Selected quad for the lemma: ground_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
ground_n	church_n	pillar_n	truth_n	16,480	5	7.1251	4	true

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A06199	Cum bono Deo Raine from the clouds, vpon a choicke angel: or, A returned answere, to that common quæritur of our adversaries, VVhere was your church before Luther? Digested into several meditations, according to the difference of points. Extorted off the author, for stilling the vncessant, and no lesse clamorous coassation of some patmicke frogges, against the lawfulness of our calling.	Logie, Andrew.	1624 (1624)	STC 16694; ESTC S108810	39,602	80

〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 must not bee 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 would bee 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 so 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or potestas as they speake in Schooles hee must bee instructed with commission Hitherto the LORD is said to haue called Bezaleel by name and to haue filled him with his spirit for working in his Tabernacle Exod. 31. Hitherto the LORD commanded Moses to take Ioshua the sonne of Nun in whom the spirit was and to put hands vpon him Num. 27. vers 18. Hither-to wee see Numbers 17. amongst all the twelue Roddes of the Princes of Israel onelie AARONS Rodde to haue budded blossomed and borne rype Almondes where-by wee are taught symbolicallie that the LORD will onelie blesse their Ministrie whom hee setteth aworke himselfe Matth. 28.19 Hitherto wee see the marriage of these three in unum Spiritum Ite Docete Baptizate Matthew the last at the vpshot whereas CHRIST sent foorth his Disciples to that publicke Ministrie Hitherto wee see with what care the whole Prophets at least in common alleadged still in the entrie of their prophesie to their warrand of Calling Yea last wee see quàm severè à DEO hic animadversum in sacri bujus ordinis temeratores but the least regard to their qualitie But in respect our Adversarie goeth no farther length but contenteth him simplie to amasse some passages together enforcing the necessitie of Vocation or Calling I might vel citra tenuissimum pulvisculum hoc labore defungi by subscrybing to this granted and acknowledged trueth in common the quaestion still remaining with whom this vocation or calling is Alwayes I shall lay hold on the matter even from so farre and impose here a necessitie on my selfe whereas there is none so much as deferred or but barelie offered not out of the least consciousnesse of anie vnlawfulnesse of our Calling or the least weaknesse therein Neither yet heerein sillilie to subserue the humour of our Adversarie Neither yet out of the least praesumption on my part but fiduciâ bonae causae as lykewise to satisfie in some measure as the expectation of all so the most earnest expetition of the well affected as last of all lest else I might justlie seeme overpassing it with a dry foote to overleape it lyke a Ditch from whence I feared danger Yea and bee misconstrued as to detrect the Combate whiles being so pointlie poynted at c. Out of these considerations then one word en passant with a running pen of this so much ventilated quaestion of our Church her being before Luther which our Adversaries with so opē full mouth noyse so much to day yea fill both Heaven and Earth with the brute hereof and wherein they place the strength of their cause as Sampsons strength lay in his haire Truelie to vntye and vnloose this their Gordian knot non expectandus hîc nobis Elias aliquis aut 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Primum Meletema FIrst of all this maine ground would be laide and headilie adverted vnto in the Frontispice of this Worke to wit That the Church is still one and the same though not alwayes alyke affected as a man remaineth one and the selfe same man in sicknesse and health Now from hence the ridiculous follie of these demands of our Adversaries appeare of will to wit Of the being of our Church before LVTHER as lykewyse If shee was in Poprie or not Certes Papatus invasit Ecclesiam Poprie hath invaded the Church for accidentis est inesse subjecto but not on the contrarie subjecti inesse suo accidenti so that the Church throughout her diverse conditions before Poprie vnder Poprie and delivered or come foorth of Babel is but one and the same remaining thus one common subject lyable to diverse alterations and lyke heerein to the naturall or physicall bodie of man diverslie affected Hitherto it is that you see the two witnesses Revel 11.3 to bee cloathed in sacke-cloath ob tristem videlicet Ecclesiae statum and againe the Angels comming foorth with the seaven Plagues ad sumendum debitas de Antichristo poenas to be cloathed in signe of victorie triumph sutablie in pure bright linnen Revel 15. ob laetum Ecclesiae statum Now Est of the third adjacent praesupponeth Est of the second as they speake in Schooles And so it remaineth quòd subinde alia atque alia sit Ecclesiae facies Whitherto shee is well likened by the Fathers to the Moone which remaineth one and the same etiam vel ubi patitur deliquium even while shee is eclipsed For closure then as the Church remained the same even whilst holden in captivitie in that Easterne Babylon so did shee remaine one and the same whilst thralled and enbondaged in that Westerne and mysticall Babylon c. Secundum Meletema WEE acknowledge all in common the Church for the ground and Pillar of the Trueth the word Pillar heere being taken aright ratione scilicet forensi and not Architectonicâ for else all shoud proue confused in that speach of Sainct Paules as if domus id eui innititur domus that is the Trueth and the Church were one and the same as our Adversaries heere confound yea as if the Church were not built on that foundation of the Prophets and Apostles their doctrine as lykewyse allusion heere being made ad domum illam Salomonis totam columnis conspicuam I leaue to speake of the different interpunction which as it would cleare all heere so hath it no little probabilitie because of the synapticke or copulatiue particle Kaì in the beginning of the next verse which would seeme to knit these wordes with something going before to this sense That CHRIST or GOD manifested in the flesh is the ground and pillar of the Trueth without controversie the great mysterie of godlinesse But to follow the received interpunction interpretation ne crabrones irritemus it is cleare frō hence that we must needs acknowledge that pillar for the Church wherevpon wee find the Trueth appended since that ad Ecclesiam tanquam ad columnam prostat veritas in ea demum comparet so that from the doctrine judgement must bee given of the Church and not on the contrarie Whitherto Gregorie Nazianzen sayeth well 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Wherefore thus are wee ledde by the hand to institute a tryall penes quod sit veritas where and with whom the Trueth is this proveth in the ende the last analysis or resolution of this quaestion If I durst make bolde I would pose our Adversaries heere a little of their judgement Whether it bee safer and surer worke with Tertullian personas ex fide or on the contrarie fidem ex personis aestimare now our Adversaries holde this latter and so must needes promiscuouslie receiue the leaven of the Pharisees because they sit in MOSES Chaire for sound and true Doctrine That I may make this farther tributarie to the errand in hand from hence I thus argue

and Tyrannie of the Romane Church or in the Romane Church whereas the ground it selfe or the secession is justlie denyable Now non entis nulla sunt accidentia XIIII MELETEMA WHereas our Adversaries suffer not that to bee called Rebaptization whilst they superadde de suo their toyish assumentes to that Baptisme conferred by our men as hereby acknowledging the Baptisme in it selfe to be valide and lawfull quòd viz. simus in ministerio si non ministri as the matter and quaestion was cleared and decided about BARBARIUS PHILIPPUS his acts of Praetorship that they were to bee holden rata grata and not to bee rescinded quòd fuerit in praetura licet non praetor nay and as the case I hope holdeth de Ioanna Papista who was in Papatu though not Papa and semblablie whilst it falleth out that an Hereticke nay a Magitian or Necromancier possesseth the Chaire which cases haue proven possible as the Councels can beare vs heere record Now that I may reason hence by way of Analogie vsing the lyke libertie Why may they not suffer the vocation and ordination obtaining with vs goe for current Cum nostri ordinatores fuerint saltem in ministerio si non ministri Or I pray you is Ordination of greater weight and importance than Baptisme Or may Baptisme bee conferred and administred by anie not instructed with commission May these but suffer the least divorce which CHRIST Himselfe hath thus coupled MATTHEW the last Ite Do●●te Baptizate Certes mee thinkes it strange how our Adversaries so farre foorth miscarrie heere as to permit to Laickes the administration of this blessed Sacrament yea farther acknowledge it lawfull whilst conferred but in sporte and merriment and that not in the ordinarie element thereof appointed by CHRIST but in sand yea and but by Children Truelie horret animus yea tremunt artus whilst I but shew quàm impiè hîc ludant in re tam seria To make collection to the errande in hande If our men may baptize Or if the Baptisme conferred by them bee valide and effectuall then they may teach haue the warrand of Ite are instructed with commission and so from the first to the last viget inter nostros vocatio vel ipsis hic Adversariis nobis suffragantibus astipulantibus c. XV. MELETEMA IN that Vocation or Calling obtayning with our Adversaries and which our men brought from thence with them giving wee had our Calling of them these three acts are distinctlie to bee considered GODS owne act penes quem summum vocandi jus ac mittendi imperium and from whome is that inward Calling next The Church her act from which as GODS Instrument in this worke is that externall or outward Calling The third is of the Church popishlie affected or of the Pope his act and of his Bond-slaues from whence is vitium Vocationis or that faultinesse and vitiositie in the Calling Nowe this last cannot 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or make devoyde and of null effect and force the two 〈◊〉 so that there remayneth still a Calling amongst our Adversaries though well vitious Thus whereas our men came as it were foorth from amongst them they but renounced this latter parte constantlie retayning quod DEI erat quod Ecclesiae It is to bee adverted heere That wee traduce not even those Ordinations obtayning to daye with our Adversaries pro nullis sed pro vitiosis as wee acknowledge a Church with them whiles the matrimoniall Tables are not rent or repeated nor a Bill of divorce given ubi libellus repudii as it fared with the adulterous ISRAELITES they continued GODS people even after their manie adulteries and spirituall whoredomes I say that wee acknowledge their Church as veram Ecclesiam though not veracem as a true Church in regard of a Physicall veritie though not of an Ethicall veracitie Alwayes it is to bee considered headilie howe the case heere altereth whilst their ordinations are not so much as warrandable by their owne Canons as whereas they deferred orders to Idiots and Children for heere non habemus hujusinodi ordinationes pro vitiosis sed pro nullis for the lawfulnesse of the Cheirothesie dependeth from the lawfulnesse of the praeceeding Cheirotonie and not on the contrarie this from that other the signe beeing suspended from the matter and not the matter from the signe XVI MELETEMA WHere-as there concurre and occurre some three actes even in that Vocation obtayning with our Adversaries and so in that Calling which our first men brought from thence so the concurrence and occurrence of the same are necessarie to a lawfull deposition for the same must occurre and concurre to a lawfull destitution which to the prior institution For exemple Where Kingdomes come by election the same consentes are required to a Kings destitutione which to his prior institution in Regem and else to meddle with the sacred person of a King is to touch and meddle with the LORDS anoynted yea and to faile and fault even against the Law of Nations These are hitherto to meete heere with our Adversaries excepting that wee haue losed by excommunication what right wee had from amongst them formerlie by anie vocation Certes the Pope heere cannot 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or make of no force neither quod DEI est nor yet quod Ecclesiae Nay in common and promiscuous marriages multa quae impediunt contrahendum non dirimunt contractum Againe without the concurrence and occurrence of the whole actes in the destitution which occurred and concurred to the prior institution the proceedure is well summarie and vnformall as I hope is cleare from the instanced exemple I leaue to speake of the ground of the excommunication according wherevnto judgement must bee given of the excommunication it selfe where it feareth mee the matter hath proceeded clave errante As lykewyse quod non statim rumpatur interius illud spiritus coagulum vbi rumpitur exterius illud vinculum giving that a sister-Church to wit the Romane Church could haue lawfullie sentenced vs where-about sub judice lis est XVII MELETEMA WHereas out of the common Colledge of Presbyters or Elders one began to bee praefected over the rest and bee singularlie so called by the name of BISHOP I dispute not heere whether this Bee ju ris divini or positivi 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or the act of Ordination or matter it selfe remained common solâ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or ritu ordinandi manente penes Episcopum singulariter the sole Rite or externall signe of ordination being appropriated to the BISHOP singularlie But no not even then whereas this custome first obtained and was in its greatest vigour 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 was the Rite or the externall signe 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 scilicet solelie proper to the Bishops so called in opposition as that it was not administred and peracted by Presbyters as the Fathers heere Sainct AMBROSE and AUGUSTINE beare vs recorde and ALEXANDRIA and AEGYPT can beare witnesse where