which reason at least I think I might well be startled at the largeness of our Author's Toleration For whereas you say you do not see why Pagans should not be tolerated as well as others if we wish their Conversion whatever may be said for the tolerating of others I think it is plain enough as to them that we ought not to purchase the opportunity of conventing them by suffering them to commit those Indignities and Abominations among us which they call Religion till they are converted But as to the converting Iews Mahumetans and Pagans to Christianity I fear there will be no great progress made in it till Christians come to a better agreement and union among themselves I am sure our Saviour pray'd that all that should believe in him might be one in the Father and in him i. e. I suppose in that holy Religion which he taught them from the Father that the World might believe that the Father had sent him And therefore when he comes to make inquisition why no more Iews Mahumetans and Pagans have been converted to his Religion I very much fear that a great part of the blame will be found to lie upon the Authors and Promoters of Sects and Divisions among the professors of it Which therefore I think all that are guilty and all that would not be guilty ought well to consider In what sense I allow that Force is improper to convert Men to any Religion has already been sufficiently declared in my Answer and I shall have occasion to speak more of it afterwards Where I say that some seem to place the advancement of Trade and Commerce above all other Considerations you tell me that if I do not know that the Author places the advancement of Trade above Religion my Insinuation is very uncharitable But I thought I had sufficiently prevented such an interpretation of my words by acquiâ—ting the Author but just before of any ill design towards Religion That there are some Men in the World who are justly suspected of the Crime I mention I believe you will not deny And I assure you I did not intend by those words to bring any Man under the suspicion of it who has not given just cause for it I say speaking of the Toleration which our Author proposes I see no reason from any experiment which has been made to expect that true Religion would be any way a gainer by it And you tell me I have an experiment of this in the Christian Religion in its first appearance in the World and several hundred of years after But how does that appear Why you say the Christian Religion was then better preserv'd more widely propagated in proportion and render'd more fruitful in the lives of its Professors than ever since though then Iews and Pagans were tolerated and more than tolerated by the Governments of those places where it grew up And is this your Experiment of the true Religion's being a gainer by Toleration The Christian Religion prosper'd more you say in those times than ever since though then Iews and Pagans were tolerated c. and therefore it was a gainer by the Toleration of Iews and Pagans Is there any manner of Consequence in this That the Christian Religion prosper'd more in those times than ever since though then Iews and Pagans were tolerated I readily grant you But whoever does but understand what though means must needs see that this is so far from proving what you inferr from it that it strongly proves the contrary viz. that the Toleration of Jews and Pagans was rather an hindrance than an advantage to the Christian Religion But let us see the utmost you can make of this Experiment of yours You say you hope I do not imagine the Christian Religion has lost any of its first Beauty Force or Reasonableness by having been almost 2000 Years in the World that I should fear it should be less able now to shift for it self without the help of Force And you doubt not but I look upon it still to be the Power and Wisdom of God for our Salvation and therefore cannot suspect it less capable to prevail now by its own Truth and Light than it was in the first Ages of the Church when poor contemptible Men without Authority or the countenance of Authority had alone the care of it In which words I understand you to say these three things 1. That the Christian Religion prevail'd at first meerly by its own Beauty Force or Reasonableness without the help of Authority or Force 2. That that Religion has still the same Beauty Force or Reasonableness which it had at first 3. Lastly that therefore it is now as well able to shift for it self and to prevail without any assistance of Authority as it was then Now to clear this matter I must observe that in the Beauty Force or Reasonableness by which you say the Christian Religion prevail'd at first without the Assistance of Authority either you include the Miracles done by the poor contemptible men you speak of to make their Religion prevail or you do not If you do not then the meaning of your first Assertion is that the Christian Religion prevail'd at first without the Assistance of Authority meerly by the Beauty Force or Reasonableness which it had separate from those Miracles Which I believe you will not undertake to defend But if you do include the Miracles then your second Assertion is manifestly false For I am sure you cannot say that the Christian Religion is still accompanied with Miracles as it was at its first planting And so the Conclusion you draw from thence That therefore the Christian Religion is now as well able to shift for it self and to prevail without any Assistance of Authority as it was at first falls to the ground You add This as I take it has been made use of by Christians generally and by some of our Church in particular as an Argument for the Truth of the Christian Religion that it grew and spread and prevail'd without any Aid from Force or the Assistance of the Powers in being Wherein I hope you are mistaken for I am sure this is a very bad Argument That the Christian Religion so contrary in the nature of it as well to Flesh and Bloud as to the Powers of Darkness should prevail as it did and that not onely without any Assistance from Authority but even in spight of all the opposition which Authority and a wicked World join'd with those infernal Powers could make against it This I acknowledge has deservedly been insisted upon by Christians as a very good Proof of the Truth of their Religion But to argue the Truth of the Christian Religion from its meer prevailing in the World without any Aid from Force or the Assistance of the Powers in being as if whatever Religion should so prevail must needs be the true Religion whatever may be intended is really not to
reason why But you go on and speaking of this lurking Supposition That the National Religion now in England is the onely true Religion and therefore no other is to be tolerated you say Which being a Supposition equally unavoidable and equally just in other Countries unless we can imagine that every where but in England men believe what at the same time they think to be a Lie will in other places exclude Toleration and thereby hinder Truth from the means of propagating it self How Sir Is this Supposition equally unavoidable and equally just in other Countries where false Religions are the National Religion For that you must mean or nothing to the purpose If so then I fear it will be equally true too and equally rational For otherwise I see not how it can be either equally unavoidable or equally just For if it be not equally true iâ— cannot be equally just and if it be not equally rational it cannot be equally unavoidable But if it be equally true and equally rational then either all Religions are true or none is true For if they be all equally true and any one of them be not true then none of them can be true And then the least that will follow is that we must unsuppose again what we supposed but now viz. that the Religion now establish'd in England is the onely true Religion For whether we admit that all Religions are true or that none is true we must unavoidably admit that there is no onely true Religion And if there be no onely true Religion then neither the Religion now establish'd in England nor any other can be the onely true Religion There is therefore no remedy but you must either recall this Assection of yours or own these Consequences which flow from it But I hope when you have thought a little more of the matter you will be so far from asserting that the Supposition that the National Religion is the onely true Religion is in all Countries equally unavoidable and equally just that you will acknowledge that it cannot be at all unavoidable or just where any false Religion is the National Religion Otherwise you will be forced to own that men may be bound to embrace false Religions For whatever Religion any man does unavoidably and justly suppose or judge to be the onely true Religion that Religion he must needs be bound to embrace because he has all the reason to embrace it which any man can have for embracing any Religion whatsoever and he can no more reasonably reject it than any other man may reject the onely true Religion Now if this Supposition that the National is the onely true Religion be indeed neither equally unavoidable nor equally just in other Countries as it is where the True is the National Religion then neither will the Supposition that therefore no other Religion is to be tolerated be either equally unavoidable or equally just in other Countries as it is where the True is the National Religion And therefore if this Supposition shall any where exclude the Toleration of the Truth and thereby hinder it from the means of propagating it self the blame will lie upon those who admit that Supposition where there is no just ground for it who therefore must answer for the Consequences of it The Toleration the Fruits whereof I say give no encouragement to hope for any advantage from our Author's Toleration to true Religion is that as I thought you would easily have guess'd which almost all but those of the Church of England enjoyed in the times of the Blessed Reformation as it was call'd And for the Fruits of it viz. the Sects and Heresies which it produced some of which I say still remain with us how numerous and of what quality they were some yet living remember and the Writers of those times do sufficiently discover But here whatever the Fruits of that Toleration were you boldly say that if the Magistrates will severely and impartially set themselves against Vice in whomsoever it is found and leave men to their own Consciences in their Articles of Faith and Ways of Worship true Religion will be spread wider and be more fruitful in the Lives of its Professors than ever hitherto it has been by the imposition of Creeds and Ceremonies It seems then with you the rejecting the true Faith and the refusing to worship God in decent Ways prescribed by those to whom God has left the ordering of such matters are not comprehended in the name of Vice Otherwise you must allow the Magistrates to set themselves against these things likewise if they must severely and impartially set themselves against Vice which would not consist with leaving men to their own Consciences in them But if you except these things and will not allow them to be call'd by the name of Vice perhaps other men may think it as reasonable to except some other things which they have a kindness for For instance Some perhaps may except arbitrary Divorcing others Polygamy others Concubinacy others simple Fornication other Marrying within Degrees which have hitherto been thought forbidden And all these it may be will boldly say too that if the Magistrates will severely and impartially set themselves against Vice and leave men to their own Consciences in these things Vertue and good Manners would be spread wider and shine more gloriously in the Lives of men than ever hitherto it has done by the help of any Laws that have been made about these matters But Sir whether the Magistrates setting themselves severely and impartially against what I suppose you call Vice or the imposition of found Creeds and decent Ceremonies does more conduce to the spreading true Religion and rendering it fruitful in the Lives of its Professours we need not examine I confess I think both together do best And this I think is as much as needs to be said to your next Paragraph also As to what our Author offers in behalf of the Toleration he contends for I thought the whole Strength of it comprized in this Argument There is but one Way of Salvation or but one true Religion No man can be saved by this Religion who does not believe it to be the true Religion This Belief is to be wrought in men by Reason and Argument not by outward Force and Compulsion Therefore all such Force is utterly of no use for the promoting true Religion and the Salvation of Souls And therefore no body can have any Right to use any Force or Compulsion for the bringing men to the true Religion neither any Private Person nor any Ecclesiastical Officer Bishop Priest or other nor any Church or Religious Society nor the Civil Magistrate But to this you say If it be a true Consequence that men must be tolerated if Magistrates have no Commission or Authority to punish them for Matters of Religion then the onely Strength of that Letter lies not in the unfitness of Force to convince Men's
are capable to judge of such matters that many do heartily believe and profess the true Religion and conscientiously practice the Duties of it who yeâ— do not understand the true Grounds upon which it challenges their belief And no man doubts but whoever does so believe profess and practice the true Religion if he perseveres to the end shall certainly attain Salvation by it 2. That how much soever it concerns those who reject the true Religion whom you may call Dissenters if you please to examine and consider why they do so and how needful soever Penalties may be to bring them to this it is however utterly unreasonable that such as have not the Coactive Power should take upon them to inflict Penalties for that purpose Because as that is not consistent with Order and Government which cannot stand where private persons are permitted to usurp the Coactive Power So there is nothing more manifest than that the prejudice which is done to Religion and to the interest of men's Souls by destroying Government does infinitely outweigh any good that can possibly be done by that which destroys it And whoever admits and considers these things I am very secure he will be far enough from admitting that there is any Parity of Reason in the Cases we here speak of or that yours is as just and natural a Conclusion as mine What follows here has been sufficiently consider'd already You say Faith is the Gift of God And I say This Gift comes ordinarily at least by hearing And if the Magistrate be both warranted and obliged to use convenient Penalties to bring his Subjects to hear the Gospel as I think I have shewn that he is then in doing so he cannot be said to use any other means to procure this Gift to any one than what God himself has prescribed If say you all the means God has appointed to make men hear and consider be Exhortation in season and out of season c. together with Prayer for them and the Example of Meekness and a good Life this is all ought to be done whether they will hear or whether they will forbear But if these be not all the Means God has appointed then these things are not all that ought to be done As to the first Spreaders of the Gospel it has already been shewn that God appointed other Means besides these for them to use to induce men to hear and consider And though when those extraordinary Means ceased these Means which you mention were the onely Means left to the Ministers of the Gospel yet that is no proof that the Magistrate when he became Christian could not lawfully use such Means as his Station enabled him to use when they became needful By what Means the Gospel at first made it self to be heard c. without the Assistance of any such Force of the Magistrate as I now think needful we have seen already But whatever Neglect or Aversion there is in any impartially and throughly to instruct the People I wish it amended and that the most effectual course may be taken for the amending it as much as you can do But I do not see how pertinent your Discourse about this matter is to the present Question For when you have made the best provision you can for the Instruction of the People I fear a great part of them will still need some moderate Penalties to bring them to hear and receive Instruction But this new Method of mine viz. the useing Force not instead of Reason and Arguments but onely to bring men to consider those Reasons and Arguments which are proper and sufficient to convince them but which without being forced they would not consider Which I say no body can deny but that indirectly and at a distance it does some service towards the bringing men to embrace the Truth This new Method of mine as you will needs call it though it be at least as old as St. Austin you tell me was never yet thought on by the most refined Persecutors Which may be very true for any thing I know Though I think it hath been both thought on and made use of too by all those Magistrates who having made all requisite provision for the instructing their People in the Truth have likewise required them under convenient Penalties to embrace it But you say however It is not altogether unlike the Plea made use of to excuse the late barbarous Usage of the Protestants in Fâ—ance designed to extirpate the Reform'd Religion there from being a Persecution for Religion For it seems the French King requires all his Subjects to come to Mass. Which they cannot lawfully do nor he lawfully require them to do But you go on Those who do not come to Mass are punish'd with a witness For what Not for their Religion say the Pleaders for that Discipline but for disobeying the King's Laws Whether those Pleaders plead in this manner or not I know not But if they do I am sure their Plea is ridiculous and carries nothing at all of an Excuse in it For if true Religion which is God's Law forbids men to go to Mass then those Laws can be no Laws which require men to go to Mass unless Man can make Laws against God's Laws And if those Laws be no Laws then 't is grosly improper to talk of disobeying them For where there is no Law there can be no. Transgression or Disobedience Nor can any Act of Obedience to God as all Acts which true Religion requires are be an Act of Disobedience to any body Now if those Laws by which the French King requires his Subjects to come to Mass be no Laws and consequently their refusing to come be not a disobeying his Laws 't is evident there is nothing left for which the Refusers can be said to be punish'd but onely their Religion which requires them to refuse But let us see the likeness of my new Method to this Plea So say you by your Rule the Dissenters from the true Religion for I speak of no other must be punish'd or if you please subjected to moderate Penalties such as shall make them uneasy but neither destroy noâ— undo them For what Not for their Religion say you So you tell me Sir But where I beseech you do I say that Dissenters from the true Religion are not to be punish'd for their Religion not for following the Light of their own Reason not for obeying the Dictates of their own Consciences No Sir but raâ—â—er for the contrary For the Light of their own Reason and â—he Dictates of their own Consciences if their Reason and Consciences were not perverted and abused would undoubtedly lead them to the same thing to which the Method we speak of is designeâ— to bring them You proceed For what then are they to be punish'd To make them say you examine the Religion they have embraced and the Religion they have rejected Right Sir That is indeed the
him say what he does not that they may have something which they can confute Your next Paragraph runs high and charges me with nothing less than Prevarication For whereas as you tell me I speak of it here as the most deplorable Condition imaginable that men should be left to themselves and not be forced to consider and examine the Grounds of their Religion and search impartially and diligently after the Truth c. It seems all the Remedy I offer is no more than this Dissenters must be punish'd Upon which thus you insult Can any body that hears you say so believe you in earnest and that want of Examination is the thing you would have amended when want of Examination is not the thing you would have punish'd But if in all your Treatise you can shew me one place where you say that the Ignorant the Careless the Inconsiderate the negligent in examining c. are to be punish'd I will allow your Remedy for a good one But you have not said any thing like this and which is more I tell you before hand you dare not say it And whilst you do not the World has reason to judge that however want of Examination be a general Fault which you with great vehemency have exaggerated yet you use it only for a pretense to punish Dissenters and either distrust your Remedy or else care not to have it generally cured Now here I acknowledge that though want or neglect of Examination be a general Fault yet the Method I propose for curing it does not reach to all that are guilty of it but is limited to those who reject the true Religion proposed to them with sufficient Evidence But then to let you see how little ground you have to say that I prevaricate in this matter I shall onely desire you to consider what it is that the Author and my self were enquiring after For it is not What course is to be taken to confirm and establish those in the Truth who have already embraced it Nor How they may be enabled to propagate it to others For both which purposes I have already acknowledged it very useful and a thing much to be desired that all such persons should as far as they are able search into the Grounds upon which their Religion stands and challenges their belief But the Subject of our enquiry is onely What Method is to be used to bring men to the true Religion Now if this be the onely thing we were enquiring after as you cannot deny it to be then every one sees that in speaking to this Point I had nothing to do with any who have already embraced the true Religion because they are not to be brought to that Religion but onely to be confirm'd and edified in it but was onely to consider how those who reject it may be brought to embrace it So that how much soever any of those who own the true Religion may be guilty of neglect of Examination 't is evident I was onely concern'd to shew how it may be cured in those who by reason of it reject the true Religion duly proposed or tender'd to them And certainly to confine my self to this is not to prevaricate unless to keep within the bounds which the Question under debate prescribes me be to prevaricate In telling me therefore that I dare not say that the Ignorant the Careless the Inconsiderate the negligent in examining c. i. e. all that are such are to be punish'd you onely tell me that I dare not be impertinent And therefore I hope you will excuse me if I take no notice of the three Reasons you offer in your next Page for your saying so And yet if I had had a mind to talk impertinently I know not why I might not have dared to do so as well as other men There is one thing more in this Paragraph which though nothing more pertinent than the rest I shall not wholly pass over It lies in these words He that reads your Treatise with attention will be more confirm'd in this Opinion viz. That I use want of Examination onely for a pretense to punish Dissenters c. when he shall find that you who are so earnest to have men punish'd to bring them to consider and examine that so they may discover the way of Salvation have not said one word of considering searching and hearkening to the Scripture which had been as good a Rule for a Christian to have sent them to as to Reasons and Arguments proper to convince them of you know not what c. How this confirms that Opinion I do not see nor have you thought fit to instruct me But as to the thing it self viz. my not saying one word of considering searching and hearkening to the Scripture whatever advantage a captious Adversary may imagine he has in it I hope it will not seem strange to any indifferent and judicious Person who shall but consider that throughout my Treatise I speak of the true Religion onely in general i. e. not as limited to any particular Dispensation or to the Times of the Scriptures but as reaching from the fall of Adam to the end of the World and so comprehending the Times which preceeded the Scriptures wherein yet God left not himself without witness but furnished Mankind with sufficient means of knowing Him and his Will in order to their eternal Salvation For I appeal to all Men of Art whether speaking of the true Religion under this generality I could be allowed to descend to any such Rules of it as belong only to some particular Times or Dispensations Such as you cannot but acknowledge the Old and New Testaments to be You say that Page 26. of my Answer out of abundant kindness when the Dissenters have their Heads without any cause broken I provide them a Plaister But whoever shall consider the Penalties I there speak of will I perswade my self find no Heads broken and so but little need of a Plaister But having said there That the Power I asscribe to the Magistrate is given him to bring men not to his own but to the true Religion And That though as our Author puts us in mind the Religion of every Prince is Orthodox to himself yet if this Power keep within it's bounds i.e. if the Penalties the Magistrate makes use of to promote a False Religion do not exceed the measure of those which he may warrantably use for the promoting the True it can serve the interest of no other Religion but the True among such as have any concern for their eternal Salvation and they that have none deserve not to be consider'd â—â— because the Penalties it enables him that has it to inflict are not such as may tempt such persons either to renounce a Religion which they believe to be true or to profess one which they do not believe to be so but onely such as are apt to put them upon a serious and impartial Examination
have God for their Author and Truth for their Standard and how much soever the greatest part of Mankind may be exposed by the Force which is used to make them hearken to the Information and Instruction of Men appointed to it by the Magistrate or those of his Religion to be led into Falshood and Error than they are likely this way to be brought to embrace the Truth which must save them Yet every one sees that it may be true nevertheless that convenient Force used to bring men to the true Religion which is all that I contend for and all that I allow may be very serviceable for that purpose by bringing men to that Consideration which nothing else besides the extraordinary Grace of God would bring them to Which is that which I mean by doing service indirectly and at a distance toward the bringing men to the true Religion and so to Salvation You might therefore for any thing I see have spared the Pains you have here taken to give me a view of the Usefulness of Force my way applied For how confidently soever you tell â—e that it amounts but to the shadow and Possibility of Usefulness but with an overbalancing weight of Mischief and Harm annex'd to it I hope I have sufficiently made it appear that instead of proving this you have onely trifled hitherto and said nothing at all agâ—inst my Assertion Having thus as you imagine or to speak more properly perhaps as you would have it thought destroy'd the Usefulness of Force which I had asserted you go on to new matter of triumph But suppose say you Force applied your way were as useful for the promoting true Religion as I suppose I have shew'd it to be â—he contrary it does not from thence follow that it is lawful and may be used By your savour Sir I think it does follow from thence that Force is not therefore unlawful to be used because it is utterly useless or absolutely impertinent which is all that I was to shew against our Author That being all in effect that he says to prove the unlawfulness of using Force in matters of Religion as has already been made appear against all that you say to the contrary But as to the Lawfulness of such Force as I take to be useful for the promoting the true Religion I must again put you in mind that I do not ground it upon the bare Usefulness of such Force but upon the Necessity as well as Usefulness of it as any man must acknowledge that reads my Answer Where as I shew at large that Force is generally necessary to bring those thaâ— wander to the right Way so I expresly declare that I look upon outward Force to be no fit means to be used either for that purpose or for any other where it is not necessary as well as useful And therefore how useful soever you may suppose it in a Parish that has no Teacher or as bad as none that a Layman that wanted not abilities for it should sometimes preach to them the Doctâ—ine of the Gospel c. yet unless you suppose it necessary withall it will not serve your purpose And that you cannot suppose it necessary is evident because any such Parish may quickly have redress if they will but seek it Whether I have rightly framed the Author's Argument or not has already been consider'd You say further As Force applied your way is apt to make the Inconsiderate consider so Force applied another way is as apt to make the Lascivious chaste c. Thus you see Castration may indirectly and at a distance be serviceable towards the Salvation of men's Souls But will you say from such aâ— usefulness as this that therefore the Magistrate has a right to do it and may by Force make his Subjects Eunuchs for the Kingdom of Heaven Where again I must tell you that unless you will say Castration is necessary as well as apt to make the lascivious chaste this will afford you no advantage Now I suppose you will not say Castration is necessary because I hope you acknowledge that Marriage and that Grace which God denies to none who seriously ask it are sufficient for that purpose But however this is not a like Case For if Castration makes any lascivious person chaste it does it by taking away the Part upon which the Power of offending depends Whereas the Force which I think may be used in order to the â—uring men of destructive Errors concerning the Way of Salvation does not destroy the Possibility of erring by taking away or any way disabling the offending Part but leaves men's Brains safe in their Skulls Indeed if I had said that to cure men of damnable or dangerous Errors it is useful to knock out their Brains the Case had been exactly parallel as far as Usefulness goes But since I say no such thing I hope no man that has any Brains will say it is You add It is not for the Magistrate or any body else upon an imagination of its Usefulness to make use of any other means for the Salvation of men's Souls than what the Author and Finisher of our Faith has directed Which how true soever is not I think very much to the purpose For if the Magistrate does only assist that Ministery which our Lord has appointed by using so much of his Coactive Power for the furthering their Service as common Experience discovers to be useful and necessary for that End there is no manner of ground to say that upon an imagination of its Usefulness he makes use of any other means for the Salvation of Men's Souls than what the Author and Finisher of our Faith has directed 'T is true indeed the Author and Finisher of our Faith has given the Magistrate no new Power or Commission nor was there any need that he should if himself had had any Temporal Power to give For he found him already even by the Law of Nature the Minister of God to the People for good and bearing the Sword not in vain i.e. invested with Coactive Power and obliged to use it for all the good purposes which it might serve and for which it should be â—ound needful even for the restraining of false and corrupt Religion as Iob long before perhaps before any part of the Scriptures were written acknowledged when he said that the worshiping the Sun or the Moon was an iniquity to be punish'd by the Iudge But though our Saviour has given the Magistrates no new Power yet being King of Kings he expects and requires that they should submit themselves to his Sceptre and use the Power which always belong'd to them for his service and for the advancing his Spiritual Kingdom in the World And even that Charity which our great Master so earnestly recommends and so strictly requires of all his Disciples as it obliges all men to seek and promote the good of others as well as their own especially