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A61556 The grand question, concerning the Bishops right to vote in Parliament in cases capital stated and argued, from the Parliament-rolls, and the history of former times : with an enquiry into their peerage, and the three estates in Parliament. Stillingfleet, Edward, 1635-1699. 1680 (1680) Wing S5594; ESTC R19869 81,456 194

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noble_n 77._o ut_fw-la episcopi_fw-la abbates_n comites_fw-la &_o potentiores_fw-la quique_fw-la si_fw-la causam_fw-la inter_fw-la se_fw-la habuerint_fw-la ac_fw-la se_fw-la pacificare_fw-la noluerint_fw-la ad_fw-la nostram_fw-la jubeantur_fw-la venire_fw-la praesentiam_fw-la neque_fw-la illorum_fw-la contentio_fw-la aliubi_fw-la judicetur_fw-la but_o in_o this_o court_n they_o challenge_v that_o as_o their_o privilege_n to_o be_v try_v by_o their_o peer_n who_o be_v call_v pares_fw-la curiae_fw-la 1434._o so_o the_o emperor_n sigismond_n in_o his_o protestation_n before_o the_o state_n of_o the_o empire_n cum_fw-la secundùm_fw-la juris_fw-la communis_fw-la dispositionem_fw-la nec_fw-la non_fw-la usum_fw-la morem_fw-la stylum_fw-la &_o consuetudinem_fw-la sacri_fw-la romani_fw-la imperii_fw-la feudalis_fw-la contentio_fw-la per_fw-la dominum_fw-la feudi_fw-la ac_fw-la pares_fw-la curiae_fw-la terminanda_fw-la sit_fw-la etc._n etc._n and_o again_o nisi_fw-la parium_n nostrae_fw-la 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not_o be_v do_v in_o that_o parliament_n i_o thus_o prove_v that_o parliament_n be_v call_v craft_n 428._o animarum_fw-la the_o king_n appoint_v another_o at_o london_n craft_n hilarii_n where_o the_o difference_n still_o continue_v he_o appoint_v a_o new_a parliament_n on_o the_o day_n of_o s._n peter_n ad_fw-la vincula_fw-la or_o lammas-day_n wherein_o he_o be_v reconcile_v to_o the_o archbishop_n and_o clergy_n then_o fealty_n be_v swear_v to_o his_o son_n before_o his_o go_v into_o flanders_n and_o the_o king_n excuse_v himself_o as_o to_o the_o great_a tax_n and_o subsidy_n on_o the_o account_n of_o his_o war_n while_o he_o be_v about_o winchelsea_n a_o remonstrance_n be_v send_v to_o he_o of_o the_o grievance_n of_o the_o nation_n in_o the_o name_n of_o the_o archbishop_n bishop_n earls_z baron_n and_o the_o whole_a commons_o of_o england_n wherein_o they_o complain_v of_o illegal_a tax_n and_o the_o breach_n of_o magna_fw-la charta_fw-la the_o king_n give_v a_o dilatory_a answer_n and_o pass_v over_o into_o flanders_n
they_o with_o go_v against_o the_o law_n or_o custom_n of_o parliament_n therein_o but_o the_o author_n of_o the_o letter_n say_v 30._o whatever_o be_v do_v this_o parliament_n signify_v nothing_o because_o the_o whole_a parliament_n stand_v repeal_v by_o 1_o h._n iu._n and_o all_o do_v in_o it_o delcare_v null_n and_o void_a yet_o to_o our_o comfort_n 79._o the_o same_o author_n tell_v we_o the_o three_o henry_n be_v usurper_n and_o therefore_o i_o desire_v to_o be_v satisfy_v whether_o a_o usurper_n by_o a_o parliament_n of_o his_o call_n can_v null_n and_o repeal_n what_o be_v do_v by_o a_o king_n and_o his_o parliament_n if_o he_o may_v than_o the_o king_n lose_v his_o title_n to_o the_o crown_n by_o the_o late_a usurper_n if_o not_o than_o the_o parliament_n 21_o r._n ii_o can_v not_o be_v repeal_v by_o that_o 1_o h._n iu._n if_o the_o author_n of_o the_o letter_n have_v consider_v this_o he_o be_v a_o person_n of_o too_o great_a judgement_n and_o loyalty_n to_o have_v mention_v more_o than_o once_o the_o repeal_n of_o that_o parliament_n 115._o by_o the_o subsequent_a parliament_n 1_o h._n iu._n from_o all_o this_o we_o see_v that_o by_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o whole_a parliament_n both_o 11_o r._n ii_o and_o 21_o r_o ii_o the_o bishop_n have_v a_o right_a to_o sit_v so_o far_o that_o judgement_n be_v reverse_v where_o they_o be_v not_o present_a and_o therefore_o all_o the_o pretence_n they_o can_v have_v for_o withdraw_a must_v be_v from_o the_o canon-law_n which_o although_o not_o sufficient_a to_o bind_v they_o if_o the_o matter_n have_v be_v contest_v yet_o it_o serve_v they_o for_o a_o very_a colourable_a pretence_n of_o absent_v themselves_o in_o such_o dangerous_a time_n as_o those_o of_o 11_o r._n ii_o here_o the_o author_n of_o the_o peerage_n and_o jurisdiction_n of_o the_o lord_n spiritual_a think_v he_o bring_v seasonable_a relief_n to_o the_o cause_n 19_o when_o he_o undertake_v to_o prove_v that_o the_o bishop_n withdraw_a be_v not_o mere_o on_o the_o account_n of_o the_o canon-law_n this_o i_o confess_v be_v home_o to_o the_o business_n if_o he_o can_v make_v it_o out_o 1._o he_o say_v there_o be_v a_o act_n of_o parliament_n before_o that_o do_v express_o prohibit_v they_o to_o excercise_n jurisdiction_n in_o those_o case_n this_o we_o utter_o deny_v and_o the_o constitution_n of_o clarendon_n to_o which_o he_o refer_v prove_v the_o contrary_a 2._o the_o bishop_n make_v bold_a with_o the_o canon_n when_o they_o think_v fit_a 20._o as_o 21_o r._n ii_o but_o how_o can_v they_o do_v that_o unless_o they_o have_v a_o parliamentary_a right_o to_o be_v present_a he_o say_v the_o constitute_v a_o proxy_n be_v as_o great_a a_o violation_n of_o the_o canon_n as_o be_v personal_o present_a and_o what_o then_o therefore_o the_o parliament_n will_v not_o have_v suffer_v they_o to_o do_v that_o if_o there_o have_v be_v a_o law_n to_o exclude_v they_o how_o do_v this_o prove_v that_o the_o bishop_n do_v not_o withdraw_v on_o the_o account_n of_o the_o canon_n two_o r._n ii_o because_o they_o make_v a_o proxy_n 21_o r._n two_o but_o why_o do_v they_o not_o appear_v personal_o if_o they_o have_v no_o regard_n to_o the_o canon_n when_o the_o receive_v their_o proxy_n show_v they_o have_v a_o legal_a right_o to_o appear_v but_o he_o grievous_o mistake_v the_o meaning_n of_o the_o canon_n of_o stephen_n langton_n in_o lyndwood_n when_o he_o interpret_v literas_fw-la pro_fw-la poena_fw-la sanquinis_fw-la instigenda_fw-la scribere_fw-la vel_fw-la dictare_fw-la against_o make_v of_o proxy_n which_o be_v only_o mean_v of_o give_v or_o write_v the_o sentence_n for_o execution_n 21._o 3._o he_o say_v they_o be_v exclude_v by_o ancient_a custom_n which_o by_o a_o very_a subtle_a way_n of_o reason_v he_o prove_v to_o have_v be_v part_n of_o the_o fundamental_a contract_n of_o the_o nation_n as_o he_o speak_v see_v then_o say_v he_o it_o be_v without_o doubt_n that_o there_o be_v such_o a_o custom_n that_o the_o prelate_n shall_v not_o exercise_v jurisdiction_n in_o capital_a case_n not_o so_o altogether_o without_o doubt_n unless_o it_o be_v better_o prove_v than_o we_o have_v yet_o see_v it_o and_o there_o be_v no_o record_n that_o do_v mention_v when_o it_o do_v begin_v nor_o any_o time_n when_o it_o can_v be_v say_v there_o never_o be_v such_o a_o usage_n yes_o before_o the_o council_n of_o toledo_n be_v publish_v in_o spain_n and_o receive_v here_o it_o must_v of_o necessity_n be_v suppose_v that_o it_o be_v as_o ancient_a as_o the_o government_n itself_o and_o part_n of_o the_o fundamental_a contract_n of_o the_o nation_n which_o look_v so_o like_o a_o jesuitical_a argument_n that_o one_o will_v have_v think_v he_o have_v be_v prove_v transubstantiation_n by_o it_o for_o just_a thus_o the_o argument_n run_v at_o this_o day_n among_o that_o party_n there_o be_v a_o time_n when_o it_o be_v receive_v and_o no_o time_n can_v be_v instance_a in_o wherein_o it_o be_v not_o therefore_o it_o be_v a_o part_n of_o the_o fundamental_a religion_n of_o jesus_n christ._n the_o plain_a answer_n in_o both_o case_n be_v the_o same_o if_o we_o can_v produce_v unquestionable_a authority_n to_o which_o a_o doctrine_n or_o practice_n be_v repugnant_a we_o be_v not_o oblige_v to_o assign_v any_o punctual_a time_n in_o which_o it_o must_v first_o come_v in_o but_o in_o this_o case_n we_o do_v assign_v the_o very_a time_n and_o occasion_n of_o the_o bishop_n absent_v themselves_o in_o capital_a judgement_n and_o that_o be_v from_o the_o receive_n the_o canon_n of_o the_o council_n of_o toledo_n here_o for_o no_o such_o practice_n can_v ever_o be_v prove_v before_o and_o therefore_o this_o can_v never_o be_v prove_v to_o be_v any_o part_n of_o the_o ancient_a common_a law_n of_o england_n and_o that_o this_o come_v in_o by_o way_n of_o imitation_n of_o other_o country_n appear_v by_o the_o cite_n the_o council_n of_o toledo_n both_o by_o lanfranc_n and_o richard_n in_o the_o council_n of_o winchester_n 23._o 4._o he_o say_v the_o practice_n be_v ancient_a than_o any_o of_o the_o canon_n of_o the_o church_n but_o how_o do_v that_o appear_v the_o elder_a canon_n he_o can_v find_v be_v that_o of_o stephen_n langton_n in_o lyndwood_n which_o be_v make_v above_o 50_o year_n after_o the_o parliament_n at_o clarendon_n but_o we_o have_v make_v it_o evident_a there_o be_v a_o canon_n receive_v here_o in_o lanfranc_n time_n long_o before_o the_o constitution_n of_o clarendon_n and_o so_o a_o full_a answer_n be_v give_v to_o these_o objection_n but_o we_o be_v tell_v by_o the_o author_n of_o the_o letter_n that_o the_o bishop_n protestation_n be_v receive_v and_o enter_v in_o the_o roll_n or_o journal-book_n make_v it_o to_o pass_v for_o a_o law_n it_o be_v agree_v to_o by_o the_o king_n and_o two_o house_n so_o as_o whatever_o be_v the_o law_n before_o if_o it_o be_v only_o the_o canon-law_n it_o be_v now_o come_v to_o be_v the_o law_n and_o rule_n of_o parliament_n and_o the_o law_n of_o the_o land_n 2._o this_o be_v therefore_o the_o second_o point_n to_o be_v examine_v whether_o the_o receive_v this_o protestation_n amount_v to_o a_o law_n of_o exclusion_n which_o it_o can_v by_o no_o mean_n do_v for_o these_o two_o reason_n 1._o from_o the_o nature_n of_o protestation_n in_o general_a 2._o from_o the_o particular_a nature_n of_o this_o protestation_n 1._o from_o the_o nature_n of_o protestation_n in_o general_n for_o a_o protestation_n be_v only_o a_o declaration_n of_o their_o mind_n that_o make_v it_o and_o not_o of_o they_o who_o receive_v it_o or_o suffer_v it_o to_o be_v enter_v in_o the_o act_n or_o record_n of_o the_o court_n unless_o it_o be_v receive_v in_o such_o a_o manner_n as_o imply_v their_o consent_n for_o the_o very_a next_o parliament_n after_o this_o 13_o r._n ii_o the_o two_o archbishop_n in_o the_o name_n of_o the_o whole_a clergy_n enter_v a_o protestation_n that_o they_o give_v no_o assent_n to_o any_o law_n or_o statute_n make_v in_o restraint_n of_o the_o pope_n authority_n and_o it_o be_v say_v in_o the_o roll_n of_o parliament_n that_o at_o their_o request_n these_o protestation_n be_v enroll_v will_v any_o man_n hence_o infer_v that_o these_o protestation_n be_v make_v act_n of_o parliament_n if_o the_o cause_n will_v have_v bear_v any_o better_a a_o person_n of_o so_o much_o skill_n in_o proceed_n of_o parliament_n will_v never_o have_v use_v such_o a_o argument_n as_o this_o beside_o it_o be_v a_o rule_n in_o protestation_n 24._o si_fw-la protestatio_fw-la in_o judicio_fw-la fiat_fw-la semper_fw-la per_fw-la contrarium_fw-la actum_fw-la tollitur_fw-la say_v hostiensis_n a_o protestation_n although_o allow_v in_o court_n be_v take_v off_o by_o a_o subsequent_a act_n contrary_a to_o it_o which_o show_v that_o a_o protestation_n can_v never_o have_v