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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A69038	The theatre of Catolique and Protestant religion diuided into twelue bookes. Wherein the zealous Catholike may plainelie see, the manifest truth, perspicuitie, euident foundations and demonstrations of the Catholique religion; together with the motiues and causes, why he should perseuer therin. ... Written by I.C. student in diuinitie.	I. C., student in divinity.; Copinger, John, b. 1571 or 2, attributed name.; Colleton, John, 1548-1635, attributed name.	1620 (1620)	STC 4284; ESTC S115632	314,600	666

the order of the tradition which was then deliuered vnto them to whome they comitted the church to the which many nations of those barbarous people that haue beleeued in Christe doe consente without letter or inke hauinge saluation written in in their hartes and keepinge diligentlie the tradition of our elders and soe S. Hier. saith cont Heres 9. The creede of our faith and hope which beinge deliuered by tradition from the Apostles is not written in paper and Incke but in the tables of the hearte and this is in the church booke also wherby wherein shee keepeth faithfully all trueth in the hartes of those to whome the Aposles did preach And therfore S. Paule saith 2. Thes 2.15 Brethren stande hold the tradition which you haue learned whether it be by worde or by epistle not only the thinges written and sett downe in the hollye scriptures but all other truethes and pointes of religion vttered by worde of mouthe and deliuered and giuen by the Apostles to their schollers And so S. Basil saith thus I accompte it Apostolique tradition to continue firmlie euen in vnwritten traditions and to proue this he alleadgeth this place of saint Paule ●n the same booke cap. 17. and saith if wee once goe aboute to reiecte vnwritten customes as thinges of no importance wee shal ere wee beware endamadge the principall partes of our faith and bringe the preachinge of the ghospell to a naked name and so example of these necessarie traditiōs he named the signe of the Crosse prayinge towardes the easte the wordes spoken at the eleuation or shewinge of the holy Euchariste with diuers ceremonies vsed before and after baptisme with three immersions in the fonte the wordes of abrenunciation and exorcismes of the partie that is to be baptised and what scripture saith he taught these and such like None trulie all cominge by secret and silent traditions c. S. Hierome reckneth vpp diuers such like traditions Hieron in dialogo Lucife c. 4. epist com Luci 28. willinge men to attribuit to the Apostles such customes as the Church hath receaued by Christians of diuers Countrie 5. S. August ad Genn saith Let vs holde faste those thinges that are not written but are deliuered vnto vs which beinge generally obserued in all places of the worlde wee must thincke them to come from the Apostles or from the generall councells which oughte to be of greate authoritie in the churche of God and whosoeuer will dispute hereof ought to be counted of most insolent madnes S. Hier. ad Luc. wee must obserue the traditions of our Ancestors S. Paule comaunded vs to submitt our selues to our pastors and teachers S. Augustine saith wee learne by tradition that children in their infancie shoulde be baptized de gen ad liter 101. 23. Tradition caused him to beleeue that the baptized of heretiques should not be rebaptized by tradition onlie he and others condemned Heluidius the heretique for denyinge the perpetuall virginitie of our Ladie and without this noe Arrian noe Macedonian noe Pelagian noe Caluin will will yealde Wee must vse tradition saith Epiph for the scripture hath not all thinges and therfore the Apostles deliuered certaine thinges by tradition S. Iren. lib. 3. 14. saith that in all questions wee must haue recourse to the traditions of the Apostles teachinge vs withall that the waie to true apostolicall tradition and to bringe it to the fountaine is by the apostolicall succession of Bishoppes but especially of the apostolicall church of Rome declaring in the same place that there are manie barbarous people simple for learninge but for constancie in the faith moste wise which neuer had scriptures but learned onlie by tradition Tert. lib de corn reckoneth vpp a great number of christian obseruations or customes as S. Cyprian in mannie places doth whereof in fine he concludethe of such and such If thou require the rule of scriptures thou shalt finde none tradition shal be alleadged the author custome the confirmer and faith of the obseruer Orig. he mil. 5. proueth the same Dyonisius Areopag referreth the oblation and prayinge for the death in the lyturgie or Masse to an Apostolicall tradition Soe doth Tertull Aug. Chrys Damasc alleadge Also wee mighte add that the scriptures themselues euen all the bookes of the Byble be giuen vs by tradition else should wee not take them as they be indeede for the infallible worde of God noe more then the worcks of S. Ignat. S. Aug. S. Dion and the like 6. The true sense alsoe of the scriptures which Catholiques haue and heretiques haue not remayneth still in the Church by tradition the Creede is an Apostolicall tradition Ruff. in expo simb ad principium Hier. Epist. 61. cap. 9. Ambr. ser 38. Aug. de Simb ad Cath. lib. 3. cap. 1. Alsoe it is by tradition wee hould that the holie Ghost is God therfore Macedonius was condemned in the 2. Naz. lib. ● Theol. councell of Constantinople for an heretique for that he denyed the same because in the scripture this name is not giuen vnto him for in the scriptures manny thinges are said to be such by Metaphors which are not soe indeede as that God is a sleepe that he is angrie that he is sorrye although noe such thinge is in God as alsoe manny thinges that are such and yet are not mentioned in the scriptures God to be ingenitus with manny such attributes as Trinitie parson consubstantialitie hypostasis vnto hypostatica homousion and because the Arrians did not yelde vnto the same not findinge them in the scriptures they were in the councell of Nyce condemned for heretiques And althoughe the verie wordes be not in the scripture yet they be collected of the sence of the scriptures And soe S. Cyrill Cyrill l. 1. dialogorū de trinit of that place of scripture Ego sum qui sum I am the same that is doth gather that the sonne is consubstantiall with the father although the worde consubstantiall is not founde in the scriptures So the catholique Church in all ages out of the sense of the scripture doth gather that wee oughte to pray vnto Sainctes to pray for the deade that there is a Purgatorie althoughe the verie wordes themselues be not there And when S. Paule did speake of the holy Eucharist he broughte noe scriptures to proue it I haue receaued of our Lord saith he that I deliuered vnto you he alleadged nothinge but tradition which he had receaued from our Lorde that a woman ought not teache in the Churche that a womān ought to be couered that the man oughte to be bareheadded that the Bishoppe ought to be husband of one wife he alleadginge nothinge but the custome if any man would be captious or contentious he did oppose against thē the custome of the Churche saying wee haue noe such custome nor the Church of God and whosoeuer despiseth these thinges he doth not despise man but God And therfore wee are referred by the holie

more indisciplinable then they were in poperie These be Luthers owne wordes As touching their learninge or knowledge in diuinitie Stanc lib. de trinitate mediatore Francis Stancarus witnesseth one of their prophetts one Petrus Lombardus is more worthie then one hundreth Luthers two hundred Melancthons three hundred Bullingers foure hundreth Martyrs fiue hundreth Caluines Who all if they were pounded in one morter there could not be beaten out of them one ounce of true diuinitie especiallie in the articles of the trinitie incarnation mediator and sacraments 12. You see what testimonie your owne prophett doth beare against you looke to all those countries where they haue stirred vpp their tragedies was there any countrie the better for this ghospell or was the wicked life of any one reformed by it or were the professors themselues amended any thinge in their wicked liues by it Compare the wicked life of the professors of this newe religion with the vertuous life of the holie fathers that haue planted the religion that wee professe No kingdome gained vnto thirst by the woord Haue they not shined in all holines of life in all heauenly conuersation by which they haue allured the hearts of faithles and stiffnecked gentiles did they conuerte any kingdome vnto Christe by the sword haue they euer surprised citties or ouerthrowen kingdomes or euer brought with them armies into the fielde no not by the sword but by godes word and humilitie of spiritte haue they ouercome the deuill Was not Luther a professed Fryar many yeares who beinge giuen to loosenes of life did transgresse the lawe of God in breakinge his vowe by which he consecrated himselfe to serue God in holines of life and continencie of body all the dayes of his life whoe rann awaie and tooke a Nunne with him out of her Cloister Was not Iohn Caluine the fire brād of France and Scotland and other countries alsoe he being a priest for Sodomitticall wickednesse burned in the backe and continewinge his wicked life stil in that filthie sinne surprised Geneua Was not Beza his next successor giuen to that wicked and abhominable sinne with a boy called Andebertus and that manifestlie And to defend their wicked lines and filthie sensualitie they cast forth poisoned doctrine as that vowes and votaries are not made by the lawe of God that wee are not iustified by works done by Gods grace and that the same be not meritorious before God but that wee are iustified by faith only that all our woorkes though neuer soe good are sinfull before God that to bridle or restraine our filthie desires is to resist Gods ordinaunces that God is the cause of all euill and that from him all mischeefe comes Therfore they take away free will from man saying that man doth not concurre to his owne iustification with many such damntble heresies which were to long to relate and whether these be false prophetts who bringe into the world such poisoned doctrine lett euerie man iudge at least lett him take heede that his soule be not poisoned therwith in followinge their liues or imbracinge their cursed heresies out of which as our Sauiour wittnesseth noe good fruicte can bud forthe and consequentlie noe meritorious works of religion or charitie can wee euer expect at their handes The absurditie of this doctrin that euery one should assure him selfe that he is predestinated vnto life euerlastinge and that wee ought to be soe certayne therof as wee should not once feare the contrarie or to misdoubt the same is discussed CHAPTER V. 1. THis doctrine is most false wicked and hereticall sith the holie scriptures saie Cogitationes mortalium timidae incertae prouidentiae nostrae Sap. 9. The thoughtes of men are fearfull and their prouidence is vncertaine by reason that the bodie which is corrupted doth aggrauate the soule beinge in great danger by reason of the inclinations of the flesh occasions of the world and tentations of the deuill and wee being in the countrie of our enemies wherevpon S. Bernard saith faciles sumus ad seducendum debiles ad operandum sragiles ad resistendum wee are easilie to be seduced weake to worke and labour well and fraile to resist manfullie and couragiouslie And soe our Sauiour said to the Apostle Luc. 10. Neminem per viam salutaueritis You shall salute none by the waie as S. Vincentius expoundeth Ser. 11. post trinit Saluum dixeritis viatorem to him that is a poore pilgrime● or stranger you cannot assure his saftie without danger nor securitie without feare for the shipp is not safe without feare in dangerous seas otherwise wee should not be admonished Lauda post mortem magnifica post consumationem prayse none before his deathe nor magnifie any before his end The scripture confirminge the same Eccle. 9. Nemo scit vtrum ●dio vel amore dignus sit sed omnia in futurum seruantur incerta None knoweth whether he be worthie of hatred or loue when all thinges are reserued in tyme to come And therfore the Apostle which was one of the greatest Saintes that was saith Nihil mihi conscius sum 1. Cor. 4. sed tamenin hoc non iustificatus sum I am not guiltie in conscience of any thinge but I am not iustified herein The Apostle durst not assure himselfe that he was iustified neither would he iudge whether this thoughtes were pure or noe but the trial thereof he left to Gods iudgment And for this cause wee are wild to worke our saluation with feare and tremblinge 2. As for predestination which is almightie God his election foresight purpose and decree of his deare children as alsoe his other actes touchinge their vocation inspiration illustration and illumination of them and consequentlie their iustification and last of all their glorification wee doe not denie but it ought to be reuerenced and embraced of all men with tremblinge feare dreadfull humilitie but that wee should not cast our selues with headlonge fall into any precipitat madnes and presumptuous malipartnes for this hath bene the gulfe wherein manie proude persons aswell at this tyme as before haue by godes iust iudgment perished groundinge thereon most execrable heresies and damnable blasphemies against godes mercie good life free will humble behauiour and religious christian modestie Rom. 8. S. Paule hath these wordes of predestination whome he hath forknowen he hath also predestinated to be made conformable to the Image of his sonne that he might be the first borne in many brethren and whome he hath predestinated them also he hath called and whome he hath called them also he hath iustified and whome he hath iustified them alsoe he hath glorified S. Augustine answereth those that are curious of Gods fore-knowledge and decree who saith Si quaeras c. If any man will aske wherfore God doth make choise more of this man then of that man lett him search godes inscrutable and vnsearcheable iudgment and in that search lett him take

But to those wordes of our Sauiour S. Basill doth aunswere saying Nihil aliud ijs recepi verbis intelligi Bas in Ethicis quam quod humanis traditionibus ad mandatum Dei reprobandum obsequendum non sit that nothinge else is meante by those wordes then that wee ought not obey such traditions as are repugnant to Godes lawes as many obseruations of the Iewes and alsoe of the pharisies were then and the like traditions of heretiques are nowe yet we ought to obey the custome of the church otherwise wee should be counted by the wordes of Christe as Ethnicks and Publicans But the traditions deliuered to vs by the pastors and fathers thereof which are the foundation of our faith and which are not repugnant to Godes precepts nor to his lawes or scriptures but doe rather confirme the same are not meant by those wordes for Godes worde doth not consiste onlie of the scripture Vppon what occasion heraesie did growe but also of tradition for such as were old heretiques did not gainsaie the written word but because they did not beleue the tradition of the church and the definition thereof they were soe counted and accursed 2. That the sonne is of the same substance with the father the catholique fathers haue defined by godes word but because the heretiques did not finde the same written they would not beleue the church which did grant it was nor written but deliuered by tradition Soe as you may see the difference betwixt the heretique and the catholique Felix Pontifex writinge to Benignum 130. yeares before the councell of Nyce saith that it was an Apostolicall tradition that the sonne was of one substance with the father and that the holie Ghoast is to be adored as the father and the sonne and that he is of the same substance with the father and when the same heretiques did aske where it was written the church did answere them that it was deliuered vnto them by tradition which two pointes continued afterwardes by the 2. councell of Nyce and Constinople Articles of faith by traditions Also in the councell of Ephesus that the blessed Virgin Marie should be called the mother of God In the councell of chalcedon that there are two natures in Christe In the 3. councell of Constantinople that there are in him two wills and two operations In the second councell of Nyce against heretiques that the church should vse Images In the generall councell of florence that the holy ghoast proceedeth from the father and the sonne And when heretiques did relie all vpon the scripture the catholique fathers did conuince their interpretation of scriptures by tradition of the successiue doctors and fathers in all ages The tradition also that easter daye should be obserued vpon the sondaie next after vnto the 14. daie of the new Moone as some doe write S. Peter and S. Paule ordained so as in all pointes of doctrine wee recurr to the tradition of our ancestors and when you teache that all thinges are ●on by necessitie not by the free will of man wee recurr vnto the successiue age and wee find out that the first author was Symon magnus next vnto him was Marcion next vnto Marcion was Manichaeus next vnto him was Petrus Adelhardus Next vnto him was Iohn Wicklief Next after whome followed your great master Martyne Luther so that we find in all antiquitie of tymes that this doctrine was detested by the holy doctors that liued in those ages 3. Againe when you obiect vnto vs your tradition of your imputatiue iustice where you say that our faith is imputed vnto vs by the iustice of Christ as if it had bene our owne iustice as also that euery one vnder paine of damnation is bounde to beleue Tradition of protestantes and to be certaine that his sinnes be forgiuen him that he should not mistrust his proper infirmitie therein also that not any one is iustified but he that beleues for certaine that he is iustified and that his iustification and absolution of his sinnes is effected by faith onlie without any relation to the Sacraments and that euerie one is bound to beleue that he is in the number of those that are predestinated and that by all infallible certitude he hath the guifte of perseuerance to be the true seruante of God vnto the last gaspe of his life this and such like wee can not find in the scriptures nor in the fathers nor in the doctors of the churche but rather the contrarie and that which the holie catholique churche calles pennaunce All things peruerted by the protestants you call terror of conscience and that which she calles Sacraments and sacrifice you call it the Lords supper wee search the fathers and wee can finde noe such wordes and although somtimes they make mention of the supper yet more often doe they call the same a sacrifice Did not S. Paule wish Timothy to keepe his depositum to auoide the prophane nouelties of voices and oppositions of false tearmed knowledge For the scripture is not subiecte to loftie skill or arrogant or presumptuous mindes who I pray hath greater skill or knowledge and vnderstandinge of the scriptures then the deuilles and yet it auaileth them nothinge because their mindes are possessed with malice and their hartes are emptie of charitie soe as men doe not sinne so much by the ignorance of the vnderstanding as by the malice of the will Aug. de doctrina Christi an cap. 35. and accordinge to S. Augustine the summe scope of all the scriptures is charity whosoeuer saith he that seemes to vnderstād the scripture or any parcell thereof soe that his vnderstandinge doth not edifie that knott I meane the loue of God and our neigbors he hath not as yet vnderstoode the scriptures 4. Now all your manner of administration and ministerie is your owne tradition and inuention without scripture or warrant of godes worde but the traditions of the Apostles and ancients and all the preceptes of holie churche were comaūded to be kepte and they are not prescribed by man only but are made by the holie ghoast ioyninge with our pastors in the regimente of the faithfull Luc. 2.37 Matt. 18. where Christe saith he that heareth you heareth me and he that despiseth you despiseth me they are made by our mother the churche which whosouer obeieth not wee are warned to take him as a heathen 2. Cor. 3. S. Paule willed the people to keepe the decrees that were decreede by the Apostles and auncientes at Ierusalem he commaunded the people to keepe the precepts of the Apostles You are saith he written in our hartes not written with Incke but with the finger of the holy ghost S. Paule wrote many thinges not vttered in any epistle as some of the Apostles wrote the christian religion in the hartes of their hearers Wherfore Ireneus saith Iren. l. 3.4 what if the Apostles also had lefte noe scriptures ought wee not to followe

behold with the eyes of our vnderstanding for noe sensible thinge was deliuered vs of Christe but vnder thinges sensible But as for those thinges which he deliuered they are all out of the reache of our senses Soe in baptisme is that excellēt guifte that is giuen by water which water is a sensible thinge But that which therin is wroughte I meane the sprituall generation that is to be conceaued by the vnderstandinge for if thow hadest bene without a bodie he would haue deliuered these guiftes simply also without bodies But for as much as thy soule is coupled and ioyned to a body therfore they are deliuered vnto thee vnder bodilie and sensible thinges that they may be the better vnderstood S. Chrys hom 24. O quot modo dicunt vellem formam speciem eius vellem vestimenta ipsa vellem calceamenta videre hunc ipsum vides ipsum tangis ipsum comedis O how many doe say now a dayes I woold faine see his forme phisiognomie behold thou seeste himselfe thow dost touch himselfe thow dost eate him thow desirest to see his garments but he deliuereth himselfe vnto thee not that thow shouldest see him only but touch him and haue him within thee Lett noe mam therfore come neere whose stomacke wambleth or riseth against it nor anny that is cold of deuotion but lett all such that approach herunto be sturred vpp and feruentie inflamed for if the Iewes did eate their Paschale lambe with haste standinge on their feete with their shoes on and holding their staues in their hands how much more muste we watch and be diligent for they were takinge their iourney from Egipte to Pallestine and therfore they had on wayfaringe and pilgrimes apparell but thow art goinge vpp from earth to heauen wherfore thow muste watch and take good heede Yf a Duke saith he in that homilie if the coūcell it selfe yea if he that wereth the crowne come herunto vnworthilie forbid him keepe him backe thie autoritie is greater then his If soe be that a fountaine of most pure water were comitted to thie chardge to be kept cleane for thie flock when thow shouldest see most stinckinge and filthie swine drawe nere thow wouldest not suffer them And now whereas a most holie fountaine not of water but of blood and spiritt is comitted vnto thee if thow shalt see those men drawe neere which are most defiled with sinne wilt thow not take indignation and forbid them Thus farr S. Chrisostome who most plainlie declareth Christs reall presence Chrysost hom 24. 1. Cor. 1. not only in this homilie but vpon the first Epistle of S. Paule to the Corinthians And also moste euidentlie in his second homilie to the people of Antioch saying What will yow say then if I shewe yow that soe manny of vs as be partakers of the holie misteries doe receiue a thinge farr greater then that which Elias gaue for Elias left vnto his disciple his Cloake but the sonne of God ascendinge into heauen lefte with vs his flesh And againe Elias wēt himselfe without his cloak but Christe both lefte his flesh with vs and ascendeth hauinge with him the selfe same fleshe c. By which the sacramentaries can not possible mantaine the blessed Sacramente to be a remembrance only of Christs flesh if they will admitt this holy and learned doctors testimonie For Elias lefte a remēbrance of himselfe alsoe when he lefte his cloake behind him But herein standeth the force of this comparison that Christ farr passeth Elias therfore saith S. Chrisostome he did not only leaue a farr more excellent thinge vid. his owne flesh but also tooke the same with him into heauen which he lefte behind him Cyrill li. 4. c. 13. in Iohn 7. S. Cyrill that famous Bishoppe of Alexandria in Egipt who for his great sanctitie and science was appointed president of the generall councell of Ephesus against Eutiches and Dioscorus anno Domini 434. doth agree with S. Chrisostome who vpon S. Iohns ghospell in his 6. chapper hath these woordes Then the Iewes fell at variance amoungest themselues sayinge Quomodo potest hic nobis carnem suam dare ad manducandum How can this man giue vs his flesh to eate The malitious and wicked minde whatsoeuer he vnderstandeth not he reiecteth vpon pride as vaine and false ne●her will he giue place to anny other or thincke any thinge true which is aboue his owne capacitie and such wee shall finde the Iewes in this place for whereas they hauinge nowe perceiued by those miraculous signes Christs diuine power they should of right haue allowed that which he said they cleene cōtrariwise saie how can this man give vs his flesh They crie out blasphemouslie vpō God not callinge to minde that with him nothinge is impossible 1. Cor. 2. for beinge as S. Paule saith sensuall and carnall they could not vnderstand spirituall thinges but this great misterie seemeth vnto thē peeuishnes and folly But let vs I beseeche yow take greate profitt of other mens sinnes and beleeuinge stedfastlie those misteries let vs neuer vtter with our mouthes or soe much as thincke with our harte that same how for it is a Iewish word and deserueth extreame punishmente And Nicodemus therfore whē he saied how may these thinges be b●ought to passe was aunswered accordinglie arte thou a maister in Israell and ignorant hereof Exod. 4. Exod. 7. A little after in that place he saith How was Moyses rodd turned into a serpente how was his hand stroken with a leprosie in a momente restored againe to his former state Exo. 14. Exo. 15. Exo. 17. how the waters were turned into blood how did their fore fathers escape through the middst of the sea as though they had walked vpon the drie land Iosue 3. Iosue 6. howe were the bitter waters changed sweete by the tree howe fountaines of water did flowe oute of the stone howe the running riuer of Iordan stoode still There are innumerable thinges in which if thou aske how thow must needes ouerthrowe the scripture sett at naught the doctrine of the prophetts and Moyses owne writinges wherfore yee Iewes should haue beleeued Christ rather then like dronken folke cry out how can this man giue vs his flesh Thus farr S. Cyrill Cap. 14. in Ioh. and more at Iardge in his 4. booke alleadginge that of Isaias for if yow beleeue not saith he yow shall not vnderstād First therfore they should haue fastned the rootes of faith in their minde and afterwardes aske those questions meete for men to aske Cyrill lib. 4. c. 23. 8. And the said S. Cyrill in another place saith Yee doe not vnwisely denie that the flesh hath altogether power to quicken and giue life for if yow aske the fleash alone by it selfe it can nothinge at all quicken as lacking that which should quicken it But if yow will search the misterie of the Incarnation and will knowe him that dwelleth in flesh although fleshe by it selfe be able