Selected quad for the lemma: duty_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
duty_n	church_n	minister_n	people_n	2,506	5	4.7611	4	true

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A80158	Responsoria ad erratica pastoris, sive, vindiciæ vindiciarum. Id est, the Shepherds wandrings discovered, in a revindication of the great ordinance of god: Gospel-preachers, and preaching. By way of reply and answer to a late booke, called, The peoples priviledges, and duty guarded against the pulpit and preachers encroachment. And their sober justification and defence of their free and open exposition of scriptures. Published by William Sheppard, Esq. Wherein Mr Sheppards pretended guard, consisting of ten propositions and ten arguments, is examined, and found to wear nothing by wooden swords. And all his replyes to Mr Tho. Halls arguments, and Mr Collinges arguments in his Vindiciæ ministerii, brought against not ordained persons ordinary preaching, are found but cavils and too light. And the truth still maintained, ... in that, preaching and expounding scripture publiquely, are proper acts to gospel officers; not common to all. Wherein also the great question, how far the spirit of God ... dothïnable them to understand scripture is opened, ... / By John Collings, M.A. and preacher of the Gospel in Norwich.	Collinges, John, 1623-1690.	1652 (1652)	Wing C5331; Thomason E672_1; ESTC R207127	122,201	185

Churches are these that have no preachers in office belonging to them I take it a constituted Church must be a body of Christians united and under the inspection of a Pastour Extraordinarily and occasionally if on the Lords day the congregation be met and the Minister failes through sicknesse or otherwise and there be no preaching Minister near to whom the people may go we agree with you that a private person if prepared and truly gifted may either in the Church or in some other place according to his gift discourse of the Scripture to the people though we think he might spend the time as well in repeating a Sermon to them and they spend their time as well in going home and searching the Scriptures and meditating and praying privately It is true that you say that there were exhortations in the Jewish Synagogues but the places you quote Io. 16.20 Acts 18.28 13 15 20 9. prove onely that Jesus Christ so taught and Paul and Apollos called by the Apostle 1 Cor. 3.5 a Minister and rank'd with Paul so exhorted none of these were meere gifted brethren Page 24. You would have such men as these viz. Naylers Taylors Bakers Weavers p. 22. have leave and encouragement to visit Parishes destitute and unprovided and exercise their gifts and doubtlesse you say this would doe more good then setting up meer Readers I answer 1. Provided that first all those be first employed who are more fit for it being more eminently gifted with learning and the knowledge of the Tongues being also sober and godly 2. Provided that according to the Apostles rule these same Nailors leave making Nailes and the Taylors leave stitching and the Coblers cobling and the Weavers weaving or else I am afraid that rule of the Apostle will be broken which he gives to preachers 1 Tim. 4.15 Meditate upon these things give thy selfe wholly to them and that v. 13. Give attendance to reading to exhortation and to doctrine Surely you will not say that those rules concerne onely preachers ordained that are pastors for then it must follow That it is Gods will that the pastors of Churches should meddle with his word reverently and seriously and speake of it premeditately but the gifted brethren have a priviledge to prate at randome and ex tempore and that curse denounced on them that doe the worke of God negligently belongs onely to pastors in office 3. Provided that they be called and sent out and ordained according to the Gospel-rule else they will not be able to answer him that questions them who gave you this authority it will be no Scripturall answer to say the State gave it me with these provisoes I grant you what you would have especially considering your excellent limitations and your sober reproofe of extravagant members in p. 24. 25 26 27. Against which I have nothing to say but easily grant you that all Gospel-preachers must be limited by those rules And I am glad to heare from you so sober a checke of the lawlesse preachers of this sinfull age But yet Sir you must pardon me if I yet after all this say to him that would be a preacher 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 one thing is yet wanting if you be an ordinary constant preacher viz. A solemne setting apart to the office after Probation by fasting and Prayer and laying on of the hands of the Presbytery without which his constant preaching will be a constant sinning against God in the rules of the Gospell This now you oppose by 10 Arguments from the 27 to the 50 page of your booke I come now to the strength of them CHAP. XII In which Mr. Sheppards first Argument for Guifted brethrens preaching ordinarily is examined and answered YOur first argument is ex concesso you say we grant you 1. That private persons may and must read the Scriptures Catechize their families and that they may expound the Scripture to their families Deut. 6.7 8 9. Col. 3.16 and they which tell you that every Master is a Prophet a Priest and a King in his family And 2. That we give you leave privately occasionally extraordinarily and by way of discourse to reprove admonish encourage teach exhort comfort support feed out of the texts Leu. 19.17 Heb. 3.13 Es 2.2 Mal. 3.10 Gal. 6.2 Job 2.17 Acts 18.26 Pro. 20.23 And 3. They also allow you to make an open confession of your faith or an Apology for defence against unjust accusations or being a Magistrate to give a charge to the people and this they warrant by other Scriptures 4. And that in case of planting or decay or corruption of a Church and where a Church is not regularly constituted that in these and such like cases a gifted man may ordinarily and publikely preacht and that without a solemn call And 5. That they may preach as probationers and by writing Nay 6. We doe admit strangers to preach of whose call we are not assured Here is now an huddle of arguments together all taken out of our own concessions and practice for my better answer I will observe this method 1. I will shew you how farre we have granted those or any of those 2. I will examine quid inde what this Gentleman can conclude from those our grants 3. I will answer what he sayes in the enforcing his argument 1. Therefore I confesse I have granted him that private persons must read the Scriptures Catechize their families and they may observe what God discovers to them of the sense and meaning of the Scriptures This I have granted from Deut. 6 6 7. and the usuall notion that every one is a Priest Prophet and King in his family in my Vindiciae p. 19. 20. but not that he may un●y the difficult places of Scripture or meddle with the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 see my limitations of this grant p. 20. for Col. 3 16. indeed my Brother Hall quotes it as a proofe of this but I have not being not I think so clear and conclusive but suppose we doe grant this if you have any argument from this Sir it must be thus What private persons may doe in their families privately that they may doe in a constituted Church and its assembly publikely but privately they may teach their Children and servants Ergo. I deny your major utterly Sir you may as well conclude that every private person may rule the Church because he may rule in his family God hath set him over his family to instruct that but not over his Church to instruct that see my answer to this trifling argument in my Vindiciae p. 64. 65. But you say people and preachers are both meant alike Rev. 1. v. 5 6.19 1 Pet. 2.9 and therefore the duty and power laid upon them and given them hereby is to be performed in other places as well as their own houses 1. I grant you that for the terme Priests it doth not properly belong to the Ministers of the Gospell 2. That it is by allusion

applyed to both and the people are called Priests and Preachers Priests in a common notion But yet let me tell you I doe not thinke their services are both alike For 3. He that Ministred the Gospell of God that the offering up of the Gentiles might be acceptable being sanctified by the holy Ghost was one that was in office and had grace given him of God to be a Minister of the Gospel of Christ Ro. 15. ●6 Shew me where in that sense the people are called Priests You tell us next that that place Deut. 6. Doth contain and command more then bare reading the Scriptures and and preaching of them to a mans owne family onely and to this purpose you tell us that that Text in Deut. seems to be a Metaphor taken from whetting an instrument by which it is made more sharpe and so more usefull So the word of God c. I wonder how many words you would have to restraine a Text here are four or five 1. To thy children 2. In thy house 3. When thou lyest downe and risest up 4. Vpon the posts of thy house and thy gates Let the indifferent reader judge whether this Text be not enough restrained For your observation of the metaphor I say nothing for it is nothing to the present purpose But p. 29. You say suppose there come twenty or an hundred in of the neighbours may you not preach to them also c. Sir we can give you no license to preach to any To the law and to the testimony if that say you may you may if not you may not this Text in Deuteronomy gives you no liberty to preach to them nor doe I know any that doe you may doubtlesse if they come occasionally to joyne with you in a family duly go on with your duty before them but if you make it your businesse to call them into your charret to see your zeale for the Lord of hostes I know no Scripture will justifie you I passe on to our second and third grant as you say Scriptures misapplied We doe nay the word of God doth grant you that you may privately occasionally extraordinarily and by way of discourse reprove admonish encourage exhort comfort support but we doe not grant it you from Pro 20.22 or Mal. 3.10 there is not a letter in them to any such purpose no more is there in Io. 2.17 nor in Gal. 6.2 nor in Acts 18.26 Apollos was more then a gifted brother Sir indeed we grant it from Levit. 19.17 Heb. 3.13 Es 2.2 your other five places are shamefully applyed to shew you that it is not the spirit of God that immediately and specially directs you in applications of Scriptures alwayes We doe grant also that private persons if called to it may make open confessions of their faith and apologies on their own defence and magistrates may make charges and in them make use of the Scriptures But now let us heare what you will conclude If they may doe this then they may without any call preach the Gospell publikely in a constituted Church I deny this shamefull consequence Sir are families constituted Churches or meetings of people at assizes constituted Churches fy fy surely your mind if we may judge of it by your Logick is to abuse not convince your readers but to defend your weake cause you tell us 1. The texts named and duties pressed doe as much appertain to preachers as people what then Sir therefore the preachers may also exhort c. privately we doe not goe to conclude from those Scriptures what you may not doe but what you may doe 2. You tell us The preachers have forced these termes occasionally extraordinarily and privately upon the texts there being not any one word in any of them holding forth any such distinction or intention only in Acts. 18.26 a place very neare to one of their texts there is this that Apollos a man then doubtlesse out of office did mightily convince the Iewes and that publikely by the Scriptures proving that Iesus was the Christ Nor can we understand what they meane by these terms or how to make any certain definition of them or to give to our selves any certain rules for the guiding our selves therein the duties enjoyned are common and necessary the command generall and indefinite how then are such destinctions warrantable 3. Let the force and use of the words and the nature of the duties thereby enjoyned and the use and sense of the words in other Scriptures Acts 2.4 Heb. 10.22 23 24 25. Acts 15 32 13 15 11 23. Titus 2.3 Heb. 5 12. 2 Chron. 17.7 8 19 6 7. 2 Tim. 2 16 17. be well weighed and then let the preachers tell us if they can wherein these things doe differ from preaching and how they may be done without preaching To these cavills I answer 1. If the preachers have devised the distinctions of Occasionally and Extraordinarily and privately you are beholden to them for it for you your self make use of them p. 23. and tell us that but in some cases it may be done ordinarily and constantly 2. Though the very word privately should not be found in Scripture yet words are found that argue the same thing Heb. 3.13 exhort one another which is a terme of a private notion and differing from exhorting the congregation 3. The peoples inquiry concerning the interpretation of Scripture was privately Math. 24.3 Mar. 13.3 Math. 13.36 contrary to the practice of many publikely to dispute with the Preachers when they have done their sermons or interrupting them when they are preaching 4 As the term extraordinarily is not put in so neither is it needfull for the duties commanded them are to be done ordinarily viz to admonish reprove comfort support c. 5. Though it be no where said they must doe it onely privately yet withall it is no where said they may do it in a constituted Church that hath publike officers to preach to them 6. Neither is there any one example of any not gifted with the extraordinary gifts of the holy Chost nor in office that did it publikely 7. If Apollos mentioned Acts 18.25 26. were at that time out of office which yet by your favour is not doubtlesse yet he was no private person for it is more then probable he had the extraordinary gift of proph●●cy and to be sure he was to be a minister in office 1 Cor. 3.5 8. The very putting in of that terme Acts 18.28 and that publikely argued that it was not ordinary for private persons or any not in office to speake publikely in the Synagogues 9. It is an easie thing for men to pretend ignorance when they have no mind to understand to helpe you By privately we meane not in publike assemblies and congregations By extraordinarily we meane they may doe it 1. Where no Ministers in office can be procured or resorted to till such time as the congregation can be supplyed regularly 10. The duties enjoyned are common and

a truth that the Hebrewes doe sometimes confound tenses and we often translate their future tense by the preterperfect yet with submission to those more learned and criticall in that language I conceive it should not be so translated except the sense inforceth it the primary and proper signification being otherwise 3. Neither doe I see such a necessity for the coherence sake so to translate it there V. Our Annot. for might not the Prophet as well set out their impiety by their declination from their duty as well as from the piety of the Priests formerly 4. Nay under favour Sir the coherence is both against you and Piscator too the very next words are for he is the messenger of the Lord of hosts now let any judicious man judge whether the sense be better as you would have it thus For the Priests lips did keep knowledge and they did seeke the Law at his mouth for he is the Angell of the Lord of hosts or as we read it For the Priests lips should preserve knowledge and they should seeke the Law at his mouth For he is the Angell of the Lord of hosts or the messenger of the Lord of hosts for the same word signifies both this is the reason given why the people should enquire the interpretation of the Law at his mouth because he is the Messenger he is one authorized and sent and appointed by God to open the Law 5. But Fifthly suppose we admit your reading it alters not the case at all for you grant that the Priests lips did keep knowledge and the people did require the Law at his mouth and this in the purer state of the Jewish Church and this was a piece of their sinne that they were deviated from this practise this is as much as we desire surely the Jewish Church order was not altered but by their corruption in Malachies time if we take your sense it amounts to this In the old time The Priests lips did preserve knowledge and they did require the law at his mouth who was the messenger of the Lord of hosts But now the Priests are ignorant and the people profane they care for no Priests but thinke themselves best able to interpret the Law of the Lord for they were deviated as well as the Priests v. 11.12 13 14 15 16. Have not you warded this Text well think you Sir It is as if we should say of England In the Prelates times the Ministers of the Lord Jesus preached plainely and powerfully and constantly they preached Law and Gospell reproofes and exhortations and the people heard the word of God diligently and reverently and were content to teach their families and to repeat Sermons and then the power of godlinesse encreased and Christians kept in the Vnity of the spirit and the bond of peace and walkt humbly with God and hated Arminian and Socinian and familisticall Errors and Blasphemies and were kept under an aw of Ordinances But now many Ministers are come to preach notions and allegories and whimzies to read Sermons instead of preaching to lay aside preaching duty and reproofe and to preach nothing but priviledges and mysteries and nonsensicall notions and to preach once a fortnight And the people they are come to neglect and despise Ordinances to thinke themselves as much preachers as the Ministers and to know as much as they can tell them and hence they are puft up with pride and are taken in the snare of the Devill and are continually rending and dividing one from another and running into error and blasphemies and the whole Nation of professors almost is turn'd Arminian Socinian or Familisticall You have put the interpretation Sir upon the Prophets words I have to strengthen our argument helpt you with a parallell Quam bene conveniunt To your second answer in which you point us to Deodate for a note but you have abused him for he hath never a note upon the words you quote I grant you the words onely held to us Analogically but where is the Analogy if not here as the Priests were the onely ordinary persons that had the knowledge of the Law betrusted to them to communicate it to others and the people were not to go to seeke it at an ordinary Jewes mouth but at the publike officers mouth so the Ministers of the Gospell are the only ordinary persons under the Gospell that have the Gospell committed to them to teach others out of it and Gospell Christians are not to require the opening of those Mysteries at one anothers mouthes but at theirs But you tell us thirdly the Case is otherwise under the Law and Gospell I grant you all you say there onely I do not finde that Is 61.8 the people of God are called Priests nor doe I believe that all people generally come under those promises you mention onely Saints and I turne your argument upon your selfe thus If under the Gospell people be generally more full of knowledge then under the Law then they had need have more eminent able teachers that should give them strong meat And these Sir had need be such as are able to search the deeps of Scripture to dive into the hidden mysteries Besides as knowledge encreaseth so in some wantonnesse will encrease and the Gospell preachers had need be such as shall be able to oppose those that gainesay their doctrine in opposing those that contradict a truth Those that maintaine a dispute either for a truth or for an errour had need have some more abilities then unlearned gifted brethren A late experience of this I could tell you in the gathered company at Bury where were many thought themselves able enough to Preach but being challenged by the Reverend pastor of the Presbyterian Church to dispute a point which they might have beene well versed in for I believe the persons have been studying it and practising it these seven years whether the Ministers of England be true Ministers they were glad to send for some of their Norfolk Brethren for helpe and some of the gifted brethren went and when they returned being miserably bafled by their owne confession they said they wanted a Scholler yet I suppose they thought they had the spirit of God but God will convince men learning is his Ordinance to enable men both to expound Scripture and defend his truth In the last place you come to the Commission Math. 28.19 Mar. 16.15 From which both my Brother Hall and my selfe urged you to say 1. That the word may be read go make disciples Jo. 4.1 2. There is no negative Clause in it 3. In common reason it doth not exclude others and to the last purpose you serve us with our usuall fare Similitudes instead of proofes it is for want of better Arguments sure Sir 4. You tell us the people have a commission to teach 5. That the native sense of the place seems only an enlargement of the former commission Mat. 10.1 2. Lu 10.1 2. 6. That the force of

Saint of God under a temptation and a son of perdition and three profane wretches 2. Nor are Heretickes so thin amongst us as amongst the Apostles 3. Nor did Christ and the Apostles use a direct meanes to propagate errours as we argue this would be But you tell us where the spirit dwells it leades into truth and not errrur This is truth Sir but to what purpose hence I conclude therefore they that are led by the spirit neither lead others into errours nor are led themselves but unlearned preachers doe both 2 Pet. 3.16 2. The evill spirit may sometimes lead those into errour in whom the spirit dwells this is a temptation Saints may be under and it is one ready way to be brought into it to usurpe acts of office and run before they are sent when they run out of Gods way the spirit of God leaves them The fourth ill consequence we urged was That by this means Preachers and preaching in office would he uselesse and contemptible To the latter you answer 1. The same might have beene said of the Priests under the law Right and was it not so see Num. 16.3 what Corah Dathan and Abiram say you take too much upon you seeing all the Congregation are holy every one of them and the Lord is amongst them wherefore then lift up your selves aboue the Congregation of the Lord. 2. You say you doe not believe it because you have seene the contrary in your own experience None so blind as they that will not see Sir I durst undertake for one that you can shew me that being a private person gifted and a publike preacher that yet continues with an humble sober heart under the aw of Gods ordinances and honouring the Lords publike officer I will shew you twenty that are either above Ordinances or slighters and contemners of the Ministers of the Gospell 3. You tell us This is certaine Those that honour God God will honour that 's our comfort Sir and we doubt not but God will doe it here or hereafter Dan 12.3 but that is no warrant for our spitting on them You say This will not make the preachers office less use● full and necessary for God in his wisdom and mercy will have some whose office it shall be to take care of the soules of his people c. Right Sir God will but man would not and what you have here said will be an argument against you If this be Gods Ordinance and will surely he would not have all usurp the peculiar acts of his office as this doth See my Vindiciae Ministerii p. 96 37. CHAP. XXI In which Mr. Sheppards 70 71 72 73 pages are examined and answered and his answers to eleven objections scann'd and found very weake Pulpit guard p. 25 26. YOu are now come to answer my brother Halls eleventh Argument which was this They which have no promise from God of divine assistance cannot comfortably or succesfully undertake the work But private persons turning preachers without a call have no such promise Ergo. To this you answer 1. By denying the Minor and you tell us there is a promise to a right hearing Truth sir but this is not a right hearing for how shall they heare without a preacher and how shall they preach except they be sent Ro. 10.15 2. You say There was a blessing followed the preaching of those scattered upon the persecution of Stephen Acts 8.1 4. Act. 11.21 I answer 1. You are to prove 1. That they were not in office 2. That they had not the extraordinary guifts of the holy Ghost 3. That they preached in a constituted Church ordinarily when the people might heare such as were in office You will come short in this proofe 3. It is false that you say we may as well say there is no promise made to private teachings and exhortings of one another They are commanded duties which when rightly performed have promises annexed constantly In the next place you come to my brother Halls 17 Argument p. 48. and my seventh p. 46. My Argument was this It is likely that that tenet which the Churches of Christ have in all ages rejected and that practice which the Churches of Christ in all ages have decried and avoyded is not a truth of Christ But the Churches of Christ in all ages have rejected and decried this opinion and practice Ergo. Now let us heare what you say against this 1. You say You are to live by Rule not by example 1. Truth sir but you can shew us no Rule for you 2. Neither is there any Rule that hath not been put in practice by some of the Churches of Christ 3. Where you can onely say It is not directly forbidden not that it is absolutely necessary Example Sir if generall or of the most is not to be despised 4. Surely the Apostle said something when he said we have no such customs nor have the Churches of Christ 1 Cor. 11.16 You say it was not so in the primitive times Prove that Nor so every where this day What 's that to the purpose we have generally sad examples in this age We told you That many of these Lay-preachers were such as denied Scripture ordinances Duties Obedience to Magistrates Sabbaths Fastings To this you answer 1 None that are led by the Spirit doe so They doe it may be speak against the abuse of duties and peoples resting on them and performing them carnall Sir notwithstanding this shamelesse insinuation we would have you know we are as much against and preach as much against resting in duties that high idolatry and carnall performance of them as any others can or doe 2. You say None that are led by the Spirit doe so But many guifted brethren doe so Ergo. Again we say For Magistracy you appeale to all the world who more alienate the peoples affections from our present governers the preachers or the guifted brethren 1. What 's this to the purpose doe preachers in Office preach down Magistracy 2. Any one is good when he is pleased Suppose our Parliament should forbid private persons preaching or severely punish errours and heresie what would you do then we can tell you when the guifted brethren were not such friends to the Magistrates or Magistracy of England 3. What if some Ministers not all Sir were for a while unsatisfied in the late change was there nothing in it Sir that might startle a tender conscience 4. We believe that our Parliament doth and in seven yeers time will more thinke them like to be best subjects who most feare an oath and are most tender of doing any thing which might make an appearance of the breach of it Another Objection you say we make is It is against Gospel precepts and order 1 Tim. 5.1 22. Act. 13.3 You aime here I believe at my first Argument p. 23. But you are so wise as not to put it in the forme I put it To this you answer nothing but Magisterially deny it

A 13 Objection which you pretend to answer is drawn from 1 Cor. 7.20 Let every one abide in his calling This I think is one of my brother Halls Arguments You answer That guifted brethrens preaching is a piece of their generall calling But Sir I have already proved that publique preaching is a proper act of a particular calling and no such act can be an act of our generall calling A 14 Objection This was to be committed to others 2 Tim. 2.2 This is now a bit of my fourth Argument Sir you are a shamefull disputant You should repeat my Argument and then deny a proposition But you tell us That place is meant of the office of the Ministery which you contend not for Truth Sir but you contend for a proper and chiefe Act of that office as I have already proved Whereas you say that the word is committed to the whole Church 1 Tim. 3.15 I have answered that place before In the next place you pretend to answer a fifteenth objection which is my fifth Argument p. 40. of my Vindiciae Whosoever may lawfully preach the Gospell and interpret Scriptures ordinarily c. may warrantably require a maintenance competent for them of those to whom they so preach But this guifted persons cannot c. You grant the Minor and tell me the Major is a Non sequitur You deny the plain words of the Apostle Sir 1 Tim. 5.18 They that rule well are worthy of double honour countenance and maintenance viz. especially such as labour in the Word and Doctrine Matth. 10 10. 1 Tim. 5.18 Gal. 6.6 He that is taught in the Word is bound to communicate to him that teacheth in all good things 1. Prove this is meant onely of such as are in office And then 2. That any are to preach that are not in office or else you tell the holy Apostle his words are false A 16 objection you pretend to answer is drawn from that of the Apostle 1 Cor. 12 Where the Apostle to shew that there should be order kept in the Cburch of Christ that one should not be dissatisfied at the excelling gift or office of another compares the Church to a Naturall body wherein are severall Members and all have their severall offices c. some eyes some eares c. and hence proves that in the Church all should not be eares eyes c. they should not usurpe one anothers places nor envy one another for them To this you answer Who denies this or what have we said against this You deny it Sir when you say God hath ordained all to be Tongues A 17. Objection Then women and boyes may preach You tell us 1. Women might if they were not forbidden I deny it they must be commanded or else they might not this was the old Popish plea for ceremonies they were lawfull because not forbidden 2. You say women did it 1 Cor. 11.3 That place Sir is to be understood of being present at prophecying or of extraordinary prophecying or else the Apostle contradicts himselfe in the same Epistle 1 Cor. 14.34 which I hope you dare not say 3. You say Boyes may if they have a gift and to prove it you tell us Christ did Lu. 2.46 and Timothy 1 Tim. 4.42 1. You have put a pretty uncivill terme upon our Saviour and upon Timothy surely they were no ordinary boyes Sir I perceive you have not read Aristotle he would tell you there is a Juvenis aetate Moribus young men in respect of age or manners and abilities You come to an 18. Object This gift of opening and applying Scripture especially hard places was onely temporary and now ceased This you say if true were something but many have it at this day You say right Sir this is something and before you condemne it for false answer the Reasons to prove it extraordinary which I have gathered out of severall learned and holy men and presented you with in my Vindiciae Ministerii p. 50. 51. and when you have done that well tell me what you thinke of men having that gift in these dayes 19. Object Whatsoever is not of Faith is sinne This is one of my Brother Halls arguments and all you can say can never answer it for it will not serve your turne to prove it is of faith because it is not specially forbidden But you tell us it is warranted by Scripture where Sir this is all you will say to this argument I believe it scared you and you made hast to quit your hands of it 20. Object There are two ordinances of Parliament in force against it In answer to this you grant 1. That it is a practice restrainable by Authority Now see Sir how obedient our gifted Brethren are to Magistrates 2. You say Authority doth connive at it Connivence Sir doth not frustrate publike acts nor warrant disobedience to them 3. But you hope in time the Parliament will repeale them It is possible but if they doe not doe it till they finde them inconsistent with the lawes of Christ they will be in force long enough 4. You grant it irregular and inconvenient for them to preach till authority doth command or allow it then I see our Brethren though they may have the Spirit are not infallible in their principles and practices they may be irregular But I cannot but observe how upon all occasions our brethren are more beholden to you then our God is you grant Magistrates in this case have power to command and restraine Ro. 13.1 Let every soule saith the Apostle be subject to the higher powers v. 2. Whosoever resisteth the power resisteth the Ordinance of God and receiveth to himselfe damnation this is undoubtedly true of resisting true and lawfull powers in things which they may command and restraine yet you mince it prettily not sinfull and unlawful but irregular and inconvenient when it concerns the gifted brethren I have now done to the doctrinall part of your Booke and have proved your doctrine false The Application if such as it should be must onely be the conclusion from these premises I have denyed the premises I need not deny the conclusion I will only in one Chapter note a note or two CHAP. XXII Containing some short notes upon Mr. Sheppards fourth Chatper p. 73. to the end of his Booke Concluding with a short application unto him 1. YOu chide the preachers p. 74. that they never presse upon the people their duty to interpret Scriptures we must Sir first know it is their duty and not their sinne you goe on p. 74. 75 76. in some things scandalously aspersing in other things unwarrantably reproving the Ministers impertinently applying and shamefully wresting Scriptures and lastly calling away our people from us as from Babylon Rev 18.34 Bona verba quaeso As is a man P. 78. so is his tongue Causa infirma est semper querula here 's hard language enough Sir but your arguments before and your sense here is as soft as a

Lollards Hugonites Calvinists Puritanes Non conformists yet they bare their names with Glorying because it was for the Lords sake Blessed be God that he hath now taught our enemies a Scripture name Presbyter is a name of the Lords owne coyning Tit. 1.5 1 Pet. 5.1 2 Ep. Jo. v. 1. 3 Ep. v. 1. c. I confesse Christians that name next the name of Christian is my glory and the next Scripture name for the Ministers of the Gospell and officers of the Church After that way which they call Presbytery I desire to worship the Lord Jesus Christ in Gospell-order And if this be to be vile we must be more vile we cannot but looke upon Pastors Elders and Deacons to be the Church officers under the Gospell and thinke that the government of the Church is to be in such hands and that Synods are Gods Ordinance to which Churches ought to be subject and that errors and hereticks are not to be endured nor publike Ordinances to be administred by private hands nor the great Ordinance of the supper to be given out promiscuously and these are the great things that Presbyterians differ in both from some of their dissenting brethren and the Episcopall party and whether this charge will be enough to justifie your hatred of the Ministers of the Gospell and dividings from them in the day of the Lord Jesus Christians I beseech you seriously to consider 3. But Thirdly the Ministers are bitter Nos sic sapimus omnia prorsus ●sse reprehendenda arguenda consundenda nihil excusandis ut medio stet campo libera aperta pura veritas Porro aliud est eos quos corripueris summa mansuetudine suscipere tolerare juvare Hoc jam ad charitatis officii exemplum pertinet non administerum verbi charitas est quae omnia sustinet omnia suffert omnia sperat fides vero seu verbum prorsus nihil sustinet sed arguit devorat seu ut Jeremias dicit evellit destruit dissipat maledictus qui facit opus domini fraudulenter Lutherus loc com cl 4. p. 75. I could never yet understand this charge when a Minister might be said to be bitter or upon what score this charge lies upon them was not John Baptist so bitter when he called the Pharisees a generation of Vipers and Jesus Christ so bitter when he called them rotten painted Sepulchers doe they reprove sinne harshly and is it not their duty to Cry aloud and not to spare I would faine Fathome this Notion of bitternesse when you have considered it Christians examine whether it be not Zeale in opposition to Lukewarmenesse that you put this scandalous name upon if it be knowne that whatsoever you thinke of it they thinke it a dreadfull thing to be spued out of the Lords mouth for being neither hot nor cold against heresies and Errours and for the glory of the Lord Jesus If I rightly understand this notion it is this such a Minister is bitter why he inveighes sharpely against an opinion or practice which is mine I am perswaded many Saints of God are of it But Christians surely you will be ashamed to own this before the Lord Jesus hereafter or in a discourse here Is the Minister an holy conscientious man doest thou thinke that he verily thinkes thy opinion or way is a sinne if thou doest Christian surely thou should'st love him that he will not spare thee was not Jesus Christ thus bitter when he said to Peter get thee behind me Satan and Paul thus bitter when he rebuked Peter to his face Could David say concerning a wretch that charged him with bloud and usurpation when he so shamefully railed on him in the streets Let him alone perhaps God hath bidden him curse And if thou hast an humble heart shalt not thou say when an holy servant of God shall not raile but from Scripture reprove not in the streets but in the Pulpit where God hath set him to reprove sinne possibly God hath bidden him reprove possibly my soule may be guilty however doubtlesse he speakes what he thinkes the Lord hath bidden him speake Let the righteous smite me and it shall be like oyle that shall not breake my head yea it shall be a kindnesse for yet my prayer also shall be in their calamities Psal 141.5 E●si me Lutherus Diabolum vocaret ego tamen illum insignem dei servum agnoscam Calv. Mr. Calvin heard that Luther rail'd on him what sayes he to it sayes he though Luther should call me a Devill yet I would acknowledge him a famous servant of the Lord Jesus Christ But Calvins Doctrine and Spirit too is much forgotten 4. But the Ministers Preach nothing but damnation they Preach legally and Preach nothing but duties they should Preach priviledges Isa 30.8 Now go write it before them in a Table and note it in a Booke that it may be for the time to come for ever and ever That this is a rebellious people lying children children that will not heare the law of the Lord which say to the seers see not and to the prophets prophecy not unto us right things speake unto us smooth things prophecy deceits get you out of the way turne aside out of the path cause the holy one to cease from before us There are no conscientious Ministers but will preach the priviledges of the Gospell but they know that there are a thousand sinners and hypocrites to ten true Saints Read Mr. Sheppards Sincere Convert Mr. Hooker on humiliation Mr. Fenners Books and holy Rogers and Bolton See if they did not preach terrours as well as comforts yet who are now such instruments of God to convert soules they know there are many wanton loose professors to one strict humble close walking Christian and therefore they thinke it their duty to preach the Law as wel as the Gospell did not John Baptist preach law Math. 3.7 8 9 10. And Jesus Christ preach law Math. 25.41 And St. Paul write law to the Saints Rom. 2. v 1 2 3 4 5. c. and 2 Thes 1.10 11. Profane persons had need of law to humble them and hypocrites to convince them and loose professors to make them humble and strict But my Pen runs too farre Deare Christians the Lord keep you humble in these wanton dayes and sober in the midst of this mad generation and under an holy aw of his precious ordinances in this day of their reproach and tender of his Ministers by whom you have beene brought in to Christ in this day of their contempt and zealous for Christ Jesus in this Lukewarme time And the Lord Jesus keepe you all blamelesse to the day of his comming This is the Prayer of Your meanest servant in the worke of the Lord Jesus JOHN COLLINGS From my study in Chaply-field-house in Norwich April 26. 1652. ANIMADVERSIONS By way of Reply to a Book entituled The Peoples priviledge and duty guarded By WILLIAM SHEPHARD Esq CHAP. I. Wherein the Authors

Scriptures as to the right use and understanding of them is necessary to the people as well as the preachers I observe a scurvy term As well as in every proposition If there be not a snake in that word I see nothing of falshood in this 4. That the people as well as Preachers are to abound in the knowledge of the Scriptures As wel as again Surely the cheat lies in that terme we will search it anon But admit it rightly understood After these comes in the Tripartite notion called the priviledge that should be guarded 1. That the gift of Scriptures exposition being a part of that prophecy which doth now remain is a gift common to all people of Christ out of office as well as the Preachers of Christ in office 2. That the people may as well use the gift of expounding Scripture as the Preachers 3. That it is the duty of all people of God as well as of the Preachers to expound Scriptures In the last place comes in the Rear-guard consisting of three other positions which are innocent truths if they have no daggers under their shirts more then a common Reader will see God willing we will search them anon 1. That all Gods people may and ought to expound Scriptures to themselves and one to another Query What the Author means by expounding 2 By one to another If by expounding he means speaking of the Scriptures or telling their thoughts or what they have heard or read or observed of the sence of the Scriptures and by One another he means privately It is granted 2. That such as have any singular gift herein above others are to exercise it as may be most for the profit of others This is true enough onely adding that they keep the limits by which Gods Word and their calling bounds them 3. That these expositions of Scripture of the people one to another have been frequently blessed of God for the begetting and encreasing of faith in the hearers This I feare will prove anon to be barely proved yet we dare not limit the holy one of Israel nor say but that they may have sometimes been so blessed although I believe you might have left out the word frequently I feare you will want Scripture proofe anon for that word These are his ten Propositions Now Sir although I could grant you and easily doe grant you severall of these positions to be true if rightly understood yet I shall examine what you have said to all them Partly because I have a suspicion upon some words in them not to have so honest a meaning as they have a looke And partly that I might see whether you have been guided by the Spirit in your applications of your many Scriptures to prove the points for which they are brought I will begin with the first of your Van-guard CHAP. IV. Wherein the fifth and part of the sixth page is examined and the first proposition is scann'd and opened viz. That the Scriptures doe as well belong to the people as the Preachers THe first proposition is That that the Scriptures doe as wel belong to the people as to the Preachers This point the Gentleman first proves Secondly cleares from objections 1. He proves it he should have done well to have opened it first Those two terms 1. Belong 2. As well as are not cleare We may say the government of the City belongs to the people of it but how quoad exercitium actus as to the exercise of the acts of government Are the keys of government theirs no sure Then farewell Magistracy and welcome Levelling But it belongs to them as it is for their good and peace and order as that under which and according to the rule of which they are to live If this Gentleman means by belonging what the Apostle saith 1 Tim. 3.16 That the Scriptures are profitable for all for doctrine for reproofe for correction for instruction in righteousnesse That the man of God may be perfect throughly furnished unto all good workes God forbid but we should grant it and this belonging is proved by Deut. 29.29 and Ioh. 5.39 and Iude 3. and many other places But if this Genleman means that they should belong to them as the keyes to the Steward to open and apply them to the people he both contradicts himselfe for he tels us in other places of this book That they cannot expound and apply Scriptures authoritatively and he contradicts the Apostle too 1 Cor. 4.2 Mysterium distribuimus in verbum Dei Sacramenta P. Martyr ad loc Let a man so account of us as of the Ministers of Iesus Christ and Stewards of the mysteries of God Of which mysteries the Gospell is one Col. 1.16 And if he doth not meane that the Scriptures thus belong to the people 1. He sayes nothing to the purpose 2 His second objection is little worth of which more by and by for suppose we argue thus If the Scriptures be for the peoples use and belong to them for reproofe correction doctrine instruction in righteousnesse then the people may expound and preach them publiquely He sayes They are committed to Preachers and yet not so as excluding the people But The Preachers are especially Natura enim omnes jubet mutuò esse custodes ac defensores salutis nostrae alienae maxime veri fratres Pareus Immo quod tibi frater est proximus ideo es illius custos tibi illius salus est a deo commendata P. Martyr and by publique office and the duty of their place to take care of them but this hinders not but that every Christian is by duty bound in generall to take care of the soules of his fellow Christians and so of the truth We easily grant that private Christians are in the generall bound by the Law of God and nature to take a private care of their brethrens soules and bodies and of the truth so farre as to keep it in their own hearts and propagate it in their own families yea and to admonish reprove and exhort one another to watch over them if standing if any brother be fallen through infirmity to endeavour to restore him in the spirit of meeknesse But Sir they are not to take a publique care of nor are they put in a publique trust concerning their brethrene soules Neither are the Scriptures committed to them to teach others Quicquid enim ingenio humano ex cogitatum assuitur Scripturae ut pro divinitus revelato habeatur mendacium est Pareus in Apoc. c. 22. 1 Tim. 2.2 What the word of God doth not say in reference to the Ordinances and worship of God that we must not say For if we doe we shall adde to the Scriptures God must order every pin in the Tabernacle But the word of God no where saies that the people have the glorious Gospel of God committed to their trust to teach others out of it as 1 Tim. 1.11 1 Tim. 6.20 2 Tim. 2.2 and

guifts of the Spirit are given to every one but one to this Christian another to another something to all v. 29 Are all Prophets are all Teachers are all workers of miracles That very Text 1 Cor. 12.7 8. is witnesse enough against you Nor doth Rom. 12.6 prove that the use of this guift is not confined for it is confined to them that have it and those are onely such as are Officers if you mean by prophecying ordinary preaching which I perceive you take for granted though I shall shew you anon you have no reason to doe so For your third place Acts 17.11 that onely proves that searching the Scriptu●es is not confined to officers but people also may doe it and this none denies Your second reason to prove that they may use the guift is because they have the same guift the Preachers have The Argument is thus Those that have the same guift with others may use it as well as others But the people have the same guift Your Minor is undoubtedly false of the most Saints But suppose it were true you Major is fallacious If you mean using it in their places and relations none denies it if otherwise your Major is false For by such an argument I would prove that every one that hath the guift of a Souldier may exercise the Office of a Colonell or a Generall For the Scriptures you bring to prove they have the same guift I have answered them before But you say by this guift they did interpret in the Primitive times and for this you quote 1 Cor. 14.26 Acts 18.16 Acts 8.4 Acts 11.19 Here Sir you beg a question which is so great a piece of truth that I cannot give it you upon alms you must purchase it by a solid proofe if you have it viz. that the Prophecy spoken of in the New testament was not an extraordinary but an ordinary guift That they did preach I deny you not but what their guift was whether ordinary or extraordinary we will argue anon But thirdly you tell us that reasonably they should use the guift because they have occasion to use it to reprove exhort teach comfort This you told us before p. 9. I told you then this proves a private use but not a publique use of their guifts But you tell us fourthly that God hath commanded them to use this guift 1 Pet. 4.10.11 I have fully answered this place I mean this false glosse put upon it in my Vindiciae p. 57. to which I refer you You tell us That some say Page 15. none but those that are skilled in the Tongues can interpret Scriptures some places in it are so difficult To this you answer 1. That Preachers grant that such as want School-learning being duely called may be publique Preachers 2. You agree that somethings in Scripture are very hard to be understood but others easie 3. You take it that the knowledge of the truths of Gods Word is a guift of God attainable by the Spirit onely and not by any humane power and strength and this you promised after to shew This is to set up a man of Straw and then to spend time in undressing him I know none say that none can interpret or rather know the meaning of any place of Scripture but such as have skill in the Tongues In omni copid Scripturarum sanctarum pascimur appertis exercemur obscuris illic fames pellitur hic fastidium Aug. t. 1. p. 16. E. This indeed we say that none are so accomplished by means to doe it as they nay further that there are some Scriptures to the right interpretation and full interpretation of which a knowledge in the Tongues is necessary Other Scriptures there are which need no interpreter he that runneth may read them and the coherence is evident enough But you say we grant That such as are not skild in the Tongues Nam quan●o Scriptura non habet vivam vocem quam audiamus utendum est quibus dam medus quibus investigemus quis sit sensus quae mens Scripturararum si enim Christus ipse nobiscum ageret si Apostoli prophetae inter nos viverent eos adire possemus ut sensum illorum quae ab iis scripta sunt nobis indicarent sed cum illi abierint libros tantùm suos reliquerunt videndum est quibus medits ut verum Scripturae verborumque divinorum sensum inveniamus Ecclesia enim semper mediis quibusdam usa est Whitaker de Scrip. l. 5. c. 9. if duely call'd to it may be publique Preachers If there be such a necessity that the Church cannot be otherwise supplied and these be otherwise qualified we grant it To your second it is granted that there are some places of Scripture easie and these need no Interpreter But for your third viz. That the knowledge of the truths of Gods Word is a guift attainable by the Spirit of God onely and not by any humane power or strength You have delivered it ambiguously I know not whether you mean a practicall reflex knowledge or a notionall direct knowledge If you mean the first we grant it you but it makes nothing to your purpose If you mean a notionall knowledge we deny not but that the Spirit can and doth teach us that but it is Sir in the use of means of which the knowledge of the Tongues is one If your meaning be that an enlightning our minds in the knowledge of our Scriptures upon our searching of them meditating studying of them and using all other means is a guift of the Spirit none denies it but this is nothing to your purpose But if you mean that the Spirit by a work of speciall grace enlightens the minds of his Saints onely in the understanding of Scriptures and that I know not which way without the use of those means he hath allowed us in order to that end As it is a pernicious opinion so it is as false and simple For how many have been able to expound Scripture that never had the Spirit of grace what think you of Iudas And what strange nonsensicall erroneous interpretations doe many make of Scriptures that think and others think too that they have much of the Spirit in them But you promise to prove your assertion hereafter You had need open it too I am now come to your seventh point That it is the duty of all Gods people as well as Preachers to expound Scripture This you endeavour to prove saying 1. It is their duty to doe many things which cannot be done without this 2. They have the guift of Scripture exposition given them 1 Cor. 2.12 16. 1 Cor. 12.7 3 It is their duty to make the best use of Scripture they ean but this they cannot doe but by expounding it 4. It hath been commended in them that have done it Act. 17.11 2 Pet. 1.19 Rom. 15 14. Tardior est stultorum ut ait ille Magistra experientia quemadmodum mauspicatus est

necessary but those duties are private exhortings not publike expoundings for those are neither common nor necessary to be performed by persons not in office and the command is generall but not to all duties 11. The command to preach is no more common then that to Baptize Math. 28.19 But your selfe will grant they may not Baptize unty the knot for your self and you doe it for us 12. What though the same words be used to expresse the duty of the peoples private exhortations one of another and the Pastors publike exhortations yet this will not prove that their exhortations are to be in the same manner nor that the duty is the same The Magistrate in his charge at an assize may be said to exhort yet surely it is not every private persons duty so to exhort the people 13. If the use of the same word for both be any argument then they are not only bound to exhort and preach but to doe it as Apostles and prophets and pastors the places you quote will prove this yet you your selfe say p. 24. that they cannot doe it as preachers in office in an ●uthoritative way or as a pastorall act 14. The same word signifies to Baptize and to wash our hands or pots and cups and by your Logick it will follow that every man that may wash his hands or every kitchin wench that is by her office to wash a cup may Baptize a Christian why the word is the same But to proceed yet with you p. 30. you say We grant that in case of planting or decay or corruption of a Church and where a church is not regularly constituted that in these and such like cases a gifted man may ordinarily and publikely preach without a solemne call If so we desire them to consider how neere our case at this time at least in some congregations comes to this if our Churches be rightly constituted you say why is there so much labour to alter and reforme the constitution of them 1. Let us see how far this is granted 2. What you can conclude from our grant 3. how you apply it and cavill from it 1. I never granted you that in case of the planting or decay of a Church and where a Church is not regularly constituted that in these cases a gifted man might preach without a call c. except the case were so that none could be found to ordain nor none ordained found to do the Lords worke Nor doe I thinke it Regular I doe not thinke it the best way to convert Indians to send unguifted men to them not ordained But for the Church to set some apart by fasting and prayer and send them out to them with authority See M. Firmin● separation examined p. 60. I am sure this is Gods way when he was to send preachers where Churches were not formed Acts 13.5 indeed if the case be such that no ordained persons can be found nor any Presbyters to ordaine them the case is otherwise My Brother Hall in his pulpit-guarded p. 5. 6. durst grant you no more now what doe you argue from hence Those that may preach to Heathens or to Christians where no officers can be had to preach or set apart preachers these also may ordinarily preach where there are preachers in office and more may be made A miserable consequence Sir apply it to Magistracy and you will see the absurdity of it But you tell us this is our case or very neere We are beholden to you for this Sir are we no better then Heathens thinke you 2. Have we no officers ordained in England nor 3. Any meanes of Ordination But our Churches are not rightly constituted 1. The Church of England Sir is rightly constituted here are in it preachers rightly ordained and people rightly qualified and the ordinances rightly administred 2. For the particular Churches in England possibly they may not be organized regularly but constituted they are though corrupted and so have much need to be reformed 3. You have foisted in this terme Rightly into our grant we doe not thinke that every particular fault in the constitution of a Church makes the Lords Vineyard such a common that every one may come and dig in it But fourthly you tell us we grant you That gifted men may preach as Probationers and by writing in what manner and method they please without any call at all and that a judge may give a charge and a Colonell or Captain exhort his Souldiers That a man may comfort his afflicted friend 1. The three latter we grant you in terminis as you propound them 2. We also grant that men may exercise their gifts as probationers but not in what manner and method they please for their method we deny them not what they please but for the manner it must not be ordinarily but once or twice or more in order to Timothies laying on of hands upon them which must not be suddenly 3. These Probationers must not be Naylors Taylors Coblers c. but such as have beene approved as have studied the Scriptures and give themselves wholly to that worke 4. We say others may write but we doe not call writing preaching But what followes upon this grant Will you conclude that therefore those that never intend the office of the Ministry nor to give themselves wholly to that worke may make it a Trade to preach every Lords day in a constituted Church is there no odds thinke you Sir betwixt our grant and your taken conclusion we have given you an inch you have taken an ell But lastly you tell us that we doe constantly admit preachers to preach for us that are strangers to us and of whose call we can have no assurance I answer 1. It is no argument to argue a facto ad jus that because some doe it it is lawfull 2. But surely none do it if they know them to be such as are not called if we be deceived by report or common fame or their own words the sin is not ours so much 3. I know none that doe it if there be any let them plead for themselves If such thrust into our places we give them no leave And thus Sir I have shewn you the weaknesse and insufficiency of your first argument which proves too short for your purpose I come now to your second CHAP. XIII Wherein Mr. Sheppards foure next main Arguments are weighed in the ballance of the Sanctuary and found too light I Am come now to the second argument which you call a maine one That it is no where forbidden in the word of God and then it cannot be unlawfull Your Logick is this What is not forbidden to be done is not unlawfull But the ordinary preaching of gifted uncalled men in a constituted Church is not forbidden Ergo. Arg. 2 As you deliver your mind we must be forced first to distinguish then to answer 1. A thing is forbidden either generally or specially either directly or by consequence If you

Read and Baptize or Write and Baptize or Rule and Baptize though we grant all those to belong to him yet they are not proper Acts of his office quà a Gospell Preacher so he hath but two proper Acts that I know viz 1. Publike preaching 2. Administring the Seales those that are for Episcopacy adde a third but we conceive that belongs not to him alone except other officers be wanting Thirdly you come to tell us what it is to be in office as a Preacher so you say 1. He must be lawfully called and authorized thereto 2. He must be over some people being duly called to them for if Minister and people be Correlatives then can there be no Minister in office untill he be engaged to some people And till then he seemes to be onely in the Nature of a gifted man To this I answer that it is true that Minister and people are correlates but to what people is a Minister a Correlate what to this or that Church onely I deny that he is in office as a Gospell preacher to any people in the world pastors and teachers are in office for the whole body of Christ Eph. 4.11.12 when he is engaged to a particular people he is but appropriated not by that constituted a Minister for if a minister be onely in office to his own Church 1 He can administer the Sacrament to no single person that is not a fixt member of his Church 2. He can Baptize none but such 3. He can preach by authority to none but such See Mr. Firmins and Mr. Hudsons arguments for this novell fancy See Mr. Firmin against separation p. 61 62 63. Mr. Hudsons vindication 138 139 c. Baronius t. 4. l. 26. D. Hieron ep 61 It is true there is thus much said for it from antiquity that Bishops were not usually ordained fine titulo but 1. This was not to shew that they were onely in office to this or that Church but to prevent vagrant itinerary preachers 2. St. Hierom contested with Paulinus the Bishop of Antioch when he was ordained and would not be ordained to any particular Church if we may either believe Baronius or Hierom himselfe in his 61 Epistle ad Pammachium But to make hast p. 63. you tell us five things which you conceive usurpations of the Gospell preachers office I agree with you in all of them onely I must still maintaine That preaching is the proper Act of a Preachers office and so incommunicable and if I make good what I have said to this purpose you are condemned out of your own mouth To this purpose in my Vindiciae I produced three Arguments p. 34 35 36 37. you have answered not one of them onely you say We say that it is as much his proper act as Baptisme Truth I did so and proved it because the same commission authorizeth to both 2. Saint Paul seemeth to lay more upon it then upon Baptizing 1 Cor. 1.17 to neither of these doe you say a word A second argument I urged you with was this The proper acts of Elders Bishops Stewards of the mysteries of God Heralds Embassadours Watchmen extraordinary Deacons Pastors Teachers are acts of office But this is their proper act see Scriptures p. 24. Third Argument Either this is their proper act or they have no proper act But God did not ordaine an office with no act proper You have nothing to say against this unlesse you say Baptizing and giving the Supper is their proper act and then I require one Scripture to prove either of these a more proper act then preaching see Vindiciae p. 37. To none of these you answer So that for all that you have said our argument stands strong and will do so till you bring us a plaine Scripture or a good argument from Scripture to prove that God hath appointed Gospell preachers some acts that are more proper to them then preaching CHAP. XIX In which Mr. Sheppards 65 66 67 pages are answered and his answers to our sixth and seventh Argument found too short THe next argument you pretend to answer is my 1 argument and the substance of my Brothers Halls second eighth and ninth You say we say you may not doe it because you are not called and sent by the Presbytery as Ro. 10.15 1 Tim. 3.10.4 14.5.22 2.2 3. It is the Scripture saith so Sir not we onely To this you answer 1. That you will not now dispute the Presbytery nor thus call to the Ministry no Sir it is not your best course believe it Swords and Pistols will serve you better in that worke then Scripture and Reason 2. You agree that preachers in office must be duly called none of them Scriptures say Sir preachers in office but those that preach must be sent Ro. 10. those that teach oothers must be not onely faithfull and able but have the Gospell committed to them 1 Tim. 2.2 But you hold it convenient if not necessary Jesus Christ Sir is beholden to you for drawing out duties into conveniences I suppose you hold it convenient too that the Gospell should be Preached and people heare and be saved it will be found necessary one day Sir Jesus Christ will make you ashamed of that same if not But the places onely speak of a call from God and then a man is sent of God when he is fit and able to teach 2. hath a willingnesse in his minde to give himselfe to the worke 3 when providence disposeth him to a call to exercise his gift I professe I tremble to read and heare men professing to the feare of God so boldly contradicting his word trampling upon his plaine precepts and all to exalt carnall corrupt reason But to answer a little 1. If that be a call from God which you instance in I beseech you Sir with what face of a Christian can you say most of the Scriptures quoted speak of no more there are but five Scriptures in all 1 Tim. 3.10 And let these also be proved who should prove them good Sir 1 Tim. 4.14 With the laying on of the hands of the Presbytery is there no call from men thinke you The third is 1 Tim. 5.22 Lay hands suddenly on no man what is that meant of Gods immediate sending thinke you doth he lay hands on any the fourth is 1 Tim. 2.2 the same commit thou to faithfull men who shall be able to teach others is God meant by that thou thinke you Sir the fifth place quoted first is Rom. 10.15 that indeed is not so plaine but carnall reason hath more roome to cavill but I have spoke enough before to cleare that from the Socinian glosse of providentiall sending you tell us p. 66. you have cleared that Text and shall adde no more But truly Sir except you had spake more to the purpose before you might have added your pleasure but you say If these places be admitted in the sense we would have them then it would follow that none might