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A14060 A perseruatiue, or triacle, agaynst the poyson of Pelagius lately renued, ... by the furious secte of the Annabaptistes ... By Willyam Turner, Doctor of Physick. Turner, William, d. 1568. 1551 (1551) STC 24368; ESTC S101787 56,116 208

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the chylder of the Christianes haue the promys of the heretage as these places folowynge do testyfie I wyll make stronge my cumnant betwene me and the and thy sede after the in their generacions in a continuall comnant that is to wyt that I wyll be a GOD vnto the and to thy sede after the. And agayne in the .xxij. of Genesis In thy sede shall all the nacions of the earth be blissed In the .xliiij. of Esaye is thys prymis I wyll poure oute my Spirite vpon thy sede and my blessyng vpon thy buddes And Peter in the second of the Actes speketh of a playn promis in these wordes The promys was made vnto you and to youre chylder and to all that are far of whome soeuer the Lorde oure GOD shall call Lo here is playne mention made of the promys made vnto chylder Then when as GOD perfourmeth all that he promyseth and he promysed saluation vnto childer it foloweth that they haue the heretage that GOD promysed them then doth the heretage and kyngdome of GOD perteyne vnto them Why do you so vncharitably wyth hold the sygne and seale of saluation from chylderen to whome the heretage belongeth Who gaue you any such authoritie ye proude and presumptuous tyrannes as to make wardes of the chylder of GOD and to wyth hold from them the sygne and seale of theyr fathers heretage Now where is all your scripture whyche ye boost that ye defende youre errour wythall aunswere vnto these scriptures and confute them yf ye can Where as ye saye afterwarde that nother the sygne of Chrystes Supper nother the raynbowe sygnyfyeth anye thynge to chylder ye are farre oute of the waye The breakynge of the breade in the supper and deliuerynge of it vnto the congregation be tokeneth that Christes body was broken for all them that shal be saued and that the vertue of his passion shulde be delt to all them that are elect and chosen to be saued Thē when as childer are elect and chosen to be saued is the misterye of Christes supper no signe of saluation vnto childer Doth not the rayne bow signifie to al the worlde that the world shal no more be drowned wyth water Doth not that promis that the worlde shuld be no more destroyed wyth water perteyne vnto chylder If that the promys perteyne vnto childeren how happeneth that the signe of the promys signifieth nothyng vnto them It must nedes signify vnto yong childer as well as to olde men that they shall not be drowned wyth an vniuersall sloude as the worlde was ones destroyed So dothe the baptysynge of chylderen sygnifie as well vnto chylder that Christ dyed for them and rose for them as it sygnifyeth the same to olde menne For all althoughe they see not the sygne and knowe not of the sygne yet maye they haue it as surely as thei haue the thing sygnyfyed by the sygne Almyghtie GOD made a couenaunt and promysse not onely vnto menne but also vnto byrdes and bestes that they shuld not be drowned with the vniuersall fould Genesis .ix. Beholde sayth the Lorde I make my couenaunt wyth you and wyth yoursede after you and wyth euery lyuynge soule that is wyth you as well foul as cattell and beestes Thys shall be the sygne whyche I geue betwene you and me and euery lyuynge soule whyche is wyth you I haue set my bowe in the cloude and it shall be a sygne a sygne of the couenaunt betwene me and the yearthe So that when I bryng cloudes vpon the yearth the bowe shall appeare in the cloudes and then wyll I thynk vpon the comnant betwene me and you and all lyuyng creatures Fyrste I gather of thys place that the comnant of GOD is profytable not onely vnto them that haue the vse of reason but also vnto byrdes and vnreasonable bestes although they knowe nothynge at all of the promys I gather also that the sygnes of Goddes comnaunte are sygnes vnto byrdes and beestes and not onely sygnes but profytable sygnes vnto them althoughe they neuer see them nor vnderstande theim Whereupon I gather that the holy sygne of Baptyme is not onely a signe vnto childer of remission of synnes and of Goddes fauor toward them but also a fruitful profitable signe For how can the sygne of the raynbow be more profytable vnto vnresonable beastes and byrdes then the Sacramte of baptyme is profytable vnto yōg chylder seyng that GOD promysed as well saluation to chylder from hell death and damnation and made baptyme the sygne thereof as he promysed vnto beastes and byrdes safegarde from general drowning and made the raynbow the token sygne or seal of the same Here is your sayinge that the raynebowe is noo sygne vnto chyldern proued playne false and contrarye vnto the open text of Goddes holy word Where is the great clerke that sayde that I should not haue Winchester in hande when I had hym in hande as thoughe he had passed Wynchester so far in wyt and learnyng that ther were no comparison to be made betwene them Here myght ye be ashamed yf ye hadde anyō shame at all Here myght your disciples be ashamed of suche an vnlearned and dotynge scolemaster Is the seale of a childes landes no seale vnto hym because he hath no knowlege of the seale and knoweth nothynge therof What soeuer ye aunswer the seale is euen a seale vnto chylder and when they come to age they clayme theyr lands therby Euen so is baptyme a seal of remission of synnes vnto chyldern although they know it not And when they cum to age it shal be an assurance vnto them to clayme the promiss of God by ye haue been therfore to bolde to bable of these matters where in ye haue very lyttelle skill And pronounce as boldelye as though ye were syttynge vpon Apolloes trestell Let youre I sayes haue autorite amonge your bewitched scholars as much as ye wyll but they shal haue none with me excepte ye can proue your saying true by the scripture Ye axe me why is baptym not differred as wel as the supper of the Lorde A mā might answer you that they wer lyke to be lurched at your gluttenous supper yf that they were with you for ye wolde haue at the supper of the gluttenous catabaptistes whiche ye call the supper of oure Lord befe mutton vele capons and such harde meates as the pore sucking childer can not eat and therfore it were no wisdom that thei shuld suppe with you vntyl theyr teeth wer growen If that I had bylded my opynion vpon doctores and stories as ye do yours I coulde haue broughte manye places both oute of the doctours and stories which proue that it was the custome a M.CC. yeres ago to gyue the Sacramente of CHRISTES body and blud only in bred and wyne vnto the yōg chylder streyght waye after baptyme But because I ground my opinion only vpon scripture I wyll aunswere you by scripture The supper of the Lorde requireth a doer and it is an actiue
broughte by lynage into all men by the trespasse of one man vnto condemnatyon The rewarde of synne is death By Adam all men do dye and by one manne synne entred into the worlde and thorough synne death as farre furth as we haue all synned that all chyldern whych as ye holde are vnbeleuers and therefore can not be purged for lacke of fayth in Christes bloude muste nedes be damned Whych opinion howe wycked it is and howe contrarye vnto the holye scrypture lette the chyrch of CHRIST gyue sentence Haue ye not taught holsome lessons in youre boke wherof suche a damnable conclusyon foloweth Are ye not worthye to be dubbed a doctour of heresye If ye be not I can not tell who is Wher as ye say that water cā not scoure the soule because orygynall syn is a wounde receyued of the soule ye seme to mene that the bodye shall not be damned for orygynall synne as a thing that neuer receyued it Is it not agaynst iustyce that they shoulde be condemned together whych were not conioyned in the dede doynge that deserued damnation ¶ Ye holde in youre nexte sentence a maruelous opynyon whyche is thys It is to be vnderstande that thoughe synne be common to all yet baptyme is not common to all Whych sentence semeth not to be true For to whomsoeuer preaching is common to the same is also baptyme common For preachyng and baptysyng are ioyned and commaunded together in these wordes Euntes docete omnes gentes baptizantes eas Go and teache all natyons baptysyng them Then is baptyme as common as preaching is hut preachyng is common to all ▪ therfore is also baptyme common to all though all wyll not receyue it For a man hauinge seuerall grounde ynough of hys owne oft tymes putteth no cattell into the comon allthough hys parte is as commō vnto hym as vnto anye other man Are the feldes no more cōmon vnto a man after that he enioyeth no longer the profyte of the common feldes Answer me wyth scrypture as I do confute yow wyth scrypture and let your arrogant I says whyche ye haue wythin thre leues of the begynnyng of your booke in the stede of scrypture boldly brought in thre tymes goo shake theyr eares For thoughe ye haue inchaunted your wretched scholars so that they beleue that it is the gospel whatsoeuer ye say yet are ye in no such autoryte maister doctor with me that I wyll beleue your I say when as ye bryng neuer one text of scrypture to bylde your I say vpon Well I deny the doctor saye what he wyll and set these textes of the scripture agaynst hym Paule wryteth vnto the Romanes thus As by the trespas of one man euel was brought by lynage into all men to condēnation so by the rightuousnes of one good came vnto all men to the iustifycation of lyfe Then is iustifycation as comon as condemnatiō And baptym is as cōmon as iustifycatyon is then is baptyme common vnto as many as sinne is common to Saynt Ihon sayeth that Christ obteyned mercye for our synnes and not only for our synnes but for the synnes of the hole worlde Lo here is mercy and remyssyon of synnes as generall and as commō as synne is And baptyme is common to all to whome remissyon of synne is common for baptym is the seale of forgyuenes of synnes and so he that maketh the one common maketh also the other common youre meruelous sentence therefore will not stand with scripture Of lyke folyshnes is youre conclusyon that foloweth that is that baptyme is to be offered to all men yet is it not to be gyuen to all men nor to be taken of all men Whosoeuer offereth anye thynge to anye creature and intendeth not to gyue the same mocketh the creature as when the Popishe priest sayeth vnto hys parishoners Accipite comedite take ye and eate ye and gyueth them nothyng but eateth all hym selfe mocketh hys parishoners And ye captaynes of catabaptistrye offer baptyme vnto all chyldren and intend not to gyue it vnto them Therfore ye mocke all chylderne lyke as boyes mock yong byrdes and yong choughes whyles ye offer vnto thē baptyme whych ye neuer intende to gyue them ¶ For the confutacyon of the laste parte of your sayinge that is that baptyme is not to be taken of all men I aske you whether mortification and regeneracyon ought to be taken of all men or no If that mortificatyon and regeneratyon ought to be receyued of all men and true baptym is true mortifycation and perfyt regeneracyon then ought all men to receyue baptym That baptim is mortyfycacyon and regeneracion Paule beareth witnes to the Romanes in the sixt Chapter and vnto Titus the thyrd chapter and in other places whych I might here reherse if I thought not these sufficient And so is your sayng false that all men ought not to the baptysed But what if all men ought not to be baptised What hindereth that baptisyng of yōg childrē What if many wicked persones be not worthy to receiue the seal of saluaciō I mean the outward baptime because thei wilfulli willingly refuse mortification wtstand the word of God shal their vnworthines make the innocent childer whō Christ hath wasshed with his bloud vnmet vnworthy to receiue the sacramēt of saluatiō regeneratiō the seal of the promis which god made vnto thē Thē this sayng of yours that al mē ought not to receiue baptī proueth nothing that chylder ought not to be baptized here may al mē se that your ground that ye wold make is but sande falleth whē it is but lightly touched that the worke that ye wold bylde vpō your fundaciō can fynd no fast groūd to rest vpō Wherfore ye ar not lyke to prosper in your purpose baptim say ye is onli dew to the elect churche chosen in Christe Iesus before al worldes What maketh this agaynst the christening of yōg childer I thāk yow for ye help me with argumētes agaynste your false doctrine For if baptim be only dew vnto the elect churche chosen in Christ Iesus before al worldes then is baptim dew vnto al the mēbres sparkes of the same churche but chylder ar membres a part of the elect churche Therfore baptim is dew vnto thē What nede vs now to dispute any longer in this matter seyng that by your own sayēg baptim is dew vnto childer as the membres of Christes elect churche chosen befor the worldes Is baptim only dew to the elect and chosen if that be so your brether anabaptistes of munster did wrong whē they baptysed so many deuilishe and reprobat persones of your sect that they by theyr myght and strenght put down all lawfull magistrates and rulers there and set vp a Kyng among them selues which had .xvi. wyues were these murderers and dispisers of goddis ministers of the elect chyrche was thys kyng ryghtly regenerate and a mortifyer of hys membres vpon earth which had so many wymen to