haughtinesse of that faction is fittest to answere such scurrilous Puritans and so fit it seemed to me that if some had not thought otherwise I would also haue commended this Petition with the Articles and Interogatories annexed to their answering for such biting stuffe is to be answered by those that wil rebite againe First then I answere that the bookes which were written against Martin are more tolerable wittie then Martin although they were not allowed secondly that it is as absurd for Libellers to complayne of Libelling as dogges that byte of byting those that goe to warres in this sort must looke for blowes againe And lastly that not onely Martins madde deuises but also this Sycophantes writings are against lawe yea against common humanitie Quaere Put-case Quest 10. of Math. Sutcliffe who is alwayes carping at master Cartwrightes purchase why master Cartwright may not sell the Landes hee had from his father and buy other with the money as well as some of the Bishops who by Briberie Simonie Extortion Racking of Rent wasting of Wooddes and such like Stratagemes waxe riche and purchase great Lordships for their posteritie Seeing you aske of me this question Answere I take my selfe bound to answere you especially hauing vndertaken to answere many other questions as impertinent and bad as this Pleaseth it then master Put-case to vnderstand that I doe not carpe alway no nor once at master Cartwrights purchase Let him purchase and buy at pleasure I hinder him not I enuie him not Onely thus much I must tell him as I did once that Tho. Cartwright a man that hath more Landes of his owne in possession then any Bishop that I knowe and that fareth dayntily euery day and feedeth fayre and fatte and lyeth as soft as any tenderling of that broode and hath wonne much wealth in shorte time and will leaue more to his posteritie then any Bishop should crye out eyther of persecution or of excesse of Bishops liuings whose pouertie I might but I will not disclose Secondly that hee is a most happy man that with selling a cottage and so much ground as would scarse grase three goslings worth at the vttermost but twentie Nobles yeerely can purchase two or three hundred markes land and gladly would I learne that secrete Thirdly that seeing hee hath such authoritie with a packe of Sots that follow him that euery word of his should be deemed good lawe there is no reason why he should cōplayne of the superioritie that is in our gouernours and yet continue his bitter inuectiues against the State As long as he repenteth not himselfe of the wrong that hee hath offred to the church nor renounceth his fond conceits of discipline nor forbeareth to maintaine a confederacie to reuel against al such as are well affected to the State he must looke not onely to bee carped at but also to be launced if hee be not otherwise dealt withall If he keepe himselfe priuate and seeke not to aduaunce himselfe by pillage of the Church I for my part will let him alone neyther shall his Frierlike begging nor his couetous dealing with his Hospitall nor his disloyall dealing with his good friendes nor his Vsurie nor any other matters bee touched or carped at To the question therefore I answere that it is neyther lawfull for Tho. Cartwright nor for Bishoppes to waxe riche and purchase by Extortion and Briberie no nor Vsurie nor Friponnerie nor by any vnlawfull practise And therefore if hee knowe any Bishops that hee can charge with Simonie Briberie Extortion Racking of Rentes Wasting of woods c. let him name them I defende them not Onely thus much I say that for one whome hee can prooue guiltie among his aduersaries there will bee found twentie among his friendes most guilty viz. Pillers of the people Raueners of the poore and Spoylers of their countrey and among these certaine Quidammet companions liuing all by scraping of quilles that haue by force and fraude wonne great wealth besides other Pettifoggers and parasites that haue purchased more then any bishop in England and yet not so much as this Putcase for he may percase purchase to himselfe a gibbet for reuelling at lawes and gouernours at least hee may purchase shame for abusing men of honour so shamefully Quaere Putcase Quest 11. whether the Bishops that affirme it is vnlawfull to giue Liuings appoynted to Ministers to Lay men and Doctor Bridges affirming that a Priest is Lord of her Maiestie or Doctor Bancroft that affirmeth her Maiestie to be a Petit-Pope do not diffame her Maiestie and be not therefore Felons Answere The slaunderous and shamelesse reportes and opinions of the Puritans concerning the thinges touched in this question I haue refelled before Nowe it will bee sufficient to say that this Sycophant belyeth these good men and if hee bee not therefore a Felon yet is hee a lying companion and vnlesse hee vse the matter better hee will neyther cleare himselfe of Felony nor Treason For he and his companions are most guilty in those crimes which he would impute to others They teach that things once 1 Complaynt of the comminaltie c. 6. consecrate to God for the seruice of the church belong to him for euer Appropriations the spoyle of Abbey lands they call 2 Admonit p. 33. sacriledge Vnto the reuenues of the church they challenge immunitie impositions laid vpon them they call 3 Eccles disciple p. 87. impietie barbarisme Martin saith that they which challenge ecclesiasticall superioritie such as the Queene hath are Petie-Popes all of them doe teach that Princes are subiect to the iurisdiction of the Consistory which things how they may be taught by good subiects I do think our platformers wil take some large time to declare Quaere whether those that say Put-case Quaest 12. the oath of supremacie importeth that her Maiestie may deuise what gouernment she pleaseth be not malicious persons and those that yeelde to the oath with the exposition good subiectes Who be malicious persons Answere and who be good or disloyall subiects appeareth in part by this treatise but especially by the disloyall and malicious treatises and practises of Puritans and therefore this is a vayne and doltish question The Iniunctions surmisse those to bee malicious which thinke that a Popedome is attributed to her Maiestie by the worde of supremacie such are the Papistes and the Puritan hypocrites for both doe holde that we doe and may aswell giue vnto her authoritie to preach minister the sacraments as the poynts of her supremacie The law reputeth none for good subiects but those that acknowledge the seueral points of her Maiesties supremacy as power to make ecclesiasticall lawes to appoynt ecclesiasticall Commissioners so forth which the Puritans denie and therefore by lawe and the Iniunctions they are reputed malicious persons That any man did say her Maiestie might simply doe as shee list in gouernment of the church is not
and which he hath set downe in malitious Articles and interrogatories shall be answered neither doe I meane therein to omit any speach that shall seeme any way pertinent to purpose being loth he should say he was not answered Wherein if you see no colour or shew of reason for this newfound platformes or proofe of his accusation consider then I pray you first what indignitie hath ben offered by this libellor to the Church of God to her Maiestie and her lawes to the Ecclesiasticall state and such as liue in obedience of lawes and secondly what they deserue that haue offered this indignitie vnto so many and honorable persons and brought this scandale into the Church of God the common 1 Rescius iâ— ministromach aduersarie maketh profite of those shameles slaunders which those vnciuil and vnlettered authors of the Admonition haue vttered against the Church the aduersarie triumpheth to see this contention disordered companions take occasion of contumacie and rebellion when will the gouernors vse like diligence to represse them If then you loue religion her Maiestie and the state you will not suffer such notorious reuellors at lawes and gouernors if you be desirous of trueth you will no more be abused with vaine gloses H. Nicholas hath painted his booke with quotations as full as T.C. he vseth the same stile and seemeth to haue the same erronious spirit He saith as well as T.C. that for Sions sake 2 In euangel regni he will not holde his peace and yet nether of both speaketh to purpose nor to the edifying but rather the pulling downe of Gods Church and therefore seing both the authors and their dealings haue bene tried let them be both dealt with all and esteemed according to their deserts It may be these felowes looked for answere of her Maiestie and to say sooth the Magistrate were most fitte to shape aunsweres for such disordered petitions but in the meane while it may please them to accept of my answere they are no such high persons but meaner men then her Maiestie may answere them reason it is seing they put their petition in print they should also receiue a printed answere and seing they chalenge me they should heare my answere And let them not thinke but that howsoeuer their malice is repressed by lawe their fond assertions and cauils shal be refuted by reason That trueth may appeare I haue done my endeuour God is my witnesse I seeke for nothing but trueth and peace there rosteth then nothing but that trueth be embraced and lawe maintained for little auaileth it to knowe either if by faction mutinie lawes may be broken trueth oppressed to make trueth and Iustice knowen it belonged to vs to defend the same belongeth to Magistrates to wish the same to all reade therefore and iudge and seeke the maintenance of Iustice and trueth without which neither Church nor state can be well gouerned AN ANSWERE TO A CERtaine calumnious Petition and also to certaine Articles and Questions of the Consistorian faction CAP. I. Wherein is declared that the authoritie and state of Bishops as it is vsed in England is lawfull and the Petitioners cauils brought to the contrary answered ALmightie God when he gaue Magistrates and Lawes vnto his Church appoynted first and next vnder the soueraigne Magistrate one high Priest to haue the 1 Deut. 17. leuit 13. exod 28. nom 3. 4. superintendence of the affaires of the church and vnder him 2 1. Chron. 24. 25. diuers heads of their diuisions that things might be done in order And lest wee might suppose that this was but a ceremoniall constitution vnder the Law of nature the chieftie of the Priesthoode ouer all his was first in Noe then in Sem then in Abraham then in Isac and Iacob afterward in the 12 Patriarkes which for many yeres gouerned their whole families both in matters diuine and humane If equalitie of ministers had bene so profitable no doubt God would haue vsed that order in his Church The Lawe ceremoniall ceasing our Sauiour ruled his Church as soueraigne Bishop of our soules he adioyned no fellowe aldermen to himselfe Departing this worlde he gaue commission to his disciples within those places where they remayned to gouerne the church So we reade that they did excommunicate alone that they did ordeine ministers alone yea and did by superiour authoritie order both the affayres and goods of the church Paul did excommunicate 3 1. Timoth. 1. Alexander and Hymenaeus Peter as Beza confesseth by the swoorde of excommunication strooke Ananias and Saphyra alone Beza aduers Erast Paul ordeined Timothy and Titus and Timothy and Titus ordeined other ministers The Apostle Paul prescribeth orders and lawes to Timothy and Titus and their churches the populer gouernement which our platformers commend was not so much as in time of persecution vsed This was the practise of the Apostles successors likewise Saint Iohn writeth to the bishop of Ephesus to the bishop of Smyrna and likewise to the seuerall Bishoppes of other Churches to them hee giueth directions them he reprehendeth for bearing with the wicked which if they had had no authoritie aboue other Ministers had bene very vnfitting All Ecclesiasticall stories writing of that argument giue witnesse that seuerall Bishops succeeded the Apostles at Rome Constantinople Alexandria Ierusalem Antioche other famous Churches Saint Ierome and diuers other ancient writers testifie that Marke ruled Alexandria as Bishop which happened in Saint Iohns time All counsels giue preheminence to Bishops ouer other Ministers and to the counsels the fathers subscribe by infinite testimonies whereof it may appeare that excommunication ordination and the gouernement of the Church next vnder the prince did belong to Bishops the wordes I haue set downe heretofore in my English booke written against this counterfeite newe discipline Saint Ierome hath a most pregnant place for excommunication Ieronym aduers vigilant where hee wondereth that no one Bishop could bee found to excommunicate Vigilantius and if all the gouernement of the Church was committed to Bishops no doubt but that they disposed of these matters also When in our times religion began to be reformed the chiefe learned men that then liued and tooke paines therein In histor Apologia confess August protested in their publike writinges to the entent that all posteritie should knowe it that if Bishops would embrace religion they would most willingly submit themselues to their episcopall iurisdiction accompting in most godly and expedient for the Church Melancthon vseth many speeches to that purpose fearing that if the authoritie of bishops were reiected a greater tyranny would succede and Caluine likewise to Sadolete protesteth that he misliketh not Episcopal authoritie Neither can any thing bee deuised more absurd then that equalitie of ministers which is brought in to ouerthrow Bishoppes for no gouernement can be without superioritie neither can any thing bee well ordered where there is no speciall care in some one it
perceiue we shall haue a new booke of counsels to frame a new consistory withall to put the blame from himselfe he putteth it on Illyricus as true a quoter of textes almost as euer was Th. Cartwr his scholler but suppose that which 1 Catal. test veritat pag. 121. Illyricus hath of this counsell were true yet can not the wordes of the counsell be interpreted against bishops for suppose that a bishop may not be a King or Prince and that the callings be distinct yet may hee haue episcopall iurisdiction against which that counsell is alledged To helpe his aray of counsels hee bringeth in a supply of Fathers but very vnlike it is that they should speake against counsels being diuers of them chiefe doers in diuers counsels and therefore let him take heede least while hee mustereth the names of Fathers against bishops the men themselues doe not all fight against him That Cyprian is contrary to his allegation it is notorious for he establisheth the dignitie of bishops and vtterly ruinateth the cause of the new come gentlemen called Church-aldermen Hee subiecteth the whole 2 Lib. 1. ep 3. brotherhoode to the bishop and sayth that the same obedience is according to the commaundements of God The same authoritie is confirmed by the letters of the clergie of Rome to Cyprian Post Fabiani 3 Lib. 2. ep 7. excessum say they non est constitutus à nobis episcopus qui omnia ista moderetur He giueth to bishops the 4 Lib. 3. ep 9. succession of the Apostles and from no 5 Lib. 4. ep 9. lib. 1. ep 3. other roote doeth hee suppose heresies and schismes to spring then from contempt of the authoritie of Bishoppes So shamelesse is this Libeller to alledge Cyprian against bishops that in the places aboue named yea and in the 6 Lib. 3. ep 10. places by him quoted doth confirme their authoritie For albeit Cyprian doeth say that from his first entrance into his charge hee had determined to doe nothing but by the consent of the people and counsell of his Clergie yet doeth it not make against his superioritie nay it confirmeth it rather For with vs Bishops may doe nothing without lawe which is a most certaine consent nay good Princes rule by counsell and Lawes and yet they will not denie but that Princes in all places and Bishops with vs haue a superiour aucthoritie ouer those that are committed to them And Cyprian in that selfe same Epistle writing to the priestes and Deacons vseth these woordes I 1 Hortor mando exhorte and commaund yea further hee prescribed what was to bee done both concerning the poore and confessors and 2 Vice mea fungamini circagerenda quae religiosa administratio deposcit made a deputation to others that were to gouerne in his absence as much or rather more then bishops may with vs take vpon them to doe Likewise in the 14 Epistle of his thirde booke alledged also against bishops there are found manifest argumentes for their authoritie For hee reprehendeth the presumption of certaine Ministers too rash in reconciling those that had fallen and declareth vnto them that the Bishop is 3 Ep. 14. episcopus ipsis praepositus set ouer them and that their place is vnder the bishop of which 4 Loci sui immemores they were vnmindfull that the bishops duetie was to 5 Vt instructi à praepositis faciant omnia instruct them and their dutie to obey him It is euident that this author was not much acquainted with Cyprian that alledgeth him thus cōtrary to his meaning which is most childish and absurd quoteth the 27 epistle of Cyprians 3 booke where there are onely 15 epistles there In 6 Lib. 1. ep 9. another place Cyprian reprehendeth a certaine minister being apointed gardein to orphans executor of a testament but how the same may be drawen to make against the estate of bishops I vnderstand not for bishops among vs desire no such matter as that which Cyprian cōdemneth neither came it euer in Cyprians meaning to condemne the authoritie of Bishops as it is vsed in this Realme If hee speake against any it is especially against T. C. for albeit he be a Minister as he sayth himselfe yet refused he not the execution of his brother Stubbes his will no nor refuseth the gouernment of his Hospitall and therefore this fellowe seemeth vnwise thus deepely to lanch his deare brother T.C. whose purchases and purloynings hee hath taken on him to defend where in the meane while the state of Bishops for any thing Cyprian sayth standeth inviolable nay in the same place their iurisdiction is confirmed for Cyprian being a Bishop taketh on him to reforme Ministers and giueth bishops 1 Episcopi antecessores nostri censuerunt c. sacerdotum decretum authoritie to make ecclesiasticall lawes which pearceth the Church-aldermen that long for superioritie to the very heart Finally he taketh on him to punish disorders then which authoritie what can be greater 2 Dist 10. c. quoniā idem Gratian also extolleth Bishops aboue Princes so farre is hee from speaking against Bishoppes or their authoritie so that to alledge Gratian for proofe is as much as to vse corrosiues for pleasant medicines Neither doth it take away or diminish the authoritie and state of Bishoppes that by the Canons they may not encroche vpon the Princes authoritie in Ciuill causes for wee say that the vocation of Magistracie and ministerie is distinct and that Bishoppes in England doe not in respect they are ministers meddle with Ciuil causes but as they are subiects and are commanded Wherein they doe not shewe themselues busie in encrochments in taking on them charges imposed but shoulde shewe themselues disloyall persons at least no good subiects if they shoulde refuse them the consistoriall faction contrariwise doeth encroche both vpon Ecclesiasticall and Ciuill gouernours hauing authoritie from neither and intrude themselues where no man sendeth for them or admitteth them After Cyprian Tertullians 3 De ieiunio booke of fasting is by force drawen in by the imperious Consistorials for euidence against Bishops which I cannot but wonder at seeing they condemne both fasting in Lent other fasts which he alloweth and the degree state of bishops which he commendeth in his booke 1 Lib. de baptism of baptisme where hee giueth the chiefetie and praerogatiue of Priesthoode to Bishoppes expelling out the impudent Aldermen that nowe are crept in I knowe not by what strange concetie into Churchgouerment In the booke of fasting there is not so much as the office of bishoppes mentioned much lesse any speach against them there is order taken for their allowance which the sacrilegious consistorials that haue ruinated the Church in all places where they come doe denie them In the same place Tertullian doth construe the place 1. Timoth. 5.17 against these men for hee onely vnderstandeth by Elders that rule
well Bishops and Priestes and not these newe Aldermen which albeit they bee mute in pulpits yet are they mouthy inough in Consistories The opinion of Augustine concerning the estate of bishops is sufficiently knowen for hee thrusteth them among heretickes that deny their superioritie In which croude let this Libeller and his fellowe T. C. goe packe out of the Church together with Aerius their ringleader and an olde master of an hospitall and a famous hereticke himselfe was also a bishop and gouerned his clergie and church with as great power as nowe doe our byshops neither doeth he in eyther of the places 2 De opere monach c. 16. de ciuit der lib. 19. c. 19. quoted say any thing against them Hee condemneth not the state of bishops but their worldlinesse and not the dignitie of bishops but such as sought honour and would not endure labour which negligence wee doe not defend in any neither was hee so scrupulous in distinguishing ciuill and ecclesiastiall causes as these seeme to be for in his booke de opere Monachorum alledged by this Petitioner he doth declare that hee dealt himselfe in ciuill causes notwithstanding he was a bishop and that he hoped God woulde reward him for it Neither is there in 3 In Tit. ad Ocean Hieroms whole workes any worde sounding to the disgrace of bishoppes Hierome maketh the termes of Bishops and Priestes common in the Apostles time but that bishops and priestes should nowe be equall in power and dignitie hee neuer concluded nay hee saith that the superioritie of bishops is an Apostolicall 1 Ep. 85. tradition and borrowed of the analogie betwixt the Lawe and the Gospell and confesseth that it began in the Apostles time accordingly hee vseth Damasus Bishop of Rome and all bishops with great respect The authoritie and credite of Ambrose both with the Emperour and people and his iurisdiction in ecclesiasticall causes was farre greater then that which our Bishops haue Is it then thinke you likely that a bishop woulde speake against Bishops nay he is sayde himselfe to haue exercised the Church censures against the Emperour and giueth ordination to Bishops and calleth them the Apostles successors The place of Ambrose commonly alledged 2 Ep. 33. against Bishops ciuill iurisdiction maketh nothing against the state of Bishops for in England no Bishop hath ciuill iurisdiction as hee is a Bishop but as hee hath it by commission which to refuse were not onely a weakening but a deniall of loyaltie neither doth Ambrose forbid any to take ciuill iurisdiction but to followe worldly cares and to giue ouer their ministerie and as diuers of this faction haue done to throwe off the robes of the ministerie and to runne in their lether Ierkins after worldly gaine and pleasure That Ambrose esteemed highly the office of bishops is apparant for hee 3 In eph 4. saith that those that are nowe called bishops succeede in the charge and place of gouernment of the Apostles Chrysostome taketh to himselfe the power of excommunication yeeldeth to bishops the power of ordeining 4 In 1. Tim 4. epist Paul ad Philip. homil ad pop Antioch ministers ouer whom he giueth them authoritie himselfe was a bishop of great power and authoritie hee condemneth certaine heretikes which would not yeelde the due titles to bishops but called them onely 5 In Psal 13. reuerentia tua dignitas tua and such like termes condemned by Chrysostome reuerend and worshipfull euen like to the platformers what shame then haue these fellowes that blush not to make either so holy a bishop contrary to himselfe or manifestly to belye him and slaunder him wherefore let the words of Chrysostem against bishops be brought forth if hee bring them not Hom. 2. in epist ad Phil. euery man will take him for a plaine false coyner of authorities which nowe is in part apparant he saith that the names of bishops and priests were all one but that all bishops and priests should haue equall authoritie he saith not nor euer thought That Gregory the great is alledged against bishops is a matter most miraculous for in his time the bishoppes of Rome were come to extraordinarie greatnes incroched not only vpon their neighbors but also vpō most christian Churches so far was he frō condēning the state of bishops in the preface to his dialogues if they be his as is most vnlike he reprehendeth those that waxed old in worldly desires which neither in bishops nor other is to be alowed against episcopal authoritie he saith nothing the power of bishops ouer priests euery wherein his epistles he commendeth The quotation out of Hillary maketh nothing to the purpole hee reprehendeth Constantius the Emperor for aduancing bishops aboue the degree of bishops but that maketh for bishops and not against them for hee disaloweth not the state but the Emperors too much forwardnesse in giuing Arrian bishops too much honour and credite The Libeller hath a strange sight in 1 Ep. 67. Synesius if he thinke that he spake any thing against bishops percase he had on his 2 Those dreames that passe through horny doores as Homer feigneth are vntrue for horne is not trans parent horne spectacles when hee read them without such sight nothing is to be found in Synesius against our cause If he would haue made any conclusion out of him he would haue acknowledged so much him selfe He alledgeth with like iudgment Nazianzen his oration aduersus Maximum yet in all his works is there not any such oration found there is an oration of such matters as Gregory did against Maximus but concerning the superioritie of bishops there is nothing therein least of all any thing against bishops neither is it like he would speake against bishops himself being a bishop alowing the state of bishops he gouerned with authoritie his 1 Cum auctoritate hic praesidemus haec multis ex vobis tamquam lege sancimus Nazianz. in orat de modest in disputat seruanda words were obserued as lawes in the church he saith 2 Ibidem there is order while bishops commaund and others are ruled of such as these felowes are that wil neither obserue order nor rule he complaineth and commendeth that which they despise only he speaketh against ambitious seeking the greatest bishopricks and highest places wishing that the principality should be remoued rather then such incōueniences admitted Origene 3 In Esaiam hom 6. giueth most ample titles authority to bishops euen in the same place where he is supposed to speake against thē onely he would not haue them insult nor tyrannise ouer the people which the bishops of England neither doe nor can doe according to lawes but the Aldemen of the consistorie whose word is proofe and will law and against whose wrongs there is no sufficient remedie by appeale they do properly tyrannife yea oligarchize and therefore against such cruell tyrants Origen declaymeth and we
haue good cause to speake Bernarde 4 De consid ad Eugen. lib. 2. speaketh against the Pope for clayming soueraintie in both swordes which no bishop in England claymeth neither doth any bishop by his episcopall authoritie exercise the materiall swordes as the Pope doeth and therefore as Bernards reasons are good against the Pope so are they not to be vsed against our bishops neither was it euer Bernards meaning to condemne the prerogatiue of bishops allowing the same in so many of his epistles and writings and commending so highly the bishop of Rome notwithstanding his infinite abuses he 5 Serm. 66. in Cantic non est mirum si ordinibus ecclesie deirahunt si mandatis non obediunt bitterly inueigheth against those heretickes which for their apish imitation of the Apostles called themselues Apostolickes because they condemned prelacy and therefore calleth them Stultissimos obstinatissimos Thus the man or at least his partakers haue sought euery corner of the Fathers and yet finde nothing against the prerogatiue of bishops therfore is hee glad to flye to the practise of late churches late writers but the conclusion which he draweth from them is most weake for admit that in Geneua in France Flaunders and other churches they haue not bishops of such quality in all respects as wee haue no more haue other churches such Elders as they of Geneua haue it is sufficient that we haue such bishops as in time past they had at Ierusalem Constantinople Alexandria Antioch Carthage Seuil throughout the world before that the cornercreeping Aldermē crept out of the slime of fond mens inuention that the bishops in reformed churches of Almayne haue episcopal authoritie ouer other ministers in ordination of ministers correction of maners so that they are to be blamed that digresse from all antiquitie yea and later churches not we that agree with al former times and the Almayns for both they the Danes albeit some of them mislike the names and most of them haue taken away the liuings of bishops yet reteine still their authoritie and office in their superintendents generall superintendēts and had done better if also they had reteined the liuings rewards of learning stipends of ministers wherefore let the libeller cease to obiect vnto vs the Heluetian and Dutch and Danish churches for they differ farther from the Geneuians then from vs and the petitioner himselfe 1 Pag. 10. confesseth that they haue authoritie though not so much Of late writers I know none of name that hath condemned our bishops euen the chiefe authors of this innouatiō Caluin and Beza as may appeare by their letters which are to be shewen speake euery where honourably of them Zanchus greatly extolleth that order onely Beza as some say hath written a foolish 2 Entituled The iudgement of a learned man beyond the sea pelting discourse wherein he would proue our bishops to proceed of men as if himselfe were a bishoppe of God and Daneau in that poynt consenteth with him taking himselfe also to be a bishoppe of God and yet the Geneuians when through weakenesse of body sicknesse and age hee coulde not execute the ministerie shut this bishop of God from his liuing and forced him through want to depart out of their Citie Bullinger and Gualter and diuerse learned men of Suitzerland and Germanie haue by letters and writings allowed our bishops yea 1 Histori confess August Melancthon Camerarius Sturmius wished to God they had such in their Countreys neyther did any of these that are named by the libeller euer speake against other then papisticall bishops let the worlde then iudge what honestie or shame was in this companion that alledgeth Luther Melancthon Bucer Caluin Beza Bullinger Zanchus Erastus Gualter and Mounster against our bishops whereof some neuer spake of them others neuer spake of them but with reuerence and none against them and 2 In diuers of his letters to be shewed Beza complaineth of some that drewe his wordes vttered against popish bishops against our bishops If therefore the libeller do not bring forth some other places then these hee hath quoted there is no cause but that euery man shoulde take him for a forger of false writings and an abuser of his reader But suppose Beza or Daneau or some other of that sort shoulde write their pleasures in priuate letters or in their imperious paltrie pamphlets who would not be ashamed to oppose these two or all their headie followers to Ignatius Dionysius Chrysostome Augustine Ambrose Hierome and all antiquitie yea to most writers of late times And if these men that patronise the consistorie which cannot stand with bishops for in deede there is no agreement in gouernement betwixt the rusticall fauni and the muses betweene learned men and men of occupation betweene clownes and schollers if these I say doe not speake against bishops wee may not thinke that bishop Iewell orbishop Elmar or bishop Bollingham or others that haue written in defence of the state haue vttered any thing that soundeth to their disgrace 1 In his Apologie Bishop Iewell expressely defendeth the degree of bishops aboue priestes and good reason for it is the publike doctrine of this Church and those that goe against it make this Church to reuoke a part of their publike confession and doe more harme by their secret trechery then euer did Harding by his open enmitie neyther can there be a greater scandale or dishonour offred to religion or the state then that we should now alter the publike confession of faith made by our Church Iewell saith that the office of prince and bishop is distinct and no man denieth it for no man by the office of bishop challengeth as doth the pope soueraigntie of both swords but if any conclude because bishops ciuil officers are distinct that a bishop shal doe no ciuil office he wil conclude that hee may not looke to his house nor do the office of a subiect nor fight for his country which is a nice point of puritanisme and little better then trechery and by the same reason should ministers be excluded both from gouernement of colledges and hospitals and al offices in the vniuersities whereto our puritanes ambitiously aspire are as great canuasers as any notwithstanding their ministerie or puritanisme Neither can master Nowels words be stretched against bishops for what if Christ would not receiue riches or dominion of the deuil may not a minister receiue a benefit of a Prince or because Christ forbade them to rule as Princes may they do no offices of good subiectes but liue like traitors or like puritanes that liue in open contēpt of lawes if then the petitioner had any conscience he would not alledge Mr. Nowel against bishops whose authority he mainteineth against Dorman and whose resolution for this present gouernement is sufficiently knowen Master Bilson distinguisheth betwixt apostolicall gouernement and princely gouernment but hee
fiery tryals and bene sealed with their blood namely Bishop Cranmer bishop Ridley bishop Latimer bishop Farrar master Philpot and master Bradford and many moe martyrs that liued in good liking of our state and defended bishops whereas few of these that are alleadged condemned our Bishops and none of the ancient Fathers allowe such an Eldership as these seeke for Adde hereunto the learned men now liuing in England comparable to the best and farre exceeding these Bastinges Loquians Golarts Perots and such obscure and vnlearned and vnwise authors Who will not I say rather giue credite to such consent then to a fewe ouerweening late writers especially seeing all the Fathers ioyne with vs against them Ignatius speaketh of an eldership of ministers of the word men subiect to the Bishop conuersant in the ministration of sacraments of these aldermē that albeit they meddle neither with worde nor sacramentes and are base begotten and mishapen creatures yet take on them to depose Princes throwe out their Bishops at pleasure hee neuer heard any ynkeling nor speaketh one worde of them To his Eldership 1 Epist ad Trallen Magnes Ignatius maketh the Bishop superiour these giue to the Consist orie power to depose the Minister yea and accordingly we vnderstand that in Fraunce they haue thrust out many poore men which either haue perished for want or lāguished for pouertie and all because they were so sencelesse as not to vnderstand that Clownes are euil Iudges of the merites of learned men and accorde not with schollers nor schooles They alledge also 1 Apol. c. 39. libr. de baptism Tertullian to the same purpose but his words fit not their turne for he talketh of elders that managed the word and fed with doctrine and meaneth a synode of bishops or assembly of the ministers of the worde for those are called presidents and such presidents as dealt with the administration of sacraments Of these new aldermen which starting from their occupations and stalles runne rashly into church gouernment in Tertullians time there was no newes heard That the Elders he talketh of were ministers of the worde administred the sacramēts of baptisme is apparant in his booke of baptisme so that alleadging that booke the Libeller doeth nothing but turne the poynt of Tertullian against his motley 2 Tertul. de baptis de coron milit and party-natured aldermen For in in him the worde Presbyteri signifieth alwayes ministers of the word subiect to the bishop neuer any men of trade or occupation vsurping Church-gouernment and chalenging equall power with bishops as in the places aboue mentioned is euident The places of Cyprian make no more for his purpose then those before alledged out of Tertullian Ignatius In the 5 epistle of his second booke he declareth how he and his Collegues had ordained Aurelius a reader but that by Collegues is meant bishops is apparant for that bishops did onely ordeine Secondly for that priests were not Collegues to bishops but subiect to them Thirdly for that priests of one church had not to do in another but bishops had Fourthly because hee neuer heard of nor knewe any temporary prophane churchaldermen which were not ministers of the worde and sacraments Lastly for that he writeth to the elders supposed to be aldermen of the new creation not to ioyne with him but to declare what he had done he would haue done otherwise if priests had bene his Collegues In another place he saith he purposeth to doe nothing without the counsell of his Cleargie and consent of his people but that maketh nothing for the consistorie for in all lawes with vs the consent of the people is adioyned yet haue we no aldermen 〈…〉 the Consistorie doeth things without consent of the people albeit the same consisteth of aldermen And Cyprian albeit he would not then do yet sometimes did and might doe things by his owne authoritie Thirdly it is one thing to haue the counsell of men another to be ioyned in commisson with them for the Prince hath a counsel but no ioynt nor equall gouernours Lastly these elders were ministers of the worde such as residing now in Cathedrall churches were then liuing in cities about bishops Vnto the wordes of Cyprian in his 18 and 22 epistle of his third booke we will then yeelde answere when we finde any of that nomber for there are but 15 epistles in that boooke But this is an ordinary fault of this fellow to quote counsels bookes orations and epistles that neuer were in the world He alledgeth also the 5 9 epistle of Cyprians fourth book but in the 5 there is nothing but the name of Elder without the thing in the 9 there is neither the name nor any note of the supposed elders but contrariwise diuers reasons to shew the gouernment of the church to haue ben alwayes committed to the bishop and the vnion of the same to bee placed in consent of bishops not in supposed consistories That Cyprian knew no elders but ministers of the word these reasons do declare First for that not onely Deacons which were vnder elders but Readers also did deale in the worde and were accompted among the cleargie which was not communicated to men of occupation Secondly for that such elders as hee speaketh of dealt in sacraments and in the word for he 1 Lib. 3. cp 10. reprehendeth certaine for administring the sacraments to certaine that had not declared sufficient signes of repentance Thirdly for that they had 2 Vt sportulis iisdem cum presbyteris honorentur lib. 4. epist 5. wages fourthly for that they were not deposed at pleasure nor were temporary which is a qualitie incident to the newfoundland aldermen Augustine neuer so much as dreamt of Lay or temporary 3 De verb. Domini in Mat. ser 19. or occupacion aldermen nay himselfe diligently obserueth the distinction of the ministers of the word conuersant about the word and sacraments into bishops Priests Deacons 1 De cor grat cap. 11. He calleth the censures of the Church 2 Lib. de paenit medic cap. 2. 3. Episcopale iudicium and affirment that the keyes were to be vsed by Prelats which can no way be drawen to be vnderstoode of Lay aldermen This being considered the libeller saith his Aldermen are in these authors mentioned but obscurely but he had said farre more truely if he had said neither obscurely nor in any sort for darkenesse is not more obscure then the steps of these surmised fellowes and nothing more cleare then that they are not there To illustrate the former Fathers obscuritie he bringeth others which as he supposeth speake clearely The first is Ambrose but nothing doth hee speake to the Libellers content For he speaketh of a counsell of Elders that were ministers of the word and assistant to the bishop whom hee also calleth vicarios Dei antistites which cannot be vnderstood of these base and vnlettered aldermen whose hands
some did which inueighed against popish bishops and affirmeth that they woulde write so much against their father if hee were a bishop or non resident matters most absurde and false for neyther haue these leude and loose companions such a commission as had the Prophetes nor is the ecclesiasticall state to be compared with the idolatrous and wicked priests or popish bishops Neither haue the same followed the steps of Prophets or any propheticall persons Gods Prophetes they speake nothing but truth these are still telling vs prodigious and false tales of their consistorie and counterfeit discipline The Prophets neuer ray led against authority nor gouernors these raile against ecclesiastical ciuil gouernors and al that withstand thē the prophets shewed not thēselues vnnaturall to their parents these professe vnkindnes they did not assemble in seditious sort nor go about to make new lawes for the Church as these did They neuer by wicked conspiracy went about to establsh any newe fancies as did Wigginton Hacket Coppinger Cartw. Vdall and all that were acquainted with that action They neuer declaymed against others being most guilty thēselues as these fellowes do which being most negligent and loose in laboring most vnlearned and ignorant full of newe fooleries doe notwithstanding inueigh against others so bitterly that as this wise felow professeth they wil not spare their father no nor mother and why forsooth because they are of those which S. Paul speaketh of and telleth vs that they are without 1 2. Tim. 3.3 naturall affection This defence therefore is vnsufficient first for that it is false for they doe otherwise then they professe And secondly for that they confesse in this treatise at vnawares that they diffame her Maiesties gouernment affirming the same to be full of enormious corruptions and to haue in it reliques of Idolatrie and impietie and to mainteine a wicked and vnsufficient 2 The ministery of England is better without comparison then that of France Scotland or Dutchland ministerie imitating therein as vnderhand they insinuate the wicked kings of Israel and cruell tyrants that persecuted the Church And lastly for that hee auoucheth that in those times no man was accounted a diffamer of princes that spake against the ecclesiasticall lawes and state which cannot be prooued To iustifie his companions doings he telleth vs further a long discourse how they pray for her Maiesty how they pay subsidy how they fought for her Maiesty when the Spanyards were here And how some whom England shall remēber while it is England ventured as farre as any which is no more thē the papists professe nor thē Iewes Pagans do which yeeld al duties to princes fight when as the Puritanes plaied the cowards few shewed themselues for I knowe diuerse that being there sawe very fewe puritanes armed to mainteine this bragge But so deinty and nice they are that they exclame if they be not highly rewarded for euery litle dutie yea for fighting for themselues their countrey and plainely professe that without their desires for discipline they meane to withdrawe all duetie And therefore this is but a vaine bragge of praying preaching foure times a day and I knowe not what for their tumultuous praying and prating in those times did rather discourage then encourage any and was rather the beginning of tumult then any encouragement and hee that preached foure times a day had much idle talke and made many vnsauorie discourses But suppose some fewe of these men shewed themselues loyall and were so ventrous as to come to Tilberie or rayle against the Spanyardes yet others as it may well be surmised were framing supplications and prouiding horse and armes to come to present them al in armes Then did Martin frame his seditious libelles then others preached seditious sermons all tending to the weakning of those that willingly offred themselues in that seruice And Martin senior professeth that when the enemie was readie to assayle vs abroad there were a hundred thousand handes readie to subscribe the supplication of puritanes at home which saith he in good pollicie we being in feare of outward force might not bee denied nor discouraged Then which there can bee no greater argument of their disloyall proceedings Where they are charged with rayling against the princes gouernement they excuse it saying that therein they meant no more malice to her Maiestie then the godly prophets that vnder Ezekiah and Iosiah reprooued the abuses of the Church which is a point which must bee read with great patience for who can else endure to heare them compare themselues to the prophets their doings to the doing of the prophets the comparison being so vnlike Gods prophets were humble meeke peaceable and possessed with Gods spirit These are proude disdainefull contentious and driuen with other spirits They neuer spake against the state nor condemned the calling of priests nor said that the lawes were antichristian and diuelish these stand especially on these points abuse the gouernors and rayle against lawes and this fellowe as malepertly as the best He would further make the worlde beleeue that his clyents seeke onely for reformation and doeth euery where dubbe them with names of seekers of reformation But great difference there is betwixt pretence and performance Iacke Strawe and Wat Tyler and Kett of Norffolke and all rebels pretend reformation as well as these but the courses and deedes of both tend to nothing but disorder confusion the prince they would abase the Church they would spoyle the ecclesiasticall state they seeke to abolish learning and rewardes in all places where they come they take away Moreouer hee goein about to prooue that bishops may be hated for their doctrine and first for that they impugne that which heretofore they haue taught but neither is his cōlequent good nor antecedēt true for albeit that bishop Elmar spake sometimes against the excesse of bishops liuings as he then imagined not knowing in what state they stood yet did he neuer condemne the degree and dignitie of bishops nor did bishop Bollingham as it should seeme speake against the manners of others then papisticall bishops assuredly against the degree of bishops he neuer spake Neither are the opiniōs of one or two to be ascribed to all but if they which speake contrary to themselues deserue hatred what doeth Tho. Cartw. deserue that in many things speaketh hee knoweth not what in some things contrary to himselselfe as in election of ministers power of the presbytery and diuers poynts And what doth the Libeller deserue that confesseth hee talketh he knoweth not what contrarying his whole discourse Another reason hee bringeth to prooue that bishops may iustly be hated and that is because they confesse saith he infinite abuses to be in the church But the ground of the reason is false for no bishop did euer confesse so much nor doth it follow because some one speaketh vntrueth that all the cleargie of England should be maligned and hated Thirdly he thinketh
gospell If the libeller had had any modestie he would not thus haue abused mens writings nor if he had intended any other matter then to make libels would he haue drawne out certaine rimes out of Pierce Plowmā Chaucer men farre excelling him in all modestie and humanitie for albeit they rimed against wicked bishops yet doe they speake more ciuilly of them then he doth of godly and learned men whome with rime dogrell and dogged railing and many slaunderous reportes and that in the presence of a prince he goeth about malitiously to disgrace Not that he would teach them any good For he sendeth them to the diuill to learne Learne saith he of the deuill of which Maister the libeller hath learned all his rayling and shamefull slaundering and from him hath he borrowed all his malice Therefore I say not as he saith learne of the deuill but learne not of him he is a raylour and slaunderour and so are all libellers and reuellers the right disciples of Sathan That these bookes passe with this approbation Seene and allowed it followeth not that all thinges therein conteined are allowed but that they are allowed to be printed as hauing nothing in the opinion of him that allowed them cōtrarie to state and rather because we should reape some profite by that which is good then loose the good for the bad or alallow that is euil because it is ioyned with that which is good Neither are the consistoriall libellers punished for speaking against ciuill offices in bishops or faultes in them albeit it be an vnciuill parte to disgrace honest men in rimes and rayling discourses and sermons and to reprehend with such vehemencie that which they cannot disproue but because they bring in many pernitious doctrines and ouerturne all gouernement and deface the princes regiment and bring in infinite lewd nouelties and that by rayling reuelling faction And therefore if any suffer any punishment it is not for seeking reformation but for deforming and diffaming the frame of this Church gouernment and common wealth and that in shamefull sorte Neither doeth this libeller desire any thing more then that learned men should bee set aside that such sorrie hines as himselfe might enter in place A man fitter to be scourged in Bedlem then placed in Church gouernement Neither is there any shelter for the libellers cause vnder the names of my Lord of Canterburie Maister Nowel Maister Rainoldes M. Bancroft their opinions manners being so contrarie same was M Bancroft from calling her Maiestie a pope He reprehendeth Martin for his rash assertion implying that she is a pope All these men defend the other oppugne the state the one by good meanes seeke disorders to be reformed the other by all iniurious and vnlawfull meanes yea at length by conspiracie sought to ouerturne the state And therefore as the one deserueth praise so the libellers clyents deserue punishment And nought it is that hee can say for them their fault is so foule and his wit so simple They doe I say deserue punishment first for diffaming her Maiestie and next for plotting and working of rebellion And that is gathered by their doctrine which doeth clearely shewe their meaning for how should a man gather a mans meaning but by his wordes Listen then first what goodman saith a patriarke of this seditious congregation All men 1 p. 73.74.77 saith he Counsellors noblemen inferior Magistrates and people are bound and charged to see the lawes of God kept and to suppresse and resist idolatrie by force Againe If the 2 p. 196. Magistrates shal refuse to put massemongers and false preachers to death the people in seing it performed doe shewe that zeale of God which was in Phinees destroying the adulterous and in the Israelites against the Beniamites Further 3 p. 4. saith he to teach that it is not lawful in any case to resist the superior powers but rather to submit our selues to punishment is a dangerous doctrine taught by some by Gods permission for the punishment of our sinnes He 4 p. 63.43.59.72 affirmeth also that it is not sufficient for subiectes not to obey wicked commaundements of their princes but that they must withstand them also in doing the contrarie euery man in his vocation and office And 1 P. 3. 35. that it is the office of Counsellors to bridle the affections of Princes and gouernors And 2 Goodm p. 99. that it is lawfull to kill wicked kings and tyrants with him did he consent that made the booke of Obedience in Queene Maries time Queene Marie saith he 3 P. 99. 113. good m.p. 180. 184. 185. ought to be put to death as being a tyrant a monster a cruel beast And if saith he neither the inferior Magistrate nor the greatest part of the people will doe their office viz. in punishing deposing or killing of Princes then the Minister must excommunicate such a king And againe 4 obed p. 110. By the worde of God in such a defection or rebellion a priuate man hauing some speciall inward motion may kill a tyrant Whittingham that made a preface to Goodmans booke affirmeth That this doctrine was commended by the most learned in those partes which were Caluine Beza and certeine English men The same doctrine or disobedience rather against princes was taughr by 5 De iure regni Buchanan 6 Knox. appell p. 28. 30. Knoxe saith that the nobilitie and comminaltie ought to reforme religion and in that case may remoue from honors and punish Vnto these accorded Hottoman in his Francogallia and Beza de iure Magistratuum in subditos vindiciae contra tyrannos Vrsinus and the rest of the great patrons of the Consistoriall discipline Secondly the proceedings of the Consistorials both in Scotland and England declare the same In Scotland the roades first of Ruthuen then of Sterling where forcing the king for safegarde of his honor and life to take himselfe to the Castle they deposed Bishops and erected Consistories In England they sent about their factors into euery shire to procure subscriptions to their newfangled discipline they set vp Consistories and Synodes and watched the time of the Spanish inuasion to beginne their faites and but that they sawe themselues two weake would haue by force as many reasons make vs suspect executed their purpose yea notwithstanding their weakenes Hacket Coppinger and Wigginton with whome Th. Cartwright did communicate by diuers letters went about to raise a tumult and to set vp their discipline which they called their newe kingdome for which their new king was hanged drawen and quartered and Coppinger according to the puritan stile made away himselfe Thirdly these men haue many markes of faction in their doings their nightly meetings secrete whisperings open inuectiues against lawes and gouernours glorious pretenses of reformation mutuall intelligence newe names secrete confederacies subscriptions and such like doe marke them out for mutinous and rebellious companions
wee must tell him that where hee talketh of fiue hundred traytors that maintaine the present ecclesiasticall gouernement hee is out of reason and account and doeth nothing but rayle as well beseemeth his libelling humour The state and iurisdiction of bishops nowe in England dependeth externally on the Prince to him they are subiect and from him they receiue lawe finally they thinke it vnlawfull to rebell against him condemning all rebellious practises to pull downe his authoritie and to bring them vnder but the proud and insolent Consistory claymeth power aboue princes and rendreth in Ecclesiasticall matters account to none but God as they professe the same acknowledgeth it felse subiect to none and prescribeth lawes to Princes yea teacheth and putteth in practise rebellion against them and therefore when there is speach of loyaltie and obedience let the Libeller henceforth take heede how he compareth the most factious and suspicious gouernment to Princes that euer was to our ecclesiasticall gouernours which in their doctrine and life cannot bee noted of any disloyaltie And finally let him holde his peace and thanke God for the princes clemencie For it is not the innocencie of his Clients nor the eloquence of the aduocate that can cleare the disciplinarians from faction In such bad causes repentance and submission is best defence the next is silence And therefore wisely did he passe ouer that offence for which Iohn Vdall was conuicted and condemned Onely this fault hee committeth herein that forgetting howe before hee had promised to answere for him now hee leaueth him to answere for himselfe and like a man that had lost both memorie and wit runneth out into an idle discourse of othes Ex Officio and an inuectiue against Iudges and furiously rayling at the State calleth such as speake in defence of it Traitors and Rebels To terrifie the Iudges hee cyteth certaine Textes of scriptures ill fitting his purpose For neither as hee sayeth are his consortes Saintes nor doe they suffer for holinesse nor are they put to death howsoeuer they deserue it That sentence of 1 Iames 1. Iames rather belongeth to them If any man deemeth himselfe to be religious and refaineth not his tongue but seduceth his hart his religion is in vayne or that rather Woe bee to 2 Matth. 23. you Scribes and Pharises ye hypocrites yee are like to whited sepulchres faire without and within full of bones of dead men and all filthinesse And albeit Iohn Vdall had the name vnwothy to be a Preacher yet neuer any worse deserued it being euery way vnsufficient nor tooke a more factious course This fellowe braggeth hee was no murtherer yet if hee had proceeded further I knowe what woulde haue followed So arrogant hee is that hee imagineth all fooles but such as like his fancies But if the 3 Pag. 49. Iudges haue so little skill in condemning such a Minister as Iohn Vdall why doth not this great Clarke shewe it this is impudencie to condemne such reuerend learned men of ignorance and to shewe no reason Besides this in lawe there ought to be no respect of persons Howe then can there bee such difference betwixt ministers and others if ministers offend as well as others Either this man meaneth to challenge immunitie or els hee meaneth if euer he bee a Iudge to respect persons Some haue painted Iustice blinde but this man woulde haue them iudge with spectacles His accusation against such as speake in defence of the state will neuer be prooued he racketh and teareth their sayings as a man lying without conscience and shame yet will they not reach to his purpose Concerning master Dalton whom he accuseth as the Bishops factor it is an easie matter to answere hee hath more honestie learning and lawe then is to be found in all the Puritanes distempered braynes The cause he defended was not the Bishops but of religion learning and the Church Hee chargeth the Bishops that they write in a certaine 1 Admon a g. M. M. p. 252. booke that it is not lawfull to bestowe such liuings vpon laye men as are appoynted by lawe to preachers of the word But neither doe the Bishops say it nor is that booke that is quoted the Bishops nor is it likely that so graue men had so litle to doe as to busie themselues with the answering of such a vaine Libell as Martin and Martins barking sonnes But whose-soeuer the saying is it is iustifiable for if the liuings bee appoynted by lawe to preachers what law is it to infringe law that the Queene doeth keepe the temporalties of Bishops in her hands during the vacation is by law not against law So likewise it is lawfull to holde some Ecclesiasticall liuings that be appropried As for Wiclefs words against the excesse of his times they are euill extended against the want of ours and are voyde of reason for what reason is it that for the default of one a succession should be spoyled as he would haue it But sayth hee who woulde not thinke the superfluities of Bishops liuing better bestowed vpon such a man as Sir Francis Walsingham that right honourable Chancellour and benefactor of the Church and Countrey then vpon any Bishop Wherein hee doeth wrong to the memory of that good knight and in needelesse discourse bringeth his name in question To his supposall I answere that there be very wise men that thinke the liuings of Bishops better as they are and I thinke hee would so say if hee were aliue and were asked the question for no man was more desirous then hee of true honor neyther is any thing more dishonourable then to rise by the spoyles of the Church that hee pretendeth to loue nor to take that to him selfe which was giuen to other vses Neyther doe wee reade of any that hath risen by the spoyles of the Church that hath long prospered or enioyed them nor haue the Papistes any thing to obiect against vs more then sacriledge and spoyle of the Church As for the superfluities of bishops there is order taken Take foure of the best bishops in England and there will bee found eight knights euery one whereof shall farre ouermatch them in reuenues Take eight bishops next in liuing to the greatest and there will bee found two hundreth esquires euery of which shall ouerpasse them diuers yeomen clownes and marchantes doe farre excell the rest Why then should any enuie to men of learning and qualitie the estate and liuing of knights esquires yeomen and clownes It will bee sayde these haue it by inheritance but why should it not as well be lawfull to haue it and winne it by industrie as by inheritance But I am glad I know why all this while the petitioner barketh so loude Hee woulde haue great men fall to spoyling that hee might light vpon some reuersion or like a dogge gather vp crummes vnder the table when men shall ryot with Churches rapines well for his good will when churches come to be spoyled let him out
the state nor are the women he frequēteth so honest as Rahab nor is it a seemely matter for such a braue challenger to make a brag so to run away nor decency for him that preferreth a supplication to the Queene that kneeleth before her Maiestie to hide himselfe his name nor can it stand together that a man should kneele before her Maiestie and yet conceale his name and person He promiseth when his apparance shall be found more profitable then his concealement that he wil come forth and try himselfe a proper man but he had best come forth in time lest if as he saith he be in concealement some one or other begge him of the Queene for to her belong both concealements and the custodie of Ideots He braggeth that he williustifie his wordes in such maner and forme as he hath written them but goodman he neither vnderstandeth what he hath written nor hath furniture nor stuffe in him for so hard an encounter for hee holdeth more of Luna then Mars and is rather lunaticall then martiall It is not long since his Bedlem fits left him Of Logicke he hath no taste nor yet of Diuinitie why then should he like a desperate sotte or like a man without armes or order of warre venture into so dangerous a battell His good masters are quite fled out of the fielde and all their newe disciplinarian deuises are vanished away like cloudes and onely remaine in certaine idle mens braynes who may in time percase disgest them and therefore if this sentence nubecula est citò transibit please him let him write it vpon the doore of the consistory for like a cloude it hath bene lift vp and like a cloude it hath bene tossed with contrary opinions and like a cloude it is almost vanished away And thus much concerning the petition Now let vs consider his Articles and Questions not that they conteine any new matter for both his petition articles and interrogatories proceede from the same malice and tende to one ende and conteine the same odious accusations against the State but for that wee meane not to leaue vnto these men any shadow or pretence for their cause If the same things bee often repeated blame him that so often obiected the same not them that answere their calumnious and vayne obiections accusations are often odious defence of orders and lawes cannot but fauourably be esteemed WHEREIN IS CONTEINED AN ANSWERE TO CERTAINE Articles and Questions annexed to the foresayd Petition wherein the Libeller hath spread diuers slaunders against Ecclesiasticall gouernours and their proceedings The Title to the Articles CErtaine Articles wherein is discouered the negligence of the Bishops their Officials Fauourers and Followers in perfourmance of sundry Ecclesiasticall Statutes Lawes and Ordinances royall and Episcopall published for the gouernement of the Church of England Answere THE Libellers purpose was in pretence onely to defend but I perceiue albeit beside his purpose now he meaneth to strike and offend and that in treason and in the darke when no man can strike him againe A common tricke of Libellers that deuise what reproche they can against such as they hate and publish them then renounce them So this fellowe goeth about to bring bishops in disgrace then all those Ministers that liue in obedience of Lawes But he meaneth not to stand to the matter for he concealeth his name Well let vs see what he saith against Bishops and other Ministers and ecclesiasticall persons Much it should seeme he cannot say for he is ignorant what are Ecclesiasticall lawes and by what autthoritie they stand and calleth them Ordinances royall and Episcopall when it is euident that there is no lawe in England but Royall and that no bishop may make any ordinance or Lawe Article 1 By the statute 25. H. 8.14 it is accompted by the Parliament against equitie due order of iustice to bring any man in danger of his life name goods or landes by any intrapping Interrogatories without verdict witnes presentment or confession c. for making printing or dispersing of seditious bookes sundry other grieuous crimes c. Answere Neither is the statute truely reported nor is it proued that the bishops or their officers proceed cōtrary vnto it or other lawe concerning that poynt as this false accuser pretendeth For the first it is euident for that which the statute decreeth cōcerning heresie this accuser trāsferreth to printing writing seditious bookes as if it were to be presumed that as innocents by that statute were deliuered from trappes of heresie so such seditious offenders libellers were protected by law against law whereas there is no mētion nor intendment of any such matter in that statute The second appeareth for that the Accuser doth not once charge the high commissioners at which he aymeth with breach of this statute He knew very wel v t there is nothing in their proceedings contrary to this statute For they do not as this libeller surmiseth minister captious interrogatories Secondly they do proceed to punishment against none but conuicted by lawful witnesses euidence or confession neither otherwise then by warrant of their commission which I would gladly see the libeller whether he dare to oppugne That which is set in the side Of oath ex officio perteineth not to this matter for in this statute there is no word cōcerning any oth And therfore he that put the same there did like him stroke a faire blow but touched not his aduersary Article 2 All men are baylable that are not prohibited by law to be bayled 2. West c. 15. Answere These words are not found in the place quoted nor any of such nature no nor in any other place Percase the Libeller meaneth as wel to forge new lawes as new religion If he meaneth the statute made at West 1. Ed. 3. c. 15. yet is there no such matter for there we find rather who are not to be bailed then who are to be bayled which is to be gathered out of the statutes common lawes against which if he wil charge the honourable persons of the high commission to haue proceeded why doth he not note the fact and time other circumstances If hee thinke that either those that are taken by the writ de excommunicato capiendo or such as are committed by the high cōmissioners ecclesiastical for contempts are bayleable he neither vnderstandeth law nor statute for law auctoriseth both And if it should not then would penalties be frustratory and offenders be rather protected by law then by lawe punished Article 3 No officiall nor other officer should take any more thē three pence for the seale of a Citation els they forfeit double costes c. Answere Why doe you not sue them vpon the statute if they take more you might make a goodly gaine in promoting of matters against them but you will not your proofes are so sclender That Officials others do take more then they ought for seales of processes I
frameth an articulat infamous libell A second fault it is that such leude and shamefull practises are notwithstanding sayd to be drawen by a fauourer of reformation as if there were no difference betwixt slandering and reforming A third fault hee committeth in affirming these questions to be annexed by the Printer But the greatest fault is that such shamefull libels are commonly solde and the authors passed ouer without punishment Quaere first whether Iustice Wray did not affirme Putcase Quaest 1. that men should incurre no penaltie for opinions which they helde doubtingly and whether a man may not without breach of lawe make Quaerees and doubtes whether I may not be a Putcase I haue enquired of those Answere that were present at the time when these wordes are pretended to bee spoken and they doe assure me that hee neuer vttered any such words which I haue no reason to doubt of for it is not probable that so reuerend and learned a Iudge shoulde mayntaine or deliuer so strange an assertion for in matters fundamentall of faith to doubt is haeresie as all diuines doe agree And in externall matters the Apostle saith that whatsoeuer is not of faith is sinne And who woulde not detest him that would make a doubt whether these disciplinarians be impious and flagitious fellowes that affirme it to be lawfull to make doubts and questions in those cases The very Paganes were farre more reasonable then this impious Putcase For the Athenians banished 1 Cie de natur Deor. Protagoras for doubting whether there were a God or no. As for matters of state I doubt not but whosoeuer shall doubt and make a question and not categorically affirme that her Maiestie hath right to her crowne and is supreme Gouernour within her dominions in all causes and ouer all persons is a ranke traytor Let therefore Pierce Putcase looke to it a little better and cleare himselfe of doubting and questioning least hee bee taken for a traytor out of doubt To come to the matter in question it is also euident that whosoeuer doth make questions to the diffamation eyther of the gouernment or gouernours or of priuate persons liuing in obedience of lawes he is to be punished as a libeller And therfore I would wish the man to shut vp himselfe in a case to take heed that he be not taken abroad For he wil be in a very bad case for his libelling and putting of cases if euer his reuelling against her Maiestie her ecclesiasticall lawes her officers and many other good men shal come in scanning Quaere Putcase Quaest 2. whether the forme of prayers administratiō of sacramēts attyre of ministers other ceremonies in England do more agree to the Apostolicall and primitiue order or to the vse of the Romish church whether popish orders be more seemely thē the Apostolike The questioner supposeth that I will answere that Answere which maketh for his purpose not doubting but to cut vs downe with the next blow But in vaine doth he feed himself with his owne conceit For I answere and will shewe that our liturgie and ceremonies agree neerer to the liturgie and ceremonies of the primitiue Church then to the popish orders And that is apparent first in quality for that wee haue purged out all idolatrie superstition false doctrine in which the papists do most differ from the ancient Church Secondly in forme For as the Iewes had readings of the law certaine hymnes and prayers interposed so no doubt the Apostles kept the reading of scriptures with prayers interposed which forme we keepe the papists keepe not The papists reade no scriptures and haue other formes of prayers Thirdly in the language for as in anciēt time so now we vse our mother tōgue Nay further we come neerer in our formes to the primitiue church then the consistorial orders For they haue no set reading of scrptures nor forme of liturgie as they had in the times of the first fathers and are so vnlike them that they haue abolished al the orders of the ancient Church They haue no set praiers but leaue al to the discretion of their speaker as they cal him who cōceiueth prayers either so confused that they are not vnderstood or so vncharitable that a true Christian may not say Amen Contrariwise ancient counsels decreed that no praiers should bee said in the church but such as first should by cōmon authority be allowed And albeit apparel is a matter indifferent yet in publike liturgie wee come neerer to the Apostolike Church whereas the puritanes haue abolished al Apostolike orders as they haue abolished al Apostolike gouernement To the last part of the question whether popish ceremonies bee more decent then Apostolicall I answere that where they are contrarie there the Apostolike is more decent But I denie that eyther the newe consistoriall gouernement or the ceremonies by the same appointed are Apostolicall or that our ceremonies are papisticall Nay I say that their newe orders are not Apostolicall but fantasticall and that our gouernement is Apostolicall neyther shall they euer be able to prooue the contrary Quaere Putcase Quaest 3. whether our rites and ceremonies doe not giue offence to the papists and whether indifferent things causing offence ought not by Pauls doctrine to be remooued out of the Church Whether they giue offence to the papistes or no Answere wee are not to respect nor to omit ancient and Apostolike orders to please them To good men the vse of our ceremonies cannot giue iust offence Nay rather the confusion of the newe gouernment and absurditie in the newe liturgie giueth offence for it confirmeth the papists in their opinion and offendeth all that are comming forward to ioyne with vs. For they see not how that can be the Church that refuseth all ancient gouernement and ceremonies and is nothing but a bundell of nouelties And therefore in vaine is the latter part of the question propounded whether matters that giue offence be by S. Pauls doctrine to be remooued for wee denie that our ceremonies doe giue offence Quaere Putcase Quaest 4. whether the square cappe surplesse c. condemned in generall by the Queenes Iniunctions bishops articles and doctrine of England and other Churches misliked by Bullinger Alasco Bucer Pilkington Bale and other learned men be decent and comely for a preacher and being vncomely whether they should not be abolished out of the Church First it is denied Answere that the attyre of ministers in England now is condemned by the Queenes iniunctions or bishops articles or doctrine of England A shamelesse man was he that affirmed it so impudently and so to bee credited accordingly for the contrary is euident both by doctrine of the Church and law of the realme And neuer shall this bold bayardlike Putcase prooue them either to be monumentes of poperie or defiled with idolatrie let him begin when he wil. What other Churches mislike in themselues we do not
new gouernement at pleasure nor doth any of them doubt but that the gouerment of the Church of England is Apostolicall and that the gouernement by elders is both new and fantasticall Quaere Putcase Quaest 36. if Iohn at Stile shoulde grant there was a gouernement by elders in the primitiue Apostolicall and best Church and shoulde call the same gouernement a popedome and tyrannie whether this did not rankly smell of detestable atheisme If Iohn at Stile should say as much as this libeller hath said in his libell Answere hee might percase change his stile and bee called Iohn at Gibet for these bee matters worthy Gibets but concerning this matter I thinke Iohn at Stile will not say that there was euer such a packe of Church-aldermen as this faction vseth in their Consistories And if hee should say so hee should say vntrueth neyther were the Elders in the primitiue Church or after other then Apostles and ministers of the worde All the ancient Fathers were ignorant of this newe gouernment yet was it not Atheisme in them to say it as this wicked and hypocriticall Atheist auoweth nor are these Atheistes that impugne the fonde Consistorie or that affirme that the newe gouernment is tyrannie nay which is worse that it is meere foolerie but those that wrest Gods worde and lye shamefully to proue it For what more sottish sencelesse gouernment can there be then to make clownes iudges of learning religion and controuersies of diuinitie or more absurde then to refuse that gouernment that euer was in the church Quaere whether the Churches in Scotlande France Put-case Quest 38. the lowe countreyes Hungary Poland Bohemia Saxony Heluetia and the County Palatine of Rhene and whether Zuinglius Oecolampadius Melancthon Bucer Caluin Zanchus Martyr infinite other the most excellent diuines in all the world commending the continuance of the Eldership be all Anabaptistes Puritans rebellious Traytors Marstates Marlawes Marprinces and Maralles and D. Bancroft M. Sutcliffe c the onely good subiectes in all the worlde As we do not willingly condemne other churches in their gouernment Answere so we thinke Beza and others might haue done more wisely discretely not so rashly to haue censured ours especially pronouncing without hearing both parties and sitting iudge in his owne cause and speaking neither good diuinitie nor good lawe nor good reason yet we say if any of these aboue named should in this state go about to place the eldership so contrary to a monarchicall regiment he should haue done therein no good office nor discharged the ductie of a wise man this I say further that this libeller doeth make most shamefull lyes where hee nameth many churches and many learned men as fauourers of the new Eldership whereas in trueth they neuer knewe what it meant It is not in Saxonye Bohemia Polande Hungary nor in many places in the low countreyes and where it is the same continueth with small profit and much displeasure The countie Palatine of Rhene hath after many styrres cōditionally receiued it Heluetia neuer had it neither Oecolampadius nor Zuinglius nor Melancthon euer knew it nor I thinke the rest What a shamelesse fellow then was this thus impudently to lye nay Saxony hath superintendents and so sometimes had Scotlande and Tossane they say is generall superintendent of all the Palsgraues dominions concerning Church causes and the Churches of Strangers in Englande in King Edwardes dayes had superintendents Melancthon and Zanchus liked our bishops and therefore none of these are like to our factious Puritans And as for Doctor Bancroft and my selfe they cannot say but that wee are good subiectes nor note vs with any disloyaltie But beside vs the least of thousandes there are infinite more good subiectes and learned men of which nomber the Puritans are none all which stande against the factious gouernment of the Elderships maintaine the ancient apostolicall orders of the Church That the best Diuines in the worlde should hold with the Eldership is a fancy for all the ancient Fathers were ignorant of it and the godly martyrs of our land in Queene Maries time refused it beside them infinite learned men all which hold with bishops which these condemne chuse you therefore whether you will follow all antiquitie or Th. Cartwright Giles Wigg Iohn Penry Tauergius Caluetus and such tagrag fellowes percase great fauourers of the church-aldermen but neyther wise nor learned Quaere Put-case Quest 39. whether the Kings of France and Scotlande the princes of Condè and Orenge the duke of Saxony the countie palatine of Rhene the States of the lowe countreyes many other Dukes Princes Marquesses Earles Barons and other christian and noble potentates who haue mainteined fauoured and preferred the Ministers that stand for reformation and whether here in England the right honorable sir Nicolas Bacon Lord keeper the Erles of Bedford Warwicke and Leycester Sir Francis Walsingham Sir Amias Paulet Sir Walter Mildemay and other right noble Lordes Counsellours Countes and Countesses woulde haue countenanced and protected the Ministers that seeke reformation if they had perceiued them to bee enemies to the Queene and state worse then papistes and miscreants and whether our Prelates bee more trustie to her Maiestie and prouident to auoyde danger then these excellent personages were This argument for the consistory is drawen from the opinion of courtiers men of warre Bellipotentes sunt magis quà m sapientipotentes Ennius apud Cicer. 2. diuinat therfore seemeth to me strange in diuinitie howsoeuer it is approued as good in the consistorie that dependeth on opinion and is turned as the cloudes with the winde If the same were any thing worth then might the heresie of Arrius yea Paganisme bee confirmed also to bee as good religion as the consistorian discipline for many Emperours Kings noble men dukes countes countesses captaines yea whole States haue embraced Paganisme and condemned Christian religion and fauoured idolatrous priests and persecuted christians Constantius and all his court for the most part most of his dominions embraced Arianisme And what wonder if diuers noble men and women embraced this fantasticall Discipline for whome would not the demure countenance sober sighes and out drawen speech of these hypocrites abuse wherefore let this libeller ground him selfe vpon these mens courtly fauour muster an army ready to fight for discipline let him haue his captaines officers his marshals lieutenants ensignes sergeantes corporals drummers and fifes and let him make his aldermen gunners for if they could looke with one eye they would proue most excellent in that facultie shooting so well at randon about interpretation of scriptures hauing so long layne battering downe our State I say all these mens opinions without authoritie of Scripture wey not one pepper graine Hee is a simple man that will die in that religion that most of these fauourers of Discipline which this man hath named did and most simple that will thinke the
for such men when Luna is praedominant in their heades 18 Quaere whether it be a matter tolerable and beseeming wise gouerners that clownes and men of occupatiō should determine matters of religion or that ideots should iudge of lawe and gouerne all matters ecclesiasticall and by what rule of diuinitie it may be surmised that an ignorant man being chosen an Elder shoulde sodenly be endued with new graces and as Th. Cartw. the great disciplinarian patriarke faith become a new man as if he were new perboyled in Peleus his tubbe 19 When the Consistorie consisteth of 13 good men and true whereof sixe looke one way and seuen another Quaere why the odde voyce should make the sentence of seuen to be the determination of the Church and whether this be not an odde discipline where one odde man maketh a determination to be called the Churches determination 20 Quaere by what lawe Doctors Pastors and Deacons make one corporation seeing in no place of scripture they are mentioned together nor by any authoritie or commission are linked together 21 Quaere by what authoritie the Ministers of forreine churches take on them to prescribe formes of discipline and new lawes vnto our Church seeing they teach that all churches haue equall power and whether this be not a foundation to a new popedome 22 Quaere whether all the errours of Barrowisme doe not folowe and may be concluded of Th. Cartw. Wat. Tr. and Dud. Fenners positions and whether this sort of men is fit to deale with those sectaries and ought not rather to be driuen to make a publike recantation of their foule opinions 23 Quaere in case a musterd seller or chandeller should be chosen a churchalderman and thought worthie to iudge of the highest matters of religion who should all that while furnish the common wealth with musterd and candels and whether that their sentences would not sauour ranke of musterd and tallowe and how many candlesellers or men of occupation they finde to haue bene present in Synodes of olde time at the debating of pointes of religion 24 Quaere whether the disciplinarians doe not flatly deny the principall pointes of her Maiesties supremacie and take from her power to ordeine rites and orders for the church to nominate Bishops to appoint Ecclesiasticall commissioners and to delegate learned men to heare the last appeale from the Ecclesiasticall courtes to call Synodes and other authoritie giuen to the prince by the lawes of England and endeuour to bring in forreine lawes and iurisdiction repugnant to the statutes of supremacie and her maiesties prerogatiue and the lawes and liberties both of the Church and all her maiesties subiectes 25 Quaere if the establishment of the consistoriall discipline in the Church of England would not ouerthrowe infinite statutes most of the Common lawes diuers courtes of Iustice the two Vniuersities and innes of court and finallie the whole state and whether the Vniuersities in places where this discipline is entred be not decayed and the state shaken notwithstanding that the power thereof by diuers lawes contrarie to the rules of discipline is abridged 26 Quaere how many sound diuines or learned men there are that haue bene bredde in the places where this discipline is receiued and whether they haue not parted the Church goods among themselues where they were masters as the soldiors parted Christes coate giuing some little portion backe againe of the whole least they should liue all together without religion 27 Quaere whether it be likelie for the vaine hope of a hundred poundes pention depending on the vncerteine pleasures of marchants men of occupation and husbandmen that yong men of towardnes will giue themselues to the studie of diuinitie and what braue youthes are made ministers within the disciplinarians iurisdiction 28 Quaere how the spoyles of the Church which these men haue made in all places where they rule are bestowed and what portion thereof is come to the maintenance of learned men or learning 29 Quaere what commodities her maiestie doth receiue now by renthes subsidies first fruites patronages lapses custodies of bishops temporalities and how much the same amounteth vnto likewise what seruices she hath now by the Ecclesiasticall state and their followers and whether shee should not loose both great reuenues and make many faithfull seruitors vnable to serue her if this inkepot discipline shoulde come in place and if any man say that the same should be bestowed vpon noblemen and knightes and gentlemen that should succeede in the place of others let inquire be made whether some puritane dame doe not spend in apparell more then the reuenues of diuers cathedral churches and whether it would fall out that the reuenues of the Church would bee wasted vainely which now mainetaine manie able men to doe the prince seruice 30 Quaere whether in all places where the factious disciplinarians haue set foote in this Church they haue not set the people against their pastors and deuided the people among themselues and hardened mens heartes and made them without naturall affection and lifted vp their followers in pride and vanitie and made the people farre worse then before and sought nothing but their owne profite and aduancement 31 Quaere whether it be not a dangerous point to this Church and state that we are so much vrged by some to imitate the course helde for reformation by them of Geneua and Scotland heretofore considering the dangerousnes of their plattes and the effectes that followed vpon them and the vnsounde diuinitie whereupon they are grounded 32 Quaere by what point of discipline they of Geneua expulsed their Bishop and liege Lorde and right Countie of Geneua and what reuenues of the Church they seased into their handes and what portion they allowed backe againe to the poore ministerie and whether it bee not capitall in that state to speake for the estate of Bishops which pointes cleared it will appeare what reason they had first at Geneua to inueigh and declaime against the state of Bishops Quaere whether the peremptorie dealings of the ministers of Geneua and some others adhearing vnto them and the greedie sacrilege of their abbettors and followers and the vtter subuersion of the ecclesiasticall state which this antischolasticall and fantasticall discipline doeth euery where worke haue not greatly hindered the reformation of religion in France and other places and is not still likely to hinder the same vnlesse the same be newly recocted and reformed 34 Quaere whether the disciplinarians doe not deliuer doctrine as dangerous to princes as Rosse Sanders Allen and other papistes namely concerning excommunication deposing and murdering of princes that withstand the religion and reformation which eache of them respectiuely desireth 35 Quaere whether 1 History of the Church of Scotland pag. 213. Knoxe saide truely of Caluin and certeine other Ministers then residing at Geneua and if hee reporte their doctrine truely whether they holde a sounde point of doctrine teaching That it is lawfull for