A VINDICATION OF THE Parliament of ENGLAND In answer to a BOOK WRITTEN By WILLIAM MOLYNEUX of Dublin Esq INTITULED The Case of Irelands being bound by Acts of Parliament in England stated By JOHN CARY Merchant in Bristol Nolumus Leges Anglicanas mutari LONDON Printed by Freeman Collins and are to be sold by Sam. Crouch in Cornhill and Eliz. Whitlock near Stationers-Hall 1698. To the Right Honourable John Lord Somers Baron of EVESHAM And Lord High Chancellor of ENGLAND I Humbly make bold to Present Your Lordship with this little Tract being an Answer to a Book Entituled The Case of Ireland 's being bound by Acts of Parliament in England stated Written by William Molyneus of Dublin Esquire The Reason which induced me to intermeddle in a thing so much out of my Profession as Matters of Law are was that I had formerly amongst other things discours'd on the State of Ireland in my Essay on Trade and offer'd it as my Opinion That except that Kingdom was bound up more strictly by Laws made in England it would soon destroy our Woollen Manufactory here Wherefore I proposed to reduce it with respect to its Trade to the state of our other Plantations and Settlements Abroad which I supposed the only Means we had left to help our selves and to render Ireland more useful to this Kingdom This I humbly presented to the King 's Most Excellent Majesty and also to the Honourable the Commons of England then sitting in Parliament which I presumed to do because I thought I had Faithfully and Impartially discoursed on the Subjects I undertook at least I knew I had endeavoured to do so and supposing that Book might give some beginning to the Bill for Encouraging the Woollen Manufactures in England and restraining the Exportation of the Woollen Manufactures from Ireland I found my self obliged to consider the Arguments which might be brought against Ireland 's being bound by Statute Laws made in England What Success that Bill will have I know not but I very much fear if something of that nature be not done we shall soon loose that part of our Woollen Manufacture now left which will tend to the Ruining our Poor the Lessening the Value of the Lands of England and depriving us of a great Number of People who will be necessitated to leave this Kingdom and go over to Ireland to follow their Employments there and all this without rendring the Gentlemen of Ireland any sort of Advantage that may not be made up to them another way This I humbly conceive may be done and Ireland encouraged on another Manufacture no way Detrimental to the Interest of England and carried on by such Methods as may become profitable to both Kingdoms Till this be done I very much fear both will be uneasie I humbly beg your Lordship's Pardon for my Presumption and that you will be pleased to accept what I here offer as from a Person who truly Honours your Lordship and so much the more because you have always Asserted the Rights and Powers of Parliaments I am with all Dutiful respect Right Honourable Your Lordship 's most Humble and most Obedient Servant JOHN CARY A VINDICATION of the Parliament of England 's Power to Bind Ireland by their Statute-Laws in Answer to a Book written by William Molyneux of Dublin Esq SIR YOUR Book Entituled The Case of Ireland 's being bound by Acts of Parliament in England Stated I have seen and read over with some thought and because I cannot agree with you in your Opinion I design this as an Answer to shew you the reason why I differ from you But before I proceed farther I shall premise and grant with you That Ireland hath long had a Parliament and I am apt to think that your mistake arises from this that you Build too much on the Name not considering the Power that Parliament Legally hath For this is no more then our Foreign Plantations and great Corporations in England have in the former the Governours represent the King the great Men or Council the Lords and the Commons are represented by such as they elect and send from their several Districts In the latter these three Estates are likewise Represented by the Mayor Aldermen and Common Council of the several Cities or Corporations these make Laws for their better Order and Government yet all subservient to the great Council or Parliament of this Nation from whose Jurisdiction those Priviledges do not in the least set them free but they pay a due Obedience to their Laws especially those made with an Intention to bind them The Dispute now between you and me is Whither Ireland can be bound by our English Acts of Parliament This you deny and I affirm I will therefore proceed to enquire into your Arguments And because I intend as much Brevity as possible I can I will pass by all that in your Book which I apprehend doth not concern the Matter in Dispute Your Stile is good and your Language like a Gentleman but with this fault that under that you sometimes endeavour to cloud your Design and represent it to the Reader quite different from your own Intention Page 4 You tell us That the Subject of your present Disquisition shall be how far the Parliament of England may think it reasonable to intermeddle with the Affairs of Ireland and bind you up by Laws made in their House This you might have informed your self from our Statute-Books which begin with the Laws of Henry III. about Five hundred years since and you will find that in that King's Reign and ever since in the Reigns of his Successors the Parliament of England have thought it reasonable to Bind up Ireland by Laws made here so often as they saw there was occasion and no doubt they did the same or at least had Power so to do in the Reigns of Henry II. Richard I. and King John who all preceded King Henry III. and Reigned after Ireland came under the English Government Now were that all the Question in Dispute I could soon answer you that what the Parliaments of England did Five hundred years past and have done ever since the present Parliaments think reasonable to suppose themselves impowered to do because they make Precedents of former times their Rule and Government so that 't is not the Will but the Power of the Parliament of England in this Matter that you Dispute and this appears more plainly in your next Paragraph where you call it a pretended Right founded only on the imaginary Title of Conquest or Purchase or on Precedents and Matters of Record I do not think it very material for me to consider on which of these imaginary Titles as you call them they pretend to this Power the Question will not turn on that 't is enough if I assert and prove that the Parliaments of England did exercise this Power ever since Ireland hath been under the English Government and I think it will lye on you to
Poor so that all Persons from the King to the Beggar reap advantage by it I hope I say you will spare us these Acts tho' I can't believe you would did it lye in your power to take them from us therefore I will pull up my Spirits and enquire whether you have this Power you pretend to The quotation you make is from Pulton I have perused him but he goes no farther then 4 Car. 1. and I can meet with no Body who hath seen any later Edition therefore I suppose you must mean Keeble if so you have left out a great part of the Remark For there I find it to be thus An Act for reducing the Rebels in Ireland to their Obedience to his Majesty and the Crown of England EXP. See an Act for the Settlement of Ireland passed in that Kingdom Anno 14 Car. 2. 1662. by which this and the following Acts concerning Ireland are besides their Expiration of no force Methinks I find my Spirits revived it is not so bad as you represented it Keeble saith the Act is expired and then that is the reason why 't is of no force Every Body that understands Parliaments knows that none of their Acts can remain in force longer then they intended them But now I think of it I was to blame to be so much disturbed For what if Pulton had said so Hath Pulton liberty to bound the Power of the Parliaments of England by Notes he shall print in his Statute Book 'T was my extraordinary love for Parliaments not the weight of your Argument that cast me down at first Perhaps Sir you may think this way of arguing savours of Levity I confess it does but you may please likewise to consider That some People are not to be beat out of their groundless Fancies but by ridiculing them Would any prudent Man have thus wrested the Sence of this Note and then brought it as an Argument against the Authority of the Parliament of England Surely by leaving out EXP you expected to have catcht Butterflies I suspect your candidness in those other Quotations wherewith your Book abounds tho' many of them to little purpose by your insincerity in this And having thus got over this Goliah Argument of yours against the Power of our English Parliaments I am the less careful to give Answer to the Objection you raise your self pag. 101. viz. It will be said That by those Acts 't is manifest that England did presume they had such a right to pass Acts binding to Ireland or else they had never done it I confess I am of that opinion only I will not call it a Presumption I think it the just right of the Parliament of England to exercise a Legislative Power over the Kingdom of Ireland And what Answer do you give to this Objection of your own framing why truly The deplorable Condition of Ireland at that time made it impossible for them to have a Parliament of their own and it being absolutely necessary that something should be done toward the suppressing the Violences then raging among them the only means could then be practised was for the Parliament of England to interpose and do something for their Relief and Safety Was this the true Reason Pray what could you expect from the Parliament of England if Ireland was a separate Kingdom and they had not Power to make Laws to bind it The Laws they made could then be of no more Service to them then if they had been framed in the Parliament of Scotland besides the danger of such a Precedent But now I think of it you were not afraid of that danger the Parliament of England had made Laws for you five hundred years before and therefore what they did at that time was not as you say to Interpose but to put in execution a Legislative Authority they had over you As to what past in Cromwel's days p. 101 102. I shall say little to it 't is not of much moment one way or the other And now I am come with you to King Charles the Second's days and in it you say there were several Statutes made to bind Ireland pag. 102. The first you mention is An Act against importing Cattle from Ireland or other Parts beyond the Seas 18 Car. 2. cap. 2. made perpetual by two Acts in the same Reign These you say do not bind Ireland and I say so too therefore I wonder you mention them The next you quote are The Acts against planting Tobacco in England and Ireland 12 Car. 2. cap. 34. 15 Car. 2. cap. 7. 22 23 Car. 2. cap. 26. these you say do positively bind Ireland pag. 103. But you suggest That as there was no need of making them because no Tobacco was ever planted in Ireland which perhaps there might have been if those Laws had not been made so you imply they are of no force in Ireland now made for you see no more reason for sending of Force to trample down an Acre of Tobacco in Ireland by those Statutes then there would be for cutting down the Woods of Shelela were there an Act made in England against your planting or having Timber Truly Sir I am of the same opinion for if the Parliament of England had made a Law against planting and having Timber in Ireland I do not see how you could have avoided putting it in execution any more then you could this And here we are once more agreed The next you mention is the Navigation Act pag. 103. by which I suppose you mean the before-mentioned Act 22 23 Car. 2. also the two Acts against exporting of Wool 12 Car. 2. cap. 32. and 14 Car. 2. cap. 18. pag. 104. These you confess do bind Ireland and have received due obedience but what right the Parliament of England had to make these Statutes you very much question you take them to be Innovations on you as not being warranted by former Precedents for that you say before these Acts the eldest of which is not over Thirty seven years there is not one positive full Precedent to be met with in all the Statute Books of an English Act binding the Kingdom of Ireland pag. 104. Thence you argue p. 105. Shall Proceedings only of Thirty seven years standing be urged against a Nation to deprive them of their Rights and Liberties which they enjoyed for Five hundred years before and which were invaded without and against their Consent and from that day to this have been constantly complained of Let any English Heart that stands so justly in vindication of his own Rights and Liberties answer this Question and I have done Well Sir I think now we are like to bring the Matter to a short Issue provided you will stand to what you say for I confess I must agree with you in this so reasonable a Challenge viz. That if no positive full Precedent can be produced of above Thirty seven years standing whereby the Parliament of England have made Laws to bind
by the same Argumentation Scotland it self may be bound by English Laws I confess I would gladly pay a great Respect to your Person but I would not willingly be drawn aside by your Opinion which I should be if I were thereby perswaded that the Parliament of England have no more Power to make Laws to bind Ireland than they have to bind Scotland since it does appear that they have done it from the first time of our Statutes being extant and long before it can be rationally concluded there was a Parliament there And yet I do not think they can make Laws to bind Scotland because they themselves never pretended to any such Power save in the Case aforementioned that ever I heard of England and Ireland are not two distinct Kingdoms as England and Scotland are Ireland is a Kingdom dependant on and annexed to the Imperial Crown of England and the Parliament of Ireland is likewise subordinate to the Parliament of England therefore the Laws made by the latter will bind the former This I hope I have prov'd notwithstanding what you say That the contrary will be denied by no Man As to what you say in relation to France pag. 94. Whether on this way of reasoning the People of England had not been subject to the King of France had our Kings continued the Possession of that Country and there kept the Seat of the Monarchy I answer No for those two Kingdoms had not been united as England and Ireland are but as England and Scotland However you will find That it was provided against by a Statute made 14 Edw. 3. Anno 1340. All I find of it in Keeble is this not being printed at large By a Statute it was ordained That the Realm of England and the People thereof shall not be subject to the King or Kingdom of France But you say pag. 94. That the Statute Laws of England have not received your Assent and you argue thence That the People of England will consider whether they also are not the King's Subjects and may therefore by this way of reasoning be bound by Laws which the King may assign them without their assent c. I shall have occasion to speak to this hereafter so I shall for the present wave it here And now I find you have done with your three Ancient Precedents the last of which was in the Second of Henry VI. and I have cited to you several other Statutes made before that time which do undoubtedly bind Ireland being intended by the Parliament so to do which I suppose you never saw or would not cite because you had nothing to say against them I shall next follow you to your Modern Instances which you likewise call Modern Precedents pag. 98 99. And here you assert That before the Year 1641. there was no Statute made in England introductory of a new Law that interfered with the Right which the People of Ireland have to make Laws for themselves except only those which you have before-mentioned Is this really so What think you of those I have before cited I am very unwilling to swell this Answer but I find my self obliged to follow wherever you will lead even to 41. Well then besides them What think you of these several Statutes under-mentioned viz. 32 Hen. 8. cap. 24. Whereby the Knights of St. John of Jerusalem in Ireland were dissolved 1 Edw. 6. cap. 1. Whereby the Sacrament is directed to be administred in both Kinds unto the People in Ireland 1 Edw. 6. cap. 2. Entituled an Act for Election of Bishops wherein Ireland is named 1 Eliz. cap. 1. Whereby the Queen hath power given her to assign over to any Person power to exercise Ecclesiastical Authority in Ireland 8 Eliz. cap. 3. Against exporting of Sheep from Ireland I think all these Laws bound Ireland But what you mean by Introductory of a new Law or Interfering with the Right which the People of Ireland have to make Laws for themselves I shall not labour to understand these seem to be nice Quibbles All I proposed was That the Parliament of England have and always had power to bind Ireland by their Statutes which you have denied and I hope I have proved And now I am come with you to 41 where you end your Assertion and acknowledge That in that Year and since some Laws have been made in England to be of force in Ireland I take your own words p. 99. These Acts you say are of 17 Car. 1. you do not name the Chapters but they are 33 34 35 37. which being expired are not to be found in the Statute-Book any more save the Titles therefore I must apply my self to what you say of them p. 100. The Titles say you of these Acts we have in Pulton 's Collection of Statutes but with this remark That they are made of no force by the Acts of Settlemement and Explanation passed in King Charles the Second's time in the Kingdom of Ireland And having gained this Advantage against the Parliament of England you make use of it to the utmost and presently conclude That they plainly shew that the Parliament of Ireland may Repeal an Act passed in England in relation to the Affairs of Ireland Sure I cannot think so for if the Parliament of Ireland can Repeal any one Act made by the Parliament of England they may Repeal all they make which cannot be except they have a Jurisdiction above them For the Power which any one Body or Society of Men hath to Repeal Laws made by another Body or Society must proceed from a Superiority that Body or Society hath over the other whose Laws it doth Repeal So that then if what you say be true it follows That the Parliament of Ireland is Superiour to the Parliament of England and then we have brought our Hogs to a fair Market instead of the Parliament of England's making Laws to bind Ireland the Parliament of Ireland may make Laws to bind England and likewise Repeal those Laws they have already made You Gentlemen of Ireland are angry That we will not give you leave to carry away our Trade and therefore you now undertake to prove That your Parliament can Repeal the Laws our Parliament makes 'T is very pretty truly but I hope you will not put this your Power in Execution and Repeal our Act of Navigation or our Plantation Acts and particularly that Act wherein is the Clause against landing Tobacco in Ireland This I am fond of for a certain reason therefore I beg your favour for it We will part with our Woollen Bill provided you will spare us the Acts already made It will be a great loss to the Kingdom of England if you should Repeal the Acts against planting Tabacco in Ireland 't would very much prejudice our Settlements in Virginia a Trade which besides the great Revenues it brings to the Crown whereof you pay a part does likewise encourage our Navigation expends our Manufactures and employs our