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hand_n	good_a	king_n	lord_n	7,040	5	3.9036	3	false

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A19394	An apologie for sundrie proceedings by iurisdiction ecclesiasticall, of late times by some chalenged, and also diuersly by them impugned By which apologie (in their seuerall due places) all the reasons and allegations set downe as well in a treatise, as in certaine notes (that goe from hand to hand) both against proceeding ex officio, and against oaths ministred to parties in causes criminall; are also examined and answered: vpon that occasion lately reuiewed, and much enlarged aboue the first priuate proiect, and now published, being diuided into three partes: the first part whereof chieflie sheweth what matters be incident to ecclesiasticall conisance; and so allowed by statutes and common law: the second treateth (for the most part) of the two wayes of proceeding in causes criminal ... the third concerneth oaths in generall ... Whereunto ... I haue presumed to adioine that right excellent and sound determination (concerning oaths) which was made by M. Lancelot Androvves ....; Apologie: of, and for sundrie proceedings by jurisdiction ecclesiasticall	Cosin, Richard, 1549?-1597.; Andrewes, Lancelot, 1555-1626. Quaestionis: nunquid per jus divinum, magistratui liceat, a reo jusjurandum exigere? & id, quatenus ac quousque liceat?.	1593 (1593)	STC 5822; ESTC S118523	485,763	578

the finding out and fetching of a wife for his sonne Isaac of his owne kindred hee willed him to lay his hand vnder his thigh with this ceremonie likewise 2 Gen. 47. v. 29. did Iacob take an oath of his sonne Ioseph that hee should not burie him in Aegypt thereby as it were signifying that simplie they were to take the oathe euen as they looked for Saluation in the promised Messiah that was to descend of those two Patriarkes according to the flesh So doeth Saint 3 Aug. de ciuit Dei lib. 16. ca. 33 Augustine interprete this ceremonie The hand saieth he put vnder the thigh did signifie that the Lord according to the fleshe was to descend from that person Another ceremonie besides this we find vsed in holy Scripture when such corporall and more impressiue oathe was taken and that is the lifting vp of the hand towards heauen a gesture so commonly vsed that sometimes it is taken for the oathe it selfe For Abraham 4 Gen. 14. v. 22. 23. sayd to the king of Sodome I haue lift vp my hand vnto the Lorde the most high God possessour of heauen and earth that I will not c. Likewise God saieth in 5 Deut. 32. v. 40. Deuteronomie I lift vp mine hand to heauen and say I liue for euer And likewise where it is 6 Exod. 6. v. 7. sayde I will bring you into the lande which I lift vp mine hand id est sware that I would giue to Abraham Isaac and Iacob So the Prophet Ezechiel I 7 Ezech. 20. v. 15 lift vp mine hand vnto them in the wildernesse that I would not bring them into the lande c. That these were oaths taken with that significant ceremonie another 8 Dan. 12. v. 7. Prophet declareth I heard the man clothed in linnen which was vpon the waters of the Riuer when hee helde vp his right hand and his left hand vnto heauen and sware by him that liueth for euer with the same pertinent gesture doeth the Angell in 9 Apoc. 10. v. 5. the Reuelation sweare by the liuing God lifted vp his hands towards heauen where by immutable prouidence that was decreed from whence commeth swift iudgement vpon all that make or loue leasings This gesture in taking a corporall oath was so vsuall that from the people of God it seemeth to haue bene deriued downe and taken vp euen with the Gentiles 1 Virgil. lib 12 Aenead sequitur sic deinde Latinus Suspiciens caelum tenditque ad syderadextram Haec eadem Aenea terram mare sydera iuro as Virgil writeth And no lesse is by some thought to be meant in the Digests of the ciuil Lawe by the word 2 L. quidam ff de probationibus emissamanus Yea and the practise of that very ceremonie of swearing with laying hand vpon the holie Gospels was both had and allowed by the Fathers in the Primitiue Church as appeareth by Saint 3 Aug ad Publicol epist. 154. Augustine in his Epistle ad Publicolam In the times of the ancient Christian Emperours it was receiued and vsed in Ciuill Courtes An oathe saieth 4 Nouell Iustin. 8. vel 9. Iustinian is then saide to bee corporally taken when a man in swearing doeth touch with his hand the holy Gospels And againe 5 L. generaliter § in omnibus C. de rebus credit iureiur Whether the oathe be to be taken in tublike iudgement or in houses or in holie Oratories or with touching the holie Scriptures c. And it is prouided not 6 L. rem non nouam § patroni C. de iudicijs onely that they shall be taken tactis sacrosanctis Euangelijs but that 7 Ibidem ante the Scriptures shall lie continually before the Iudges sitting in iudgement that both they and the suters may bee put in minde that the iudgement is Gods and doone in his presence For touching the holie Gospels at the taking of an oathe wee haue other testimonies also recorded in 8 L. 2. C. de iuramento propter calumniam dando § 1. § nulli de sanctiss ep in Auth. ancient lawes So for the laying of holie Scriptures before them at the time of taking oathe both 9 Auth. sed iudex C. de episcopis clericis c. fin de iuram calumniae Clem. 1. de homicid Clem. 1. § porrò de haereticis out of Lawe and Canons And by the most generall custome of all Christendome the same ceremonie in taking a corporall oathe is vntill this day continued But it is 10 Panorm in c. li Christus de iureiur reported that in Italie they vse to lay their hand vpon any Booke Bible or other And it seemeth by a 11 Duarenus in tit ft. de iureiur ca. 11. French Writer that they which sweare there doe vse to holde vp their hand towards heauen thereby signifying that they call God to witnesse In some other places they take a corporall oathe by laying their hand on their breast But where the Treatisor reprehēdeth at taking an oath a vaine ceremonie and sond inuention as he calleth it of stretching out three middle fingers vpon the booke the thombe and litle finger vnder it with some mysterie by him supposed thereby to be signified as if hereby this Church of England or present regiment therof which he oppugneth were therein to bee touched Truely hee might with lesse shewe of humour haue spared that vaine and fond inuention insomuch as no such matter is either by law commanded by Iudges vrged or by any others practised One other Ceremonie or maner of taking an oath is by some of them also reprehended that is for swearing by the booke or by the contents of it We doe finde in a very old statute of this Realme termed the awarde of Kenelworth these 1 51. Hen. 3. wordes All that haue to doe in this b●…halfe shall s●…eare vpon the holy Gospels of God that none shall take reuengement c. by occasion of the Commotion And in the same Statute not onely vpon but also by the holy Gospels For it is there thus 2 Ibidem conteined Those that haue bene robbers in warres roades and haue nothing shall come and sweare by the holy Gospels of God finding sufficient suretie that from hencefoorth they shall keepe the peace and suffer satisfaction and penance after the iudgement of the Church where by the way may be noted that it seemeth Ordinaries then did and might enioyne penance and satisfaction to parties delinquent for wrongs done by them in temporal goods and chattels The maner of swearing by the 3 1. Eliz. ca. 1. contents of the Booke is prescribed to bee vsed in the oath of the Queenes supremacie But is this the onely cause thinke yee that some of that suite refuse wholy to take it or come very hardly vnto it Some of them mince it and glose vpon it and I know not

the Imposers of them to be in a Praemunire for incroching vpon the Kings rights and prerogatiues and for conuenting subiects by forrein made Lawes and for practising Antichristian Decrees and Popish Canons which hee sayeth appeareth by the Praemunire brought by Hunne against a person suing the said Hunne for his yoong deceased infants bearing-cloth by the name of a Mortuarie in an Ecclesiasticall Court howe doth this inferre that it is Praemunire either to encroch vpon the Kings rights prerogatiues though this peraduenture by some circumstances may amounte sometimes to no lesse or to conuent subiects by foreine made lawes It may not be thought that euery intrusion deteiner or concealement which is incroching vpon the Kings right or rauishment of his wardes which hee ought to haue by his Prerogatiue Royall is straightway and necessarilie a Praemunire neither were the Kings Temporall Courtes in this case encroched vpon because they could not giue remedie for deteining a Mortuary if this were so in trueth to be accounted neither yet is there so much as any mention made of foreine lawes which the Ecclesiasticall Court then proceeded by or practised This course of the Treatisour is rather to prophesie then to reason thus to tell vs afore hand vpon the very bringing of the action of Praemunire by Hunne what the iudgement was in that matter yea and vpon what ground the iudgement was giuen in a cause which neuer receiued iudgement for any thing I can learne To this point he also mentioneth the Praemunire wherein blind Nixe sometimes Bishop of Norwich was condemned and addeth to the aforesaid two points that by that also appeareth Iudges Ecclesiasticall are in Praemunire whensoeuer they exceede their Iudiciall authority But if euery exceeding of authoritie were a Praemunire then what Iudge is there of any court of either sort so skilfull or alwayes so aduised but might iustly feare that at one time or other he shall not escape this rigorous doom of Praemunire In trueth this example prooueth all his three points iust alike that is none of them at all I doe verily beleeue the Treatisour neuer sawe that Record if he haue either he makes verie bolde with his Reader or else with the Arte of reasoning thus to collect I haue perused the Record 1 H. 25 H. 8. Rot. 42. Suffolk it selfe it containeth a suite of Praemunire brought against the saide Bishop by the Kings Attourny generall on the Friday after the P●…rification pleading the Statute of 16. Ric. 2 and adding that al Indictments Presentments and Impetitions in any court of the Kings 2 B. Nixe his condemnation in a Praemunite or in any Court of a subiects which is in any sort deriued or diduced from the Kings crowne duely taken or found are to be tried iudged in that Court where they were found or in some of the Kings Courts and not in any Ecclesiasticall Court and that whereas there was an old custome in the Towne of Thetford that whosoeuer should trouble any of the Kings or Duke of Lancasters tenants commorant in that Towne and shoulde call them by citation into an Ecclesiasticall Court out of the Deanery of the saide Towne shoulde thereby forfeit and he also that should execute such processe should also forfeit 6 shillings 8. pence which custom by a Iurie of twelue men being accordingly presented before the Maior the said B. cited the Maior two others to appeare personally before him in his Mannor and Chappell at Hoxne or Hoxstone in Suffolke The Maior and the one of the other two appearing and hauing nothing obiected but that presentment made were by the B. enioyned vpon paine of excommunication at the next court of the Kings to be holden in Thetford to call the same Iurours together and therepublikely to adnull and reuoke the said presentment as being against Gods Lawe so that saith the Record the B. did in an Ecclesiasticall Court iudge of the presentment being duely made in the Kings court and enioyned the reuoking and disanulling of it against the King his regalitie crowne c. wherevpon immediately the Bishop appeared and desired libertie of imparlance till monday next after and had it graunted vpon good mainprise c. On the prefixed monday the B. appeared againe and said he could not deny but that he was culpable in all the premisses put himselfe thereupon into the Kings hands c. so had iudgement to be from thenceforth out of the Kings protection and al his lands and tenements goods chattels to be forfeited to the King and that he should remaine in the custody of the Marshall quousque c. but presently vpon special grace of of the Court he was let to baile in a far lesse summe then afore for his appearance in Easter terme next after At what time hee appeared by his Atturney and both he and his pledges were discharged by vertue of an Act of Parliament made the same yeere Whereby wee may see that encroching vpon the Kings rights c. is not heere specially assigned for any cause of such iudgement and much lesse is the practising of any Canons or forreine made Lawes for they are not once mentioned and least of all that euery exceeding of their authoritie by any Court shoulde be a Praemunire For the originall and onely cause hereof was the B. enioyning of the Maior and of another townesman of Thetford vpon paine of censures to adnull and make voyde a presentment first duly made in a temporall Court of the Kings It is also to be noted out of the generall Atturneys bill in this Record where it is saide that presentments c. found or made in the Kings or in a subiects Court which is in any sort deriued from the Kings crowne must be tried there or in some of the Kings Courts and not in an ecclesiasticall Court that at this time Courts ecclesiasticall were not holden to be deriued any way from the Kings Crowne as no we they are and so bee acknowledged and indeede by conferring the times I finde that this fault of the Bishop was done in Nouember 24. H. 8. hee was attainted in Hilarie terme 25. H. 8. which is a yeere and more after and it was in a Parliament time that was continued till 30. Martij next aster Now the supremeheadship ouer the English Church was not yeelded vnto the King vntill the Parliament by prorogation holden the third of Nouember then next following viz. 26. H. 8. That which the Treatisour collecteth by Cardinall Wolseys Praemunire and the whole Cleargies also for assenting to and assisting the Court Legatiue which the saide Wolsey had erected hee himselfe doth sufficiently confute for albeit hee doe affirme that Wolsey was in a Praemunire for preiudicing but ecclesiasticall Courtes and not the Kings and thence gathereth thus How much more those which practise Antichristian Lawes and Popish Canons repugnant to the royall Matestie and policie of this laend yet doeth hee by implication contrary his owne

what they are lawfully commanded albeit trouble and punishment by that occasion shal happen vnto them that so take offence So that this example doth make flat against their owne purpose and intention and can no way helpe them Another example they bring of 2 1. Reg. 1●… ver 4 13. Obadiah who hid 100. Prophets in two caues secretly and susteined them with necessaries when Iesabel slewe the other Prophets whom she could hit vpon But this commeth farre short of the purpose for which it is brought For who euer denied it to be lawfull to shewe charitie vnto the Lords Prophets then there appeareth no commaundement to the contrary but that he might receiue them againe it doth not appeare that he was euer by authoritie charged to reueile them or to tel his knowledge what was become of those Prophets and therefore it is vnlike to the case in handling furthermore it was wholly an vniust wilfull and tyrannous persecution without warrant of law or colour of any iudiciall proceeding besides if he had bene charged by Iesabel to discouer where they were or had beene commaunded by her to relieue none such yet had it bene no disobedience towards the Magistrate for it is not noted to be the doings of the king but that Iesabel slew them Now the kings wife is no soueraigne but a subiect her selfe Moreouer the killing of the Prophets for no pretence or colour of cause at all is in it selfe so apparant an euill as no man can haue any shadow to giue a lawfull consent vnto it Lastly a man cannot gather a generall doctrine in a matter doubtfull and not plainely deliuered els where in Scripture out of any particular mans fact because all the circumstances which then fell out are not knowen But most especially an example can neuer serue to the ouerthrow of the generall commandement of obeying the Magistrate And viuendum est legibus non exemplis Out of the first booke of Samuel they bring three other examples 1. Sam. 19. ver 1. 2. The first that Saul spake to Ionathan his sonne and to all his seruants that they should kill Dauid but Ionathan Sauls sonne had a great fauour vnto Dauid and bade him take heede c. The second when Saul said to Ionathan Send and fetch Dauid vnto 1. Sam. 20. ver 31. 32. me for he shall surely die Ionathan answered Wherefore shall hee die What hath he done the third that when Saul commanded his seruants to fall vpon the Priests of the Lord to slay them they would 1. Sam. 22. ver 17. not moue their hands to fall vpon the Priests of the Lord. To these three one answere may serue and therfore they are thus set together First these commandements though of the king yet they were when he was enraged and in a furie after the Lord was departed from him an euil spirit was come vpon him Againe it is apparantly vngodly in it self for any to kill an Innocent vpon the tyrannous and vnaduised commandement of the king euen without all colour of any lawful Iudiciall course Lastly Dauid was knowen vnto them to be afore appoynted yea their annointed king from the Lord howsoeuer Saul was tolerated de facto to continue in place till the measure of his iniquitie was fulfilled And therfore in this respect was it vnlawful to kil either him or those that fauoured him especially the Lords Priests whose linnen Ephod should be a protection vnto them against Ibid. ver 18. al such precipitate executions where neither conisance of their cause nor any due conuiction and iudgement was precedent Another example they bring of the mid wiues of the Israelites to proue their intention It is thus written they feared God and did Exod. 1. ver 17. not as the king of Egypt commanded them but preserued aliue the men children This obiection carrieth his answere with him For it is said they feared God therefore did not herein as the king cōmanded noting vnto vs that the cōmandement was such as could no way stand with the feare of God There is no Prince in the world to bee obeyed when he commaundeth any thing directly forbidden by God for it is better to obey God then man The Prince is no God nor yet Gods Lieutenant but a meere man in that which he cōmandeth directly contrary to God That this was of that kinde it appeareth for to kil is manifestly by y e moral law of God nature forbidden Yet this hath his exception viz. that it is no murder when we execute the penaltie of lawe vpon murderers other wicked persons duely conuicted condemned For he that Gene. 9. ver 6. sheddeth mans blood his blood shall be shed by man saith the Lord. But there could be no colour or apparance of any actual wickednesse in children newly borne why they should be executed being but by a generall iudgement condemned most wickedly and tyrannously euen before they were non censetur existere saith the law qui adhuc est in vtero matris Now let vs compare these last foure examples with the scope and purpose for which they are vsed The very act of murdering a person notoriously innocent in that he is neither conuicted nor condemned is malumper se a thing simply and absolutely in his owne nature euill without any further circumstance But to declare what a man knoweth to be done by another the very authours themselues of this opinion must needes confesse to bee sometimes lawfull and requisit and therefore they must at least graunt it to be medius Actus such as by circumstance may be lawfull howsoeuer by the circumstances of this case as it is propounded they will perhaps hold it vnlawfull And therefore there is such dissimilitude and diuersitie betwixt these examples and that which they holde as they can neuer serue this purpose Therefore to fit their turne in the very poynt of the issue they must proue vnto vs that it is vngodly for any man though charged by lawfull authoritie to declare his knowledge of another mans actions if hee that is vrged so to make declaration doe iudge afore-hand that the Magistrate mindes to punish such action either where he ought not at all or in other sort then Gods law permitteth For this purpose they alledge as strongest the example 1 Iosh. 2. ver 3. 4. of Rahab who would not tell the king of Iericho where the two spies of Israel were though she were by him commanded to bring them foorth and she is commended for it by the 2 Heb. 11. ver 31. holy Ghost In answere hereof I say we reade not that the king asked her whether they were there still or not albeit shee 3 Iosu. 2. ver 5. answered that they went out but she was commanded to bring them forth which is something more then to tell where they were if she had beene so asked Secondly by 4 Heb. ibid. Iosu ibid. V. 10. faith

againe to a pretie kind of pacification hold as wel as long as it shall But there is another partie also that perhaps will venture to rip vp agayne the seames of this greene peace if hee may not in some sort bee satisfied For there came vnto mine handes a good while after the former Treatise certaine briefe Notes without discourse that are deliuered abroad into many hands by writing being commended to be gathered by a man of great reading and iudgement in Diuinitie I awe and in what not It beareth this title Notes to prooue the proceeding ex Officio and the oath and subscription which are now required to be against the word of God the ancient Fathers and Canons of the Church and the lawes liberties and customes of the realme of England the proceeding of Office and the oath required though hee telleth not how he conceiues it to bee required as the Treatiser did doe both fall into this disputation which we haue in hand As for the subscription vpon other occasion that may hereafter elsewhere be debated The seuerall points which in respect of the two former hee handleth are by himselfe distributed and sorted into these seuerall heads viz. First testimonies out of ancient Fathers that do mislike the proceeding ex Officio and oath now vsed Secondly English Martyrs that haue refused and misliked the oath now vsed Thirdly the proceeding against heretikes in Englād without exacting an oath c Fourthlie the Canon lawe teaching Inquisition and proceeding ex officio by oath Fiftly another order of proceeding but yet in causa fidei and not otherwise Sixtlie the bishops proceedings contrarie Seuenthly the lawes of England Eightlie the maner of the reuocation of the proceeding ex officio in king Henry the 8. time Ninthly the maner of debating of that cause in those dayes 10. Sir Thomas Mores reasons for maintenance of proceeding ex Officio the oath with summarie answeres to them 11. And lastly Inconueniences which come by the vse ex Officio contrary to the common lawe For proofe of some of which especially the first he is so plentifull in quotation onely of places without rehearsing their sayings out of the ancient Fathers counsels c. that for mine owne part I must confesse that vpon the first view of their names in his moster booke I was greatly astonished least I had too resolutelie defended a matter against such an armie of ancient Fathers and as it were against the generall consent of the olde Primitiue Church from which I meane not God willing casilic or rashlie to swarue But when I had approched neerer I well discerned this my feare to be all in vayne in that they had neither banner displaied nor weapons bent against this cause but rather against the faces of the aduersaries thereof as may plainelie appeare in the seuerall opportune places of this simple Discourse ensuing I may well resemble this dealing of the Note-gatherer vnto yong setters vp in London as Apothecaries and such like that be not at first well stored with stuffe who to furnish vp their shoppes vnto the best shewe are woont oftentimes to embellish them with good numbers of painted gallie pots boxes and glasses intituled on the outside euen with golden letters sometimes of such precious Waters Oyles Simples and other drugges of medicine which they neuer smelt of because such neuer came within them And perhaps I should saue him from suspicion of a greater fault that is eyther want of iudgement or of wilfull peruerting of the ancient Fathers if I should freelie deliuer my conceite in this behalfe which is that his leisure serued him not to looke what was indeede contained in those places which there hee quoteth but that hee did set them downe vpon trust out of the Pies or Indices of the sayd seuerall bookes wheresoeuer the bare wordes of Inquisition of Accusing of Oath or of Swearing was found For I dare auowe that hee which shal read thē in the Authors themselues will iudge that many of them were gathered together in condemnatiō of taking any oath at all an errour holden by the Anabaptists albeit being truely vnderstood according to the circumstances the places serue neither the one turne nor the other rather then that by any colour they may be wrested to speake either against oathes ministred in causes criminall or against proceeding by Iudges of Office Let thus much therefore if it be not too much suffice to haue deliuered in some generalitie touching the said Treatise and Notes both which are vndertaken for the whole substance of them to be here and there answered in this simple discourse ensuing THE CONTENTS OF the seuerall Chapters of the First part 1 THat a seuerall royall assent is not required to the executing of euery particular Canon 2 The particular distribution of all other causes to be proued to be of Ecclesiasticall conusance besides Testamentarie or Matrimoniall with a discourse of bishops certificates against persons excommunicated being a speciall point of their voluntarie iurisdiction where there is no partie which prosecuteth 3 That matters in the former chapter adioyned to Testamentarie Matrimoniall causes though properly they be not of Testament or Matrimony are of Ecclesiasticall conusance and how farre 4 Generall proofs out of statutes that sundry other causes besides Testamentarie or Matrimoniall are of Ecclesiasticall conusance 5 That suites for title of Benefices vpon voidance or spoliation likewise that suites for tithes oblations mortuaries c. for pensions procurations c. are of Ecclesiasticall iurisdiction is prooued by statutes especially 6 That suites for right of tithes belong to the Ecclesiasticall iurisdiction and how farre is shewed out of the books and reports of the Common law so of places of buriall and Churchyardes and of pensions mortuaries oblations c. 7 Of right to haue a Curate and of contributions to reparations and to other things required in Churches 8 Proofes in generall that sundry crimes and offences are punishable by Ecclesiasticall iurisdiction and namely idolatrie heresie periurie or laesio fidei and how farre the last of these is there to be corrected also of disturbance of diuine seruice or not frequenting of it and neglect of the Sacraments 9 That Simony Vsury defamation or slander beating of a Clerke sacriledge brawling or fighting in Church or Churchyarde dilapidations or waste of an Ecclesiasticall liuing and all incontinency are punishable by ecclesiasticall authority and how farre 10 That the matters and crimes here reckoned be also of ecclesiasticall iurisdiction and proofes that any subiects lay or other may be cited in any cause ecclesiasticall 11 That lay men may be cited and vrged to take oathes in other causes then Testamentarie or Matrimoniall 12 The grounds of the two next former opinions examined and confuted 13 That iudgement of heresie still remaineth at the Common law in iudges ecclesiasticall and that the prouiso touching heresie in the statute 1. Eliz. cap. 1. is onely spoken of ecclesiasticall commissioners

it vpon question of her incontinencie There was none Accuser that tooke vpon him to proue it neither was any Fame risen thereof but inuidia conflata ipsi she was depraued by light persons by hereticks and infamous men and that by wicked practises through briberie and intemperancie yea by some such as had bene afore put out of her house for actions farre vnseeming that which they outwardly professed But it was alledged in iustification of the saide Bishops proceeding with her that a rumour had bene spread that the saide Indicia had borne a childe which she had made away And that this rumour was so spread by certaine women though but base that ranne vnto the Monasterie and there first bruited it from whence it came abroade among the people and so to the eares of one Maximus Howbeit these which were said to be the first authors of that rumour were conueyed out of the way Now Syagrius the Bishop there hearing of such a rumour and thereupon proceeding against the saide Indicia did decree that she should be inspected by Midwiues for the clearing and proofe of her Virginitie Which as he alledged he did the rather because certaine taking scandal hereat did affirme that if she should be tolerated without such inspection they would not communicate any more with their Bishop But S. Ambrose there taxeth them thus Quales illi qui volunt praescribere Sacerdotibus quid sequi debeamus What kinde of persons be these that will presume to prescribe vnto vs Bishops what we haue to doe And albeit the said Maximus was in very trueth the Relatour 1 Sermone suo accusationem detulit aures tuas impleuit clamore testes auditionis deduxit cognitionem poposcit thereof to the Bishop yet was there none Accuser in proper termes of Lawe so to be called nor any that did iudicially denounce her thereof Quam nullus argueret nullus deferret Now because a woman of her qualitie in so disorderly sort vpon no better grounds of inducement was adiudged to so vncomely a course of clearing her Virginitie and of so great vncertaintie besides the danger that the Midwiues might be suborned Therefore S. Ambrose being Archbishop of Millaine in whose Prouince Verona stoode did auocate this cause from the Bishop vnto his owne audience He therefore hearing it Iudicially in the presence of his brethren and fellowe Bishops to whom he imparted it besides the former defects did finde vpon examining of the matter that Renatus and Leontius two witnesses produced vpon the Fame which it was entended they had heard though they were suborned yet did they materially varie one from the other in the ground of the cause It fell out likewise by proofe that they two had sent out of the way Mercurius and Lea two other supposed witnesses and but lewde persons Also that another pretended witnesse called Theudule was runne away knowing that it would be obiected in way of exception against her how she had lien at the saide Renatus his beds feete Besides another woman had also confessed that the said Renatus did commit fornication with her Now because hereupon no sinister or bad fame against Indicia was in Lawe sufficiently proued but rather to the contrary a good fame was proued by one Paterna and by the nurse of Indicia therefore S. Ambrose absolued and dismissed her from such inspection restoring her to her former good name but cōdemning Maximus and excommunicating Renatus and Leontius for their indirect vniust and calumnious dealings Yet did he not as he saith simply cōdemne that kinde of purgation and proofe of Virginitie by inspection For he saith thus Quid ergo Negamus inspiciendas virgines interim quòd nusquam legerim Non adstruo nec verum arbitror In which Processe many pointes may be noted to auoche the Iurisdiction of Archbishops and Bishops and sundrie their proceedings Ecclesiasticall at this day but I finde no footesteps or colour of any mislike If these wordes of his be alledged to proue that no Criminall Processe should be made without an Accuser properly so called viz. It is requisite that the witnesses be voyd of partialitie yet so that there first appeare an Accusour this very Epistle will shewe that such Accusour though then they were more vsuall is not necessarily alwayes to be required For he findeth fault that she was conuented although there would appeare neque author criminationis neque accusator neque professor delationis Maximus in trueth being vnder-hand both a Relatour and a kinde of Prosecutour So that no Fame being thereof if any one would but haue shewed himselfe as a Relatour or a Denounceour it might haue sufficed though he were not a very Accusour Qui delationis se nexu obligabat as S. Ambrose there speaketh of the Inscription required by Lawe adpoenam Talionis for him which should faile in proofe And in trueth if Enquire of office were not lawfull and none Accusour were to be receiued but as Lawe and olde Canons appoint assuredly there would be fewe or no Crimes at all in any Court euer prosecuted So great is the trouble and danger Besides if the want of an Accusour had bene sufficient to haue reuersed Syagrius his sentence and to haue quashed the whole Processe then what needed S. Ambrose so carefully to haue examined her Fame good or bad by so many witnesses But that he knew if an euill Fame had bene proued the Iudge might by Lawe haue proceeded as he did without any either Accusour or Denunceour So that we see he thought it meete and by Lawe required at his handes for her clearing and absoluing to make Enquirie of the Fame albeit eche of those were wanting And therefore he did of meere Office by way of Enquirie proceede to the final sentencing of that cause In like sort was that his condemnation of Maximus Renatus and Leontius done of his meere Office without somuch as prosecution by any other man Furthermore to shewe that hee required not of necessitie an Accusour in euery Criminall cause he maketh there a plaine seuerance betweene the Ciuill Lawes as in that behalfe they were then most practised from the Lawes Ecclesiasticall euen at that time For saith he Si leges publicas interrogemus accusatorem exigunt Si Ecclesiae duobus in quit aut tribus testibus stat omne verbum Then where witnesses might bee had to prooue the matter there was not in an Ecclesiasticall cause no not in Saint Ambroses time any Accusour necessarilie required besides the Iudges Office In the 136. Epistle of S. Augustine by him also quoted there is nothing sounding that way Hee there onely sheweth that Bonifacius a Priest was not detected before him of any Crime and that he had not commaunded his name to be razed out of the number of Priests In the next Epistle is contained that the saide Bonifacius being of S. Augustines householde and perceiuing the lewde inclination of another in that house would neither agree vnto it nor yet conceile it

that euery one in authoritie that requireth an answere of a guiltie person being vnder his power in a matter of crime must needes either driue him to a lie which 1 Sapient 1. slayeth the soule or else to accuse himselfe of a matter dishonest as these men speake and gainesay When Peter and Iohn 2 Act. 4. V. 7. 8 were examined in the great Councell vpon this Interrogatorie By what power or in what name they had doone that miracle Peter full of the holy Ghost answered plainely and truely though happely it might haue beene capitall vnto him Then what are they full of who being required by authoritie to answer vnto matters of no such danger vnto them doe neuerthelesse refuse to answere directly or who will not answere at all for vpon a mans owne confession Iudiciall though he be not sworne he may aswell be conuicted as if hee had answered vpon his oathe In the proceeding 3 Act. 6. vers 11. against Saint Stephen there were in trueth none Accusers but those who by subornation denounced him to the Priestes and who are twise 4 Ibid. V. 13. ca. 7. vers 58. called witnesses because they deposed against him yet when the high Priest asked him 5 Act. ca. 7. vers 1. c. thus Are these things so Stephen refused not to make answere and that truly howbeit they made his Apologie to be capitall vnto him Likewise when the 6 Act. 21. vers 38. 39. Captaine asked of Saint Paul whether hee were not that Aegyptian which had made a sedition c. Paul answered directly and slatly denied it Likewise the same Saint Paul 7 Act. c. 24 25. 26. in all his other seuerall conuentings before authoritie mentioned in the Acts euen at the suite accusation of a partie refused not particularly truly to answer to all that was obiected by confessing some denying other some of the crimes by his aduersaries and accusers imputed to him But if hee had learned the readie way that is nowe deuised not onely to answere accusers obiections but the Magistrates owne questions hee might haue wiped them off quickely without such long Apologies and haue willed them onely to prooue what they sayde yet neither expressely affirming nor denying any thing No doubt though the Apostle or any of those other godly men mentioned had beene guiltie of anie thing yet being duely asked they would not haue stood mute nor haue answered doubtfully neither would they haue affirmed more without it then they would haue doone vpon their oaths if the course of the proceeding had admitted it and that their oathes had bene required It is therefore well 1 Chromatius in 5. Matth. facit can 36. concil Tolet. quart saide by an ancient and learned Writer thus Dominus inter iuramentum loquelam nostram nullam vult esse differentiam God makes no difference betwixt our speech whether it be without oath or vpon our oath And 2 Thom. 2. secundae qu. 69. art 1. Aquinas saith if he which is brought into question and interrogated by the Iudge without his oathe shall answere vntruely that therein he sinneth deadly The olde Christians in the Primitiue Church were as farre off from these shifts of answering vnto most dangerous Interrogatories demanded of them euen by heathen Magistrates as they were from all vntrue answeres thereunto which point I minde to make apparant out of such of the Ancient Fathers especiallie as bee auowched by the Note-gatherer for condemnation of these examinations and of exacting men to confesse their owne crimes so that heereby it may bee the better iudged howe sclenderlie their Writinges by him quoted doe serue this turne Tertullian herein is very plentifull especially in his Booke called Apologeticon yet is hee quoted by the Note-gatherer for a condemner of examining and interrogating men touching their owne crimes of which sort y e very profession of Christianitie was then accounted to be A Christian 3 Tertull. in Apolog cap 1. sayth he if he be endited or denounced to the Magistrate he reioyceth in it if he be accused he propoundeth no defence when he is interrogated he most willingly confesseth and when he is condemned he giueth them or God thanks By his complaint in the same place for that Christians were not dealt with as other offenders were he both sheweth what then was practised in Criminall proceedings by the lawes Ciuill and also his owne good lyking thereof At the Chrstians handes 1 Tertul. ibidem saith he that onely is expected which suffiseth to stirre vp the peoples hatred against them that is an onely confession of the name of a Christian not an examination of his crime whereas if you hold conisance against any offendour as a mansleaer sacrilegious incestuous person or publique enemie to the state these being vsuall praises giuen vnto vs Christians you doe not pronounce sentence vpon the bare confession of the name of the crime but you enquire also of the qualitie of the facte the number place manner time priuies and partners But concerning vs you obserue no such matter which you ought no lesse to doe then with those others And againe 2 Ibid. Apolog. cap. 7. We are still said to be murderers of infants and incestuous persons yet you haue no care to finde that out which of so long time hath bene said of vs. Therefore either get it out of vs if ye beleeue it or else refuse to beleeue it because you cannot finde it to be so Then 3 Ibidem followeth this You commaund Christians by a farre stranger kinde of torture viz. not that they should declare what they doe commit but that they should deny themselues to be the men which in deed they are Which vrging of Christians to declare what they had committed that Tertullian doeth not disallow if the Magistrates would haue taken that course with them appeareth also by 4 Tertull. Apo log cap. 3. another place Whatsoeuer we are charged saith he to haue committed secretly though by others the same be committed openly yet we will answere it point by point or euery iote yea euen that for which we are reputed as pestilent persons as vaine and as men worthie to be scorned and condemned by others Saint Augustine also in his verie booke alledged by the Notegatherer doeth plainely establish and allowe of Othes taken concerning a mans owne offenses being in deede such also in their owne nature If perhappes saith he 5 August serm 28. de verbis Apostol cap. 6. thine oathe be vrged meaning a Decisorie oathe be exacted of thee by a priuate person say not I will not sweare for it commeth of euill which thou doest but yet of his euil that doeth exact it of thee Insomuch as thou hast none other meanes but thine oathe to purge and cleare thy selfe of the matter in handling But it may perhappes be said that the oathe here meant may be aswel in a cause

vpon hearing the miracles that God had done and wrought for the children of Israel and by special reuelation Rahab knew that God 5 Ibid. ver 11. euen the God of heauen aboue and earth beneath whose the earth is and the fulnesse thereof and who according to his prouidence and wisedome doth translate and establish kingdomes as it seemeth best to his diuine pleasure had afore that giuen that whole 6 Iosu. Ibid. V. 9. land vnto the children of Israel So that in very right and trueth she did owe no more obedience to the late king of Iericho but was by God discharged thereof and lawfully might as she did submit her selfe capitulate for her safegard with the embassadours of those to whō of very right her subiection then belonged and therefore could not without sinne haue betraied them being sent frō Ioshua her lawful soueraigne into the hands of an vsurper whō she knew perfitely the Lord had deposed 7 Ibid. ver 13. meant soone after to destroy accordingly This interpretation is euidently very strongly confirmed by that place of Scripture where she is for this cōmended By 8 Hebr. ibid. faith saith that place the harlot Rahab perished not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 with the disobedient when she had receiued the spies peaceably If then the rest of Iericho were disobedient in respect of which Rahabs obedience peaceable receiuing of them are cōmended therfore they perished by the hand of Ioshua the people is it not manifest that Ioshua was their lawfull Magistrate in right and that they ought to haue taken knowledge thereof and to haue obeyed him at their owne perils Lastly there is in this fact something extraordinarie as done by spectall oeconomy which by vs may not safely be followed As the lye that shee made in 1 Ios. 2. v. 4. 5. saying shee wist not whence they were and that they went out in the euening And likewise it is not to be presumed by any subiects in these dayes when as miraculous and speciall reuelations are ceased to adiudge themselues either wholly or in some particular actions circumstances to stand discharged of their obedience and alegeance towards their Soueraigne or vndermagistrates when and how farre themselues wil fansie For if by this and such like extraordinarie examples or by that of Obadiahs hiding of the hundred Prophets such presumption were lawfull or tolerable what a goodly colour might all disobedient and rebellious subiects haue namely vnnatural fugitiues ouer sea Iesuites Seminarimen recusants concealers harberours of these and such like boutifeux bellowes of sedition for all their godlesse attempts are they not or at least will they not pretend to be as assured and resolute of the goodnes of their cause as the Disciplinarians are touching theirs their designements so that for these men that would be counted most sincere professors of the Gospel to holde the like dangerous positions to seeke to confirme them with the same no better reasons and examples then the Papists doe theirs for my part I doe recken it to be the practise and part neither of grounded and iudicious Diuines nor of well aduised or duetifull subiects quorum vestigijs insistunt eorundem exitus perhorrescant But they say further that by such oath they should be drawen to discouer vnaduised speeches that sometimes passe men in priuate felowship as at table c. or such as come vnto them for counsell and for priuate resolution of their consciences First there is no man bound to answere more matters then be conteined in the Article or Interrogatorie whereof he is examined But if any matter be therein layde downe in such sort as it leadeth pertinently directly to such discouerie then is it likely that by some meanes it is detected vnto the Magistrate afore and by him thought expedient for some necessarie publike cause worthy of such Enquirie Againe if such priuate talke or asking of counsell haue bene cōcerning some platte or practise laid or to be laide that shall in discretion be adiudged by the Magistrate expedient for the common wealths sake to bee knowen and discouered and therefore if they shall enquire directly of it I can not see howe it may stand with any mans dutie to God vnto the Prince vnto Lawes to the Common wealth to conceale it being charged to the contrary But of other secret speeches treaties and resolutions of mens consciences no Magistrate is of so slender discretion as to enquire nor can by lawe though hee would for want of those indicia and speciall presumptions and inducements that are required to ground an enquirie vpon and therefore this is but matter deuised ad concitandam conflandam inuidiam against lawfull authoritie They alleage also that by their discouerie some that be very poore may be vndone and that the most of the matters and persons being already knowen vnto authoritie there can be none vse for them to appeach any but to alienate their mutuall affections and to haue one another in ielousie This is very loose simple to reason vpō a casuall euent which may happen thereby to prooue a thing vnlawfull for of a good matter an ill euent may and doeth often fall out è conuerso Careat successibus opto quisquis ab euentis facta notāda putat could the very heathē Poet say And why should a mā withdraw his duty to Magistrates onely for particular priuate respects touching himselfe and some few other priuate persons Whatsoeuer may happen let him doe as he ought Fiat iustitia ruat mundus Particularly to the first why should any man pitie his pouertie that pitieth not himself but wilfully runneth into dāger of lawes shal a man holde a poore man more deare vnto him then the common quiet peace of the Church and Common wealth both The second part implieth a contradiction in itselfe for if the matters and persons were sufficiently knowen then in trueth were it of no vse for the Magistrate to enquire further yet if they be so knowen already then what wilfulnesse is it in these men thus obstinately to persist to their owne hurt and yet to doe others no good thereby They obiect further that to discouer their brothers secrets is condemned as a fault by the Holy ghost for 1 Prou. 11. v. 13. he that goeth about as a slanderer discouereth a secret but he that is of a faithfull heart concealeth a matter And seeing they haue met in some mens houses that did it for good affection and opinion vnto them if they should discouer such it were a very vnthankefull requitall they say towardes them And for that their felowship is in the trueth the course they walke holy therefore euen by the law of loue and felowship they may not detect one another for that were a note of a false brother As for the trueth of the matters that they meete about the holines of the course they