Selected quad for the lemma: evil_n
Text snippets containing the quad
|
ID |
Title |
Author |
Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) |
STC |
Words |
Pages |
|
A26924
|
The English nonconformity as under King Charles II and King James II truly stated and argued by Richard Baxter ; who earnestly beseecheth rulers and clergy not to divide and destroy the land and cast their own souls on the dreadful guilt and punishment of national perjury ...
|
Baxter, Richard, 1615-1691.
|
1689
(1689)
|
Wing B1259; ESTC R2816
|
234,586
|
307
|
by Church-Government it is by the Magistrate's Sword and not by ours by the Keys 7. And is it not then ridiculous contradiction to dispute so hard about Church-Power and against the Presbyters claim when you confess that it is an useless shadow that you dispute for and it 's not it but the Sword that doth the deed 8. Is it not an odious defacing of Princes and Magistrates to say That they are bound to Imprison and Ruine a man as a meer Lictor or Executioner of the Judgment of the Clergy or of a Chancellor without ever hearing or trying his Cause and to punish him again because they punisht him before or because he hath not got their pardon 9. If Excommunication be grosly unjust as against Christs Members for doing their duty or for common humane infirmity they do well that set by it no more than it deserveth and pretend not to repent when they do not nor cannot nor ought to repent L. Though you call it no Punishment to keep all the Non-Communicants from publick power and trust I think it will pass for a notable Penalty M. I grant them as much as I can as knowing how little they will yield to and indeed it 's my opinion that to deny all Non-Communicants Magistracy and publick Trust would be to Reform the Common-Wealth in the Foundation if the Keys were but justly exercised But then by this I exclude none but the Intolerable that Neither Communicate with the Approved or the Tolerated Churches L. But Rulers will turn this against you and shut out the Tolerated with the Intolerable M. I cannot help that Must I not tell men what is Right because they will do Wrong L. But you are for having all the Subjects forced to be Catechised and to be Auditors And do you think that this will not force Non-Conformists to hear against their Consciences M. I say not that they should be forced to hear in the Parish Church but either in a Parish Approved or a Tolerated Church How have they a Toleration that may not hear their Tolerated Pastors And he that is not for hearing at all is not to be Tolerated And indeed if those that are no Members in Communion of any Church but meer Catechumens or Auditors should be forced to hear in their own Parishes ordinarily if there be meet Teaching I oppose it not L. But is it noâ— as injurious to force men against their Consciences to Hear as to Communicate M. No the Case is greatly different Nature bindeth all men to learn that they may know what is good or evil to themselves Learning and Knowledge is the common Duty and Interest of mankind and though no man can be forced to Believe and Repent he that is forced to Hear may hear that which may make him Voluntarily Believe and Repent You must force your Children to Learn but not to Communicate I told you that to give a man the Sacrament is to give him a seal'd Pardon and Gift of Christ and Life which no unwilling man is capable of but he may be capable to Hear and Learn And this being only to those that are refusers of all Church-Communion or are uncapable and are in none either Approved or Tolerated what Conscience can such pretend against hearing or against being restrained from crimes and profaning holy things or reproaching Religion though they be not constrained to what they are uncapable of L. I am fully satisfied that your way of dividing all the Subjects into the Approved the Tolerated and the Intolerable is of absolute necessity And to conclude I am satisfied that you Non-Conformists have a Cause so good that you do well to suffer for it but were I in your case I know not what I should do my self The Flesh and World are strong and it 's easier to be convinced that one should be a Martyr than to submit to Martyrdom God be merciful to our weakness M. He trusteth not Christ that thinks he shall be a loser by him and he that will save his life from him by sin shall lose it and he that loseth it for him shall save it L. X. Your 10th for some Toleration will never be endured though the truth is your Reasons for it are unanswerable and your Limitations so strict as prevent most of the Objections that might be made against it M. God's Law requireth forbearing and forgiving one another and receiving the weak in Faith. And they that cannot Tolerate the Tolerable methinks should fear the thoughts of death lest then God will not Tolerate them but cast them out as they cast out his Children L. I confess you convince me that know what most Patrons in England are that it is unfit that all the Peoples Souls should be so far at the mercy of those Patrons that seem to care but little for their own as that no man must have any other or better Pastor than they will choose for him and that all mans duty to care for his Salvation and all the judgment of the Church of Christ from the Apostles dayes till a few hundred years agoe should wholly give place to the pretended right of any fellow that can buy an Advowsoâ— or Presentation And it were to be wisht that it were wholly taken from them and left to the Clergy and People alone the Magistrate being Iudge whom he will Approve or Tolerate But there is no hope that Patrons will let go their supposed right if an Angel from Heaven should speak against it but in all reason they should grant the Communicants that small consequent Vote of Consent or Dissent that you pleaded for but if they will not do that they should give them leave to go to another Parish or to choose a Tolerated Pastor whom they will maintain But men are so set on their own ways that they banish all sense of others case and of what conduceth to the common good M. We can but bring the truth to light and shew a self-wounding people the Balsam that must heal them and stay till God will give them a heart to use it L. But you are so careful not to offend them by â—otioning 〈◊〉 wide a Toleration that I doubt it will do little good For 1. some will scruple some of the Subscriptions or Oaths which you grant shall be imposed on them 2. If all the Tolerated must be responsible for their Doctrine and Ministration it 's two to one but the Rulers to whom they must give account will be so contrary to them that they will have no peace or safety M. How would you have these dangers and inconveniences be avoided An unlimitted Toleration of the Intolerable is it self Intolerable and you can devise no safer limitation The engagements which they are to take tell you the Terms of Toleration and if men will-Preach against those Terms that is against the Christian Faith or the Holy Scripture or their Allegiance to the King or if they use their Meetings to destroy Love and Peace
Oath L. The end is but to secure your Loyalty M. The End is one thing and the Means another We are ready to give better security of our Loyalty than this which I before intimated to you Do you think in your Conscience that all the Souldiers in England and all the Corporation-Officers and entrusted Persons and all the Vestry-men and all the Ministers are so well skill'd in Politicks and Law above Bishop Bilson Grotius Barclay and all the Tribes of Learned Lawyers Casuists Canonists Philosophers c. before named as that they can take such an Oath in Truth Iudgment and Righteousness Swearing Allegiance and renouncing Rebellion is easily known to be every Subjects Duty But to unty knotty Controversies in Law is sure above every vulgar Brain Why was not this way found out to prevent all the Civil Wars in the days of the two Williams of Stephen of Henry the 1st and 3d. of K. Iohn of Edward 2d of Richard 2d of Henry 4th and Edward 4th and Henry 6th and Richard 3d. and to prevent the Insurrections in the days of Q. Mary and Q. Elizabeth Why do they not this way decide all the Controversies at Liege Colen c. to make the People determine them by Oath All Politicks agree that the Difference between near Subjects and Slaves is that the former have propriety which none can take from them but by their Consent at least in their Wives Children and Lives and that Slaves have none such nor may resist a Commission to take them away though causlesly and Laws are there but the Will of the Lord who may cross them at his pleasure and that a Ruler of Subjects and an Owner of Slaves thus differ Now if it be a Controversy Whether the English be meer Subjects or Slaves the ignorant Vulgar are no fit Judges to decide it and that by Oath CHAP. LV. POINT XII Whether all Trusted in Corporations may declare That there is NO OBLIGATION on them or any other Person from the Oath called The League and Covenant M. I Spake to this before but a little on the by it being no XII part of the Ministerial Conformity Ministers are only to subscribe or swear that the said Oath bindeth no man to endeavour any Alteration of Government but the Corporations are to declare That there is no Obligation at all from that Oath on them or any other I have read much of the History of Heathens Mahometans and Christians and I confess I remember not that ever I read the like to this The likest to it that I remember was in the long Wars and Contentions between the Pope and the German Emperour when they sware and unsware and sware again as either Party got advantage And that Popes and Councils have Decreed the dissolving of Oaths of Fidelity to those Kings whom the Pope Excommunicates is commonly known but Protestants know no such power L. This Declaration is to be expounded by the many following Acts which only say there is no obligation to Change the Government M. That 's gratis dictum without proof that several Acts have the same meaning when the words so much differ is not to be presumed One of them is an Universal Negative without the least exception and the other a particular Negative only 2. And the Acts were made at several times to several men and the Parliament in the latter never pretended to limit or explain the former which sure they would have done if they repented of the Terms 3. And Parliament Men tell us That it was mentioned that the Non-Obligation of the Covenant should be limited and it was pleaded against it That if men believe that they are bound by it to any thing some will think that they are bound to all that is lawful and that it 's lawful to take Arms against the King and so there is no securing them from Rebellion as by that Covenant but by renouncing all its Obligation And this carried the Cause 4. It is not lawful for Subjects to put a particular Sence on Universal Words imposed unless the imposers first so expound the Terms which they have refused to do after twenty years complaint of the Dissenters and do justifie the universal sence to this day Therefore such forced Expositions of our Rulers words in so tremendous a matter are not to be feigned without good proof L. We say Bonum est ex Causis integris There is Evil in that Covenant therefore it is an Evil Covenant M. That 's none of the Question it may be Evil in that part that is Evil and the thing it self may thence be denominated Faulty or Evil and yet not all that is in it be Evil nor it Evil simpliciter but scundum quid Do you think all is Evil that is there Vowed L. If it be Evil no one is bound to keep it M. No not in the Evil part But do you think that the conjunction of some Ill things in a Vow or Covenant doth disoblige a man from all that 's good in it If so mark what will follow 1. Man is so ignorant and imperfect and faulty that he doth nothing that 's good without a mixture of some evil how can sinless perfection come from sinful Imperfection And so we should be bound by no Vow or Oath or Contract at all 2. If Knaves once learn this Lesson they will be sure to foist in some ill clause into their Vows to GOD and their Covenants with Man that so they may be bound by none 3. The Oath of Allegiance or Fedelity to the King and the King 's own Oath at his Coronation in the time of Popery had ill clauses in it for the Papal interest doth it follow that neither of them did bind 4. If an Irish Tory should on the high-way meet an English Lord and take his Purse pretend that he is against the King and should force him at once to take an Oath to be true to the King and to give him his Estate and conceal his theft The latter is evil and yet even that Oath bindeth to be true to the King. 5. If the Clergy in their Ordination in time of Popery had divers sinful clauses and promises doth it follow that their Ordination was null and obliged them to no Ministerial Duty 6. If the Clergy in former ages or in France or Spain be sworn to the King and the Pope doth it follow that this binds them not to the King because it binds them not to the Pope 7. If men were Married in time of Popery with unlawful Words and Clauses or lately in England by Justices in new terms was such marriage null 8. If a Papist make to you a Testament or Deed of Sale of his Estate and put in some unlawful clauses appealing to Angels or wishing you to pray for the Souls in Purgatory I do not think you would take that Will or Deed for a nullity 9. If in Popery or here some Clauses at Baptism prove bad it doth not