Selected quad for the lemma: england_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
england_n	church_n	minister_n	ministry_n	3,814	5	8.8738	4	false

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A87825	A modest plea for private mens preaching. Or An answer to a booke intituled, Private men no pulpit men; composed by Master Giles Workman. Wherein the thing in controversie is briefly debated; the examination of private mens preaching examined; also certain accusations wip'd away and removed. / By John Knowles a preacher of the gospel, formerly in and neer Glocester, now belonging to the life-guard of his Excellency Sir Thomas Fairfax.	Knowles, John, fl. 1646-1668.	1648 (1648)	Wing K730; Thomason E434_8; ESTC R206223	32,543	41

calling be sufficient to make lawfull preachers then there are at Rome lawfull Church-officers in that both ours and theirs arise from the same fountain but at a further distance in that our first ordainers received from Rome their holy orders from whom by way of succession ordination hath descended even to this generation Thus you may easily see how obnoxious the doctrine I oppose is to the hearing of the Gospel Conseque 3 The third consequent which is of the same discent with those fore-going is That the Saints when there is no necessity must be restrained from enjoying the preaching of of the Gospel As if in case there may be first some-times in some places where Saints are a cessation of visible Churches Or secondly If where visible Churches are some Saints are not convinc'd of their order Or thirdly If they are in order and want Church-officers Or fourthly If their Officers be through sicknesse persecution c. absent from them in all which cases though they have amongst them persons of great abilities for Gospel-preaching yet they must be exposed at least to scarcity of the Word because none but Church-officers may lawfully preach I shal not farther increase the number of the children of the forementioned Father but shal leave it to the diligent searcher Thus I have done with the first sort of testimonies which are divine and shall now come to the second which are probable being humane testimonies which are either the speeches or practices of men that are godly Of the speeches of men that professedly speake with me that I may not overburthen this Booke I shall instance but in a few An Apol. of the exiles p. 45. 1. The english Christians who were Exiles in the low Countries witnesse to the truth of the doctrine heare pleaded for their fourth position being this That discreet faithfull and able men though not yet in office of ministry may preach the Gospel and whole truth of God c. 2. I shall bring in the Elders of the severall Churches of new-New-England speaking fully to my mind in this particular in their answer to the twenty seventh question sent over to them from certaine Ministers of Old England which I have not hear inserted for brevities sake but it may be found at large in a Book intituled Church Government and Church Covenant discussed p. 77. published by Master Peters De conscientiâ et ejus jure vel casibus p. 229. 3. You shall have the testimony of that learned man Doctor Ames whose workes praise him in the Gate Thus he speakes That for the preaching and teaching of the Gospel a singular calling is not required For proofe whereof he brings these Scriptures Acts 8.4 c. 11.19 21. c. 18.24 and adds to them these Reasons 1. Because this is the duty of all Christians that they Promote as much as they can the Kingdome of God and therefore that they teach others the doctrine of God 2. Because t is some time necessary that men be convinced of errors and instructed in truth before a calling can be rightly instituted 3. Because the People being some-times destitute of a Minister cannot without the losse of edification be holpen unlesse they allow those to instruct them who as yet are not rightly called to the ministry Further he affirmes That not only private but also publike preaching may be exercised without a singular calling first in a Church to be constituted Secondly in a Church already constituted with the approbation of that Church if confusion be avoided and order observed 1 Cor. 14.23 Acts 13.15 For it belongs saith he to the Churches edification that they who excell others in gifts exercise those gifts before others to help and stirr them up Also P. 245. he speakes to the same effect affirming 1. That there was in the primative Church a certain propheticall exercise distinct from sermons 1 Cor. 14.31.32 c. 2. That not only Ministers were permitted to use this exercise but also among the brethren the ch●efe and most expert for tho●e gifts which they had conferred to them ibid. 3. That it was also lawfull for other men of the Church for the sake of learning to propose their doubts that they might be taught of those who were more skilfull ibid. v. 35. 4. That where this exercise may conveniently be brought into Churches it ought not to be contemned 1 Thes 5.20 1. Because it is most agreeing to the order of the primative Church approved by the Apostles Secondly Because it singularly healpeth to stirre up cherish and increase spirituall gifts in severall Believers Thirdly Because it taketh away negligence and envy and nourisheth charity Thus far Amesius 4. Hear the judgement of M. Thomas Goodwin and M. Nye men of no small eminency their very enemies being Judges They in their Epistle to M. Cottons Booke of the Keyes of the Kingdome of Heaven thus speake Wee humbly conceive Prophesying as the Scripture tearmes or speaking to edification of the whole Church may sometime be performed by brethren gifted though not in office as the Elders 5. I might add to the number dear M. Burrowes M. Peters M. John Ellis junior with many others who affirme That men out of Office may preach the Gospel but I forbeare to cite their expressions having spoken enough of this particular Wherefore I come to the next sort of humane testimonies to wit godly mens practices carrying a kind of testimony with them what did the Martyrs of whom our Cronicles make a glorious relation who were not Church-officers lesse then preach publickly when they did before multitudes of people open and apply the Scriptures which men now call preaching If it may be said that the congregationall Churches both in Old and New England doe consist of believers men that are Godly then it may bee affirmed that Godly men out of Office doe preach the Gospel for private mens Preaching is not a rare practice amongst them Who is there acquainted with Godlinesse that dares call those ungodly who in the Army City and Country do Preach the Gospel though out of Office What if I should call writing in Divinity Preaching And so put the stile of Preachers upon those of the Layety who are writers in matters of Divinity I might then bring in Mr. Prynne and Doctor Bastwicke the one a Lawyer the other a Physitian both busie writers in matters of Divinity to justifie the practice of Private mens Preaching But if that liberty may be deny'd me yet I may boldly affirm that there is such a neernesse between the writing and Preaching of men out of Office that the Arguments which justifie the one will plead for the other Thus having dispatch the confirmation of the thing in controversie I shall returne briefe answers to some common Queries for somes satisfaction Quest 1 Whether men out of Office may be fitted for Gospel Preaching Answ Men may said Sir Richard Baker have Sacrae dotes though they are not Sacerdotes Abilities and holy

upon the Assumption False accusing both of opinions and persons is a crime too common Many things which are not absurd are branded for absurdities Many opinions and practises are accused with the bringing forth of monstrous births of absurdities which are as free from them as Christ was from iniquities But doth not the expounding of the word Gifts in Rom. 12. for abilities produce and bring forth many absurdities Surely there had been no need to wander farre for resolution in this particular if the Author of the Reason had been as good in proving as bold in affirming For absurdities saith he will follow such an Exposition which are in number two according to his reckoning The first is this following We may then proceed from abilities to the Exercise of other callings G. W. Pag. 3. for if ability to preach be sufficient to Authorize one to Preach without any more adoe then also ability to Baptize and to Rule and Governe is sufficient to Authorize any to Baptize and to take on them to Rule Governe and Judge as Rulers Magistrates and Judges doe c. Answ Three things are here affirmed which are clearly expressed or necessarily implyed I shall here declare them and declare something in Answer to each of them First He affirmes that it is unlawfull to proceed from abilities to the exercise of callings Secondly That he that Preacheth doth by Preaching enter into the calling of him who by Office is a preacher Thirdly That if it be lawfull from abilities without any more adoe to proceed to the Ministers calling then 't is lawfull from abilities to proceed to other callings as that of the Magistrate to Rule c. To the First of these I shall thus Answer First I dare not allow that speech to bee true without exception For there are some callings as the Husband-mans calling with some other into which a man having ability may lawfully enter and in them exercise himselfe from abilities only Secondly That if it be spoken with limitation it may be receiv'd for a truth without contradiction If it bee restrained to callings in the Church then I affirme that it is unlawfull for any man to proceed into the exercise of callings meerly from abilities because the Lord in his Word requires that unto qualifications for Offices Election and Ordination be annexed before the exercise of them in way of Office be undertaken Now to the Second of his affirmations which is this That hee that Preacheth doth enter into the calling of him who by Office is a Preacher This affirmation is false and absurd which may appeare by these two Reasons First Because a man may doe in some way some actions that belong to anothers calling and yet not intrench upon or enter into his calling Praising of God under the Law upon Musicall Instruments was the calling of some of the Levites Now did all not being Levites intrench upon their calling who did in the presence of others praise God upon Musicall Instruments Prayer is a worke that belongs to a Ministers calling Acts 6.4 Now doe all those that pray when a company is met together as their mouth unto God enter into the Ministers calling Is it not a worke of the Magistrate to judge betwixt persons in matters of civill difference Notwithstanding the Apostle bids the Corinthians to set those to judge who were not judges by Office 1 Cor. 6. But I hope the Apostle would not have them to intrench on the Magistrates calling Preaching of the Gospel is an Apostles worke Rom. 1.1 Doe all then that take upon them to be Preachers enter into the Apostles Office c. Every calling hath not all it's workes peculiar to it selfe Secondly Because Preaching is not a worke peculiar to a Minister that is 't is not a worke which none may lawfully doe save those who are in Office for to doe it I shall here propose some questions only The first part of this Treatise being a proof of this Reason to which I shall refer thee Christian Reader for thy further satisfaction Quest 1 Where in the Scripture hath God called Church Officers to preach and restrained others from the work Quest 2 Whether there be not at least a probability that preaching is not peculiar to a Minister seeing that many both godly and learned have affirm'd it Amongst many others here what one and in a Preface to a Sermon preached before the Parliament said The peculiar workes said he of the Ministery were the administration of the Sacraments and Discipline but as for preaching it is a more common worke c. Mr. John Ellis junior Epist The sole path to a sound peace The Elders of the Churches of New England tels us That the Act of praying and preaching is improperly called a Ministeriall worke c. Church-Government and Church-Covenant discussed pag. 78.76 I remember a saying that another hath to this purpose The Papists saith he and some ignorant Protestants would have no word of God sounded out by any but by their selected Clergie Whither they who doe affirme preaching to be a worke peculiar to Quest 3 Church-Officers 2 Chron. 19.20 doe not sin against the Generation of the Righteous Doe they not condemne Jehosaphat and others who taught and exhorted the People publiquely to believe God he being neither Priest nor Prophet If preaching be a worke peculiar to the Ministery who will justifie the Martyrs Nay who will not blame them rather May we not say to them O Martyres culpandi estis ye are blame-worthy for intrenching on the Ministers calling in that you being not Church-Officers did preach the Word a Company being met together for did you not Expound and apply the Scriptures informe and exhort the people Why suffered ye so many things in vaine Why was the enemy constrained to cut your Tongues to gagge and with balls of Iron to stop your mouthes to hinder you from preaching seeing God did not command you to it How may the Saints make use of their Gifts knowledge and Utterance Quest 4 for the building up of the Church and yet not preach Hebr. 4.12 c. 10.25 Or how may they be said to be Teachers of others and to exhort one another when they meet together and yet not preach To this Question mine Antagonist hath framed an answer pag. 6. but how far from the purpose let us a little consider He answers to a saying of mine which was this It is the duty of a Servant of God to use those gifts for the edifying of the Church which God hath given him for that end Which he grants to be true but not to my purpose but let us see how men may without preaching use their gifts of knowledge and utterance He will informe you pag. 7. that there are otherwaies of using gifts for the edifying of the Church besides preaching He tels us that Family governors and Parents must edifie their Children and Family and God gives them Gifts in Prayer and knowledge and for

that purpose But I pray what 's this to the purpose The speech was not of Families but of Churches But what if there bee none in the Family sit to be edified being not begotten how then may hee use his gifts of edifying He further tels us of another way more likely to be the way thus And Christians saith he must exhort and comfort G. W. Answ 4. and ●●●difie one another in Christian conference and discourse c. This is true that the Saints may and ought to doe so But to me 't is strange and no lesse than a riddle to affirme it lawfull for private persons to do so and yet unlawfull for them to preach as if there were such a vast difference between it and preaching T is my desire to plow with the Authors heifer that I may understand that his a●nigmatical affirmation What may they exhort comfort and edify one another when they are met together and yet not preach Oh strange expression Now to the third thing affirmed by mine Antagonist which is this Mr. W. That if it be lawfull from abilities to proceed to the Ministers calling then 't is lawfull from abilities to proceed to other mens callings as the Magistrate c. Answ First This is a strange kinde of reasoning if 't is lawful from abilities to proceed to one calling then 't is lawfull from abilities to proceed to any calling What rule is there delivered by either Aristotle Ramus or any other in their Logick to iustifie this kinde of arguing generals from particulars not of the same kinde What Reason may there be found to plead for that Assertion Let him that can shew Secondly If it were granted 't were not for his purpose for I have proved that he that preacheth doth not by preaching enter into the Ministers calling Thus the Answer to the first absurdity let us now cast our eies on the second G. W. If all that can may and must preach the Ministers Office were needlesse What need of Authority by Office to doe that which every one may and must doe without it c. Answ First That such an absurdity will follow so saith mine Antagonist But doth not the Scripture say so also Surely from his writing I cannot informe you for not so much as one Sic Dominus dixit may be found in it Wherefore if I should but barely deny what hee barely affirmes why might it not be sufficient Seeing that my Nay hath as much authority as his Yea in matters of this Nature Eph. 4.11 Secondly 'T is false else Paul will be found a man making opposition against Christs Institutions Hath not Christ ordained Pastors and Teachers 1 Cor. 14. men in Office for the Churches edification And did not Paul allow those to prophesie in the Church of Corinth who had the Gift but were not by Office Pastors or Teachers And so did not he approve of that which made the Office of Ministers uselesse For they publikely preach't in the Church for it's edification But if the preaching of men who are neither Pastors nor Teachers doe now make uselesse the Ministers calling then it could at that time have no better effects And so Paul must needs be an enemy to Christs ordinary Ministery Thirdly Private mens preaching is so far from making uselesse the Ministers calling that it doth not a little help it Heb. 5.11 For hereby their mouthes are opened to speake wisdome the deep things of Christ Jesus to the people The truths of God taught by the Officers are the more confirmed when others also beare witnesse to them Also the truths taught by the Officers are the better preserved for by the use of private mens gifts they are often occasionally mentioned The Officers are moreover comforted and incouraged by beholding Gods blessing upon their Ministery in that some grow so much that they grow up to bee Teachers of others The truth of this those know who are Officers in Congregationall Churches where there are such private preachers Thus much in answer to the Assumption which hath denyed liberty to the conclusion therefore the Exposition of the word Gifts in Rom. 12. for abilities only is not to be followed to passe as an Orthodox Truth Now I shall lead you on to the Second Scripture which as mine Antagonist conceives will not plead for private mens preaching The place afore mentioned is Acts 8.1 and 4. And at that time there was a great persecution against the Church which was at Jerusalem Vers 1. and they were all scattered abroad throughout the Regions of Judea and Samaria except the Apostles Therefore they that were scattered abroad went everywhere preaching the Word Vers 4. I shall here in speaking observe this method First I shall discover my deduction from it Secondly I shall answer to the reply of mine Antagonist For the First thus The thing thence concluded was that private persons having abilities may lawfully when a company is met together preach the Word in that those there mentioned did so preach they being for the generality private persons or no Church-Officers sith their practice being approved may be to us for a paterne That they were for the greatest part private persons is the thing in Question That they were so is mine opinion wherein I am neither alone nor without reason I am not alone for others thinke so with me The Elders of the Churches of New England were of the same minde this being their saying They that were scattered abroad by reason of the persecution that arose about Steven were not Church-Officers at least all of them for the Apostles who were their ●●●●e if not their only preaching Officers were not scattered abroad but remained still at Jerusalem c. 8. v. 1. and yet th●se men did so preach the word of the Lord Jesus c. so Dr. Ames with divers others Now the reasons that make me so to believe amongst other may be these following First Because it plainely tells us that the generality of the Church were scattered v. 1. Now the Scripture will not informe us that there were at that time any Teaching Officers save the Apostles and Reason will teach us that the greatest part could not be Officers Which scattered Christians without any exception are said Ans 4. to preach the word Secondly Because 〈◊〉 in such an Exposition no Scripture will be crossed neither will any bad consequence be thence produced c. I shall draw you now forwards to consider mine Antagonists answer wherein two things especially are endeavour'd by him First that they who preached were not private persons Secondly that if they were such yet we might not gather thence a Warrant for the preaching of private persons now To his Reply I shall Answer First more generally Secondly in a more particular manner For the generall thus First There is scarce a Scripture which lyes not under divers Interpretations And there may appear a probability of Truth in crosse Expositions Whence