the King as Head thereof and have placed it upon the Bishops of Canterbury as you may read at large in the 10. and 11. p. of his Answer to sir John Bankes if Canterbury be her Head as Mason and others affirme then sure I am that Christ is none of her head for his body is no monster to have two heads Therefore the Church of England is a whorish and Antichristian Church and none of Christs having nothing to doe with Jesus Christ nor any of his Lawes Worship Offices Ordinances or Administrations but in the next place you bring an Argument to prove the Religion in the Church of England to be true and you thus lay it downe That Religion which will lead men on into the true way of salvation that must needs be the true Religion But the Religion which we professe leads into the true way of salvation for men to looke for salvation in Gods free mercy in Jesus Christ Therefore say you your Argument must needs be true I answer that if it were granted which in the least I doe not that your Religion is true yet this alone were not sufficient to prove your Church true But I absolutely deny your Argument and affirme that your Religion neither is the true Religion nor that it leads men the true way to salvation for I have already proved it to be a false Religion and that it leads men the true way to Rebellion against God and his Son Jesus Christ But you will say how comes it to passe that some are saved which professe our Religion which you affirme to be false I answer in Moses words hidden things belongs to God but revealed things to us and our Children Devt 29.29 but yet when I seriously consider of it and with a deliberate eye looke into the holy Scripture the revealed will of God it makes me thinke say and cry out with Paul Rom. 11.33 O the depthes of the riches both of the wisedome and knowledge of God how unspeakeable are his judgments and his wayes past finding out who can save his People those elect ones even in the bosome of Antichrist his cursed Kingdome of darknesse contrary to all grounded reason that the wit of man is able to give or render from his revealed will but only must say it is alone his meer mercy and gratious and omnipotent pleasure so to doe who is tyed to no meanes place or person but can worke and bring to passe his owne ends and purposes without meanes yea and beyond all outward meanes 1 Kin. 19.10.17 Ezec. 57. for the holy one of Israel is not limited But to prove this Argument you lay downe an other after this manner If men professing the same way to salvation that we doe have lived and dyed in the profession of it and been saved then is the Religion and way to salvation that we professe a true Religion and way to salvation But men that professe our Religion have been saved Ergo it is true what childish reasoning is here to beg things after this manner and to judge the cause by the effect contrary to the whole currant of the Scripture for it doth largly shew that a bad and wicked cause or action may produce and bring forth a good and glorious effect and this is just as they said in Pauls time let us doe evill that good may come of it but saith he such mens damnation is just Rom. 3.8 and if you have read the Scripture which it appeares you have not very often you may know that the Midwives and Harlot Rahabs lying saved the Israelites children and the Spies lives Exod. 1. Josh 2. for which act of mercy they are commended in the Word of God and also it produced good effects to them for the Lord caused the Midwives to prosper and saved Rahab alive yet for all this they sinned in lying and doe you not know that the Word of God saith wee must not doe the least evill that the greatest good may come of it but yet by your reasoning a man may which to affirme is the height of wickednes and impiety and also by your reasoning a man may defend and justifie all the sinnes and sayings of Gods people and others recorded in the Booke of God out of which that God that is able to bring light out of darkenes and good out of evill hath brought much glory to himselfe as out of Pharaohs hard heartednesse and blood thirsty cruelty that he exercised upon Gods people it produced good to them by working their deliverance and glory to God by manifesting his power and goodnes yet for all this Pharaohs sin was never the lesse And also according to your reasoning Judas his treason might be excused for that sin of his brought a world of glory unto God and salvation and eternall glory to his elect and chosen ones yet though his betraying of Christ did produce such a good and glorious effect it did nothing at all excuse his sin Againe your Arg. is nothing to the purpose to prove that which you have undertaken for we are not reasoning of the way and meanes of salvation which is only and alone by faith in the Lord Christ which is possible may be had in a false Ch. yea also in no Ch. but the thing we are about is to prove see whether the Ch. of Eng. be a true Ch. of Christ or a false Ch. of Antichr But yet more fully to Answer your Argument what though it be confessed that many of God Elect have been saved that have professed your false and Antichr Rel. it will not therefore follow that your Religion is a true Religion nor your church a true church because some have been saved that have professed it I hope you will not so conclude which if you doe then I say by your owne grounds that the chruch of Rome is a true church the Religion there a true Religion for many therein have lost their lives for the maintaining of some truths which have yet adheared to the Church of Rome of many of their eternall happines as good grounds may be given as the most of the martyrs of the ch of Eng. yea and I verily beleive that God hath had and still hath a people there which belongs to his Election of grace which both hath and will save and so by your owne grounds their church and Religion are both true because it is possible that some that professe have been and still may be saved But if you will maintaine this then you contradict your owne writers which have plentifully proved the Religion in Rome and the church thereof to be false and yet have granted that some have been saved there therefore for you to goe about to prove rhe church of Engl. true and the worship therein true because some of the members thereof that have professed the Religion therin have been saved is an erronious unsound ground for by this ground it will follow that the Crosse upon
which the Theife was hanged was a true church for there he had salvation the apprehension of Gods love his assurance of his enterance into the Kingdome of glory as fully as ever any in the ch of En. had and also it will follow that the Chariot in which the Eunuch rode Acts 8. was a true ch for there he came to the knowledg of his salvation the apprehension of the true love of God in Christ also you know God by his almighty power saved Daniel the three children alive even in the Lyons den and in the hot burning furnace and because God by his power did this shall I therefore goe cast my false into the fire and among the Lyons say they have no power to burne me or kill me but I am safe enough because God preserved Daniel and the three children alive in the like condition every wise man would conclude surely I were out of my wits So you see how erronious rotten insufficient unsound all your grounds arguments are in the lying downe of which you run with your deceitfull Logike like a blind horse in a mill about about and still come to the same place where you begun never in the least prove any thing you say by the authority of the word of God nor yet by any grounded reason but ruly your false affirmations for the wind that comes out of you mouth is so weak and feeble that it will scarce blow away a straw if it lie in your way And then in the last place you bring an Arg. in the necke of this being of the same nature with the former and it is this That because Latimer Hooper Bradford with many others were martyrs in your ch and were saved ssâ—… by the judgment of charity not infalibly wee may judge were saved and knew the corruptions of your church and yet did not separate away from it therefore it is a true Church and need not be separated from seeing men may be saved in it Truly I must confesse unto you I am almost weary with answering your paultery old rotten mouldy stuffe and you are such a novice in the misteries of God and godlynesse and the Kingdome of his Son Jesus Christ not understanding what you say or affirme nor bow to prove an Argument that I am almost loath any more to contend with you in regard the victory in overcomeing you will be so poore and meane and your wares are such paltery and peplary commodities that I am even tyred with lookeing upon them and turning them over but yet for all this I will a litle reply to this your last Argument but I hope you do not hold that maxime in the Church of Rome extra ecclesia nulla salus that is out of the Church no salvation if you doe it is most erronious for I have proved it and the whole New Testament doth declare it that it is possible for a man to be saved though he be a member of no visible Church yea and that some that are joyned to a false Church may be saved but yet if they may be so it is no ground for their staying or abiding there for God cals and commands all his people to be separated from the World and all false churches 2 Cor. 6.16.17.18 Rev. 18.4 but it seemes by your reasoning you hold that if a man get salvation and get to heaven and so get his own ends served let Gods glory goe a begging and lye at the stake a bleeding for all you but truly such a servant deserves no wages but rather punishent for alas man this is but selfe seeking at the best in which a man can have no spirituall comfort and joy But God would have his people to joy and rejoyc in walking in his wayes and sing and be merry and be of a chearefull countenance as it doth become the heires of the Crowne of glory and he would have them not only as it were creep into Heaven but to strive and labour to have an abundant enterane thereinto 1 Pet. 19.10.11 but by your reasoning you would have them never be merry joyfull nor chearfull for in false wayes there is no peace nor comfort Esa 59 8 9.11 Mal. 2.2 but live like forlorne men destitute of all comfort hanging downe their heads like bulrushes and so dishonour their God and their Christ in the eyes of the men of the world who will glory and triumph over them as though there were not that sweetnes beautifulnes amiablenes fulnes satisfaction and contednes in the enjoying of God in his Son Christ that might make them walke with merry counterances chearfull hearts and reioycing soules as it becomes the Sons and heires of the King of glory disdaining contemning and lightly esteeming the base and empty moth eaten contents of this present world and to have their affections crucified to it and it to them and though they be in the world yet to walke as those whose conversation is already in Heaven longing and desiring to be dissolved to be with Christ which is best of all Away man Christ hath no need of such unserviceable selfe seeking servants as you on are to weare his glorious and rich Livery and let me tell you God never sent his sonne Christ to save us for that end to live at ease and delight as we lift or in the fashion of the World but that we should glorifie him in being unlike to the World in our lives and conversation by an unblameable walking in all his wayes labouring and endeavouring to yeild obedience to all his Lawes and commaunds not suffering our hearts to be possessed with base feares of the world nor be in love with the things thereof but that wee should hold forth the profession of the purity of his truth and Gospell without feare before the eyes of the world and though wee suffer persecution affliction and tribulation for it that wee should joy and rejoce in it and esteem it our Crown and happines that the Lord counts us worthy to suffer for his sake And truly let me tell you he that seekes but his own ends and so that he could be but saved cares for no more not regarding or takeing thought what becomes of Gods glory honour and praise it is an evident and demonstrable signe that that man doth not belong to God nor never shall be heire of glory John 14.23.24 25.8.14 1 John 3.8.10 2.9 Rev. 12.11 14.4 And what if Latimer and the rest of the martyrs had communion with the Church of England is that a sufficient ground that therefore wee must not separate away from it I hope not for what if God winked at their blindnes darkenes and ignorance yet now let me say with Paul that in truth he will have all his people to come to the knowledge of his truth and wayes Acts 17.20 because he hath appoynted a day wherein he will shortly judge that great scarlet whore of Rome and all her
my Sorrow for you to see you who are so mighty a Champian as you boast your selfe to be to reason so shallowly and ungroundedly for if your Argument be true then all the Nations under Heaven are true visible Churches of Christ for it is not possible that the Heathenest Nation in the World should runne out of Gods Voyce and Call Psal 139.7.8.9 For saith Dauid If I ascend up into Heaven thou art there if I make my Bed in Hell behold thou art there if I take the Wings of the Morning and dwell in the uttermost part of the Sea even there shall thy hand lead me and thy right hand shall hold me if I say surely the darknes shall cover me even the night shall be light about me yea the darknes hideth not from thee but the night shineth as the day the darknes and the light are both alike to thee And also see Amos. 9.1.2.3 Where you may also read that no place can hide a people from Gods presence or call so that I say no place can exempt a people from Gods voyce but wheresoever they are he can find them out and by his Judgements laid upon a Nation or Peeple whether they be Pagans Heathens and Infidels that professedly serve and worship Idols and nothing else or whether they be a Nation of seeming Christians as England is no more like the Samaritanes that professe the Worship of the true God and yet serve their Idols 2. King 17.32.33 yet take them in which sence you will I say they are within the Voyce and call of God and by his Judgements and Plagues laid upon them for their sinnes he calls them to Repentance that so they might not perish but be saved as the Apostle Paull in the first of the Romans doth largly prove Vers 18.19 and so forward So that by your Argment all the Nations under Heaven are visible Churches of Christ for I thus frame my Argument according to your owne grounds All the Nations of the Earth that are within the Voyce and call of God calling them to Faith and Repentance that so they may be saved are true Churches But all the Pagan and Heathen Notions in the World are within the Voyce and call of God as I have already proved Ergo. They are true visible Churches Deny any part of the Argument if you can and prove against it But for the proofe of your Argument you cite Math. 20.16 where it is said Many are called but few chosen the first part of the words Many are called you say but doe not prove that we are to understand them of the visible Church which are called to the outward preaching of the word to which I answere and say you are not an Oracle of God that we must beleeve your sayings without ground for you bring no proofe for what you say but your owne bare Affirmations but if you will be an Oraclo it is but a lying Oracle and not of Gods you say they are called to the outward preaching of the Word it seemes to me that you will have all the people in a Nation that are within Gods call to be Preachers and then what shall become of all your Preists for if this be not your meaning I know not what you drive at but for that place of Scripture many are called but few are chosen I understand it thus many there was that heard the Word of God and seemingly professed it as they that came to Johns Baptisme and Herod that reformed many things and those many great multitudes that Christ preached unto many of which made an outward profession of him for a time but it was but for the loaves as he himselfe doth witnesse John 6.26.27 so here are many called to the outward profession of the Gospell but saith the Text few are chosen that is to say ehough there be many that make a formall profession of Christ and have the ouiside of Christianity yet few are they that are chosen either to Christs glorious kingdome with his father or are chosen and admitted as visible members and Subjects in his visible Church or Kingdome which in Scripture hath many and divers names as Syon Jerusalem his holy Mountaine the Lords holy place the kingdome of Heaven Psal 54.7.147.12 Fsa 62.6.65.9.11 Psal 68.17.33.46.4 Mat. 20.1 Rev. 21.1.10 this exposition of the place I plainly prove from Christs preaching to so many as he did the most of which for a time did outwardly prosesse him yet all those great multitudes that he preached unto and wrought Miracles amongst at his death there was but an hundred and twenty that entered into communion to worship him in a visible Church Acts 1.15 and in the second of the Acts Peter preached to a great multitude of people yet that multitude were not members of a true visible Church neither before he preached to them nor after but only so many of them as declared and manifested faith which were to the Number of three Thowsand and they were added or joyned to the Church and the Apostle commands them to save or seperate themselves from the rest of the multitude which he preached unto seing they did not peleeve nor were never the better for his preaching saying Save your selves from thes untoward Generatron Vers 40.41 For the Lord would not have them to joyne Riffe Raffe and all sorts of people to the Church to whom the Word was preached but only those that declared the worke of Grace to be wrought in their hearts therefore the Spirit of God saith The Lord added to the Church daily such as should be saved Now though I grant the Kingdome of England is within the Voyce and call of God calling the people thereof to Repentance that so they may be saved yet I grant no more then what all the Nations under Heaven are therefore you cannot conclude from this Ground that the Church of England is a true Church of Christ seing the Whol Nation good or bad wicked or righteous godly or ungodly have all one and the same Priviledge by virtue of their being professed Membees of your Ch. therefore from that which hath been said I frame this Argument That the true visible Church of Christ under the Gospell doeth not consist of all sorts and kinds of people to whom the word of God is preached but only to such persons who by their outward Conversation may be judged to be true Beleevers Esay 4.3.35.8.9.10.51.11 Rom. 1.7 1. Cor. 1.7 Rev. 22.14 But the Church of England is not made up nor doeth not consist of true Beleevers that is to say Saints by calling and practice but of all sorts and kinds of wicked persons as Witches Sorcerers Whoremungers Drunkards Idolaters Swearers Blasphemers all sorts of Prophane Lewd Wicked livers Ergo It is no true Church of Christ but a false and Antichristian Church of Antichrists 2. Cor. 6.9.10 Rev. 9.20.21 and 13.8.16.17 and 21.27 and 22.15 Both the Proposition and Assumption I have already strongly proved
made it manifest Well now to come to your fift Argument which is thus framed If the Church of Engl. have the true matter and forme of a true Church then it must needs be a true Ch. But the Ch. of Engl. hath the matter forme of a true Church Ergo. It is a true visible Church Ans 5. I Answer if it had the true matter forme of a true visible Church then ti were true indeed for these are both and only essentiall to the being of a true Ch. but I say you want them both But you for to prove it say that the matter of a true Ch. is a company of men and that you have and you say the Forme is a profession of true Religion truly you bewray the blindnes and ignorance of a man whse braines and understanding is infatuated and made drunke with the spirituall cup of fornication of the scarlat whore not in the least understanding what you say and affirme yet to answer your Arg. though I grant that where true matter and true forme is there is a true Church yet I absolutely deny that you have either true matter or true forme which you say you thinke none will deny so that the begging of things and takeing that for granted which I deny and which you are never able to prove is the best ground you have to prove your false Arg. true But now for the matter of a true Ch. you will have it to be a company of men making no distinction but let them be what kind soever they will serve it seemes to be true matter in your ch whether they be a company of men possessed with Divels and uncleane spirits from whose mouth Christ will owne no confession nor service but absolutely commands them to hold their peace and not to take his name in their mouthes to speake of him Mar. 1 s 25.34 oa whether they be Inchanters Sorcerers or diviners or wether they be whoremongers fornicatorss Idolaters adulterers drunkards swearers blaspheamers prophane persons lyars or those that commit the sin against the holy ghost so they be but men let them he what kind of men they will you say they are fit matter for a true church indeed I confesse they are the fittest matter for your church that you can have and your church is made up and doth consist of all such sorts kinds of wicked persons which doth evidently and undenyably prove it to be an Antich Ch. and one of the nationall Citties that is under the government of the Beast for he is said to compell all as you doe both rich and poor high low bond free to become his servants subjects and to worship him according to his lawes and whosoever will not shall not live neither in peace nor quietnes Rev. 13.15.16 and this is the practice of your Church daily and hourly for the most unfittest matter for your Churches are the Consciencious Saints that desire to glorifie God as well in their Bodys as in their Sâ—ules and to walke unblameably in all his waies and if there be any such among you they are cast out of your Synagogues by you and prohibited either to buy or sell with you though such as these alone be the only true and fit matter for the visible Church or Kingdome of Jesus Christ Esay 35.10 51.11 Jer. 4.5 Act. 1.14.15 2.41.47 11.21.23 Rom. 1.7 1 Cor. 1.2 1 Pet. 2.9 Rev. 22.14 For all uncleane wicked and ungodly persons of what sort soever are no fit matter to become members of Christs holy City new Jerusalem which is said to come downe from Heaven or visible Church for all such should and ought to be kept out from thence Act. 2.40 1 Cor. 5.13 6.9.10 Rev. 21.27 22.15 In the second place you say the proffession of true Religion is the forme of a true Church this you in England doe and have and therefore are a true Church For answer to which I say that I have already in the foregoing discourse fully proved that your Religion is not a true Religion but a false seing you worship and serve God not accoding to his Lawes and commands but with and according to your owne devises and Inventions but yet I doe confesse that yee doe professe like the Samaritane the worship of the true God but for all that with them you serve your Idols therefore by your owne grounds you have not the forme of a true Church wherefore by the same Ground it followes that you are not a true Church But now punctually to answer your Argument I affirme that thâ— forme of a true Church is for a company of beleevers who are washed in the blâ—od of Christ by a free and voluntary Consent or willingnesse to enter into that heavenly and holy State City or Kingdome which in the word of God is plentiuflly described and by the power of Christ to become a constituted or Polytique Body or Corporation or an inclosed or fenced Garden or Vinyard and then by virtue of their combination uniting joyning themselves together each to other so unto the Lord promising to walk in all his waies to yeild obedience to all his Lawes commands as he requires they should Gen. 17. 2 Cor. 6 17.18 they become a true visible Church of Jesus Christ Deut. 29.9.10.11 2 King 11.17 2 Cron. 15.12 Nehe. 10.29 Psal 110. 3. Jer. 50.4.5 Act. 23.24 so hath power from Christ her head to cast out offenders 1 Cor. 5. to chuse elect ordaine her own Officers Act. 6.3.5 14.23 they ordained them Elders in every Church by Election as the Originall and Beza's Translation with others read it though the word Election by the Bishops fraud and Pollicy be left out in our last English Translation and to receive in beleevers 2 Cor. 2.7.8 and to keepe out wicked persons Rev. 21.27 and 22.15 and to reprove and admonish her owne Officers Bishops or Overseers Col. 4.17 or doe her selfe any sprituall good or exclude from herselfe any evill shee feares or is like to come upon her without the helpe or assistance of any either church or officers besides her selfe Rev. 1.2.3 ch but the Ch. of Eng. neither hath or ever had this forme in the least as I have fully manifested elsewhere as also you may read in a litle Booke lately printed called the Three Estates that is to say the Civill State the rrue Ecclesiasticall Sate and the False Ecclsiasticall State and also you want the profession of the true Religion and therefore your Ch. is no true Ch. of Christ for it is vnited by profession subjection to the Pope of Lambeth who is substitute to the Pope of Rome whome Mason in his Epistle Dedicatory before his Booke of Ordination of Bishops Preists and Deacons cals the Head and cheife over the Ch. of Engl. for they in their publike Court of High Commission at the censure of that noble and worthy Dr. Bastwicke have renounced
by the Authority of the Scripture and deny either of them and prove against them if you be able Againe your second Argument to prove the Church of England a true Church is this That Ministry which doeth accomplish the same and which the Ministry of the Apostles did must needs be a true Ministry But the Ministry of the Church of England doeth accomplish the same ends that the Apostles Ministry did namely conversion and confirmation Therefore the Ministry of the Church of England must needes be true But to prove your Argument you bring not one Place of Scripture but take that for granted which I confidently thinke neither you nor none in the Ch. of Engl. are ever able to prove therefore I absolutely in every respect deny your Arg. two manner of waies prove against it 1. I will prove that if the Ministry in the Ch. of Engl. did accomplish the same ends that the Ministry of the Apostles did yet for all that that is not sufficient to prove it a true Ministry for to judge the cause by the effect is a Leaden and false Rule 2. I will prove that the Ministry in Engl. doth not accomplish the same ends that the Ministry of the Apostls did therfore by your own Arg. is no true Ministry Now for the first of these which answers the Major of your Arg. I say it hath beene and still may be possible for a man to accomplish the same ends that you here speake of namely to be an Instrument to bring Gods people to the manifestation of Faith also to build them up yet be no true Officer or Minister in the Ch. of God I prove it out of the Acts of the Apostles in which we read that when the Ch. began to encrease Saul raised a great persecution against it upon which all the brethren viz. the members of the Ch. were scattered abroad they went up down preaching the word Act 8.3 but the Apostles themselves they stayed still at Jerusalem Vers 1. Now all those that were scatterd abroad were not true Officiall Ministers for they were but Lay-men according to your distinction in the Church of England yet divers of them who were no true Officers but Bretheren Disciples or private men as you call them yet they preached the Word to the Gentiles there begot by their preaching maany of them to the Faith for the Text saith The hand of the Lord was with them and a great number of them beleeved and then came Barnabas from Jeausalem who was yet no true Officer in the Church of God being as yet uncalled to his Apostleship and he confirmed and strengthened and more fully built them up in the Faith of Christ and in the Knowledge of the wayes of God Also Aquilah and his wife Priscilla did further instruct and build up that Eloquent man Apollos Act. 18.26 Also there were certaine women that laboured with Paull in the Gospell Phil. 4.3 So that here you see and I have proved it that people may be called to the manifesttaion of Eaith and further built up by those that are no true Officers or Ministers in the Church of Chirst but if your Argument were true then it would follow that all those men yea and the women too were true Officers and Ministers in the Church of Christ because they were Instruments of bringing Gods people to the manifestation of Faith and further built them up but your Argument is rotten and unsound and falls here flat to the ground and therefore if I should grant it which I doe not that your Ministers by their Ministry did accomplish the same ends that the Apostles by their Ministry did yet this would not be sufficient to prove them true Officers or Ministers for the excecution of an Office doeth not prove an Officer but only a true and lawfull call into the Office which all your Priests and Minnisters in England want and therefore are no true Officers nor no true Ministers of Jesus Christ For you know that a King hath many in his Kingdome besides himselfe that doe those actions administer those administrations that is peculiar to him alone to doe and administer unlesse they were Authorized by virtue of a power given and derived from him to do such actions without a lawfull Authority given and received from him they might loose their lives for the doing of them but now if your Argument were true that all those men that are meanes or Instrumensts to bring Gods People to the manifestation of Faith and obedience to the Law and will of Christ were true Officers and Ministers of Christ it would follow by the same Argument that all those men that doe the actions of a King or accomplish the same ends that Kings by their actions doe accomplish are true Kings but so to conclude in England is little better then High Treason Therefore your Argument is erroneous and false and hath not validity in it for if so be you will have their Administrations to prove the lawfulnesse of their Office then I pray you wherein doth the execution of their Office consist for an Office and the execution of it are two distinct things for a man by virtue of being instated into the Office of a Judge though he never live to execute any of those acttions or Administrations that belong to his place or Office but he must first receive power to sit in Court of Judicature before he dare take upon to fit there as Judge and when he hath receiced power from the King by virtue of which he is instated into his Office and doth become an Officer then doth he lawfully sit in Court of Judicature and condemneth fellons and guilty persons and acquit the innocent and doth there passe sentence according to the Lawes for the King under whom he is a Judge But now if this Judge should usurpe his place and come into it by virtue of a false Authority and then condemne the Kings Subjects to death though they be theives and malefactors yet he would be in danger of loosing his life for all that though he doe the act and actions that belong to a true Judge to doe because he had no lawfull Authority from the King so to doe for it is the Kings Authority placed upon a man that doth make that person to be an other kind of person then before he was for before he had received this power he was but a private man but now he is an other kind of man namely a a publike person in Office and Authority and may lawfully do those actions now which if he should have done before would have cost him his life Even so is it with the Ministers and Officers which Jesus Christ hath instituted in his New Testament and left personally to officiate in his Church they must be members of an incorporated or constituted City body or visible Church and then if the Church find any amongst themselves fitted or qualified according
to those guifts and qualifications which the Apostle layes downe in the first of Timothy the 3. 5. chapters and the first or Titus then the Church hath authority to chuse them for her Officers Num. 8.9.10 Ezeck 33.2 Acts 1.23.6.3.5 14.24 but though they be never so fitted guifted and qualified yet they are not to take upon them to officiate in the Church of God by virtue of an Office before they have a true and lawfull Call from the Church who only and alone hath power from Christ her only King and Head to instate them into that Office and whereas before they were but members or private men as you in the Church of England call them and could not lawfully doe those actions that belong to a true Minister or Officer in the Church of God to doe yet now they may doe them upon grounded grounds for it is only their lawfull Call into their Office that puts a distinction betwixt them and the other members or Brethren of the Church as is plaine out of the first of the Acts where Joseph and Matthias were by the Apostles and Brethren set a part for the Apostleship and Joseph for any thing I know was as well fitted for the Office as Matthias was for the Church was not able to put a difference betwixt them which was the more fit but yet for all this they were not both Apostles but only Matthias who was lawfully chosen and immediatly called by God into the Office and then those actions that he did and Adminstrations that he administred was the execution of his Office so that it any should have questioned him whether he was an Apostle or no he would not runne to the Administration or Execution of his Office to prove himselfe a true Apostle but he would goe to his Call into his Office which was from God and which gave him a being in his Office and power to Officiate and doe those actions that he did and though he had nevâ—â— lived to have executed any of those actions that belonged to his Office yet he had been a true Apostle for all thae by virtue of his Call into his Apostleship So that I say to you of your Ministers it is not sufficient for them when they tre questioned about their Calling and put upon it to prove it whether it be from God or the Diuell the one of which it must needs be to runne to the Execution and Administration of their Office to prove the lawfullnesse of their standings in their Office but they should goe to the power and Authority that instituted them into their Office of Priesthood and prove it whether it be true or no which if they cannot doe I say they are all false and Antichristain Officers and Ministers which all Gods people are bound in Conscience to detest as the Divell and oppose to the utmost of their power and strength and therefore I put you upon it to prove if you can the lawfulnes of their standing for doe you thinke that they which are Antichrists Ministers have a greater priveledge of exempion from proving the lawfulnes of their Calling and Office when they are questioned then either that great Prophet Jihn the Baptist or Josus Christ the sonne of God and his Apostles had truly I see no Ground nor Reason for it unlesse you will say their bare word is of greater Authority then the words of the Eternall Sonne of God and his Apostles For first of all John the Baptist when he was questioned by the Scribes and Pharisees what he was he doeth not say It is sufficient that I doe the worke of a Prophet and therefore you need not nor have noe ground to question me any further about my Authority no he knew such an Answer would not serve their turne and therefore when they aske him what he was he confessed that he was not the Christ what then art thou say they to him art thou Elias and he saith I am not who then art thou he said I am the voyce of one caying in the Wildernesse make straight the way of the Lord as saith the Prophet Esay as Joh. 1.19.20 and so forward So you see John brings Authority from the Scripture to prove his Office doeth not runne as your Priests doe to the Administration or Execution of his Office to prove his Office or the lawfulnesse of his standing in it Also Christ himselfe when he was questioned by the Jewes about his miracles and those great workes which he wrought by virtue of what authority he did them he answers and saith If I beare witnesse of my selfe my witnesse is not true and therefore he brings his Father and John the Baptist and the holy Scripture to beare witnes of him that he did not take up his authority that he exercised of himselfe neither did he come unto them of his owne head and in his owne name but brings the voyce of his Father and the authority of the Word to bear witnes that he was sent of God prophesied of old to be the Messias John 5.31.32.37.46 8.17.18 Also the Apostle Paul when he was questioned by his enemies about his authority or the lawfulnes of his office he goes unto his Call into his office and that authority that placed him in it and by that proves that he tooke not that authority that he exercised upon him without good grounds but had it placed upon him by Jesus Christ himselfe Acts 22.10.11 so forward Also when he was questioned by the false Apostles at Corinth and Galatia about his authority he answers for himselfe that he was an Apostle and was free for I have saith he seen Jesus Christ who placed me in my office and by his authority gave me my Apostleship and called me by his voyce thereunto so that my authority and calling is not from men as you false Apostles are nor by men as the Ordinary Officers of the Church are who are called by the Church who hath authority from God so to doe but immediately from Jesus Christ our Lord as all his true Apostels are 1 Cor. 9.1 Gal. 1.1 So that you see Paul proved he was an Apostle and a true officer of Jesus Christ before ever he preached his Gospell and before ever he was an instrument to bring any to the knowledge and obedience of the truth and before ever the Corinthes became being begot by his Ministery the Seale of his Apostleship And doth John Baptist Christ and his Apostles whensoever they are questioned about their authority by their opposers prove their calling into their office by virtue of which they doe officiate and administer those administrations they administer and thinke your Ministers those Preists and Deacons of Antichrist to have more exemption then Christ or his Apostles had and therefore if they be ministers of Christ as they say they are I put you and them upon it to prove their calling and office from him that they were instated into their Ministry by
have them follow him no further then he followed Christ 1. Cor. 11.1 But your Ministers in their actions and practise do declare and say unto the people that they will not owne Jesus Christ for the only Prophet or his Church and therefore they teach the people to worship the Lord with Ceremonies and Wil-worship as Capping Cringing and Duking clean contrary to the seccond Commandement and also with Holy Gâ—â—ments as they call them and with booke prayer translated out of the Popes cursed Masse-booke as worthy Dr. Eustaricke doeth in the third part of hâ—s Letany declare and prove by which they teach the people to leave the naked simplicity of that worship which Jesus Christ hath instituted in his New Testament John 4.23.25 saying to the woman of Samaria the hower cometh and now is when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth for the Father seeketh such to worship him for God is a spirit and they that worship rim must worship him in spirit and in truth and tie and bring the people to worship God with a worship which is meerly and altogether sinfull mens inventions and foolish devises which worship is odious detestable hatefull abominable to God Esa 1.11.12.13 66.3.4 Jer. 6.19.20 25.6.44.21.22.23 Amos 5.21.22 Mat. 15.8.9 Marke 7.7.8 Col. 2. So that I may truly say of the Church of England and the worshippers therein as the spirit of God said of Judah in the second of Esa 8.9 their Land also is full of Idols they worship the workes of their owne hands that which their owne fingers have made and the meane man boweth downe and the great man humbleth himselfe therefore forgive them not 3. Againe in the third place as Jesus Christ is the only Preist and Porphet of his Church so he is the only King and Lawgiver of it and to it and none else Psal 2. 149.19 Esa 9.6.7 83.20 for the Lord is our Judge the Lord is our Lawgiver saith the Church of God the Lord is our King he will save us now the Apostles by their ministery taught this to the Saints and Churches of God That Jesus Christ is the only King and Lawgiver of and to his Church vnto whose Lawes and Septer alone and to none other they must stoope submit and yeild unto Ephes 1.21.22 2.22.23 Col. 2.2.3.6.7 Heb. 3. begin 20.28.29 12.25 But your Ministers by their Ministrery teach the people to rebell and bid defiance against the Septer Lawes and Commands of Christ as though he had not had wisedome and power enough to have erected and governed his owne spirituall Kingdome and to have instituted sufficient Offices as voyd places for his people by virtue of his Lawes to elect and chuse Officers to administer therin for the building of them up till they come to perfect then in the knowledge of God and unto the measure of the fulnes of Christ contrary to what the Apostle affirmes by the spirit of God Ephes 4.11.12.13 and therefore they teach the people to run to Antichrist and seeke for more Officers Away with such horrible wickednes as this which your Bishops Preists and Deacens those litle toes of Antichrist dayly and howerly perpetrate and commit as if so be Jesus Christ had not been so faithfull in his House as Moses was in his and as though he had not had so sufficient a care of his Church under the Gospell as Moses had under the Law and therefore they goe unto Antichrist Christs professed enemie and there would teach the people to seeke for Lawes for the governing of the Church of God under the Gospell rakeing them out of his cursed counsels Bookes of Articles and diabolicall Traditions and in their doing of this which is their constant practises they teach flat Rebellion and High Treason againg the Septer and Kingdome of the everlasting Son of God who will have his church governed by his owne Lawes which he instituted and left recorded in his last Will and Testament which he hath bequeathed to his church commanding them as they will answer it before his dreadfull appearing to observe and keep them strictly without violation in the least and also by his owne Officers therein expressed who are only five who are to be permanent officiating in personall presence and Being for the freedome of his church namely Pastor Teocher Elder Deacon and Widdow Rom. 12.7.8 Phil. 1.1 1 Tim. 3. 5. chap. But they teach the people to goe to the Lawes and Officers of Antichrist which are a great multitude in number as Patriarkes Primates Metrapolitanes Arch-Bishops Lord Bishops Deanes Chancellours Vicar generall Prebends Doctours of the Civill Law Doctours of Divinity Proctours Registers Arch-Deacons Sub-Deacons Preists Jesuites Parish-preists Parsons Vicars Curates Cannons Petty Cannons Chanters Vestrey men Church wardens Sworne men Side men Parish clarkes damnable and divelish Pursevants Summers Apparritours with a great many more And therefore in this respect doe not by their Ministery accomplish the same ends that the Ministery of the Apostles did and so by your owne grounds are no true Ministers And aâ— for those two things of conversion and confirmation or building up in the wayes of God which you speake of if you meane by conversion an opening of the eyes to turne them from drunkenes to light and from the power of Satan unto God Or if you meane by conversion a deliverance from the power of darkenes and a translation into the Kingdome of the Son of God both of which the Apostles Ministery did accomplish in the hearts and lives of Gods people Asts 26.18 Col. 1.13 I absolutely deny it that your Ministery in England doth this And therefore I desire you to declare what you meane by conversion and prove your definition by the holy Scripture and also prove that you in England are so converted which when you have done I shall further answer you by Gods assistance And as for their building them up in the wayes of God as all true Sheepheards ought to build up their sheepe as Acts 20. 1 Pet. 5. yet I deny it that your ministers doe it for how can they build them vp in that which they themselves are ignorant of and enemies unto for as Jannes and Jambres which withstood Moses so doe these men also resist the truth being men of corrupt minds and destitute of the truth 2 Tim. 3.8 and doe feed you with huskes and chaffe being neither willing to embrace it themselves nor to let those that would as their constant preaching and speaking against the truth of God and the Kingdome of his Son doth witnesse And in the conclusion of this your Argument you say when the Separation can prove conversion in an Antichristian Church you will say more to them this belongs to you to prove for we doe not plead for Antichrist but against him and all his And therefore have I taken the paines by the Word of God and demonstrable Argument grounded therevpon to prove the Church
and till you have proved it true all the paines that you have taken in proving that it is possible for corruptions and wicked livers to be in a true Ch. is spent in vaine and to no purpose and I am confident that you nor none else will ever be able to prove the Ch. of Eng. true nor any other Nationall Ch. for Jesus Christ by his death did abolish the National Church of the Jewes with all there Lawes rites and Ceremonies thereof and in the new Testament did never institute no nationall Ch. nor left no Lawe nor Officers for the governing thereof but the Church that he instituted are free and indedendant bodies or Congregations depending upon none but only upon Christ their Head Therefore nationall Churches under the Gospell are of Antichrists that man of sins institution and ordaining who only hath ordained Lawes and officers of his owne for the governing of them as I have sufficiently proved at large in my foresaid Answer to W. G. and but put the ease the Ch. of Eng. had been a true Ch. as it never was yet those abominable corruptions and most detestable grosse open notoriovs wickednes and prophanes would have utterly destroyed long ere this her Essence and Being and have made her utterly to have forfeited her Charter and have ceased to a true Ch. for if God threatned to unchurch the Ch. of Ephesus Rev. 2. and to take his heavenly state Charter and Candlesticke frow her for but forsakeing her first Love and the Gh. of Pergamus for having some in her that taught the Doctrin of Balam and the Ch. of Thiatira for suffering Jesabels doctrine to preached amonst them doe you think that he would haue spared the Ch. of Eng. to this day who for many hundred yeares even ever since her first constitution take her at her best hath been ten times worse then all these in which all manner of false doctrines have been manifestly maintained and preached and all kind of prophanes wickednes by her nembers practiced perpetrated Therefore for you or any other to say and affirme that this monsterous ugly botched and skabbed body is Christs true Spouse is dishonourable to his blessed Being and Mediatorship who gave himselfe for his Ch. that he might sanctifie and cleanse it with the washing of water by the Word that he might preserve it to himself a glorious Ch. not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing but that it should be holy and without blemish Ephes 5.26.27 for the name of this City is the Lord is there Ezr. 48.15 all the true Inhabitants of which are to be righteous as the servants and elect ones of the Lord Esa 60.21 65.2 but in the Ch. of Engl. he that is most acute in teaching false doctrine and setting up Antichrists wicked Kingdom climbes to the highest preferment and Church dignity as they call it witnes the prophane ignorant sottish athiesticall Bishops who are so voyde of understanding in the misteries of God and godlines that they dare not publikely dispute with the yonguest boy that doth oppose them though they have been challenged to it Also he that commits the most widkednes and ungodlynes is the best loved and respected and those that labour to oppose false doctrine and walke more holyer then others are the most hated despised and reejcted and this even in the bosome of your Church even by the Pillars and corner stones thereof witnes those late bloody barbarous and tyrannicall cutting of mens eares at the Pillory and whipping others at the Cart that even for conscience sake therefore doe you thinke or have you any ground to imagine that if ever your Ch. had been true but that these transcendant exceeding grosse vile corruptions would not have nullified destroy'd and annihilated her and â—â—â—e made Christ long ere now to have given her a Byll of Divorce as he did to â—…keslyding Israel and to have taken her Charter from her as he hath done from all those famous flourishing renouned Churches recorded in the New Testament It is true The Ch. of the Jewes had grosse mighty corruptions in her which was the height of her sin for which God severly plagud and punished her many times And what if she had such things in her that will not in the least defend the mighty corruptions in your Ch. seeing as I have proved it never was a true Ch. no nor never so long as she stands in that falfe Antichristian Nationall state as she doth but as for the Ch. of the Jewes it was a true Ch. unto whom God truly gave his Lawes Ordinances in the observation keeping of which she might have continued lovely amiable and beautifull in his eyes but yours hath not her Power Lawes and Ordinances from God but from the Divell Antich Rev. 13.2.4 It is true it was the sin of the Jewes to commit such grosse evils as they did and to suffer the offenders amongst them to goe unpunished contrary to their wholesome Lawes Gods own commaund who had ordained commanded them that the soule that committed such such evils should be out off destroyed from amongst the people as you may largely read in the 4. last Bookes of Moses because the Land as well as the people was an holy Land by virtue of Gods institution of it and setting it a part for himselfe as well as the people and therefore he would have had haynous transgressours to be destroyed or killed least the Land should be polluted desiled with their wickednes as he himselfe speakes now because they would not observe the Lawes Ordinances that he had given them though he suffered their manners long and bare much with their sin in that he fatherly chastised and corrected them againe againe before he utterly destroyed them and anhialated their nationall Ch. that so they might be left without excuse but seeing no Reformatton after so many corrections could not be had but their prophanations and grosse abominations were so great and continued in it caused him at the last utterly to renounce them and for ever put an end unto their nationall C. and Ceremoniall Law which was done at the death of Christ when he spake and said it is finished and now he will never any more returne againe unto them to become an husband as he was to the Nation of the Jewes though yet he hath as the Scriptures declare an elect remnant and company amongst them and at the end of their Nationall Church Jesus Christ the eternall Son of God by virtue of that power which he had received of and from his Father changed their Lawes Ordinances as the History of the Acts of the Apostles with the rest of the new Testament doth fully declare and he institued no nationall but particular Churches or Congregations many of which may be in one Countrey or nation all of them independant bodyes depending upon none but only upon Christ their head and withall
Cup which shee hath filled to us let us fill to her dâ—uble for she hath beene exceeding proud against the Lord of Hoasts even against the Holy One of Israel Jer. 50.8.14.29 51.6.9.10 Rev. 18.4.5.6 And also I will maintaine that the Church of Rome as it is called and as at this day it stands and hath done for above a Thousand years neither is nor never was a true visible Church of Christ It is true there was a true Church in Rome and at Rome but never of Rome the members of which were Saints and Beleevers but the Church of Rome now consists of all sorts and kinds of wicked and ungodly persons which they force by spirituall Tyranny if they refuse to submit unto them Rev. 13.15.16 Yea the common Strumpets Whores that pay so many thowsands in the year to the Popes Gracelesse Impiety for keeping publique and open Stew-houses even in Rome it selfe for all eommers and goers are as good members of the Church thereof and as well accepted of as the best they have And thus I have punctually answered the second thing that you desire your friend to take notice of which is that Corruptions may be in a true Church which I have granted but yet have proued that it is their sinne the continuance in their corruptions will overthrow their Essence being make Christ to begon from them and so unchurch them Also I have shewed that it serves nothing to the benefit of your Church seing you are not able to prove that ever it was true Now to that which I have said and by the Authority of the sacred word of God proved I chalenge your particular and punctuall Answer in writing wishing you to goe to W. B. and G. W. who hoth have been main sticklers enemies of late to the truth of God professed by the totall Seperation and desire their best and ablest asistance for I beleeve that some of your nine flexible Erronious Antichristian Argumenss were digged out of their Leaden Mines wherefore with importunity without any deniall desire them to helpe you to reply in writing to this my publique answer otherwise I will say and proclaime it that you all three are fearefull cowards and but the ignorant darke night bragging and screeching Owles of Antichrist Now out of that you have largely proved you say but I affirme you have proved nothing at all to the purpose you infer those four Conclusions 1. That all the Descriptions Definitions of a visible Church given by the Separation are all false because they will have none but Saints in their Church to be the matter of it 2. That all their buildings are false 3. That the ground of their Separation is not sound seing that in a true visible Church there have beene knowne wicked men 4. From hence you infer that it is lawfull and warrantable to have spirituall Communion mith known wicked men in a religious worship seing they are the greatest part of a visible Ch. then to conclude all you say many more things you might have set downe if time had permitted but these you say are sufficient To which I answer that these four Conclusions are all of them wicked Antichristian and damnable without all warrant in the least from the Scripture as as I have already largly proved therefore they are not in the least sufficient to satisfie the Conseicnce of any man or woman I trvly desire to walk-in Gods ways therefore if you would still keepe your Freind a subjected servant to Antichrist as you your selfe are then publiquely in writing aunswer that which here I have writ otherwise I beleeve and hope that you will loose her with many moe besides ere long so leving you unto Baall for whom you plead and stand vp salyng with the spirit of God in Rev. 22.11 he that is unjust let him be unjust still and he that is filthy let him be filthy still and he that is righteous let him be righteous still he that is holy let him be holy still yet for all that if you belong to Gods Election of Grace I desire for you as it is my duty that God would reveale his truthe counsels and secrets unto you which he doth lesse or more to all those that truly feore him Ps 25.12.14 Pro. 3.32 Mar. 4.34 and that you may give true declaration of your unfained repentance for your great sin for standing for Antichrists Kingdome with all your might and for so bitter and malitious opposing and reviling the truth of God and the true professours thereof which if God give you not grace to doe assuredly know that seeing you have fallen upon the cheife corner stone Jesus Christ he will destroy and breake you but if he fall upon as you may justly feare he will grind you all to dust and powder Mat. 21.44 Therefore as you love your soule looke to it seeing you are now admonished by me your Opposite And so I rest your opposing Oppugner in the truthes behalfe against all Antichrist are â—…ours and maintainers thereof though in most cruell and close imprisonment in Irons with my bloody Prelaticall enemies desire and hope will shortly put a period to my dayes John Lilburne Anno. 1638. which to me is the second yeare of Remembrance and the 21 yeere of my age From the Fleet the Prelats fiery Furnace yet to me God â—hat made it a delightsome and rejoycing Pallace and Castle in which I stand Sentinell night and day to defend Sion the City of the living God from her enemies and to oppose all her opposers desiring all my fellow brethren that professe the same truth with me as valiant and worthy Soldiers of Jesus Christ to lend me their best and corragious assistance with the choysest of their spirituall weapons that sowe may haue in hand with violence â—…ble downe in the ground the tottering confused Tower of Babel These Verses were my meditations one night in my close Imprisnment after the reading of a pamphlet sung in the streets of London in which I was joyned as a Traytour with the Scots at their first comeing into England The Lord our God is both firme and stable And all his Councels and Decrees unalterable Which when they surly shall accomplish'd be The downfall of his enemies we shall see Which I by faith doe apprehend to be at hand Which fils my soule with zeale full fast to stand To that renowned cause for which in bonds I lye Seeing his prayse and truth doth spread thereby O happy be the day that he me brought Unto my sorrowes for they unto my thought doe serve to be the choysest safety can be found Upon this vaine and empty earthly ground For in them my soule such large experience hath got Of that celestiall tresure that ne're shall rot But will for ay and ay endure As long as God's both stable firme and sure The like whereof I apprehend can not be had As liberty though my estate esteem'd be had Therefore for ever praysed be my God That no my house of clay hath laid his rod In loving kindnes mercy and in favour That so my soule from him might never waver Wherefore before I will his Truth deny Resolv d I am at Stake to dye John Lilburne Errata p. 2. l.r. Deut. 16.16 p.l. 12. r to you my l. 18. that her l. 16. r. so knit l. 29. r. ordination of p 6. l 11. r. best p. 9. l. 41. r. one of p. 10. l. 16. dele 54. 7. l. 91. r. yet for all p. 12. r. of faith l. 29. and unlesse l 31. dele without a lawfull authority given and received from him p 14. l. 13 they are p. 19. l 3. r. to observe l. 19. r. I challenge l. 20. r. your people p. 20. l. 28. r. bind p. 21. l. 21. r. feeding p. 25. l.r. therefore p. 26. l. 28. r. Gal. 5. p. 30. l. 25. r. failings p. 31. r. only p. 36. r. vnder l. r. of l. in Syon p. 39. l.r. never can be p. 40. l. 13. dele though FINIS