your pleasures without good warrant or ground and so may be reduced to cōformitie prescribed by superiours Your owne S. Thomas in his summe saith Q. 79. art 13. that conscience is no speciall facultie or power of the soule because it may bee laide away which the other cannot but bee that as it wil be A corrupt conscience such as yours is may and ought to bee laide away The reasons in your treatise as in place we finde deale little or nothing to proue the contrary to this I tell you or deale as you doe very hollowly being grounded altogether vpon supposition which not grounded on Gods truth in matters of Religion is a rotten post for conscience to leane vpon Trye your consciences in religion by right iudgemēt and good vnderstanding taken out of Gods booke runne not vpon false suppositions and we shalbe soone at an ende I still maruell M. Howlet how you can exempt your cōsciences from 〈◊〉 and so from her 〈◊〉 that before condemned these sentences as errours That the consciences of the faithfull are exempted from the power of all men that Chistians are fre and exempted from all Princes lawes as touching their consciences c. For you admit this exposition of the former sentence in saying that Caluin and Luther holde therein one doctrine whereof I haue spokē in his place The matter is that your Secondary faith and alleageance sworne vnto her Highnesse as to the sub stitute of God thus yee speake is at the Popes pleasure broken and nowe discharged of that faith by his warrant and the same bestowed vpon him and such as hee wyll appoint without good warrant from God or her Maiestie In the meane while we will take as graunted by you this Maxime or supposition That conscience dependeth of iudgement vnderstanding and not of affect will albeit in your case this wholy raignethin you therefore seemeth not be conscience But because pretended conscience is the grounde of these mens whole matter and the only shift of excuse that both M Howlet and his authour haue to cloke their disobedience withal let mee be bold with thee gentle Reader somewhat at large to vnfolde some parte of their Popish 〈◊〉 in this case of conscience which that I may the better doe I will first set downe some of both their wordes agreeing in this point together Then examining in generall the popish doctrine whereon they grounde themselues without all Scripture yea contrary to Scripture common reason and hon estie also as the same is deliuered vnto vs in their bookes by the principall 〈◊〉 of their religion I will shewe howe godlesly and howe hollowly they may be found to speake write and thinke in the whole enough in my opinion to bring their religion into vtter 〈◊〉 detestation and hatred for broching vs such abhominable abhominations Afterwarde God willing returning to M. Howlets wordes againe and comparing them with the doctrine of the Scripture will I so much as I shall thinke needefull answere the same particularly Thus writeth M. Howlet of this matter heere at large 12 Now because as the Philosopher saith that is onely good vnto euery man which ech mans vnderstanding tel leth him to be good vnto the which the Scripture and 〈◊〉 agree when they say that wee shall bee iudged at the last day according to the testimonie of our conscience 〈◊〉 followeth that what soeuer wee doe contrary to our iudgement and conscience is according to the Apostle damnable Because wee decerne it to bee euill and yet doe it So that howe good soeuer the action in it selfe were as for example if a Gentile shoulde for feare say or sweare that there were a Messias yet vnto the doer it should be a damnable sinne because it seemed naught in his iudgement and conscience and therefore to him it shall bee so accounted at the last day Which thing hath made all good men from time to time to stande very scrupulously in defence of their conscience and not to commit any thinge against the sentence and approbation of the same All Princes also Potentates of the woorlde haue abstained from the beginning for the very same consideration from enforcing men to Actes against their consciences especially in religion as the histories both before Christe and since doo declare And amongest the very Turkes at this day no man is compelled to doe any act of their religion except he renonuce first his owne And in the Indies and other farre partes of the worlde where infinite Infidels are vnder the gouernemente of Christian Princes it was neuer yet practised nor euer thought lawfull by the Catholike Churche that suche men shoulde bee inforced to any one acte of our religion And the reason is for that if the doing of such actes shoulde 〈◊〉 sinne vnto the doers because they doe them against their conscience then muste needes the inforcement of suche Actes be muche more greeuous and damnable sinne to the inforcers Mary notwithstanding this when a man hath receiued once the Christian Catholike religion and will by new deuises and singularitie corrupte the same by running out and makinge dissention in Christe his bodie as all Heretikes doe then for the conseruation of vnitie in the Church and sor restraint of this mans furye and pride the Churche hath alwayes from the beginning allowed that the Ciuill Magistrate shoulde recalle suche a fellowe by temporall punishment to the vnitie of the whole bodie againe as all the holy Fathers write to bee most necessarie especially suche as hadde most to doe with suche men as Cyprian Ierome Optatus Augustine Leo Gregorie and Bernarde And Saint Austin in diuers places recalleth backe againe his opinion whiche hee sometimes helde to the contrary So that wee keeping still our olde religion and hauing not gone out from the Protestantes but they from vs wee cannot bee enforced by any iustice to doe any acte of their religion HEnce yee gather y t because ye alleadge your conscience in this cause of yours Therfore neither may ye do there against vnder paine of damnatiō neither be enforced to doe otherwise then you doe vnder like paine to the enforcers and because yee sawe you shoulde be excepted vpon two wayes yee prouide answere for the same first If it bee alleadged against you as is by vs very truly alleadged that the thing yee are called vnto is godly honest and good and seemely to bee yeelded vnto and therefore no reason you shoulde in this case bee left to your pretended conscience to followe that whiche is euill but that you shoulde giue ouer and take a newe course Yee affirme howe good soeuer the action in it selfe bee whervnto yee are called yet the yeelding is damnable sinne to the doer because it seemeth naught in his iudgement and conscience and therefore to him it shall bee so accounted at the last day So he must bee left to his
with victorie the ambitious with honor the couetous with monie c. scripture diuines to agree with this hellike doctrine God forbidde Wee haue better Schoole maisters then so thankes bee to God Euery good giuing and euery perfect gift is from aboue and commeth downe from the Father of lyghts c. euen to this father of glory must we pray for this gyft of wisedome and reuelation through the knowledge of him that the eyes of our vnderstanding may bee lightened that wee may knowe what the hope is of his calling c. It is a seconde grace and gyfte that I may so speake aboue and beyonde nature and the lyght thereof or eche mans vnderstandyng Your Saint Thomas if you woulde haue consulted but with him would haue tolde you as muche Searche the Scriptures Are yee not therefore deceyued because ye knowe not the Scriptures c. sayth our Sauiour Christ heare him As all poyntes of Diuinitie and Religion woulde bee grounded on Gods booke and the Scriptures not vpon the Philosophers and Rhetorique so especially when there is question of conscience or of doing or not doing thereafter in matters of religion shoulde wee haue recourse vnto that heauenlye 〈◊〉 but yee say The Scripture and Diuines agree to this sentence of the Philosopher when they say That we shall bee iudged at the last day according to the testimonie our of conscience Make this sentence playner and expound it not by the first least both fall out to be very false very pernitious the better of the two make of it what you can is very perplexed darke and doubtfull at least as you set it downe and followe it This may be propounded in lecture among you by him that is your publike reader in the cases of conscience but wee haue seene to muche of your Schoole diuinitie and diuelishe doctrine in conscience to haunte your Romishe lectures or receiue that is therein taught and professed Our senses are better acquainted with the phrases of the Scriptures If this latter sentence be all one with the other and first cited out of Aristotle thē might you haue spared your Philosophers Rhetoricall sentence and rested vpon this whiche yee pretende to take out of the Scripture and Diuines The heauenly Scripture hath no neede of mans wisedome to bee vnderstood sayth one but 〈◊〉 y t reuelation of y t spirit but first I tel you I find not y t words ye set vs downe in those Scriptures whiche yee quote vs in the margin yee tell vs of beeing iudged at the last day according to the testimonie of our conscience yee sende vs to 2. Cor. 1. and to 1. Iohn 3. The Apostle in the place ye poynt vs speaketh more particularly of the testimony of a good conscience onely and of his owne that hee had in this worlde his wordes bee these Our reioycing is this the testimony of our conscience that in simplicitie and godly purenes not by fleshly wisedome but by the grace of God we haue had our conuersation in the worlde c. Marke here that Saint Paul had his conuersation in the worlde not directed by his owne vnderstanding As your Philosophical sentence pretendeth not by fleshly wisdome but by the grace of God in simplicitie and godly purenes The testimonie of suche a conscience is a goodly matter and to bee reioyced in in deede let it bee if you will a 〈◊〉 feast c. And this is the oddes here betweene a heathen and a Christian life yet doth not the Apostle in this place saye generally that wee shall bee iudged at the last day according to the testimonie of our conscience neither yet of him selfe sayth hee so muche speaking of the testimonie of his own conscience Though I deuy not but y t faithful being receiued 〈◊〉 by gods mercy ingraffed into Christ by faith shall haue matter of 〈◊〉 in a good conscience in wel doing euen at the last day But you carry it further The Apostle in another place speaking of his fidelitie in his Ministerie and of a better conscience still then you seeme hereto note sheweth yet a higher Iudge rather and more sharper of sight who will iudge him more thoroughly then according to his owne vnderstanding and conscience Nay as one that durste not iustifie him selfe though his conscience charged him with nothing in his function hee reiecteth that iudgement from himselfe and from all men also as vnfitte and vnsufficient vnto the Lorde himselfe who at his comming will lighten thinges that are hidde in darkenesse and make the counsailes of the hearts manifest The other place yee cite to shewe wee shall bee iudged at the last day according to our conscience is out of Saint Iohns Epistle where thus it is written I must ghesse because yee neyther set downe the wordes nor the verse For thereby that is by louing in deede and truth wee knowe that we are of the truth and shall before him assure our heartes For if our heart condemne vs God is greater then our heart and knoweth all things Beloued if our heart condemne vs not then haue wee boldnesse towarde GOD. Here the Apostle speaketh of that boldnesse and enterance with confidence that the faithfull here haue towardes God by Christ Iesus and by fayth in him of the benefite thereof whiche as by a certaine marke is expressed by true and vnfaygned loue and of the lacke of this full perswasion againe what a losse it is here is nothing spoken of our being iudged at the last day according to our conscience And this is all I finde of this matter in the places of Scripture here alleadged For the Diuines that ye talke of because yee quote vs Augustin alone for all sende vs to two places 〈◊〉 him and the matter is not great what is there saide I referre it to the learned Readers iudgment that is disposed to examine the places You report heere bring in Austin for proofe that wee shall bee iudged at the last day according to the testimonie of our conscience Where Austin speaketh not of the iudgement of the last day in neither of both the Chapters Consult therefore with them from whome ye tooke these places that they may appoint you fitter for the purpose or you better followe the simplicitie and sinceritie of the sacred Scriptures If yee say Austin name conscience or speake a worde thereof in both the Chapters I graunt you 〈◊〉 you must remember with all that euery thing may not be gathered of euery worde The two places much agree the first yee recite hath relatiō to the latter hee saith not that whiche you speake heere Againe speaking very briefly as for a conclusion of his first booke of Christian doctrine Of this sentence of S. Paul The end of the commaundement is loue out of a pure hearte and of a good conscience and of faith vnfained hee sheweth wherefore the Apostle put in that
clause of a good conscience which hee putteth for hope saith Austin Learne you also saith M. Howlet to adde this worde good to conscience ioyne it with faith and keepe that bonde or knot that the Apostle maketh in this sentence And so if you can apply it to your selfe yee shall not onely haue great matter of reioycing but her Maiestie and the lawes also I doubt not to beare with your conscience and to tender the same as reason and equitie woulde and besides because the same shalbe found to agree with Gods word to be grounded thereon wee shalbee as readie to auowe and allow therof as we now are to 〈◊〉 the same for y t it is so directly contrary to the worde and therefore neither for you to flatter your selues in nor meete for the State to allowe or beare withall Wee doubt nothing but that the testimonie of a good vpright conscience is of great waight and force and to be respected and hearkened vnto So that we remember still 〈◊〉 a pure heart therewith and an vnfained faith which must euer haue the light of Gods worde goe before or accompanie the fame in the faithfull that vnder the colour of conscience other persuation or the rule of reason deceiue vs not The 〈◊〉 of all is I would haue you know conscience a right and distinguish wel betweene a good and a naughtie conscience by the Scriptures For the accord or agreement betweene your two sentences one and the first taken out of Aristotles Rhethorike that is onely good vnto euery man which eche mans vnderstanding telleth him to be good The other as is supposed out of diuinitie that wee shall be iudged at the last day according to the testimonie of our conscience Make them you agree as you can I cannot see the agreement betweene them Vnderstanding is one thing and the testimonie of our cōscience is another thing good to euery man nowe and 〈◊〉 at the last day bee two Finally the two sentences as in wordes so in substance and meaning seeme vtterly to disagree I woulde therefore whereas you say the scriptures and diuines agree vnto the Philosophers saying you woulde or coulde haue made the Philosophers saying agree with the scriptures rather whiche though yee shall trauell as yee doe by enticing speache of mans wisedome to performe Yet all is but in vaine the thing will neuer come about Let Philosophie goe therefore and the Philosopher in testing the fountaine rule of good 〈◊〉 vs Christians Let Gods word and law or the holy Scriptures bee our rule there in alone according to that there is one rule and measure for one thing let reason in 〈◊〉 with your S. Thomas if ye will be the 〈◊〉 of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 actions let y t spirit of god be y t beginning of all good in vs that be 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and other Augustin a Diuine whome yee 〈◊〉 in this matter saith very well against your first sentence of Philosophie in this sentence of his Faith openeth the way to vnderstanding and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 it And againe as is alleadged in your owne decrees All the life of the vnfaithfull is sinne neither can it bee good that is doone without God for where there lacketh the knowledge of the enternall vnchangeable truth there is false vertue euen in the best behauiour and manners And concerning the phrases maner of speaking of Philosophers and diuines howe different they ought to bee thus saith Austin Philosophers speake with wordes at will and in matters very harde to vnderstande feare not the offence of religious eares but we that are Christians and 〈◊〉 haue a lawe to speake after a certaine rule least libertie of speech or wordes breede wicked opinion of those things which are signified thereby And thus muche concerning your two sentences and the agreement thereof wherevpon all the rest that followeth here of this matter seemeth to be grounded Of your propositions thus taken from Philosophers Diuines yee say it followeth that whatsoeuer wee doe contrary to our iudgement and conscience is according to the apostle damnable because wee decerne it to be euill and yet doe it But that which the Apostle heere saith for all your whatsoeuer false glose must bee vnderstood in those things which are lawfull saith your owne D. Thomas in y t very next sentence verse before y t last vpon these wordes which are y t groūd of that that followeth Blessed is hee that condemneth not himselfe in that he alloweth That moderation shoulde yee haue kept but yee doe not for yee say bee the action in it selfe neuer so good and the man that doth it neuer so bad as seemeth for you name vs a Gentile or Heathen man and to confesse there is messias yet because it seemed naught in his iudgement and conscience therefore to him shall it be accounted a damnable sinne at the last day Heereby it appeareth yee holde that at the last day the testimonie of a 〈◊〉 iudgement and naughtie conscience euen of an Heathen shalbe admitted to cleere him from euill and to condemne him for doing good or that any man shalbe damned at the day for acknowledging there is a Messias against his wicked iudgement and conscience at least will there not bee other matters sufficient and I nowe thinke you to condemne such men for but that such cases and causes as these vnwonted and vnmentioned in the Scriptures shoulde after they bee by your heades deuised and moued then also be alleadged This is prophane and vaine babbling and brawling which breedeth questions rather then godlye edifiyng which is by faith which thing the holy Apostle S. Paule so carefully warneth his schollers Timothie and Titus in many places to take heede of to auoide they may beseeme your scholding disputes your subttle schooles and readinges they beseeme not her maiesties eares they agree not with the diuinitie schooles of the holy Ghoste Did your testimonies of Scriptures and Diuines you set vs downe teathe you this or whence had you it shall wee be iudged at the last day according to the testimonie of our conscience be it good bee it bad must wee bee iudged by that onely Shall it bee now good and then good and so alwayes good to the Gentile to denie the Messias because his vnderstanding iudgemēt and conscience telleth it him to bee good c. This is a maruellous and strange Paradoxe the foundation building thereon are muche alike Is there no difference nor oddes Before I further examine the matter you tell vs Let mee a litle consider howe you handle the holy Scripture with your foule handes or our euill fauoured clawes and how vntowardly you alleadge your testimonies still because wee decerne it to bee euill and yet doe it Yee quote vs for it Rom. 14. though yee name no verse yet your words seeme to sende vs to the last verse of the Chapter which hangeth on the wordes before are a reason
rendered Yee cite the wordes falsely corrupt the sense Which that it may the better be perceiued I will set downe both your wordes and also the Apostles Thus you Whatsoeuer we doe contrary to our iudgement and conscience is according to the Apostle damnable because we decerne it to bee 〈◊〉 and yet doe it The Apostle thus He that doubteth if hee eate is condemned because he 〈◊〉 not of faith And whatsoeuer is not of faith is sinne The Apostle speaketh particularly and of a certaine matter whiche restraineth his note of vniuersalitie You generally without any restraint or obseruation of the circumstance of the text and matter treated of hee of a faythfull man and of fayth You giue vs an example of a Heathen man and talke at randome of our owne iudgement and conscience he speaketh of eating which is an outwarde action and of it selfe as they speake indifferent You in a far otherkind of things of their own nature good or euill We acknowledge in sum the holy Apostles words and sense we find not yours in the text ye sende vs too And it is an ill commentary that corrupteth the text The Apostle saith because not of faith Nowe because you haue set downe in steade thereof iudgement and conscience you foyst also into the text the woorde decerne Because wee decerne it to bee euill and yet doe it If you say you followe the Author of this your discourse with whom yet in citing this texte yee altogether agree not though yee both corrupt the same foully As of him I speake in his place so let me here tell you what opinion soeuer greater then reason you haue of your Maister wee are not bounde I tell you to followe neither him nor you in corrupting of the holy Scriptures yee both put in the worde decerne of your owne and yee put our iudgement conscience or knowledge for fayth which it seemeth ye take out of your Schoole mens Commentaries But I woulde you woulde not change the wordes of holy scripture into your Scholasticall wryters expositions and termes and set vs the same down for scripture stil Yf your parenthesis here according to the Apostle were thus according to our D. Thomas or Schoole Doctors c. or according to our notes taken at the Lecture in cases of conscience then might it paraduenture stande right but the Apostle and your D. Thomas or Schoole doctors c. not being one you take to muche vpon you and wee can giue you no such licentious libertie to vse the ones name for the other I see 〈◊〉 you driue It is a principle with you that Byrdes of one feather must flie and holde together Errour agreeth very well commonly with errour and falshood Your common translation of the Byble like as your Scholemen must bee kept and followed inuiolably not to be checkt nor corrected by the 〈◊〉 or Greeke text vnder paine of the Popes great curse hence belike you and your fellowe woulde seeme to take your woorde decerne But sir there is falshood in fellowshippe though your eyes M Howlet coulde not possibly discerne neyther by day nor by night euery letter sillable and therfore might easily be deceiued in taking one word for another y t were somewhat like yet y e Autor of your treatise mee thinketh might haue lookt better to y e matter if it had bin but for deceiuing of you herein many other y t follow him Where both of you haue it decerne euen your common translation if ye looke well on it hath discerne Now Gramarians y t shew y t etymology of words wil tel you y t discerne decerne be two wordes different in signification discerne is to put difference beetweene thinges decerne is a higher woorde of iudgement and authoritie whereof wee call A decree c. And your Pope decernimus statuimus c. They that leaue both your woorde of decerning or iudging deuised by your selues and discerning which the worde of your vulgar latine Translation in this last verse of the 14. chapter to the Romanes and translate it by the woorde of doubting as both in Latine and Englishe is done haue both better and 〈◊〉 rendred it and expressed by a fit woorde the meaning of the holy Ghost also Cauell not here at nor barke not at our translation for leauiug heere your vulgar and common translation he leaueth himselfe in another place and translateth this very worde as our men doe heere But dogges will barke euen at the Moone You must bee content to 〈◊〉 your owne lawe and to giue vs leaue to deale with you truly in that wherein you vntruely take to your selues libertie against vs you so prie into our translations and translating of the Scriptures that the least fault must be espied yea where there is none fault must bee imagined and deuised and we roundly taken vp and compared to a boy in a Grammer Schoole that shoulde bee brecht so yee speake and further and worse to whereof in his place Leaue your decerning iudging and discerning leaue for shame your corrupting of the holy Scriptures in woorde and sense leaue your caueling and carping at our translations of the Byble vse in all a better and more vpright conscience then hitherto For the matter of an action good in it selfe and the example yee bring vs in deuised of a Gentile that shoulde for feare say or sweare that there were a Messias it is altogether impertinent and besids the Apostles purpose who as I sayde treateth not in that place of things simply good or euyll or of bearing with a thing euill in it selfe and of the owne nature muche lesse with impietie or superstition he speaketh but of outwarde thinges hee speaketh not of Gentiles or Infidels nor yet of obstinate Christians that walke stubburnely vtterly condemning the profession of the Gospell but of a brother a faithfull man and one that hath receiued and embraced the profession of the Gospell and is weake through ignorance of some one point partaining to Christian libertie in the outwarde vse of Gods creatures wherin he is not yet thorowly instructed of bearing with such a one by those whom God hath called to more plentifull knowledge of his heauenly truth speaketh hee Againe the maner and the end of bearing must be considered which is not to nourish errour or to obstinate harden the weake in their opinion and doing but rather to drawe them by all meanes we may from errour and to aduance them more and more in the knowledge of the truth The Apostle calleth it beefore in this chapter edification when he biddeth vs followe the thinges which concerne peace and wherwith one may edifie another or as he speaketh in y e beginning of y e next chap. Let euery mā please his neighbour in that which is good to edificatiō Lastly the matters y e Apostle here speaketh of particularly would bee cōsidered which are not al outward things but such as God himselfe was
iudge and as many as thereafter and according thereunto list to iudge and as much say I of Schismatikes in Augustines wordes thus if you will whether we be Schismatiks or you neither I nor thou but let Christ be asked that hee may iudge or shewe his Church In the application of this to vs and our assemblies and to your men that haunt the same yee say The communion of the Church confisteth in three thinges that all christians haue one sacrifice one and the selfe same seruice of God There bee greater in warde spirituall thinges wherein the vnitie of the Church doth 〈◊〉 consist In the vnitie of the spirit one heart one minde loue peace consent in one Christian doctrine fayth c. But let vs see these that yee thought made for your purpose What is the sacrifice yee meane If it be that which Christ offered vpon the Crosse to his Father for the redemption of the worlde wee say it is common to all Christians all are partakers of it and we are directed thereunto contially both by doctrine and also by the vse of the Supper among vs. If you meane the Sacrifice of your blasphemous masse thē thank we God y t we are free frō it as frō a most abhominable blasphemie The giuing vp of our bodies A liuing Sacrifice holy acceptable vnto God c. The sacrifice of distributing and doing good the sacrifice of Praise and thankesgiuing c. These grounded on Gods word in vse among vs are belike no sacrifices we haue no sacrifice at al say you none w t you but your massing sacrifice as seemeth we are al made priests though to offer vp these spirituall sacrifices wherewith God is pleased You haue of your selues without all warrant of Gods worde erected a massing priesthood Keep it we bid you to your selues Of Sacraments we haue in deede but two Baptisme and the Lords Supper As those which Christ instituted and lefte in his Church we acknowledge not your number of seuen sacraments for that the word warranteth them not Those that Christ hath lefte the lesse they haue of your superstitions and ceremonies the more neerely they be administred according to Christes Institution the better is God pleased therewith the better are wee contented also Thus speaketh the holy Ghost of the benefite and of the vnitie represented and bestowed on the Church in our sacraments of Baptisme and the Lordes Supper In one Spirit are wee all baptised into one body and haue beene all made to drinke into one spirit And agayne we that are many are one breade and one bodie because we all are partakers of one breade therhood c. Let the reader cōpare your translation with Cyprians or M. Hardings translation if yee will to see your slight then considering all circumstances Let him iudge whether Cyprians time beare anie such orders and degrees as ye imagine to be aboue a Byshop in those times Thus writeth and speaketh Cyprian in the assembly of many byshops in those daies at Carthage in coūsel which is also repeated by Augustine None of vs appointeth him self to be a bishop of bishops or driueth his fellowes w t tyrannous feare to necessitie of obedience seeing euery Byshop according to his free libertie and power is at his own choyse as one that can not bee iudged of another as hee him selfe also can not iudge another But let vs all looke for the iudgement of our Lord Jesus Christ who one alone hath power both to place vs in the gouernement of his Church and to iudge also of our doyng Here is more plaine wordes for the equalitie of Byshoppes in those dayes and against that one Byshop shoulde bee iudge ouer all other Byshops then can be pickt out of the other place for an vniuersall or generall Pastour ouer all or thorough the worlde yea here is plainly shewed there was no one Bishop of Bishops or iudge ouer his fellowe Byshops in those dayes And that the Byshop of Rome was fellowe Byshop and Brother with therest and so reputed and called And let none cauill on that y t this Epistle was written to the Byshoppe of Rome and therfore these words by a prerogatiue are to be vnderstood of him when as Cyprian vseth the same testimonies to shewe the dignitie and authoritie of a Byshop in his owne respect and speaking of himselfe and sayth whence sprang and spring Schismes and 〈◊〉 but hence whilest the Byshop that is one and gouerneth the church is contemned by the proude presumption of certaine men and a man vouchsafed with honour of God is iudged of vnworthie men This Cyprian of himfelfe being Byshop of Carthage whome though Christians seemed then to name their Pope as is reported yet I thinke these men doe not nor will not accompt him general Pastour of all the world nor to haue such preeminence and prerogatiue as they chalenge to the Pope at this day heade of the Church c. For al this Rome must needes haue that alone he nor none els shall haue it It is not the worde of one Byshop wherewith Cyprian here calleth himself much lesse of one Priest as this Reasoners place reporteth that will enforce that he woulde gather or such iurisdiction and authoritie as he imagineth where findeth hee one generall Pastour ouer al the worlde not here sure Is not your general Pastours soueraintie y t you dreame of grounded on Peters supremacie whereof there is not one worde in all the scriptures and doth not this noble Martyre Saint Cyprian aboue thirteene hundred yeeres agoe say thus of the Apostles The rest were that that Peter was endewed with all honour and power and after him another Father speaking of the Byshops sayeth where euer they bee they are of one and the same merite or estimation and of the same Priesthod and Ministerie The whole brotherhood was that particular congregation where hee was Byshop of whom hee treateth were it the Bishop of Rome or any other Bishop For there is one Bishopricke a part whreof is throughly holden of euery one in particular saith Cyprian but let Cyprian and his place goe which is at large answered by other for them that list to see more Let this man if he will gaine his cause against vs reason soundely out of the scripturs and booke of God which he can not doe and that maketh him to seeke these outleapes But when all is sayde the best and surest holde for this generall Byshop ouer all is that wicked Emperour Phocas and his authoritie and gift to Boniface a pope of Rome many C. yeres after Cyprians time Considering the course that this Reasoner holdeth howe easie it is to answere all that he bringeth foorth and that the same is alreadie answered elsewhere by diuers in their bookes and lately by a godly and learned brother for troubling the reader ouer long and not to repeat one the same things
I say in a masking Masse in a crucifixe Medall agnus Det and such other images yee call them lay mens bookes in a seely payre of beads so you speake your selfe and such other reliques then woulde I surely haue all men consider well the dayly exercises of our Religion which is Catechising and instructing of youth and the ruder sort in y e Articles of the beliefe the tenne cōmandements the Lord his prayer and other the principles of christian religion preaching and hearing preached God his holy woorde ministring and receiuing the Sacramentes of Baptisme and y e Lord his supper according to Christ his holy institution in the Gospel prayers to God for necessities and thankesgiuing for benefites with confession of sinnes and of our faith also and singing of Psalmes c. These are the vsuall and ordinarie exercises and the principal of our religion in our dayly meetings kept among Englishe men in the Englishe tongue Nowe let these be compared with your exercises that you set vs heere downe and with the other ceremonies of your Catholique Romane Churche and their Latine seruice at this day and then let iudgement hardly bee giuen whether of the two bee more to God his glorye the Churches that is God his peoples edification to heauenwarde and as God his religion best grounded on his holy worde as comformable thereto and so consequently to be receiued and imbraced with all thankfulnesse to God and our soueraigne I am perswaded M. Howlet that as in your motiues for alteration in so bad and corrupt a religion as yours is you moue very litle her Maiesties resolute and setled conscience on better groundes then yours for all your cunning and sugred speeches so this well weighed and rightly your friendes reasons and your glosing will gaine as litle to your side I can not followe particularly all your impudent 〈◊〉 slāders without vsing to much vnseemely tearms in geuing you that you deserue I will but touche so much as I shall thinke requisite the things that seeme needefull vnto me for the readers satisfaction and admonition I cannot let passe that ye say heere we were borne baptized bred vp c. in the Catholike Religion still ambiguitie of speeche but I guesse at your meaning you meane your selfe and your fellowes I suppose for we renounce and vtterly denie with thankes to God that wee or any of vs were baptised in Popishe or in any man his religion Wee were baptised In the name of the Father of the Sonne and of the holy Ghost in the name of Christ and into Christian religion and therefore is Baptisme called Christening and Christendome not Popening and Popedome I will not calculate your age M. Howlet and yet it may bee you were borne and bred vp in the time of the Gospel and profession of this religion many of your side I am sure were yet shal not neede to be rebaptised as though yee had been baptised in heretical religion by your opinion You were baptised wee hope In the name of the Father of the Sonne and of the holy Ghoste for euery Popishe Priests forme in baptising wee haue not to answere looke you vnto it We finde in your owne decrees among other your corruptions of Gods holy orders his Institution recorded euen in the ministring of this sacrament of Baptisme in the Latine tongue that a Priest in Pope Zacharies time baptised a childe in too too barbarous vnto ward and vile a forme as is set downe in the margine Therefore not without cause bid I you looke to your Priestes and their doings afore time One may iudge there bee many holy things euill fauouredly 〈◊〉 vp among you I haue tolde you the order of Baptizing in our Churches for the circumstance of tyme when it is no great matter in this case looke to the substance Antichrist with all his corruptions and mischief coulde neuer ouerthrow the forme substance of Baptisme hithertoo not in the tyme of Poperie Let your Antichrist take his corruptions y t is his religiō Let vs thāke God for the substance of our Baptisme that wee neede not be Baptised againe reserued by God for vs and vnto vs in spight of Antichriste and the diuell in all ages To God greatly yea wholly To these wee are nothing beholding for the same and as litle or lesse for the corruptions they mingled therewith What ye meane when ye say we were borne in the Catholike religion is somewhat darke in a thing is diuersly taken consulte with your M. Aristot. we were borne and you too in iniquitie dead in trespasses and sinnes and are by nature the children of wrath aswell as others Thus speake the Scriptures If you meane as I thinke yee doe that wee were borne your selfe and all and Baptised in the tyme of Poperye wee graunt it But in or into Popishe religion wee denie it It is one thynge to bee Baptised in a Popishe tyme and another in Popishe religion keepe the woordes wherewith we were baptised In the name of the Father and of the Sonne and of the holy Ghost This is neyther Poperie nor Popishe religion Here vpon wee say your argument and your fellowes is taken from Sophistrie and is a Sophisticall and brabbling quarrell You may easily finde the fallacion Thus falleth the Bulwarke alone and of it selfe or is taken very easily that yee imagine impregnaable till it bee tryed or assaulted wee see and heare well inough what accompt yee make of this argument abroade to deceiue the simple Distinguishe whiche is not harde to bee done Betweene God and the Diuell Christe and Antichriste Poperie and True Religion Gods holy word and mens Inuentions Let eche one haue that is proper to him and it And this argument of being Baptised in the Catholike Romane religion as these men speake that is Popishe religion as wee truely speake will easily bee answered Her Maiesties clemencie that yee talke of and great mercie as it hangeth not on your commendation as needing the same so both it and the cares wherewith you disquiet her peaceable and quiet estate and perce her tender heart so much as in you lieth should make your hearts to bleed in your bellies rather then hers if they were not harder then flint neuer praise your loue to her Maiestie you are litle beholding to your neighbours that neede to praise your selues for no body els can Say not to excuse your peruerse wilfulnesse that ye are not able to remooue the cause because it is your conscience iudgment in religiō You haue framed your selues a conscience ye may as well remoue it Ye haue freewill 〈◊〉 yee say on both sides Yee could freely enough fall arise as freely I pray you by reforming your conscience and iudgement Lie not still in your owne myre and say yee bee perplexed because some of your doctours talke and teache perplixetie that men are sometime brought into whiche is but a foolishe opinion We will
make mention of and suche as your Authour or you seeme to promise shall followe and to shewe that the proceedings of your Catholike part bee not so quiet modest as is in wordes to her Maiestie heere pretended neither they such important a stay in euery of her Maiesties Countries as is heere iollily bragged Though vppon occasion I haue beene rounde in this matter and it may seeme sharpe that I here vtter yet let the matter bee well wayed and I shall not bee founde I trust to haue exceeded the bounds of truth and charitie I protest that I meane not to excite or stirre vp my Soueraigne to any crueltie or the State or any of authoritie heere though on the other side I bee so farre of from disliking of iustice and execution of wholesome lawes that though the same turne to the hurt and mischiefe of some yet I like that better then that an inconuenience should grow to the publike state Let mē looke to themselues but that it is not requisite or needefull nor my part to deale in prescribing nor yet in aduising the wisedome of those that rule this State I am so farre of from hastening any particular mans vndoing that I wold wishe which I am assured is without mee thought of and sought that all meanes might bee vsed to the recalling of men home conferrence and other before execution especially of death And is it not so I doe but preuent the aduersaries cauill and shewe my purpose and meaning I neede not nor list not to wade any further heerein The particular rebellions in the North Irelande and such other sturs from time to time by your Catholike part as to well knowne to all men I here omit Further to diduct and come now to answere that which is obiected in this behalfe to vs by the aduersarie whiche generally consisteth as the former in doctrine and demeanour For our doctrine of Magistrats obedience as we professe no other then that which is set vs foorth and plainly layed vs down in the holy scriptures So I marueile agayne that M. Howlet beyng an Englishe man leaueth out those publique testimonies and wrytinges of our 〈◊〉 in this matter whiche to the viewe of the worlde are published by this Church both in Latine and Englishe to expresse their iudgement herein and chargeth our doctrine with particular mens bookes and teachings of late yeres to bring hatred and displeasure or spitefully to wrecke and reuenge himself vpon some one man if he can doe no more where of though some be aliue yet others are dead so can not answere for thēselues but their books must be their clering to all y t world If the godly doctrine we professe here had bin by you read with a single heart before rash iudgemēt wel weighed as in y e bookes aforesaid is declared you would haue forborne I take it these words y t our final end is as our doctrine declareth To haue no gouernour or ruler at all Whence you tooke this doctrine you y t are so ful of quotatiōs here quote vs nothing And we tell you plainly y t things deuised by your brame or picked out of your fingers ends be none of our doctrine wee say it is a great and vntrue slander ye charge this Church with Her Maiestie though diuers times disturbed in her State by you false Catholiks hath raigned in a Gospelling time nowe aboue twenty yeres as chiefe gouernor by y t doctrine of y t Gospel ruler ouer y t professors thereof in much honor great quiet highly to Gods glory her Maiesties singular cōmendation y t exceeding comfort of all true harted englishe mē her Maiesties natural most bonden subiects and many moe yeres may shee raigne we dayly do beseech y t almighty to y t promoting of Christs holy Gospel y t benefit of his Church her own comfort honor Though it be to y t regret renting of all popish Catholike hearts in Christendome To charge our doctrine about Magistates w tall you set vs down three or foure sentēces takē out of three worthie men Christes faithfull souldiers and seruantes in their time The first is M. John Wickliffe one of our progenitours say you one of the singular instrumentes that it pleased God in his time to vse for the aduauncement of his Gospel say we and so rare a one that hee might iustly bee counted among the rest a bright starre shining and giuing light to a great many to their inestimable comfort he opened long since such a wicket as greatly profited the postetitie in Gods matters The seconde whom you alleadge is Doctor Martin Luther whose rare and excellent giftes euery way mightily both astonished the highest of your side in state Ecclesiastical and 〈◊〉 and no lesse furthered and profited Gods cause and encouraged all the godly by his godly and learned writings and otherwise The thirde is that odde and incomparable man of our time The reuerende Father and most painefull and faithfull Pastor and Teacher in Christes Church M John Caluin Whom thogh your heart swelt you can not discredite among Gods seruantes nor iustly staine his trauailes and writings left among vs for the benefite of Gods Church so hath it pleased his maiestie to blesse this good mans labours The Diuell I confesse as in other hath beene very busie in his instruments to deface and disgrace this excellent man diuers wayes but euer their mischiefes returned vpon their owne pates and they euen as many as haue risen and bent thēselues against him haue had the foyle to their shame Although wee highly prayse God for these men and for his great gifts in them as in others giuing them likewise their due cōmēdation as reasō is yet would I y t you M. Howlet and your fellowes shoulde knowe we make none of them nor them all our Pope to depende of them and their authoritie ne yet the Authours of our religion as you do the man of sinne at Rome But we reserue this priuiledge to Jesus Christ alone w tout being addicted to any mans doctrine or writings for faith and religion further then he shal teach vs by canonicall scriptures All these men are dead gone ye might haue let them rest in peace w tout slanderously charging them if it had so pleased you M. Howlet But it shall not be amisse to enter into particular examination of that ye say first therefore let vs see what it is yee charge M. Wickliffe withall and howe you doe it Iohn Wickliffe say you one of their progenitors teacheth that a Prince if he rule euill or fal into mortal sinne is no longer prince but that his subiects may rise against him and punish him at their pleasures If Wyckliffe should haue holden any errour the times wherein he liued considered it were not greatly to be marueyled at God rather is highly to be praysed that in so corrupt and blinde times he sawe and helde the truth in
inestimable ioye and comforte knowe by whose power and prouidence alone her Maiestie was deliuered out of the Lions mouth placed in her Royall seat too well to ascribe y t prayse vnto you hot Catholiks Were you most ready to place her highnes in that royall roome wherein now by the fauour of God she standeth Indeed by the fauour of God y t ye say well trulye more than by your willes and help els were it harde with vs all You were so great helpes at y t beginning y t not being able to kepe in any longer the cankered poysō lurkinge in the heart but opening y t hiddē malice euē in honorable and open meetinge after her Maiestie was placed in her royall Throne when the barbarous crueltie towardes her Maiestie and other vsed in the former dayes was obiected one amongst other answered in y e name of y e rest that there was no other fault but that leauing the roote standing the brāches only were hakt of whē rather the mightiest tares so it pleased a champiō of yours to speake of y e professiō some professors of the Gospell should haue bene puld vp by the rootes which if it had bene done we shoulde not now see so many and so great wicked stockes saide this stout Catholique remaine euery where and flourishe This was it that happelye greeued you that by your wicked and trayterous dealinge her Maiestie was not before that time made away But if her Maiestie we all were so beholding vnto you for this seruice why dyd not you and your felowes make this sute when the matter was fresh in memorie the thing was not then ripe haue you now firste gotten hart of grace It is but of late M. Howlet that most of you haue puld your neckes out of the coller of obedience to God and her maiestie and therefore the recompence of that seruice that yee brag of if there were any such longeth litle to you young men Iesuites and other late Byrdes of Rome that which foloweth perhaps you wyll saye doth for ye recken not vp onely what yee haue done whiche in truthe yee neuer dyd but what proper men yee presentlye bee and wyll bee to spende the vttermost drop of your blood to defend her Maiestie in all safetie peace quietnesse to the ende yf it lyke her Highnesse to beleeue pour tale or truste to the broken reede of your defence Your dealinges heretofore in both her Maiesties Realmes of Englande and Irelande to leaue olde practises and to remember but her dayes confirme this promise of yours The stirres ye nowe afreshe goe about to make continuing the old rebellions till ye may ioyne them to new vtter your good meaning hearts remember whēce you come frō whome and in whose name This seruice to her Maiestie and the State had neede bee recompenced it were pitie els I thinke certainely your affections at the beginning towardes her Maiestie were euen such as yee nowe shewe them and will hereafter to the ende approoue them while her Maiestie liueth Can the blacke Moore change his skinne or hue or the Leoparde his spottes Then may yee also doe good that are accustomed to euill Your great fathers stomackes in the beginning were to high to become Petitioners popishe Prelates coulde not or woulde not submitte them selues to her highnes One White in his rochet after Queene Maries death at Paules crosse speaking of alteration of religion from Poperie to the Gospell c. openly sayde It can not be it may not bee it shall not bee yee holde one course yee are I perceiue no changelings But there is sir an oddes between doing a thing in deed and pretending to doe a thing betweene doing of conscience affection duetie loue heartily and betweene rhetorically doing that I may so speake that is Italian and Romanlike with colour and great cunuing or if you will 〈◊〉 of our Englishe mens doing now that come thence if her Maiestie therefore spie your drift and rewarde you with fourtie stripes as the frenche king once did in not much an vnlike case a dissembler for pretending in hope of rewarde with termes and 〈◊〉 of great reuerence to take a 〈◊〉 from him after another 〈◊〉 of his had receiued rewarde for a very like seruice and office done to the king his M. before Are yee not well ynough serued Or at least if her Maiestie comparing you with other consider her faithfull subiectes in deede which aske nothing nor brage of their seruice but acknowledge they haue receiued more then they haue deserued and desire nothing more then that they may in all thankefull dutie answere their Soueraignes bountie towardes them as the Chauncellour to the said French king somtime did stāding amongst such gaping and rauening Crowes Cormorantes or Owles call thē what ye will As you in words set out your 〈◊〉 byrdes here to bee if I say she shall in the end reward those good Subiectes as King Lewes did his Chauncellour and send you emptie away that gape so fast afterward answer you that you must waite for an other occasiō as y t King did c. What haue you to plain of It is said that y t king toke a delight to mocke the gaping byrde were it Crow or Daw. Is this your waightie motiue ye so glose in the margin of your booke If your Authour haue no better in store to come hereafter as in this your treatise promised shall come both he you may put vp your pypes for ought I see But yee runne backe to your starting hole and alleadge conscience this is a poore helpe And yet this must bee a satisfaction for all if the rest faile howe hollowe soeuer your consciences bee if there remaine any at all the bare name of cōscience must be your defence whē you haue nothing els to say Heere make yee now a Rampeere Conscience you say dependeth of iudgement and vnderstanding not of affect and will It cannot be framed at pleasure nor consequently reduced to such conformitie as is prescribed by Superiours Conscience no doubt where it is in deede and not in fancie and wordes pretended onely is a great matter and woulde by any meanes be respected and tendred of all And so doth her Maiestie heere God be praised why did yee not heere M. Howlet set downe the groūd of your vnderstāding iudgement or forbeare this brag of cōscience till we had seene examined the groūd thereof y t which w tout all proofe ye here bring forth in wordes only that do we returne vnto you againe as a thing vnproued therfore reproueable to wit y t the persuasiō you are entred into of not comming to the Churche among vs at this day and refusing the oth of alleageance to her Maiestie is not onely not grounded on the scriptures but is contrary thervnto and thereupon dependeth altogether of affect and will not of iudgement and vnderstanding is framed at
men are brought of sinning damnably euery way in following their erronious conscience or in doing against the same and by implication at length the Magistrates and ciuill Authoritie Kinges and Princes themselues are wrapped in like perplexitie and damnation for dealing with such by enforcement to doe against their wicked and diuelishe conscience These are the perplexed questions and resolutions in the case of conscience whereinto these prophane questionists and schoolemen tumble such mens consciences as beleeue and followe them without euer being hable well to help them out againe They make of the sacred scriptures A tennis ball to tosse and to play withal they greatly disgrace obscure the same in troubling the pure fountaines therof And hauing entangled troubled snared mens consciēces w t their quidities by abusinge gods gifts they highly please and pleasure the Deuill and highlye displease and dishonour Gods maiestie leauing a testimony and example to all posteritie of Gods heauy iudgement against all such as with vnwashen handes as they speake that is vnreuerently handle the holy word of the eternall God But let vs prosecute their question answer whether an erronious conscience in thinges simply and of themselues euill doe binde a man so as if hee doo against the same he commit damnable sinne be it in commaundinge to doo euill or forbidding to doo good all is one D. Thomas his answer you heare is alwayes one and like him selfe affirmatiue and yea The reaso why is rendered in his summe because will followe the direction of reason and vnderstanding or conscience as hee speaketh for hee maketh conscience the prescriptiō of reason be it right or wrong which reasō whē it doth erre propoūdeth to the will good for bad and bad for good or telleth vnder a shewe that that which is good is naught and that whiche is naught is good so will accepteth alloweth followeth the same and thereafter is the wyl good or bad for the goodnes badnes of the wil dependeth on the obiect y t is on y t which is propounded vnto it of reasō whereupō he concludeth that wee must say that euery wyll is simplye or vtterly euil alwayes which disagreeth from reason be reason right bee it wronge be that it propundeth true bee it false And all this is grounded forsooth by D. Thomas vppon Aristole who sayeth that simply to speake hee is incontinent that foloweth not right reason but accedentally or after a maner he that followeth not false reason Here is false and lying reason vnder title of good truth prescribing euill and falshod and contrarilye vnder title of euill falshod forbidding good and truth Heere is wyl following false reasō accordingly in accepting or refusing that y t is thus offered Heere is lastly man hymselfe bounde vnder payne of damnation neyther to wyll nor to doo against y t which is by this false reasō or conscience thus prescribed What vsually nowe followeth but execution or action doing therafter we may here iustlier cry out I trow with the holy Ghost and Gods worde than M. Howlet and his Catholikes doe of his pretended Riot woe bee vnto you that say euil is good and good is euill Woe be to that conscience wo be vnto that man that thus is guided yea that is boūd vnder paineof damnatiō not to do against the euill that false reason propoundeth him vnder the shew of good but to reiect that good that it propoūdeth him vnder the shewe of euill Or which is all one not to leaue in this case that which is euill not to accept that which is good Such blind leaders of the blinde must needes at the length fall both into the ditche But for better explanation of this whole matter let vs see some of their examples giuen vs in this case of an erronious or lying conscience that bindeth There wante not I warrant you in these mens examples taken from mens doings according to this erronious conscience against both the Tables of Gods commaundements the first and the seconde M. Howlet and his fellowe gaue vs two examples against the first Table of a Iewe and an Infidel in denying the Trinitie the Messias or Sauiour of the world Looke vppon their wordes afore set downe and there may you finde the same Adde to them another example set down in their Popishe decrees in the margin in great letters 〈◊〉 is called the marrowe of the glose The Iewes had sinned mortally or deadly if they had not crucified Christ whiche riseth vppon this question whether the Iewes were bound in conscience to crucifie Christ yea or no a deepe and worthy question among these men And because D. Thomas is so great a man in their bookes to make euen with them ioyne to this one example more of him agaynst the first Table in his Summe in the place before alleaged If to beleeue in Christ bee propounded to a man as an euill thing by false reason the man that will beleeue in Christ doth naughtily or the will accepting to beleeue in Christ is naught because the thing is euill in the apprehension of Reason albeit simply and in deed it be good clarkely resolued and like an Angelicall Doctour Nowe if you will haue a Corollarium or a conclusion for a Surplusage in this first Table Take the questions that vpon this errour of fayth and conscience in matters of the first Table are mooued and determined in other subtill schoole wryters as namely this is one in y e Maister of the Sentences and repeated in the golden decree and allowed If the diuell transfiguring him selfe into an Angell of light be beleeued to bee good when he faigneth him selfe to bee good it is no dangerous errour and if the diuell shoulde then demaunde of some simple body whether hee woulde bee partaker of his blessednes and hee shoulde answere that hee woulde passe into the diuels fellowship whether shoulde hee being thus deceiued be saide to haue consented into the fellowshippe of diuelish damnation and not rather into the fellowship of eternall brightnesse It is true that this man sinneth not sayth the glose wherevpon going yet further it is demaunded by Fryer Holcot whether one worshipping the diuill transfigured into the shape of Christe being deceiued by inuinsible errour or ignorance as hee speaketh bee excused from Idolatrie Answering hee sayth I sayde that not onely hee is excused from sinne but he meriteth as much as hee should merite if he shoulde worshippe Christe if he did that lay in him to discerne whether hee were Christe or no proofe and reason why one among the rest is beecause the prescription of Conscience when it is erroneous byndeth as muche as when it is true But Iohn vnder whose name this case is put hath the prescriptiō of conscience though erronious that that which appeareth vnto him is to bee worshipped as God ergo if hee worship not he sinneth mortally In summe Iohns worshipping of the deuill
scriptures directing ruling your consciences thereby On the other side againe wyll you as honest dutifull Subiects renouncing all forraigne power of Prelate Prince or Potentate whatsoeuer betake your selues hence forwarde to bee gouerned by her Maiestie and the temporall lawes of this lande and such Statutes as for the good and peaceable guiding thereof be by her Maiestie the State made agreed vpon in the high court of 〈◊〉 according to the order of this Realme What say you to this condition I aske you because I am in doubt whether you will in the ende stand to the resolution and iudgement of her Maiestie the State herein Nor to any in deed but vnto your Pope your selues and yet had yee neede I tell you resolue be resolued in this point before you make sute to her maiestie so earnest sute to haue publike disputation as wherevpon your eternall saluation dependeth c. And to this point answere hardly in your next writing for in this Epistle DEDICATORIE your wordes hetherto seeme to imploy som cōtradictiō in this matter or els your sute seemeth yf not hollowly yet cunningly made to your vantage but preiudiciall and perillous to this quiet and peaceable state setled nowe aboue these xxii yeeres together in this kind of gouernement of reiecting the authoritie of the Pope of Rome and Popish religion and receiuing the profession of the Gospel and acknowledging her Maiesties Royall soueraigntie ouer all States and degrees All which is wel and sufficiently warranted and maintained by the expresse testimonie of Gods holy worde and the wholesome lawes of this Realme as hath beene and is still both for the one the other by proofe published to the viewe of all the worlde You M. Howlet and your late start vp Iesuites and other English Romanistes or Rhemistes to be plaine with you are too weake in the shoulders God haue the glory to take in hande by disputation or otherwise to vndermine or shake this Godly State or to prooue your owne cause good Yee are but princockes and babes for the most part in comparison of those of your side aforetime that stoode in the front of the battaile whose force yet God be thanked haue beene well tryed and met with all It is vnto you a harde 〈◊〉 of the decay and vtter ruine shortly to fall vpon your huge Antichristian kingdome as that was an after demonstration in the Poet Naeuius that Tullie mencioneth when newe Oratours foolish young men arise and take in hande the administration of the common wealth who were wont so to bragge of gray haires olde men c. Yea 〈◊〉 is that that hath alreadie beene a great part of the vndoing ofit on your behalfes Young men I speake not to reproch age nor to touche towardly youth may haue good heades fresh memorie quicke sight sharpe wit ioly art and prompt and readie tongues and wordes at will which thinges if they bee well applyed wherein is all haue their commendation as in young men But in heauenly matters Gods truth reuealed in his written worde his feare a setled vnderstanding and iudgement framed by Gods holy spirite ioyned with simplicitie and sinceritie in Christes religion and a reuerent humble minde to Godwarde directed alwayes by the sacred Scriptures in young or olde are a great deale more worth and yet by your vaunt you seeme to trust much to the other and thereupon are you so earnest for disputation Of your vaine Scholasticall disputations and arguments pro contra that can make quidlibet ex quolibet or as wee speake Make men beleeue that the Moone is made of greene cheese or that the Crowe is white by your sophistrie The Churche of God to the hurt thereof hath had too great experience afore time and the faithfull at this day see but too muche of this stuffe in your subtill Doctor Scotus your Angelicall Doctors Quodlibetal questions and in numbers of bookes of that stampe We haue beene faithfully warned by the holy ghost to take heed of admitting that kind of dealing a great while since namely in Saint Paules Epistles to Timothie And in deed by tryall we find dayly that by wrangling iangling and vaine disputiug the truth commonly goeth to wracke and is lost besides other inconueniences that arise thereby There be other meanes to try out the truth by then this This kinde of exercise vnlesse it bee very soberly kept and vsed with great moderation is very dangerous in matters of diuinitie And yet God be thanked for his gifts you may be and are euen in this exercise matcheable and to bee matched if neede were with your equals heere at home You that make these great bragges were but yesterday to talke of in Oxeford you haue left your fellowes and your betters too behind you in Oxeford Cābrige abrod also if you will giue other besides your selues leaue to iudge but let vs heare what you tell vs more of y e particulars for you offer also of your liberalitie two other wayes of dealing besides publike disputation These are your wordes 15 ANd as for the particulars wee shall easily agree with them For wee offer all these three wayes both iointly and seuerally that is either by trying out the truthe by briefe scholasticall arguments or by continuall speeche for a certaine space to be allotted out the other part presently or vpon studie to answere the same or finally by preaching before your Maiestie or where els your Maiestie shall appoint And for our safeties we aske nothing els but only your Maiesties worde set downe vnto vs in no ampler maner then the Councell of Trent made the safe conduct to our aduersaries which they notwithstanding refused to accept But I hope they shall see that wee will not refuse or mistrust your Maiesties worde if we may once see it set downe by proclamation or otherwise by letters pattents for our safetie but that within 80. dayes after by the grace of God wee shall appeare before your highnesse with what danger soeuer to our liues otherwise for the try all of Gods truth which we make no doubt but to be cleare on our side 16 If our aduersaries refuse this offer they shall shewe too muche distrust in their owne case for it is with great labour perill and disaduantage on our partes and on their sides nothing at all I woulde they durst make but halfe the like offer for their comming hyther on this side the Seas it shoulde bee most thankefully taken and they with great safetie and all gentle intreatie disputed withall aud made to see as I presume their owne weakenesse But seeing this is not to bee hoped for wee relye vpon the other beseeching your Maiestie most humbly instantly that our iust demaund may be graunted for the tryall of Gods truth most necessary for vs all too our eternall saluation YEE talke vnto vs of three wayes of conference both ioyntly and seuerally as yee speake but all must
Humble iumble such is your religious handling of the scriptures I pray you howeuer you talke of y e sense meaning shuffle vs not out the holy Ghostes wordes phrase A man when the Apostle speaketh onely of the faythfull is too general Decerne or iudge it to be vnlawfull is put into the text by your self as is not according to his cōsciēce or knowledge The next words adioyning are also a text of your own coining In y e last of the three sentēces here cited out of the fourteenth to the Romanes where finde you in doing contrary to that he best alloweth And all these corruptions be in that one place that you would cite out of S. Paule to the Romanes It is the first text yee alleadge yee geue vs but a taste therein of the forgerie we haue to looke for at your hands if we haue not good regard to you your doinges It is not for vs now adaies to receiue things from you namely the scriptures at your handes vpon your bare credit and reporte S. James his place also somewhat halteth by your citation but let this passe M. Howlet and you iumping so close together in corrupting this text of S. Paule I neede adde no more then that I haue alreadie sayd thereof but referre the reader to my answere made to him in his place whereof if you and hee haue any shape me a good defence you wil leese nothing for quoting thrise for failing the fourteenth to the Romans in your margin Matthewe Marke and Luke for one sentence of the Gospell Iohn the 15. prooueth not that you cite it for Gregorie out of whom you tooke it citeth it fitlier a great deale Actes 9. occupieth also a roome and toucheth not this sinne against the holy Ghost vnlesse the whole had beene better vnderstoode applied howeuer you would needs set vs downe those holy writers to fill vp your margin yet might you haue spared well enough your doctors your D. Thomas is twise heere called forth Gregory the Pope is adioyned to him the place alleadged out of Augustine is sufficiently answeared by the Godly and learned brother D. Fulke It is very vnfitly applied to the multitude and common sorte suche as doe things for feare c. That Augustine sheweth is properly to be applied to captaines and ringleaders but without all proofe more vnfitly yet to such as ioyne with truth and godlines though erring in conscience is that applied which pertaineth to the leaders into error schisme 〈◊〉 but the supposition must helpe although it be no reason S. Pauls doctrine speaking of meats or things in thēselues indifferēt lawful your doctrine talking of cōmunicating with the churches wherein the Gospel of Christ is preached or abstaining from the same which is simply good or euill agree as wel as light and darknes truth falshood Ye say truly that S. Paul layeth no lesse punishmēt vpon the sinne against a mans owne conscience than iudgement damnation no more doth he vpon any sinne Be it done according to the doers conscience as you single thinges or against it for that doctrine is generall The wages of sinne is death By one offence giltines vpon all to condemnation And againe iudgement of one offence vnto condemnation c. But hee dealeth more fauourably with the parties and their persons than you doe who leaue them without all hope of pardon in this world or in the worlde to come charging them to haue sinned against the holy Ghost c. S. Paule in the 14. to the Romanes chargeth not those so farre vnlesse he be racked but that by repentance they may be renued again The matter ye talke of is but an act cōmitted against a foolish cōceite or diuellish opiniō which hardly can be called conscience vnlesse yee prooue it better than hitherto God open their eyes and geue them that be entangled therein grace to leaue it I answere you I defende not their sin wickednes what euer it be neither must ye think we equal al sinnes or make no degrees therein we acknowledge some be greater worse and more hainous sinnes then other but this is not vnpardonable nor sinne against the holy Ghost that we say For your description of sinne against the holye Ghost out of D. Thomas to be against an appropriate good thing as your schooles like to speake As we are not bound to beleeue them nor you in your subtilties So in the application ye make there of vpon your owne Catholikes and to sinne committed against conscience hardly agree you with D. Thomas who maketh that sinne to be committed of certain malice onely Againe I meruaile how you that are so addict to old doctors could to follow this opinion of others leaue the expositiō of the auncient doctors herein Athanasius Hilarie Ambrose Hierom Chrisostome and Augustine whose sentences of the sinne against the holy Ghost D. Thomas reckoneth vp in his summe And if this 〈◊〉 y t yee follow be admitted the sixe kinds of sinne against the holy Ghost that D. Thomas after the M. setteth down you had neede to looke well to your selfe that you bee not 〈◊〉 charged therewith rather then set so fiercely vpon other Besides this where your D. Thomas in his golden chaine vpon the words of Christ expressely treateth of the sin against the holy Ghost And after his maner reckoneth vp the approued doctors opinions he mentioneth not that exposition that you heere set vs downe And seemeth directly to charge you in this your application therof to be a Nouatian heretike who saide that the faithfull after their fal can not rise by repentance nor attaine to the forgiuenes of their sinnes principally they which being in persecution marke this did denie the truth And this is the woorst that I am sure euen you can will or doe charge your owne Catholikes with now who you say are to be accounted ac cording to S. Paule that is vntrue damned men in this life Or that they sinne against the holy Ghost whiche to say is to playe the Nouatian heretike Moreouer D. Thomas thus reporteth there not from himselfe alone I cannot see how euen the departing from christianitie or the catholike church is sinne against the holy Ghost and reason thereof is there rendred Againe it cannot be iudged of in this life for we must dispaire of none as long as the patience of God bringeth to repentance for what if those whome vou note in any kinde of error and condemne them as most desperate men before they end this life repent and finde true life in the worlde to come with manie other thinges which out of Augustine he there reciteth whom hee also most commonly followeth These thinges be contrary to your singular opinion against your false Catholikes And yet I suppose you will admit this if not for their sake out of whom it is alleged yet for that ye take that which D. Thomas wrote as a heauenly
many waies Examine the doctrine of those ye name and ye shall finde it was in the world before Luther was borne Then maye you not say they al sprung of that first sect of Lutherans and they of Luther So as if Luther had not beene heard there had not beene now in the world any of them c. Consult but with N. Sanders and tell vs from him whether Adamians and Adamites Trinitaries c. were not their doctrine professed in the worlde before Luther was borne how then sprung they all thence how know you their would not be at this day one in the world of them if Luther had not beene hearde M. Howlet sayth Wickliffe was one of the progenetours of some of these yee heere 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 hee was many and many dayes beefore Luther was borne How then is that true you heere affirme Heere is a large fielde to walke in but let vs passe ouer it If in England at this day her Maiestie and the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 higher for their profession and religion then Luther I 〈◊〉 you will shut all them out of this heape of 〈◊〉 not charge them to haue had the beginning of Luther sprung thence otherwise you doe them wrong But 〈◊〉 doe so that is 〈◊〉 higher leaue therefore charging with these names 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 deuised and called 〈◊〉 by you You playe 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 heede of 〈◊〉 spirite that saide he woulde be a lying spirite in the mouth of the Prophets Ye take vpon you to tell not onely what had beene in the worlde nowe if Luther had not beene hearde a great while since But as though you were yet nearer and more 〈◊〉 of Gods councell ye wrap men in eternall damnation yet aliue and presume to tell what sentence shall bee giuen vpon these and these men at the day of iudgement Great and rash is your audacitie in this behalfe It is happie Sir you haue not euerlasting fier at commaundement to flashe and fling amongst vs at your pleasure nor a throne yet set you to giue sentence like a iudge in this case You will needes be a Prophet and you tell vs what you haue persuaded your selfe but we tell you againe many a man persuades himselfe in his dreame of many thinges 〈◊〉 when he awaketh he findeth to be false and vaine we y t stand by seeing you in a dreame iog you as hard as we can wee put you in remembrance what he saith Awake thou that sleepest stand vp 〈◊〉 the dead and Christ shal giue thee 〈◊〉 If that will not serue to doe you good then for the 〈◊〉 of others we say The Prophet that hath 〈◊〉 dreame let him tell a dreame and he that hath my word let him speake my worde faithfully what is the chaffe to the wheate saith the Lorde But Syr if the talke of our side be so greatly to be auoyded and it be so dangerous for you your fellowes and such 〈◊〉 to giue our side the hearing whence commeth it ye so earnestly now seeme to sue to her Maiestie that you may heare vs talke and reason the matter with vs for otherwise we cannot Preache answere or vse 〈◊〉 a certaine space continuall speech whervnto M. Howlet in all your names prouoketh To conclude this part we may iustly say to you herein if none had giuen eare to the Serpentes talke in your Antichristian 〈◊〉 if the Church 〈◊〉 a virgin had not been presented to an other to be corrupted but kept pure to her one and owne husbande Christe as the holy Ghost by the Apostle witnesseth shee shoulde be as for whom alone she is prepared and 〈◊〉 if an other then Christes Gospell had not beene preached and receiued Popery had not now been in the worlde nor yet should the same be troubled with papists as it nowe is c. Let the Reader consider that whiche the Apostle writeth to the Corinthians And let them that haue any zeale to Christes Churche here shew and vse the same in cleering it from Popish corruptions and restoring it to the simplicitie that is in Christe In the next and second Reason you are muche in Scandale I wel wote not why ye so purposedly leaue here that english worde of offence but let that goe Here you exaggerate here you amplifie here you set out the sinne of scandale like an Oratour In a thing not doubtfull you spend vnnecessary florishes of proofes you paint and set out your iudgement to the ix degree And all of your scandale and scandalizing vsing the same in some textes where you finde it not such loue are ye in w t this new English worde scandale And thus you reason All scandale is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c A 〈◊〉 going to our 〈◊〉 is scandale 〈◊〉 to be 〈◊〉 c. As in the former reason so here is it not hard to turne this in truth vpon you and your religion goe you vpon persuasion and supposition as much and as long as you will The thing is 〈◊〉 and well done by the sacred scriptures of those of our 〈◊〉 to 〈◊〉 it vnlawfull to goe to your abhominable Masse and Idolatrous and superstitious Latine Seruice I haue heere to answere your argument in explanation and proofe of your first proposition you are busily occupied and deuide scandale into three partes The first is by 〈◊〉 any to 〈◊〉 by doing or saying that which is naught The second by doing a thing in it selfe lawefull the thirde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the enimie The whole is doone neither scholastically 〈◊〉 nor plainely but let vs admit this your diuision and that you say of scandale in generall Let vs examine your Hypothesis or second or next proposition and the application of the whole particularly wherein I tell you you fault and faile And I say your second and middle proposition ACatholikes going to our church is scandale is false and you shall neuer be able to prooue it For this Reason there fore bend your self to doe that or els you doe nothing That you nowe say doth it not We graunt that for the first point to giue offence by euill doing or speaking in life or doctrine c is a heynous sinne ye might haue spared your trauel in that point we admit your examples one and other here because they beset vs in the Canonicall Scriptures and agreeable to that heauenly doctrine Your application is naught It wyll be very right well when you apply all to your side and corrupt religion You are like 〈◊〉 Priestes in the olde law like the Moabites you are Prophets like Balaam and very like to Ieroboam that ye cite out of the Scriptures in inducing to sinne to Idolatrie and superstition which is easily followed and craftily vnder couert of wordes by you broched couloured The example ye bryng out of 〈◊〉 no lesse perteineth to you Cyprians very wordes well considered will prooue it who in Christendome bring vp their youth in ignorance more then you Who persuade there the