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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A69095	The third part of the Defence of the Reformed Catholike against Doct. Bishops Second part of the Reformation of a Catholike, as the same was first guilefully published vnder that name, conteining only a large and most malicious preface to the reader, and an answer to M. Perkins his aduertisement to Romane Catholicks, &c. Whereunto is added an aduertisement for the time concerning the said Doct. Bishops reproofe, lately published against a little piece of the answer to his epistle to the King, with an answer to some few exceptions taken against the same, by M. T. Higgons latley become a proselyte of the Church of Rome. By R. Abbot Doctor of Diuinitie.; Defence of the Reformed Catholicke of M. W. Perkins. Part 3	Abbot, Robert, 1560-1618.	1609 (1609)	STC 50.5; ESTC S100538	452,861	494

not Apostolical traditions which appeare certainely so to be and yet woorthily we reiect those vnwritten doctrines and counterfet traditions of the Papists which are falsely fathered vpon the Apostles It is by these vnwritten doctrines and counterfet traditions that the grounds of our faith are impeached and shaken We therefore cannot be said to shake the grounds of faith who retaine the meere simplicity of those grounds and refuse all other strange and bastard stuffe but they shake the grounds of faith who become patrons of such tradition coloured with the names of the Apostles when notwithstanding they plainely crosse the written doctrine of the Apostles 2. W. BISHOP But let vs descend to the particulars wherein the truth will appeare more plainely Thus beginneth Master PERKINS with the Creede First of all it must be considered that some of the principall doctrines beleeued in the Church of Rome are that the Bishop of Rome is the Vicar of Christ and head of the Catholike Church that there is a fire of Purgatory that Images of God and Saints are to be placed in the Church and worshipped that Praier is to be made to Saints departed that there is a propitiatory sacrifice daily offered in the Masse for the sinnes of the quicke and the dead These points are of that moment that without them the Roman religion cannot stand c. And yet marke the Apostles Creed which hath beene thought to containe all necessary points of religion to be beleeued and hath therefore beene called the key and rule of faith This Creede I say hath not any of these points nor the expositions made thereof by the ancient Fathers nor any other Creed or confession of faith made by any Councell or Church for the space of many hundred yeeres This is a plaine proofe to any indifferent man that these bee new articles of faith neuer knowen in the Apostolike Church and that the Fathers and Councels could not finde any such articles of faith in the bookes of the old and new Testament Answer is made that all these points of doctrine are beleeued vnder the article I beleeue the Catholike Church the meaning whereof they will haue to be this I beleeue all things which the Catholike Church holdeth and teacheth to be beleeued If this bee as they say wee must beleeue in the Church that is put our confidence in the Church for the manifestation and the certainety of all doctrine necessary to saluation And thus the eternall truth of God the Creatour shall depend vpon the determination of the creature And the written word of God in this respect is made insufficient as though it had not plainely reuealed all points of doctrine pertaining to saluation And the ancient Churches haue beene farre ouer-secene that did not propound the former points to be beleeued as articles of faith but left them to these latter times Thus farre Master PERKINS Wherein are hudled vp many things confusedly I will answere briefly and distinctly to euery point The first is that in the Apostles Creede are contained all points of religion necessary to be beleeued which is most apparantly false as the Protestants themselues must needes confesse or else grant that it is not necessary to beleeue the King to be Supreame-head of the Church or that the Church is to be gouerned by Bishops or that we are iustified by Christs iustice imputed to vs or that there be but two Sacraments or that the Church seruice must be said in the vulgar tongue or that all things necessary to be beleeued to saluation are contained in the Scriptures To be short not one article of their religion which is contrary to ours is conteined in this Creede of the Apostles therefore to affirme as he doth all necessary points of religion to be contained in this Creede is to cast their owne religion flat to the ground and to teach that not one point of it is to be beleeued this Creede may neuerthelesse be called the key and rule of faith because it containeth the principall points of the Christian religion and doth open as it were the doore vnto all the rest and guide a man certainely vnto the knowledge of them by teaching vs to beleeue the Catholike Church which being the pillar and ground of truth 1. Tim. 3.15 Ioh. 16.13 directed and guided by the spirit of truth will alwaies instruct her obedient children in all truth necessary to saluation Then saith M. PERKINS The eternall truth of God the Creatour shall depend on the determination of the creature Nothing lesse for Gods truth is most sincere and certaine in it selfe before any declaration of the church but we poore creatures that are subiect to mistaking and error should not so certainely vnderstand and know that truth of God vnlesse hee had ordained and appointed such a skilfull and faithfull Mistris and interpreter to assure vs both what is his word and what is the true meaning of it Like as pure gold is not made perfect in it self by the Gold-smithes touch-stone but other men are thereby assured that it is true and pure gold euen so the word of God doth not borrow his truth from the Church but the true children of God are by the holy Church assured which is the same his word If we did hold as we do not that the written word containeth all points of doctrine necessary to saluation yet were it most necessary to relie vpō the Catholike churches declaration both to be assured which books of scriptures be Canonicall which not whereupon Saint Augustine a man of far better iudgement than any of these daies said Con. Epist. Iud. cap. 5. that he would not beleeue the Gospel vnlesse the authority of the church mooued him therunto as also to vnderstand them truly because the words of holy Scripture without the true meaning and sense of them do but deceiue men and lead them into error and to that end haue alwaies beene and yet are by Heretikes abused to draw others after them into destruction The like may be said of other ancient Creeds and confessions of faith which holding the Apostles Creed did adde some few points vnto it namely such as were in those daies called into question by Heretikes of greater fame and who were followed of many not touching in particular diuers other articles generally beleeued of all true Christians or else by so●e fewe and obscure men onely questioned Wherefore to argue that no other points of faith are to be beleeued but such as are expressed in ancient Creeds is to cut off a great part of our faith Lastly it is most vntrue to say that those ancient Fathers and Councels knew not of these articles of faith by him mentioned for they haue most plainely taught them in their writings yea and expresly condemned of heresie most of the contrary positions now againe reuiued and holden by the Protestants as in those seuerall questions I haue before prooued R. ABBOT How M. Pirkins vnderstood that all necessary

death confessed that all his life he had doubted of three things whereof now he should be resolued whether there were a God whether the soule be immortall and whether there be any life after this life as Iulius the third who commanded to bring him his Porke in despight of God as Leo the tenth who made but a fable and a toy of all that we beleeue concerning Christ Many other of them haue there been of the same stampe most damnable villaines the very monsters of mankind vtterly deuoid of all remorse and conscience of piety towards God and thereby giuen ouer to all dissolutenesse and abomination of wicked and finfull life From them and their appendants hath this poison spred it selfe not only into the whole Court and City of Rome but into all Italy insomuch that in the Italian tongue the name of f Hespinian de Origine Monachatus lib. 6. c. 66. a Christian is by custome growen to signifie a foole M. Bishop well knoweth what the curse of the Wolfe is a most horrible blasphemy there vsed not fit for the mouth of any Christian to speake or the pen of any Christian to write to which though the Pope for his credits sake haue of later time assigned some kind of punishment yet well he woteth that it is more generall than that his Law can worke the restraint of it Out of Italy or at least from birds of the Popes hatching came the book De tribus mundi impostoribus whereby Moses and Christ as well as Mahomet are made but deluders and deceiuers of the world Out of Italy came Machiauels precepts wherby he hath taught men to cast off all yoke of religion and to vseit only to serue turne which notwithstanding according to that conceipt that he had of religion could say that g Machiauel Disputat de resubl l. 1. c. 12. Nusquam m●nus vel pietatis vel religionis est quam in ijs hominibus qui Romae vicin●ores habitant there was no where lesse faith or piety than in them that dwell neerest to Rome Whose rules as they are at this day the managing of the Papacy and familiar to all states that are confederated therewith so specially are they entertained and practised by the Iesuits who hauing taken away the honor from Friar Dominick of being the pillar of the Lateran Church and being become the speciall vpholders of the declining kingdome of Antichrist are discouered by the secular Priests and namely by their Proctor Watson to be very Atheists not regarding religion at all but only for a cloke to hide their villanies and for the compassing of their wicked and vngodly designes Thus Atheisme albeit it be not contained in the positiue Doctrine of the Romane Church yet becommeth a sequell thereof whilst hauing no true grounds for the iustifying of it and therfore being driuen to support it selfe by carnall policy it begetteth in the Politicians that practise for it a striuing and fighting against God whereby religion is quite banished out of the heart and only an outward colour remaineth for their maintenance of outward state Now therefore I will not question them of Atheisme vpon M. Perkins grounds but leauing his conclusion will only examine so far as need requireth M. Bishops defense of the propositions from which he draweth that conclusion there being nothing here but what either hath been before or must afterwards be further spoken of First M. Popery ouerthroweth the grace of God Perkins propoundeth that the Church of Rome making the merit of mens works to concur with the grace of God ouerthroweth the grace of God Which to be true appeareth by the words of the Apostle who mentioning k Rom. 11 6. the election of grace inferreth thus If it be of grace it is not of works otherwise grace is no grace or if it be of works it is not of grace otherwise worke is no worke importing plainly that grace and worke cannot be so reconciled as that what is of grace may truely be said to bee of works or what is of works may truely bee said to bee of grace For grace as Hierome expoundeth it importeth i Hieron Rom. ca. 11. Gratuitum munus appellatur a free gift so that k Iden epist●ad V●metriad vli gratià non operum retributio sed donatis est largitas where grace is there is not rewarding of works but largesse and bounty of gift For l Leo epist. 84. Quae vt●que nisi ●atis detur non est gratia sed merces retributi●o merito●ū grace saith Leo bishop of Rome except it be freely giuen is not grace but the reward and recempense of merits or workes implying that if it be the reward of merits then it is not freely giuen and therefore cannot be calied grace Therefore when the Apostle saith m Rom. 6.23 Eternall life is the grace or gift of God through Iesus Christ our Lord we must vnderstand it according to the words of the Psalme n Vulgat Latin Psal 55.7 Pro●ihilo saluos facies illos Thou wilt saue them for nothing o ●●eion ad P●●●g lib 2. Hand 〈◊〉 quio iustos qui nou propr●●●cr●to sed de salu●ntur clementia meaning the iust saith Hierome who art not saued by their owne merit but by the mercy of God To this M. Bishop telleth vs that they doe not make the merit of mans worke and the grace of God two distinct agents but hold that no works of man haue any merit vnlesse they proceed and prin● from the very grace of God Where not to question what he meaneth by giuing the name of an agent to the merit of mans worke answer him to the rest that his answer is vnsefficient and vaine because the Apostle knew well that we haue no workes wherewith to mooue God but only such as proceed from the grace of God and yet resolueth that Gods election if it be of works cannot be said to be of grace Whencesoeuer the workes proceed this rule standeth still most firme and sure that that cannot be said to be freely giuen and for nothing that is repaied to the merit of workes But whilest they will haue only workes of nature excluded by the Apostles words and not the workes that are wrought by grace they necessarily fall into the heresie of the Pelagians that the election of grace dependeth vpon the foresight of those works which our free will should doe by the help of grace Which if they will not grant as I trow they will not they must perforce confesse that the Apostle heere excludeth not only workes of nature but generally all workes whatsoeuer And the rather must they so confesse that they may not make the Apostle speake so idlely as by that construction he doth If it be of grace then it is not of workes done without grace and if it be of workes done without grace then it is not of grace as if the Apostle had had to doe with men who

made If these Ministers had once deceiued you in a money matter you would beware how you trusted them againe and will you beleeue them still they hauing by their owne confession hitherto deceiued you both in your Church seruice Bible cōmending the one to you as diuine seruice and the other as Gods pure word and now condemning them both Which words of his doe carry some colour to blinde the ignorant but he himselfe well knew that he did but play the Sicophant and made only a shew of great matter against vs wherein in truth there is no waight at all For wold the sorry fellow haue argued thus against the faith of the whole church that had been for the space almost of foure hundred yeeres when Hierome tooke in hand to translate the Bible anew and to reforme the defects and imperfections both of the Septuagint of other translations which the Church had vsed till that time It appeareth by Hierome that c Hier. ad Paulam Eustoch Praefat. in Esaiae translat Qui scit me ob hoc in peregrinae linguae eruditione sudasse ne Iudaei de falsitate scripturarum ecclesiis e●us diutiùs insultarent the Iewes insulted ouer the Christian Church for their false translations of the Scriptures for the auoiding whereof he protesteth it was that he tooke that paines to learne the Hebrew tongue that he might himselfe more perfectly translate them and so d Idem Praefat. in Iosue Dolere Iudaeosquòd calumniandi eis irridendi Christianos sit ablata occasio take from them all occasion to calumniate and mocke the Christians Will our Iudaizing Iesuite heereupon say of all the time before that there could be no goodnesse in their faith that it was built vpon an euill foundation that their Bibles were naught because there were so great defaults in their translations What had so many Churches beleeued in vaine so many Martyrs and Confessours suffered persecution and death for a faith of which they had no certaine or assured ground But to come somewhat neerer to him when Hierom had more perfectly translated the Scriptures his translation grew in the Latin Church to bee much respected and hath beene since in speciall name aboue any other The Councell of Trent hath decreed that that translation if at least it be that which now carieth his name wherof there is iust cause to doubt e Concil Trident sess 4. c. 2. shall stand for authenticall and good in all publike lectures disputations preachings expoundings and that no man vpon any pretence shall presume to reiect it Yet of that translation it is confessed by f See D. Rainolds Thes 5. § 30. where he citeth Budaeus Valla sir T. Moore acknowledging so much in the new Testament Pagnine Galatinus and Masius in the old Isidorus Clarius Andradius and Arias Montanus in both sundry the most learned of his side that there are many defaults and slippes wherein the interpreter hath swarued both from the words and from the right and true meaning of the holy Ghost Yea into that translation there were also crept by neglect manie grosse corruptions acknowledged by themselues and therfore g Biblia excusa Romae anno domini 1590.92.93 reformed first by Sixtus Quintus and afterward by Clement the eighth such as whereby the meaning of the text in many places was wholly altered And will this cauilling Sophister giue vs leaue to conclude heereof that there hath beene all the while that those errors and corruptions haue continued no goodnesse in the faith of their church of Rome that their Bibles by themselues haue been condemned for naught that their religion hath beene built vpon an euill foundation because there haue beene errors and imperfections in their translations of the Scriptures If hee thinke that this is no argument against them we must needs thinke him to be that that he is that would go about to blinde simple men by such a cauillation against vs. For thy better satisfaction gentle Reader thou maiest consider that translations of the Scriptures are the same to the Church as are glasse-windowes to a house The glasse neuer yeeldeth the light altogether so cleere as it commeth immediately from the Sun and the interleadding of it hindereth that there is not fully and thorowout a perfect transparence of the light and yet it giueth light so as serueth abundantly for the discerning of euery thing and for the directing and doing all the businesse of the house Euen so translations can neuer so cleerely and fully expresse the things that are translated as they are to be seene immediately in the originall from whence they are deriued By the vnperfect apprehension of the translatours it commeth to passe that they haue their ouersights as it were traces and barres of lead thorow which the light of the originall text perfectly shineth not which notwithstanding doe compact and hold together the body of the text as it were the glasse thorow which the Sunne of righteousnesse most comfortably shineth vnto vs and by which we haue vndoubted and certaine direction for the whole worke and seruice of the house of God There is in euerie language some special proprietie the grace and significancy whereof no other language by any industrie of the translator can atteine vnto There are in the originals but specially in the Hebrew tongue many words of doubtfull and diuers significations of which it is very hard manie times to say which best fitteth to expresse the meaning of the place Sometimes though the signification of the words be knowen yet the phrase and composition breedeth ambiguitie of translation By this meanes the wordes being subiect to diuers constructions one interpreteth them one way another another way and neither can controll other because it is hard to say which is the truest way Yea S. Aust doubteh not to say that h Aug. de dect Christ li. 3. cap. 27. Certè dei spiritus etiam ipsam alteram sententiam occursurā lectori vel auditorisine dubitatione praeuidit imò vt occurreret quia ipsa est veritate subnixa prouidit Nam quid in diuinis eloquijs potuit largius wherius prouideri quam vt eadem verba pluribus intelligantur modis c. the holy Ghost for more large and plentifull instruction did not onely foresee but prouide that of the same words diuers meanings might be made which notwithstanding both or all should bee agreeable to the truth But there are furthermore many allusions many allegories many prouerbiall and figuratiue speeches the reasons whereof are not alwaies easily discerned and therfore they are coniectured diuers waies Sometimes it falleth out that the words of themselues seeme to the translatour to leane one way and the expositour seeth that by the drift and intendement of the text they are to goe another By these and other occasions translatours according to the gifts that God hath giuen them vse their iudgements diuersly one seeing that which another seeth not

the greatest number were Italians they deserued for the most part rather to bee accounted a heard of swine than a Councell of learned men His reason that the principall points of Poperie cannot bee against the grounds of the Catechisme because the same is expounded by the decree and order of that Councell maketh as much for vs as it doth for them For the Catechisme is by order expounded and taught by vs wee open to the people the Creed the ten Commandements the Lords Praier the doctrine of Sacraments M. Bishop therefore doth amisse to say that our religion is opposite to those old grounds of true religion If this argument auaile not for vs then neither shall it auaile for him but wee are still at libertie to conceiue that notwithstanding their expounding of those grounds they teach points of doctrine contrary thereunto And indeed that expounding of theirs was no otherwise begun but in emulation of our doings in that kinde for vntill it pleased God to stirre vp the spirits of some of our men to endeuour the reformation of the Church and to that end to bring the people so much as in them lay out of the thraldome of blindnesse and ignorance wherein they were then holden the vse of Catechisme was quite abolished out of the Church the people knew neither the Creed nor the Lords praier but onely that they spake them like a charme in a strange and vnknowen tongue But when they saw vs recalling them to the ancient order of Catechising and thereby training them to the knowledge of God and of faith towards him they held it necessarie for the satisfaction of the world that they themselues should make some shew of doing the like and thereupon in the Councell of Trent tooke order for a Catechisme to bee published though they neuer meant to make any great vse of it but onely where necessitie should enforce them for the countermining of our labours and the staying of manie whom otherwise the desire of learning and of the knowledge of God would haue caried away from them Into that Catechisme and the rest of theirs how they haue foisted in matters of faith and doctrine which the old expositours of the Catechisme neuer knew nor haue deliuered wee shall somewhat perceiue by examining the processe and particulars of this booke In the meane time we answer M. Bishop that it is verie credible and ready enough to be beleeued of them that are carefull to vnderstand it that the church of Rome albeit while it continued sound in the faith all ancient Churches and holy Fathers did desire to agree with it yet since being gon out of her * The church of Rome hath swaiued from the tradition of the Apostles ancient way doth indeed crosse and destroy those principles of religion which formerly haue beene agreed vpon by all Churches For whereas hee saith that that church hath been euer most diligent to obserue all Apostolical traditions it is a stale iest Bellarmine himselfe perforce acknowledgeth it to bee a lie For it being manifest by the testimonie of Anacletus an ancient Bishop of Rome that c De consecrat dist 2. cap. Peracta Peracta consecratione communicent omnes qui nolin● eccleasisticis carere liminibus sic enim Apostoli statuerunt sancta Romana tenet ecclesia the Apostles decreed and the church of Rome then obserued that they should be excommunicate whosoeuer were present after consecration and did not receiue the Communion Bellarmine in the behalfe of the now-church of Rome reiecteth the same as a thing d Bellarm. de Missa lib. 2. ca. 10. Cortum est decreta ista quae sine dubio non diuini sed humani iuris erant si ad populum pertinebant progressis temporis abrogata fuisse in processe of time abrogated by the church being but a matter of humane only constitutiō decree So likewise we see in the Councel of Cōstance acknowledging that e Concil Const sess 13. Licèt Christus post coenam instituerit discipulis suis administranerit sub vtraque specie panis vini hoc venerabile Sacramentum tamen hoc non obstante c. Et similitèr quòd licèt in primitiua ecclesia huiusmodi Sacramentum à fidelibus reciperetur sub vtraque specie tamen haec consuetudo ad euitandum aliqua scandala pericula est rationabilitèr introducta quòd à laicis tantummodo sub specie panis suscipiatur c. vnde pro lege habenda est c. Christ administred the holy Sacrament to his disciples vnder both kindes and that in the Primitiue Church it was so receiued of the faithfull and yet this notwithstanding they decree it for a law that lay men shall receiuc only in one kinde Now when thus with our eies we see and they themselues tell vs the contrary will M. Bishop notwithstanding tell vs that the Church of Rome hath been euer most diligent to obserue all Apostolicall traditions Surely if they had failed but in these two they had not obserued al but now how many other things are there wherein they haue apparantly swarued from the example of the Apostles How then can we beleeue M. Bishop any further who doubteth not heere to affirme so grosse and manifest vntruth And to this vntruth he addeth another when hee saith that we slander all churches since the time of the Apostles with some corruption or other It is true that we note the corruptions of some churches and of some men accordingly as the history of the Church and the monuments of antiquity doe lay the same foorth vnto vs but wee cannot say that al Churches or al the Fathers of those times were guiltie of those corruptions For many Churches were there and many Bishops and Pastours of Churches of whom no memoriall is come vnto vs many whom we finde otherwise reported of than was true by the corrupting of those writings which they left vnto the Church and suborning other counterfets in their stead many who haue deliuered some exorbitant opinions of which notwithstanding it appeareth not that they had publike approbation in the Church many who haue left so little in record as touching points of faith as that it is hard by them to esteeme what the doctrine of the Church was As for the corruptions whereof we speake there are many of them such as that I doe not thinke M. Bishop to be so impudent but that hee will acknowledge the same as well as we there are none of them but that either by the word of God or by like warrant of antiquity we prooue them to be such as we report them His other tale that we hold no kinde of Apostolicall traditions to be necessary he himselfe knoweth to be vntrue because he knoweth that we receiue the Creede as necessarie which he saith came by tradition from the Apostles It hath beene also f Of Traditions sect 4. before giuen him to vnderstand that we reiect