Hell but of that to come Though you cannot conceive how yet you must beleeve that the fire of Hell is corporall and worketh on spirits Perdidisti rationem tene fidem saith Austin Yet the Schoolemen tell us divers waies how the soule may be affected and afflicted by that fire First as it shall be united to the fire and shut up as it were in a prison there Secondly as it shall retaine the experimentall knowledge of those paines which it suffered in the body Thirdly as it is the principium and originall of the senses which shall remaine in the soule as in their root Fourthly as that fire shall be a representative signe or symbole of Gods indignation against them and of their losse of his favour and of so great happinesse and that eternally for so small foolish and fading sinfull delights these are the corporall waies by which that fire shall torment the soule And if you hold your Masters Tenent Mores animi sequuntur temperamentum corporis you will find no more impossibility for a corporall fire to worke upon a spirit then for the materiall humours of the body to worke upon the soule As you thinke Hell and Hell-fire to be metaphoricall and in mens consciences onely so you seeme to doubt of the place under earth where you say though wee â—â—ace Hell under earth the Divels walk is about 〈◊〉 But this is no argument to disswade â—s from beleeving Hell to be under earth â—ecause the Divels are not yet confined â—â—ither By the same reason you may say â—â—e habitation of Angels is not above beâ—ause they are imployed here by God upâ—n the earth Wee beleeve Hell to be unâ—er earth because it stands with reason â—nd Gods justice that the wicked should â—e removed as farre as might be from the â—resence of the Saints and the place of â—oy which is above Secondly as their â—elight and hopes were not in heaven but â—n earth and earthly things so it is fitting â—hat their eternall habitation should be within the earth Thirdly the name 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 â—n Hebrew 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in Greek Infernus in Laâ—in Hell in English c. doe shew that the â—lace of the damned is low and in darkâ—esse Fourthly the Scripture still speakes of Hell as a place under ground and the â—nhabitants thereof are said to be under the earth and the motion thither is called there a descending Fifthly the Gentiles were not ignorant of this as Tertullian sheweth Imum tartarum carcerem poenaruâ— cum vultis affirmatis c. Iuvenal callâ— Hell subterranea regna Virgil Barathrum and infernas sedes tum tartarus ipse Bis petet in praeceps tantum c. Homer calls it a most deep gulfe under earth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 You thinke it hard to place the soules of those worthy Heathens in Hell whose worthâ— lives teach us vertue on earth If there be no salvation but in Christ if there be no other name under Heaven by which meâ— can be saved but by the name of Iesus if it be life eternall to know God in him if he only is the way the life and the truth if there be no coming to the Father but by him I cannot thinke it hard if those worthy Heathens have no place in Heaven seeing they had no interest in him who with his bloud hath purchased Heaven to us and hath opened the gates of that Kingdome to all beleevers And how specious soever their lives and actions were in the eyes of men yet without Christ â—hey were nothing else but splendida peccaâ—a glorious enormities onely in this I can â—lace them that it will be easier for them as it will be for Sodome and Gomorrha for â—yre and Sidon in the last day then for â—ewes and Christians who have knowne â—heir Masters will and have not done it â—ewer stripes remaine for Socrates a Heaâ—hen then for Iulian a Christian. We cannot deny say you the Church of God â—oth in Asia and Africa if wee forget not the â—eregrination of the Apostles the death of Marâ—yrs c. nor must a few differences excommuâ—icate from Heaven one another First wee â—eny not but God hath many who bow â—ot their knee to Baal in those countries â—nd that his Church is oftentimes invisiâ—le Secondly wee deny that the preâ—ence of Apostles death of Martyrs sessiâ—ns of lawfull Councels can or have priviâ—edge those places from Apostasie Christs owne presence and miracles and doctrine â—n Iudea have not given stabilitie or perâ—anencie to the Church there What 's â—ecome of the famous Churches of Coâ—inth Ephesus Laodicea Philadelphia c. planted by the Apostles themselves Thirdly it is not for a few or light differences that we have separated our selves from the communion of the Church of Rome and of those in Asia and Africa if wee can call them Churches which are rather Sceletons then the body of Christ. The differences between the Church of Rome and us are not few nor small as you know The differences betweene us and the Eastern Churches are greater for most of them are either Nestorians denying Mary to be the mother of God and so in effect making two Christs by making two persons or else they are Eutychians or Monothelites affirming but one nature and will in Christ and therefore reject the Councell of Chalcedon such are the Iacobites in Asia if they be not lately converted and those other Iacobites in Africk under the King of the Abyssins I will not speake of the Greek Church which denieth the procession of the holy Ghost Nor of the Cophti of Egypt who are also Eutychians and reject the observation of the Lords day as superstitious and marry in the second degree The Georgians in Iberia baptise not their children till the eighth yeare of their age and give them the Eucharist at seven The Armenians are little better As for the Christians of Saint Thomas and the Maronites in Mount Libanus if they have forsaken their old heresies they are fallen into those that are little better by submitting themselves to the Religion and Jurisdiction of Rome You are confident and fully perswaded yet dare not take your oath of your salvation for you think it a kind of perjury to sweare that Constantinople is such a City because you have not seen it To be fully perswaded and not dare to sweare is a contradiction and if you dare not sweare but what you have seen then you will in a manner perjure your selfe if you should sweare that Christ was the son of Mary or that he was crucified on Mount Calvaâ—ie for this you have not seen What think you if a blind man should sweare that the Sun is a great light for hee hath no infallible warrant from his owne sense to confirme him in the certainty thereof You have I perceive so much humility that you meet with many doubts But indeed doubting is not the fruit of humilitie but of infidelitie you encline too
and therefore are not the objects of his omnipotencie but that is only the object which is possibile absolutum So I think it is good manners to say God cannot lie or die because it cannot â—gree with his active power to suffer or to die So he cannot sin because it agreeth not with right reason In a word Deus nequit facere quod nequit fieri I think then it were breach of good manners to say that God could do any thing which were repugnant either to his wisdome goodnesse or power And though his power and will make but one God yet they are different attributes ratione for the will commands and the power puts in execution You say that they who deny witches deny spirits also and are a kind of Atheists A strange kind of Atheisme to deny witches but is there such a strict relation between witches and spirits that hee that denies the one must needs deny the other Sure the existence of spirits depends not upon the witches invocation of or paction with spirits We reade that Zoroastres was the first witch in the world and hee lived after the Floud were there no spirits I pray till then This is as much as if you would say there were no divels among the Gadarens till they entered into their swine You thinke the Angels know a great part of our thoughts because by reflexion they behold the thoughts of one another That the Angels know one another is out of doubt but how they know one anothers thoughts is unknowne to mee This I know that none knowes the thoughts of man but man himself and God that made him it being Gods prerogative to be 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 If they know our thoughts 't is either by revelation from God or by some outward signe and demonstration from our selves for whilest they are immanent and in the Understanding they are only knowne to God because he only hath the command of our Wills from which our thoughts depend The light which wee stile a bare accident you say is a spirituall substance where it subsists alone and may be an Angell Let us see where and when it subsists alone without a subject and then wee will beleeve you that it is a spirituall substance And if your light may be an Angel that must needs be an Angell of light What a skipping Angell will ignis fatuus make The Chandlers and Bakers trades are honouâ—able those can make lights which may in â—ime become Angels these wafers which â—n time become gods This Section consists of divers errours First you call the Heavens the immateriall world so you confound the celestiall world with the intellectuall which only is immateriall and had its being in the divine intellect before it was made Secondly if the Heavens be immateriall they are not movable for matter is the subject of motion Why then doe you call the great Sphere the first movable Thirdly an immateriall world cannot be the habitation of materiall substances where then will the bodies of the Saints after the resurrection have their residence Fourthly if the Heavens have not matter they have not quantity and parts Fifthly nor are they compounded substances of matter and forme but simple as spirits Sixthly though they have not such a matter as the elementary world yet immateriall they are not they have a matter the subject of quantity though not of generation and corruption Your second errour is that you call Gods essence the habitation of Angels and therefore they live every-where where his essence is Divinitie tells us that Angels are in a place definitivè and that they as we all live and move in him as in our efficient protecting and sustaining cause but not as in a place for Angels move out of one place to another and while they are on earth they are not in heaven but if Gods essence be their habitation then they never change place for his essence is every-where and so you make them partakers of Gods proper attribute Ubiquity Your third errour is that God hath not subordinated the creation of Angels to ours but as ministring spirits they are willing to fulfill Gods will in the affaires of man Then belike God made them not to be ministring spirits to the heires of salvation but they are so of their owne accord if so wee are more beholding to them for their comfort protection and instruction of us then to God who made them not for this end but as you say for his owne glory But if you were as good at Divinity as at Physick you will find that Gods glory is not â—ncompatible with their service to us but â—n this is God glorified that they comfort â—nstruct and protect us for this charge hee hath given to his Angels over us and so we are bound to them for their care much more to him for his love in creating them to this end Your fourth errour is that both generation and creation are founded on contrarieties If creation were a transmutation which still presupposeth a subject I would be of your opinion but seeing it is not and hath no subject without which contrarieties cannot be in nature I deny that creation is founded on contrarieties neither is non-entity contrary but the totall privation of being which God gave to the creature You wonder at the multitude of heads that deny traduction having no other argument of their beliefe but Austins words Creando infunditur c. But I wonder as much at you who is not better acquainted with our Divinitie for wee have many reasons to confirm us against traduction besides Saint Austins authority At first that the soule is immateriall therefore hath not quantitie nor parts nor is subject to division as it must be if it be subject to traduction or propagation Secondly the soule existeth in and by it selfe depending from the bodie neither in its being nor operation and by consequence not in its production nec in esse nec in fieri nec in operari Thirdly if the soule were educed out of the power of the matter it were mortall as the soules of beasts are which having their beginning and being from the matter must faile when that failes Fourthly the effect is never nobler then the cause but the soule in regard of understanding doth in excellencie far exceed the body Fifthly a body can no more produce a spirit then an horse can beget a man they being different species Sixthly if the soule were propagated in or by the seed then this were a true enunciation Semen est animal rationale and so the seed should be man Seventhly if the soule of the son be propagated by the soule or of the soule of the parent then we must admit transmutation of soules as we doe of bodies in generation Eighthly we â—ave the Churches authoritie Ninthly â—nd the testimony of Gentiles for Aristotle â—cknowledgeth the Intellect to enter into â—â—e body from without And Apuleius in â—is mysticall
Medicus Medicatus OR THE PHYSICIANS RELIGION CURED BY A LENITIVE OR GENTLE POTION With some ANIMADVERSIONS upon Sir Kenelme Digbie's OBSERVATIONS on Religio Medici By ALEXANDER ROSS LONDON Printed by Iames Young and are to be sold by Charles Green at the Signe of the Gun in Ivie-lane Anno Dom. 1645. TO MY VVORTHY AND EVER HONOURED FRIEND Mr. EDWARD BENLOWES ESQUIRE SIR TO satisfie your desire I have endeavoured so farre as the shortnesse of time the distractions of my mind and the want of Bookes would give mee leave in this place of exile to open the mysteries of this Treatise so much cried up by those whose eyes pierce no deeper then the superficies and their judgements then the out-sides of things Expect not here from mee Rhetoricall flourishes I study matter not words Good wine needs no bush Truth is so amiable of her selfe that shee cares not for curious dressing Where is most painting there is least beauty The Gentleman who at last acknowledgeth himselfe to be the Authour of this Booke tells us that many things in it are not to be called unto the rigid test of reason being delivered Rhetorically but as I suspect that friendship which is set out in too many Verball Complements so doe I that Religion which is trimmed up with too many Tropicall pigments and Rhetoricall dresses If the gold be pure why feares it the Touch-stone The Physician will trie the Apothecaries drugges ere hee make use of them for his Patients bodie and shall wee not trie the ingredients of that Religion which is accounted the physick of our soules I have no leasure nor mind here to expatiate my selfe a sparkle of the publike flame hath taken hold on my estate my avocations are divers my Bookes farre from mee and I am here Omnibus exhaustus pene casibus omnium egenus Therefore accept these sudden and extemporary Animadversions so earnestly desired by you as a testimony of his service and love to you who will alwaies be found Your servant to command Dum res aetas Sororum Fila trium patiuntur atra A. R. The Contents of the chiefe things briefly handled here in this Booke are these 1 IF the Papists and we are of one faith 2. If it be lawfull to joyne with them in prayers in their Churches 3. If Crosses and Crucifixes are fit meanes to excite devotion 4. If it be fit to weep at a Procession 5. If we owe the Pope good language 6. If we may dispute of Religion 7. If the Church at all times is to be followed 8. Of the soules immortality 9. Of Origen's opinion concerning the damned 10. Of prayer for the dead 11. Of seeing Christ corporally 12. If the soule can be called mans Angell or Gods body 13. Of Gods wisedome and knowledge 14. How Nature is to be defined 15. If Monsters are beautifull 16. If one may pray before a game at Tables 17. Of judiciall Astrologie 18. Of the brasen Serpent 19. Of Eliah's miracle of fire Of the sire of Sodome Of Manna 20. If there be Atheists 21. If man hath a right side 22. How America was peopled 23. If Methusalem was longest lived 24. If Judas hanged himselfe Of Babels Tower Of Peters Angell 25. If miracles be ceased 26. If we may say that God cannot doe some things 27. If he denieth Spirits who denieth Witches 28. If the Angels know our thoughts 29. If the light be a spirituall substance or may be an Angell 30. If the Heavens bee an immateriall world 31. If Gods presence be the habitation of Angels 32. How they are ministring spirits to us 33. If creation bee founded on contrarieties 34. If the soule be ex traduce 35. Of Monsters 36. If the body be the soules instrument 37. If the seat of Reason can be found in the braine 38. If there be in death any thing that may daunt us 39. If the soule sleeps in the body after death 40. If there shall be any judiciall proceeding in the last day 41. If there shall be any signes of Christs coming 42. If Antichrist be yet knowne 43. If the naturall forme of a plant lost can be recovered 44. If beyond the tenth Sphere there is a place of blisse 45. Of Hell-fire and how it workes on the soule 46. Of the locall place of Hell 47. The soules of worthy Heathens where 48. Of the Châ—rches in Asia and Africa 49. If wee can bee confident of our salvation The CONTENTS of the second Part. 1 OF Physiognomie and Palmestry 2. If friends should be loved before parents 3. If one should love his friend as hee doth his God 4. If originall sin is not washed away in baptisme 5. Of Pride 6. If we should sue after knowledge 7. If the act of coition be foolish 8. Evill company to be avoided 9. If the soule was before the elements The CONTENTS of the ANIMADVERSIONS 1 IF the condition of the soule cannot bee changed without changing the essence 2. How the light is actus perspicui 3. If the first matter hath an actuall existence 4. If matter forme essence c. be but notions 5. Iudiciall Astrologie impious and repugnant to Divinity 6. If the Angels know all at their creation 7. If the light be a solid substance 8. If the soule depends on the body 9. If terrene soules appeare after death 10. Departed soules carry not with them affections to the objects left behind 11. If slaine bodies bleed at the sight of the murtherer 12. How God is the cause of annihilation and how the creature is capable of it 13. If our dust and ashes shall be all gatheâ—ed together in the last day 14. If the same identicall bodies shall rise â—gaine 15. If the forme or the matter gives nuâ—ericall individuation 16. If the matter without forme hath actuâ—ll being 17. If identity belong to the matter 18. If the body of a childe and of a man be â—he same 19. Of some Similies by which identicall â—esurrection seems to be weakned 20. If grace be a quality and how wee are â—ustified by grace I Have perused these Animadverâ—â—ons entitled Medicus Medicatus anâ— those likewise of Sir Kenelme Digbieâ— themselves also animadverted on bâ— the same Authour and finding then learned sound and solid I alloâ— them to bee printed and published that many others may receive thâ— same satisfaction content and delight in reading of them which professe my selfe to have enjoyed iâ— their perusall Iohn Downameâ— Medicus Medicatus THough the Authour desires that his Rhetorick may not be brought to the test of reason yet we must be bold to let him know that our reason is not given to us in vaine shall we suffer our selves to be wilfully blind-folded shall we shut our eyes that wee may not see the traps and snares â—aid in our waies he would have us sleep securely that the envious man may sowe tares among the good corne latet anguis in herba all is not gold that glisters it were strange stupidity in
description of Psyche affirmes her to be the youngest daughter of the great King intimating that she is not infuâ—ed till the body be first framed Many testimonies I could set downe here if I were not in haste Tenthly the Scripture is â—or us affirming that the soules returne to God that gave them but the bodie to the â—arth from whence it came therefore God keeps the same order in generation that hee did in creation first framing and articulating the body and its organs and then infusing the soule But the maine reason that enclines you to the opinion of traduction is the monstrous productions of men with beasts for in these you â—ay there is an impression and tincture of reaâ—on So I may say that Elephants are â—en because in them is an impression and â—incture of reason more then in any such â—onstrous birth Secondly if I should grant that in these equivocall productions there were more reason then in otheâ— beasts it will not prove the traduction oâ— the reasonable soule because the formative power of mans seed or the vegetativâ— faculty thereof which is not the worke oâ— the reasonable soule being conveigheâ— with the seed makes organs semblable to these of men and therefore somewhat fitter to exercise functions like those of men in which you may see the shadow of reason but not a reasonable soule which is not conveighed by the seed but infused into the body when it is articulated Thirdly if mens soules with the seed bâ— transfused into beasts then these monstrous productions must be men and so capable of salvation and damnation of faith and the Sacraments and the other mysteries of Religion You will not have the body the instrumeâ—â— of the soule but rather of sense and this thâ— hand of reason As if I would say The axâ— is not the proper instrument of the Carpeâ—ter but of his hand and this of the Carpeâ—ter Causa causae est causa causati what is subject to the sense is also subject to the soule But if you will speak properly the body is â—ot the instrument of the sense but the â—ense rather the bodies instrument for whether depends the body on the sense or â—his on the body the body can subsist without the sense not the sense without â—he body The whelp hath a body before â—he ninth day but not the sight because â—he corporeall organ of that sense is not till â—hen fitted for sight but to speak Philosoâ—hically the sense is the instrument of the whole compositum You cannot find in the braine the organ of â—he rationall soule which wee terme the feat of â—eason There is no reason why you â—hould seeing you confesse that this is a â—ensible argument of the soules inorganiâ—ie Shew me the seats of the Intellect and â—he Will and I will shew you the seat of Reason Though you can discover no more in 〈◊〉 mans brain then in the cranie of a beast yet mans braine differs specifically from that of â—he beast Now why we call the brainâ—â—he seat of reason is because the ratioâ—all soule makes use of the senses and â—he phantâ—sie which have their being in and their originall from the braine You find nothing in death able to daunt the courage of a man and you cannot highly love any that is affraid of it Then you would hardly love David that prayed against it and Ezechia that wept so bitterly when newes was brought to him of it Sure Christ as man was not quite exempt from the feare of it Hee often avoided it and wills his Disciples in persecution to flie from it The Apostle shewes that the Saints desire not to be unclothed but to be clothed upon There is something in it able to daunt the courage of man as it dissolves his fabrick of a wicked man as it is an introduction to eternall death of a Christian man as it is the fruit of Adams sinne and a part of that punishment laid on him and us all for sin Nullum animal ad vitam prodit sine metu mortis said hee who feared death as little as you And the greatest of all Philosophers not unfitly called it the most terrible of all terrible things The Philosophers Stone hath taught you that your immortall spirit or soule may â—ye obscure and sleep awhile within this house of flesh I am sure the Scripture teacheth you other Divinity to wit that the soule returnes to God that gave it Christ did not tell the penitent Thiefe that his soul should sleep in his house of flesh but that it should be with him in Paradise The soule of Lazarus was not left to sleep in that putrefied house of his flesh but was carried by the Angels into Abrahams bosome Saint Paul desired to be dissolved not to sleep in the grave but to be with Christ who will not leave the soules of his sons in that hell nor suffer them to see corruption whose comfort is that when this earthly tabernacle of their house shall be dissolved they have a building given them of God made without hands eternall in the Heavens You see then what a bad Schoole-master the Philosophers Stone is which hath taught so many to make shipwrack of their estates and you of the soules immortalitie You cannot dreame that there should be at the last day any such judiciall proceeding as the Scripture seemes to imply It seemes then that in your opinion the Scripture speaks here mystically but your bare word will not induce us to subscribe to your conceit being the whole Church from the beginning hath to this day beleeved that Christ shall in a judiciary way come as a Iudge and call all flesh before him and we shall stand all naked before his Tribunall and receive the sentence of life or death A mysticall and unknowne way of tryall will not stand so much with the honour of Christ as an open and visible that all may see and witnesse the justice of the Iudge First then observe we have the literall sense of the Scripture for our beliefe Secondly the consent of the Church Thirdly Reason for as the beginning of the world was so shall its consummation be that was not created in a mysterie as some have thought but really and visibly neither shall it be dissolved but after the same way it was created Fourthly it is fit that Christ who wâ—s not mystically but visibly and really judged by sinners should be the visible Judge of those his Judges and of all sinners therefore as the Apostles saw him ascend in glory not mystically so they shall see him with reall glory returne Fifthly this visible proceeding will be more satisfactory to the Saints who shall see their desire upon their enemies and vengeance really executed on those that afflicted them Sixthly and it will be more terrible to the wicked who have persecuted Christ in himselfe and in his members when they shall look on him whom they have pierced Seventhly if you thinke
this last Judgement to be but mysticall then you may as well say with Socinus that eternall death and eternall fire prepared for the wicked is only mysticall and signifieth nothing else but the annihilation of the wicked for ever without sensible paine which is indeed to overthrow all Religion and open a wide gap for impiety and security The antecedent signes of Christs coming you thinke are not consistent with his secret coming as a thiefe in the night You must know that the wars and signes in the Sun Moon and Stars are partly meant of those signes which were the fore-runners of Ierusalems last destruction Secondly if wee understand them of the signes of Christs second coming they are meant oâ— such wars and apparitions as have noâ— been knowne in the world since the beginning in respect of the extent and numbeâ— of them Thirdly though signes goe before his coming yet men shall be so secure and hard-hearted eating drinking and making merry as in the dayes of Noah that they will take no notice of warning thereby then shall Christ come suddenly as a thiefe in the night Hardly hath any man attained you say thâ— perfect discovery of Antichrist These notes which are given by Christ Saint Iohn and Saint Paul doe most agree to the Pope who sits in the Temple of God as God and exalts himself above all that 's called God in throning and dethroning of Kings and disposing of their Kingdomes at his pleasure in pardoning sins in making of Saints and dedicating temples and dayes unto them in dispensing with cancelling and making of lawes at his pleasure in tying sanctitie infallibilitie of judgement to his Chaire and freedome from errour in appointing new sacraments and lawes in the Church and domineering over mens conâ—ciences in dispensing with matrimony forbidden by Gods lawes and the law of Nature in assuming to himselfe those tiâ—les which are due onely to God These and many other notes have prevailed so far with Wickliffe the Waldenses Hus Ierome Luther Calvin Bucer and other eminent men of our profession that they thought they had attained the perfect discovery of Antichrist If you know any other to whom these notes doe more exactly agree name him and wee will free the Pope from being the man of sin and childe of perdition A plant you say consumed to ashes retains its forme being withdrawne into its incombustible part where it lies secure from the fire and so the plant from its ashes may againe revive Admiranda canis sed non credenda For if the forme of the plant be there still then it is not consumed Secondly then Philosophy deceives us in telling us that the matter is onely eternall and the formes perishing Thirdly then Art and Nature is all one both being able to introduce or rather educe a substantiall forme Fourthly then the radicall moisture and naturall heat without which the forme hath no subsistence in the plant is not consumed by the fire but in spight of all its heat lurkes within the ashes credat Iudaeus Apella Fifthly then an Art being an accident can produce a substance and so the effect is nobler then the cause Sixthly then from a totall privation to the habit whose cause was taken away there may be a naturall regresse Seventhly if the forme of the plant be in the ashes still then it actuates distinguishes denominaâ—es defines perfects the matter for the ashes are not the first but second matter in which it is and so it is a plant still lurking under the accidents of ashes as in the Masse Christs bodie under the accidents of bread So by your Doctrine it is no hard worke to beleeve Transubstantiation or the storiâ—s of the Phenix Eighthly if the forme of the plant be still in the ashes then the forme is not in its owne matter but in another for so long as the ashes are ashes they are â—ot the matter of the plant but of that â—ubstance we call ashes Ninthly by this â—lso the appetite of the matter is taken away for to what can it have an appetite â—eeing it retaines the forme of the plant But I doubt mee your revived plant will prove more artificiall then naturall and â—ike Xeuxes his grapes deceive perhaps â—irds but not men So farre as I can perâ—eive in Quercitan and others who have written of Chymistry this forme of the plant is nothing but an Idea or a delusion of the eye through a glasse held over a flame wherein you may see somewhat like a plant a cloud in stead of Iuno A sallet of such plants may well tantalize you they will never fill you Though it be true that where Gods â—resence is there is Heaven yet wee must not therefore thinke that there is not a peculiar ubi of blisse and happinesse beyond the tenth Sphere wherein God doth more manifestly shew his glory and presence then any where else as you seeme to intimate when you say that to place Heaven â—n the Empyreall or beyond the tenth Sphere is to forget the worlds destruction which when it is destroyed all shall be here as it is now there First we deny that this sensible world shall be destroyed in the substance thereof its qualities shall be altered the actions motions and influences of the Heavens shall cease because then shall be no generation or corruption and consequently no transmutation of elements Secondly though this sensible world were to be destroyed yet it will not follow that therefore above the tenth Sphere there is not the Heaven of glory Whither was it that Christ ascended Is hee not said to ascend above all Heavens and that the Heavens must containe him till his second coming Did not the Apostles see him ascend in a cloud Doe not you acknowledge it an Article of your Creed Was not Saint Paul caught up into the third Heaven If you thinke there is no other Heaven meant in Scripture then Gods presence it must follow that Christs humanity is every-where because hee is in Heaven that is in Gods presence which is every-where and so you are of the Ubiquitâ—ries â—aith therefore we beleeve as the Church â—ath alwaies done that Heaven is locall â—r a place above this visible world whiâ—her Christ is gone to prepare a place for â—s which is called the Throne of God where â—ee have an habitation made without â—ands given us of God eternall in the Heavens Let us therefore seek the things not which be every-where but which are above where Christ is at the right hand of God The Gentiles as Tertullian witnesseth were not ignorant of the place of blessed soules quas in supernis mansionibus collocant which they placed in these upper mansions of Heaven Apud Platonem in aeherem sublimantur c. You cannot tell how to say fire is the essence of Hell nor can you conceive a flame that can prey upon the soule Flames of sulphur in Scripture are you thinke to be understood not of this present