catholic_n which_o be_v greedy_o catch_v at_o by_o such_o as_o leap_v for_o joy_n to_o find_v any_o lick_v thing_n to_o bespatter_v the_o church_n with_o and_o startle_v some_o unattentive_a and_o too_o credulous_a catholic_n drive_v they_o zealous_a of_o defend_v the_o council_n to_o a_o unwarrantable_a position_n which_o tenet_n and_o its_o practice_n my_o ld._n himself_n know_v well_o the_o generality_n of_o catholic_n hate_n and_o detest_v as_o much_o as_o himself_o eight_o way_n 27._o the_o eight_o and_o last_o way_n be_v to_o pick_v out_o as_o well_o as_o i_o can_v those_o proposition_n or_o principle_n my_o ld_n rely_v on_o and_o show_v their_o weakness_n which_o be_v sufficient_o perform_v by_o single_v they_o out_o and_o then_o name_v they_o principle_n they_o be_v so_o quite_o unlike_o what_o they_o be_v call_v now_o his_o principle_n he_o lay_v in_o his_o first_o section_n i_o mean_v his_o main_a and_o fundamental_a proposition_n which_o because_o he_o rely_v on_o yet_o never_o prove_v we_o be_v from_o his_o carriage_n to_o take_v for_o principle_n and_o self_n evident_a to_o he_o though_o he_o himself_o call_v they_o not_o so_o for_o it_o be_v dangerous_a to_o they_o who_o have_v not_o truth_n on_o their_o side_n even_o to_o mention_v the_o word_n principle_n evidence_n or_o demonstration_n his_o first_o concern_v scripture_n i_o shall_v speak_v to_o anon_o a_o second_o seem_v to_o be_v this_o p._n 6._o we_o all_o acknowledge_v that_o the_o whole_a church_n of_o god_n keep_v the_o faith_n entire_a and_o transmit_v faithful_o to_o the_o after-age_n the_o whole_a faith_n that_o be_v to_o the_o age_n next_o after_o the_o apostle_n as_o he_o express_v a_o little_a before_o call_v by_o he_o p._n 7._o the_o first_o and_o best_a antiquy_o and_o signify_v to_o mean_v the_o first_o three_o age_n now_o the_o positive_a part_n of_o this_o principle_n be_v good_a and_o assertive_a of_o tradition_n but_o withal_o unapt_a to_o stead_v he_o the_o negative_a part_n of_o it_o or_o that_o the_o three_o age_n transmit_v it_o not_o to_o the_o four_o and_o so_o forward_o imply_v in_o his_o discourse_n will_v only_o stead_v he_o but_o it_o be_v left_a unprooved_a and_o so_o be_v a_o voluntary_a assertion_n and_o strange_o ridiculous_a for_o if_o the_o first_o two_o age_n keep_v the_o faith_n entire_a and_o transmit_v it_o to_o the_o three_o it_o be_v evident_a the_o three_o be_v able_a to_o transmit_v it_o to_o the_o four_o and_o so_o forward_o wherefore_o it_o be_v evident_a from_o the_o concern_v of_o the_o thing_n it_o be_v also_o willing_a to_o do_v so_o it_o be_v demonstrable_a it_o do_v so_o this_o principle_n then_o on_o which_o he_o so_o much_o build_v be_v either_o not_o for_o he_o or_o else_o high_o against_o he_o 28._o another_o main_a and_o fundamental_a proposition_n or_o principle_n be_v find_v p._n 7._o and_o as_o the_o former_a concern_v the_o tradition_n of_o the_o church_n so_o this_o and_o the_o three_o follow_v one_o concern_v the_o authority_n of_o father_n the_o present_a roman_a doctrine_n say_v he_o which_o be_v in_o difference_n be_v invisible_a and_o unbeard_v of_o in_o the_o first_o and_o best_a antiquity_n that_o be_v no_o heretic_n have_v arisen_a in_o those_o day_n or_o in_o the_o first_o three_o hundred_o year_n deny_v those_o point_n and_o so_o the_o father_n set_v not_o themselves_o to_o write_v express_o for_o they_o but_o occasional_o only_a and_o yet_o by_o his_o leave_n our_o controuâ—â—â—â—â—â—_n be_v frequent_a in_o cite_v they_o for_o diverse_a point_n especial_o for_o the_o ground_n of_o our_o faith_n the_o church_n voice_n or_o tradition_n to_o the_o utter_a overthrow_n of_o the_o protestant_a cause_n so_o far_o this_o improve_v and_o main_a position_n disannul_v all_o use_n of_o the_o father_n of_o the_o first_o 300_o year_n in_o our_o controversy_n be_v from_o not_o need_v proof_n or_o be_v self_n evident_a 29._o it_o may_v be_v his_o respect_n and_o value_n for_o the_o father_n of_o the_o next_o age_n will_v make_v amends_o for_o this_o rashness_n he_o tell_v we_o immediate_o after_o that_o in_o the_o succeed_v age_n secular_a interest_n do_v more_o prevail_v and_o the_o write_n of_o the_o father_n be_v vast_a and_o voluminous_a full_a of_o controversy_n and_o ambiguous_a sense_n fit_v to_o their_o own_o time_n and_o question_n full_a of_o proper_a opinion_n and_o such_o variety_n of_o say_n that_o both_o side_n eternal_o and_o inconfutable_o shall_v bring_v saying_n for_o themselves_o respective_o now_o if_o they_o be_v so_o qualify_v that_o both_o side_n may_v eternal_o dispute_v out_o of_o they_o and_o neither_o be_v ever_o able_a to_o confute_v the_o other_o or_o conclude_v then_o let_v he_o speak_v out_o and_o say_v all_o the_o father_n after_o the_o first_o 300_o year_n be_v not_o worth_a a_o straw_n in_o order_n to_o decision_n or_o controversy_n nor_o yet_o the_o father_n of_o the_o first_o 300_o year_n because_o they_o speak_v not_o of_o our_o point_n in_o difference_n and_o so_o there_o be_v a_o fair_a end_n of_o all_o the_o father_n and_o of_o his_o own_o dissuasive_a too_o for_o that_o part_n which_o rely_v on_o they_o which_o look_v like_o the_o most_o authoritative_a piece_n of_o it_o the_o reader_n will_v easy_o judge_v now_o whether_o we_o as_o he_o charge_v we_o p._n 18_o have_v many_o gripe_n of_o conscience_n concern_v the_o father_n that_o they_o be_v not_o right_a on_o our_o side_n or_o the_o dissuader_n our_o constant_a and_o avow_v doctrine_n be_v that_o the_o testimony_n of_o father_n speak_v of_o they_o proper_o as_o such_o be_v jufallible_a that_o in_o two_o case_n they_o speak_v as_o father_n that_o be_v when_o they_o declare_v it_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o present_a church_n of_o their_o time_n or_o when_o they_o write_v against_o any_o man_n as_o a_o heretic_n or_o his_o tenet_n as_o heresy_n some_o complexion_n of_o circumstance_n also_o may_v be_v find_v out_o by_o much_o read_n and_o compare_v several_a consideration_n which_o make_v it_o evident_a they_o speak_v as_o witness_n though_o it_o be_v more_o laborious_a and_o tedious_a to_o compass_v a_o satisfaction_n this_o way_n whereas_o as_o appear_v by_o our_o dissuader_n the_o protestant_n neither_o acknowledge_v they_o infallible_a nor_o indeed_o useful_a and_o this_o be_v my_o ld_n four_o principle_n which_o with_o the_o former_a destroy_v the_o efficaciousness_n of_o all_o the_o father_n &_o invalidate_n all_o that_o part_n of_o his_o own_o book_n which_o shall_v seem_v weighty_a 30._o notwithstanding_o the_o two_o former_a principle_n to_o invalidate_v the_o father_n it_o may_v still_o be_v say_v by_o the_o catholic_n in_o behalf_n of_o their_o validity_n as_o be_v by_o i_o now_o that_o the_o say_n of_o father_n as_o witness_n be_v convictive_a and_o therefore_o it_o shall_v seem_v sit_v my_o ld_n do_v lay_v another_o principle_n to_o provide_v against_o that_o he_o be_v not_o unmindful_a of_o it_o but_o have_v take_v order_n about_o it_o for_o though_o p._n 9_o he_o tell_v we_o the_o father_n be_v good_a testimony_n of_o the_o doctrine_n deliver_v from_o their_o forefather_n down_o to_o they_o of_o what_o the_o church_n esteem_v the_o way_n of_o salvation_n yet_o that_o be_v to_o be_v understand_v according_a to_o the_o rule_n premise_a p._n 8._o thus_o thing_n be_v thus_o it_o will_v be_v impossible_a for_o they_o the_o catholic_n to_o conclude_v from_o the_o say_n of_o a_o number_n of_o father_n that_o the_o doctrine_n they_o will_v prove_v thence_o be_v the_o catholic_n doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n because_o any_o number_n that_o be_v less_o than_o all_o do_v not_o prove_v a_o catholic_a consent_n so_o that_o unless_o each_o single_a father_n affirm_v each_o single_a point_n to_o be_v of_o faith_n or_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n which_o moral_o speak_v be_v impossible_a to_o happen_v it_o follow_v by_o his_o word_n that_o it_o be_v impossible_a to_o conclude_v thence_o the_o catholic_n doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n which_o amount_v to_o this_o that_o it_o be_v impossible_a to_o conclude_v any_o thing_n in_o controversy_n from_o the_o father_n even_o take_v as_o witness_n and_o this_o be_v his_o five_o principle_n a_o strange_a conceit_n that_o it_o shall_v be_v impossible_a to_o know_v the_o consent_n of_o all_o england_n in_o a_o matter_n of_o fact_n for_o example_n the_o late_a war_n without_o speak_v with_o each_o single_a man_n in_o the_o whole_a nation_n yet_o this_o be_v his_o discourse_n when_o he_o say_v that_o no_o number_n less_o than_o all_o can_v prove_v a_o catholic_n consent_n 31._o yet_o some_o use_n certain_o he_o allow_v of_o the_o father_n for_o all_o this_o else_o why_o do_v he_o quote_v they_o yes_o and_o the_o principle_n which_o i_o reckon_v his_o six_z by_o virtue_n of_o which_o he_o enforce_v they_o be_v this_o
so_o qualify_v as_o be_v apt_a to_o convince_v to_o answer_v it_o and_o not_o at_o all_o by_o protestant_a ground_n which_o yield_v they_o all_o fallible_a yet_o i_o have_v that_o regard_n for_o any_o thing_n that_o tend_v though_o remote_o to_o solidity_n that_o i_o will_v even_o remit_v something_o of_o my_o own_o advantage_n to_o give_v it_o a_o respectful_a consideration_n the_o testimony_n be_v of_o gennadius_n cite_v by_o my_o l._n p._n 58_o &_o 59_o thus_o for_o after_o christ_n ascension_n into_o heaven_n the_o soul_n of_o all_o saint_n be_v with_o christ_n and_o go_v from_o the_o body_n they_o go_v to_o christ_n expect_v the_o resurrection_n of_o their_o body_n with_o it_o to_o pass_v into_o the_o perfection_n of_o perpetual_a bliss_n to_o which_o my_o ld._n subjoin_v and_o this_o he_o deliver_v as_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n i_o take_v this_o excellent_a testimony_n as_o put_v down_o by_o himself_o to_o do_v which_o the_o usage_n of_o st._n greg._n nazianzen_n immediate_o forego_v give_v i_o small_a encouragement_n in_o answer_v then_o i_o affirm_v that_o this_o testimony_n so_o insist_v and_o rely_v on_o as_o against_o we_o be_v as_o plain_a a_o declaration_n of_o the_o faith_n of_o our_o church_n at_o present_a as_o any_o nowadays_o catholic_n can_v pronounce_v for_o since_o no_o catholic_n hold_v that_o any_o go_v to_o purgatory_n but_o they_o who_o die_v sinner_n to_o some_o degree_n and_o that_o all_o who_o be_v saint_n be_v with_o christ_n in_o heaven_n as_o be_v evident_a by_o the_o church_n common_a language_n affirm_v constant_o the_o saint_n be_v in_o heaven_n and_o never_o that_o the_o saint_n be_v in_o purgatory_n but_o the_o soul_n only_o it_o be_v manifest_a that_o the_o word_n be_v as_o express_o for_o we_o as_o we_o ourselves_o can_v invent_v or_o wish_v i_o hope_v it_o will_v not_o wrogmethod_n if_o on_o this_o occasion_n i_o show_v how_o protestant_a writer_n speed_v when_o they_o bring_v against_o we_o any_o testimony_n of_o a_o father_n speak_v as_o a_o father_n that_o be_v declare_v that_o he_o deliver_v the_o sense_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n however_o in_o other_o testimony_n which_o speak_v not_o narrative_o or_o matter_n of_o fact_n the_o very_a nature_n of_o word_n join_v with_o the_o variety_n of_o their_o circumstance_n must_v needs_o afford_v room_n for_o ambiguity_n and_o several_a gloss_n i_o affirm_v then_o that_o this_o testimony_n not_o only_o be_v not_o in_o the_o least_o opposite_a to_o we_o but_o be_v direct_o opposite_a to_o the_o protestant_n in_o another_o point_n of_o faith_n in_o which_o we_o differ_v to_o discover_v this_o let_v we_o reflect_v on_o the_o word_n after_o christ_n ascension_n into_o heaven_n the_o soul_n of_o all_o saint_n be_v with_o christ_n and_o ask_v what_o mean_v these_o word_n after_o christ_n ascension_n and_o first_o it_o be_v evident_a it_o put_v a_o distinction_n between_o the_o soul_n of_o saint_n before_o christ_n ascension_n and_o after_o it_o in_o some_o respect_n and_o what_o be_v this_o respect_n most_o express_o this_o that_o the_o soul_n of_o the_o saint_n after_o christ_n ascension_n go_v from_o the_o body_n to_o christ_n that_o be_v that_o before_o the_o ascension_n none_o do_v the_o avow_a doctrine_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n prosess_v that_o those_o who_o die_v saint_n in_o the_o law_n of_o grace_n go_v straight_o to_o heaven_n but_o that_o the_o best_a saint_n before_o our_o saviour_n die_v for_o they_o and_o ascend_v with_o they_o do_v not_o whence_o also_o we_o hold_v that_o christ_n descend_v into_o hell_n be_v to_o free_v they_o from_o that_o state_n of_o suspense_n and_o want_n of_o their_o strong_o desire_a and_o hop_v for_o bliss_n according_a to_o that_o hymn_n of_o s._n ambrose_n and_o s._n augustin_n in_o the_o common-prayer-book_n so_o oft_o say_v over_o by_o rote_n but_o never_o reflect_v on_o when_o thou_o have_v overcome_v the_o sharpness_n of_o death_n thou_o do_v open_v the_o kingdom_n of_o heaven_n to_o all_o believer_n signify_v plain_o that_o no_o believer_n sound_a heaven_n open_a for_o they_o till_o after_o christ_n death_n by_o the_o success_n of_o this_o one_o testimony_n be_v see_v how_o utter_o the_o protestant_n cause_n will_v be_v overthrow_v by_o way_n of_o testimony_n as_o well_o as_o reason_n be_v citation_n distinguish_v bring_v to_o ground_n and_o those_o only_o admit_v from_o the_o father_n in_o which_o it_o be_v manifest_a they_o speak_v as_o father_n or_o witnesser_n of_o what_o be_v the_o present_a church_n doctrine_n to_o close_v up_o this_o discourse_n about_o the_o dissuader_n citation_n he_o be_v to_o show_v we_o first_o that_o they_o fall_v not_o under_o the_o faulty_a head_n to_o which_o they_o be_v respective_o assign_v or_o under_o diverse_a other_o of_o those_o head_n next_o that_o they_o have_v in_o they_o the_o nature_n of_o testimony_n and_o last_o which_o be_v yet_o hard_o that_o though_o they_o have_v in_o they_o the_o nature_n of_o testimony_n their_o authority_n be_v certain_a and_o their_o language_n unambiguous_a so_o that_o they_o may_v be_v safe_o rely_v on_o for_o principle_n or_o ground_n of_o a_o solid_a discourse_n this_o if_o he_o show_v of_o any_o one_o citation_n which_o strike_v at_o our_o faith_n i_o promise_v he_o very_o hearty_o to_o subscribe_v to_o the_o validity_n of_o all_o the_o rest_n 13._o thus_o much_o for_o his_o authority_n next_o shall_v follow_v a_o refutation_n of_o his_o reason_n produce_v against_o our_o faith_n for_o as_o for_o those_o against_o our_o school-divines_a or_o casuist_n they_o concern_v not_o i_o as_o a_o controvertist_n let_v he_o and_o they_o fight_v it_o out_o now_o reason_n that_o strike_v at_o our_o faith_n must_v either_o be_v against_o the_o ground_n of_o faith_n and_o those_o shall_v be_v consider_v in_o my_o answer_n to_o his_o first_o section_n or_o against_o point_v of_o faith_n and_o these_o may_v proceed_v two_o way_n first_o by_o show_v those_o point_v incomprehensible_a to_o our_o natural_a reason_n or_o unsuitable_a to_o our_o faney_n and_o this_o way_n he_o frequent_o take_v make_v a_o great_a deal_n of_o game_n upon_o such_o subject_n as_o any_o atheist_n may_v do_v by_o the_o same_o way_n in_o point_n common_a to_o he_o and_o we_o but_o this_o hurt_v we_o not_o in_o the_o least_o in_o regard_n we_o hold_v not_o mystery_n of_o faith_n object_n of_o human_a reason_n nor_o spiritual_a thing_n the_o object_n of_o fancy_n and_o so_o these_o reason_n need_v no_o far_o answer_n the_o other_o way_n reason_n against_o point_n of_o faith_n may_v proceed_v be_v to_o show_v those_o point_n contradictory_n to_o some_o evident_a principle_n at_o least_o to_o some_o other_o know_v or_o else_o acknowledge_v truth_n and_o these_o be_v worth_a answer_v but_o such_o as_o these_o i_o find_v none_o in_o his_o whole_a book_n rather_o that_o he_o build_v his_o sleight_n descant_v or_o discourse_n on_o some_o controvertible_a text_n or_o citation_n rely_v on_o they_o as_o firm_o as_o if_o they_o be_v first_o principle_n indeed_o p._n 65._o the_o dissuader_n tell_v we_o of_o a_o demonstration_n of_o he_o for_o the_o novelty_n of_o transubstantion_n and_o that_o a_o plain_a one_o too_o but_o i_o shall_v manifest_v short_o from_o the_o very_a word_n of_o the_o author_n peter_n lombard_n on_o which_o his_o plain_a demonstration_n rely_v that_o it_o be_v either_o a_o plain_a mistake_n or_o plain_a abuse_n of_o he_o nay_o argue_v the_o direct_a contrary_n to_o what_o the_o dissuader_n product_v it_o for_o some_o consequence_n also_o he_o deduce_v ad_fw-la hominem_fw-la against_o diverse_a point_n of_o our_o faith_n build_v on_o our_o own_o concession_n or_o allow_v truth_n take_v from_o the_o father_n by_o which_o he_o attempt_v to_o overthrow_v it_o but_o these_o consequence_n be_v so_o strange_o inconsequent_a and_o those_o tenet_n he_o will_v counterpose_v so_o far_o from_o contradictory_n that_o it_o be_v hard_a to_o imagine_v whence_o his_o reason_n take_v its_o rise_n to_o leap_v into_o such_o remote_a conclusion_n i_o will_v instance_n in_o two_o find_v p._n 49_o and_o 50._o that_o the_o conflagration_n of_o the_o last_o day_n and_o the_o opinion_n of_o some_o father_n that_o the_o soul_n be_v detain_v in_o secret_a receptacle_n till_o the_o day_n of_o judgement_n do_v both_o destroy_v intermediate_v purgatory_n which_o consequence_n if_o he_o will_v make_v good_a i_o will_v vield_n his_o whole_a book_n to_o be_v demonstrative_a and_o unanswerable_a in_o a_o word_n all_o the_o good_a reason_n he_o bring_v be_v take_v from_o some_o of_o our_o divine_n write_v against_o other_o and_o he_o have_v do_v himself_o the_o right_a to_o choose_v the_o best_a which_o level_v against_o the_o opinion_n of_o a_o less_o able_a divine_a in_o stead_n of_o a_o point_n of_o faith_n must_v needs_o bear_v a_o
p._n 8._o the_o clear_a say_n of_o one_o or_o two_o of_o those_o father_n true_o allege_v by_o we_o to_o the_o contrary_a will_n certain_o prove_v that_o what_o many_o of_o they_o suppose_v it_o do_v affirm_v and_o which_o but_o two_o or_o three_o as_o good_a catholic_n do_v deny_v be_v not_o then_o a_o matter_n of_o faith_n or_o a_o doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n i_o wish_v my_o ld._n have_v be_v so_o ingenuous_a as_o to_o have_v make_v use_n of_o this_o principle_n when_o he_o charge_v our_o church_n itself_o with_o the_o mistake_v of_o a_o few_o writer_n contradict_v not_o by_o one_o or_o two_o but_o sometime_o by_o a_o whole_a nation_n but_o this_o principle_n show_v it_o be_v not_o reason_n in_o he_o but_o will_n and_o interest_n which_o make_v he_o so_o hot_a as_o for_o his_o principle_n itself_o it_o subsist_v not_o at_o all_o for_o be_v it_o not_o know_v that_o more_o than_o one_o or_o two_o that_o be_v s._n cyprian_a and_o the_o african_a father_n deny_v the_o baptism_n of_o 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