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A10373 The prerogative of parlaments in England proued in a dialogue (pro & contra) betweene a councellour of state and a iustice of peace / written by the worthy (much lacked and lamented) Sir W. R. Kt. ... ; dedicated to the Kings Maiesty, and to the House of Parlament now assembled ; preserued to be now happily (in these distracted times) published ... Raleigh, Walter, Sir, 1552?-1618. 1628 (1628) STC 20649; ESTC S1667 50,139 75

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first so published that all men might plead it for their advantage but a Charter was left in deposito in the hands of the Archbishop of Canterbury for the time and so to his successours Stephen Langthon who was euer a Traytor to the King produced this Charter and shewed it to the Barons thereby encouraging them to make warre against the King Neither was it the old Charter simplie the Barons sought to haue cōfirmed but they presented vnto the King other articles and orders tending to the alteration of the whole common-wealth which when the King refused to signe the Barons presently put themselues into the field and in rebellious and outragious fashion sent the King word except he confirmed them they would not desist from making warre against him till he had satisfied them therein And in conclusion the king being betrayed of all his Nobility in effect was forced to graunt the Charter of Magna Charta and Charta de Forestis at such time as he was invironed with an Army in the meadowes of Staynes which Charters being procured by force Pope Innocent afterward disavowed threatned to curse the Barons if they submitted not themselues as they ought to their Soueraigne Lord which when the Lords refused to obey the King entertained an army of strangers for his own defence wherewith hauing mastered beaten the Barons they called in Lewes of France a most vnnaturall resolution to be their King Neither was Magna charta a law in the 19 th of Henry the 2● but simply a Charter which hee confirmed in the 21 ● of his reigne made it a law in the 25 th according to Littletons opinion Thus much for the beginning of the great Charter which had first an obscure birth from vsurpation and was secondly fostered shewed to the world by rebellion IVST I cannot deny but that all your Lordship hath said is true but seeing the Charters were afterwards so many times confirmed by Parliament made lawes that there is nothing in them vnequall or prejudicial to the King doth not your Honour thinke it reason they should be obserued COVNS Yes obserued they are in all that the state of a King can permit for no man is destroyed but by the lawes of the land no man disseized of his inheritance but by the lawes of the land imprisoned they are by the prerogatiue wherē the King hath cause to suspect their loyaltie for were it otherwise the King should neuer come to the knowledge of any conspiracy or treason against his Person or state and being imprisoned yet doth not any man suffer death but by the law of the land IVST But may it please your Lordship were not Cornewallis Sharpe Hoskins imprisoned being no suspition of treason there COVNS They were but it cost them nothing IVST And what got the King by it for in the conclusion besides the murmure of the people Cornewallis Sharpe Hoskins hauing greatly ouershot themselues and repented them a fine of 5 or 600 l was laid on his Maiesty for their offences for so much their diet cost his Maiestie COVNS I know who gaue the advice sure I am that it was none of mine But thus I say if you consult your memory you shall finde that those kings which did in their own times confirme the Magna Charta did not onely imprison but they caused of their Nobility and others to bee slaine without hearing or tryall IVST My good Lord if you will giue me leaue to speak freely I say that they are not well advised that perswade the King not to admit the Magna Charta with the former reseruations For as the King can neuer loose a farthing by it as I shall proue anon So except England were as Naples is and kept by Garrisons of another Nation it is impossible for a King of England to greaten and inrich himselfe by any way so assuredly as by the loue of his people For by one rebellion the King hath more losse then by a hundred yeares observance of Magna Charta For therein haue our Kings beene forced to compound with Roagues and Rebels and to pardon them yea the state of the King the Monarchie the Nobility haue beene endangered by them COVNS Well Sir let that passe why should not our kings raise mony as the kings of France doe by their letters and Edicts only for since the time of Lewes the 11 th of whom it is said that hee freed the French Kings of their wardship the French Kings haue seldome assembled the States for any contribution IVST I will tell you why the strength of England doth consist of the people and Yeomanry the Pesants of France haue no courage nor armes In France euery Village and Burrough hath a castle which the French call Chastean Villain euery good citty hath a good Cittadell the king hath the Regiments of his guards and his men at armes alwayes in pay yea the Nobility of France in whom the strength of France consists doe alwaies assist their King in those leavies because them selues being free they make the same leavies vpon their tennants But my Lord if you marke it France was neuer free in effect from ciuill warres and lately it was endangered either to be conquered by the Spaniard or to be cantonized by the rebellious French themselues since that freedome of Wardship But my good Lord to leaue this digression that wherein I would willingly satisfie your Lordship is that the kings of England haue neuer receiued losse by Parliament or preiudice COVNS No Sir you shall find that the subiects in Parliament haue decreed great things to the disadvantage and dishonour of our kings in former times IVST My good Lord to avoide confusion I will make a short repetition of them all and then your Lordship may obiect where you see cause And I doubt not but to giue your Lordship satisfaction In the sixt yeare of Henry the 3 rd there was no dispute the house gaue the King two shillings of euery plough land within England and in the end of the same yeare he had escuage paid him to wit for euery knights fee two markes in siluer In the fifth yeare of that King the Lords demaunded the confirmation of the Great Charter which the kings Councell for that time present excused alleadging that those priviledges were extorted by force during the Kings Minoritie and yet the King was pleased to send forth his writ to the Sheriffes of euery county requiring them to certifie what those liberties vvere and hovv vsed in exchange of the Lords demaund because they pressed him so violently the king required all the castles places which the Lords held of his had held in the time of his Father vvith those Manors Lordships vvhich they had heeretofore vvrested from the Crovvne vvhich at that time the King being provided of forces they durst not deny In the 14 th yeare he had the 15 th peny of all goods giuen him vpon condition to
the K. the Prince were cōstrained to yeeld to the Lords A cōstrained consent is the consent of a Captiue not of a K. therefore there was nothing done there either legally or royally For if it be not properly a Parliament where the subiect is not free certainely it can be none where the King is bound for all Kingly rule was taken from the King and twelue Peeres appointed and as some writers haue it 24 Peeres to gouerne the Realme and therefore the assembly made by Iack Strawe other rebels may aswell bee called a Parliament as that of Oxford Principis nomen habere non est esse Princeps for thereby was the King driuen not only to cōpoūd all quarrels with the French but to haue meanes to be revenged on the rebell Lords but he quitted his right to Normādy Aniou Mayne COVNS But sir what needed this extremity seeing the Lords required but the confirmation of the former Charter which was not preiudiciall to the King to graunt IVST Yes my good Lord but they insulted vpon the King and would not suffer him to enter into his own castles they put downe the Purvey or of the meate for the maintenance of his house as if the King had beene a bankrupt and gaue order that without ready money he should not take vp a Chicken And though there is nothing against the royalty of a King in these Charters the Kings of England beeing Kings of freemen and not of slaues yet it is soe contrary to the nature of a King to bee forced euen to those thinges which may be to his advantage as the King had some reason to seeke the dispensation of his oath from the Pope and to drawe in strangers for his owne defence yea Iure saluo Coronae nostrae is intended inclusiuely in all oathes and promises exacted from a Soueraigne COVNS But you cānot be ignorant how dangerous athing it is to cal in other natiōs both for the spoile they make as also so because they haue often held the possession of the best places with which they haue beene trusted IVST It is true my good Lord that there is nothing so daungerous for a King as to be constrained and held as prisoner to his vassals for by that Edward the second and Richard the second lost their Kingdomes and their liues And for calling in of strangers was not King Edward the sixth driuen to call instrangers against the rebels in Norfolke Cornewall Oxfordshire and elsewhere Haue not the K s. of Scotland beene oftentimes constrained to entertaine strangers against the Kings of England And the King of England at this time had he not bin diuerse times assisted by the Kings of Scotlād had bin endāgered to haue bin expelled for ever COVNS But yet you knowe those Kings were deposed by Parliament IVST Yea my good Lord being Prisoners being out of possession and being in their hands that were Princes of the blood and pretenders It is an old countrey prouerbe that might overcomes right a weake title that weares a strong sword commonly prevailes against a strong title that weares but a weake one otherwise Philip the second had never bin Duke of Portugal nor Duke of Millayne nor K. of Naples Scicilie But good Lord Errores not sunt trah udi in exemplum I speake of regall peaceable and lawfull Parliaments The King at this time was but a King in name for Glocester Leycester and Chichester made choise of other Nyne to whom the rule of the Realme was committed the Prince was forced to purchase his liberty frō the Earle of Leycester by giuing for his ransome the County Pallatine of Chester But my Lord let vs judge of those occasions by their events what became of this proud Earle was hee not soone after slaine in Euesham was he not left naked in the field and left a shamefull spectacle his head being cut off from his shoulders his priuy parts from his body laid on each side of his nose And did not God extinguish his race after which in a lawfull parliament at Westminster confirmed in a following parliament of Westminster were not all the Lords that followed Leycester disinherited And when that foole Glocester after the death of Leycester whom he had formerly forsaken made himselfe the head of a second rebellion and called in strangers for which not lōg before he had cried out against the K. was not hee in the end after that hee had seene the slaughter of so many of the Barons the spoile of their castles Lordships constrained to submit himselfe as all the suruiuers did of which they that sped best payd their sines and ransomes the King reserving to his younger sonne the Earledomes of Leycester and Derby COVN Well sir we haue disputed this King to his graue though it be true that he outliued all his enimies brought them to confusion yet those examples did not terrifie their successors but the Earle Marshall and Hereford threatned King Edward the first with a new warre IVST They did so but after the death of Hereford the Earle Marshall repented himselfe and to gaine the Kings favour he made him heire of all his lands But what is this to the Parliament for there was never K. of this land had more giuen him for the time of his raigne then Edward the sonne of Henry the third had COVNS How doth that appeare IVST In this sort my good Lord in this kings third yeare he had giuen him the fifteenth part of all goods In his sixt yeare a twentith In his twelfth yeare a twentyeth In his fourteenth yeare hee had escuage to wit forty shillings of euery knights Fee in his eighteenth yeare hee had the eleventh part of all moueable goods within the kingdome in his nineteenth yeare the tenth part of all Church liuings in England Scotland and Ireland for sixe yeares by agreement from the Pope in his three twentith yeare he raised a taxe vpō wooll and fels on a day caused all the religious houses to be searched al the treasure in thē to be seized brought to his coffers excusing himselfe by laying the fault vpō his treasurer he had also in the end of the same yeare of algoods of all Burgesses of the Commons the 10 ● part in the 25 ● yeare of the Parliamēt of S t Edmūdsbury he had an 18 th part of the goods of the Burgesses and of the people in generall the tenth part Hee had also the same yeare by putting the Clergy out of his protection a fift part of their goods and in the same yeare he set a great taxe vpon wools to wit from halfe a marke to 40 ● vpon euery sacke wherevpon the Earle Marshall and the Earle of Hereford refusing to attend the King into Flanders pretended the greeuances of the people But in the end the king hauing pardoned thē cōfirmed the great Charter he had the ninth penny of all goods from the Lords and
this summe strangers not being inhabitants aboue 16 yeares 4 ● a head All that had Lands Fees and Annuities from 20 to 5● and so double as they did for goods And the Cleargy gaue 6 the pound In the thirty seuenth yeare a Benevolence was taken not voluntary but rated by Commissioners which because one of the Aldermen refused to pay he was sent for a soldier into Scotland He had also another great subsedy of sixe shillings the pound of the Clergy and two shillings eight pence of the goods of the Laity and foure shillings the pound vpon Lands In the second yeare of Edward the sixt the Parliament gaue the King an ayde of twelue pence the pound of goods of his Natural subiects and two shillings the pound of strangers and this to continue for three yeares and by the statute of the second and third of Edward the sixt it may appeare the same Parliament did also giue a second ayde as followeth to wit of euery Ewe kept in seuerall pastures 3 of euery weather kept as aforesaid 2 ● of euery sheepe kept in the Common 1 ● ob The House gaue the King also 8 the pound of euery woollen cloath made for the sale throughout England for three yeares In the third and fourth of the King by reason of the troublesome gathering of the polymony vpon sheepe the taxe vpon cloath this acte of subsedy was repeal'd and other reliefe giuen the King and in the kings seauenth yeare hee had a subsedy and two fifteenes In the first yeare of Queene Mary tunnage and poundage were granted In the second yeare a subsedy was giuen to King Philip and to the Queene shee had also a third subsedy in Annis 4. 5. Now my Lord for the Parliaments of the late Queenes time in which there was nothing new neither head money nor sheepe money nor escuage nor any of these kindes of payments was required but onely the ordinary subsedies those as easily graunted as demaunded I shall not neede to trouble your Lordship with any of them neither can I informe your Lordship of all the passages and actes which haue passed for they are not extant nor printed COVNS No it were but time lost to speake of the latter and by those that are alreadie remembred we may iudge of the rest for those of the greatest importance are publique But I pray you deale freely with mee what you thinke would bee done for his Maiestie if hee should call a Parliament at this time or what would bee required at his Maiesties hands IVST The first thing that would be required would be the same that vvas required by the Commons in the thirtenth yeare of H. the 8 to wit that if any man of the commons house should speake more largely then of duety hee ought to doe all such offences to be pardoned and that to be of record COVNS So might euery Companion speake of the King what they list IVST No my Lord the reuerence vvhich a Vassall ovyeth to his Soueraigne is alvvaies intended for euery speech howsoeuer it must import the good of the King and his estate and so long it may bee easily pardoned othervvise not for in Queene Elizabeths time vvho gaue freedome of speech in all Parliaments vvhen Wentworth made those motions that were but supposed dangerous to the Queenes estate he was imprisoned in the Towre notwithstanding the priviledge of the house and there died COVNS What say you to the Scicilian vespers remembred in the last Parliament IVST I say hee repented him heartily that vsed that speech and indeede besides that it was seditious this example held not The French in Scicily vsurped that Kingdome they kept neither law nor faith they tooke away the inheritance of the Inhabitants they tooke from them their wiues and rauished their daughters committing all other insolencies that could bee imagined The Kings Maiesty is the Naturall Lord of England his Vassals of Scotland obey the English Lawes if they breake them they are punished without respect Yea his Maiesty put one of his Barons to a shamefull death for being consenting onely to the death of a Common Fencer And which of these euer did or durst commit any outrage in England but to say the trueth the opinion of packing the last was the cause of the contention and disorder that happened COVNS Why sir doe you not think it best to compound a Parliament of the Kings seruaunts and others that shall in all obey the kings desires IVST Certainely no for it hath neuer succeeded well neither on the kings part nor on the subiects as by the Parliament before-remembred your Lordshippe may gather for from such a composition doe arise all jealousies and all contentions It was practized in elder times to the great trouble of the kingdome and to the losse and ruine of many It was of latter time vsed by King Henry the eight but euery way to his disadvantage When the King leaues himselfe to his people they assure themselues that they are trusted and beloued of their king and there was neuer any assembly so barbarous as not to aunswere the loue and trust of their King Henry the sixt when his estate was in effect vtterly ouerthrowne vtterly impouerished at the humble request of his Treasurer made the same knowne to the House or otherwise vsing the Treasurers owne words Hee humbly desired the King to take his staffe that hee might saue his wardship COVNS But you know they will presently bee in hand with those impositions which the King hath laid by his owne royall prerogatiue IVST Perchance not my Lord but rather with those impositions that haue beene by some of your Lordships laide vpon the King which did not some of your Lordships feare more than you doe the impositions laid vpon the Subjects you would neuer disswade his Majestie from a Parliament For no man doubted but that his Majestie was advised to lay those impositions by his Councell and for particular things on which they were laid the aduice came from petty fellowes though now great ones belonging to the Custome-house Now my Lord what prejudice hath his Majestie his revenue beeing kept vp if the impositions that were laid by the aduice of a few be in Parliament laid by the generall Councell of the kingdome which takes off all grudging and complaint COVNS Yea Sir but that which is done by the King with the aduice of his priuate or priuy Councell is done by the Kings absolute power IVS. And by whose power is it done in Parliament but by the Kinges absolute power mistake it not my Lord The 3 estates doe but advise as the priuy Councel doth which advice if the king embrace it becomes the kings own acte in the one the kings law in the other for without the kings acceptation both the publicke priuate aduices bee but as empty egge-shels and what doth his Majestie loose if some of those things which concerns the poorer sort be made free