from time to time and these following their own lusts and humours and Interests have perverted and drawn aside others we grant it But we say too That not a few or a small party but multirules have been corrupted as once it was when all the world wondered to see it self Arian Not to mention the times of Noah and Elijah which are famous for a general Apostacy we ask How all Israel came to be corrupted after Joshua and the Judg's that out-lived him Yea how the Body of that people were corrupted even while Moses was alive and upon all'occasions turning themselves to Idols And how came the Jews in our Saviours time to have so many Traditions not only besides but contrary to the written Word Now the force of our arguing lieth in this That notwithstanding Tradition and a written Word too for some thousands of years past the generality and whole body of people who had the mind of God revealed to them have been corrupted and perverted And when it is thus what credit is to be given to Tradition Or what shall the Fathers deliver over to their Children other then they themselves have received believed and practised We cannot enough wonder at Papists arguings in this kind And therefore desire to be resolved in some particulars ere we can yield so much to Tradition as they would have us 1. We would know who these Foref thers were that have so carefully delivered over the doctrine of Christ in all ages For our Forefathers after the flesh till this and the last age we know and are sorry for it that they were Roman Catholicks this land having taken the infection as much as any other place and we acknowledge that other Kingdoms and Nations were as they so as those whom we count our Forefathers after the faith were for a great while up and down in the world as they that had not bowed the knee to Baal in Elijahs time And what then can be inferred from the Tradition of Forefathers We know there is a pretious promise Isa. 59. 21. that Gods Word and Spirit should continue with his Church and the Churches children to all generations as our Saviour promised his Disciples Mat. 28. 20. to be with them to the end of the world But observe the Spirit is promised as well as the Word because one is unavailable without the other cooperating with it Isa. 30. 20 21. 2 Cor. 2. 16. 2 Cor. 3. 6. and 4. 13. But where is there any promise that the Word and Spirit shall continue with any one people uninterruptedly unto the worlds end We read that the word of the kingdom should be taken from the Jews and so it was and is not restored to them yet And in many places where once were famous Christian Churches there is not to be seen at this day so much as a relique of Christianity Witness the Churches of Asia now possessed by Mahometans We think it certain and undeniable that errors and impieties of all sorts may infect whole Nations of such as have professed the doctrine of Christ and when the infection hath once taken a few it will spread like a gangrene till the body be all overrun So when some have once departed from the faith others are too apt to follow and the tares soon outgrow the good seed Hence we answer That we cannot admit Tradition as an infallible witness since multitudes yea whole Nations have been overspread with errors and those no small ones For when a generation is once corrupted in their Principles it is not imaginable to us how they should teach their children other then what they themselves have learned So our Forefathers after the flesh would we believe have taught us the same Religion which had been taught them for many ages i. e. the Popish or Romish But we deny them to be our Forefathers as to our faith If any ask us Who these were We answer all they who in all ages protested against the errors and abuses of the Church of Rome We know well that England was Christian before Austin the Monk came hither For he found such here as stoutly withstood his Romish impositions though it cost them dear And what if there never had been a Church in England before or that Church had utterly failed yet the Church truly Catholick never fails but God hath had alwayes and will have to the end a company that contend for the faith once delivered to the Saints and desire to worship him in spirit and in truth And these we own for our Forefathers as to our faith and from these we received what we now profess and believe according to Scripture To clear the matter yet further we say this argument of Tradition supposes what we cannot yield viz. That the present Church of Rome holds the same faith in all particulars with the Apostolick and Primitive Church and that the same faith hath been handed down to them in all ages successively to this day That there was once a famous Church at Rome we grant but that the present faith of Rome is the same with that in the Apostles dayes can never be made good unless Papists will have the difference of mea's and dayes to be the whole Catholick faith Let them now prove their faith to be the same with what it was in the Apostles times and we may then heed this argument more then now we can For our parts we stand to prove as others before us have done that there hath been a general departing from the faith and when the generality are once corrupted in principles and practises we know not what they should teach posterity other then what they themselves have learned Do not Heathens now as in all former ages teach their children to worship Idols as themselves have done And is it so hard to conceive how the face yea whole body of the Church may be overspread by errors and heresies Who knows not that one scabbed sheep will infect a whole flock and how a little leaven will soon leaven the whole lump We hear of vain conversation received by Tradition from Forefathers 1 Pet. 1. 18. And wee know too well that Children for the most part betake themselves to such courses as their Fathers have taken before them That our Saviour delivered the whole truth to his Apostles and they to the Churches in those times we make no question yea we think it a sin to question it But we know and can shew how the Churches planted by the Apostles degenerated quickly and by degrees came to be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ and his Gospel And is this strange Alas Even in the Apostles times how were some Churches perverted in so much as he wonders Gal. 1. 6. they were so soon removed to another Gospel And here I might enlarge in shewing how by degrees the first Churches came to be perverted and corrupted But it lies on our Adversaries to prove their faith as it is now to be as
it was in the Apostles time We have said enough to shew how Tradition which they so much commend and magnifie may fail and so prove no infallible Testimony And who were our Forefathers from whom we learnt our faith we have shewed already and now shall name some of them viz. The Reformers in the last ages and Jo. Hu and Hiâ—…rome of Prague and before them Wickliff and before him the Waldenses and all that protested against the Churches corruptions in all ages upward as might be shewed if it were pertinent Jo. Whites Way p. 336. § 45. 337. Digress 48. 2. Tradition being the Testimony of the Church let Papists first ascertain us which is the true Church whose Testimony we must believe For our parts we know none upon earth that pretend to Christianity that do not account themselves the true Church and that avow not themselves to have the true faith which the Apostles delivered Now there being so many pretenders we are at as great a loss wich Tradition as without it since all say they hold the Apostolick faith and yet extreamly differ one from another not in few matters or small at least some of them And it is said and granted on all hands that there are dissenters and of these some are ignorant and some obstinate and some Scepticks and we know too many professing Christians who are in their wayes and doings no better then Infidels Now may not any or all of these question Tradition as well as Scripture upon this pretence that they know not which is the Church whose Testimony they are obliged to believe If it be said as it hath been by some that there is no Christian but knows the Church It may be justly replyed that there is no Christian but knows the Scripture as well For all that own not Scripture we may justly disown them as being no Christians A man may be a Christian it is confessed though he never saw a Bible if he have heard the doctrine of Christ as many Gentiles yea all for ought I know did in the first times of the Church when the Gospel was first preached to them by the Apostles But to be a Christian and not know the doctrine of Christ is a pure contradiction Now how we shall know which Church gives the truest testimony to the doctrine of Christ if not by Scripture let Papists resolve us for we know not what to answer We think among so many pretenders there will be differences such as â—â—â—â—adition will no better reconcile then Scripture and that as Protestants cannot agree about the sense of Scripture but some interpret it one way and some another so they and others will agree no better about the Church and its Tradition For as I have said there are many Churches and those hugely differing in some things and yet all pretend to the Apostolick faith Therefore we have need of somewhat to ascertain us of that Church which hath preserved and delivered down all along the same faith which the Apostles taught For the true Catholick Church we believe it hath been faithfull in its testimony to the truth in all ages But we Protestants cannot own the Church of Rome as such though we know there was there one sound part of the Catholick Church in the Apostles times Papists indeed pretend and boast great things of their Church but what is that to us who can well distinguish between a Roman-Catholick and a Catholick Christian. Here then we Protestants resolve to believe the Church for the Scripture and not the Scripture for the Church And yet we allow what that ancient Father saith of himself That he had not believed Scripture but for the Church For we know that after he came once to learn the Scriptures he then believed it not upon account of the Churches authority but it s own only The Church we grant may at first perswade Infidels to attend and heed the Scripture as the Word of God even as the woman perswaded her neighbours to come and see Christ. But as they when they had heard him themselves believed not because of her saying but because of his own word even so is â—…in the case that now is in question The Church of Christ hath the office of ministry to hold out the light that others who are in darkeness may see it But this will never prove the Church to have such an authority as Papists plead for and much less that their Church is the Catholick Church which only holds the Apostolick faith And when they have said all they can they say no more then any Church never so corrupt will say for it self viz. That it hath the doctrine of Christ which the Apostles taught Hence we say again that Tradition leaves us at an irrecoverable loss and that we must have somewhat more certain then the Churches testimony which any company of never so corrupt principles may pretend unto as well as the Church of Rome 3. We desire to be satisfied whether the doctrine delivered down be true because the Church hath delivered it or that the Church hath delivered it because it is the truth For we think the Church ought to receive and believe the truth only and to deliver that and nothing else to be believed by others and if it received other then the truth it was deceived and if it delivered other it was not only deceived but deceived others also The Church can make nothing to be true but what is such before of it self and all it can do is to declare the truth which it hath received and perswade others to believe it Therefore when Papists press us as they do about our being assured of Scripture we say that we believe it upon account of its own authority because it speaks it self the Word of God For as when a place of trust and honor is conferred upon a person by his Prince and assured to him under the Great Seal though the messenger that brings the Patent may avow it to be the Princes act yet that which gives assurance to the person of his interest in that office and honour is the Patent it self and the Seal annext So we know the voice of God speaking to us in his Word and even so hath the true Church in all ages received Scripture as the true Word of God and commended it to others for such as a Patent sealed from Heaven 4. We desire to know when the Church first resolved the Case in Question and determined what is the doctrine of Christ. For the 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 Councils we count them of a latter date and but of yesterday in comparison For our part we think under correction of better judgments that the Canon was agreed upon very early because two eminent ones among the Ancients â—…counted upon the same number of Canonical Books which we now do and one of them saith that the Canonicall authority of the old and new Testament was confirmed in the Apostles times And that
had been made in many ages and did not coin a new faith never before heard of We are not Calvinists or Lutherans though so miscalled by some but Christians as Luther Calvin and others were in the last age And they and all others of the same profession stood to maintain their doctrine as the faith of Forefathers all along from the beginning of the Gospel And our Adversaries are not ignorant that this hath been held and sufficiently made good by the vote and testimony of the most antient Fathers unto whom our Learned have appealed as unto Judges in this Cause But our faith is not in the Fathers never so antient or learned but in our Lord Jesus Christ whom we have learnt to count and call our Father and Master as being the only Lawgiver Only we appeal to the Fathers thus far as to produce them for our witnesses and know we have reason to alledge their testimony because they owned the same doctrine of Christ which we now do And though the appellation of Protestants was occasioned in the last age by the Protestation made against the Interim yet these were but successors to those who had for many ages before protested against the additions and inventions of men besides the Rule of faith We can therefore plead Antiquity and Succession as well as others and better too unless they could prove better then they have done yet that their Faith is the same that was delivered by the Apostles For this is it which we build our faith upon and by this are we confirmed in it viz. That we profess the same truths which the Apostles received from Christ and delivered unto the first Christian Churches Hence we say when we are told that the Tenets of our Adversaries wherein they differ from us have been received for many ages that they are not so old as the Apostles Besides we know that custome besides or against truth is but an old errour And whatsoâ—…ver is against truth is an Heresie though never so old Truth is older then errour and good was before any evil And so we consent that what was first was best But that our Adversaries Tenets are such we deny and say they were not from the beginning though some of them were taken up early enough and too soon as we know it was not long ere sin got into the world and yet it was after God had made men righteous Our Saviour Matth. 5. corrects many things that had been long received and went for currant by opposing his Word against them But I say unto you It is abundantly enough to justifie us in what we hold that we find our faith in Scripture and this our Adversaries know very well and therefore we need not marvel that they are so busie in raising doubts and questions about its Divine authority For let us once let Scripture go as some would have us our faith is gone also Were it not for Scripture I know nothing to hinder why every man may not coine a faith to himself and say it is the doctrine of Christ. Yea deny Christ and all Christianity For what have we to prove it besides the Scripture or how can we disprove any damnable doctrines and devices of men without it O! let us never think of turning from the good old way wherein we follow all those Champions whom nothing could perswade to part with it 3. Consider what and how much we loose if we hold not fast this ground of our confidence stedfast unto the end It is not for nothing that our adversaries press and urge us so much this way They tell us plainly that let go this and all is gone And they say truly in it For our faith hath no Sure footing if Scriptures authority be such as they would make it We have separated from them for many years past and the true reason and ground of our separation was that they held and practised so many things contrary to Scripture and would not yield to lay them aside Hereupon we resolved to communicate no longer with them because we could not admit what we judged sinfull as being against or beside that which we count the only Rule This I say hath been and still is the quarrel between us For if it be observed in our differences with them we still are on the negative part And why so Surely because our differences are about such things as they hold besides and against Scripture For in these we are bound to deny what they affirm I say again bound sub poenâ of loosing all our profession so far as we are Protestants in opposition to Papists And this let any man that is sober and intelligent judge of For let Oral and Practical Tradition as they call it be the only Rule of faith what is become of Scripture may I not justly ask whether it be something or a meer empty nothing what can it be at best more then a Cipher which we know in numbering stands for nothing unless a figure be put to it Tradition say they is that and that only which can ascertain us that this is the very doctrine of Christ which we believe And then what is Scripture more then a dead letter and Tradition is it which gives Spirit and life to it And where are we then even where our adversaries would have us to be Then we must go to the Church for our faith and take that for the truth which hath been delivered down for many ages whatever it be right or wrong The Church say they cannot erre And so say we But they and we are not agreed for all this For they mean no other Church then their own and this say they hath the true faith which from the Apostles was delivered at first and hath been conveighed down succesfively in all ages and it now rests only among Roman Catholicks God hath and ever had say we a Church or society of men on earth who did not indeed could not because of Gods promise erre in any thing necessary to to be known and believed in order to salvation But we cannot admit their Church and this to be all one God hath made a promise to his Church that he will be with it to the end of the world and this Church shall be led into all necessary saving truths But let our adversaries shew us if they can one promise of God made to any generation of men after the flesh such as was made to Abrahams seed and was made good to them untill the promised seed came Israel so long continued to be Gods people because of his promise But God hath no one people of one stock and kindred ever since unto which he hath made any such promise For many who were once a people to God afterwards became none and they who yet are none are in a capacity to be Gods people and shall be such when he pleases to call them Hence we count nothing of any arguments drawn from personal and