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A77397 Anabaptism, the true fountaine of Independency, Brownisme, [double brace] Antinomy, Familisme, and the most of the other errours, which for the time doe trouble the Church of England, unsealed. Also the questions of pædobaptisme and dipping handled from Scripture. In a second part of the Disswasive from the errors of the time. / By Robert Baillie minister at Glasgow. Baillie, Robert, 1599-1662.; Baillie, Robert, 1599-1662. Dissuasive from the errours of the time. 1647 (1647) Wing B452A; Thomason E369_9; ESTC R38567 187,930 235

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indeed I have for had I thought that the Parliament had had no rule but their own will to have walked by I should never have drawn my sword for them and for my part I know no difference betwixt Tyranny and such proceedings Ib. p. 3. Since the first of May last I have by authority from the House of Commons been three times imprisoned before ever I knew mine accuser or my accusation or ever was suffered to speak one word in mine own defence Ib. p. 14. Hear O heavens and give ear O earth and thou righteous God that lovest Justice and judgement and hatest and abhorrest oppression and cruelty which makest wise men mad put forth thy hand and do justice thy self upon the unjust and unrighteous Judges of this age whom the people have set up for their good namely to preserve their lives liberties and estates as their faithfull Stewards and servants and yet destroy what they would seem to maintain p. 17. Amongst those that would be thought their friends they are rob'd plundered spoiled opprest undone and destroyed by all sides and no remedy left for redresse but the little ones to be eaten up of the great ones in every place which makes poor mens lives a burden to them that they are ready to wish themselves back again in Egypt in their bondage and rather to have one Tyrant then many Alarum p. 11. These deceivable snares leading to worse then Egyptian slavery wherein we our poor infants on their mothers breasts others who know not the right hand from the left yea and our whole posterity are most pitifully catched and involved even as Gods own particular people the Jews were in the days of Haman except there come such a happy and speedy remedy as it pleased him in mercy then to send beyond the expectation of man IIII Gangren second Part p. 117. They teach that the people of God are a free people and what they do they should do freely and voluntarily and not to be assessed and rated by the Parliament compelled to pay rate upon rate assessement upon assessement KKKK Gangren second Part p. 122. It was laid to M. Oats charge then that he had preached against the assessements of Parliament and the taxes laid upon the people teaching them that the Saints were a free people and should do what they did voluntarily and not be compelled but now contrary to this they had assessement upon assessement and rate upon rate LLLL Remonstrance p. 1. Calling those their Commissioners in Parliament to an account how they have discharged their duties to the universality of the people their Soveraign Lord from whom their power and strength is derived and by whom ad bene placitum it is continued MMMM Ib. p. 3. We are your principals and you our agents to preserve the splendor and glory of that underived Majesty and Kingship that inherently resides in the people or the State universall the representation or derivation of which is formally and legally in the State elect or representative and none else whose actions ought all to tend to that end against encroachments usurpations and violences of all its creatures officers and Ministers in the number of which are Kings themselves from whom for whom they have all their power and authority as the execution of their will and minde for their good and benefit to whom they are acountable for the faithfull discharge of that trust reposed in them NNNN Birthright p. 32 33. Whether is it not agreeable to Law justice equity and conscience that there should be a Parliament once every year and more often if need require that seeing this present Parliament by reason of the extraordinary necessities of the Kingdom have sate four years many of the Members betrayed their trust and those that remain ingrosse Law-making and also Law-executing into their own hands contrary both to reason and to the meaning of the Law by which manifest abusing negligent and not true using the Laws oppressions mischiefs and grievances are no lesse if not far more increased then they were before the Parliament began many times by the powerfull interest of a faction in the Parliament to save some one two or three of their Members undeserving credits they so violate the known unrepealed and declared Law of the Land yea and their own Votes Ordinances Declarations Protestations as if they had never made them I say all these things considered ought not the free men of England not only to choose new Members where they are wanting once every year but also to renew and enquire once a year after the carriage and behaviour of those they have chosen OOOO Vide supra NNN PPPP Remonst p. 20. Nor do we value a Trienniall Parl. before 3 years come to an end grievances mischiefs may be past remedy QQQQ Birthright p. 30. We have just cause to fear they will set up an interest of their own destructive to the common freedom so make this present Parl. an everlasting Parl. the War a never dying War seeing it tends so much to the enriching of Parliament men their Officers RRRR Vide supra also Conscience cautioned p. 12. If neither Law nor Lords will allow the people to be saved then may they not be saved any way and both Laws and Lords fall before their Soveraign the people as Dagon did before the Ark rather then the people perish Birthright p. 32. I have heard it reported that self-denying Cromwel was about a design of getting a Committee set apart an order made published to the whole Kingdom that if any man were unjustly oppressed by any Member of Parl. Committee-man or any other Officers or Ministers let him bring his complaint he shall have a just and fair hearing and justice done not in words but in acti●ns upon the transgressor Interest p. 10. We know it is not Gods way to have respect of persons in judgment and that the doing thereof has frequently lost Gods favour and made States miserable Englands lame●table slavery p. 6. What became of that common and thredbare doctrine that Kings were accountable only to God what good effects did it produce No they are but corrupt and dangerous flatterers that maintain any such fond opinions concerning either Kings or Parliaments SSSS The Conqueror rob'd England of Edward the Confessors Laws and in stead of them set up the Dictates of his own will whose Norman rules practises to this day yet remain in the administrations of the Common-Law at Westminster Hall By reason of their tediousnesse ambiguities uncertainties the entries in Latin as bad as the French because it is not our own tongue their forcing men to plead by Lawyers and not permitting themselves to plead their own cause their compelling of persons to come from all places of the Kingdome to seek for justice at Westminster which is such an iron Norman yoke with fangs teeth in it that if we were free in every particular else
that circumcision did primarily seal the temporall promise and signified sanctification but secondarily I know the Anabaptists in Germany shame not to say that the Covenant made with Abraham was a meer carnall thing and had nothing to do with eternall life as for the expression of learned Cameron if by primarily he meaned immediately that it sealed these things first in order as they were types of spirituall things it may then passe cum grano salis but if by primarily he intended principally that circumcision did chiefly seal earthly blessings the opinion is too unsavoury to be received BB M. Marshals Defence 245. For my own part I seriously professe that supposing infant Baptism a nullity I cannot understand how any in the world should this day be lawfully baptized unlesse it can be made good that a person unbaptized himself may be a lawfull Minister of baptism to others Tombs Apology p. 54. That none be admitted to the Lords Supper till he be rightly baptized I professe is to be stood upon in point of prudence for right order yet if it be stood upon in point of conscience so as in no case the contrary is to be permitted it will of necessity make many superstitious perplexities for besides that it may be doubted whether all the Apostles were baptized who yet were admitted to the Lords Supper by Christ himself when Constantine the Great and others did deferre their Baptism so long it is not likely they never received the Lords Supper before their Baptisme CC Tombs Apology p. 31. I do count the story of the Anabaptists to contain in it many things the true reasons of which and the true knowledge of the circumstances concerning them will not appear till the day of the revelation of the righteous judgement of God DD Ibid. p. 32. How farre the Anabaptists sought reformation I cannot tell it is plain that Carolostadius and Pelargus and some say Melancthon would have reformed it in Saxony had not Luthers pertinacy in that as well as Consubstantiation and Images withstood it and Baltazar Hubmer sought it at Zurick and was denied it is known I think the reformed Churches have been to blame and so may be our present reformers that they have never yeelded to reform it in a regular way EE Ibid. p. 106. M. Marshals Book it appears was contrived by divers I believe the ablest of the Assembly I wish it were declared whether the paedobaptists would stick to that work or any other FF Ibid. p. 93. And though many magnifie the vertue and benefit of their juridicall excommunication yet the best intelligence I have makes me question whether it hath not b en rather an engine of much harm as being used rather against dissenters in opinion and opposers of profit then men openly vitious managers of that censure generally shewing themselves irreconciliable to them that dissent from them but favourable enough to vitious living GG Ibid. p. 57. I was told there was a very intelligent man that said he was sorry that I had M. Marshall for my Antagonist as knowing him to be apt to mistake which he conceived would be a vexation to me and indeed I finde his words true p. 69. I must confesse I finde M. Marshall still so confused a Disputer that I know not to what purpose his manner of writing in this point should tend but to puzzle his Reader and weary his respondent HH Ibid. p. 19. M. Marshall says that I vilifie M. Thomas Goodwin as a man who by spinning out similitudes and conjectures deceives his auditors I say still that I expected from M. Goodwin arguments but counted my self deluded with his conjectures finding nothing to his purpose in any of these Texts which were the main he alledged HH 2 Ibid. p. 3. I saw few or none regarded for clearing the truth but popular Orators such as relate to great men or are usefull to uphold a party are the men esteemed And p. 95. I may rather say that by my two Treatises there is such a wound given already to infant baptisme that however men may play the Mountebanks and skin it over it will never be cured at the bottom II Vide supra BB. KK Ibid. p. 10. I durst not justifie such a practise as to gather a separated Church LL Vide supra C. MM Vide supra BB. NN Tombs Apology p. 92. I doubt much how hence may be concluded any power of suspension from the Lords Supper for every emergent scandall so judged by a congregation or congregationall Presbytery OO Ibid. p 91. I have said that I doubted whether ever excommunication a sacris or the Presbyterian or the Independent Ecclesiasticall Government would be proved to be Jure Divino by Christs appointment and I doubt whether the power of the Keyes Matth. 16. be any other then doctrinall and whether Matth. 18. contain any other direction then about particular injuries betwixt brother and brother or Let him be to thee a Heathen and Publican be any other then shunning familiar converse PP Ibid. I confesse that I take it to be but a matter of prudence whether each congregation have its compleat power within it self or that it be ordered in some things by an Assembly of select persons out of divers congregations and whether congregations and Pastors be fixed or unfixed p. 93. I suppose in the manner of doing these things we have not certain precise direction from Gods word but that we are left free by God to order such things though pertaining to Christians as Christians by alterable rules of prudence QQ Ibid. p. 93. Nor doth the Church lose by having a Christian Magistrate if that jurisdiction be wanting sith I suppose it is better provided for by the constant care of a Christian Magistrate if conscientious in executing judgement if not such censures have been seldome executed with conscience or good effect RR M. Marshals Defence p. 73. Have not multitudes of our Anabaptists swallowed down all Arminianisme SS A Defence of the lawfulnesse of infants baptism in answer to M. Spilsberry VV M. Spilsberry peculiar interest of the elect in Christ and his saving grace XX Gangren first Part division second p. 23. M. Den exercises in Lambs Church the usuall theme that he is upon is Christs dying for all for Judas as well as Peter he often preaches this Doctrine as those who have heard him do report this is the everlasting Gospel to beleeve that Jesus Christ hath dyed for all men Turks Pagans and that all the sins of men committed against the morall Law were actually forgiven and pardoned when Jesus Christ shed his blood and none of them that ever men had committed or should were imputed to them but men were onely damned for not beleeving in Christ and for nothing else YY Ibid. p. 36. Oats who is a great Dipper and Preacher amongst them delivered in Bell-Alley in Colemanstreet not long ago that the Doctrine of Gods eternall election and predestination was a damnable Doctrine and