto with great circumspection certaine cautions of moderation Which authority of theirs say they neuerthelesse ought to be moderated that their iudgement may be rightly accounted the iudgement of the holy Church I thinke they would say of the whole Church But the terme holie is well-inough For verily if the Churche be not the holier this Segnorie might bréede a mysterie of great mischiefe and vnholinesse except their iudgement in choosing and the authoritie of those that be chosen shall the better be moderated Let vs therefore marke our Bretherens moderating of these Gouernours to bridle and represse all these inconueniences Which thing consisteth in these two points First that the Elders be elected and chosen by consent of the whole Congregation men of godlinesse and wisedome in whom the whole Church reposeth such confidence that they committe vnto them their authority in hearing and determining such matters as without horrible confusion they cannot performe themselues I looked here for the moderating of these Elders that their authoritie should haue béen so restrayned or limited that either they should not deale in all matter of gouernement or not proceede ouer farre therein But our Brethren talke of no such moderating of them Their moderation consisteth in two pointes whereof the first is for their election that the Elders be elected and chosen by the consent of the whole congregation What And shall neither Prince Magistrate Bishop Pastor nor any officer ciuill or Eccl. haue any stroake ouer and aboue the whole multitude of the congregation in the election of them which shall deale in all matters of gouernment This first point is a point as daungerous as any of the residue And how shall the whole congregation giue their consent in the electing of them Shall they doe it by some other chosen persons among them that shall giue their consent for them And then who shall choose them that shall chose those that shall choose these Elders chosen for them Or shall euery person of the whole congregation by himselfe or all of them together on a huddle choose them And what if they cannot consent vpon them Shall the halfe or greater parte goe for the whole when the other halfe or the lesser part of the whole congregation dissenteth from the election And how then will they chose suche men of godlinesse and wisedome as they imagine And what also if the greater part thēselues of the congregation want wisedome to make such choise of them Or affection of loue hate feare hope c. ouercome their wisedome As we sée it doth oftentimes not only in fewe but in multitudes And the greatest parte hath not alwayes the greatest wisedome nor greatest godlinesse Whereupon ariseth the common saying maior pars vincit meliorē the greatest part ouercomes the better And our greater part must be accounted for the whole or else no choise at all will bée made among them And where then shall our men of wisedome and godlinesse by the consent of the whole congregation be elected and chosen Well say they yet they shall be men of such wisedome and godlines as in whome the whole Churche reposeth such confidence that they committe vnto them their authoritie in hearing and determining such matters as without horrible confusion they can not performe themselues And can they not giue their cōsent to the hearing determining such matters without not only confusion
also of the Chiliarkes Moreouer in the whole and out of the whole people there was a cheefe Senate that consisted of 70. Elders being so elected as the reason of the time coulde beare it For before thâ— carying away of the 10. Tribes it is likely that they were chosen of the families of those 70. that came downe out of Cananie into Egipt and of those families that were substituted in their steedes as in his place we haue sayde Besides these as the matter required the fathers of the houses of all the Tribes came together at solemne meetings Thus first we sée howe Bertram heere doth summarily describe all the sortes of Seniors and Elders that were in Israell and all their senates and assemblies Not onely those that were inferiour in euery of the Cities principall Families and in all the seuerall Tribes among them but also in generall of all the whole Realme and state especially that of the Three-score and ten Elders that were chosen out of euery Tribe as a cheefe standing senate ouer all the other and in what matters not onely nor so much Ecclesiasticall as ciuill and politicall they had to deal with all euen from the first Institution of them and while these senates and seniors were in their perfectest estate Which estate of theirs Caluin our Learned Brethren here affirme was restored translated renewed and ordeined by Christe to be continued in his church to the worldes end as it was before it was afterward corrupted by the Iewes All which senates and seniors or any of them but chéefly of all the other which our Br. vrge chiefly indéede it was the chéefe if they or it were restored or translated or renued among vs how shold not forthwith all the state not only of the church but of the whol common weal be clean altered so of like consequence all other parts of Christendom Now to proue that these Senates had this authority Bertram procéedeth to the practise of it To returne therefore to the times of Iosue Iosue seemeth out of those thinges that are written Ios. 23.2 24.1 to haue very well appointed the iudgements according to the prescription of Moses Lawe For there it is treated on the solemne meetinges First all the Tribes of the Israelites or all the Israelites that is to say the Fathers of the housholdes of all the tribes that were enfranchised with the right of the City or also were Citizens are set downe Then the Elders that is the 70. afterwards the heads of Israel that is of the thirteene Tribes 13. cheefe capteynes Last of al the Iudges and Prefects that is the ordinary iudges of euery city Which consisted of the Chiliarkes the centurions the fiftiniers and Prefects of ech city After the death of Iosua this ciuill policy seemeth to haue continued especially during the time that those seniors or Elders did suruiue which had seene the workes of God in the wildernesse of whose number Phinees seemeth to haue beene one in whose age the battell was waged against the Beniamites In his time therefore all the Tribes of Israell are sayde to haue come together vnto Mitspa that the cheefe citizens beeing before warned and assembled to the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Caal that is to the army or vniuersall assembly of the citizens concluded to giue battell to the Beniamites and had determined the same and had promised by a solemne othe that they woulde not giue in mariage their Daughters to the Beniamites All the selfe same citizens deale about the restoring of the Tribe of Beniamin But 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Gnedah that is all the Chiliarches centurions Fiftinaries Decurions and Prefects decree the Warre agaynst the Iabesites and to that viage or exployte they sende 12000 souldiers But the seniors or Elders that is the other 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Gnedah To witte the seuenty at the beginning in the battell giue the councell of catching the Virgines of the Siloites But that the seuenty Elders are signified by that assembly It appeareth thereby in that they tooke vpon them to pacify the Siloites if at any time the Siloites shoulde before them appeach the Beniamites for that rapte or catching of their Virgins This therfore seemeth to be the processe of that story so far as serueth to our purpose The Leuite sent the twelue peeces of his secondary wife or wife then permitted of the second sort otherwise then called a concubine into all the coastes and regions or cities of the twelue tribes The seniors or Iudges that is the Chiliarkes centurions Fiftinariens and decurions of euery tribe and so of euery city call a councell about this matter among their citizens and kinreds By whose agreement an vniuersall or generall councell is indicted at Mitspa to the which all the tribes of Israell which are there called the Angles or corners of the people that is to say the prouinces or tribes c. Except the Iabesites make apparance The Prouinces therefore of the Israelites which otherwise are called Tribes are present at the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Caal that is the armie congregation or vniuersall Concion of Gods people to the number of 400000. In that vniuersall concion or calling together the Leuite declareth the matter The matter beeing hearde the people decree a message to be sent to all the families and villages of the Beniamites to deliuer vp the authors of that wicked fact The Beniamites doe rather prepare themselues to battell The Israelites take an othe of not giuing their daughters in marriage to the Beniamites and doe thus order the battayle towardes that by lot out of ten thousande they chose one Chiliarke or bande of a thousandes and out of a thousande a hundred and oâ—t of a hundred tenne To take the care of vittayling the campe They aske counsell of God at Silo what tribe shoulde fight first The Lorde aunswereth the tribe of Iudah shall doe this The battayle being ended the people come together agayne before the Lorde They repent them of their oath The army being mustered it is founde that none of the Iabesites was among them in the Beniamites Warre 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Gnedah that is the assembly to wit the Chiliarks centurions c. decreeth Warre against the Iasebites and against them they send 12000. men They return conquerors and bring 400. Virgins of the Iasebites But when they sufficed not the Beniamites The people do more repent them of the Tribe destroyed At the selfe same time the seuenty Elders doe decree the catching of the Siloites Virgins For there is no likelihoode that the Chiliarkes centurions c. of the Siloites if they had beene present woulde haue suffered this decree At the ende of that history is annexed vnder it that therefore these thinges hapned thus because there was no 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that is no king whome the Israelites shoulde reuerence and to whome beeing eyther priuately or publikely offered iniury they should flee But
neuerthelesse the number of the 70. Elders was preserued For Ezechiel in the 8. chap. said And the threescore and tenne men of the Elders of Israel when notwithstanding in the Age of Ezechiel the 10. Tribes of Israel were in Assyria And Ieremie in the 19. named the Elders of the people Take an earthen bottell of the Elders of the people and of the Priests Neither onelie did this Senate flourishe while the kingdome stoode but also the kingdome being ouerthrowen after the Iewes returne out of the captiuitie of Babylon the same was restored For in the 1. of Esay it is written I will restore thy Iudges and thy Counsellours as in the auncient time And in the 10. of Esdras which place we haue hearde cited by Danaeus Euerie one that shal not come within three daies according to the coūsell of the Princes and of the Elders all his substance shall be forfaised And the 12. of the first of the Machabees Ionathas the high Priest of the Nation and the Elders and the residue of the people of the Iewes And in the first of the 2. booke The people that is at Ierusalem and the Senate and Iudas to Aristobulus the Maister of King Prolomeus sendeth greeting And in the 11. King Antiochus to the Senate of the Iewes and to the other Iewes And in the 14. To Simon the Bishop and to the Seniors and to the whole people And Saint Luke 22. The Seniours of the people being called in Greeke the Presbyterie or Eldershippe of the people Iosephus also sheweth that in last times of the Citie Florus the Procurator of Iurie calling vnto him the Princes of the Senatours and the Senatours and the Senate he said that he woulde depart out of the Citie And hee addeth that with the Temple the Court also was set on fire which Court he calleth Buleuterion the Counsell-house But although this Senate for consultation sake remained alwaies notwithstanding we haue to vnderstande that the Kings which haue had the Common-weale in their power were not thrall vnto the Lawes although they made Decrees without the authoritie of the Senate as those that were in chiefest authoritie not such as God had prescribed but such as their selues wished Moreouer that the Tribes had euerie one their Senatours different from those that were the Senatours of the Common-people it is more probable by coniecture than certaine by authoritie For although it be written in the 20. chap. of the 4. booke of the Kinges All the Seniors of Iuda and Ierusalem were gathered together to the King Iosias and in the 30. of the first booke Dauid sent giftes of the Pray◠to the Seniors of Iuda his neighbours and 19. of Hieremie God said I will destroy the Counsell of Iuda notwithstanding it may bee that they that were the Seniors of Iuda were all one with the Seniors of the people But without doubte euerie one of the Cities had gotten their Senatours separate from those whome we haue spoken of Whereupon are these speaches All the Seniors of Iuda and Hierusalem were gathered together to the King Iosias And Iosephus lib. 2. The Seniors of Ierusalem tooke it greeuouslie that the brother of Iaddi the Bishop maried a straunger And Iudges 11. the Seniors of Galaad proceeded to take Iephthe for their aide said vnto him Come and bee our Prince And in the 8. Hee tooke a childe of the men of Sucoth and asked of him the names of the Princes and Seniors of Sucoth And Ruth 4. Booz taking tenne men of the Seniors of the Citie of Bethleem said vnto them c. Thus dooth Sigonius deuide the Seniors into three sortes The Sēniors of all the people the Seniors of euerie Tribe and the Seniors of euerie Citie And if Christe had meant anie of these Seniors it is farre more likelie that he shoulde haue meant this last sort if not some yet of lower degrée than these of euerie Synagogue of the Citie than the highest of all that sate with the Prince in Counsell and had the consultation of all the summe and principall points of all the Churches Common-weales affaires which were the manifest endaungering of her Maiesties estate and the cleane altering of all the Common-weale In the next Chapter Sigonius procéedeth to their Iudgements saying cap. 5. We haue spoken of the Counsells in which chiefelie the Cities profite is disputed vpon After which we haue to speake of the Iudgements wherin the singular or particular equitie is defined that could not either be prouided for or prescribed by the Lawe But these iudgments the Greeke Interpreters of the Bible haue now and then translated them 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 now and then 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to wit respecting the double force it selfe of Iudgements in which condemning and acquiting is conteined which by these two wordes Iudgement and Iustice or iustification they expressed as we haue shewed before Furthermore among the Hebrues there were two Tribunall seates of the Iudgements the one in euerie of the Cities called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the other chiefelie at Hierusalem named 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which the Latine Interpreter translated Iudgement and Counsell Whereupon in S. Mathew Christe saith Euerie one that is angrie with his brother shall be guiltie of Iudgement But he that shall say Racha shal be guiltie of a Counsell But that the Iudgement was an other thing from the Counsell Dauid in the first Psalme sheweth when hee saide Therefore the wicked shall not arise agayne in Iudgement neither the sinners in the counsell of the righteous And héere commeth in our 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 corruptlie called Sanedrin that Caluine and our Brethren applie Christes wordes vnto Which Synedrion was the Iudiciall Consistorie of the seuentie Elders that with the Prince as Counsellors had the gouernment of all the policie of the Iewes But because the other called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 was the Iudgement of euerie Citie if Christe had meant to haue alluded to the Iewes orders and to haue translated and established the same or the like in euery Congregation among the Christians is it not more likelie of the twaine he would haue taken that which was the Iudgement of euerie Citie than the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which was onelie in Ierusalem the head Citie a chiefe Iudgement to ouer rule all the other But yet for our further resolution let it not be tedious to heare also Sigonius testimonies at large for both these Iudgements of these Seniors Let vs first saith he chap. 6. treate of the Iudgements of the Cities and then of the Counsell of Ierusalem when they were instituted and confirmed who they were that entred into them who were Gouernours of them where they came together and to conclude in what order they tooke notice of the causes I say therefore that the Iudges of the Cities with their Princes which in Greeke were called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 introducers informers or teachers of the writings or of
shall binde vpon earth shall bee bounde in Heauen and whatsoeuer yee shall loose c. In this sentence Christ strengtheneth first the Iudgements of priuate men if the Church shall not haue a publike magistrate For when men are wont tobee stubborne it may come to passe that hee that fayleth in his cause before the Church of priuate men and is iudged an Ethnike and publicane may contemne this iudgement and thinke him-selfe neuertheles to be an inheritor of the kingdome of Heauen although hee bee cast out of the assembly of these as hee thinketh them vile or base persons But Christe strengtheneth their authority and affirmeth that their sentence is approued also in Heauen Furthermore hee strengthneth also in this saying the publike iudgementes of them that are in lawfull Magistracy that we may manifestly knowe that their Iudgementes are not of men but are the Iudgementes of God According to that of Paule hee that resisteth the power resisteth the ordinaunce of God And verily Christe in other places with the like sentences in Math. 16. and Iohn 20. chapter confirmeth the authority of the Ministery of preaching the Gospell But in this place hee confirmeth the iudgementes of priuate men or of Magistrates against the contemners that the same shoulde bee ratified before God in Heauen Heere lo is the ratifiing whereof our brethren speake but heereupon hee concludeth thus But all these things are to be vnderstoode of a right and lawfull iudgement and of that sentence which is giuen in the ministery of the church according to the Worde of the Gospell and in causes forinsecall according to the publique and ordinary Lawes For if the sentences of the Iudges or Ministers striue with these it is none before God howe greatly soeuer thou shalt be condemned before men So that here he concludeth with these two excommunications a ciuill and an Ecclesiasticall The ciuill eyther in these priuate mens small assemblies or in the publike Magistrate But the Ecclesiasticall to pertaine onely to the Minister and to be in the Ministery of the worde of God such as was mentioned before Math. 16. And afterward againe Iohn 20. And verily if we shall search the ground of this Eccl. Exc. what abuses soeuer be or haue beene or may be by the Ministers or by any other not Ministers committed therein which I take not vpon me to defende and may easily bee helped without the supply of this Seniory and good prouisions there are in that behalfe yet that the act of the proper Ecclesiasticall Excommunication shoulde be executed by such Ecclesiasticall gouernors as are not Ministers nor teachers of the Worde I can not yet see howe it may be sufficiently warranted or howe it may stand with the nature of this spirituall and Ecclesiasticall censure For if this power of binding and loosing be the same that is called the power of opening and shutting called also the power of the keyes then it cheefely consisteth in the Ministery of the Worde For what is the key but Gods Worde Yea if it bee the same that consisteth in remitting and retaining of sinnes towardes God what other power hath the Church thereof than by the prenouncing of Gods Worde So that our Brethren must eyther make these Seniors to bee Ministers of Gods Worde or else they must graunt that in this place Christe meaneth not such a Seniory of Gouerning Elders as are not Ministers of the Word But here saith Caluine Hic locus non omnino c. This place is not altogether like that place which is aboue written Chapter 16. c. 19. But it is to bee vnderstoode in part a little different But wee make them not so diuers that they haue not muche affinitie betweene themselues This first of all on both parts is alike that eyther of them is a generall sentence and the power of binding and loosing is always the same that is to witte by the word of God the same commaundement the same promise But they differ heerein that the former place is peculiarlie of the preaching which the Ministers of the word of God do exercise Here it pertayneth to the Discipline of excommunication which is permitted to the church There Christe woulde auouch the authority of the Doctrine Here hee constituted Discipline which is an appendant vnto doctrine There hee sayde that the preaching of the Gospell shoulde not be frustrate but that it shoulde bee a quickning or a killing sauour here he affirmeth that although the wicked doe scorne the iudgement of the church notwithstanding it shoulde not bee vayne This distinction is to be holden because there it is simply treated vpon the word preached here vpon the publike censures and Discipline Although I doe not altogether deny this difference in respect of the obiect matter wherin the subiect person hath diuers times on diuers occasions and diuers ends to deale yet since Caluine heere him-selfe maketh the power of binding and loosing the promise also and the commaundement to be all one and the same to consist all onely by the ministery of the word although the occasion or purpose of Christe in the former place Math. 16. be more for ratifying the Doctrine of the worde when it is taught or preached than for ratifying the publique censures and Discipline beeing onely the appendants to the Doctrin Yâ—t this letteth not but rather prooueth so much more that he to whome the execution of both or eyther of these actions being both of them powers of the worde and ministeriall pronouncings of the same word doth appertaine ought to be his selfe a Minister of the worde And thus doth Caluine himselfe afterwarde also confesse saying For neither doth Christe auouch authority of or vnto his church whereby he shoulde diminish his or his Fathers right but rather whereby hee may establish the maiesty of his Worde For euen as before hee woulde not confusedly establish euery Doctrine whatsoeuer but that which proceeded out of his mouth chap. 16. c. 19 So neither sayth he in this place that euery Iudgement whatsoeuer shall be stable and ratified but that wherein he himselfe is president or gouerneth Neyther that onely by the spirite but also by the Worde Whereupon it followeth that men bring no preiudice vnto or hinder not God while they pronounce nothing but out of his mouth and stoode onely to execute faithfully that which he hath commanded For although Christe bee the onely iudge of the worlde yet would hee haue in the meane season ministers to be the publishers of his Worde and then he woulde haue his iudgement to be of his Church set foorth So that commeth to passe that it derogateth nothing from him that the ministery of men commeth betweene but that he onely looseth and bindeth And hâ—ere Marlorate coâ—texteth out of Bucer Hereupon it appereth how proposterously or rather how naughtily some gather out of this place that the Church can doe any thing but cheefely can make lawes of religion which whosâ— despiseth shall
theÌ„selues it is in this their humor for this Presbyterie What is héere for so excellent and godly learned men to haue alledged this tyrannical Decree or rather this very doctrine of Diuels in this superstitious Council against the law of God against the lawfulnesse of Bishops Elders and Deacons mariage against the verie Antiquitie of the Church which they pretend â—ind yet what is there in this Decree to inferre that this power and Censure of excommunication apperteineth onelie and alwaies to a Presbyterie ioyned with the Bishops But since Danaeus hath alledged this CouÌ„cill let vs sée how this CouÌ„cill directlie euen in this matter of excommunication maketh cleane against him For in the 8. chap. following it is sayd Alipius the B. of the Church of Tagasta the Legate of the Prouince of Numidia did say Neither must that be praetermitted that if perhaps anie Priest or Elder which is corrected or excommunicated of his B. being puffed vp with swelling or pride shall thinke that Sacrifices are separatelie to be offred vnto God or shall beleeue that anie other altare should be erected contrarie to the eccl faith and discipline let him not go vnpunished Valentinus of the first seate of the Prouince of Numidia said The thinges that our brother Alipius hath prosecuted are necessarilie agreeable to the eccl discipline and faith Declare ye therfore what thereupon seemeth good vnto your louingnesse Whether if anie Priest or Elder shall make a scisme against his B he should be accursed It was said of all the Bishops If anie Priest or Elder shall be excommunicated or corrected of his Prelate he ought to complaine to the Bishops adioyning that his cause may be heard of them and by them he may be reconciled to his B. Here both we sée what these Presbyters Priests or Elders were to wit such as celebrated the L. supper also that vpon iust occasion the B. himselfe might excom eueÌ„ these Priests or Elders And if we may gather an argument of absoluing or recoÌ„ciling to the Church which is equiualent to excoÌ„municating we might haue séene before in the 4. chap. that not onlie a Bishop by himselfe but also anie particular Priest or Elder in some cases might doo it Aurelius the B. that propâ—â—ded the decrée against Bishops Priests Deacons wiues which Danaeus citeth said If any man shal be in danger shal desire to be reconciled to Gods altars if the B. shal be absent the Priest or Elder ought to take couÌ„sell of the B. so at his coÌ„mandemeÌ„t to recoÌ„cile the partie that is in danger If the Priest or Elder can absolue the repeÌ„tant partie at the coÌ„mandement of the B. being absent is it not likelie the B. could doo it himselfe being present And if the B. or anie one Priest could thus absolue coulde neither Priest nor B. by theÌ„selues not haue excoÌ„municated the said partie being a manifest notorious offeÌ„der So that by examining this couÌ„cil further it maketh more against Danaeus in this point thaÌ„ for him The like Decrée vnto this for a Priests absoluing restoring a penitent in the absence of the B. is also in the 3. CouÌ„cil of Carth. cap. 32. These CouÌ„cils being about the time of Siritius which Siritius was in the time of Ambrose as Danaeus coÌ„fesseth Ambrose himself without any Presbyterie ioyned with him excoÌ„municating the Emperor Theodosius how is it not apparant that in those daies a B. by himself might excoÌ„municate his excoÌ„municatioÌ„ holdeÌ„ for good lawful But Danaeus to coÌ„firme it better that a B. might not excom by himself addeth the 4. Council of Carth. chap. 22. 23. where it is said that a B. shal not ordeine Clearks without the Council of his Clerkes so that he seeke the assent the sufferance and the testimonie of the Citizens Againe that the Bishop heare the cause of none without the presence of his Clerkes otherwise the Bishoppes sentence shal be frustrate except it bee confirmed by the presence of his Clerkes What is héere that the Bishop may not by himselfe excommunicate The former chap. is onlie of ordeining Clearks yet it doth not take the power of ordeining from them but it manifestlie giueth the power thereof vnto him Though in ordeining a Priest the Council say that all the Priests present should lay their hands also on the head of him that is ordeined But the B. hand onelie on a Deacon c. chap. 3. 4. c. As for this Decrée chap. 22. is but of the Clearkes counsel to the B. And though they say also hee should seeke the assent sufferance testimonie of the Citizens yet in the action of ordeining they haue no power As for the 23. cha requireth onelie the presence of the Bishops Clerkes in the processe of his iudiciall sentences But this proueth not that they ioyne with him in the authoritie of the Iudiciall proceeding and giuing the sentence There is no Iudge can iudiciallie heare and determine anie causes temporal but he must haue his Clearkes and Registers about him to witnesse and recorde the same but neither their presence nor yet their inrolling of the acts giueth them anie authoritie in the Iudgement He is Dominus Iudex for all their presence And that doth the 28. declare saying The vniust condemnation of the bishops is voyde therefore to be retracted of a Synode But what is this to excommunication it is said euen in the next Decrée to that Danaeus héere citeth chap. 24. that the sacerdotall priest making â— speech or preaching in the Church he that shall depart out of the audience shal be excommunicated Might neither the priest nor the Bishop if they saw anie person to vse this dooing obstinatelie mainteine the same pronounce this sentence of excoÌ„munication on him But that the Bishop might so doo in this and in other greeuous crimes we may well conclude by the 55. chap. of that Council that a Bishop shal excommunicate those that are the accusers of their Brethren if they shall amend their fault he may receaue them to the Communion not to the Clergie Héere â—o is the excommunication and absolution made by the Bishop without anie ioyned with him in these actions were they present at the dooings neuer so much And that this was allowable by the ancient custome of the Church the Councill of Eliberis holden almost an 100. yeres before anie of these CouÌ„cels approoueth the excommunicating made by a Bishop himselfe saying chap. 53. It pleased them all that euerie one should receiue the CoÌ„munion of that Bishop of whom being in anie fault hee was Abstentus that is put backe separated or excommunicated But if so be anie Bishop shall presume to admit him he being not yet willing or consenting of whom he was depriued of the communion let him knowe that he shall aunswere these causes among the Brethren with the danger of his estate Concerning Cyprians Epistles we haue perused them
what other thing do the verie Papists alleadge for the most part of their excommunications more then contumacie and contempt Yea but say our brethren this contumacie and contempt is of the Churches admonition In déede so sayth Christ in the place héere cited Math. 18.17 If he heare not the Church But can our brethren héere vnderstand by the namâ— of Church some few persons chosen by the Church and may not the Papists do so to haue not they also their Consistories and that many of them of mo persons then one yea if the Church choose one man as for example their Bishop or Pastor before whome those matters should be heard debated decided doth not the contumacy and contempt against that one man encrease the sinne as well as the contumacie and contempt against any other persons that the Church may choose to this purpose I speake not in defence of the Popish excommunications not acknowledging them as they stand now in open resisting of the truth reuealed to be the true Church Why the Popish Churches excom is no true excomm so that they being now neither of nor properly in the true Church can not rightly expell others out of the true Church in and of which their selues haue no paâ—â— for all their craking of the bare name and therefore their Excommunications are of no force CoÌ„tumaty But if in déede they were as would God if it pleased him they were of and in the true Church as by the grace of God his name be blessed for it we are and in lesser crimes the contempt and contumacie of the Churches admonition giuen by a few persons chosen by the Church thereunto be worthy excommunication then where the Church hath chosen but one that is to wit a Bishop to execute her authority in those matters the contumacy and contempt against his iust and lawfull admonitions is not so much against that one man as against the Churches and so is worthy of the same castigation This testimonie héere rehearsed Matth. 18.15.16.17 Matth. 18.15.16.17 I trust we haue already sufficiently shewed how it maketh nothing at all for any such Seniors as our brethren before alleaged it for and much lesse for any theyr authority of excommunicating nor prescribeth any certaine order in what manner or by what persons anie Excommunication should be made against the offenders which there it speaketh of as we haue heard thereon the diuers iudgements not only of the auncient Fathers but of our best brethren As for the 2. Thess. 3.6 c. the Apostle hath these words 2. Thess. 3.6 VVe commaund you brethren in the name of our Lord Iesus Christ that ye withdraw your selues from euery brother that walketh inordinately and not after the institution that he receyued of vs And in the 11. verse Verse 11. For we heare that there are some among you walking inordinately working not at all but be busie bodies But to such we denounce and beseech in our Lord Iesus Christ that laboring with silence they eate their bread And in the 14. verse Verse 14. But if any obey not our word note him by an Epistle and haue no companie with him that he may be ashamed What kind of persons he séemeth héere to note and what fault he findeth in them I ouerpasse True it is he would haue them first induced by all gentle meanes but if thereby they will not be reformed he yet commaundeth them not héere to be seperated by Excommunication though they haue well deserued it Neither yet in this solemne denouncing â—oth he Excommunicate any but would haue them write vnto him of such inordinate persons insinuating that he himselfe would Excommunicate them as he had done with the incestuous person at Corinthus and with Hymeneus Alexander and Philetus But now our brethren foresâ—eing that this is nothing to the fortifying of their Seniory they returne to that point to aunswere the obiections made against it But it may be obiected say they that hetherto appeareth not so great vse of this Consistory The learned disc Pag. 94. why it should be thought necessary for Excommunication neither doth S. Paule make mention of it in all places where he speaketh of Excommunication In good time be it spoken not onely it may be obiected Bridges but it is obiected Our Obiection that hitherto appeereth not so great vse of this Consistorie why it should be thought necessarie for Excommunication or for anything else hauing beene so little or not in vse at all for any necessary proofe or vse thereof and the Church of Christ hauing continued so manie hundreth yéeres vtterly without it As for all these examples of Excommunicating the incestuous person Hymenaeus Philetus Alexander c. or any other testimonie of Saint Paule héere mentioned What is héere eyther necessarie or likely that may be referred to a Consistorie Neyther will we so much obiect this that Saint Paule maketh no mention of it in all places where he speaketh of Excommunication but that he maketh no mention of it in any place where he speaketh of Excommunication And heere let vs marke our Brethrens confession for if this may be obiected that hitherto appeareth not so great vse of this Consistory that it should be thought necessary for Excom then all that hitherto is alleaged may be thought vnnecessary to inferre this and this appearing that it may be so thought of all that hitherto hath been alleaged let our Brethren looke better to that that is to come to alleage such proues as whereby it should be thought more necessary But to these obiections say our brethren we aunswere that although the simple institution of Christ The learned disc pag. 94. and approbation of the holy Ghost should suffice vs to thinke it necessary yet there are many necessary vses thereof to be alleaged And to this aunswere we reply if this place can be shewed and proued so to be Bridges where this simple institution of Christ and approbation of the holy Ghost was made Our Brethrens aunswer to our obiection speaking of the state of the new testament and since the time of Christes incarnation it shall suffice vs forthwith simply to thinke it necessary But if this be rather supposed and threaped vpon vs then shewed and proued vnto vs our Brethren haue to pardon vs if we thinke it not so necessary or rather to aske pardon of God that dare thus without plaine and manifest proofe pretend the simple institution of Christ and the holy Ghostes approbation of it But to our further satisfaction to prooue this they tell vs that there are many necessarie vses thereof to be alleaged let vs therefore heare also these so many and so necessary vses The learned disc pag. 94. 95. For whereas our Sauiour Christ say they commaundeth in priuate offences the matter to be brought before the congregation except you vnderstand thereby the congregation or assemblie of Elders there shall follow horrible
as they call them but for matters farre more importaunt and necessarie they their selues by their wilfull contumacie beeing the cheefe causes of their owne displacing The Synode therefore ought to bee carefull in ordeining of caeremonies not onely that they bee pure and agreeable to the worde of God but also that they bee expedient for the time and persons for whose vse they bee ordeyned and as wilfull contemners of good orders established by publique authoritie are worthie to bee corrected so intangling of mennes consciences or Tyrannicall coaction in these indifferente matters muste alwayes bee auoyded Still our Brethren giue the whole authoritie in ordeyning of Caeremonies to the Synode Albeit I gladly subscribe thus farre heereto that in ordeyning of caeremonies and so farre as their authoritie to ordeyne reacheth the Synode ought to bee carefull that they bee pure and agreeable to the worde of God But agayne vnderstanding this puritie of them in their owne nature and institution although by corrupting the fame institution they haue beene afterward defiled For these caeremonies that the Apostles and Elders Act. 15. did ordeyne had beene also defiled by the Iewes with great superstition of holinesse in them and erronious opinion of necessitie of the worship of God of the wrought worke of merite and of preferring them aboue fayth in God and the morall commaundements of the Law and yet for all those former so dangerous abuses yea for all the date of them was also expired The Apostles and Elders considering the weakenesse of the ChristiaÌ„s for the most part of the multitude did ordeyn those caeremonies to be vniformely generallie for the time vsed without anie of those errors or corruptions of them And so now in like maner if any caeremonies in their owne nature be not euill or be indifferent and were first instituted onely for purposes that were good though the posteritie degenerating haue corrupted with errors and superstitions thâ—se good caeremonies and so made them euill yet may the Synode now with the authoritie of the Prince confirming them not onely if they thinke it best remooue and abolish those corrupted and defiled caeremonies but also if they see there be needefull and expedient vse of them remoouing all the corruptions defilings and superstitions of them and reâ—â—ning them vnto their first good ends and institutions they haue good authoritie with the Christian Magistrates approbation to reordeine them And so may those caeremonies well be called and holden for all their former pollution pure agreeable to the worde of God But the Synode say they must not onlie haue a care of this point in them but also that they be expedient for the time persons for whose vse they are ordeyned This I graunt likewise And euen therefore wee vse the caeremonies now in our Church ordeyned because they bee expedient for the time and persons for whose vse they are ordeined And contrariwise although we improue not in other reformed Churches their caeremonies different from ours which our Brethren would bring in though their varietie of ceremonies in one state is more to be misliked yet we admit not those caeremonies euen for this because they are considering well the time and persons not so expedient eyther for our time or for our persons but woulde breede great offence to manie among vs and no lesse daunger to the state both of our Prince and of our whole Church also And therefore as we holde vs content with our good and lawfull caeremonies so we accept this that heere they say wilfull contemners of good orders established by publike authoritie are worthy to bee corrected But sith we may well take our orders established by publike authoritie for good orders till they can better than yet they haue beene able prooue them to be ill orders I speake not of the abuses of them but of the orders them-selues according to the ends and institution of them it followeth that they being both wilfull contemners and that is more not onely open breakers but al that euer they can by preaching writing and practising earnest impugners of them they are by their owne verdict worthie to be corrected although we wish rather their amending than their correction And yet let them think of this that whereas the orders that they would erect are not established by anie publike authoritie among vs. What correction then shall men iudge that they are worthy of who being but priuate persons and without all publike authoritie would establish and impose those orders vpon vs As for intangling of mens consciences or tyrrannicall coaction in these indifferent matters that it must alwayes bee auoyded we holde wel therewith neither doe we knowe or allowe of anie such intanglinges or coactions but doe as much mislike it as they doe Howbeit in those matters which in their owne nature are indifferent but not indifferent in their vse being established by publike authoritie we affirme that a dutifull obedience and reuerence may be required and is to be yéelded without anie note or touch of tyrannicall coaction in them that haue authoritie or any intangling of mens consciences that obey them when in the ordeyning of them plaine exception is made both against the opinion of necessitie and of all matter of worship religion and conscience in them and that they are ordeyned onelie for order and comlinesse sake The argument of the 15. Booke THis Booke proceedeth further on the Synods First of the Synods Eccl. Censure for faults and controuersies and whether there would not still be as many and worse then now there are and that euen in the Pastors also Of our Br. remedie by hauing two Pastors at least in euery CongregatioÌ„ and if these two Pastors contend of the remedie by the Synod Of their example in the assemblie Act. 15. Of Timothies Eccl. Censure without Synodes Of Danaeus iudgement in calling Synodes and Councels not without the Princes licence Of the Assemblies of particular and Shire Synods and what authoritie our Br. ascribe vnto them and what daunger they would breede to the whole state How the elections and ordainings of all thâ— Pastors in the Realme should bee made by these Shire Synodes Of the example that they would proue it by Act. 14. in Paule and Barnabas ordeyning Pastors by the peoples election How election by the people is not necessarilie inferred on that example How our Br. exclude their Elders that are Gouernours and not teachers from dealing in these matters Of calling a Synode where any Benefice is vacant or Pastorship voyd in all England VVhat the Synode what the Congregation hath to doe therein VVhether this be the right electing and ordeyning grounded on the word of God practized in the Church 200. yeeres after Christ. VVhether the right of Patrones presentations be prophane and preiudiciall VVhether the Bishops giuing of orders bee presumptuous and full of absurdities and of the 4. absurdities and presumptions whereof they challenge it
once excommunicated there is no remedie but he must trudge to the Chauncelor or Officiall for absolution Neither doth his absolution coÌ„sist as they to make it odious and contemptible scoffe out the matter in absoluing his purse of a fewe groates It was meruel they raysed it not from fewe to many groates and yet good reason if he be able that he should smart so farre euen by the purse also as to satisfâ—e the duetie of the fees that are by lawe appoynted to the officers But this is most vntrue that his absolution and releasing from the bonde of excommunication that in mockerie they call the giuing him his blessing which terme they might as well vse if it had bene the action of their whole Seniorie is the absoluing of the purse or consisteth on paying of money Whereas indeede he was neither excommunicated nor is absolued for money but as he was excommunicated for the encreasement of his fault with disobedient contumacie and contempt for the which lesser sinnes deserue this correction as our Bretheren pag. 39. confesse so is he released of the same and restored to his state vpon his humble and penitent submission and serious request Yea if the case so require vpon his publike acknowledgement and declaration of his hartie repentaunce with some demonstrances and notes of humblie susteyning open rebuke and shame in the face of all the congregation With what conscience now can our Bretheren agaynst their owne knowledge in things so manifest knitte vp this matter saying and this is the Image of our little particular Synod and is this the Image also of our great faithfull Bretherens little faithfull and syncere dealing Our generall conuocations hauing a more shewe of good order but in effect little better For first they are stuffed full of Popish prophane Chauncellors and other Lawyers which being meere lay men and vnlearned in diuinitie by their owne law ought to be no members of the Synode and yet these will beare the greatest sway in all things The Bishops as though they were greater than the Apostles must haue their seuerall conuenticle whereas the Apostles and Elders came together with the whole multitude Acts. 15. and as they are seuered in place so will they be higher in authoritie So that whatsoeuer is decreed among them that must be called the determination of the whole Synode So that no man must be suffered to speake any thing agaynst it be it neuer so reasonable or agreeable to the word of God yea whosoeuer will not subscribe to all such things as they decree must be excluded out of the conuocation as was practised and threatned in the conuocation at the foresayd Parliament vnto diuers godly and learned Preachers that offered to speake agaynst diuers grosse and palpable errors that had escaped the Bishops decrees As for the distinctions of Canonical and Apocryphall bookes for explication of the clause in the article of predestination where it is sayd that the elect may fall from grace and such like matters If this be not to practise Lordship ouer our faith to set downe decrees of Religion which must be accepted of all men without either reason or testimonie of the Scripture to proue them and no man permitted to shewe any reason or Scriptures that inforceth his conscience to the contrary but onely to hang vpon the authoritie of Bishops let some other declare what Paule meaneth 2. Cor. 1.4 where he denyeth that hee would exercise any Lordshippe ouer the faith of the Corinthians For although their decrees were neuer so perfect yet it were an example of Tyrannicall dominion neither to giue reasons to satisfie the ignoraunt themselues nor to heare or confute that which might bee alleadged agaynst them by others but for a fewe Lordbishops in comparison of all the Conuocation to sit by themselues and order all thinges at their pleasures as though the Gospell sprang first from them or had come vnto them onely if sauoureth nothing so much as of Popish tyrannie whereas otherwise it is well knowne they are not all of the best learned nor all of the longest studie nor all of the soundest iudgement nor all of greatest zeale nor all of best example and therefore not meetest to be the onely determiners in Ecclesiasticall matters to the preiudice of the whole Synode Wherefore it is greatly to bee desired that our Synodes also which are so farre out of order may bee refourmed according to the Scripture and the example of the Primitiue Church that all thinges maye bee done with such modestie grauitie and iudgement as they were by the Apostles and Elders Acts. 15. From our little or particular Synods our Bretheren come now to our generall conuocations of which they yet confesse that both they haue a more shewe of good order and are in effect though little yet somewhat better And here to prooue this little better they say For first they are stuffed full of Popish and prophane Chauncellors and other Lawyers Is this their little better good order in effect that they spake of If this were true it is much worse than before they made the little Synodes to bee Before we had but trifles here is worse stuffe if the conuocations are stuffed full of Popish and prophane Chauncellors and other Lawyers And if they bee stuffed with them then belike there is some store of them But can they name and prooue any such Chauncellors or Lawyers as bee admitted to bee members of the Synode to bee popish and prophane If they can it had bene very well none that at such tymes as the Conuocations were holden they had by these our Bretherens intimation bene detected and examined that if they had bene so conuinced they might haue bene auoyded remoued or punished If they can name none nor prooue any to be such persons then is this too prophane too vncharitable too vnprotestant-like a sclaunder and the more at randon that these foule speeches are thus cast foorth so much the worse and more suspicious Or is the very name and office of Chauncellor or Lawyer accounted of them to bee prophane and popish Or doe they meane it of Chauncellors onely and not ioyntly of Lawyers And are all Chauncellors then popish and prophane These speeches sauing our Bretherens reuerence are not onely rasâ— but daungerous agaynst many worshipfull and right honorable personages that haue the name and office of Chauncellors and are yet neither prophane nor popish but godly sincere religious and very great fauourers of the Gospel As for our Conuocations are so little stuffed full of Chauncellors or Lawyers that wee haue there very fewe of them And if wee haue some of them for their counsell and experience in the lawe I thinke it no such matter of offence but rather expedient they being such as are knowne to be of sound Religion and not popish or infected with any other knowne errour and not prophane but vertuous and holie in life
they renounce they vaunt of long studie in which they could not for shame make any comparison therfore they flie to the example of yong Elihu to the reuelatiō of gods spirite as though their learning and these platformes came by reuelation to thē on a sudden and doe they now vpon the smattering of a little learning or for the small time beit of their earnest studie come in as it were vying withall the B. making exception of none but obiect to them all that they are not all of the best learned nor all of longest studie But what néede long study for greate or best learning among them when their gouerning Elders in euery congregatiō shal go for men learned in diuinity that haue little leasure to studie long or perhaps at all and euery Pastor holden for a learned diuine andfor a learned Preacher although he were but new made a Pastor And as for sound iudgement they measure that after their own iudgement and conceite esteéeming euery mans iudgement albeit he be of neuer so long studie or greate learning to bee no sounde iudgement if it sounde not soundlie in their forestalled Iudgement As also their ouer great preposterous zeale condemneth all the Bishops and all vs their bretheren in the Gospell of Christ to be but Popish and without all zeale if wée yeilde not straight way to them in all the deuises of these newe platformes And no maruell then if the shoue in this among the residue that the Bishops be not all of the best example Would God both they and wee and all our bretheren were if not of best yet of better example than wee be For to say the truth the better of both yea the best of vs all therein may be amended Neuerthelesse though it be an offence vnto the weake and a steyne vnto the authoritie yet not so but that the authoritie it selfe is good and maye stand euen in those persons that are not all of best example no nor all of the greatest zeale nor all of soundest iudgement nor all of longest studie nor all of the best learned neither but if the Bishops were in these thinges inferiour to some other or to them or any of them haue any defecte therein yet ought not out bretheren thus to insult vpon them being their fathers that made them Ministers of the Gospell and hauing authority ouer them in the Church were it but for the reuerence and dignitie of their authoritie except indeede they were open enemies to the Faith or manifest wicked in the example of their conuersation It should better me thinkes beseemeour brethren to followe the shame fastnesse of Sem and Iapheth than the shamelessenesse of Cham in deriding and reuealing his fathers shame But what do I speaking this of those Children that are growne into such disdaine that they will not acknowledge them to be their Fathers If they saye that in these words they do not thus accuse them all in saying they are not all of the best learned nor all of the longest studie nor all of soundest iudgement nor all of greatest zeale nor all of best example What then do they meane by these so intricate speeches bicause they still place this word all so cunningly in the middle that as it may be called in question whether they referred it to these matters as when we saie a thing is not all of the best that is to say it is but meane or base not all of the soundest that is to saye rotten or corrupted not all of the longest that is but short not al of the greatest that is but little or els that they referre the worde all not to the matter but to the persons as they are not all of the best that is to saye some of them are not of the best and so for the residue of these qualities In which later sence if they shall meane it that though they bee not all of thē of the best learned yet some of thē are of the best learned of the lōgest studie of the soundest iudgement of the greatest zeale and of the best example as it is apparant they cannot for very shame denye these things or the most of them in some of our Bishoppes why then doe they not follow those fewer some than thus for some not so good in these things to shake off all And yet it is well knowne also that there are many other God be praysed besides the Bishops that may compare with any of these our Bretheren the learned discoursers in any yea in all these things But their quarrell is here pretended onely or chiefly at the Bishoppes concluding agaynst them vpon these premisses And therefore not meete to be the onely determiners in Ecclesiasticall matters to the preiudice of the whole Synode This conclusion wee may safely admit were the Bishops neuer so excellent It is not meete neither doe they nor can they take this vpon them which were indeede to the preiudice of the whole Synode Nor the Synod receiueth this preiudice by them nor giueth such authoritie to them to be the onely determiners in Ecclesiasticall matters For euery one that is any particular member of the whole Synode hath both his deliberatiue and determinatiue voyce except wee shall speake of such determination as recollecting all their seuerall determinations pronounceth publikely the sententiall and finall determination of the matters in the name and authoritie of them all as Iames did being Bishop of Ierusalem And yet neither so all the Bishops doe it but one and the chiefest among them as the full resolution of the whole Synode But how will our Bretheren cléere themselues of this whereof they accuse our Bishoppes for they pretending to be Pastors and that Pastors and Bishops be but al one they will then be Bishops euery one that pretendeth to be a Pastor Now though these Bishops admit their gouerning Elders to come to the Synode and to be parts also of the Synode with the Pastors saying that the Synode consisteth principally of Pastors Elders Teachers and men of wisedome iudgement and grauitie as it were of necessarie regents pag. 113. And hereto they vrge the assemblie Act. 15. the Apostles and Elders came together to consider vpon this matter c yet when they come to the determination euen where they say pag. 117. the Synode hath to determine what shal be obserued in particular charges as of the tyme place and forme of preaching and praying and administring of the Sacraments they so make themselues to bee the onely determiners in all Ecclesiasticall matters that disoayning any other should so much as knowe them they say For who should bee able to knowe what order comelinesse and edification requireth according to Gods word but they that be teachers and preachers of the same vnto all others for it is absurde that they should bee taught by such in these small things as ought to learne the trueth of them in all matters Doe
ringing at burials Caluine prescribeth an exhortation or sermon at funeralâ— Protestantâ— bookes of funerall sermons Zanchius of the buriall of the dead Singing Psalmes at burials A sermon after the buriall The learned disc pag. 75. 76. Hote contentions Bridges Hoâ— vnexcusable they are that contend for small trifles How farrâ— thinges indifferent being authorized are to be contended for Not the defendants but oppugners the raisers of these hote contentions Humane constitutions The vnexcusablenes of our Brethr. in withdrawing altogether of themselues from the ministerie of the word for these constitutions Whether our humane constitutioÌ„s be such as our Brethr. can not receaue with reteyning their functions ControlmeÌ„t of the churches conclusions The learned disc Pag. 76. Bridges what things a true Pastor must obserue and not control Our Brethr. their selues and their iudgement priuate Contâ—mpt of the churches conclusions lawfull authoritie The power of order iurisdiction The learned disc Pag. 76. 1. Cor. 12.28 1. Pet. 5.3 Luke 23.26 2. Cor. 1.14 Bridges The Pastors authoritie in common gouernemeÌ„t with the Elders How our Brethren beginning to include the Elders in the power of binding and loosing do exclude theÌ„â—rom it The Pastors auth in common What that power of gouernment was whereof S. Paule speaketh Cor. 12.28 Aretius in 1. Cor. 12. Elders gouerning till publike Magistrates came Politicall Gouernors Caluine in 1. Cor. 12. Gualter in 1. Cor. 12. No neede of such gouernors in these daies The gifs of powers The abuse of the popish What was the gifts of powers and who had it Elias Elizeas Peter Paule Iurisdiction Why there was need of these offices then not nowe The friuolous imitation of the primitiue Church in the erecting vp of their senate Our brethr confusion by their elder enter-comming in the Pâ—stors iurisdiction Dominion and Lordship Our brethr disagreemeÌ„t about the pastors iurisdiction The learned Dis. Pag. 77. vsurped authority Bridges The learned disc pag. 78. Bridges No such authority nor steps therof except in these new deuises The learned Dis. Pag. 78. Iohn 3.27 Heb. 5.4 Phil. 2.6 Bridges Mastershop The learned disc pag. 79. 80. Luke 22.26 Math. 20.25 Mar. 10.42 Math. 23.8 Bridges Luke 22 â—â— Math. 32.8 All mastership not forbidden in the ministery nor the title therof Vsurped authority The learned disc Pag. 80. Bridges Our breth good caueat against theÌ„selues The learned disc pag. 80. 81. Tyrannizing Bridges Gods word the rule of our faith life Gods word hath not set down an only forme of the Churches gouernment The Princes gouernmeÌ„t of the Churche of God How the authority is not separate from other Separate authority S. Pauls example of the mysticall body compared to the naturall The respects of the community and seperation 1. Cor. 11.34 Our bre reason from Christ debaâ—reth Apostles and all from anie separate authouritie Timothies authoritie giuen him separate to himselfe both in teaching and gouerning Timothies separatâ— authority Hemingius in 1. Tim. 5. Aretius in 1. Tim. 5. The rule giuen to Timothie is generall to all present gouernours and Bishops Beâ—â—ain 1. Tim. 5. A Iudges office By Priest or Elder he meaneth Doctor or Teacher This authoritie was separate vnto Timothie Aretius How the Bishoppe shoulde doe these things The office of a Iudge A Iudges office is an office separate from all the bench Beza restrayning the Bishops authoritie The electioÌ„ of Matthias Act. 14 Erasmus Caluine Beza The wordes of the text mâ—ncâ—oÌ„ not election Election The worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 referred onelie to Paule and Barnabas Paul Barnabas moderaâ—ors of the election The peoples election no necessary or anie materiall part of making pastors Imposition of hands The imposition of hands of the presbiterie Imposition of hands pertained to pastors Separate authoritie The separat authoritie of one in imposition of hands Caluinus in 1. Tim. 5. Sole absolute authoritie The Bishops authority in set out by the authoriritie of Timothie Hemingius Aretius Politicall regiment The learned disc Pag. 81. Math. 18.19 Bridges The wreasting of Christs sentence Mat. 18. The difference of the Churches consent and of the Bishops and Pastors The senteÌ„ce of Christ Mat. 18.19 more confirmeth our consents thaÌ„ our breth Ioint authoritie The learned Dis. Pag. 81. 82. Bridges The confusion of our bre equality Christes promise The learned disc pag. 82 Math. 18.19.20 Bridges This senteÌ„ce is principally spoken of consent in prayer not is any debâ—â— to the prayer of one alone Our brethr loose conclusion How Christ promised his authority All particuler churches not alike indignity The Churches autority Difference betwene â—he Churches authority and thâ— pastors authority in the Churches The learned Dis. Pag. 82. Bridges Al the parts in one church haue not one and like auth The learned Dis. Pag. 82. 83. Bridges The Pastors authority not one but indifferent Sufficient authority Bridges Our Breth diuision positions besides the scripture Diffused authoritie The learned Dis. Pag. 83. Bridges Our Brethr. beginning to examine their former positions Diffused authoritie The learned disc Pag. 83. Bridges The learned disc pag. 83. Bridges Confusion in the multâ—tudes iudgment How oâ—r Brethren mocke the multitude What offices are appointed in Gods word for gouernment The multitudes confusion Oâ—r Brethr. too bolde presupposals The learned disc Pag. 84. Bridges Seueral offices and yet not seuerall officers Rom. 12. Diuers gifts and offices in one officer The Gouernours This place also 1. Cor. 12. sheweth not whether one might not haue â—o thaÌ„ one of these giftes The Apostle includeth the gouernors in the other officers The learned disc Pag. 84. Bridges Our Brethr. bolde conclusion for their Segnorie vpon the Apostles only naming of Gouernors The ouerthrow of all Princes gouernement Both Bish. and Pastors gouernmeÌ„t excluded Moderating the gouernors How violent the beginning is of this Segnorie The learned disc pag. 84 Bridges The learned disc Pag. 84. Bridges Our Brethr. manner of moderating thâ—ir Segn auth Electing the gouernors How the whole congregation shall choose the Elders The wisdom and godlinesse of the greater part The horrible confusion of the whole congregationâ— dealing here in Gouernors The learned disc pag. 85. 86. Act. 4 23. 1. Tim. 5.17 Act. 14.23 Bridges Our Brethr. to prooue what ought to be tell vs what may be Our Brethr. argument for their gouernors The Elders Act. 14. Our Brethr. own prowes that that place Act. 14. is vnderstoode of gouernors that are Pastors What gouernors those Elders were that medled nothing with the word Acts. 14. WhoÌ„ Calu. vnderstands for Elders Act. 14. The Ciuil officers had not imposition of the Ministers hands The Elders 1. Tim. 5.17 1. Tim. 5.17 Where the name of eldersis common to pastors and gouernors both at once The name of Elders taken generally for gouernors The learned disc pag. 85 Elders Magistrates Bridges We are not bound to learne our Brethr. collections The first thing that our Brethr. say we learn hereon
what nuÌ„ber they were why those Elders had that number The preceps the prâ—ctise of this Seniory The Leuites with their offices The matters wherin the Elders gouernors dealt * Leuirationis The vniuersall assembly of the Tribes and families Iosues orders for all these Elders * Expeditionem The proces of the story Iud. 19.20 The necessity of a king or one cheefe Gouernour The beginning of these elders corruption The Elders flattery of the people The Concion of the elders Our Brethr. defacing the state of a king Carolus Sigonius de rep Haebrae orum lib. 6. Cap. 2. The Iewes Councels Three â—â—ateâ— of the Iewes then 3. kinds of Conciouâ— Sigonius of the Iewes Senates Three kinds of the Iewes Senates Our Br. will be Seniors of the highest sort The Elders in the time of the kings The Elders since the captiui tie Sigonius The Kinges authority besides the Senate Cap. 5. The Synedrion at Ierusalem Cap. 6. What elders the Iudges of the cities were What princes the Elders were inferior to the SynedrioÌ„ Elders The Elders in the time of Iosaphat These Elderships restored after the captiuitie FroÌ„ whence the Synedrian Elders wer chosen Petrus Galatinus of the processe in the courtes of iudgment Petrus Galaâ—tnus collection of the Thalmudists concerning the Sanedrin * occidere The authoritie of the Synedrian Elders The Elders chosen with imposition of hands The power of the Sanedrin diminished in Christes time They lost their place dignitie after their fals iudging of Christ. The Romanes destruction of these Elders Gods ordinaunce Deut. 17. of these Elders power in iudgement Iosephus Iosephus li. 2. ad Appionem Philo. li. 3. de vita Mosis What manner of persons the Elders were in the Sanedrin The power of the preests in the Sanedrin The order and processe in the Sanedrin The appealants accusation The foâ—me of the accusation in Ieremy and of his acquitall The formâ— of the Synedrion in coÌ„demning Christ. Bertramsâ— confirmation of these thinges â—ert de politia Iudaica ca. 10. pag. 56 The Leuites were the gouernors in the Iewes Senats The matters that the Leuiâ—es iudged Bertram 1. Chro. 26.29 How Dauid distributed the gouernments and bounds of the Leuites Seniories Solomon maintained herein Dauids orders Iosaphats restoring â—he Iewes Seniories 2. Chro. 19. * Ad Liâ—â—m The Synedrion The diuerâ— respect of Eccl. ciuil in one and the same cause The great principality of these Elders Ierem. 2. Ieremie acquitted by those Elders Bertrams 2. example of those Elders power Ierem. 36. Bertrams 3. example Ier. 37. 38. The Elders superiour to the king The state of the tenne tribes The state of the Iewes regiment after the captiuity The speciall time of the Elders gouernment The auth of Nehemias Iosephus antiq Iud. li. 7 cap. The high Bishops authoritie 1. Mach. 12.6 The mixt estate of the Iewes common weale Gabinius erecting of mo Synedrins The SynedrioÌ„ Elders slain by Herod Our Br. assertioÌ„ of the Iewes Synedrion alters al the states in Christendome and bindes vs to the IuÌ„diciall Lawe Our Br. pretence vnder the name of eccl regiment driue at the ciuill regiment Chytreus of the Synedrion When all is done our Br. Elders that are goueâ—nors and notteachers are here also excluded except they will bee Princes Beza in confess Christ. cap. 5. Art 32. Danaetus in Iâ—ag Christ. 3. part cap. 10 Danaeus Confession for the difference of the Iewes SynedrioÌ„ our Presbyteries for gouernmeÌ„t of ciuil causes Chytraeus in Deut. 17. titulo de Iudicijs Three kindes of iudgements among the Iewes The iâ—dgemeÌ„t Triumuiral of thâ— 3. Elders The little Synedrion of 23. The great Synedrion of 70. Chytreus resemblance of the chief Senate in Germanie to the Sanedâ—in The elders of the new Testament How moderatelie Chytreus alludeth on Christes words Mat. 5. to our Senates Our Breth peremptory wresting of Christes words The learned disc pag. 88. Bridges The vse of the name Elder Christe alluded not to the Iews Sanedrin or Presbytery mencioned in the newe Testament By the name Church is not meant Senate Caluinus in 1. Tim. 4.14 Bezaes testimonie that by those elders were meant onely the Ministers of the word Our Br. coÌ„clusion of these Elders Bezaes nip of Castalion for the terme Senate The Presbyteries of the Iewes Luc. 22. Act. 20. Our Brethr. chiefe euidence for their Eldership howe weake it is The power of the keies The learned Dis. Bridges The sentences of christ Mat. 18. ver 19. and 20. not to be restrained to a Consistorie Brentius on Math. 18. Brentiuâ— in Math. 18. How these words Die ecclesiae haue ben abused A small assemblie wâ—ting a ciuile Magistrate The occasioÌ„ of Christes sentence That this rule of Chr. serueth onlie among priuate meÌ„ This senteÌ„ce cannot be vnderstood of hainous sinnes Brentius The Incestuous Corinthian The last remedy is to tell the ordinary magistrate and not to constitute an Eccl. Senate Excommunication A priuate Ecclesiasticall excommunication To whome the proper Eccl. exc doth pertaine Two kindes of Exc. ciuiâ— and Eccl. Cal in Mat. 18. The ministery of the powre of the worde pertaineth to the Minister in the expounding the worde Cal. in Mat. 18. The Minist are publishers of Gods word and setters foorth of his iudgementes How the froward are punished the repentaÌ„t receiued by them that haue the word of God Aretius 2. parte problem Tit. de Excom Ciuil and Eccl. Exc. Syntagma Tit. de clauibus The definition of the Eccl. binding The definition of the Eccl. absoluing The censure of Exc. renued by Christ. Mat. 16. Iohn 20. Tertul. In Apolog. cont Gent. cap. 39. Ext. in the Eccl. history Wherein Victors exc was reprooued What Exc. by Victor was allowed Eusebius li. 6. cap. 25. The Exc. of Philip the Emperour Theodosius of Excom Theodoreâ—us li. 5. cap. 17. Cyprianus vt supâ—a Iunii ecclesiasticus cap. 3. Hierom. in Math. 16. August of excom Aug. ad Auxilium epistola 75. Math. 16. Exech 18. S. Aug. erâ—or in the Infants dying without baptisme Iames. 1. What S. Aug. dissaloweth in this B Exc. Chrysost. Homil. 2. de Dauide Saule How Chrysost woulde Excom the contemners of the word Chrysost. of Excom Chrysost. in Homil. 70. homil 4. in Hebr. 2. The Praesidents and Elders of whome Chrysost. speaketh Chrysost. â—hreat againe to Excom Matst 18. The B. seperate authoritie in excom The excommunicator such a person as may teach Melancthon Kemnitius in exam Trident. Conâ— To. cap. 6. Melanct. in locis com de regno Christi Melanct. in aâ—not locorum com The Churches power of order Iurisdiction The poweâ— of order The poweâ— of Iurisd Aretius Aretius in locis com parte 2. de excomm The definition of excommunicâ—tion The Minister is the excommunicator and the Church consenteth Cyprianus The Eccl. Senate of Gouernors not teachers reiected The example of Saint Paul 1. Coâ— 5. Cyprian epist. li. 3. epist. 16. 2. Co. 11.29 1. Co. 12 2â— Aretius