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A00333 Seven dialogues both pithie and profitable The 1 is of the right vse of things indifferent. 2 sheweth what comfort poperie affordeth in time of daunger. 3 is betweene a good woman and a shrew. 4 is of the conversion of a harlot. 5 is of putting forth children to nurse. 6 is of a popish pilgrimage. 7 is of a popish funerall. By W.B.; Colloquia. English. Selections Erasmus, Desiderius, d. 1536.; Burton, William, d. 1616. 1606 (1606) STC 10457; ESTC S121852 117,991 172

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was plaine Then said I and this same thatch of réede seemeth to bee newer than all the rest he did grant it A●…d these same beames and rafters which beare vppe the thatch séeme not to bee many yeares olde he did also grant that to be true And when I had now examined euery part of that cabine I said vnto him how then doth it appeare that this house was ma●… age●… since brought from afarre Men. And I pray how did the Mistagogue vnti●… this knotte Ogygius Forsoothe hée presently shewed vs a very olde Beares skinne fastened to the rafters and in a manner derided our dulnesse and slewnesse to beléeue so manifest a proofe so we being perswaded craued pardon for our vnbeleefe and so turned our selues to beholde the heauenly milke of the blessed Uirgin Men. Such a sonne such a mother h●…e hath left vs so much of his blood vpon earth as is wonderfull and she so much of her milke as is sc●…rce credible to come o●… one woman hauing but one childe though the infant had neuer sucked any of it away O. And so they reason ab●…ut the Crosse whereupon Christ died which is shewed in so many places but priuately that if the peeces thereof were brought together they would load a ship and yet Christ carried it all himselfe Men. And doth not this also séeme a wonder vnto you Ogy. Somewhat strange perhaps but no wonder because the Lord being omnipotent is able to augment it at his pleasure Me. You make a good construction of the matter but I feare that many such things are deuised but for lucre sake O. I suppose that God would not indure any that should so abuse him Mene. Yes surely séeing as both mother and sonne and father and holy-ghost as you said are robbed by sacrilegious persons and yet in the meane time they séeme to be so little moued at the matter that neither by a becke nor making any noise they will make those wicked persons afraide So great is the patience of the godhead O. So it is indéede but heare the rest That milke is kept vpon a high Altar in the midst of which altar stands Christ and for honour sake his mother stands at his right hand for that milke doth represent his mother Men. Th●…n it is to be ●…éene O. Yea but ●…hut vp in a christall glasse Men. What is it liquid O. What talke you of liquid for that which was milked aboue ●…ue hundred yeares since it is hardened you would thinke it to be chalke bruised and tempered with the white of an egge Men. Why do●… they not shew it naked O. Lest the Uirgins milke should be profaned with mens kisses Menedemu●… You say well for there bee some I thinke whose lips are neyther cleane nor chaste but goe on Ogy. So soone as the Mistagogue saw vs hée put ●…n a surplice and his stole about his necke and very deuoutly knéeled downe and prayed that do●…e he reached vs that sacred milke to kisse and wée very deuoutly fell downe at the foote of the Altar and haui●…g first saluted Christ wée called vpon the Uirgine Mary with a short prayer that we had prouided of purpose for her in these words Uirgin mother which hast m●…rited with thy virginean breast to sucke thy sonne Iesus the Lord of heauen and earth our desire is that we being clensed with his blood may grow to that happy reasonable infancy which being void of all malice fraud and guile doth daily desire the milke of the Euangelicall doctrine vnt●…ll we come to a perfect man and the fulnesse of Christ whose blessed fellowship thou inioyest for euer with the Father and the Holy-ghost Amen Men. A good prayer truely if it had béene made to the right party but what said shée O. They séemed both to bow vnto vs vnlesse my sight failed me for the holy milke s●…ed to leape alittle an●… the holy sacrament seemed to shine somewhat brighter then before In the mean time the Mistagogu●… came vnto vs very silent and reached vs a little table to write on such as the Germans offer which take tole bridges Men. Truely I haue oftentimes cursed those same polling tables when I haue gone through Germany O. Well we gaue him some gr●… which ●…e offred to the Uirgin By and by I demand●…d of him as ●…ly as I could by an interpreter skilful in their la●…guage and a yong man of a smooth eloquent tong I think his name was Ro Al●…ffe by what arguments it might be prooued that this was th●… milke of the bl●…ssed Uirgine Which I did truely with an honest minde that so I might be able to stop the mouthes of ●…uch as are wont to laugh at all these things as fables At the first the Mistagogue or Usher of the reliques with a lowring ●…ountenance held his peace I bade the youth to vrge it still but v●…ry mod●…stly which indeede he performed very s●…oothely insomuch that if he had intreated the Mother her selfe with the same words and shee lying in childe bed shee could not haue taken it in i●… part But the Mistagogue as if he had béen inspired with some certaine kinde of godhead beholding as with staring eyes and as it were with horro●… ex●…ating a blasphemous spéech said What neede you aske s●…ch questions when you haue an authenticall table And he sé●…d altogether a●… if he would cast vs out as 〈◊〉 if the g●…oats had not somewhat asswag●…d his furie Men. What did you in the meane time Ogy. What thinke you Euen as 〈◊〉 we had béene strucken with a club or some thunder bolt we slunke away hu●…bly crauing pardon for our boldn●…sse From thence we went to another little cabine the bl●…ssed Uirgines l●…dging as ●…ée were going thither a certaine relique-mast●…r of th●… inferiour sort of them sheweth himselfe and beh●…ld vs as if he w●…re desiruus to know vs wh●…n we had gone a little furth●…r another met vs and in like manner sta●…ed vpon vs by and by the third Men. It may be they were desirous to take your picture Ogy. But I thought ●…arre 〈◊〉 Men. What did you thinke ●… pray you Ogy. Mary I was afraid that some sacrilegious person had secretly stol●…n away some thing o●… o●…r Ladies 〈◊〉 and that they suspect●…d me for the matter Therefore when I c●…me into the Chappel in this manner I salut●…d the Uirgin●… mother O the onely mother and Uirgin●… amongs●… women●… most happy mother most pure Uirgine now w●… that are impure doe visite thée that art pure and with our poore pre●…ents w●… do●… you 〈◊〉 our d●…sire is that thy sonne ●…ould grant that we imitating thy most holy maners may be count●…d worthy through the grace of the holy spirit spiritually to conceiue him in the bowels of our minde and hauing conceiued him neuer to loose him Amen And withall hauing kisse●… the altar I laid downe certaine groates and went my way Men. What did the virgin did she not by a becke
against but alwayes without sedition but whence is it that the Butcher is such a Questionist and sifter of matters let Carpenters 〈◊〉 of their building and Eutchers of Butchers matters But. We are oftentimes troubled with such questions at feasts and s●…metimes the heate is so great that it groweth to fighting Fish Let them fight that list I thinke that the lawes of our Emperours ought to be reuerently embraced and religiously obserued euen as procéeding from God neither d●…e I holde it safe or sauouring of godlinesse 〈◊〉 ●…o conceiue or suspitiously to speake of publique authoritie And if there ●…e any thing that may séeme to sauour of tyranny which yet dooth not compell men to impietie I do holde it better to suffer it patiently than to resist it seditiously But. By this meanes I confesse you prouide well for them that excell in dignitie and I am of your minde neyther do I enuie them but I would willingly heare what course might be taken for the liberty and good of the people Fish God will not leaue his people destitute But. But in the meane time where is that libertie of the spirite which the Apostles promise out of the Gospel and which Paul so often beateth vpon crying out that the kingdome of God is not meat and drinke and that we that are the children of God are not vnder a Schoolemaister and that we shoulde be no longer in bondage to the rudiments of this world and a number of things moe if Christians be burdened with so many constitutions more than the Iewes were Fish I wil tell you Butcher christian libertie doth not consist in this that it may be lawful for men to doe what they list being set frée from humane constitutions but that from the aboun●…ance and feruencie of the spirite they being prepared for all weathers as they vse to speake doe those things willingly and chéerefully which are prescribed them that is to say like sonnes and not like vnto seruants But. Uery wel but vnder Moses law there were sons and vnder the Gospell there be seruants And more than that I feare lest the greatest parte o●… men are of the nature of seruants which are compelled by lawe to doe their duetie what difference is there then betweene the old Testament and the new Fish In my opinion great di●…ference That which the olde Testament taught vnder vailes the new Testament layeth before our eies That which the olde foretolde by figures and shadowes the new sheweth more cleerely What that promised very obscurely and afarre off this hath exhibited for a great part thereof That was offered to one nation onely this dooth exhibite saluation indifferently to all That made a few Prophets and woorthie men partakers of that excellent and spirituall grace this hath plentifully powred out all maner of gifts as namely of tongues of healing diseases of working myracles of prophecyings c. and that vpon men of all ages sexes and nations But What is then become of all these things now Fish They are not dead but asléepe not perished but ceased either because there is no need of them the doctrine of the Gospèl being now published ouer the worlde or because many being but christians onely in name want that faith whereby myracles were wrought But. If myracles be néedefull for those that be vnbeléeuers and distrustfull then now are they néedefull for now the world swarmeth with such Fishm. There are vnbeléeuers that erre of simplicitie such were the Jewes which mu●…mured against Peter for receiuing Cornelius and his housholde vnto the grace of the Gospel And such were the Gentiles who supposed that the religion of their forefathers would saue them and as for the doctrine of the Apostles they accounted it strange superstition These at the sight of myracles were conuerted They which now distrust the Gospel a●…ter so great light of knowledge so long shining in all partes of the worlde doe not erre of simpli●…itie but being blind●…d with euill affections they li●…t not to vnderstand No myracles would euer reclaime such persons to a better minde And now is the time of healing hereafter wil be a time of vengeance vpon all such as will not be healed of their errour But to let these things passe tell mee in good earnest is it true that you saide that there is libertie giuen for eating of flesh who list and when they will But. I did but ieast to stirre you a little And if such an Edict were made the Company of the Fishmonger●… would be seditious Againe the worlde is full of Pharisaicall persons who can no way else get themselues an opinion of holinesse but by such obseruations And they would neyther loose one iote of that glorie which they had gotten nor endure that their inferiours should haue more libertie than themselues Neither woulde this be for our commodities that are Butchers to haue a frée vse of all things graunted for then our gaines would be very vncertaine whereas now our gaine is more certaine and lesse subiect to chaunce and labour Fish You saide most truely and the same discommoditie would redownd vnto vs. But. I am glad yet that at the last there is somewhat found wherein the Fishmongers and the Butchers do agrée Now that I may beginne to speake in good earnest it were better as I take it for the christian people to bée lesse clogged with constitutions and humane ordinances especially such as doe not tend much to godlinesse but rather doe hurt yet on the other side I wil not defend them which reiect all and care not a strawe for any constit●…tions of any man Yea so péeuish are they some of them that therefore they wil doe such and such things onely because they are forbidden But yet I cannot maruaile enough at the preposterous iudgement of mortall men Fish No more can I. But. If we suspect any daunger of loosing any ioate of weight from the constitutions and authoritie of the Clergie we kéepe a stirre as if heauen and earth should goe togither but although there be so much giuen to humane authoritie that Gods authoritie is not so much regarded as it ought to be yet we sléepe soundly and thinke there is no daunger at hand And thus while we labour to shunne one rocke wée runne vpon another more deadly and that without any feare at all The ●…ishops and cleargy are to haue that honor which is due vnto them who denyeth it especially if they doe according to their names but it is a wicked thing to transferre that honour vnto men which is due and proper vnto God and while we are precise in reuerencing of men to do little or none at all vnto God The Lorde is to be honoured and reuerenced in our neighbour but in the meane time we must beware that God by this meanes be not defrauded of his honour Fish In like manner wée sée many ●…o put so much confidence in outward ceremonies that they altogether neglect
Xan. But I haue gotten that of my husband by a cleane contrary way Eulalia It may bee so but in the meane time there is a perpetual warre betweene you and it is a hundred to one that he wil neuer loue you for it Xan. What then would you haue me to doe Eula. First you must swallow vp all iniuries that your husband offer you and his affection must be by little and little wonne by duties and kindenesse and méekenesse and mildenesse and so you shal at last either ouercome him or vse him more commodiously than now you can Xan. Hée is too stowt and hard-harted to be wonne by any dutie or kindenesse Eula. Oh say not so There is no wilde beast so fierce but may bee ●…amed by gentle handling doe not dispaire of the man make triall some moneths blame mée if you finde not this course good for you There bée many faults also that you must winke at and aboue all beware that you mooue no brawles in chamber or in bedde but bee carefull that there all things bee pleasaunt and merrie For if that place which is consecrated to the putting away of all offences and to the restoring of loue be profaned with strife and gréefe then all remedies of reconciliation are gone And there be some women so froward that euen in the very act of generation they wil be brawling or sullen and malcontented and by their tedious and irke some conditions doe make that pleasure vnpleasant which should purge mens mindes from all grée●…e and dislike corrupting and spoiling the phisicke whereby offences might haue béene healed X●…n Truely this hath béene my case Eula. No maruaile then though your husband cannot loue you At no time a woman should be loath some or gréeu●…us to her husband but at such a méeting especially shee should doe all her endeuour to be amiable and pleasing to her good man Xan. I haue to doe with a beast and not a man Eula. Oh leaue these railing and vnciuil spéeches for the most part it is through our own default that men be no better than they are Xan. I would I could make him better but it passeth my skill Eulalia If you wil bee as good as your skil you can doe it hée must be yours and you must be his doe what you can and the better you make him the better it will bée for your selfe But you alwaies looke vpon his faults and those you aggrauate and they increase your hatr●…d and then you take the pot by that eare that wil not hold rather fa●…en your eyes vpon those things that are good in him and that is a handle by which he may be held and vsed Before you did marry him you had time to consider what faults he had now is the time of healing and not of wounding of cléering and not of accusing and you ought to haue chosen your husband as wel by your eares as by your eyes Xan●…ippe What woman did euer choose a husband by her ●…ares Eula. Shee chooseth onely by the eye who respecteth nothing but the beauty and making of the body but she chooseth by the care that doth diligently obse●…ue what report and ●…ame goeth of him Xan. Your warning is good but i●… commeth too late Eula. But it is not too late to study how to amend your husband and that you may doe yet if you wil but temper your selfe accordingly What doe others reporte of your husband his friends and acquaintance with whome he doth daily conuerse Xan. They say he is of maruellous good behauiour courteous liberall kind-hearted and friendly to his friend Eul. And that makes me of good hope that he will prooue such a one as we desire X●…n But to me onely he is not so Eul. Do you but shew your selfe to him in such manner as I haue shewed you and neuer trust me more if he pr●…oue not such to you also And there is no talking of being diuorced from him now Xan. But that hath béene often in my minde Eul. When that cogitation comes into your minde thinke first with your selfe of how small reckoning a woman is that is diuorced from her husband The chiefest ornament of a wife is to be duetifull to her husband and studious to please him so hath Nature prouided and so God will haue it that we depend wholy vpon our husbands Againe thin●…e of your children which are common to you both what do you meane to doe with them If you take them with you y●…u de●…raude your husband of his possession If you leaue th●…m behinde you then you bereaue your selfe of that which is most 〈◊〉 vnto you Last of all tell me haue you any that beare you euill wil Xan. I haue a mother in lawe and my owne mother both which doe wish me dead Eul. And what can be more acceptable vnto them than to sée you diuorced from your husband to liue a widowe nay worse then a widow for widowes may marry againe Xan. Truely I like your counsell well but I shall be wearie of such a daily labour Eul. But thinke with your selfe what a deale of labour you must take before you can teach this Parrot to speake like a man And shall it grieue you to take paines in reforming of your husband with whom you may liue swéetely all the daies of your life Xan. What shall I doe Eul. I haue already told you first vse daily earnest praier to God then be carefull that all things be cleane and swéet and decent at home that there be no loathsomnesse or sluttishnesse to make him wearie of his house shew your selfe gentle and louing vnto him and alwayes remember a certaine reuerence that a wife oweth to her husband put away sadnesse and malecontentednesse and put away all sawcines and impudent repr●…chfulnes be not sluttish nor toyish and lasciu●…ous let all your prouision at home be neate and trimme You know your husbands diet that that he liketh best prouide for him and let it be after his owne minde And moreouer shew your selfe friendly and affable to those he loueth At the table let there be no complaining nor finding of fault but let all be full of mirth and ioy so shall you inure your husband to tarry at home and saue charges Then shal he begin to thinke with himselfe thus Truly I am a very foole to liue abroad with the great expense of my wealth and credit hauing at home so plesant and louing a wife with whome I may enioy all thinges in honest decent and good sort Xan. Do you think I should haue good successe if I tried Eul. I make no doubt of it in the meane time I wil go to your husband and will admonish him of his duetie Xant I like your counsell but take héede that none of our talke come to his eare for if you doe he will take on as if heauen and earth should goe together Eul. Feare not I will so winde within him by circumstances that he shal tell