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A41593 The Catholic representer, or, The papist misrepresented. Second part Gother, John, d. 1704. 1687 (1687) Wing G1327; ESTC R30311 98,893 108

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were put over them for their rule and direction they might be perfectly join'd together in the same mind and same judgment 1 Cor. 1. 10. That they might be preserv'd in the Unity of Peace and be no more Children rossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of Doctrine Ephes 4. 14. And that the People or Flock might have no scruple or solicitude upon them for fear of being led into Error by these Apostles and Pastors but might securely and without anxiety of Spirit rest under their Guidance and Direction Christ did most solemnly promise the said Overseers the Apostles and Pastors the assistance of his Holy Spirit I am with you always even unto the end of the world Mat. 28. 2c The Comforter the Holy Ghost shall teach you all things Jo. 14. 26. By which effectual Promise they were constituted Guides were taught all Truth and all those secur'd from Error who committed themselves to their Instruction The Catholic Church being thus constituted and ordian'd by Christ himself and provided with Apostles and Pastors divinely assisted for the instructing the Flock in the Mysteries of the Christian Faith with an obligation on all that heard them to believe upon pain of damnation He that believeth not shall be damn'd Mat. 16. 16. it is certain that all such as did separate themselves from the Communion of the Apostles either by contradicting or disbelieving their Doctrine or being refractory to their Government did in this most heinously offend the Divine Majesty and exclude themselves from the hopes of Salvation the former by rejecting the true Faith without which 't is impossible to please Him Heb. 11. 6. the latter by disobedience resisting the Ordinance of God They that resist shall receive to themselves damnation Rom. 13. 1. 2. This was the Face and Constitution of the Church of Christ in the time of the Apostles Salvation being promis'd to those that believ'd He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved and Damnation threatned to disbelievers He that believeth not shall be damned Mar. 16. 16. So that 't was no Uncharitable but a most Evangelical Assertion in the Evangelist to say The Lord added to the Church daily such as should be saved Act. 2. 47. And the declaring that there was no Salvation out of their Church was nothing but a necessary Doctrine The Church being thus by Christ himself founded the Pillar and Ground of Truth 2 Tim. 3. 15. consisting of Pastors and Teachers to instruct and of the Flock under an indispensable obligation of receiving and Submitting to their Instruction it was so to continue to the end of the World Christ's Spirit being to abide with her for ever Jo. 14. 16. The Promise of his assistance being not limited to the Persons of the Apostles but annex'd to their Function As therefore St. Paul when he left Ephesus Act. 20. 28. appointed others to oversee and rule the Flock with their Commission from the holy Ghost So he and the other Apostles when they departed this Life had others to succeed them for the Direction and Government of the Faithful And as those who cut themselves off from the Communion of the Apostles incurr'd the guilt of Damnation by unavoidably in so doing erring in Faith or Disobedience so likewise all those who separated from the Communion of their Successors it being at all times most certainly true that there was no true Faith nor true Charity in any that separated themselves from the Doctrine and Government of the Church of Christ over which the Apostles were Overseers and Rulers for their time and their Successors to be so after them to the end of the World. This as to the Apostles is evident from the severe censure of Deceivers pronounc'd against all those who endeavour'd to make Divisions in their time Ephes 4. 14. where they are said to work by the sleight of men and cunning craftiness whereby they lie in wait to deceive And 2 Tim. 2. 18. Such as dissented from the Apostles are condemn'd for erring concerning the Truth and overthrowing the Faith. And Tit. 3. 11. They are said to be subverted and in sin and to be condemn'd of themselves And as to their Successors the Practice of the Primitive Church in the time of her confess'd Purity is a most convincing Argument there being none that in the first three or four Centuries ever separated from them either in point of Doctrine or making Schisms tho under the most colourable pretext of Reforming Errors or rejecting Innovation but were declar'd Innovators as men to be avoided as cut off from the Mystical Body of Christ by the Pastors and Overseers then in being The Rule of St. John 1 Joh. 4. 6. being always the standard-Measure of the Church He that knows God heareth us he that is not of God heareth not us hereby know we the Spirit of Truth and the Spirit of Error Here then 't is evident that the Catholic Church in the time of the Apostles as also of their Successors was the Depository of the true Faith and that to dissent from her in Faith was to fall into Error to divide from God He that hears you hears me and he that despises you despises me Luke 10. 16. If he neglect to hear the Church let him be unto thee as an Heathen and a Publican Matth. 18. 17. and consequently no Promises of Christ nor Salvation to be expected by such who were not of her Communion This same One holy Catholic Church he believes to have continued in all Ages it being at all times true what has been always said by the Faithful in the Creed I believe the holy Ca-Cholic Church and that 't is to remain to the end of the World assisted by the Spirit of God and preserv'd from teaching errors according to the Promise of Christ Matth. 28. 20. Joh. 14. 16. So that as then so now at this time there is a Church succeeding that of the Apostles which teaches all Truth and from which none can separate without erring in Faith or incurring the guilt of Schism Sins altogether inconsistent with Salvation And because after most serious Considerations and the weighing of all Reasons he believes this Church to be that in whose Communion he is he do's not question but what is truly affirm'd of the Church of the Apostles and succeeding Ages and those that fell from it is most true of the same Church now in being of which he 's a Member and of all those who separate from it upon what pretext soever And however this may be painted out for Vncharitablenss yet 't is certainly the very Doctrine deliver'd by the Apostles and the Practice of the Primitive Church And when the worst has been made of it yet still he do's not come short of Dr. Tillotsons Charity for notwithstanding all this yet so much Charity he has and he desires always to have it as to hope that a great many of other separate Perswasions who live piously and have been
Authority of the Church as being to decide Controversies of Faith Art. 20. and this is not to ordain or enforce any thing to be believ'd that is against the Scripture But whether that which it decides be against or according to Scripture this every man is to decide again by his own private Reason They maintain the Authority of General Councils But because these may err Art. 21. their Decrees have neither Strength nor Authority unless it may be declar'd that they be taken out of Holy Scripture But whether de facto they be taken out of Scripture or no this every Private Man must judge for himself And this Dr. Burnet asserts positively in his Exam. of Meth. p. 82. The Principle of Protestants with relation to the majority even in a General Council is That when any Doctrines are establish'd or condemn'd upon the Authorities of the Scriptures those who differ from them and do think that the Council misunderstood the Scriptures are bound to suspect themselves a little and to review the matter with greater application Yet if they are requir'd to profess that they believe opinions which they think false if they were never so inconsiderable no man ought to go against his Conscience And if any Synod of Protestants has decreed any thing contrary to this in so far they have departed from the Protestant Principles But the whole matter is more fully express'd by the Author of the Discourse before mentioned Concerning a Judge of Controversy Who p. 11. at the bottom clears it thus If you ask whose Judgment ought to take place the Judgment of the Church or of every private Christian I answer says he and mark it The Judgment of the Church of necessity must take place as to external Government to determine what shall be profess'd and practis'd in her Communion and no private Christian has any thing to do in these matters But when the Question is What is Right or Wrong True or False in what we may obey and in what not Here every Private Christian who will not believe without understanding nor follow his Guides blindfold must judge for himself and 't is as much as his Soul is worth to judge right Don't you see here there 's no Authority so Great and Safe amongst them but what is to be subject to the Censure of every Private Christian And tho' there be the Name of such a thing as a Church yet let that Command prescribe and ordain what it will to be receiv'd as the Truth and Faith of Christ 't is not That is to be obey'd or believ'd but being esteem'd as a piece of Formality not to be relied on every Man when he thinks fit must set himself up above Church and Authority and ee'n judge for himself Is not here every Controversy left to the decision of the Private Spirit And under the Notion of a Church a gate open'd to all the Fanaticisms and Quakerisms in the World By the Creed all Christians are bound to Believe the Holy Catholic Church And St. Paul Heb. 13. v. 7. commands all to Obey and Submit to those that are over them and this not only as to External Government but likewise as to Truth and Belief and therefore says he v. 7. Whose Faith follow But here you see tho' your Divines maintain the Authority of a Church yet there 's no Obligation on any Members of submitting to it as to any Point of Faith They must acknowledge it indeed as to the Governing or Politic part But as to the Christian or Believing part here every Christian as to what he is to obey and what not is to judge for himself And pray now what do's all this end in but the Private Spirit Can it desire any fairer Plea than this Certainly this their Church were it the Catholic Church the Ground and Pillar of Truth 't would not thus be commendably left to be over-rul'd by every Private Man's Reason There would not be this liberty for every one to run astray from it by preferring their own Judgment before the Decision and Judgment of the Church 'T was said heretofore and we know by whom Let him that do's not hear the Church he as a Heathen and a Publican But now it seems That Man alone is as Blind as a Heathen or Publican who do's not rather hear himself than the Church I wonder how long this has been so Misrepresent I le warrant you now you have got in your Head the Question Where was the Protestant Church before Luther But don't reproach this Church and perswade the World she is as yet but in her Infancy If you have seen a Book entit'led The Antiquity of the Protestant Religion You 'l see it there prov'd That the Protestant Religion was Anciently and Generally profest in the Christian World before the Reformation p. 1. Represent You have brought in this Question now by Head and Shoulders But since 't is sta●ted satisfie me so far as to let me know where this Church was before the Pretended Reformation In what Country or Nation was it Visible Whether in the Eastern or Western World We have a fair Historical account of it from Luther's time to our days But I would willingly know where it was in all those Fifteen Hundred years from Christ's Ascension to the coming of the Prophet Luther as he is styl'd by Slydan Misrepresent Why this Author of the Antiquity of the Protestant Religion asserts it positively and proves That the Protestant Religion was Anciently and Generally profest in the Christian World before the Reformation And sure you that pretend to History and Religion cannot be ignorant Where that Religion was which was Anciently and Generally profest amongst Christians throughout the World. Represent Certainly then This Man must have had some extraordinary Revelation or made some New Discovery For the former Protestants who liv'd nearer Luth●r's time knew nothing of this Religion being Generally profess'd ●oannes Regius lib. Apol p. 176 Bishop Jewel Apol. p. 4. c. 4. d. 2. and Mr. Parkins E●po● Cre p. 400. confe●s that before the days of Luther and Zuingli● the Church viz. Protestant was Invisible unknown unheard of that for the space of many hundred years an Vniversal Apostacy overspread the Whole face of the Earth and this Church was not then visible to the World. So that by what I see Authors don't agree in this matter And then besides this in a late Famillar Discourse betwixt a Minister and his Parishioner The Question being propos'd p. 14 Where was your Religion as it is now reform'd when Luther began his Reformation As to this particular the Minister answers It may be 't was in the Greek in the Abassine and Aegyptian Churches amongst the Armenian Christians It may be 't was in a Corner under a Cloud covered with Rubbish What if we say 't was no where Misrepresent Well and what then Represent Nothing but that I see 't is very hard to be found some find it Generally profess'd
Profess'd with as little Control or Contradiction as t is at this Day in Italy or Spain I am sure if you should be told of any Neighbour of yours in this City that in his Devotions desires the Prayers of the Saints in Heaven Prays for the Souls of the Faithful Departed keeps Anniversary Days Signs his Forehead with the Sign of the Cross uses Exercisms Oyl Breathing and other Ceremonies in Baptizing his Children c. you would presently cry out A Papist A Papist And if you Censure such an one for a Papist now how can you perswade me the Primitive Christians were Protestants whom we have found Professing such Doctrines and Practices If it be Popery now to do so how was it Protestantism then Either you must make them Protestants that Teach those things at this Day amongst us or else they were none who Taught and Practis'd them heretofore Come I le ask you one Question Had you liv'd in those Days of the Primitive Church would you have Communicated or joyn'd with those Priests and Numerous People who after the Decease of Constantine were Praying round the Hearse for the Soul of the Emperour as 't is related by Eusebius de Vit. Const lib. 4 cap. 71 If you would not I conclude Those Priests and People were none of Your Church that is no Protestants And yet while you would have stood out then as Recusant I am confident such as at this Day Pray for the Soul of Charles 2. would then have Pray'd for Constantine's had they been then Living And These are such as you call Papists By which my Reason informs me That if ●le be a Christian as Christians were in the Primitive Church I must be no Protestant but a Papist since the Protestants of our Days would no more have joyn'd with the Christians of those Times than they do now with the Papists Misrepres You triumph now as if you had got●a Victory and yet you have hi●herto done just nothing All your Proofs end in nothing but some Particular Instances and so I confess you have shewn some Private Doctors some Particular Men to have been acknowledg'd as infected with Popery in those Primitive Times by our Centuriators and other Protestant Divines But what 's all this to the Primitive Church Some Private Doctors and Opiniators might then be Papists 't is true but the Church was nevertheless Protestant Examine the Four First General Councils which were at that Time the Church Representative and you 'l see nothing Decreed by them but what We hold as Protesta●ts Repres You are for having me take all upon trust And tho' you cry out against Pinning Faith upon Sleeves yet I see if I don't pin my Faith upon your Sleeve I shall never be Protestant You Preach to me I must be guided by Reason and 't is not enough to Say the Primitive Church was Protestant but you must Prove it too if you 'l convince my Reason For my part by the Progress we have hitherto made I think I have Reason to think that not only some Private Men but that the Whole Church was then Popish as you call it For let us but reflect a little Who were These Men who by your Modern Protestants are accus'd of Popish Doctrines in those Times of Constantine and the Two Following Ages and we shall find they were the most Eminent the mosh Learned the most Exemplar and Best Men of their Times they were S. Augustine S. Hierome S. Chrysostome S. Athanasius S. Ambrose S. Gregory Nazianzen Nyssen S. Basil S. Hilary S. Cyril S. Paulinus S. Epiphanius c. These were the Men who living in those Primitive Ages of the Church are condemn'd and rejected by Modern Protestants for holding and maintaining Popish Doctrines These are they who are charg'd with Popery by the Centuriators by Osiander Chemnitius Melancthon Bullinger Beza Whitaker Humfrey Covel Whitgift Abbot Morton Fulk Trig Cartwright Field Hooker c. Now I need not ask here being upon Enquiry into the Faith of the Primitive Church whether Those Ancient Fathers cannot in all likelihood better inform me what was the Faith and Doctrine of the Church of their Times than other Modern Teachers who had not a Being in the World till Twelve or Thirteen Hundred Years after But I may consider with my self whether it be not most agreeable to Reason to think since such Eminent and Vertuous Men and Prelates as just now recited are accus'd of Popery that not only some Private Persons in those Primitive Times but that the Whole Church was then Popish I am assur'd by all Antiquity that these Persons that stand thus Indicted Govern'd the Primitive Church were Bishops Pastors and the most Exemplary of their Age the People or Flock were Instructed and Taught by them So that such Doctrines as they then Publish'd in their Writings and Preach'd to the People without Censure or Reproof I cannot look on as a Private or Closet-Concern but as the Public and Receiv'd Doctrine of their Times and that in the Sermons and Works of the Pastors is seen the Belief of the Flock And this will oblige me to conclude that Such Doctrines and Practices of which these Ancient Fathers and Doctors stand charg'd by Moderns was not the Doctrine of Private Men but of the Whole Church of their Times It being not at all probable to think while the Pastors are thus generally condemn'd for Papists that the People should be Protestants I demand of you Whether the Writings and Books of Protestant Prelates Doctors and Divines Publish'd under Edward 6. and Queen Elizabeth be not an Argument that besides shewing their Private Sentiments will prove likewise the Doctrine and Belief of Their Church and that whosoever quarrels with them for their Protestant Negatives and Dissenting from the Church of Rome do's not in the same Breath condemn their Whole Church of which they were Rulers and Overseers If so have not I equal Grounds to believe that the Concurring Sentiments of the Primitive Fathers was the Sense of the Primitive Church and that the accusing them of Popish Doctrines and Principles is a Condemnation of their Whole Church over which God had plac'd them Prelates Pastors and Teachers So that by all my Reason can discover yet if I am to be of the Religion of the Primitive Times I am to be no Protestant but continue as I am a Papist and if I were not so this your Appealing to the Primitive Church and our Search into it would e'en oblige me to renounce Your Communion who only make a Noise of the Primitive Church and are nothing like it but are as much for Reforming that as you did the Church of Henry 8. Misrepres Leave these Private Doctors and Fathers and look but into the First Four General Councils and you 'l soon discover that the Church of those Primitive Christians was nothing else but Protestant Repres I find too much of the Pope in those Councils to think they were Protestants The Pope Presides