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A41330 The questions between the conformist and nonconformist, truly stated, and briefly discussed Dr. Falkner, The friendly debate &c., examined and answered : together with a discourse about separation, and some animadversions upon Dr. Stillingfleet's book entituled, The unreasonableness of separation : observations upon Dr. Templers sermon preached at a visitation in Cambridge : a brief vindication of Mr. Stephen Marshal. Firmin, Giles, 1614-1697. 1681 (1681) Wing F962; ESTC R16085 105,802 120

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take a boy of eight years old and teach him to read with a grave tone a thing easily done and this boy shall be able to perform all your Ministerial Offices excepting Preaching which he may easily procure once a month and he at other times read but Homilies As did that Priest who was my Predecessor only one Minister for a short time between us that for fifty years could do no other but read his Book except one Sermon and that a strange one Yet he a Minister of the Church of England takes the maintenance and lets the people provide a Preacher at their charge he contributing something as that I suppose the Law would force him Mr. Falkner I see labours much in giving us an account of the practise of the Jewish Church and the Christian Church For the jewish-Jewish-Church whatever was their practise it will not reach the question But however how will Mr. Falkner give us infallible proof that the Jews in the purest time of their Church-state did compose Prayers and imposed them upon the Priests and Levites who were able to officiate without them If he prove not this which he is never able to do all that he hath writ about them signifies nothing to the proof of the question and all that labour is but lost For the Christian Church 1. Can Mr. Falkner give us an account infallibly of the practises of all the Churches after Christ for the first four Centuries are the Infallible records of them all come to our hands I thought we fell short abundantly of the records of all the Churches there might be many for ought he knows that used no Forms 2ly It is possible that he may find several Pastors or Bishops that did compose their own Forms But First Can he prove they used only those Forms and did vary at no time as was the practise of several of our old Divines that had their Forms of Prayer before Sermon but of their own composing and varied after Sermon according to the subject matter they had been Preaching upon So did improve that gift they had received from Christ before and after Sermon Secondly He must prove they Imposed these Forms of theirs upon other Ministers able to officiate without them and tyed them up to these syllables else he misses the question and his labour is but lost there too Neither of these hath Mr. Falkner proved The 23 Canon of the third Council of Carthage which some write was Anno 395 others 397 others 399 at which were 44 Bishops and good Austin amongst them thus ordered No man shall use those Forms of Prayer which he hath composed for himself till he hath communicated them to more able Brethren A Canon of a Council carries very much conviction with it what was the practise there abouts more than any thing Mr. Falkner hath produced By this it appears that the more able Brethren did not first Compose the Prayers of those who were less able 2ly Much less did they Impose them on those who were able and it may be more able than themselves Mr. Carre wrote more warily than Mr. Falkner who dares not venture beyond twelve hundred years This Canon interprets Tertullian's meaning to be against Forms better then Mr. Falkner How long after this the question arose about Ambrose and Gregories Liturgies and into what a corrupt state the Church was fallen when Imposition began Mr Falkner knows well For that instance which Mr. Falkner brings p. 107. to prove Forms to be in use from Constantine's composing of Forms of Prayer for his Soldiers Whence he thus argues It is not probable that Constantine the Emperour would have composed Godly Prayers for the use of his Soldiers if such Forms had not then been used in the Christian Church Let us see the Logick of this and how it proves the Question 1. Constantine composed Godly prayers for his Soldiers Ergo Some one Bishop or Bishops or Ministers composed prayers for Gospel-Ministers How does this follow Constantine did well and it may argue some did use Forms and who denies it But doth it follow that Ministers did tye up themselves to Forms I hope Ministers and Soldiers in a proper sense differ 2. Constantine did thus Ergo we may impose our Forms upon able Ministers How does this follow nor would Constantine impose his Forms upon his Soldiers able to pray without them Can Mr. Falkner prove it Once more Had there then been Common-prayers composed to which the Church did tye up her self would they not have composed one or two prayers for times of War they did not deserve the name of Common-prayers if that was omitted and if they had done it Constantine we all know bore such respect and honour to the Church that he would have used those prayers before his own not lay by them and compole others As our King now commandeth the Liturgy of this Church to be used in his Armies at Land and Sea there being prayers for War c. So that to me this instance of Mr. Falkner is rather against him To put an end to this first question How lawful a Directory for Worship and some Forms of Prayer composed for the help of young Ministers at their first coming into the Ministry * Thus they who composed the Liturgy for the French-Church in Francfort say Hae formulae serviunt tantum rudioribus nullius libertati praescribitur who it may be at first are not so able in all offices to express themselves in prayer 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 before a multitude of people how lawful yea how useful this may be I do not deny but for these Ministers to content themselves with these Forms and not labour to improve and increase their Talent I think it is sin against him who hath given gifts who requires gifts of all those whom he sends and to whom they must give an account how they improved and stirred up the gift he bestowed upon them never did Christ send that man into his work upon whom he did not bestow a gift of Prayer How far the Congregational Divines have allowed of Forms of Prayer for some Ministers may be seen in that acute and learned Divine Mr. Norton of New-England to which Book Mr. John Cotton Dr. Tho. Goodwin Mr. Nye and Mr. Simpson have prefixed their Epistles in a high commendation of the Book For other particular Offices I shall not follow Mr. Falkner Respon ad Apollon p. 137 c. for I had no aim at the Common-Prayer-Book more than other Forms but if the Imposing of Forms according to the question can be proved from Divine Writ I should yield to several things he labours to justifie only in Baptism there are four things I should desire satisfaction in and more must be said then Mr. Falkner hath yet spoken CHAP. II. WE come now to the second Question concerning Ceremonies Quest 2. That the Church hath power in circumstances of Divine Worship I have before easily yielded The
discerning it the mystery of iniquity wrought it is no fancy of mine but the Apostles express words The subtil serpent he wrought among the Churches under fair pretences in the second Century some addition made to Worship and Government of the Church in the third Century more in the fourth Century more so increased the Eclipse still under fair reasons till the Serpent had got the man of sin into his Throne and the Prediction fulfilled So hath the Churches coming out of the Eclipse been but gradual in Doctrine Government Worship by our worthy Reformers but as the evil spirit deceived then by Gods permission to bring about the Prophesie so the Spirit of Christ in the hearts of our first Reformers wrought powerfully and so doth the same Spirit still work and will work till the Church be quite out of her Eclipse and comes to be satisfied with the Soveraignty and Wisdom of Christ declared in the simplicity of the Gospel let men call it schism fanaticism or what they please But Sir you tell us of Mr. Ball Mr. Hildersham Mr. Giffard c. worthy men I grant they were so and honour them much and Nonconformists who condemned Separation from your Church and no more was imposed than in their time and this takes up a great part of your Book Sir while some excellent men at home conformed but groaned under the burden as I remember Mr. John Rogers of Dedham an eminent Saint though he did conform I never saw him wear a Surplice nor heard him use but a few prayers and those I think he said Memoriter not read them but this he would do in his Preaching draw his finger about his throat and say Let them take me and hang me up so they will but remove these stumbling-blocks out of the Church How many thousands of choice Christians plucked up their stakes here forsook their dear friends and native Country shut up themselves in Ships to whom a prison for the time had been more elegible went remote into a howling Wilderness there underwent great hardships water was their common drink and glad if they might have had but that which they had given at their doors here many of them and all this suffering was to avoid your Impositions and that they might dwell in the House of God and enjoy all things therein according to his own appointment But what cared your Church for this let Gods people groan at home suffer abroad they shall do it rather than your Church will part with a few trifles as your own Mr. Carre calls the ceremonies Sir is this the spirit of the true Spouse of Christ But as I said the same Spirit will work which acted those holy men till the Church be totally out of her Eclipse what ever those worthy men you mention have said But to speak more close I deny that the state of your Church now is the same it was then when these worthy men condemned Separation from it For 1. There are many thousands now in England who were never admitted into your Church were never members of it then they could not condemn these as Separatists from it This I have proved before from your Interpretation of the sign of the Cross It was not so in their time 2 The Liturgy and the Homilies were then brought in out of necessity because of the want of gifts now it is imposed in scorn and opposition of gifts By what some of your Arch-deacons have spoken in your Courts and others we can conclude no other than it was composed to bring over the Papists to your Church and for several years the Papists did frequent your Divine Service but now it was imposed with such words as in my next that it was made an engine to turn Protestants out of your Church A Member of that Parliament that made the Act for Vniformity visiting his Sister a Lady who told it me related to her what they were about she disliked their Act and told him I see then you are laying a snare in the gate Ay said he if we can find any way to catch the Rogues we will have them 3. Then they were not required to assent and consent c. but now it is imposed with these terms and I am confident that divers who have subscribed with these terms do but lye 4. 'T is true we have the same 39 Articles that was before and those Articles were assented to and assent required in that Church Rational Account p. 54 55. But now you have told the world that Bishop Bramhall gives the sense of the Church of England thus viz. She does not define any of these Questions as necessary to be believed c. Neither do we look upon them as Essentials of saving faith c. Neither do we oblige any man to believe them but only not to contradict them And this is the opinion of the Grandees in this your Church this would have been abhor'd before 5. As those 39 Articles were believed by that Clergy so they did defend them and Preached them but this Clergy can both print and preach against them I mean the great and sound Doctrines in them I do not say all of them I put the question to one of your Clergy and asked him in earnest what he thought of this Clergy as to the Doctrine of the Church of England contained in these Articles he answered me Divide them into three parts he thought two of the three were fallen from it 6. In that Church there were abundance of godly plain-hearted Ministers whose Religion was not confined to a Pulpit but walked among their people as became Ministers seeking the good of their souls I deny not but God hath some such now but for the generality of them I say nothing my self only I can tell you what others have said A learned and pious Divine so far a friend to Conformity that I doubt not but he hath subscribed he told me Though your Church would give him a Living he would not take it because he would not have such an occasion to bring him among your Clergy And discoursing with another of your Clergy whom for learning wit and piety I do honour about Mr. A's Book and his Dialect which you call uncomely writing said he Truly we have such a frothy vain Clergy gone off from that solidity and gravity that become Divine things that if Books come not out in this dress they will but scorn them but in that Book besides wit there is good matter Pridentem dicere verum c. This was his sense of Mr. A's Book But. Sir if such as these be thrust upon us must we own them for our Ministers What Sir will you deny the peoples power of Election which the Papists grant the people had till Charles the Great or till Lewis his Son about 830 years See I pray Pamelius his Annotations upon these words of Cyprian Epist 68. Quando ipsa plebs maxime habeat potestatem vel eligendi dignos
which have come to my hand but all were not written with the same Spirit As they came to hand so I perused them to see if I could find any thing to convince me And whereas there are five things imposed upon us 1. The Liturgy with stinted forms of prayer 2. Mystical Ceremonies 3. Subjection to such Episcopacy 4. Re-ordination 5. Renouncing the Covenant I applied my self to the three first Questions chiefly For if it can be proved that these are agreeable with and conformable to the Laws of God as the Friendly Debate and Dr. Templer would perswade their Readers then Re-ordination may be admitted and the Covenant renounced As to the two first Quest Mr. Carre was the first man I met with that argued for them after him I met with the Friendly Debate next with the Serious and compassionate Enquiry c. Dr. Goodman the Author as I hear Nemine contradicente but last of Mr. Falkner a man of an excellent spirit whom I shall honour and one that hath said more than all before Before he came forth I had drawn up my answer to all the former and was loth to throw away all I had done because I saw there were some things in these Authors which Mr. Falkner had not else I would wholly have attended him but where I saw they all agreed there I considered them conjunct where one had what the other had not there severally As to the third Quest something I found in a piece Entituled Samaritanism As to the Learned Dr. Stilling fleet by throwing down the Jus Divinum of any form of Church Government he prepared the way for our subjection to such Episcopacy if his principle be sound For the serious and compassionate Enquiry I found little in that piece as to our questions unless a man were so simple to take fine words for strong arguments and Rhetorick for Logick For his Discourse about schism I shall consider it in its place But the chief things I observed in him were his odious comparisons between the Conformist and Nonconformist begun at p. 21. and continued some pages His slighting that worthy Father blessed Austin the contempt he throws upon the Synod of Dort which I did never expect from the pen of a Son of the Church of England But I see this Church of England and the famons Church of England are not the same I need not say any thing there is an acute pen hath given him so full and solid an answer that I ver expect to read his Reply To what he saith pag. 3. That the Nonconformists blame the Doctrine of the Church viz. the 39 Articles are not so punctual in defining the five points debated at the Synod of Dort c. I think I may say I have been in the company of as many Nonconformists as that Author but I have not heard them blame the Articles therefore But this fault I have heard found and do find that we are commanded to affent to the 34 35 36. Articles with the same faith we do to the fundamental Articles of our Faith and Salvation therein contained I thought among the Confessions of Faith these 39 Articles were looked upon as the Confession of the Faith of the Church of England but I find it otherwise now for Dr. Stillingfleet in his defence of Bishop Laud p. 54. being pinched by the Jesuit who in this point is not answered tells us The Church of England makes no Articles of Faith but such as have the Testimony of the whole Christian world in all Ages acknowledged to be such by Rome it self And in other things she requires subscription to them not as Articles of Faith but inferiour truths which she expects a submission to in order to her peace and tranquility Afterwards p 82 104. He distinguisheth between the internal assent of the mind and the external act the Church doth not require the first but the latter To confirm his saying he quotes Archbishop Bramhall often expressing the sense of the Church of England as to her 39 Articles thus Neither doth the Church of England define any of these questions as necessary to be believed either necessitate medii vel praecepti which is much less but only bindeth her Sons for peace sake not to oppose them And in another place more fully We do not suffer any man to reject the 39 Articles of the Church of England at his pleasure neither do we look on them as essentials of saving Faith or Legacies of Christ and his Apostles but in a mean as pious opinions fitted for the preservation of unity neither do we oblige any man to believe them but only not to contradict them Thus the Archbishop And this is not his opinion alone but generally of the Grandees of this Church as an intelligent and sober Conformist tells me When I read these lines first I read them again and again to see if I were not mistaken they were so strange unto me at the first reading when I saw I was not mistaken I turned to the beginning to see who did License it and was amazed when I saw the name According to this Cerinthus Pelagius Arius Socinus Turks Jews yea Vaninus may all subscribe the Articles and be Sons of the Church of England if they can but keep their tongues from contradicting them though they do not believe one of them Though I am a Nonconformist yet I am such a friend to the Church of England as to her Doctrine that I abhor these lines and charge that Bishop Bramhall with doing wrong to the Church It seems when other Churches abroad read these 39 Articles as the Confession of the Faith of the Church of England and suppose we do believe them to be true they are grosly mistaken it may be we believe not one the Church do not oblige her Sons to it but only not to contradict them They are deluded the Church reproached and God is mocked Several things I could say to the disproving of this sense but to what worthy Dr. Stilling fleet hath said I should desire him to name that Book of publick authority to warrant what he saith 1. The Kings Declaration prefixed for the confirmation of them and with that I question not but the Bishops did agree * The Declaration expressed With the advice of so many of our Bishops c. makes no such distinction of superiour and inferiour Truths but speaking of all the 39 Articles jointly taken together thus declareth The Articles of the Church of England do contain the true Doctrine of the Church of England agreeable to Gods word c. requiring all our subjects to continue in the Vniform profession thereof Again requires all Clergy men to submit to every Article in the plain and full meaning thereof and shall not put their own sense and comment to be the meaning of the Article but shall take it in the literal and Grammatical sense Again doth not the fifth Canon say Whosoever shall hereafter affirm that
any of the 39 Articles are in any part superstitious or erroneous or such as he may not with a good conscience subscribe unto let him be Excommunicated ipso facto Lay these both together and how can we receive his Interpretation Besides doth the Church not care though her Sons be such gross Hypocrites Doth not Reason and Religion teach me first to try examine and to believe the thing to be lawful before I practise Whatever is not of faith is sin Rom. 14 23. I know two Conformists one is known to be a right Son the other is suspected neither of these do wear the Surplice the reason is the same for both neither Parish had provided one when they came to the Court the right Son hath nothing said to him though he did not practise the other was suspended Was it not the internal assent that the Court regarded it was that saved the true Son Are we not commanded unfeignedly to assent and consent to all things in the Common-Prayer Book in which are several Creeds and you tell us the Doctrine of your Thirty-nine Articles contained To conclude this Head of old he was esteemed a true Son of the Church of England who was tite to the 39 Articles subscribing to them in their Literal and Grammatical sense as the King required Now he is reputed the true Son of the Church who doth but submit to these three articles that respect the Ceremonies Rites Episcopacy c. let him for Doctrine be an Arminian Socinian Papist no matter how corrupt I would have lest Dr. Goodman or whoever it was that was the Author of the serious and compassionate Inquiry c. till I had come to his stating of the Questions but that I find him p. 67 69. giving one cause which he imputes to us worthy the taking notice of and the speaking to it here will save me a labour afterwards A great part of this Nation saith he having been leasened with Jewish superstition or Jewish Traditions hath thereby been indisposed to an uniform reception of the reformation of Religion held forth by this Church and thus doth charge us with Judaism quoting Cartwright Ainsworth and H. Broughton who were great Students in the Rabinical writings and they leavened us p. 68. This is very strange when as if he will please to read over Mr. Falkner he shall see how much he useth these Rabinical writings and Jewish customs to confirm the Liturgy and Forms of Prayer and the Rites and Ceremonies of this Church Yea Christ himself is not spared but he is made a Conformist to the Jewish customs different from the Law to prove our conformity Thus Scaliger and out of him Mr. Carre and Mr. Falkner That I was studying how to give answer to this head of argument in these men and this it seems is charged upon us To clear our selves then from this and to give answer to the other men I grant 1. That the Jews had many Rites Traditions and Customs of their own some of which the Holy Page od record But for their Oral Law Traditions c. they were not committed to writing till the reign of the Emperour Antoninus and not perfected till the year 219 after Christ saith Buxtorf Synag Jud. p. 52. some say more Now how shall we be infallibly certain that what Traditions they then wrote were exactly the same which they were in Christ his time above 200 years before in such a space of time how easily may things vary 2. We are infallibly certain that our Lord was an enemy to the Elders Traditions how then these should be brought in to prove the lawfulness of the things in question I know not How will you infallibly prove the Church of the Jews in the purest time did tye up it self to Forms of Prayer in publick administration which though it could be proved will not serve the turn as we shall see when the question comes to be stated 3. Suppose Christ used some actions at his Supper like to the Jews must he needs borrow them from the Jews to be conformable to them I hope he did not learn to bless and give thanks from them Homer and Hesiod some say lived before Isaiah or about his time Hesiod hath expressions very like that of Isaiah in the description of Tophet Analet Sacr. p. 425. Isa 30.33 as if the Heathen drew with the same pencil saith Doughtie But did Isaiah borrow from Hesiod the same Author instanceth in many things more and did the Penmen borrow or rather the spirit that inspired them from the Heathen Because Plato hath an expression something like to Paul's distinction of the outward and inward man must Paul needs borrow it out of Plato as Nerimbergius would have him Thus some have affirmed that John took up his Baptism from the Jews baptizing of Proselytes when others have shown that the Jews took it from John when Christ put the question Mat. 21.23 25. The Baptism of John whence was it from heaven or men Why did they not answer from the Elders Tradition it seems it was the counsel of God Luk. 7.30 whatever these men say and Joh. 1.33 He that sent me to Baptize Whence I shall desire that leave to lay by all these Quotations out of Scaliger Selden and other Rabinical men as signifying nothing to the Questions in hand We must have Scripture and Scripture reason in matters of God Here Dr. Goodman proves us to be guilty of Judaism telling his Reader p. 69 this is their grand Hypothesis That nothing is lawful in the service of God but what is expresly prescribed in Scripture Such an Hypothesis I never saw yet in any of our Nonconformists Books I will yield him more As 1. Not only express Scripture but necessary consequence from Scripture but then it must be necessary consequence 2. Where the Lord hath lest us only a General Rule and hath not tyed us op to Particulars let but the Particulars carry in them the nature of the General Rule as the species includes the essence of the Genus and we will yield them too Yet this Doctor can tell his Reader that this of express Scripture is the Characteristical Doctrine of that party and that we graft our Christianity upon the scock of Judaism Were the Jews tyed up to express Scripture in all they did about the Worship of God I think the Jews had as much liberty then as we have under the Gospel I shall give but one instance though I could more The Passover was a solemn Ordinance of God now in Exod. 12.8 there is a command given to eat it with bitter herbs 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 we supply the word herbs but the word is only bitterness or Res amarae The Chaldae Arabick and Samaritan keep the Hebrew word without any addition of herbs Here is only a General Rule given but what those bitter things should be whether herbs roots c. there is no determination Hence then I might go into
Therefore one Prelate but of ordinary mission commission and qualification that never converted one Church may be not one person in truth shall have power over many Elders and Congregations where he never Preached over so many that if he Preached every Lords-day he could not preach once in a year to them yea so many that if he Preached every day in the year he could not preach once in a year to them some Diocesses are so large This consequent from such an Antecedent my dull Intellect cannot reach I deny the Consequence What might be said I foresee and would have prevented it but I am in a Postscript and so can only touch things as I pass Arguments he fetches from three Topicks to prove the superiority of one single person over other Elders 1. From Reason p. 23. Though the Vniversal Church be built upon a Rock yet particular Churches are subject to Dilapidations c. Ergo. A. In matters belonging to the House of God I thought the will of him that built the House and is Lord over it should first have been consulted His will hath reason in it we are sure but for our reasons they will put no end to the debate for one thinks his reason is as good as another Quot capita tot sententiae It is Instituted worship we are upon depending upon the positive command of the Law giver But however I deny your consequence And that 1st Mr. Baxter Church-History gives sufficient proof From the woful experience the Church hath found of your Repairers these having been as great causes of the Dilapidations as any other That Bishops have been both great Schismaticks and Hereticks Bellarmine will tell you What woful work these have made in the Church of England in our time we do still remember but I will spare names let them alone in their graves Musculus not an English Nonconformist from the experience the Church had found of the mischiefs it suffered by these Repairers Musc loc Commun p. 195. sound out to prevent and heal Schism as Hierom tells us saith Had Hierom lived to these days to see how this counsel of setting up the Bishop above the Presbyter hath profited the Church he would have acknowledged it was not the counsel of the Holy Ghost to take away Schism as was pretended but the counsel of the Devil c. Thus he with much more he adds 2ly There are other means to repair without such Prelacy as experience hath proved in several Churches where Heresie and Schism have either been kept out or healed when crept in Profaneness suppressed better than ever it was in England by Prelacy 3ly That one Prelate is as subject to corruption in Doctrine and conversation as other Ministers and who shall repair him the Presbyters being inferior to him they must not be so sawcy that kind of Creature whom you call the Metropolitan is as subject to corruption as the other Prelate As to the proof you give p. 26 27. There is a greater probability of an union of judgments when all within a certain precinct lye under an obligation to be determined by the reason of one c. A. I thank you for this saith the now Pope Innocent this helps to strengthen my old worm-eaten Chair weak in the joints and ready to crack Heresie and Schism must be avoided in the Vniversal Church as well as in the Church in your Precinct but if the Bishops in your several Precincts differ in their Judgments about Heresie and Schism as they have done and will do now what more probable way for union of Judgments than to have them lye under an obligation to be determined by the reason of one and who should that one be but my self this is but the same reason that Bellarmine hath given for Pontifex Maximus 2ly In one Diocess are some hundreds of Elders all having the power of Jurisdiction ex aquo from Christ as the Learned Dr. Stillingfleet hath proved but however if this Doctor deny it among these there may be many as godly men of as solid reason and judgment as is this one Prelate yea it may be excel him in all and in years his Elder too yet all these must have their reasons and judgments subject to the determination of the reason of that one Prelate I shall not applaud him for a man of an accuminated Intellect that shall assert such an irrational Proposition 2. His second Topick is Gods Declaration for the perpetuity of Apostolical Government which was over other Elders and Congregations p. 28. Yea Sir this is of moment if you can carry it First Text Mat. 28.20 Teach baptize instruct all Nations to observe whatsoever was commanded them I pray add this And he commanded them to teach That one Prelate while the Church stands should have superior power over other Elders and Congregations then you do something Because you mention commands for Government name two or three Texts to stop the mouths of these Erastians But to the Text. It is not for nothing that our Lord while he mention Teaching Baptizing and under this the Lords Supper yet saith nothing of Government Surely he had a reason for it 2. I yield from the Apostles and other Elders Government recorded in the Scripture that Government belongs to the Eldership with the Erastians leave but from hence to infer that because the Apostles did exercise power over other Elders Ergo now one Prelate over other Elders I shall deny the Consequence For 1. you tell us p. 25. It 's true the Vnction whereby they were qualified for it was not of the vulgar composition But say I the Unction these Prelates have is but of the vulgar composition Hence to argue from extraordinary to ordinary is a kind of fallacy a kin to 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 They that exercise Government over other Governours as all Elders are had need be in Wisdom Learning Holiness and fitness for Government as Saul among his brethren higher by head and shoulders so were the Apostles and Evangelists above those Elders over whom they exercised Authority We find no such things amongst the men of the vulgar Vnction 2. Those Elders as well as the people were the Aposties Converts these being but newly brought home to the Faith well may their Fathers have power over them and cause enough to visit them the case is not so here 3ly When the Apostles come to deal with the ordinary Elders there is no intimation left of any such power of one Prelate over the rest You tell us p. 45. that Timothy was Ordained Bishop of Ephesus about the 13th year of Claudius I hope you will not force it from 1 Tim. 1.3 As I besought thee to abide still at Ephesus He must have an illuminated Intellect indeed who can force the ordination of a Bishop out of these words Besides certainly had he been Bishop there Paul need not have besought him to be resident there but however sure I am he must be
hereafter To conclude this If foundness of Doctrine purity of Worship and a conversation in some measure becoming the Gospel be any true notes of a Church of Christ then there have been and I know are such Churches where no Forms of Prayer are composed much less imposed upon the Ministry that it was but a bold assertion of him to say All Churches had them I find no more in Mr. Carre nor the Fr. Debat I see Mr. Falkner hath summed up five Reasons which have been used by others most of them His first The security of the Worship of God This we had before His second That needful comprehensive petitions for all common and ordinary spiritual and outward wants c. with fit Thanksgivings may not be omitted c. Ans Surely Sir he is but a mean Minister that cannot do this without a Book though I know there is a vast difference in gifts yet there is no true Minister but is able in some good measure to do this the different Congregations are to be considered some mens gifts may serve for some places well that will not for others His third That the affections and hearts of pions men may be more devont c. when they may consider before-hand what particular prayers they are to offer up Ans Who are further off from these and care less for them than your most truly pious men who walk most with God such as can pour out their souls before God in prayer I speak of private men in another manner than most of your Ministers can do how have I heard them complain of these as deading their spirits That truly Sir your argument from pious and religious hearts was quite beside the business they are your formal Christians who sooth up themselves in their outward performances that are the most devout at these But 2ly since I see you have twice quoted the Liber Ritualis in the Bohemian Churches on your side and against us let me give the Reader an account of it out of Comenius the same Author and Book which you quote When a Minister is ordained the Ritual-book is given to him so far you say true but then he goeth on which you conceal this Ritual-book the common people were not to see when the Minister died the Book was returned to the Elders again Not that the Ministers were bound up to those words and syllables in the Book saith Comenius but they were left free This is quite against you He goeth on By this means the hearers were made more attentive and greater admirers of the grace of God For to rehearse only Forms or things prescribed what will there be to excite attention Quite cross to you The reason why they suffer not the people to have these Books is that the people might not slight or despise them Had the people the Books as ours the Common-Prayer Book they would more observe whether the Minister read right c. saith Comenius Thus we see when we go from the Scriptures to Humane Reasons how Reasons clash against one another Comen in Annotat. ad Rat. Ord. Discipl Frat. Bohem. p. 100 101. who adds more that makes against you Something I may say as to the Walacrian Classis whose judgment * Thus in the Dutch Churches Minister preces vel dictante spiritu vel certa sibi proposita formula concipiet Har. Syno Belg. Cap. 11. Canon 21. Apollon p. 172. Comment on Exod. 28. Def. of B. Land pag. 102. you produce against us 't is true what you quore but withal if you please to read the latter end of the first Paragraph you will find them rejecting the ceremonies and forms of publick worship in England introduced in these latter times And in the second Paragraph condemning Forms of Prayer and publick worship though materially well disposed if imposed as absolutely necessary and essential parts of Divine Worship with a certain tyranny and violent command upon the consciences of men I could also quote Rivet whom you quote on your side for Ceremonies he mentions your Surplices in England which you retain ex reliquiis Papismi and saith if you do it in imitation of the Jews or for some mystical signification which you do then 't is not to be born saith he In his pious and learned Homily de Orig. errores grounded on the 2 Cor. 11.3 he saith Mens departing from the simplicity of Christ is the original of all error Christs wisdom is too low for men There you will find something more Dr. Stillingfleet according with him in this tells the Jesuit piously and truly If your Church had kept to the Primitive simplicity and moderation the occasion of most contreversies in the Christian world had been taken away I may say the same for England I will not deny but you may quote many against us But 1. I am of that Faith concerning Churches which the Church of England is concerning General Councils Act. 21. when General Councils are gathered together for so much as they be an assembly of men whereof all be not governed by the Spirit and Word of God they may err and sometimes have erred in things pertaining to God c. even good men may err We know but in part 2ly We have Churches if there be any true in the world that are against these things so that here is the Testimony of Churches against Churches 3ly The Holy Scriptures are the Rule of all Churches to which they ought all to conform Wherefore Constantine said right and as became a Christian in the Council of Nice Let us take our resolution of questions out of the Books that are Divinely inspired To be sure they do not err Mr. Falkner's fourth Reason From the difficult parts of Church-offices of Baptism and the Lords-Supper there a Form is needful c. Ans He that doth not understand the nature of those Ordinances and is not able to unfold them to his people is not fit to be a Minister Christ doth not send fools of his Errand he hath provided for those whom he sends Now if they do understand them and be found in the Doctrine of them which is best known by Confession of their Faith they may be able to compose prayers suitable to the Ordinances 2ly Or if such be composed for your Tyrenes when they first come into the work must they needs be continued when they are grown more able the ablest and oldest men in England must be tyed up to words and syllables as if they were still Novices 3ly Truly Sir you must not much boast of your Form in this Administration for the Parental-Covenant which is the only foundation of the administration of that Ordinance to Infants the God of Abraham and his seed this is not at all taken notice of in your Form Besides many other things which I shall not meddle with now for I do not aim at your Liturgy more than any other in my discourse 5. His last reason To be an evidence
Baptism and the Lords-Supper though there was some aptness in the Elements to signifie yet they did not actually signifie till the Ordination and Institution of Christ Such was the washing of the hands De Oratione and putting off the Cloak before Prayer in Tertullian's time which he charges with superstition Such was the girding of their garments about their loins by the Priests in France in Divine Worship Carang p. 150. Concerning which Pope Caelestinus the first wrote an Epistle to the Bishops in France charging the Priests with superstition telling them they might as well hold a burning light and a staff in their hands these having their mysteries and signification as clear as the other For as in the girding of the loins chastity so in the staff your Pastoral Government In the Light-candles the light of good works shining before men are held forth yet Caelestinus reproves them and charges superstition upon them I am sure then these deserve the same Things that signifie by civil custom as the vail did the Womans subjection 1 Cor. 11. in those times have no place in this question the vail was in use many years even among Heathens before Christ was incarnate 3ly These Ceremonies are ordained to signifie some spiritual duty we owe unto God 4ly They are means helps to our spiritual edification being very apt to stir up our minds to our duty 5ly Lastly they are appropriated to Divine Worship yea so that God shall have no worship if these be not admitted Out of this we may make a description of a Ceremony of the Church of England It is an outward sign ordained by men in the time of Divine worship to signifie some special grace or duty we owe to God unto the performance of which and our edification in so doing this outward sign is a mean by its special signification and aptness to stir up our dull minds Before I proceed I observe Mr. Falkner brings many quotations out of antiqutiy to strengthen his discourse about Ceremonies and with these many are taken but for my part I weigh them not at all they signifie nothing to me For the Spirit foretold Apoc. 17.1 there should be a great Whore c. That the Whore there mentioned is the Pontifician or Papal power now at Rome or thus Rome Chriftian not Rome Ethnick I am ready to prove it if Mr. The Whore got not into her Chair per saltum but gradually as the Churches grew more corrupt Falkner deny it That Whore then must be else the Prophecy must be false which cannot be But had all the Churches of Christ and that of Rome which was once a chaste Spouse kept close to the Rule of the Scriptures in VVorship Government and Doctrine it had been impossible for that VVhore ever to sit there Hence the wise God leaves Ministers to their own wisdom and they thought they acted very wisely when they added this and that in the worship of God and formed their Church-Government according to the civil and thus acting freely and wisely as they thought they brought about by degrees the Decree of God the VVhore is set in her Chair as freely as if God had no Decree about her nor reveal'd any Prophesie concerning her So that all Mr. Falkners and others quotations do but serve to shew us how the Churches acted to bring that Whore to her Chair and so sulfil the Prophesie suitable to what Bishop Downham said of Traditions See the Title page But though Mr. Falkner give us these Quotations is he or any man now able to give us a perfect account of the practise of All the Churches in those times some it may be many were far enough from these practises After Bartholomew-day our Church-doors being shut up for a long time I went to hear the Priest in the next Parish He I found was teaching those few that he had present before there used to be a great Congregation and grounding them in conformity and informed them that as God was pleased to institute significant Ceremonies in his Church so the Church thought it meet to appoint her Ceremonies When I heard this that Text Zach. 13.7 came into my mind where God speaking of Christ calls that man his Fellow Indeed for him who is God-man to be called Gods Fellow we can see a reason but how dirty sinful men come to be his Fellows in taking upon them to institute their Ceremonies in his Church because he had done so I could not understand the reason of this Bishop Davenant on Col. 2.20 speaks notably to this point it is too long to transcribe all The sum is this If you be free from the Rites that God did prescribe then are you free from the Traditions of men It is a most wicked thing they should impose this yoke upon you and you are most foolish to submit your necks to it For God would not have abolished the Ceremonial Law instituted by himself that a new one may be invented by men So he goeth on more fully than I transcribe though still he would have Ceremonies for Decency and Order But this is not the state of the Question for the Preface tells us other things wherefore these Ceremonies are invented and imposed Yet that of Decency will not serve the turn of which more presently But to return to that Priest who was thus instructing his people the truth of what he said and what is now in practise you may see in this Parallel 1st God takes things indifferent in their own nature and ordains them to signifie some spiritual grace or duty of man towards God This cannot be denied of seve ral Ceremonies under the Law 2ly God appropriates these to his own Worship the Priests must put off their garments when the Worship is ended 3ly Gods Ceremonies though they had some aptness to signifie yet did not actually signifie but by his Institution 4ly Gods Ceremonies though in their own nature Indifferent yet being commanded by God are now necessary 5ly Gods Ceremonies were so instituted that no Priest must dare to minister without them Exod. 28.43 6ly God punisheth the Priests and that severely if they observe not his Ceremonies Exod. 28.43 1st Man takes things indifferent in their own nature and ordains them to signifie some spiritual grace or duty of man which he ows to God 2ly Man appropriates his Religious Doctrinal Ceremonies to the Worship of God and there only used 3ly Man's Ceremonies though they had some apmess to signifie did not actually signifie but by his Institution 4ly Mans Ceremonies though in their own nature indifferent yet being commanded by humane Authority are now necessary This is their language 5ly Man's Ceremonies are so instituted that no Minister shall perform the Worship of God without them God shall have no Worship without mans Ceremonies 6ly Man punisheth the Ministers of the Gospel severely for not observing his Ceremonies Casting them out of the Lords work spoiling of their goods Imprisonments Excommunications
to have eat these meats they had sinned in their command nor were they bound to obey them with a doubtful conscience to hazard amnation by obedience to superiors is no good Divinity Yet Sir we do give obedience and will preach up obedience to Princes as much as any other only in the matters of God he is the superior and supreamest Nemini fit injuria cui praponitur Deus For your next Section pag. 442. where you labour to defend your Ceremonies though they have been abused in a corrupt way of worship in Popery As for this Section Mr. Falkner might have spared it for Humane Doctrinal Ceremonies to be annexed to Gods own Institutions we judg them sinful additions intrenching upon the Soveraignty and flighting of the wisdom of Christ though Rome had never known them as if the wise holy God could not have appointed more Doctrinal Ceremonies had he cared for them as well as foolish sinful man but since then these were and are still in the Popish worship and retained here when England threw off the Papal yoke I will consider what he hath said and but touch it briefly 1. Rome then as now it stands is that Whore described Apoc. 17.1 this I doubt not of this judgment were our English Bishops the most learned of them the Professors of Divinity in both Universities and generally of our pious and learned men in this Nation before our troubles began and also of foreign Divines Was it ever known that a chast Virgin as the Church should be to Christ 2 Cor. 11.2 would dress up her self with the reliques of a known Whore Come out of her my people Apoc. 18.4 this is not obedience to that call 2ly It seems very strange that when Gods own Institution came to be abused to Idolatry as the Brazen Serpent 2 King 18.4 that must now be broken in pieces and must a Humane Institution used in superstitious worship in an Idolatrous Church be yet retained in a Reformed Church I shall not write out his Argument at length 1st In Regeneration the bodies and souls once abused to the service of the Devil Lust Idols may yet find acceptance with God in serving of him Ans A strange argument for a learned man If so excellent a Creature as man made after the Image of God under a necessity of obedience to his Creator being fallen from God but by Gods rich mercy the Obedience Blood and Sacrifice of Immanuel and the renewing of the holy Ghost be accepted of God Then a paultry human Ceremony indifferent in its own nature and no necessity for the use if abused in an Idolatrous Church may yet be retained in a chast Church and the use of it acceptable to God This Logick I understand not Consequence denied I could enlarge my answer but will not 2d Arg. From single mersion and threefold mersion in baptizm A. Was the water so baptizing in water a Human Ceremony and Invention or Christs own Institution For dipping in the water or pouring of the water upon the person your Church allow both because the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifie both If any did dip thrice denying the Trinity of persons to be of the same essence that was their Heresie but if any did hold the Trinity of persons in the Unity of the essence and yet would dip thrice though I do not much like it yet I should not condemn them of Heresie the Text mentions nothing whether once or thrice But prove Baptizing in water to be mans invention 3ly The Christians lawfully used those fountains where the Gentiles drew water for their Sacrifices c. A. And why not did the Heathen and Julian make those Fountains or God make them for the use of Man and Beast shall therefore an Idolater deprive the Christians of those which God made for the use and necessity of Man and Beast What is sold in the shambles 1 Cor. 12.25 But this you are to prove if you will make an Argument of it that when the Idolaters had taken water out of those Fountains carried it to their Idol Temples made use of it in their Idol worship that then the Christians would take that water and baptize believers in it though yet there is more to be said for them than for your Ceremonies because to baptize in water was Christs Institution For the fountains Julian might have Dedicated the Land thereabouts to Idols and Devils as well as the Fountains and so the Christians should be afraid to sow Corn to maintain Life 4ly We meet in their Churches or places they built use their Bells Tenths for maintenance of Ministers Ergo. A. 1. For places 1st Place hath no moral signification as your Ceremonies 2. Place is necessary so not your Ceremonies 3. Those places were built for the worship of the true God and Christ though these blind Idolaters might also intend some Saint But if they had been built only for the worship of a Saint in imitation of the Heathens Demons we would not meet in them but done by them as Constantine did by the Idols Temples razed some to the ground and shut up others 2. Bells It seems you use them all the while you are reading Prayers and worshipping God in your Surplice the Bells are Chiming I thought the Bells had done when worship began 2. Something must be done to give notice to the people what time the worship of God begins so the Bell doth this day to morrow it calls the people to a meeting about Town-affairs 3. Bells have no moral signification in them as your Ceremonies 4. I believe few Bells in England but have been cast since the throwing off Popery to make them musical and none use them for that end No such musical tunes did I observe in Spain but a confused jangling in time of Thunder 3. Tenths Ministers maintenance have no moral signification nor annexed to Divine Worship The people tell you Tenths are Levitical not Popish Though by their savour twice we read of Tenths being paid to God before the Levitical Law But for maintenance poor Nonconformists are not concern'd in this argument 4 The Heathens lifted up their eyes when they worshipped their Idols their gods Sun Moon c. A. 1. Did the Heathen call a Convention and there decree That when men did worship God they should lift up their eyes to heaven as your Convocation appointed these or did Natures light teach them this gesture 2. Were the Heathens the first that in worshipping of Idols lifted up their eyes to heaven Did not Adam Abel and the Saints before the Flood and Noah Sem c. after it lift up their eyes in their worshipping of God If the Heathen will imitate the Church must the Church lay by duty because the Heathen worship Devils therefore we must not worship God 5 I dolatrous sacrifices were practised before the giving of the Law yet God continued and commanded saerifices after the Law A. Your Argument speaks thus much If the Devil will